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Maziy	Posted - 2010.03.20 05:19:00 - [31] fake edit: money tied up elsewhere
Lord Arbalest Amarr Zero Profits	Posted - 2010.03.21 20:46:00 - [32] Yuq has once again requested an audit from me after not being able to find another auditor. I have accepted the audit job and can confirm I have received API's. The audit will be completed shortly within the next few days depending on my busy RL schedule.
Anna Hansson	Posted - 2010.03.22 03:44:00 - [33] Pending audit I reserver 250 shares (250 million ISK).
Kera Delacour Royal Black Watch Highlanders	Posted - 2010.03.22 07:01:00 - [34] Reserving 200 million isk Depending on the results of the audit and my analysis of Arbalest's findings. ---
Daisuke Aoki Gallente Freelancing Corp Confederation of Independent Corporations	Posted - 2010.03.22 17:25:00 - [35] Pending an audit, I'd like to reserve 20 shares (20m ISK).
Legende Two Brothers Mining Corp. R.A.G.E	Posted - 2010.03.22 18:27:00 - [36] Yuq, you have Julian Koll down for 500m but his comment indicates he was being sarcastic in that reservation ("pending hell freezes over"). I haven't decided if I want to jump into this one yet, it's very difficult to justify the risk here. I will be happy to see Arbalest's report after completing the audit.
Lord Arbalest Amarr Zero Profits	Posted - 2010.03.22 22:35:00 - [37] RL obligations have unfortunately resulted in me having to postpone this audit a few days. I will aim to have it posted by Thursday/Friday. Sorry.
Nudibranch	Posted - 2010.03.23 00:21:00 - [38] Pending results of the audit and analysis I may be interested in 250Mil worth.
Estel Arador Minmatar Estel Arador Corp Services	Posted - 2010.03.23 00:44:00 - [39] Originally by: Legende I haven't decided if I want to jump into this one yet, it's very difficult to justify the risk here. It's easy to justify it: considering this is a rep-grind bond / a setup for bigger things, odds are pretty good this one will pay off. It's the next offering which you should be worried about. Just pull your money out when the next one is announced (preferably slightly earlier, though that has the obvious difficulty of requiring supernatural abilities). Free jumpclone service\|924 stations - 6000+ users
Nova Sand	Posted - 2010.03.23 03:38:00 - [40] 100 share reserve thx. Pending audit. Once the audit is out eve mail me and i will send the money to you.
Taram Caldar Blackwater USA Inc. Gentlemen's Club	Posted - 2010.03.23 13:42:00 - [41] Originally by: Nova Sand 100 share reserve thx. Pending audit. Once the audit is out eve mail me and i will send the money to you. Why bother waiting for an audit if you're just going to send the isk once the audit is out? TBH the audit is so that you can analyze the results the auditor gives and evaluate risk once full details are disclosed. Audits aren't rubber stamps. If you just dump money because an audit was done without taking time to read, review and analyze the audit you are just asking to get scammed. It's not the auditor's job to make sure a venture is safe for you. It's their job to report their findings. Only YOU can determine if the level of risk vs level of reward makes investing a wise decision. True on EVERY offering, not just the dodgy looking ones. Market Alerts Mailing List
Airkas	Posted - 2010.03.23 15:42:00 - [42] Audit pending, I would like to reserve 50 shares (50 Million ISK).
