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Tranquility and market issues post downtime Friday, 07 May

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Author	Thread Statistics \| Show CCP posts - 9 post(s)
Orbite BioTech Industries	Posted - 2010.05.07 17:49:00 - [1] Originally by: Falkrich Swifthand Originally by: crashchick There is a easy method called Backup and Restore, if they dont have a DB backup then no wounder it takes so long AFAIK they backup every downtime. It's part of the reason FOR downtime. Maybe they're trying to repair the DB so that they don't have to roll back. <tech crap> I'd be surprised if they only backed up like that, more common to use transaction log shipping for "constant" backups (Yes, yes I know they are not constant, but the time frame of backups is down to the DBA's running the MSSQL cluster. It's near enough to be counted as constant in most cases - 15 minute shipping is common depending on the size of the DB)... MSSQL can be quite stable and is widely used so there's not really much point blaming MS - it's more common that the issues are caused by the way the DBA's design/implement things or the coders interact with things. I'd be surprised if there wasn't a rollback personally, least there shouldn't be "much" lost of they do use log shipping. </tech crap> Yes I'm bored :P
Orbite BioTech Industries	Posted - 2010.05.07 17:59:00 - [2] Edited by: Orbite on 07/05/2010 18:01:24 Originally by: ispyispy Originally by: DJB16 they do part backups each downtime coz to so a backup for the WHOLE of eve in less than 10 hours would be impossible thats partly why RAID systems were invented :) Ok - RAID isn't backup simple as that. It's redundancy intended to keep systems online during a partial failure of 1 or more drives/controllers. Originally by: Falkrich Swifthand Originally by: Orbite snip Isn't that kind of backup really slow to restore from? Yes, it can be. Which could quite well explain extending downtimes when the cluster goes haywire. Really depending on the database, number of records, number of transactions etc etc. It's diffrent for every setup to be honest. Edit: Shortened that second quote, didn't look quite that long when answering it!
Orbite BioTech Industries	Posted - 2010.05.07 18:05:00 - [3] Edited by: Orbite on 07/05/2010 18:06:09 Originally by: Marcus Vorenius give me a freakin break - the database is as good as the ISK you thow at it. Imagine one of the top-5 Investment banks going off-line for an hour ... not happening. I'm pretty sure the bank would have the money to throw at getting 5 9's uptime. Sure CCP could get 5 9's but your monthly fee would likely have to go up to pay for the extra hardware, licences and staff... Edit: 5 9's = 99.999% - Sorry, used to referring to it as that at work.
Orbite	Posted - 2010.05.07 18:13:00 - [4] Originally by: Marcus Vorenius Originally by: Orbite Edited by: Orbite on 07/05/2010 18:06:09 Originally by: Marcus Vorenius give me a freakin break - the database is as good as the ISK you thow at it. Imagine one of the top-5 Investment banks going off-line for an hour ... not happening. I'm pretty sure the bank would have the money to throw at getting 5 9's uptime. Sure CCP could get 5 9's but your monthly fee would likely have to go up to pay for the extra hardware, licences and staff... Edit: 5 9's = 99.999% - Sorry, used to referring to it as that at work. .... which confirms my point: it's a matter of how much they invest in the tools (i.e. DB) and people (e.g. DB designers, admins etc.) ... obviously the need to throw a few more ISK at this So you (and others) wouldn't moan if that entailed your monthly payment (or whatever you choose for a payment cycle) went up as a result of providing for that?
Orbite	Posted - 2010.05.07 18:22:00 - [5] Originally by: Marcus Vorenius Originally by: Orbite Originally by: Marcus Vorenius snipped extra quotes .... which confirms my point: it's a matter of how much they invest in the tools (i.e. DB) and people (e.g. DB designers, admins etc.) ... obviously the need to throw a few more ISK at this So you (and others) wouldn't moan if that entailed your monthly payment (or whatever you choose for a payment cycle) went up as a result of providing for that? lol - if they can just provide a useable forum that would ge a great start. On your question: they should just make sure that the current features are working in a decent way - i.e. major fleet battles, then I would be happy to pay more Fair enough :) Most people that tend to be in the "spend more money" camp also fall into the camp of *****ing about price rises to fund them... Can't argue with someone who wouldn't have an issue with it.
