Crazy maths.

I'd be happy to give Marmite another 30-1 thrashing.

And judging by his CSM post, Tora's campaign is doing a bit of floundering. His crazy 30 minute no dockup post gank idea is not being met with much support (nor does it make sense!).

Marmite Decs Veers, costing them 50 million ISK. Veers sends Tora an Evemail offering to cease hostilities for 8 billion isk in reparations. Tora fails to respond. Veers closes and reforms his corp costing 1.6 million isk. The war ends. Marmite has spent 50 million isk, Veers has spent 1.6 million isk.

Result - a clean 30-1 Veers victory. Marmite looks stupid. Veers looks brilliant.

Your not very bright are you cupcake?

Closing your corp due to a wardec is fail before anything else is taken into account.

Dear Veers.
Since you dont like other people "stretching" the mechanics in this "sandbox", why are you doing it yourself?
I honestly dont think CCP had in mind people shuffling corps (like you do) to get out of wars when they made the mechanics.
Like a shitload of other things in Eve, people take advantage of the grey areas.

Who are you to say that one gray area is ok and others are not?
I know you do this just for the trollings sake and trying to be eve famous...
But still, if you are advocating change, jumping corp to get out of a war is a broken mechanic right?
You have to fix that too!

PS: Telling a merc that got paid you won the war, is kinda sad really.. you clearly dont understand the consept of mercing.
Maybe its another troll trolling you? making you lash out and make a fool of yourself

Finally, a decent question! It took a non-Marmite for that, of course.

For one, CCP used to consider corp rolling an exploit. They specifically reversed that position, and now explicitly allow players to do it without consequence.

Is it gamey? Sure. Should it be curtailed? Sure. How do you curtail it? Well, here is what I think. I think the current wardecc mechanics are crazy. The 90 man Marmite collective can wardecc my 1 man corp. Does that create a fair fight or interesting content? Nope. It's stupid. I have no hope of beating them (barring my current strategy). All it leads to is docking up and playing on alts. And let's say I got friends to help and brought a huge fleet to Uedama..what would Marmite do? Dock up and play on alts of course.

That's the problem...Eve wars are not real wars. There is no negative consequence from docking up and playing on alts for a week. In RL if someone invades you, you respond or you die. In Eve, you just ignore it.

Result - only new players really fight wars, and they get slaughtered by thugs like Marmite. The whole system is a giant sham.

Solution? Get rid of all non-mutual wars. They serve no purpose, they are a joke, and it's just a free jobs plan for station and gate campers like Marmite. It adds nothing valuable to the game, and should be thrown out of it. Then I would no longer need to dodge these worthless wars.

So that would mean if a corp with less the numbers you have dec you its all kosher? and you wont change corp?
interesting..

Oh, and making people dock up for a week or more is a viable tactic... people actually pay us to do exactly that.
So the smaller bears can get enough available spacerocks or as a method to get a bigger bear out of the area!
Dont mess with my sandcastle!

Making people dock up is useless because they can accomplish the exact same objectives on alts. What's the point?

No, even if the numbers were equivalent, the fact that there is no way to actually hurt the attacker makes the wars useless.I'll fight a war if winning it means the attacker gets a year log sentence in eve jail.

Making people dock up is useless because they can accomplish the exact same objectives on alts. What's the point?

Not all in eve has alt, and not all chars are skilled the same... you dont have to be bright to understand that it has an effect.

PS: Most of the time

Great...so wars work against new and casual players...not against rich and experienced players. So just a grief mechanic. Time to get rid of it. And sunset Marmite "joke" Collective.

No, even if the numbers were equivalent, the fact that there is no way to actually hurt the attacker

If blowing up spaceships isn't a means to hurt someone then the attacker equally has no means of hurting the defender.

All wars do is enable people to shoot eachothers space ships.

Both the defender and attacker are equally capable of fitting a ship for PVE or for PVP.

There were numerous occasions early on during my PVP career that I was wardeced by people who proceeded to attempt to kill me in PVE fit ships, they failed because I, the defender, was PVP fit. Moreover there's very little difference in terms of skill requirements for effective PVE ships and effective PVP ships. The defender in almost all cases, and particularly in the case of mission and incursion runners entirely capable of being PVP fit if he wants to be.

On a purely mechanical level there's zero difference between the defender and attacker when it comes to their ability to "defeat" the other.

One side not being able to determine a way to beat the other, or being unable or unwilling to execute it is the natural way that a winner or loser in a conflict is determined.

It sounds bizarre to actually be typing this as part of a real conversation, but it is entirely okay and entirely expected for the people who don't know a way to win to lose. That's the very nature of competition.

Result - a hopeless situation for ABC mining corp, and a great example of why the wardecc system is so hopelessly broken.

Hopeless? Minning vessels have proven to be effective for BAW in the past (they're rather proud of it it seems).. point is theres always a way to fight for your flag. food for thought..

Also, can we go back to friendly-ish trash talk? If this continues as it does, were all gonna focus on Veers and hold hands over his corpse..

Your average PvE mining corp isn't going to be able to do that. A Marmite wardecc is effectively a death sentence. Thankfully, despite the merc crying, dec dodging works. Hopefully nonconsensual wardeccs in highsec will soon be a thing of the past.

You sound like quite the defeatist. Has anyone ever told you that?

Nonconcentual pvp is at the core of Eve. It will stop the day Eve dies.


ps. hopefully dropping corp and reforming instantly will be seen as the exploit it is and will soon be a thing of the past.

Nah, I win every war I'm in. If you want nonconsensual PvP go suicide gank someone. Paying 50 million to be able to force people into PvP in highsec without CONCORD assistance is antithetical to the core of highsec. Hopefully non-mutual wardeccs will be seen as the exploit it is and will soon be a thing of the past.

I like how you ignore the use of wars to knock down structures such as POSes and POCOs, which are well beyond the realm of suicide ganking. In your no non-consenual decs in HS world, do you ban all player owned structures? Or do you make corps that own them subject to non-consensual war?

Frankly, it sounds like you haven't really thought through the consequences of your version of an "ideal" EVE. It also seems like you're making an awfully large number of assumptions about how wars are used based on a small amount of personal experience.

Veers looks brilliant.

You don't get it. Marmite Collective decs ABC mining corp, a 15 man outfit of low sp miners with minimal combat skills. If they keep mining and hauling, Marmite will blow them up. If they fit for PvP and engage Marmite, Marmite will blow them up. If they dock up for a week, they may not have enough alts to play on, and will be forced to play a different game. If they hire every Merc in the galaxy to come to Uedama, Marmite will dock up and play on nullsec alts.

Result - a hopeless situation for ABC mining corp, and a great example of why the wardecc system is so hopelessly broken.

Hahaha, trust me, there are many things in life, but that aint one of them

@BAW members : Stop making sense, so we can do the smacktalk thing again