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Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 5 post(s) |
Verone
Gallente Veto Corp
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Posted - 2010.04.05 20:25:00 -
[31]
Originally by: CCP Pann Dear capsuleers,
Recently, it came to our attention that there were conflicting rules about whether or not it was permissible to discuss other games in this section of the EVE forum.
I would like to explain the reason why the rule existed in the first place. As the original EVE community manager, it fell to me to create the forum rules back in the day. Though we did have volunteer forum moderators then, I carried the bulk of responsibility for moderating and it was simply easier to have people to post about other games on the official forums for those games.
The special rules for OOPE were written in 2004 by the then-new community manager. It was an oversight that the contradictory rule went unnoticed for so long. We really donÆt have an excuse and I take responsibility and personally apologize for our failure to correct it sooner.
The Community team has read your feedback and we agree that itÆs time for a change. We will allow discussions about other games in OOPE though we will set some ground rules in order to keep those discussions constructive. (Shadow will be posting the amended rules shortly.) We know rules and guidelines are never popular but hope youÆll understand the reason for them and work together with us to find a compromise that everyone can live with happily. WeÆre always interested in hearing your feedback and ask that you use the petition system to register complaints about specific rules and moderation decisions.
Further discussion within the Community team also found everyone in agreement that warnings that were given in relation to this situation prior to this post should be rescinded and weÆre in the process of finding and removing those now.
Fly safe, ~P~
Good to see you guys doing what's right.
I'll apologise for kicking up a fuss about it in the CSM forums, and spreading the link around. You guys over there in Reykjavik are awesome, but this rule was just plain wrong, and was having a seriously crappy effect on the forums.
It's awesome to see that something's been done about it, because it was getting biblically stupid.
<3
>>> THE LIFE OF AN OUTLAW <<< |
Menkala
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Posted - 2010.04.05 20:28:00 -
[32]
http://eve-search.com/thread/1107760/page/1#1
Bingo, thanks Lance.
Yeah, this. This was the OOPE rules up until a few days back. Quite plainly allowed to talk about other games... not something that you came up with years ago that just wasn't paid attention to. (As I'm fairly sure rule 17 was).
I really didn't like the lack of info that accompanied this change.
Don't get me wrong, I'm glad everythings fixed and won't say any more on the matter after this, but I would still like an explanation about why it was changed in secret in the first place.
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yfz3r0
Caldari TunDraGon Pandemic Legion
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Posted - 2010.04.05 20:28:00 -
[33]
Good job CCP.
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Akita T
Caldari Caldari Navy Volunteer Task Force
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Posted - 2010.04.05 20:30:00 -
[34]
Got to love people that can admit when they're wrong and actually do something about it. Thumbs up CCP for this one.
_
Beginner's ISK making guide | Manufacturer's helper | All about reacting _
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Lance Fighter
Amarr
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Posted - 2010.04.05 20:30:00 -
[35]
Originally by: Menkala http://eve-search.com/thread/1107760/page/1#1
Bingo, thanks Lance.
Yeah, this. This was the OOPE rules up until a few days back. Quite plainly allowed to talk about other games... not something that you came up with years ago that just wasn't paid attention to. (As I'm fairly sure rule 17 was).
I really didn't like the lack of info that accompanied this change.
Don't get me wrong, I'm glad everythings fixed and won't say any more on the matter after this, but I would still like an explanation about why it was changed in secret in the first place.
You have no clue how long it took me to find tha in the first place - I mustve spent the better part of an hour looking for it last week...
Originally by: CCP Shadow Have you ever wished you could have prevented a train wreck before it actually happened? I need to stop this one before the craziness begins.
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Red Raider
Caldari Airbourne Demons DeMoN's N AnGeL's
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Posted - 2010.04.05 20:31:00 -
[36]
Dust this mean you are going to delete the stupid Dust threads in the assembly hall and elsewhere?
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Zions Child
Caldari Carthage Industries Consortium.
