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Ava Starfire
Minmatar
Nordanverdr Modr
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Posted - 2010.05.02 15:11:00 -
[1]
Hello all.
I enjoy my shield buffer fits (rifter, stabber, cane) as they fit my playstyle (faster and no repper management, ie, easier for me) but always wonder about my rigs.
Those of you that use buffer fits, do you use 3x field extender rigs, or 2 extender rigs and 1 em resist rig? Plugging the EM hole seems reasonable enough, or is a larger buffer better?
Thanks, Ava
Space is fun! |
Sidus Isaacs
Gallente
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Posted - 2010.05.02 15:31:00 -
[2]
In general I use 2 CDFE and 1 EM.
However, if I use two Invuls I go 3 CDFE.
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http://desusig.crumplecorn.com/sigs.html |
Ap0ll0n
Gallente
Cutting Edge Incorporated
RAZOR Alliance
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Posted - 2010.05.02 15:47:00 -
[3]
Depends. For my shield harbinger, i use 1 invul + LSE + em, thermal and cdfe rigs.
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RavenPaine
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Posted - 2010.05.02 15:49:00 -
[4]
When you pick defence for a ship , its almost like flipping a coin . You never really know what the enemy will shoot you with. Some times its epic fail , and other times your fit may feel like pure genius.
That said: In general , if I'm thinking buffer , then I go all buffer. And if I'm worried about resists , I go all resists. If I mix rigs at all , its usually a damage rig I slip in there.
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Harotak
THE FINAL STAND
The Final Stand.
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Posted - 2010.05.02 16:07:00 -
[5]
Depends on how many hardening effects I have that are stacking penalized. If I have two Invulns and I am getting a siege link resist bonus, I won't be fitting any resist rigs since that would put the link bonus on a forth level stacking penalty.
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Zeba
Minmatar
Honourable East India Trading Company
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Posted - 2010.05.02 16:13:00 -
[6]
Logi support also can come into play as resist tanks are better for them for rr effeciency. So if you have say scimitar support you would want to use your rig slots to boost resists intead of buffer.
 Originally by: CCP Zymurgist
Get off the forums and go kill someone!
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Ava Starfire
Minmatar
Nordanverdr Modr
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Posted - 2010.05.02 16:17:00 -
[7]
All good points, and a few I had never even considered (like logi support) so i have some things to consider now.
I am usually alone, in losec or npc null. Rifter or stabber I use no resist mods except the DCU. The hurricane, sometimes I use 2 lse and dcu, sometimes 1 lse, inv field, and dcu. None of those have overwhelming resists by any stretch of the imagination.
Looks like an EM rig is probably not a bad idea most of the time?
Thanks much for the responses so far, keep em coming please!
Ava
Space is fun! |
Zilberfrid
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Posted - 2010.05.02 17:00:00 -
[8]
What will you be facing?
If you will just face angels, resists will not matter as much as sheer amount, but if it is vs players, those few % will matter. Also, look into projectile rigs.
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Mahke
Aeon Of Strife
Discord.
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Posted - 2010.05.02 17:18:00 -
[9]
the third cdfe and anti em are roughly equivalent on paper with even damage distribution
In practice, it depends on whether you're going to be shot by EM  .
So consider what the people you fly against like to fly, and fit for it (or just go with the anti-em since its marginally cheaper).
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Ava Starfire
Minmatar
Nordanverdr Modr
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Posted - 2010.05.02 17:35:00 -
[10]
Originally by: Zilberfrid
What will you be facing?
If you will just face angels, resists will not matter as much as sheer amount, but if it is vs players, those few % will matter. Also, look into projectile rigs.
I use projectile rigs on occasion, but with the new TEs, the once mandatory ambits are a lot less inviting (2 TEs/3 gyros on a cane is niiice) with the exception of rifters. If i use an armor tanked rifter (rare, but it does happen) I use 2 ambits and a burst aereator. On shield tanked rifter versions with a neut, I dont have the PG to use proj. rigs anyways!
This is for pvp, btw. Rats are easy enough to kill no matter how I am tanked.
Space is fun! |
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Kyo Haku
Minmatar
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Posted - 2010.05.02 18:18:00 -
[11]
Just curious, I had planned on using core defense shield purger for increased regen. What are the benefits of those rigs over purgers?
also: shield Rifter FTW!
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"Far be it from me to stand in judgment. I prefer to sit." -Stephen Colbert |
Gartel Reiman
The Athiest Syndicate
Advocated Destruction
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Posted - 2010.05.02 19:38:00 -
[12]
Originally by: Kyo Haku
Just curious, I had planned on using core defense shield purger for increased regen. What are the benefits of those rigs over purgers?
