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Is there actually any point to ganking someone in a cheap shuttle?

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Zax Zyx	Posted - 2010.04.11 13:37:00 - [1] Relatively new player here and neither a pirate nor a merc. Basically just past the Learning skills phase (L1 to V, L2 to IV) and skilling up for frigate/destroyer pvp. I understand that people enjoy tears and such. I've played MMO games since the first day Ultima Online came out (the 30 - 200 seconds between steps meant walking around was a combination of agony and the worst lag in my gaming experience) and pvp'd, stole and ganked often there. And been ganked often too to be honest. I just have to wonder why bother at all though when dealing with a cheap shuttle? A shuttle doesn't cost more than 20k at most so the tears, unless you can pod someone, aren't all that dear. And in my case all I had was a shuttle plus two rather inexpensive skill books, total value maybe 50k, that I had mistakenly bought when I had already injected the skills involved. Well here's the log that might explain better: ------------------------------------------------------------ Gamelog Listener: Zax Zyx Session started: 2010.04.10 13:35:34 ------------------------------------------------------------ [ 2010.04.10 13:35:42 ] (notify) Autopilot warping to Korama stargate [ 2010.04.10 13:36:28 ] (notify) Autopilot approaching stargate [ 2010.04.10 13:36:42 ] (notify) ****: You have foolishly engaged in criminal activity within sight of sentry guns and must suffer the consequences. [ 2010.04.10 13:36:44 ] (notify) ** <CON>(Caracal) has started trying to warp scramble you! [ 2010.04.10 13:36:45 ] (combat) Caldari Navy Scourge Heavy Missile belonging to ** hits you, doing 115.0 damage. [ 2010.04.10 13:36:49 ] (combat) Hobgoblin II belonging to ** lightly hits you, doing 40.8 damage. [ 2010.04.10 13:36:49 ] (combat) Hobgoblin II belonging to ** heavily hits you, inflicting 56.7 damage. [ 2010.04.10 13:36:52 ] (combat) Caldari Navy Scourge Heavy Missile belonging to ** hits you, doing 121.1 damage. [ 2010.04.10 13:36:53 ] (combat) Hobgoblin II belonging to ** hits you, doing 38.5 damage. [ 2010.04.10 13:36:53 ] (combat) Hobgoblin II belonging to **** misses you completely. [ 2010.04.10 13:36:55 ] (notify) Warping to Stargate (Vaajaita) [ 2010.04.10 13:36:56 ] (notify) External factors are preventing your warp drive from responding to this command. [ 2010.04.10 13:36:56 ] (notify) Autopilot jumping to Korama [ 2010.04.10 13:36:58 ] (None) Jumping to Stargate (Aurohunen) in Korama solar system Note: this isn't a killmail so technically it doesn't require editing out the other person's name but I'm doing so as a courtesy. Because seriously folks. Not killing an auto-piloting shuttle with a CN Heavy missile armed Caracal + Hob II drones is, in my noobish opinion, a major fail. So I'm assuming that either the guy changed his mind, wasn't paying attention, was dealing with the sentry guns or was goofing around. Also the damage took my shuttle down to 1/2 armor. Do I object to the gank attempt? Not at all. It was quite honestly the most interesting thing to happen all day long. But what bothers me is the logic of it. At some point in the near future I'll either go solo pvp, join a pvp corp or go FW. Or some combination of those. And I'd like to know the reasoning behind something like this if in the future I'm faced with an opportunity to gank someone in a shuttle. Is ganking a shuttle carrying almost worthless cargo worth the killmail? Or do people do this to be consistent in some way? As in "Everything that crosses my path ... dies!". Or is it to inflate the killboard? Which reminds me. I need to ask the guy why he only used 1 launcher.
Lady Karma	Posted - 2010.04.11 13:43:00 - [2] Shuttles often carry BPO's. There is a case of one dropping an officer invul field. One question, why do you think you should be able to autopilot through low sec with impunity? Just because you look like a weak target you should be invulnerable? Stop smoking crack, and stop autpiloting.
