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Author	Thread Statistics \| Show CCP posts - 3 post(s)
Cheap Dude	Posted - 2010.06.18 05:49:00 - [1] A very big fleet fight happend some days ago. The 'NC' jumping a large fleet into a smaller fleet. This resulted in the NC loosing 6 titans (and a alot of caps). The destruction was possible because the NC caused too much lag for themselfs. The next day this screenshot was posted. Large portion of their fleet was found floating in space including most of their titans. Also the 'NC' confirmed they got some ships back including a titan. I ask for a senior GM to look into this and give a public reply on the matter. This doens't feel right. I am sure I aint the only one. I really hope CCP does the right thing and/or atleast give a reply on the matter. Thx in advance
Reediculouhs	Posted - 2010.06.18 05:52:00 - [2] Did you guys inform CCP ahead of time so they could ensure the lag was not this bad? If not.....you ain't gonna get diddly squat!
Terrigal	Posted - 2010.06.18 05:57:00 - [3] Been there done that in H-W fleet fight notification were forwarded to CCP and it didnt make a bit of difference as most of us died the lag death.
Cheap Dude	Posted - 2010.06.18 06:11:00 - [4] I am only asking for a GM to look into the matter and do the right thing, whatever CCP think its the right thing. If this matter will not be investigated it will create a nasty precedent for future fleet engagements. I am sure I ain't the only one waiting for CCP to give an official reply on the matter. Don't forget the killmails were send to the killers, I believe the losses where also posted on the EVE website by ISD. How can it be the ships are found floating in space? How can the ship be killed and reappear the next day?
Gixxer 1000 Caldari Ceptacemia	Posted - 2010.06.18 06:44:00 - [5] Originally by: Cheap Dude I am only asking for a GM to look into the matter and do the right thing, whatever CCP think its the right thing. If this matter will not be investigated it will create a nasty precedent for future fleet engagements. I am sure I ain't the only one waiting for CCP to give an official reply on the matter. Don't forget the killmails were send to the killers, I believe the losses where also posted on the EVE website by ISD. How can it be the ships are found floating in space? How can the ship be killed and reappear the next day? Preferential treatment? I've barely made it out myself on a lag fest in my capital's, made the jump, but was black-screened for hours on end. Tried to log-off and back on, nothing. Eventually, when I could log on, I was still in my capital in an emergency safe spot in the system I jumped out to. If this is indeed true, then there is no doubt that the NC ***s got some GM/Dev loving. I'm not a fan of PL, but fair is fair, PL should get their Titans replaced as well. And, where does CCP draw the line? I've lost ships to lag, ships that blew up after I got to a safe POS, 20 minutes after the engagement, as many people have witnessed for themselves. Shouldn't I have my ships replaced then too after this "new" ruling? Its pretty simple really. CCP knows their game is broken, they change the rules on the fly, and yet we continue to pay to play. Who are the real losers here? Yeah, step slowly back away from the mirror m8's...
Fiery Redhead	Posted - 2010.06.18 06:52:00 - [6] Word on the street is in very high lag situations "ghost ships" can appear after the battle. These ships are supposidly boardable and have negative armor. Maybe this isn't the same thing though.
Klavis lychnuchus Caldari Hotel Charlie	Posted - 2010.06.18 07:17:00 - [7] Yes CCP were notified in advance for node reinforcement. It's because CCP had already confirmed "Something is very wrong, we're working to fix it asap!" so the "Our logs show nothing" couldn't reasonably be applied in this instance. Thems the breaks! Please re-size your signature to the maximum allowed of 400 x 120 pixels with a maximum file size of 24000 bytes. Zymurgist
Herateis	Posted - 2010.06.18 07:29:00 - [8] Originally by: Gixxer 1000 Originally by: Cheap Dude I am only asking for a GM to look into the matter and do the right thing, whatever CCP think its the right thing. If this matter will not be investigated it will create a nasty precedent for future fleet engagements. I am sure I ain't the only one waiting for CCP to give an official reply on the matter. Don't forget the killmails were send to the killers, I believe the losses where also posted on the EVE website by ISD. How can it be the ships are found floating in space? How can the ship be killed and reappear the next day? Preferential treatment? I've barely made it out myself on a lag fest in my capital's, made the jump, but was black-screened for hours on end. Tried to log-off and back on, nothing. Eventually, when I could log on, I was still in my capital in an emergency safe spot in the system I jumped out to. If this is indeed true, then there is no doubt that the NC *s got some GM/Dev loving. I'm not a fan of PL, but fair is fair, PL should get their Titans replaced as well. And, where does CCP draw the line? I've lost ships to lag, ships that blew up after I got to a safe POS, 20 minutes after the engagement, as many people have witnessed for themselves. Shouldn't I have my ships replaced then too after this "new" ruling? Its pretty simple really. CCP knows their game is broken, they change the rules on the fly, and yet we continue to pay to play. Who are the real losers here? Yeah, step slowly back away from the mirror m8's... that happened to me recently. I suddenly lost my ship through all 4600 of its effective HP, when I was taking no damage at all before from a gas cloud and just running to the gate to activate it. yes all of the sudd my ship is gone, and this is just a mission where noone else eve nshot at me and it was ambient damage that did it, and I know I wasnt lagging. no damage indications came up on screeen, just put-put-put-INSTADEAD. was really bull**. yet Im not reimbursed for that.
Gnulpie Minmatar Miner Tech	Posted - 2010.06.18 07:35:00 - [9] A clarification about that would be good. Especially since a CSM member is involved. That CSM member said that some other people scooped several of those ghostships also but a petition made a GM giving back those ships to the 'rightful' owners, all within 1 or 2 hours. So yes CCP, please clarify that.
Zun Da	Posted - 2010.06.18 07:45:00 - [10] Originally by: Cheap Dude Don't forget the killmails were send to the killers, I believe the losses where also posted on the EVE website by ISD. How can it be the ships are found floating in space? How can the ship be killed and reappear the next day? And what with those ships and capitals these titans did kill during the battle? And with other (super)capital kills during heavy lag and in bugged systems? Will they get replaced too?
Afrodite Draconis	Posted - 2010.06.18 07:50:00 - [11] Originally by: Cheap Dude A very big fleet fight happend some days ago. The 'NC' jumping a large fleet into a smaller fleet. This resulted in the NC loosing 6 titans (and a alot of caps). The destruction was possible because the NC caused too much lag for themselfs. The next day this screenshot was posted. Large portion of their fleet was found floating in space including most of their titans. Also the 'NC' confirmed they got some ships back including a titan. I ask for a senior GM to look into this and give a public reply on the matter. This doens't feel right. I am sure I aint the only one. I really hope CCP does the right thing and/or atleast give a reply on the matter. Thx in advance This indeed needs clarification. If this is true, it will kill fleet fights since nobody bothers to fight when ships magically reappear after fights. Althought I'll vote for bad troll, but it would be really nice to have response from CCP on this.
Gavjack Bunk	Posted - 2010.06.18 07:52:00 - [12] So CCP do what they think is the right thing, now you want them to do the right thing? Why don't you just say what you want them to do, then they can get right on it. In the meantime, just sit a while and wait for 1000 idiots to think that Eve can handle their weird desires and watch with glee as they learn, again, that it can't. -- On planets... nobody can see you macro mining...
