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Arugas Koken
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Posted - 2010.05.26 01:38:00 -
[1]
Many mining bots require Widescreen to check if the lasers are on.
"The reason it's so hard for bots to check is because the pretty green circle changes depending on where you are in relation to the sun. The glare from the sun creates lighter patches on the circle, making it impossible to use pixel detection or an image for it to compare to. There is also the problem that half of the menu's and stuff are slightly transparent, making it also stupidly difficult for pixel detection and imagesearch functions." - botter/bot builder
It seems that previous patches have put the macro miners out of business for a few days/weeks after deployment due to changes in menu layouts and such. I have a feeling that the removal of widescreen may put them out of business for a bit longer this time around.
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Professor Leech
Transmetropolitan
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Posted - 2010.05.26 09:16:00 -
[2]
For at least one application this will be effective at shutting it down. There are always anti-macro counter measures with each patch. I'm hoping that the results are both effective and hilarious.
 Originally by: Crawe DeRaven
this thread is obviously going places
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TheOldBrutos
Minmatar
Yarrbear Inc.
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Posted - 2010.05.26 09:50:00 -
[3]
Hope next hulkageddon will allow us to pwn 80% of true miners and 20% of elite macroers... see you in belt 
http://eve-pk.net
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Lao Dangtze
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Posted - 2010.05.26 09:53:00 -
[4]
I wish they would get serious about getting rid of macros and have a captcha randomly check people who are doing repetitive tasks.
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Vaerah Vahrokha
Minmatar
Vahrokh Consulting
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Posted - 2010.05.26 10:25:00 -
[5]
That bot coder has to smarten up and look around him.
Where I work we have encountered and fixed similar issues 3 years ago, there's at least one open source solution available.
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Auditing & consulting
When looking for investors, please read
http://tinyurl.com/n5ys4h + http://tinyurl.com/lrg4oz
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OPX2
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Posted - 2010.05.26 10:55:00 -
[6]
Originally by: Vaerah Vahrokha
That bot coder has to smarten up and look around him.
Where I work we have encountered and fixed similar issues 3 years ago, there's at least one open source solution available.
How stupid is your boss, if he hired you?! On EvE Forum?! Reported
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Mara Rinn
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Posted - 2010.05.26 11:03:00 -
[7]
I would have thought that the logserver output would be more than adequate for building mining bots. But what would I know?
The idea that the glare from the local star messes things up for macro miners seems a little far fetched.
[Aussie players: join ANZAC channel] |
Borgh Brainbasher
Noir.
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Posted - 2010.05.26 12:05:00 -
[8]
Originally by: OPX2
Originally by: Vaerah Vahrokha
That bot coder has to smarten up and look around him.
Where I work we have encountered and fixed similar issues 3 years ago, there's at least one open source solution available.
How stupid is your boss, if he hired you?! On EvE Forum?! Reported
you know, there might be perfectly legal ways to macro-ify parts image detection. maybe like bluescreen technology and general CGI in the movies.
---
Warning: You are on the pvp only server. |
shakedatazz
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Posted - 2010.05.26 12:46:00 -
[9]
The idea that the glare from the local star messes things up for macro miners seems a little far fetched.
Agreed, as I understand it, macro programs use coordinates and do not rely on what you can actually see...
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OPX2
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Posted - 2010.05.26 13:22:00 -
[10]
Originally by: Borgh Brainbasher
Originally by: OPX2
Originally by: Vaerah Vahrokha
That bot coder has to smarten up and look around him.
Where I work we have encountered and fixed similar issues 3 years ago, there's at least one open source solution available.
How stupid is your boss, if he hired you?! On EvE Forum?! Reported
you know, there might be perfectly legal ways to macro-ify parts image detection. maybe like bluescreen technology and general CGI in the movies.
I suppose I should have given him the benefit of doubt, but nevertheless this is an opportunity for the CCP to investigate further.
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Shar Tegral
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Posted - 2010.05.26 13:31:00 -
[11]
Originally by: OPX2
I suppose I should have given him the benefit of doubt, but nevertheless this is an opportunity for the CCP to investigate further.
Yes because we all know that the forum accusations are the best starting place for investigations. (Nothing like justifying putting your foot in your mouth is there?)
Wealth, howsoever got, in Eve makes
Lords of morons and gentlemen of thieves;
Aptitude and intellect are needless here;
'Tis impudence and money that grants fame. |
SencneS
Rebellion Against Big Irreversible Dinks
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Posted - 2010.05.26 13:51:00 -
[12]
OMG they are removing that widescreen black bar thing... NOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!!
I don't run bots because I don't mine but I LIKED those black bars because it's less screen to render on this horrible laptop I have :( They really did make a difference in performance.