Orar Ironfist Incarnation of Evil	Posted - 2010.04.11 13:50:00 - [3] like the post above, people have killed shuttles with billions of isk in the cargo...and with no real way to tell what someone has in their cargo in advance you just kill it and hope to god you got lucky lol
Zeta Zyx	Posted - 2010.04.11 13:57:00 - [4] Edited by: Zeta Zyx on 11/04/2010 14:00:39 Originally by: Lady Karma Shuttles often carry BPO's. There is a case of one dropping an officer invul field. One question, why do you think you should be able to autopilot through low sec with impunity? Just because you look like a weak target you should be invulnerable? Stop smoking crack, and stop autpiloting. 1. I'd suggest shuttles mostly carry people. Perhaps they carry BPO's or Officer mods but if you were to sit at any particular gate ganking shuttles all day long I expect you'd come up with very little of any value from most of them. 2. I was in high-sec. Sorry I didn't make that clear. Frankly if I were in either low-sec or null-sec I wouldn't ask this question. I'd expect that anything non-friendly would be gate ganked. And I wouldn't be on auto-pilot either. 3. I was questioning this not because I was a weak target of opportunity or that I imagine being safe because I was a weak target. But because I can't imagine anybody wanting to risk dealing with CONCORD over a worthless shuttle carrying nothing of value. Now a pvp Caracal isn't necessarily the most valuable ship in existence, especially with platinum insurance, but losing one from ganking a shuttle? 4. Which reminds me. I could perhaps have some fun invoking CONCORD, by hotboxing two toons and having one fire on the other, near those lovely high negative security level folks sitting oh so quietly 15km+ from those Gates. No idea if it would work but it does have potential. And if it creates enemies ... well then I won't have to go looking very far for that pvp experience now will I? edit: lol. Used my science/production alt toon to reply with.
Kirra Liu Echelon Holdings Echelon.	Posted - 2010.04.11 14:23:00 - [5] If you are in low-sec then there will be people who will shoot you given the chance, it doesn't matter what you are flying as it's usually a matter of (see it -> shoot it). You could have an empty cargohold or you could have 60 billion isk in it so it makes sense. Also if he may have wanted to kill your pod as it can produce tears and some people collect corpses. The main point is that sitting doing nothing is boring whereas seeing your guns go pew pew, or bang bang depending on preference is more entertaining. I was flying through low-sec recently and lost an Apotheses shuttle to a smart-bombing battleship (ffffffuuuuuu united!) which was my own fault as I shouldn't have warped directly to the gate without bouncing off a planet and scanning the gate first, but you being on autopilot is just ****ing stupid.
Cpt Branko Retired Pirate Club	Posted - 2010.04.11 14:33:00 - [6] Edited by: Cpt Branko on 11/04/2010 14:33:24 Originally by: Zax Zyx I just have to wonder why bother at all though when dealing with a cheap shuttle? (a) For the explosion. (b) Loot. (c) Loot. (d) Loot. (e to z) Loot. Basically. People sometimes carry stuff in shuttles. Of course it's silly to do in highsec without scanning the cargo. Sig removed, inappropriate link. If you would like further details please mail [email protected] ~Saint
Zax Zyx Caldari Science and Trade Institute	Posted - 2010.04.11 14:41:00 - [7] Originally by: Cpt Branko Edited by: Cpt Branko on 11/04/2010 14:33:24 Originally by: Zax Zyx I just have to wonder why bother at all though when dealing with a cheap shuttle? (a) For the explosion. (b) Loot. (c) Loot. (d) Loot. (e to z) Loot. Basically. People sometimes carry stuff in shuttles. Of course it's silly to do in highsec without scanning the cargo. I guess the above + boredom are good reasons. heh. Just found out my idea won't work since anyone with significant negative security will make sure to have a bounty on them. Evidently CONCORD won't act against someone with both negative security and a bounty. Funny stuff. Thanks!
Cipher Jones Minmatar	Posted - 2010.04.11 15:51:00 - [8] My only question is how much pot did you have to smoke to get warp scrambled in a shuttle? This is clearly a signature.