1Ekrid1	Posted - 2010.06.18 07:54:00 - [13] Originally by: Gavjack Bunk So CCP do what they think is the right thing, now you want them to do the right thing? Why don't you just say what you want them to do, then they can get right on it. In the meantime, just sit a while and wait for 1000 idiots to think that Eve can handle their weird desires and watch with glee as they learn, again, that it can't. I have a feeling u like taunting babies with candy. There's 1, repeat 1, frigate in the T1 lineup designed to be a suicide tackler. the rest are for COMBAT. so don't tell me to tackle when I'm in a combat T1 frig. OR tell CCP to fix their mess.
Chaos Incarnate Faceless Logistics	Posted - 2010.06.18 08:44:00 - [14] Edited by: Chaos Incarnate on 18/06/2010 08:46:42 Quote: How can it be the ships are found floating in space? How can the ship be killed and reappear the next day? word on the grapevine is that it's some sort of accidental duping, which I'm inclined to believe simply because several successful fleet fight reimbursements (which afaik were to be totally denied) for supercaps in a few hours is pretty much unpossible. according to the NC, a number of their supercaps in question had jumped out (lost fuel and cap from jumping) under fire, but never disappeared from the laggy system in question...thus resulting in them dying. The day after, the capitals were found floating in space near their old jump-in locations and grabbed by the NC and a few others. I'd bet the jumpin/jumpout routine got stuck somehow from the lag and didn't complete until something gets cleaned out at downtime and...poof, ship reappears. Magic. _____________________ Horrors! Demons in the deep!
KiaTader	Posted - 2010.06.18 08:51:00 - [15] Must be a dev or so in NC :D
1Ekrid1	Posted - 2010.06.18 08:53:00 - [16] lol fail =/= magic There's 1, repeat 1, frigate in the T1 lineup designed to be a suicide tackler. the rest are for COMBAT. so don't tell me to tackle when I'm in a combat T1 frig. OR tell CCP to fix their mess.
Tippia Sunshine and Lollipops	Posted - 2010.06.18 09:19:00 - [17] Originally by: Reediculouhs Did you guys inform CCP ahead of time so they could ensure the lag was not this bad? If not.....you ain't gonna get diddly squat! I think that's just the point the OP is trying to make: why did NC get their ships back? ——— “If you're not willing to fight for what you have in ≡v≡… you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.” — Karath Piki
serento	Posted - 2010.06.18 09:25:00 - [18] Edited by: serento on 18/06/2010 09:26:11 Be cool to see what happens :) Serento
Roemy Schneider Vanishing Point.	Posted - 2010.06.18 09:29:00 - [19] very common, mister edit ^^ - putting the gist back into logistics
Khors Amtek Inc	Posted - 2010.06.18 09:30:00 - [20] Interesting, hope to hear from ccp what happened here and how they will deal with it. I'm sure it will be lots of drama whatever route they chose, but deleting the jesus titans might be the more reasonable, after all these years of denying any ship reimbursements from combat zones.
Namira Sable Minmatar Pator Tech School	Posted - 2010.06.18 09:32:00 - [21] The amount of alt posting is this thread is amazing, but I too would like to see CCP make a statement on this. I will lose much faith in the game if they decide not to. Spacial anomaly excuses only go so far.
Aylara	Posted - 2010.06.18 09:37:00 - [22] Soo CCP, are you gonna reimburse PL titans too?
Lance Fighter Amarr	Posted - 2010.06.18 09:40:00 - [23] fun story: nobody gives a **. Its the GD forums: discuss something that the general public gives a damn about. Take your alliance drivel out to coad, or better, private forums. Once youve done that, remember that CCP does not make a policy of giving a damn about things posted in GD. If you want something answered, PETITION IT. If you want something answered quickly, too ing bad. The forums isnt the right place for this anyway. HTFU and stop whining. Originally by:** CCP Shadow Have you ever wished you could have prevented a train wreck before it actually happened? I need to stop this one before the craziness begins.
Afrodite Draconis	Posted - 2010.06.18 10:06:00 - [24] Originally by: Lance Fighter fun story: nobody gives a **. Its the GD forums: discuss something that the general public gives a damn about. Take your alliance drivel out to coad, or better, private forums. Once youve done that, remember that CCP does not make a policy of giving a damn about things posted in GD. If you want something answered, PETITION IT. If you want something answered quickly, too **ing bad. The forums isnt the right place for this anyway. HTFU and stop whining. Yet Another Empire Carebear whining. Just STFU.
Jojo Redana	Posted - 2010.06.18 10:29:00 - [25] Originally by: Afrodite Draconis If this is true, it will kill fleet fights since nobody bothers to fight when ships magically reappear after fights. It's not magic dude. Make love not war! -- I'm lost in space
Blane Xero Amarr The Firestorm Cartel	Posted - 2010.06.18 10:31:00 - [26] Originally by: Afrodite Draconis Originally by: Lance Fighter fun story: nobody gives a **. Its the GD forums: discuss something that the general public gives a damn about. Take your alliance drivel out to coad, or better, private forums. Once youve done that, remember that CCP does not make a policy of giving a damn about things posted in GD. If you want something answered, PETITION IT. If you want something answered quickly, too ing bad. The forums isnt the right place for this anyway. HTFU and stop whining. Yet Another Empire Carebear whining. Just STFU. Lance an empire carebear? _____________________________________ Haruhiist since December 2008 Originally by:** CCP Fallout Been there. Done that. Need antibiotics.
Slade Trillgon Endless Possibilities Inc. Ushra'Khan	Posted - 2010.06.18 10:37:00 - [27] This should be interesting to follow. Originally by: Blane Xero Originally by: Afrodite Draconis Originally by: Lance Fighter fun story: nobody gives a **. Its the GD forums: discuss something that the general public gives a damn about. Take your alliance drivel out to coad, or better, private forums. Once youve done that, remember that CCP does not make a policy of giving a damn about things posted in GD. If you want something answered, PETITION IT. If you want something answered quickly, too **ing bad. The forums isnt the right place for this anyway. HTFU and stop whining. Yet Another Empire Carebear whining. Just STFU. Lance an empire carebear? I was about to say the same thing Slade :Signature Temporarily Disabled:
Roemy Schneider Vanishing Point.	Posted - 2010.06.18 10:53:00 - [28] give it up already... CCP never speaks or does anything about their screw-ups. adding stuff? yes. fixing/improving existing errors? that's like admitting failure. hell, no! - putting the gist back into logistics
Cone Filler	Posted - 2010.06.18 10:56:00 - [29] I lost sevearal ships to lag aswell can i please have them reimbursed?

CCP Adida C C P C C P Alliance	Posted - 2010.06.18 13:46:00 - [30] If you are looking to speak with a Game Master please create a petition. They will be able to answer any questions you may have. They do not generally address issues on the forums. Adida Community Rep CCP Hf, EVE Online

Grillmeister Grim	Posted - 2010.06.18 13:54:00 - [31] The GM's talk on the forums if it is important enough. I think this IS important. People getting supercapitals back, keeping the insurance money. CSM members getting premium GM service in form of 1-2 hour fast petitions without needing to wait. At least that is what the forums say. It would be very nice if a GM could confirm that these are wrong rumours and not true. Write a petition to the GMs? Should the GM's be bombarded with hundreds of petitions about the same issue? It is really much easier if they could come forward and saying that such a thing didn't happen. After all, we are talking about 500 bil isk. And if you buy GTC for that, it is a value of $25.000 I am pretty sure that this IS of general interest.