The benefit of these rigs is that they're useful for PvP. 
In a PvP situation, your shield regen rate will typically be well, well below the amount of incoming damage - I think you're unlikely to get more than say 100 EHP/sec max recharge with a sensible PvP setup. Additionally, since you'll have many hundreds of incoming DPS, you'll likely not even spend that long in the optimum recharge zone. Hence increasing the regen rate is an extremely marginal thing to improve, it would be a bit like fitting a small shield booster on a battleship. "Every little helps", and all that, but there are much better options.
The Core Defence Field Extenders, for example, give 15% extra shield HP each. This flat increase at the start will be more HP than the extra amount your shield would recharge during the fight with purgers, in any realistic PvP scenario. Hence they are flat-out better for keeping you alive longer. Resistance rigs work in a similar way; reducing (up to) 30% of the incoming damage will result in you staying alive longer than adding a little bit of extra recharge.
This thread is basically about whether people consider a flat 15% boost to shield EHP against all damage types (extenders) to be better than a 42.8% boost to EHP against EM damage only (EM resist rig, assuming no invulns on the ship).
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CpHarding
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Posted - 2010.05.02 20:54:00 -
[13]
Originally by: Gartel Reiman
Originally by: Kyo Haku
Just curious, I had planned on using core defense shield purger for increased regen. What are the benefits of those rigs over purgers?
The benefit of these rigs is that they're useful for PvP.
In a PvP situation, your shield regen rate will typically be well, well below the amount of incoming damage - I think you're unlikely to get more than say 100 EHP/sec max recharge with a sensible PvP setup. Additionally, since you'll have many hundreds of incoming DPS, you'll likely not even spend that long in the optimum recharge zone. Hence increasing the regen rate is an extremely marginal thing to improve, it would be a bit like fitting a small shield booster on a battleship. "Every little helps", and all that, but there are much better options.
The Core Defence Field Extenders, for example, give 15% extra shield HP each. This flat increase at the start will be more HP than the extra amount your shield would recharge during the fight with purgers, in any realistic PvP scenario. Hence they are flat-out better for keeping you alive longer. Resistance rigs work in a similar way; reducing (up to) 30% of the incoming damage will result in you staying alive longer than adding a little bit of extra recharge.
This thread is basically about whether people consider a flat 15% boost to shield EHP against all damage types (extenders) to be better than a 42.8% boost to EHP against EM damage only (EM resist rig, assuming no invulns on the ship).
^Gart has it right again, although a few PVP ships can benefit from Purgers, Onyx and broadsword for small gang (<10) without logistics can work, although i prefer buffer fits.
look at what you usually face, if you can't remember, look at what killed you the last few times you died around where you are, if its mainly gallente / caldari (kinetic bonus) then it is prob better fitting 3 extenders. ( most pvp drones are exp or thermal primary damage as well)
if you are facing a lot of amarr and minmatar, might be worth fitting the anti-em.
Don't forget that when you overload your invuln, you will be getting less benefit for overloading if you fit the anti-em due to stacking, although being an elaborate piece of bait is the only circumstance where i can see this being a problem.
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Leeluvv
Destructive Influence
IT Alliance
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Posted - 2010.05.02 20:56:00 -
[14]
Edited by: Leeluvv on 02/05/2010 20:58:41
If you buffer fit, look at all the shield and armour rigs, as a single trimark on a shield fitted Harbinger will give you more EHP than a single CDFE or EM-shield resist rig. This is because it compensates for the EM shield resist hole by increasing armour, which has a high EM resist.
You want balanced overall resists on a buffered ship, despite what the 'don't mix tank' brigade tell you. They're correct for active or passive (regen) tanking, but not pure buffer.
Originally by: Doctor Mabuse
A wife is just a T2 GF. They're more expensive and their resists are higher
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Khors
Amtek Inc
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Posted - 2010.05.02 21:01:00 -
[15]
Originally by: Leeluvv
If you buffer fit, look at all the shield and armour rigs, as a single trimark on a shield fitted harby will give you more EHP than a single CDFE or EM-shield resist rig. This is because it boosts your EM resist hole by increasing your armour, which has high resists.
You want balanced overall resists on a buffered ship, despite what the 'don't mix tank' brigade tell you. They're correct for active or passive (regen) tanking, but not pure buffer.
You want to maximize one of the two to get the most out of it. If you shield tank a harbinger, you will want to **** off when shield gets too low. Having 2k ehp extra in your armor doesnt help when you pull out to recover as shields go low.
On another note: I use 1x em 2x extender rigs usually. 3x extenders if the ship got shield res bonuses, like merlin, moa, drake etc.
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