Lord Arbalest Amarr Zero Profits	Posted - 2010.03.25 01:10:00 - [43] Edited by: Lord Arbalest on 25/03/2010 01:12:36 Audit Report by Lord Arbalest on Yuq and all other linked parties. Flags Green Flag: Audit was sought and access to accounts provided. Green Flag: Auditee underwent several hours of questioning and approached the interview in a positive and helpful manner. Green Flag: Evidence has been found of trading taking place. Yellow Flag: First offering û inexperienced. Red Flag: No collateral Red Flag: Character trading û previously owned characters issue discussed later in the audit. Red Flag: Numerous changes to the amount being requested and bond details. Red Flag: Already trading with 15-16b, another 10b might not be able to be used efficiently û The auditee has stated he will move into another region. Characters -Yuq Character was born Aug 07Æ, and currently has 12.8m SP Character has 1.3m SP invested into trade related skills and the ability to maintain a large number of orders. Character can fly a freighter to a basic level. Character can fly transport ships. Character bought on 9th Feb 08Æ by konduktorsha. Auditee has stated that konduktorsha and the entire account he was located on was given to a friend. From the date of purchase, this character has made no posts on the EVE forums excluding this current bond thread. Character has a very small contract history and nothing has been found to suggest distrust. -rdking Character was born May 06Æ, and currently has 7.9m SP. Character has very specialised attributes. Character has 4.2m SP invested into Science and Research related skills. The majority of his left over SP is invested into learning skills. Character looks to be a specialised research alt. Character failed to be sold on 20th July 07Æ and the advertised receiver of the isk was padshiiangel. Auditee has stated that this character is his friend, whom he wished the isk to go to on sale of his character after the auditee had made the decision to quit EVE. Little posting history apart from this current bond thread, however character has attempted to gain funding previously on the MD forums to the sum of 10b. Auditee has stated he used this attempt of bond to take feedback and create his new one û he was asking for too much being one of the original concerns. -bardarabara Character was born Feb 10Æ, and has 2.5m SP. Character has 1.9m SP invested into trade related skills and the ability to maintain a high number of orders. Character has been created to specialise in trade. No posting history. - Two New Alts Two un-skilled alts for price checking. Previously Owned Characters -konduktorsha, koletus3 and Admiralus No longer belong to the Auditee who has given the access of the entire account including all three characters located on it to a RL friend with no charge. [Continued...]
Lord Arbalest Amarr Zero Profits	Posted - 2010.03.25 01:10:00 - [44] Edited by: Lord Arbalest on 25/03/2010 01:15:08 Business & Financial Information Auditee had originally aimed to raise 10 billion isk in investments, but was put off by the reception his initial offer received. This investment amount was changed to 2 billion isk with the auditee believing he had to ægrind repÆ to be able to obtain his larger investment û the Auditor advised against this approach. When questioned by the Auditor over the change, the auditee communicated he still wished to raise more and decided to re-raise the requested investment to 10b. The Auditor warned it would be unwise to do so. The Auditor has suggested that the auditee considers a time-scale for his bond. The Auditee has agreed. The auditee purchases items from sell orders in Jita, and then transports them to other regions to sell. He currently transports in a Viator. The auditee wishes to deploy the requested investment of 10b onto Yuq to operate in another region to compliment bardarabaraÆs trading. Currently the auditee has 15b tied up in his trading operation û namely in sell orders. Evidence of trading found. No evidence of the presence of buy orders were found. Auditee has stated he is planning to put some up in the near future û currently he buys from sell orders in Jita. Auditee trades a high volume of goods daily. Evidence of the transport ship found that the auditee has stated he will be using. Auditee has stated his current wealth has been amassed from, 2 bil in data core sales, 3 bil in collecting a loan he issued to a friend prior to taking a break, and the rest earned from various EVE trading activities. Assets and Balance An estimate of the AuditeeÆs NAV. Balance Wallet balance: 2329m Market escrow: 0m Sell Orders: 13533m Contracts: 0m Investments: 0m Total: 15862m* Assets Blueprints: 0m POS: 0m Ships: 164m Ship Modules: 20m Minerals, Ice, Trade Goods, Salvage etc.: 0m Trade Stock: 178m Total: 184m Estimated Complete Total: *16046m (16b)** [Continued...]
Lord Arbalest Amarr Zero Profits	Posted - 2010.03.25 01:10:00 - [45] Edited by: Lord Arbalest on 25/03/2010 01:15:47 Business Risks In such an event as a war declaration the Auditor believe the auditeeÆs business plan will not be affected. All of the auditeeÆs characters are in npc corporations and so are immune from a war declaration. This will help in the auditee transporting goods which the business plan outlined requires allot of. The auditee is already trading with a wallet of roughly 15-16 billion isk. Adding the requested investment to this to might cause burn out and dilute his profitable ventures having to manage a vast more orders. Conclusions The Auditor classes this a very high risk investment. No collateral is being provided and this is the auditeeÆs first dealing with MD and bonds. The 12% interest a month is justified by the amount of risk this bond offers. The auditee has been accommodating to an audit and the interview process, working with the Auditor to overcome the language barrier. The auditee has been successfully trading û however, the Auditor shows concern over the actual need for additional investment when the auditee already has a large amount of isk invested into his trading operation. Auditor wishes to draw attention to the information uncovered related to the topic of characters and the inconsistencies. Basic business plan and used by many to bring in suitable profits. Invest what you can afford to lose.