Schani Kratnorr x13 IT Alliance	Posted - 2010.06.18 14:04:00 - [32] Originally by: CCP Adida If you are looking to speak with a Game Master please create a petition. They will be able to answer any questions you may have. They do not generally address issues on the forums. Fail response. 1. You failed to lock the thread for "discussing accusations of EULA-breach." 2. You failed to grasp the logic of this post - that GMs/devs/CSM/CCP cannot be trusted. If the OP is correct, then a petition would simply be ignored. Your reply simply fuels speculations. the proper response could be: "as we have already told you on the in-game news, six titans and severeal other capitals were lost. if any of those were 're-boarded' due to a technical glitch, then the ships in question will be removed (as they are registered as gone.)" "we would also like to remind all players that, as a general rule, we do NOT replace ships lost in 'fleet battles.' This policy serves the purpose of avoiding rampant speculations and rumours of favouritism." ... wow, ccp should hire me to sort these things out.
Musical Fist Gallente The Unknown Bar and Pub	Posted - 2010.06.18 14:13:00 - [33] According to Shamis this also happened to PL, so really so far randomly after a major engagement all none SC ships tend to get reimbursed in an unusual manner. Internal affairs must be busy today :P
Zuretul Gallente	Posted - 2010.06.18 14:13:00 - [34] Originally by: CCP Adida If you are looking to speak with a Game Master please create a petition. They will be able to answer any questions you may have. They do not generally address issues on the forums. So instead of CCP's official statement, CCP wants thousands of players sent petitions in already really exhausted petition system?
ForceM Gallente POS Builder Inc. Silent Requiem	Posted - 2010.06.18 14:17:00 - [35] Originally by: Schani Kratnorr Originally by: CCP Adida If you are looking to speak with a Game Master please create a petition. They will be able to answer any questions you may have. They do not generally address issues on the forums. Fail response. 1. You failed to lock the thread for "discussing accusations of EULA-breach." 2. You failed to grasp the logic of this post - that GMs/devs/CSM/CCP cannot be trusted. If the OP is correct, then a petition would simply be ignored. Your reply simply fuels speculations. the proper response could be: "as we have already told you on the in-game news, six titans and severeal other capitals were lost. if any of those were 're-boarded' due to a technical glitch, then the ships in question will be removed (as they are registered as gone.)" "we would also like to remind all players that, as a general rule, we do NOT replace ships lost in 'fleet battles.' This policy serves the purpose of avoiding rampant speculations and rumours of favouritism." ... wow, ccp should hire me to sort these things out. Fail response tbh from you. Hes not accusing of eula breaches but he thinks there is something not right and want someone to look into it. And for your "propper" responses: CCP did not tell anyone about the six titans .. but ISN did which is an independand not CCP funded news organisation. CCP Adida's response was correct. Devs do not enforce the ingame policies .. GM's do. CCP Adida clearly stated the propper way to request an investigation which is what the op wanted.
Camios Minmatar Insurgent New Eden Tribe	Posted - 2010.06.18 15:10:00 - [36] CCP should clarify this. Rules must be equal for everyone. While it's clear that lag cannot be considered a game mechanic, it does not make sense to reimburse all lag related losses. Maybe, fixing the lag generating gameplay would help with this kind of problems.
Batolemaeus Caldari Vauryndar Dalharil	Posted - 2010.06.18 15:11:00 - [37] Originally by: Cheap Dude The 'NC' jumping a large fleet into a smaller fleet. You're wrong. If you want to create a terrible whine, at least be consistent with facts. What happened was, that ships that jumped out of the system in question, had fuel and cap removed and appeared in their new system, reappeared in the system they jumped out of after their pilots logged off. There they died, then respawned in the systems they jumped out to unpiloted. The same bug has been reported several times since Dominion hit. CCP did nothing. The only thing that was different here, was that supercaps got killed and respawned. It already happened to dreads and carriers in y-2ano, p-2ttl and possibly dg-
Geanos Phoenix Tribe Cult of War	Posted - 2010.06.18 15:13:00 - [38] Originally by: ForceM stuff Btw, you have left a hair between your teeth
Musical Fist Gallente The Unknown Bar and Pub	Posted - 2010.06.18 15:17:00 - [39] Originally by: Batolemaeus Originally by: Cheap Dude The 'NC' jumping a large fleet into a smaller fleet. You're wrong. If you want to create a terrible whine, at least be consistent with facts. What happened was, that ships that jumped out of the system in question, had fuel and cap removed and appeared in their new system, reappeared in the system they jumped out of after their pilots logged off. There they died, then respawned in the systems they jumped out to unpiloted. The same bug has been reported several times since Dominion hit. CCP did nothing. The only thing that was different here, was that supercaps got killed and respawned. It already happened to dreads and carriers in y-2ano, p-2ttl and possibly dg- Actually they never tried to jump out, not all anyway they were in that system to defend a PoS thats the reason they were there anyway knowing that it was a trap and lag worked against them THIS TIME, they tried to cyno out but failed. See NCs strategy is to get everyone their alts and trial noob ships into a system to crash it, once the system is crashed they hope to log in FIRST and kill everything, it has been a known strategy that has been practiced by Goons and I guess PL too. This backfired and instead of the node crashing NC lagged out and died -- Emo TraderJohn's Number 1 Fan!!
Batolemaeus Caldari Vauryndar Dalharil	Posted - 2010.06.18 15:20:00 - [40] Oooooh, now i get it. You're an utter moron, trying to spin this bug into something it isn't. That's why you just made up things instead of sticking to the facts. Never mind then, moving on.

GM Grimmi	Posted - 2010.06.18 15:25:00 - [41] During the fleet-battle in 6NJ8-V on June 16th server performance was adversely affected by load issues. One of the resulting problems was the revival of ships that had been killed during the fight, including a few super-capitals. We want to clarify that this was due to database issues, which are still under investigation û the ships were NOT returned by GameMasters. This matter is still being investigated and further information will be forthcoming when available. GM Grimmi Lead Game Master EVE CSS

Camios Minmatar Insurgent New Eden Tribe	Posted - 2010.06.18 15:27:00 - [42] Originally by: GM Grimmi During the fleet-battle in 6NJ8-V on June 16th server performance was adversely affected by load issues. One of the resulting problems was the revival of ships that had been killed during the fight, including a few super-capitals. We want to clarify that this was due to database issues, which are still under investigation û the ships were NOT returned by GameMasters. This matter is still being investigated and further information will be forthcoming when available. Good to know. Go go CCP
Furb Killer Gallente	Posted - 2010.06.18 15:31:00 - [43] Lol i hope for vuk lau the others already deposited ISK with chribba, then he just made enough isk due to his bets to buy a few titans.
Namira Sable Minmatar Pator Tech School	Posted - 2010.06.18 15:32:00 - [44] Originally by: GM Grimmi During the fleet-battle in 6NJ8-V on June 16th server performance was adversely affected by load issues. One of the resulting problems was the revival of ships that had been killed during the fight, including a few super-capitals. We want to clarify that this was due to database issues, which are still under investigation û the ships were NOT returned by GameMasters. This matter is still being investigated and further information will be forthcoming when available. The OP should add this comment to the first post so more can see it.
Batolemaeus Caldari Vauryndar Dalharil	Posted - 2010.06.18 15:40:00 - [45] Originally by: GM Grimmi During the fleet-battle in 6NJ8-V on June 16th server performance was adversely affected by load issues. One of the resulting problems was the revival of ships that had been killed during the fight, including a few super-capitals. We want to clarify that this was due to database issues, which are still under investigation û the ships were NOT returned by GameMasters. This matter is still being investigated and further information will be forthcoming when available. Why exactly are you doing this now, instead of straight after Dominion? The bug is over 7 months old now and has been known for that long too.