Bongo Debbie Minmatar Trillionaire High-Rollers Suicidal Bassoon Orkesta	Posted - 2010.04.11 16:05:00 - [9] As mentioned, the loot can be good. Another reason, more apt to null but still relevant in low sec, is to keep scouts from giving intel from within your systems. Some people just want to see the world burn. ----
Zax Zyx Caldari Science and Trade Institute	Posted - 2010.04.11 18:25:00 - [10] Originally by: Cipher Jones My only question is how much pot did you have to smoke to get warp scrambled in a shuttle? None. I was auto-piloting from one station to another injecting skill books in a shuttle carrying nothing of value in high-sec. I frankly didn't think anyone would waste their time on me which is why I was listening to music through my headphones and didn't hear the I-was-being-targeted sound. But what's even funnier is that the auto-pilot dumps you 15km from a Gate and that shuttles go about 500 m/s so about 30 seconds of travel time from end of warp to Gate. Total time elapsed from start of warp scramble to jump in my case is about 15 seconds. So the guy waited until I was half-way to the Gate before doing his gank schtick. No idea why but still a little amusing.
Omara Otawan	Posted - 2010.04.11 18:35:00 - [11] My guess is the guy fails hard at setting up his overview, and accidentially shot on you instead of a war target. I dont know many people that use t2 gear for suicide ganks, and certainly not on ships they dont know the cargo.
Cpt Branko Retired Pirate Club	Posted - 2010.04.11 20:17:00 - [12] Edited by: Cpt Branko on 11/04/2010 20:17:08 Originally by: Omara Otawan My guess is the guy fails hard at setting up his overview, and accidentially shot on you instead of a war target. I dont know many people that use t2 gear for suicide ganks, and certainly not on ships they dont know the cargo. Yeah. I'm thinking the most likely scenario is that the guy simply made a mistake. If someone wanted to kill AP shuttles, they'd use a T1 fit thrasher which is dirt cheap and one-volleys it; plus of course you'd scan it. Shooting everything autopiloting in highsec is a good way to ruin your sec for no gain. Sig removed, inappropriate link. If you would like further details please mail [email protected] ~Saint
Cipher Jones Minmatar	Posted - 2010.04.11 20:42:00 - [13] Originally by: Zax Zyx Originally by: Cipher Jones My only question is how much pot did you have to smoke to get warp scrambled in a shuttle? None. I was auto-piloting from one station to another injecting skill books in a shuttle carrying nothing of value in high-sec. I frankly didn't think anyone would waste their time on me which is why I was listening to music through my headphones and didn't hear the I-was-being-targeted sound. But what's even funnier is that the auto-pilot dumps you 15km from a Gate and that shuttles go about 500 m/s so about 30 seconds of travel time from end of warp to Gate. Total time elapsed from start of warp scramble to jump in my case is about 15 seconds. So the guy waited until I was half-way to the Gate before doing his gank schtick. No idea why but still a little amusing. Ahh, my bad on the trolling bro, I see. Seriously tho, I agree that autopilot sucks with the 15km limit. the thing is they put enough space in shuttles to carry blueprints, and you could fit billions in BPO's in a shuttle. The courtesy of scanning you first would be nice but aint gonna happen. Finally, they do that kind of thing for the lol's all the time. A shame, but as you have been undoubtedly told by now "its part of the game". This is clearly a signature.
