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Dandrenn
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Posted - 2010.01.24 01:58:00 -
[1]
Or do you just need them at 4, i'm trying to compare the resists between the two, and do they affect invul fields?
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Molera
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Posted - 2010.01.24 02:15:00 -
[2]
It is worth it, 3/5% helps. They only effect invul fields, and other active hardeners when the hardener is turned off. It however, effects passive hardeners at all times.
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Chainsaw Plankton
IDLE GUNS
IDLE EMPIRE
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Posted - 2010.01.24 02:24:00 -
[3]
for shields I wouldn't bother as I always use active hardeners.
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Sid Icarus
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Posted - 2010.01.24 02:50:00 -
[4]
Yeah, your looking at a month and half of dedicated training to take them all from Lv4 to Lv5, I don't think its worth it personally. I mean 5% is 5%, but it seems to me that 6 or 7 weeks of training can be much better spent in other areas.
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Sturmwolke
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Posted - 2010.01.24 02:54:00 -
[5]
Generally no as many shield boats run on active hardeners.
However, if you intend to run full passive fit (i.e. shield resist amplifiers), then I'd put the full 5 points into both EM and TH only, while KI and EX can stay at 4. The 8-10days training per skill (from 4 to 5) on a combat Per + Will char is quite substantial imo. Personally, I would not do it unless it's something that will get used regularly.
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Dandrenn
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Posted - 2010.01.24 02:57:00 -
[6]
I usually run my NH with 2 invul fields and i want a tengu which will run on active i think... so it sounds like i'll be just fine with what i have now. Thanks guys.
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Dacryphile
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Posted - 2010.01.24 03:10:00 -
[7]
It will only effect the active hardeners when they are off, which is never.
I've run a passive resistance amp CNR before, and having them at IV is pretty much required if you want to use any of the resistance amps.
 Originally by: Doc Robertson
...take a good look at this pic and tell us which one is you.
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Dandrenn
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Posted - 2010.01.24 03:14:00 -
[8]
This topic saved me over a month in training, instead i'll work on getting those missile skills to 4 or 5. By the way, which missile skills do you guys recommend getting to 5?
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Veliria
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Posted - 2010.01.24 03:47:00 -
[9]
Depends on how much you need the added resists that they give on passive resistance amps.
If you fight Sansha/Blood Raiders a lot and you have a passive resist, it might be worth it to get the EM one, but I wouldn't really bother with the rest.
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Snacks
Caldari
Pillow Fighters Inc
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Posted - 2010.01.24 03:59:00 -
[10]
Edited by: Snacks on 24/01/2010 03:59:37
It used to be worth it. They nerfed the resists so now, no it's not. As far as missiles, just get the support skills to 5 and work on the ones you use. I have a dedicated missile boat pilot that after 4 years I just now got around to training standard missiles....
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Sturmwolke
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Posted - 2010.01.24 04:07:00 -
[11]
Easily Rapid Launch 5 would be one of te first I'd get to 5. |
Wet Ferret
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Posted - 2010.01.24 04:55:00 -
[12]
Originally by: Sturmwolke
Easily Rapid Launch 5 would be one of te first I'd get to 5.
This, definitely. Next up should be guided missile precision, then target navigation prediction.
Bombardment and projection are okay at lvl 4 unless you're using rockets, HAMs or torps in which case you want these at 5.
I never bothered taking warhead upgrades to 5 but probably should someday. I kinda treat it like the spec skills (never take any past 4), except a spec skill would actually be more damage going from 4>5 I'm guessing.
But, yeah. These forums seriously need some indicator that the post has ended and the sig has started.
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Tian Nu
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Posted - 2010.01.24 22:49:00 -
[13]
no is not, pith A are worth every penny. at lvl 4 you are just fine.
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Kerfira
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Posted - 2010.01.24 23:48:00 -
[14]
Originally by: Sturmwolke
Generally no as many shield boats run on active hardeners.
However, if you intend to run full passive fit (i.e. shield resist amplifiers), then I'd put the full 5 points into both EM and TH only, while KI and EX can stay at 4. The 8-10days training per skill (from 4 to 5) on a combat Per + Will char is quite substantial imo. Personally, I would not do it unless it's something that will get used regularly.
This, more or less!
For passive fits, it's a nice-to-have, but not a need-to-have. I do have them all to 5, but not from any need... Just wanted to be able to say I had perfect engineering skills (apart from the capital skills) on that character 
For active tanks, the only place I can see them being marginally useful is for dreads when you get neut'ed by POS modules. Even then you're probably dead anyway, but it might take them slightly longer thus maybe sparing someone else's ship, or it might just make you last long enough to exit siege.
Originally by: CCP Wrangler
EVE isn't designed to just look like a cold, dark and harsh world, it's designed to be a cold, dark and harsh world.
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Dandrenn
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Posted - 2010.01.25 00:13:00 -
[15]
Originally by: Tian Nu
no is not, pith A are worth every penny. at lvl 4 you are just fine.
Pith A? Whats that. got a fitting where you use one of those?
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Chainsaw Plankton
IDLE GUNS
IDLE EMPIRE
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Posted - 2010.01.25 01:00:00 -
[16]
Originally by: Dandrenn
Originally by: Tian Nu
no is not, pith A are worth every penny. at lvl 4 you are just fine.
Pith A? Whats that. got a fitting where you use one of those?
no idea what that dude is trying to say 
but likely referring to the pithum a-type passive hardeners. or is it pith a-type active hardeners?