FlameGlow Rebellion Alliance	Posted - 2010.06.18 15:49:00 - [46] Originally by: Batolemaeus Originally by: GM Grimmi During the fleet-battle in 6NJ8-V on June 16th server performance was adversely affected by load issues. One of the resulting problems was the revival of ships that had been killed during the fight, including a few super-capitals. We want to clarify that this was due to database issues, which are still under investigation û the ships were NOT returned by GameMasters. This matter is still being investigated and further information will be forthcoming when available. Why exactly are you doing this now, instead of straight after Dominion? The bug is over 7 months old now and has been known for that long too. Are you new to eve and haven't seen bugs go unfixed for years? Originally by: CCP Manifest Imploding servers are not a part of our business model.
Dr Fighter	Posted - 2010.06.18 15:53:00 - [47] node crashes and server lag related problems is the new top end isk sink for allinces. two sides turn up, one leaves. whats the problem?
Batolemaeus Caldari Vauryndar Dalharil	Posted - 2010.06.18 15:56:00 - [48] Originally by: FlameGlow Are you new to eve and haven't seen bugs go unfixed for years? Rhetorical question.
Gordon Fell	Posted - 2010.06.18 16:01:00 - [49] Originally by: Dr Fighter node crashes and server lag related problems is the new top end isk sink for allinces. two sides turn up, one leaves. whats the problem? Not seeing the problem either. Please continue. Too many titans in this game anyway.
Ehranavaar	Posted - 2010.06.18 16:12:00 - [50] Originally by: Cheap Dude How can it be the ships are found floating in space? How can the ship be killed and reappear the next day? now we know where all the technomages who fled babylon 5's universe wound up
SIEGE RED	Posted - 2010.06.18 16:13:00 - [51] Originally by: GM Grimmi During the fleet-battle in 6NJ8-V on June 16th server performance was adversely affected by load issues. One of the resulting problems was the revival of ships that had been killed during the fight, including a few super-capitals. We want to clarify that this was due to database issues, which are still under investigation û the ships were NOT returned by GameMasters. This matter is still being investigated and further information will be forthcoming when available. By Internal Affairs?
Namira Sable Minmatar Pator Tech School	Posted - 2010.06.18 16:15:00 - [52] Originally by: Gordon Fell Originally by: Dr Fighter node crashes and server lag related problems is the new top end isk sink for allinces. two sides turn up, one leaves. whats the problem? Not seeing the problem either. Please continue. Too many titans in this game anyway. Maybe that some of the destroyed ships (titans) showed up in space and the pilots that lost them gained the insurance isk. This obviously isn't unique to the NC, but should still be zapped.
Batolemaeus Caldari Vauryndar Dalharil	Posted - 2010.06.18 16:20:00 - [53] Originally by: Ehranavaar Originally by: Cheap Dude How can it be the ships are found floating in space? How can the ship be killed and reappear the next day? now we know where all the technomages who fled babylon 5's universe wound up No, the titans are literarily Jesus.
Messoroz	Posted - 2010.06.18 16:21:00 - [54] Edited by: Messoroz on 18/06/2010 16:22:50 Edited by: Messoroz on 18/06/2010 16:22:41 I bet that as the ships jumped in, that a wormhole opened up right on the jumpgate, due to the collision of two such powerful entities, the wormhole ended up copying a portion of the reality into a parallel dimension, which when the wormhole later collasped, merged with the current dimension as it was no longer being kept in its placed by the wormhole. Quote: Maybe that some of the destroyed ships (titans) showed up in space and the pilots that lost them gained the insurance isk. This obviously isn't unique to the NC, but should still be zapped. You sure it even matters since the insurance changes? They probably got like 1 isk back.
Namira Sable Minmatar Pator Tech School	Posted - 2010.06.18 16:31:00 - [55] Originally by: Messoroz Edited by: Messoroz on 18/06/2010 16:22:50 Edited by: Messoroz on 18/06/2010 16:22:41 You sure it even matters since the insurance changes? They probably got like 1 isk back. In the greater scheme of Eve's economy no, but for principle yes. If you don't lose the ship you shouldn't get the insurance payout.
Vhaine Vhindiscar Mercurialis Inc. RAZOR Alliance	Posted - 2010.06.18 16:37:00 - [56] Edited by: Vhaine Vhindiscar on 18/06/2010 16:39:08 Dead ships respawns, some find their way home, some don't. Free ships ftw. Dead ships drop high value mods...which turn into isk for the looters. Dead ships generate insurance payments. Can you salvage a titan wreck? What's that like... The whole thing reminds me of any electronics store 30 seconds after a riot breaks out. The issue needs to be top priority for ccp. It undermines the entire game. The fact that it was high profile THIS time is pointless. That it's been going on before and nobody noticed or failed to act...most unfortunate. HOW long until someone figures out a way to turn this into a dup exploit? Has it happened already? Will it be happening by this weekend. You tell me...a chance to dup titans for insurance. I bet alot of people are gonna be all over that.
Rico Minali Gallente Sons Of 0din Cult of War	Posted - 2010.06.18 16:40:00 - [57] I am currently arguing the case for having lost a single ship carrying a few billion in stuff, I lost the ship due to a black screen and am getting the 'our logs dont show' spiel, and also that unless it is 100% proven that it is ccps fault then no you cant have anything back.. Now if NC get hundreds of billions of isk back, I will not be a happy chappy... Are the guys from that fight in H-W going to get their stuff back from the lagfest that happened on that 'reinforced node system'? Trust me, I almost know what I'm doing.
Afrodite Draconis	Posted - 2010.06.18 17:07:00 - [58] Originally by: GM Grimmi During the fleet-battle in 6NJ8-V on June 16th server performance was adversely affected by load issues. One of the resulting problems was the revival of ships that had been killed during the fight, including a few super-capitals. We want to clarify that this was due to database issues, which are still under investigation û the ships were NOT returned by GameMasters. This matter is still being investigated and further information will be forthcoming when available. Thank you.
Juwairia Amarr	Posted - 2010.06.18 17:54:00 - [59] Originally by: karttoon Some people petitioned the GMs because they received insurance ISK and retained the capital after it was killed in Y-2. From what I was told, they removed the capital, and left the insurance ISK (which was significant at the time since a lot of people had plat insurance). After that everyone else pretty much kept their mouth shut, so who knows if CCP checked for free ISK or capitals after that. The problem is most likely related to caching information causing conflicts when the TQ database is actually updated. I think they changed how they cache node actions for, or slightly prior to Dominion. If someone can figure it out you could probably dupe a ton of **** since it is evident that actions are not longer updated in the database in real-time. This is probably why a node death causes a roll-back as of Dominion, since the node database cache stored in memory is lost. Cross-posting from another locked thread. Interesting information.
Lance Fighter Amarr	Posted - 2010.06.18 17:55:00 - [60] Originally by: Slade Trillgon This should be interesting to follow. Originally by: Blane Xero Originally by: Afrodite Draconis Originally by: Lance Fighter fun story: nobody gives a **. Its the GD forums: discuss something that the general public gives a damn about. Take your alliance drivel out to coad, or better, private forums. Once youve done that, remember that CCP does not make a policy of giving a damn about things posted in GD. If you want something answered, PETITION IT. If you want something answered quickly, too ing bad. The forums isnt the right place for this anyway. HTFU and stop whining. Yet Another Empire Carebear whining. Just STFU. Lance an empire carebear? I was about to say the same thing Slade love you all <3 Originally by:** CCP Shadow Have you ever wished you could have prevented a train wreck before it actually happened? I need to stop this one before the craziness begins.
Messoroz	Posted - 2010.06.18 18:03:00 - [61] NC and SC should take a field trip to the Jita and other market hubs and have a field day. Wipe out EvE's market in a single blob.