Estel Arador Minmatar Estel Arador Corp Services	Posted - 2010.03.25 01:17:00 - [46] Originally by: Lord Arbalest Previously Owned Characters -konduktorsha, koletus3 and Admiralus No longer belong to the Auditee who has given the access of the entire account including all three characters ocated on it to a RL friend with no charge. Shouldn't you include 'EULA violation detected' as a huge big "Red Flag"? Free jumpclone service\|924 stations - 6000+ users
Lord Arbalest Amarr Zero Profits	Posted - 2010.03.25 01:20:00 - [47] Originally by: Lord Arbalest Red Flag: Character trading û previously owned characters issue discussed later in the audit.
Estel Arador Minmatar Estel Arador Corp Services	Posted - 2010.03.25 01:30:00 - [48] Edited by: Estel Arador on 25/03/2010 01:33:14 Originally by: Lord Arbalest Originally by: Lord Arbalest Red Flag: Character trading û previously owned characters issue discussed later in the audit. So you make the risks in the audit easier to identify by using coloured flags() and then you use the most undescriptive language possible to obscure the issue? I figured the red flag was about legal 'character trading' (as it mentions) and the (attempted) sales Yuq has been involved in, not about 'account trading' - which is an EULA violation. () The flags tbh are just dumbing down your work, people should read the full report, as this discrepancy between the flags and the actual report shows. Edit: How did you verify the claim that the account no longer belongs to Yuq anyway? Free jumpclone service\|924 stations - 6000+ users
mourningdawn	Posted - 2010.03.25 02:58:00 - [49] Thank you for your time Lord A. Yuq reset the reservations for some stranger reason. It works out though, as I will not be investing.
Taram Caldar Blackwater USA Inc. Gentlemen's Club	Posted - 2010.03.25 04:03:00 - [50] Originally by: Estel Arador Edited by: Estel Arador on 25/03/2010 01:33:14 Originally by: Lord Arbalest Originally by: Lord Arbalest Red Flag: Character trading û previously owned characters issue discussed later in the audit. So you make the risks in the audit easier to identify by using coloured flags() and then you use the most undescriptive language possible to obscure the issue? I figured the red flag was about legal 'character trading' (as it mentions) and the (attempted) sales Yuq has been involved in, not about 'account trading' - which is an EULA violation. () The flags tbh are just dumbing down your work, people should read the full report, as this discrepancy between the flags and the actual report shows. Edit: How did you verify the claim that the account no longer belongs to Yuq anyway? It's not Arbalests job to delineate 1 red flag from another. He is just listing all the red flags associated with the offering. It is up to the investor to read and and assess the audit provided. I think Arbalest did a fine job. If you think you can do better.... then be an auditor. Excellent audit, as always, LA. Market Alerts Mailing List
Thoraemond Minmatar Far Ranger	Posted - 2010.03.25 05:06:00 - [51] Originally by: Taram Caldar Originally by: Estel Arador Originally by: Lord Arbalest Red Flag: Character trading û previously owned characters issue discussed later in the audit. So you make the risks in the audit easier to identify by using coloured flags and then you use the most undescriptive language possible to obscure the issue? I figured the red flag was about legal 'character trading' (as it mentions) and the (attempted) sales Yuq has been involved in, not about 'account trading' - which is an EULA violation. Edit: How did you verify the claim that the account no longer belongs to Yuq anyway? It's not Arbalest's job to delineate 1 red flag from another. He is just listing all the red flags associated with the offering. It is up to the investor to read and and assess the audit provided. I think Arbalest did a fine job. On MD GAAS It might have been an improvement to see (i) the character trading and (ii) the admission of an 'account trading' EULA violation covered by two separate 'flags' in the audit. Where there are two different issues disclosed in the audit, and the auditor chooses to use the 'flags' reporting model, it is the auditor's job to properly differentiate those two flags. As Estel Arador suggests, there is a material difference between those two issues, so it's worth keeping them discrete. That said, I would not consider the conflation here a fatal flaw in the audit, since the underlying issues are laid out. Call it 'room for improvement' rather than a 'problem', maybe? On the substance The currently listed pilots look like a roster of alts, given their birth dates and SP counts. One of the pilots on the 'given away' account looks like a main. It would be nice to have some way to substantiate that the claim of an EULA violation is not simply a ploy to distance a main from a scam attempt, but maybe that's just not possible. á á
Kera Delacour Royal Black Watch Highlanders	Posted - 2010.03.25 05:45:00 - [52] Thank you for the information in the audit, Lord Arbalest. I see no reason to trust this investment. I see that Yuq canceled all reservations but just to be clear, I'm withdrawing my reservation. Not worth investing in. Far too risky. ---
Yuq Aliastra	Posted - 2010.03.25 06:46:00 - [53] Edited by: Yuq on 25/03/2010 06:52:56 If anyone want invest u can do it, just sent money with description and sign here Radioactive cats have 18 half lives. (Unless in a box, in which case they have half a chance of having no half lives.)