Orar Ironfist Incarnation of Evil	Posted - 2010.04.12 00:28:00 - [14] Originally by: Cipher Jones Originally by: Zax Zyx Originally by: Cipher Jones My only question is how much pot did you have to smoke to get warp scrambled in a shuttle? None. I was auto-piloting from one station to another injecting skill books in a shuttle carrying nothing of value in high-sec. I frankly didn't think anyone would waste their time on me which is why I was listening to music through my headphones and didn't hear the I-was-being-targeted sound. But what's even funnier is that the auto-pilot dumps you 15km from a Gate and that shuttles go about 500 m/s so about 30 seconds of travel time from end of warp to Gate. Total time elapsed from start of warp scramble to jump in my case is about 15 seconds. So the guy waited until I was half-way to the Gate before doing his gank schtick. No idea why but still a little amusing. Ahh, my bad on the trolling bro, I see. Seriously tho, I agree that autopilot sucks with the 15km limit. the thing is they put enough space in shuttles to carry blueprints, and you could fit billions in BPO's in a shuttle. The courtesy of scanning you first would be nice but aint gonna happen. Finally, they do that kind of thing for the lol's all the time. A shame, but as you have been undoubtedly told by now "its part of the game". he didnt die, it was in high sec, they didnt scan him, it was a failure mistake most likely. Read before posting
Cole Y0unger	Posted - 2010.04.12 02:35:00 - [15] Some folks would gank their grandma for the Lolz, But there is billions of isk that gets transported in shuttles. Rare BPO's blah blah
Dian'h Might Minmatar Cash and Cargo Liberators Incorporated	Posted - 2010.04.12 06:42:00 - [16] Originally by: Zax Zyx Evidently CONCORD won't act against someone with both negative security and a bounty. Funny stuff. Am I misreading something or did I just see you claim that concord won't shoot at people with a bounty on them?
Jotobar	Posted - 2010.04.12 11:18:00 - [17] He made an misstake, either because his overview was set up wrong so he thought you where an wartarget (in which case you kill everything you can ofcourse) or because any similiar brain fart.
Cpt Branko Retired Pirate Club	Posted - 2010.04.12 11:24:00 - [18] Originally by: Dian'h Might Originally by: Zax Zyx Evidently CONCORD won't act against someone with both negative security and a bounty. Funny stuff. Am I misreading something or did I just see you claim that concord won't shoot at people with a bounty on them? They will get shot IF they commit a criminal act, just like everyone else. They won't get shot by concord for just being in highsec except in systems where concord is the faction navy; the faction navies do that, which you can get away from, just not really spend time in system. Sig removed, inappropriate link. If you would like further details please mail [email protected] ~Saint
Lavraen Minmatar Remembrance Inc.	Posted - 2010.04.12 13:13:00 - [19] "Is there actually any point to ganking someone in a cheap shuttle?" Yes, it's funny!
Le Skunk Low Sec Liberators	Posted - 2010.04.13 04:13:00 - [20] Edited by: Le Skunk on 13/04/2010 04:15:39 Edited by: Le Skunk on 13/04/2010 04:14:43 Originally by: Zax Zyx [ 2010.04.10 13:36:56 ] (notify) Autopilot jumping to Korama [ 2010.04.10 13:36:58 ] (None) Jumping to Stargate (Aurohunen) in Korama solar system Quote: None. I was auto-piloting from one station to another injecting skill books in a shuttle carrying nothing of value in high-sec. Quote: the auto-pilot dumps you 15km from a Gate and that shuttles go about 500 m/s so about 30 seconds of travel time from end of warp to Gate. Total time elapsed from start of warp scramble to jump in my case is about 15 seconds. So the guy waited until I was half-way to the Gate before doing his gank schtick. Ill clear up a few things here after 60 seconds perusal of your logs and a simple system search in game. 1) The attack took place Aurohunen is a 0.4 system. This is a low sec system! Not high sec. Your logs show you in Aurohunen - autopiloting to and then jumping into korama - a high sec system. 2) Your aggressor was not to know you were carrying nothing of value. Often a shuttle will cary small but occasionaly high value items like blueprints, implants, and skillbooks (which indeed you WERE carrying (albeit probably crap ones)as you were plugging them in on route. Sure the pilot could cargo scan you before firing, but locking and activating a scan takes time which brings me to 3) The pilot did not wait 15 seconds then try to gank you. Given a couple of seconds for delayed reactions and decision making for 13 seconds he was locking your craft. Your shuttle has a very small sig radius, and he was using a large craft to lock it. This takes time. Heavy missiles do little damage to shuttles, and his hobgoblins take time to obey commands and travel to target. TLDR: OP autopilots across lowsec without realizing it then posts the standard "why does they shots at mes" snotty message on forums. No one bothers to actualy read the logs posted and a host of bizare theories about high sec ganking ensue. Le Skunk turns up to enlighten one and all. SKUNK (o)