TitansRus	Posted - 2010.06.18 18:05:00 - [62] Come on how many years have we heard the same ole song ? CCP should admit there game cannot support large 0.0 fleet battles, and stop using silly PR tactics of fancy trailers and videos. As said time and time again large 0.0 fleet battles look great on paper and watching them on video, but the fact of the matter is in real time game play they don't work and probably never will. Not saying its 100% of the blame goes to CCP since there are a lot of other factors that they have no control over, my point is, stop will the fancy PR that gives people the impression you can have a lag free battle with hundreds of people all in the same system.
Epicbeardman	Posted - 2010.06.18 18:14:00 - [63] Edited by: Epicbeardman on 18/06/2010 18:14:02 CCP didn't reimburse anything, they've stated several times that doing so is not company policy. Whoever is claiming they got ships or anything at all back is lying, and there is no reason for CCP to dignify such blatant attention whoring by copy-pasting lines from several prior discussions. Please, for the good of the forum, let this thread and every other like it die. Edit: AWHAT
Trauli	Posted - 2010.06.18 19:01:00 - [64] The simple fact is the game is so broken right now they shouldn't even be charging subscription fees until its fixed. We have endless test server events where we try to help CCP and function as volunteer Q&A, recieve no updates on how the search is going, continue to get expansions that release more useless content that increases the stress on the servers and breaks the game and have a worthless GM reimbursement policy where the tools that they should be able to analyse DO NOT WORK. I feel bad for anyone who pays for the game in RL money.
Midori Tsu Haters Gonna Hate	Posted - 2010.06.18 19:14:00 - [65] Originally by: Trauli The simple fact is the game is so broken right now they shouldn't even be charging subscription fees until its fixed. We have endless test server events where we try to help CCP and function as volunteer Q&A, recieve no updates on how the search is going, continue to get expansions that release more useless content that increases the stress on the servers and breaks the game and have a worthless GM reimbursement policy where the tools that they should be able to analyse DO NOT WORK. I feel bad for anyone who pays for the game in RL money. HAHAHA, what? things are going completely fine for me.
Trauli	Posted - 2010.06.18 19:19:00 - [66] Originally by: Midori Tsu Originally by: Trauli The simple fact is the game is so broken right now they shouldn't even be charging subscription fees until its fixed. We have endless test server events where we try to help CCP and function as volunteer Q&A, recieve no updates on how the search is going, continue to get expansions that release more useless content that increases the stress on the servers and breaks the game and have a worthless GM reimbursement policy where the tools that they should be able to analyse DO NOT WORK. I feel bad for anyone who pays for the game in RL money. HAHAHA, what? things are going completely fine for me. Thats because you are a motsu farmer amirite?
Venditore Iraniano	Posted - 2010.06.18 20:24:00 - [67] Originally by: GM Grimmi During the fleet-battle in 6NJ8-V on June 16th server performance was adversely affected by load issues. One of the resulting problems was the revival of ships that had been killed during the fight, including a few super-capitals. We want to clarify that this was due to database issues, which are still under investigation û the ships were NOT returned by GameMasters. This matter is still being investigated and further information will be forthcoming when available. this is ''dupehack'' nice
Cheap Dude	Posted - 2010.06.18 20:57:00 - [68] Edited by: Cheap Dude on 18/06/2010 20:57:48 Sorry for not being able to edit my post.. I had some diner with collegeas Thanks for the reply, I really think this problem needed a response from CCP. Alot of people think the integrity of EVE is being tested here and thus needed a public reply by EVE (I think). Thats also the reason I did not make a petition as I aint alowed to post the GM reply on this forums. Thanks again.. I have faith CCP will do the right thing edit: typos
Shamis Orzoz Sniggerdly Pandemic Legion	Posted - 2010.06.18 22:39:00 - [69] Originally by: GM Grimmi During the fleet-battle in 6NJ8-V on June 16th server performance was adversely affected by load issues. One of the resulting problems was the revival of ships that had been killed during the fight, including a few super-capitals. We want to clarify that this was due to database issues, which are still under investigation û the ships were NOT returned by GameMasters. This matter is still being investigated and further information will be forthcoming when available. So we can expect a fix in 2012?
RedLion Caldari State Constructions	Posted - 2010.06.18 22:55:00 - [70] Originally by: GM Grimmi During the fleet-battle in 6NJ8-V on June 16th server performance was adversely affected by load issues. One of the resulting problems was the revival of ships that had been killed during the fight, including a few super-capitals. We want to clarify that this was due to database issues, which are still under investigation û the ships were NOT returned by GameMasters. This matter is still being investigated and further information will be forthcoming when available. Actually it sounds like they were not "revived" after being killed. But that they got duplicated on jumping out. Not taking any sides in the Northern Crusade, I would say it's ****ing sad if these ships will be removed, as there is no way one can justify the loss of titans already jumped out of system. Too many times I have lost ships due to lag and server crashes. It's time for CCP to accept responsibility and start reimbursing ships killed due to server crash/bugs. - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - The Gallenteans must be destroyed - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
MaxxOmega Caldari Dissident Aggressors Mordus Angels	Posted - 2010.06.18 23:40:00 - [71] Don't forget the EVE mantra... Don't fly anything you can't afford to lose during a big lagfest...
arjun Battlestars Wildly Inappropriate.	Posted - 2010.06.19 00:09:00 - [72] spread the word, discourage people from joining. we dont want more of them really.
Luke S Zeta Corp.	Posted - 2010.06.19 00:13:00 - [73] This is why you create a petition before fleet fights happen. so **** like this don't happen to you. ---
Batolemaeus Caldari Vauryndar Dalharil	Posted - 2010.06.19 00:17:00 - [74] Originally by: Luke S This is why you create a petition before fleet fights happen. so **** like this don't happen to you. A preemptive ship reimbursement petition? Good idea actually.
Luke S Zeta Corp.	Posted - 2010.06.19 00:25:00 - [75] Originally by: Batolemaeus Originally by: Luke S This is why you create a petition before fleet fights happen. so **** like this don't happen to you. A preemptive ship reimbursement petition? Good idea actually. create a petition for a change in server load.... wise ass. ---
YarrMama	Posted - 2010.06.19 02:14:00 - [76] Originally by: GM Grimmi During the fleet-battle in 6NJ8-V on June 16th server performance was adversely affected by load issues. One of the resulting problems was the revival of ships that had been killed during the fight, including a few super-capitals. We want to clarify that this was due to database issues, which are still under investigation û the ships were NOT returned by GameMasters. This matter is still being investigated and further information will be forthcoming when available. Nice to see some GM's have made up their minds on what occured even though they say this matter is still being investigated. Guilty until proven innocent huh CCP. How about less forum trolling and more work on your buggy game.