Estel Arador Minmatar Estel Arador Corp Services	Posted - 2010.03.25 10:23:00 - [54] Originally by: Taram Caldar It's not Arbalests job to delineate 1 red flag from another. He is just listing all the red flags associated with the offering. It is up to the investor to read and and assess the audit provided. If he uses the flags he should make the description as clear as possible. Referring to account trading as character trading is not clear, as they are completely different things. Originally by: Taram Caldar I think Arbalest did a fine job. If you think you can do better.... then be an auditor. You know, perhaps I should be. Here is an undisclosed alt of Yuq, which Yuq nor Lord Arbelast mentioned. - jurasic was born 2006.09.10 and still exists ingame; - on 2007.07.17 jurasic posted a character sale for 'efrit' (isk going to padshiiangel as with other trades); - jurasic's thread was bumped repeatedly by Admiralus on 2007.07.19; - at that time the account with Admiralus was still under Yuq's control, as he used konduktorsha to buy Yuq on 2008.02.09. As you can see there is a link between Yuq > konduktorsha > Admiralus > jurasic, but there's no mention of jurasic anywhere. Free jumpclone service\|924 stations - 6000+ users
Nudibranch	Posted - 2010.03.25 15:01:00 - [55] Thank you for the audit Lord Arbalest. Despite the cleared reserve list, to confirm my position; I will NOT be investing in this opportunity.
Anna Hansson	Posted - 2010.03.26 12:39:00 - [56] As of now not interested in investing.
Estel Arador Minmatar Estel Arador Corp Services	Posted - 2010.03.27 23:00:00 - [57] Though this offer is dead, I'm still interested in hearing from Lord Arbalest about these two issues: - How was the claim "No longer belong to the Auditee" (which is presented as fact) verified? - Why is there no mention of the character 'jurasic' in the audit? These issues don't matter much as far as this offer is concerned (since it's dead anyway) but are still relevant for the interpretation of audits performed by Lord Arbalest, as they concern his methodology and his standards of evidence for claims. Free jumpclone service\|924 stations - 6300+ users
Lord Arbalest Amarr Zero Profits	Posted - 2010.03.28 14:24:00 - [58] Originally by: Estel Arador Though this offer is dead, I'm still interested in hearing from Lord Arbalest about these two issues: As stated somewhere above it would be virtually impossible to 100% verify a character on a separate account no longer belongs to the auditee - I did the best I could with mechanics. I worked with what I had available. That was; discovering while all the API verifiable characters on different accounts had player donation transfers between each other, managing the auditee's wealth, no signs of interaction with the characters in question were present. A series of questions and consistencies in interview. Whilst also, the admittance to the auditor of breaching the EULA - an illegal action. As for the character 'jurasic'. I raise awareness of any suspicious activities. In this case as you have stated: Originally by: Estel Arador Yuq > konduktorsha > Admiralus > jurasic I decided to stop the puck at Admiralus which was the last 'active' character. On interview with the auditee, jurasic was communicated to have been a no sp trial used to scout ahead for the auditee's main characters. The character has never been in a corporation and has no standings with anyone, nor posts on the forums of negative value. The auditee's language barrier also makes it easy to differentiate him and others when in conversation or studying writing styles. Note taken, wording shall be reviewed.
Estel Arador Minmatar Estel Arador Corp Services	Posted - 2010.03.28 15:16:00 - [59] Thanks for the elaboration Lord Arbalest. All I'll add is that jurasic was created 2006.09.10 and made a few posts 10 months later, which rules out that it was a trial character as Yuq claimed. Free jumpclone service\|924 stations - 6300+ users

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