Besides why wouldn't they just force the view to be all the way up or down. Since all the belts are on the same plan as the sun, it's no feat to simple left+right mouse button, push forward for 1 second. Done. No Sun effects.
There is a believe I have... If someone wants to do something you don't like, they are going to do it anyway, dumping time, money, effort into slowing them down, at the expense of the opinions of those that do what you want is a bad bad, poor choice and business practice..
Amarr for Life |
RAW23
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Posted - 2010.05.26 13:52:00 -
[13]
Originally by: OPX2
Originally by: Borgh Brainbasher
Originally by: OPX2
Originally by: Vaerah Vahrokha
That bot coder has to smarten up and look around him.
Where I work we have encountered and fixed similar issues 3 years ago, there's at least one open source solution available.
How stupid is your boss, if he hired you?! On EvE Forum?! Reported
you know, there might be perfectly legal ways to macro-ify parts image detection. maybe like bluescreen technology and general CGI in the movies.
I suppose I should have given him the benefit of doubt, but nevertheless this is an opportunity for the CCP to investigate further.
Assuming VV hasn't changed jobs recently she doesn't work in a macro-mining factory (she has been quite open in the past about discussing her employment in the SCC lounge). But what the hell! Burn the witch!! Unfounded accusations are always the best place to start an inquisition from.
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Shar Tegral
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Posted - 2010.05.26 14:34:00 -
[14]
I just think it sucks because I've always played with widescreen active. The black background is ideal for me to keep track of targets and chat channels.
Additionally, I've repeatedly asked CCP about having some sort of Sun Occlusion option. I know that occlusion is possible as I regularly rotate the screen to make it happen with whatever object is handy. There are a number of medical conditions that can be aggravated, or be visually impairing, from excessive use of glare.
So, yeah, losing widescreen only brings about more glarable area on the screen.
As to macro miners, lets not kid ourselves. They'll be updating and back to work faster than CCP will get the patch stable.
Wealth, howsoever got, in Eve makes
Lords of morons and gentlemen of thieves;
Aptitude and intellect are needless here;
'Tis impudence and money that grants fame. |
Dethmourne Silvermane
Gallente
League of Gentlemen
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Posted - 2010.05.26 14:36:00 -
[15]
Originally by: RAW23
Assuming VV hasn't changed jobs recently she doesn't work in a macro-mining factory (she has been quite open in the past about discussing her employment in the SCC lounge). But what the hell! Burn the witch!! Unfounded accusations are always the best place to start an inquisition from.
If VV weighs the same as a duck...
(cue riotous mob)
Regarding high-sec mining:
Originally by: AmarrettoDiAmarr
3-4 million ISK/hr is perhaps .15 0r .20 US$/hr; not quite prison wages and you are around less honest people.
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Sugar Jugs
Juggalicious
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Posted - 2010.05.26 15:02:00 -
[16]
I dont play with the black bars, but I do play at widescreen resolution (so I can have wallet orders tab/market side by side, and yet tile up my multiple client windows).
Are they removing these widescreen resolution options? I dont understand and patch notes are not clear on this either. :/
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SencneS
Rebellion Against Big Irreversible Dinks
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Posted - 2010.05.26 15:12:00 -
[17]
Originally by: Sugar Jugs
I dont play with the black bars, but I do play at widescreen resolution (so I can have wallet orders tab/market side by side, and yet tile up my multiple client windows).
Are they removing these widescreen resolution options? I dont understand and patch notes are not clear on this either. :/
They are removing the Black Bars options which emulated the "Widescreen" look at any resolution. Even on a wide screen monitor.
The Laptop I play on is 1440x800, which is an option, but the "Widescreen" option added black bars to the top and bottom of the screen. It is important to note that only the "Space" part screen was effected, The hud, windows, chat window etc all where overlays. As Shar said it did keep the chat window background constant making it easier to read.
Removal of this feature is like removal of the "Load Station" button, CCP's laziness to remove the feature that no longer works in a new patch then actually fix it :( to the CSM FORUM!!!
Amarr for Life |
Vaerah Vahrokha
Minmatar
Vahrokh Consulting
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Posted - 2010.05.26 16:21:00 -
[18]
Originally by: OPX2
Originally by: Vaerah Vahrokha
That bot coder has to smarten up and look around him.
Where I work we have encountered and fixed similar issues 3 years ago, there's at least one open source solution available.
How stupid is your boss, if he hired you?! On EvE Forum?! Reported
Not the sharpest knife in the drawer, aren't us?
Too bad there's no "lmgtfy.com" for EvE-search, otherwise you'd find out about my automotive production lines related job, including coding SCADAs / HMI. Incredibly enough, that stuff also involves developing solutions involving artificial vision, both hardware and software, via smart cameras or frame-grabber + software reconoissance software.