Diomedes Calypso	Posted - 2010.06.19 03:22:00 - [77] every time a few ships die in a system and the servers can detect irregularities* every ship in the system friend/foe/or neutral that got killed with in 60 minutes should get a full isk refund along valuation lines like kbs (but more accurate using ccp's better data on average sales prices). Would this mean lots of fighting would be meaningless? when there is lag fighting is meaningless. I'm actually more ****ed off about the stuff that went wrong for the sc in h-w than this recent one which was a gratiutus piece of crap where people knowing the sysem wasn't working and with no pressing tactical need risked their fleets to computer failure... but still only accross the board reimbursments and even better timer roll backs will make the hard decisions be made. maybe we need to remove drones and warp jammers and bombs and damage mutiplier based on relative velocity... I hope not.. but if you can't make competiion robust.. no sense having it at all. AND.. only this sort of drastic measure would bump the issue up to a high enough priortiy where 1/3rd of the programmers and developers would put their heads to it every day unitl it is fixed. As it is now they shrug their shoulders and think there are winners and losers sometimes and it often even's out but people shoulda known better... But thats a load of crap in that, in that we're being denied epic fights with thousands of mean and women communicating online spread throughout the world wording in groups of 50's and 100's with different roles.. etc... We're being denied struggles over soverignity that takes weeks and months that will be based upon the quality of the ships and the tactical maniupulations of flying the ships.. using their mods.. maxing relative resitss....having prepared fitttings specific safe spots.. etc... the largest strategy comes down to gaming whether or not a fleet will load...and a bit of a role of a dice on the odds that it will or won't... making all the beutuiful stuff irrelevent. ...irevelvent especially in the longer-burn mutly week struggles where almost inveitable the most pivotal battle will be the time where one sides fleet or the other couldn not respond... (and the client should have code a feedback loop so they can tell the difference between most logoffsi's and when a client can respond in some manners (chat? market?) but not others.)
AmarrTradeAlt9876	Posted - 2010.06.19 09:14:00 - [78] Originally by: Luke S Originally by: Batolemaeus Originally by: Luke S This is why you create a petition before fleet fights happen. so ** like this don't happen to you. A preemptive ship reimbursement petition? Good idea actually. create a petition for a change in server load.... wise ass. Thought i would just drop in and call this quoted guy "Luke S" a stupid ing idiot who knows nothing about this fight. It was a reinforced node, the directorate of several NC alliances petitioned the whole dam constellation to be reinforced. So please get your facts straight before you come out with such a stupid **ing remark like that. Empire pubbies worst pubbies.
Johnny Gurkha Digital Fury Corporation	Posted - 2010.06.19 09:28:00 - [79] Originally by: Trauli I feel bad for anyone who pays for the game in RL money. I do and I don't feel bad (apart from the exchange rate screwing me), reason is I don't join huge blobfests where I am forced to watch TV instead of shooting stuff because of the lag screensaver.... and if I was asked to I'd politely decline with an excuse that I need my wisdom teeth pulled out You have a choice not to join huge assed fleets when you know what the outcome will more or less be... ****ing lemmings
Namira Sable Minmatar Pator Tech School	Posted - 2010.06.19 14:42:00 - [80] Originally by: arjun spread the word, discourage people from joining. we dont want more of them really.
Ghoest	Posted - 2010.06.19 16:00:00 - [81] Ummm fleet warefare is comletely broken and has been since Dominion(it barely worked before that). B!tching about it is like complaining that the do it your self helicopter plans from Popular Science dont work. You lose for trying. Wherever you went - Here you are.
Aralieus Amarr The Inf1dels En Garde	Posted - 2010.06.19 16:10:00 - [82] /laughs at your loss Stop blobbing fvckheads Fortune favors the bold!!! Sticking feathers up your butt does not make you a chicken-Tyler Durden
Ris Dnalor Minmatar Fleet of Doom	Posted - 2010.06.19 16:46:00 - [83] Originally by: 1Ekrid1 Originally by: Gavjack Bunk So CCP do what they think is the right thing, now you want them to do the right thing? Why don't you just say what you want them to do, then they can get right on it. In the meantime, just sit a while and wait for 1000 idiots to think that Eve can handle their weird desires and watch with glee as they learn, again, that it can't. I have a feeling u like taunting (adults that act like) babies with candy.
CeneUJiti	Posted - 2010.06.19 18:27:00 - [84] "NC blobbed too much and deserved to lose, yadda yadda yadda." First, they were ambushed by another supercap blob. But that's irrelevant. Over all this time pretty much all big sov holding alliances have had fleets disappear to lagmosner, and always we have people who get to post the shiny killmails gloat and ignore that game is broken. And then x months later they lose a blackscreened fleet and everyone else just laughs. Poor hamsters are coughing blood and seeing double, and what will happen when some other alliance gets a cap fleet that both successfully disengaged and jumped away, and remained there and died. The age of Schroedinger fleets.
Psychotic Maniac Caldari Head Shrinkers	Posted - 2010.06.20 06:00:00 - [85] So, ccp gm says no ships were returned. Personally, I think ccp is lying to cover thier butts for the few ships they had to reimburse. Just so they don't have to do thier jobs and go through all the logs(that always show nothing btw) for all the battles. Wonder if I can get my cash back for false advertising? Gonna contact an attorney and find out if I have a case. CCP can expect some phone calls soon. -- "You can't live a perfect day without doing something for someone who will never be able to repay you." -John Wooden
Frug Omega Wing	Posted - 2010.06.20 06:21:00 - [86] Originally by: Psychotic Maniac Gonna contact an attorney and find out if I have a case. Please record this conversation and share it with us. The rest of us could use a laugh. - - - - - - - - - Do not use dotted lines - - - - - - If you think I'm awesome say BOOO BOOO!! - Ductoris Neat look what I found - Kreul Whisper/PrismX 4 emperor
Cheap Dude	Posted - 2010.06.20 07:13:00 - [87] Edited by: Cheap Dude on 20/06/2010 07:14:34 Everybody thinks this bug needs to be fixed before it happens again and again.. CCP needs alot of players to help with their Mass-Testing to fix these bugs. All join and help. Next one is at June 22, at 20:00 UTC. If you want to help out, please prepare a client some days before the mass-testing is going to happen. Trying to fix a client 10 min before its gonna happen will not work ;) It's even fun to do all stuff is 100 isk, so imagen the pew pew thats going on . For the empire dwellers this gives a nice peak into 0.0 warfare without the need to join a 0.0 alliance.
Terrigal	Posted - 2010.06.20 08:19:00 - [88] Hello Kitty here we come, why not have a massive truce between everyone, all players can get fat, get all noobs on the gtc wagon. Its the only thing I personally think will make CCP get there heads out of the sand when all of the sudden there's no more money coming in.
Napro Caldari Buccaneers of New Eden	Posted - 2010.06.20 10:05:00 - [89] Originally by: Terrigal Hello Kitty here we come, why not have a massive truce between everyone, all players can get fat, get all noobs on the gtc wagon. Its the only thing I personally think will make CCP get there heads out of the sand when all of the sudden there's no more money coming in. lol.. you do realize people have to buy GTCs with real money?
Terrigal	Posted - 2010.06.20 11:15:00 - [90] ofcourse i do. but thats my point get the noobs to but them for you in exchange for shinny new ships and a shoulder to cry on after the truce is over.