Zax Zyx Caldari Science and Trade Institute	Posted - 2010.04.13 05:44:00 - [21] Originally by: Le Skunk Edited by: Le Skunk on 13/04/2010 04:17:37 Originally by: Zax Zyx [ 2010.04.10 13:36:56 ] (notify) Autopilot jumping to Korama [ 2010.04.10 13:36:58 ] (None) Jumping to Stargate (Aurohunen) in Korama solar system Quote: None. I was auto-piloting from one station to another injecting skill books in a shuttle carrying nothing of value in high-sec. Quote: the auto-pilot dumps you 15km from a Gate and that shuttles go about 500 m/s so about 30 seconds of travel time from end of warp to Gate. Total time elapsed from start of warp scramble to jump in my case is about 15 seconds. So the guy waited until I was half-way to the Gate before doing his gank schtick. Ill clear up a few things here after 60 seconds perusal of your logs and a simple system search in game. 1) The attack took place Aurohunen is a 0.4 system. This is a low sec system! Not high sec. Your logs show you in Aurohunen - autopiloting to and then jumping into korama - a high sec system. 2) Your aggressor was not to know you were carrying nothing of value. Often a shuttle will cary small but occasionaly high value items like blueprints, implants, and skillbooks (which indeed you WERE carrying (albeit probably crap ones)as you were plugging them in on route. Sure the pilot could cargo scan you before firing, but locking and activating a scan takes time which brings me to 3) The pilot did not wait 15 seconds then try to gank you. Given a couple of seconds for delayed reactions and decision making for 13 seconds he was locking your craft. Your shuttle has a very small sig radius, and he was using a large craft to lock it. This takes time. Heavy missiles do relativley little damage to shuttles, and his hobgoblins take time to obey commands and travel to target. Indeed one of his hobgoblins missed you at one point. Pilot appears to have had one missile launcher and 2 drones only as weapon systems for some reason unless the logs miss out the "group of" for some reasons. TLDR: OP autopilots across lowsec without realizing it then posts the standard "why does they shots at mes" snotty message on forums. No one bothers to actualy read the logs posted and a host of bizare theories about high sec ganking ensue. Le Skunk turns up to enlighten one and all. SKUNK 1. I guess this is an example of "Better to remain silent and be thought a fool than to open one's mouth and remove all doubt". You're right. No idea how I got there or why but for some idiotic reason I must have crossed into 0.4 territory. Checked my auto-pilot settings and it's still set to avoid low-sec but there you have. 2. I really did not intend to be "snotty". If I've come across as snotty then I apologize as there was no need for that. I genuinely thought I was still in high-sec because my auto-pilot path was from Elonaya to Todaki and there's no reason I could imagine why either that would be changed, how it could be changed or how I could end up in low-sec. 3. Rather than being mystified as to why someone took a potshot at me I must now admit that the reaction must have been incredulous surprise as a auto-piloting Gallente shuttle burbled it's way across a 0.4 gatecamp. I see now my primary error was in not analyzing the log data I had in front of me before, as in #1, opening my mouth. I apologize to one and all for wasting your time with this. 4. And I would like to thank Le Skunk for the lesson. It stings but appropriately so.
Le Skunk Low Sec Liberators	Posted - 2010.04.13 06:06:00 - [22] Stop making me feel guilty you! I only knew because I used to live in that system. If you didn't live there you wouldn't have cause to know and being badly shot at by a one missile launcher caracal in high sec would indeed be worthy of a thread. Good luck in future. SKUNK (o)
Varesk Gallente Maelstrom Crew Underworld Excavators	Posted - 2010.04.13 06:44:00 - [23] aping in low sec. that is your answer to your question. it dosnet matter. you could have been flying a rookie ship and the same thing would have happened.

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