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Auditing & consulting
When looking for investors, please read
http://tinyurl.com/n5ys4h + http://tinyurl.com/lrg4oz
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MailDeadDrop
The Collective
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Posted - 2010.05.26 19:27:00 -
[19]
Hey Chribba! Chribba Chribba (has to occur 3 times I'm told). See if you can create a page equivalent to lmgtfy.com, but directed to Eve-Search.com. Should actually be pretty easy, and definitely LOL-worthy.
MDD |
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Chribba
Otherworld Enterprises
Otherworld Empire
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Posted - 2010.05.26 20:22:00 -
[20]
Actually one time is enough 
And as far as the site goes... I dunno what's asked really (+ I'm drinking beers to sustain the wait... could be the reason for my lack of understanding) |
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Seriously Bored
Minmatar
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Posted - 2010.05.26 20:49:00 -
[21]
Originally by: Chribba
Actually one time is enough
And as far as the site goes... I dunno what's asked really (+ I'm drinking beers to sustain the wait... could be the reason for my lack of understanding)
Let me Google it for you Chribba.
(We would love an EVE-Search version of the website.)
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thugbooty
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Posted - 2010.05.27 06:10:00 -
[22]
Couldn't you just open the map and right-click drag the stars off and you'd have a totally black screen? For umm... mineral gathering purposes.  |
Damon Pierce
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Posted - 2010.05.27 06:38:00 -
[23]
Originally by: Chribba
Actually one time is enough
And as far as the site goes... I dunno what's asked really (+ I'm drinking beers to sustain the wait... could be the reason for my lack of understanding)
Wait, how the ****? How did he.... how did you......
/o\ |
Vaerah Vahrokha
Minmatar
Vahrokh Consulting
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Posted - 2010.05.27 09:25:00 -
[24]
Getting back on topic:
My "day zero" bot findings
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Auditing & consulting
When looking for investors, please read
http://tinyurl.com/n5ys4h + http://tinyurl.com/lrg4oz
|
GauteGodager
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Posted - 2010.05.27 11:25:00 -
[25]
I find it hard to believe that widescreen change makes botting harder but it was surprising to see some ice belts empty yesterday & today, only 2-3 macks/hulks instead of the usual 30+ army
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Antralas Teraak
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Posted - 2010.05.27 13:06:00 -
[26]
Actually it makes botting harder as far as I know most bots used the black bars to set themseles up + they moved the undock button so might take the bots an wek to come back or so but I dont think its a solid solution after al
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Arugas Koken
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Posted - 2010.05.28 00:04:00 -
[27]
It seems they have already found a fix for a very popular free bot. It seems they are having a few issues but it is functional. 
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Vaerah Vahrokha
Minmatar
Vahrokh Consulting
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Posted - 2010.05.28 06:46:00 -
[28]
Yes, it looks like some bots work again. Today there are 3 times more botters than yesterday.
The "ice mining population" is still 40% less than normal, apparently some (including the guy with 9 botted Machinaws I talked about in the general forum) are still stranded.
For the little I know, a widespread bot program that got fixed is mostly single client oriented, the one still broken is the one allowing for many clients running at the same time.
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Auditing & consulting
When looking for investors, please read
http://tinyurl.com/n5ys4h + http://tinyurl.com/lrg4oz
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Tehg Rhind
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Posted - 2010.05.28 07:07:00 -
[29]
Originally by: Vaerah Vahrokha
Yes, it looks like some bots work again. Today there are 3 times more botters than yesterday.
The "ice mining population" is still 40% less than normal, apparently some (including the guy with 9 botted Machinaws I talked about in the general forum) are still stranded.
For the little I know, a widespread bot program that got fixed is mostly single client oriented, the one still broken is the one allowing for many clients running at the same time.
Couldn't they link activity to the macro program breakdowns/fixes. Like if someone is on 18 hours a day 7 days a week except when the program doesn't work, boom. Guess there could be people that would be exceptions to that, but...I dunno I think given enough breakdown/fix cycles you could easily identify who was macroing
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Shar Tegral
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Posted - 2010.05.28 07:14:00 -
[30]
Originally by: Tehg Rhind
Couldn't they link activity to the macro program breakdowns/fixes. Like if someone is on 18 hours a day 7 days a week except when the program doesn't work, boom. Guess there could be people that would be exceptions to that, but...I dunno I think given enough breakdown/fix cycles you could easily identify who was macroing
You'd get a lot of false positives that way. Last patch I couldn't get into Eve because of hardware issues though I know that <blush> I have a tendency to be logged in for long periods of time. (I forget to log off when I run out to handle a call.) Myself, I think the idea of some form of captcha would work.
Wealth, howsoever got, in Eve makes
Lords of morons and gentlemen of thieves;
Aptitude and intellect are needless here;
'Tis impudence and money that grants fame. |
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