Psychotic Maniac Caldari Head Shrinkers	Posted - 2010.06.20 11:17:00 - [91] Originally by: Frug Originally by: Psychotic Maniac Gonna contact an attorney and find out if I have a case. Please record this conversation and share it with us. The rest of us could use a laugh. I'm talking class action here and it's nothing to laugh about. I'll make sure not to include you on the list. Plus, I don't think any info./conversations will be made public until the case is closed. Even then if a settlement is made I'm sure part of that settlement would be to keep lips sealed. -- "You can't live a perfect day without doing something for someone who will never be able to repay you." -John Wooden
Hugh Hefner Caldari Paxton Industries -Mostly Harmless-	Posted - 2010.06.20 11:34:00 - [92] Edited by: Hugh Hefner on 20/06/2010 11:34:20 test
Halcyon Ingenium Caldari True Citizens	Posted - 2010.06.20 11:53:00 - [93] Originally by: Psychotic Maniac Originally by: Frug Originally by: Psychotic Maniac Gonna contact an attorney and find out if I have a case. Please record this conversation and share it with us. The rest of us could use a laugh. I'm talking class action here and it's nothing to laugh about. I'll make sure not to include you on the list. Plus, I don't think any info./conversations will be made public until the case is closed. Even then if a settlement is made I'm sure part of that settlement would be to keep lips sealed. Which means win, loose, or do nothing because your full of ****, you win! Cash Rules Everything Around ME
Tekota legion industries ltd Veni Vidi Vici Alliance	Posted - 2010.06.20 12:01:00 - [94] Originally by: Psychotic Maniac Originally by: Frug Originally by: Psychotic Maniac Gonna contact an attorney and find out if I have a case. Please record this conversation and share it with us. The rest of us could use a laugh. I'm talking class action here and it's nothing to laugh about. I'll make sure not to include you on the list. Plus, I don't think any info./conversations will be made public until the case is closed. Even then if a settlement is made I'm sure part of that settlement would be to keep lips sealed. I take it you're quitting Eve then? As continuing to play would surely constitute a continued acceptance of the game experience? In that case, all that remains is the question of your stuff.....
Gnulpie Minmatar Miner Tech	Posted - 2010.06.22 19:43:00 - [95] Originally by: GM Grimmi One of the resulting problems was the revival of ships that had been killed during the fight, including a few super-capitals. We want to clarify that this was due to database issues ... This matter is still being investigated and further information will be forthcoming when available. So ... almost one week passed. Any results from your investigation? You promised further information as soon as they are available. Are the 6 titans still in game despite being destroyed earlier? Were they at least put into custody for the time of the investigation?
Manfred Sideous H A V O C Against ALL Authorities	Posted - 2010.06.22 21:15:00 - [96] WTB forthcoming information. Or can we just throw this into the can as " Titangate " ? ______________________________
RedLion Caldari State Constructions	Posted - 2010.06.22 21:58:00 - [97] The question should be: Were the titans cynoed out of system by players. If the answer is yes, then let the titans stay in game. If they managed to exploit out after being tackled or w/e. then remove the titans. Simple criterias, unbiased. - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - The Gallenteans must be destroyed - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
RedLion Caldari State Constructions	Posted - 2010.06.24 22:33:00 - [98] still curious - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - The Gallenteans must be destroyed - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
Spurty Caldari D00M. RED.OverLord	Posted - 2010.06.24 22:50:00 - [99] To err, that is only human. To make a huge **** up that breaks the universe, that takes a computer . Fortunately, humans will always be needed to clean up the mess. Only thing I care to see is consistency dealt out by ccp. Zymurgist ACCIDENTALLY my thargoid
Namira Sable Minmatar Pator Tech School	Posted - 2010.06.24 23:43:00 - [100] Perhaps CCP should make it policy to publicly state all supercapital reimbursements in a convenient thread to end the speculation and frustration.
Huhni	Posted - 2010.06.25 03:34:00 - [101] BUMP waiting for update from CCP, we still havnt forgotten. Even with free skill points and ships coming, the NC deserve to lose those ships, as the ppl attacking them lost many ships in the process... when will this get resolved how much use are they getting out of those ships...
Rana Tekkren Native Freshfood	Posted - 2010.06.25 04:09:00 - [102] Originally by: Huhni BUMP waiting for update from CCP, we still havnt forgotten. Even with free skill points and ships coming, the NC deserve to lose those ships, as the ppl attacking them lost many ships in the process... when will this get resolved how much use are they getting out of those ships... Nar the killmails should be deleted as those SC's jumped out...
Huhni	Posted - 2010.06.25 16:31:00 - [103] fine the SCs jumped out, so what about all the ppl who spent time shooting the "SCs that jumped out" and subsequently lose their ships in the process? will they all get their ships refunded for shooting at a target that wasnt even supposed to be there? and wasting their time and money trying to take down titans that were already out of system? doesnt seem fair to the people who set the trap and risked their ships and assets to kill ships that were not there.
RedLion Caldari State Constructions	Posted - 2010.06.25 16:59:00 - [104] yes everyone who lost a ship in that system that day should be reimbursed or w/e. - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - The Gallenteans must be destroyed - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
Batolemaeus Caldari Vauryndar Dalharil	Posted - 2010.06.25 17:03:00 - [105] Originally by: RedLion yes everyone who lost a ship in that system that day should be reimbursed or w/e. Actually, anyone involved in such a fight should be reimbursed. If ccp can't even support fights that were previously absolutely no problem, they should reimburse everyone and reset everything. The Atlas titan that blackscreened, all the fleets that got slaughtered when they jumped into an outnumbered enemy fleet, everyone. And this is probably also why gms openly declared not to offer any customer support for 0.0 players involved in pvp..
Gnulpie Minmatar Miner Tech	Posted - 2010.06.28 15:10:00 - [106] Originally by: Gnulpie Originally by: GM Grimmi One of the resulting problems was the revival of ships that had been killed during the fight, including a few super-capitals. We want to clarify that this was due to database issues ... This matter is still being investigated and further information will be forthcoming when available. So ... almost one week passed. Any results from your investigation? You promised further information as soon as they are available. Are the 6 titans still in game despite being destroyed earlier? Were they at least put into custody for the time of the investigation? Two weeks passed now since GM Grimmi's promise to inform us about the 6 titans. Are they still in game? Will they be removed? Will they stay in game? Pretty disappointing to hear nothing at all. Same old strategy to brush unpleasant things under the carpet and hope that it will be forgotten and silenced up?
Mitsune Konno	Posted - 2010.06.28 17:04:00 - [107] Originally by: Gnulpie Originally by: Gnulpie Originally by: GM Grimmi One of the resulting problems was the revival of ships that had been killed during the fight, including a few super-capitals. We want to clarify that this was due to database issues ... This matter is still being investigated and further information will be forthcoming when available. So ... almost one week passed. Any results from your investigation? You promised further information as soon as they are available. Are the 6 titans still in game despite being destroyed earlier? Were they at least put into custody for the time of the investigation? Two weeks passed now since GM Grimmi's promise to inform us about the 6 titans. Are they still in game? Will they be removed? Will they stay in game? Pretty disappointing to hear nothing at all. Same old strategy to brush unpleasant things under the carpet and hope that it will be forgotten and silenced up? The really silly thing is that those ghost ships have gotten or been involved in getting a bunch of kills. So even if by some miracle, CCP decided to take them back, which i'm almost positive now, they won't, it will lead to more confusion and frustration from those who have lost ships to this epic fail by CCP.
Kuar Z'thain Amok. Goonswarm Federation	Posted - 2010.07.01 15:14:00 - [108] Originally by: GM Grimmi During the fleet-battle in 6NJ8-V on June 16th server performance was adversely affected by load issues. One of the resulting problems was the revival of ships that had been killed during the fight, including a few super-capitals. We want to clarify that this was due to database issues, which are still under investigation û the ships were NOT returned by GameMasters. This matter is still being investigated and further information will be forthcoming when available. We didn't forget, CCP. Have you?
SXYGeeK Gallente do you -Mostly Harmless-	Posted - 2010.07.01 15:46:00 - [109] CCP has always maintained no reimbursements policy for large fleet fights. they are taking a hands off approach because as many have pointed out if they where to start making adjustments after the fact like reimbursements or removing the duplicate loot, or removing the duplicate ships they would have a cascading mess. unfortunately the answer is, lag happened, stuff got weird, they're trying to help if from happening again, but what is is is. -We So SeXy
Ioci Gallente Morrigna Order	Posted - 2010.07.01 16:30:00 - [110] Who needs Cap ship assembly arrays? Just lagg out your own space in blue fleets, start jumping all over hells creation and board the duplicates.
titanalt	Posted - 2010.07.01 16:36:00 - [111] Posting in a CCP hope they can sweep this under the rug and it will go away thread.