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Posted - 2010.04.05 20:35:00 -
[37]
Rejoice! For the War of OOPE Has Ended!!! Government and Order Has Returned to the Land! Water and Food For ALL!!!! Signature not appropriate - Adida |
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CCP Pann
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Posted - 2010.04.05 20:37:00 -
[38]
Guys, I don't know how else to say it except to own up that there was a domino effect of mistakes that were made, including the "ninja revision", and we're doing our best to set things right now. I don't think it's fair to vilify one or two people for what happened. In fact, that's why it was important to me that I make the apology on behalf of the team and why I'm monitoring this thread now. We screwed up and we're sorry.
While I'm here again, let me address some of the new questions that have popped up.
1. Continued moderation/locking of posts and signatures related to this brouhaha is being done under my orders. We can't move forward if people are still beating that poor, dead horse. If I thought offering a pint of blood or a pound of Oreos would make things better, I would, but it won't. Some folks will just have to be mad until they aren't mad anymore and I don't have a magic "cheesed off" eraser. Boy, would my life be simpler if I did.
2. Mashie: Yes, "gb2wow" is considered trolling and will not be permitted. If you think you have some compelling reason why that shouldn't be considered trolling but instead is actually a constructive post, you're welcome to send in a petition explaining your reasons why.
3. Lance: Even inviting people to join a group/guild/clan/etc. exclusively for EVE players in another game would be against the rules for this forum but you would still be able to invite people in the manner I described with the HKO example. I think that's fair. As I said to Mashie, you're welcome to send in a petition to explain your counterpoint if you have one.
4. Karma: A dedicated DUST 514 site is in development though I don't have an ETA. Until then, DUST 514 discussions can happen here in OOPE or on the official DUST 514 Facebook page.
Valerie "Pann" Massey
CCP PR & Communications Director [email protected]
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Menkala
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Posted - 2010.04.05 20:37:00 -
[39]
Originally by: Lance Fighter You have no clue how long it took me to find tha in the first place - I mustve spent the better part of an hour looking for it last week...
Yeaaah im just glad im not going insane like I thought I was after having found it in 5minutes last night, and not been able to track it down in about 45mins tonight.
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Tobias Xiaosen
Gallente TX Holdings Company
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Posted - 2010.04.05 20:42:00 -
[40]
I guess that's a fair point for my sig...makes me sad that my pretty sig didn't even last a whole day though. And so many people were using it too! O well, at least I didn't pay an excessive amount of isk for it. I at least have a copy saved as a memento. Signature not appropriate - Adida |
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Lance Fighter
Amarr
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Posted - 2010.04.05 20:43:00 -
[41]
menkala
Pann: fair enough, and I/we really appreciate your efforts to fix the mess, no matter whos fault it was
Originally by: CCP Shadow Have you ever wished you could have prevented a train wreck before it actually happened? I need to stop this one before the craziness begins.
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Xen Gin
Silurian Operations
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Posted - 2010.04.05 20:57:00 -
[42]
Edited by: Xen Gin on 05/04/2010 20:59:19
Originally by: CCP Pann Guys, I don't know how else to say it except to own up that there was a domino effect of mistakes that were made, including the "ninja revision", and we're doing our best to set things right now. I don't think it's fair to vilify one or two people for what happened. In fact, that's why it was important to me that I make the apology on behalf of the team and why I'm monitoring this thread now. We screwed up and we're sorry.
Thanks for the apology, but still we don't get an explanation on what started this "domino effect". But I suspect you will just say some fluff about collective failure of community management, and not actually owning up to what we all know about how this started. CCP's failure to correct one of it's own, supporting them via stealth edits, allowing on a whim rules, and going up against the community, has been a PR disaster for CCP and devastating for the OOPE community. _________________________________ ## You got that? Right I'll be back in approximately 300 seconds to retort! ## |
Zedic
Amarr Universalis Imperium
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Posted - 2010.04.05 21:06:00 -
[43]
Pann,
Thank you so very much for taking the time to look into this and help us with a resolution.
/much lovins
me
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Bongo Debbie
Minmatar Trillionaire High-Rollers Suicidal Bassoon Orkesta
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Posted - 2010.04.05 21:07:00 -
[44]
Props for dealing with this and explaining everything so nicely.