Orbite	Posted - 2010.05.07 18:44:00 - [6] Edited by: Orbite on 07/05/2010 18:44:41 Edited by: Orbite on 07/05/2010 18:44:26 Originally by: Bexar Yang Let me take this opportunity to ask a question that I keep forgetting. In someone's post they had the TM (Trademark) symbol appended to a word. How did they do that? Is it the old ASCII key code system? ALT+0153 on Windows. Oh and the server seems to be backup according to my PC. Least, it's responding to ICMP PING now. Edit: 170 seconds till startup :)
Orbite	Posted - 2010.05.07 19:00:00 - [7] Originally by: ispyispy Originally by: Revchan Wow....people love to complain. You should be happy we have the technology to actually have games like this where you can play with thousands of other people. Does anyone even realize what it takes to create and run these games? and do you realize how much they are paid for it ? 40000 players paying 14 euros per month on average ( and dont tell me about paying with isk because the plex's are originally bought with even more EUR ) means 18.6 THOUSANDS EUR per day. Maybe you should consider the running costs of all the servers, power, bandwidth, staff, offices....
Orbite	Posted - 2010.05.07 19:07:00 - [8] Originally by: Heckter Grimm huh 17 players online? CCP Developers/Staff/Admins
Orbite	Posted - 2010.05.07 19:17:00 - [9] Originally by: Herra Muron Originally by: Orbite Originally by: ispyispy Originally by: Revchan Wow....people love to complain. You should be happy we have the technology to actually have games like this where you can play with thousands of other people. Does anyone even realize what it takes to create and run these games? and do you realize how much they are paid for it ? 40000 players paying 14 euros per month on average ( and dont tell me about paying with isk because the plex's are originally bought with even more EUR ) means 18.6 THOUSANDS EUR per day. Maybe you should consider the running costs of all the servers, power, bandwidth, staff, offices.... 6.72 mil EUR a year. And obviously they dont lose anything when they screw it up. My company keeps a trade market price feed ( 25,000+ requests a second during peak time ) battery of servers with alot less EUR. If its down only a minute we're out of business. I'm pretty sure that you don't know how many TPS CCP's DB server's run at (nor do I) so I strongly suspect that until people do have that information you can't compare it do something you deal with/work with. Finance and Gaming create diffrent types of load on their hosting platforms (I know that from experience) - direct comparisons are pointless. If you do know the scale of the TPS the CCP DB's deal with feel free to enlighten us all. Also take into account that datacenter space in the UK is not cheap, it's one of the most expensive places inside Europe for hosting - Power, Transit and Space all cost a fair bit more than in other places. These things all have to be taken into account. It is however one of the best places for "central" connectivity over to the USA, Russia and Europe. If you factor all of that it, it's likely going to be costing more than you expect.
Orbite	Posted - 2010.05.07 19:24:00 - [10] Originally by: Juliet Stellrecht Originally by: Jsha we paying for it... really for all that ****ing servers .. and when its offline its ok -but we need a compensation -right??? I agree. At this point, I'm starting to think we deserve a compensation, if ONLY because we were told in-game, right after DT I might add, that it would be 20 minutes. Well, I've got reasonable compensation even. For as long as the server's been down, take that amount of time, and give EVERY account that long to have a 100% skill training bonus. Let us get our time back at least. :/ Sorry to mention it again but not every problem can be estimated timewise accurately. I'm pretty sure that they wouldn't have said 20 minutes if they had known the extent of the issue (which we still don't know what it was...)

Orbite	Posted - 2010.05.07 19:32:00 - [11] Originally by: GerbilZ So what about our skill training queues? I know for some people thats a grain of sand on a verg big beach, but do they still tick over as usual? Depends if they had to roll anything back I guess.
Orbite	Posted - 2010.05.07 19:43:00 - [12] Looks like it's backup, nice work CCP :)

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