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Welikealts
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Posted - 2010.01.25 01:14:00 -
[17]
Edited by: Welikealts on 25/01/2010 01:20:03
Hes trying to say that with level 5 skills, you can replace a T2 Hardener (or faction hardener) with 55% resists, with a Pithum-B Resist Amp, which will give 55.125% resists and draw no cap. With level 4 skills, only a meta 14 resist amp will pass a T2 hardener, and under no situation will any of them approach the Deadspace Hardeners.
So you either stick with T2, at which you shouldn't train the skills since T2 Hardener > SRA, but going into the deadspace drop tier, you can get better then T2 resists for fairly cheap with significant skill investment, or you can get even better resists for significant ISK investment. He is saying the ISK is well spent, as the skills can be used elsewhere.
I haven't even looked at the costs of each, but it might be worth it for some (the prime benefit being cap freedom).
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Bibosikus
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Posted - 2010.01.25 04:31:00 -
[18]
Like the general advice seems to say - it depends on your playing preferences and fits.
I use a passive shield Ishtar to solo Gurista and Sansha 10/10 plexes, so I trained all shield skills to 5 and the difference is astounding when you start fitting high Meta mods.
Each to their own 
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speedybot
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Posted - 2010.01.25 04:37:00 -
[19]
If you're tanking something tough that drains your cap heavily, then it could be worth it. For example, level 5 missions require a completely capless tank and even a tiny bit more resist can make the difference in those.
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Dandrenn
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Posted - 2010.01.25 05:55:00 -
[20]
Originally by: Bibosikus
Like the general advice seems to say - it depends on your playing preferences and fits.
I use a passive shield Ishtar to solo Gurista and Sansha 10/10 plexes, so I trained all shield skills to 5 and the difference is astounding when you start fitting high Meta mods.
Each to their own
where do you find these plexes... low sec? 0.0? high sec? do you just go into a system with your on-board scanner and search it out or is it more complex then that?
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Tian Nu
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Posted - 2010.01.25 11:23:00 -
[21]
Originally by: Chainsaw Plankton
Originally by: Dandrenn
Originally by: Tian Nu
no is not, pith A are worth every penny. at lvl 4 you are just fine.
Pith A? Whats that. got a fitting where you use one of those?
no idea what that dude is trying to say
but likely referring to the pithum a-type passive hardeners. or is it pith a-type active hardeners?
yes pithum A-type amps
for exemple on the vulture i use 2 EM amps and 1 expl whith 3 shild extenders and T2 reg rigs, is 80%+ resist on all damage and is full pasif.
at lvl 4 skills is give you almost same resist (i think at lvl 5 you win like 1.78% more)to clear it up let say at lvl 4 on EM is 81.78% at lvl 5 is 82.64% see what i mean... the extra 5% you get at lvl 5 is not like all thet much.
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Max Tux
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Posted - 2010.01.25 13:14:00 -
[22]
they are worth training, but not as prioity.
How many times have you been neuted so much ur invulns have died?
the resist to active when not active is the best part here. my onyx has 90k ehp with both resist mods turned off.
without having those skills trained i'd only have 74K ehp.
That extra 16K can really make a difference on survival.
even just training the EM one raises the EM resist from 35% to 51%. thats a very nice hole filled if you run out of cap. lol
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pewpewpewr
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Posted - 2010.01.25 13:38:00 -
[23]
For active if you are planning on losing your cap then it is worth it, but if you are passive it is a complete waste of time.
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Ellmar
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Posted - 2010.01.25 16:42:00 -
[24]
Originally by: Dandrenn
where do you find these plexes... low sec? 0.0? high sec? do you just go into a system with your on-board scanner and search it out or is it more complex then that?
a search on the forums will yield better results but in short it's most common in good 0.0 systems and you scan them out using a probe ship of some kind (like a buzzard if your caldari)
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Bonafyde
Brutor tribe
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Posted - 2010.01.25 18:06:00 -
[25]
Active hardner's FTW!!! so yes I think it's worth the time.
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Ellmar
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Posted - 2010.01.25 18:22:00 -
[26]
Originally by: Bonafyde
Active hardner's FTW!!! so yes I think it's worth the time.
you didn't read the thread or the skill description. there's no benefit for lvl5 of this skill for active hardners as long as they are, well, active.
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Welikealts
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Posted - 2010.01.25 20:03:00 -
[27]
Edited by: Welikealts on 25/01/2010 20:04:16
Originally by: pewpewpewr
For active if you are planning on losing your cap then it is worth it, but if you are passive it is a complete waste of time.
How is 25% less damage taken with passive resists bad? Well, 5% for L5 is questionable, the rest are not if you plan to passive tank at any time IMO.
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Dacryphile
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Posted - 2010.01.25 22:05:00 -
[28]
Originally by: Welikealts
Edited by: Welikealts on 25/01/2010 20:04:16
Originally by: pewpewpewr
For active if you are planning on losing your cap then it is worth it, but if you are passive it is a complete waste of time.
How is 25% less damage taken with passive resists bad? Well, 5% for L5 is questionable, the rest are not if you plan to passive tank at any time IMO.
If you are getting into situations where you know your cap is going to be drained, then these are worth training and simply fitting the resistance amps.
If you want to train them for missions where you aren't going to get neuted, you need to learn to manage your ship better. If your shields are gone and your capacitor is gone and you haven't gtfo, then you need to lose your ship to learn to fly better.
Originally by: Doc Robertson
...take a good look at this pic and tell us which one is you.
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Haramir Haleths
Caldari
Nutella Bande
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Posted - 2010.01.26 08:20:00 -
[29]
Allways Passive Resistance, neverand i mean never use active hardeners. The Sound of the Active Hardeners drives you crazy, believe me. So yeah, if you wont get crazy, its worth training them. You have been warned.
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