Now please unban Gladys Pank for trying to cheer up OOPE in this time of darkness. I didn't even break any rules. ----
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Culmen
Caldari Macabre Votum Morsus Mihi
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Posted - 2010.04.05 21:18:00 -
[45]
Mark April 5th as VF-day Victory Forum Not just for the posters, but for the mods and the community as a whole! and further more why do i even need a sig? |
Slade Trillgon
Endless Possibilities Inc. Ushra'Khan
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Posted - 2010.04.05 21:22:00 -
[46]
Edited by: Slade Trillgon on 05/04/2010 21:22:37 Good to see that this has come to a positive conclusion.
Originally by: Zeba OOPE: Rebellion.
Status: Canceled.
CCP ftw!
Woot
\o/
EDIT:
Originally by: Culmen Mark April 5th as VF-day Victory Forum Not just for the posters, but for the mods and the community as a whole!
Slade
Rule #5 Repeal Petition |
Red Raider
Caldari Airbourne Demons DeMoN's N AnGeL's
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Posted - 2010.04.05 21:33:00 -
[47]
Originally by: CCP Pann
4. Karma: A dedicated DUST 514 site is in development though I don't have an ETA. Until then, DUST 514 discussions can happen here in OOPE or on the official DUST 514 Facebook page.
Originally by: Red Raider Does this mean you are going to delete the stupid Dust threads in the assembly hall and elsewhere?
This is like going to the Ghost Recon forum to complain about HAWX. Just because the games share some things doesn't make it an exception to the rule. They are completely different types of games and I don't understand how a massive emo rage that breaks the rules is allowed to persist.
Move it over here where they can whine all day and it not clog up the cogs of EVE. The Assembly Hall and FIAD has enough problems without that drivel being posted in it regularly.
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Paknac Queltel
Standards and Practices
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Posted - 2010.04.05 21:49:00 -
[48]
Posting in the official OOPE community/CCP wuv thread, woo!
My apologies to the mods who had to put up with us. I sowwee. - Paknac Queltel
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Karma
Vortex Incorporated
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Posted - 2010.04.05 21:53:00 -
[49]
oh.. and
First rule of OOPE: we accept your revised Rule #5... for now.
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Abrazzar
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Posted - 2010.04.05 21:54:00 -
[50]
Good to see that CCP is quick in correcting mistakes instead of glancing them over with gratuitous application of the banhammer. I'd say forum rule changes would be considered 'essential change' in the future and should trigger a devblog prior implementation to allow a discussion about the sense and nonsense of the changes in the feedback thread.
Also, Yay! --------
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Rawr Cristina
Caldari Omerta Syndicate
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Posted - 2010.04.05 22:05:00 -
[51]
Good to see CCP still listen to their playerbase, it's one of the reasons I still play EVE after so long... but I was worried there for a minute
- Malyutka (The Virus) - |
Tobias Xiaosen
Gallente TX Holdings Company
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Posted - 2010.04.05 22:18:00 -
[52]
Gotta admit, i've never had this much fun on a forum before. OOPE:Rebellion was pretty epic in that respect
So for that, GG CCP. GG Signature not appropriate - Adida |
Natasja Podinski
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Posted - 2010.04.05 22:27:00 -
[53]
so maybe now we can have a chat about sigs!?
cant belive some noobassadmin nerfed my sig because it was 47 pixels too wide! seriously!
get real!
it was even smaller than 24kb! Please resize your signature to the maximum allowed of 400 x 120 pixels with a maximum file size of 24000 bytes. Adida the best internetbride for sexy katalog send 1KK ISK |
Barakkus
Caelestis Iudicium
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Posted - 2010.04.05 22:30:00 -
[54]
Originally by: Xen Gin Edited by: Xen Gin on 05/04/2010 20:59:19
Originally by: CCP Pann Guys, I don't know how else to say it except to own up that there was a domino effect of mistakes that were made, including the "ninja revision", and we're doing our best to set things right now. I don't think it's fair to vilify one or two people for what happened. In fact, that's why it was important to me that I make the apology on behalf of the team and why I'm monitoring this thread now. We screwed up and we're sorry.
Thanks for the apology, but still we don't get an explanation on what started this "domino effect". But I suspect you will just say some fluff about collective failure of community management, and not actually owning up to what we all know about how this started. CCP's failure to correct one of it's own, supporting them via stealth edits, allowing on a whim rules, and going up against the community, has been a PR disaster for CCP and devastating for the OOPE community.
Most likely they were trying to get some consistency with things, as needs to be done with whatever business you happen to be running. Unfortunately, it kinda backfired with some decisions that "looked good at the time" but were actually counter productive to maintaining a happy medium.
I wouldn't call it a PR disaster since the number of people that read the forums is pretty miniscule to the actual number of players playing. You'd be surprised but on average only about 5-10% of players of the majority of mmos out there care enough to read the forums of said games, and even less bother to post. Considering this is the off topic discussion, I would venture a guess that less than 1% of the player base even looks at this board.
Originally by: CCP Dropbear
rofl
edit: ah crap, dev account. Oh well, official rofl at you sir.
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Karma
Vortex Incorporated
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Posted - 2010.04.05 22:33:00 -
[55]
oh... one request.
could you unlock a few of the more productive topics? As an example, the mass effect 2 topic.
Perhaps prune the last page and a half, as those posts are only about the new rule(tm). Up until that point, it was a *very* productive and good thread, pretty much devoid of trolls and spam.
right... now I shall go hibernate, for real. <lurkmoad>
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Lance Fighter
Amarr
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Posted - 2010.04.05 22:45:00 -
[56]
Edited by: Lance Fighter on 05/04/2010 22:45:31 could we remind shadow that quit posts are allowed, and the one he just locked is perfectly legal? edit: 4: Quit posts are allowed, however we ask you to only post that you are leaving and say goodbye to your friends, rants and non-constructive posts will be removed.
:rolleyes:
Originally by: CCP Shadow Have you ever wished you could have prevented a train wreck before it actually happened? I need to stop this one before the craziness begins.
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CCP Pann
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Posted - 2010.04.05 22:51:00 -
[57]
Karma: I have advised the team to look over threads that were locked in the last three days and unlock the productive ones, tidying up a bit as necessary. It may be tomorrow before you start seeing progress there so please bear with us a bit longer and trust that it will happen.
Lance: Please file a petition if you disagree with moderation decisions. The rule about not discussing those matters on the forum still stands.
Valerie "Pann" Massey
CCP PR & Communications Director [email protected]
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Lance Fighter
Amarr
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Posted - 2010.04.05 22:59:00 -
[58]
Would it be possible to allow the 'report' button to work on locked threads?
It seems rather roundabout to require someone to goto to the support section, log in (again -.- ) create a petition with links and all..
Anyway, its largely unimportant, feel free to ignore me really
Originally by: CCP Shadow Have you ever wished you could have prevented a train wreck before it actually happened? I need to stop this one before the craziness begins.
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Iva Posavec
Posavec Innovations Takhar Matari
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Posted - 2010.04.05 23:03:00 -
[59]
Edited by: Iva Posavec on 05/04/2010 23:04:34
Hugs and kisses to all at CCP, especially the ladies. Seriously though good going although the OOPE forums has been a mess the last few days I am glad things are resolved as far as gaming discussions go. Now the 5 minute timers and repeated log-in issues to fix.
edit: Also a petition that I made regarding the issue was replied to promptly so another thumbs up to the moderation team.
Alliance Creation |
Vaal Erit
Science and Trade Institute
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Posted - 2010.04.05 23:38:00 -
[60]
I applaud CCP Pann on an excellent post and excellent decisions.
What is being done so this does not happen again? Hey I certainly love showing how foolish and ridiculous mods are and being proven right, but I would think you should care about your own reputation.
Oh yeah and enough with the stealth editing and deleting of posts to cover your tracks. We have eve-search and frankly we play EVE and thus we are much, much craftier than you. We caught you on ghost-training, we caught you on this and we will catch you again
Originally by: Jim Raynor EVE needs danger, EVE needs risks, EVE needs combat, even piracy, without these things, the game stagnates to a trivial game centering around bloating your wallet with no purpose. |
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