Tom Sasaki	Posted - 2010.07.01 16:41:00 - [112] Edited by: Tom Sasaki on 01/07/2010 16:41:34 Edited by: Tom Sasaki on 01/07/2010 16:41:15 Originally by: SXYGeeK CCP has always maintained no reimbursements policy for large fleet fights. they are taking a hands off approach because as many have pointed out if they where to start making adjustments after the fact like reimbursements or removing the duplicate loot, or removing the duplicate ships they would have a cascading mess. unfortunately the answer is, lag happened, stuff got weird, they're trying to help if from happening again, but what is is is. Which explains the titan PL got reimbursed and the way the majority of lost NC capitals magically respawn. While none of this happens to people hostile to you, to me it just looks like a smarter version of T20 aligned with the north.
Gnulpie Minmatar Miner Tech	Posted - 2010.07.01 21:03:00 - [113] Originally by: SXYGeeK CCP has always maintained no reimbursements policy for large fleet fights. they are taking a hands off approach because as many have pointed out if they where to start making adjustments after the fact like reimbursements or removing the duplicate loot, or removing the duplicate ships they would have a cascading mess. unfortunately the answer is, lag happened, stuff got weird, they're trying to help if from happening again, but what is is is. Oh yes, suuuuuuure. The normal procedure though is to remove the stuff from game as soon as some irregularities are known and then invest it. And when investigation is finished and conclusion is that all is okay, then the items are released and given back. Not this time. This time it is SIX titans and couple of motherships. Just like that. And it isn't the first time that the NC did profit from strange GM decisions contradicting their otherwise strict policy of not reimbursing ships in fleet fights. Is it first necessary that the gaming mags make a big bahoo about this before CCP gives us the promised answers? I thought these times would have been over.

GM Grimmi	Posted - 2010.07.02 15:04:00 - [114] Here is an update regarding events which occurred during a large fleet engagement in 6NJ8-V which took place on June 16th. Some ships were destroyed during the engagement, yet they also managed to jump to safety. This resulted in the ships reappearing in-game some time after they were destroyed. Our server-side logs represent both of the aforementioned circumstances and the final outcome was that the ships remained in game with the modules which were destroyed along with them despite kill reports being sent out showing their destruction. Modules moved to wrecks upon the ships' destruction were not duplicated, and the owners of the ships received insurance payouts for the losses. No game masters or CCP staff for that matter were involved with the revival of the ships in any way. The underlying issue has been examined and improvements implemented that should prevent similar situations in the future. Regarding fleet-battle reimbursement and GM intervention in them in general, we have been down that road before and it's not the way to go. This has been discussed in much detail and the consensus is that it is best to simply stay well clear of messing with fleet-battles; this fleet engagement is no exception and we will remain consistent in this stance. We will not be passing judgment on what should have happened during this battle nor alter the outcome in any way. GM Grimmi Lead Game Master EVE CSS

alittlebirdy	Posted - 2010.07.02 15:14:00 - [115] Originally by: GM Grimmi During the fleet-battle in 6NJ8-V on June 16th server performance was adversely affected by load issues. One of the resulting problems was the revival of ships that had been killed during the fight, including a few super-capitals. We want to clarify that this was due to database issues, which are still under investigation û the ships were NOT returned by GameMasters. This matter is still being investigated and further information will be forthcoming when available. Translation, we REALLY f-ed the servers up, but we got you your unplayable expansions every 6 months! PI > server crashing, ship respawning, wtf, lag
Psychotic Maniac Caldari Head Shrinkers	Posted - 2010.07.02 15:20:00 - [116] Thanks for clarification. ccp doesn't reimburse for lost ships due to their poor coding and lack of terrabytes they're running with which results in black screen, lag, etc... Glad I sold my cap trained chars. sad, very sad that you don't have any solution. even if that soloution requires you to do you job and pay for the loses. I mean is it really that hard to do your job instead of ignore ****ed off players that lost 1b+ isk? -- "You can't live a perfect day without doing something for someone who will never be able to repay you." -John Wooden
Trianna Holepuncher	Posted - 2010.07.02 15:29:00 - [117] Soo.... the NC gets to keep the ships they found and the other guys get to keep the killmails? WIN-WIN!
Khors Amtek Inc	Posted - 2010.07.02 15:35:00 - [118] So you supposedly fixed the error that caused this but didn't clean up either km's or the respawned ships? So you basically just closed the case with "we wont touch this, hope it doesn't happen again"?
Elle L'Zute	Posted - 2010.07.02 16:28:00 - [119] Edited by: Elle L''Zute on 02/07/2010 16:28:41 facepalm NAP'd mega fleets are so awsome...
Ryel Theon Aperture Ventures	Posted - 2010.07.02 16:29:00 - [120] Originally by: Khors So you supposedly fixed the error that caused this but didn't clean up either km's or the respawned ships? So you basically just closed the case with "we wont touch this, hope it doesn't happen again"? Well do you expect them to do? They ended up with a situation where the only data they have shows them both jumping out safely and being destroyed. You expect them to arbitrarily decide "This one made it out, revoke the killmail. This one died, take the ship."? TBH there's not much else they could do than let things stand as is because the alternative arbitrarily screws someone on one side or the other. I do hope, though, that CCP will detail a little bit more about the technical side of the problem, what's being done to address it, and when the fix will be live on TQ.
Batolemaeus Caldari Vauryndar Dalharil	Posted - 2010.07.02 16:59:00 - [121] Originally by: GM Grimmi The underlying issue has been examined and improvements implemented that should prevent similar situations in the future. They just immediately blackscreen and can never engage jump while the cluster moves as many logs to /dev/null as possible to erase any evidence? Your refusal to support Eve is stunning.
SammyullJackson	Posted - 2010.07.02 17:02:00 - [122] Originally by: Batolemaeus Originally by: GM Grimmi The underlying issue has been examined and improvements implemented that should prevent similar situations in the future. They just immediately blackscreen and can never engage jump while the cluster moves as many logs to /dev/null as possible to erase any evidence? Your refusal to support Eve is stunning. Could you give the Packers a hand? They're my home NFL team, and they could really use some outsider who thinks he understands exactly how the system works instead of the people who actually do it for a living. I bet you are an IT professional and code hacking programs in your free time, eh?
cyclobs Minmatar Honourable Templum of Alcedonia	Posted - 2010.07.02 17:57:00 - [123] Originally by: Batolemaeus Originally by: GM Grimmi The underlying issue has been examined and improvements implemented that should prevent similar situations in the future. They just immediately blackscreen and can never engage jump while the cluster moves as many logs to /dev/null as possible to erase any evidence? Your refusal to support Eve is stunning. your argument is invalid. Windows does not have a /dev/null
Cromo Effect	Posted - 2010.07.02 17:59:00 - [124] Originally by: GM Grimmi Here is an update regarding events which occurred during a large fleet engagement in 6NJ8-V which took place on June 16th. Some ships were destroyed during the engagement, yet they also managed to jump to safety. This resulted in the ships reappearing in-game some time after they were destroyed. Our server-side logs represent both of the aforementioned circumstances and the final outcome was that the ships remained in game with the modules which were destroyed along with them despite kill reports being sent out showing their destruction. Modules moved to wrecks upon the ships' destruction were not duplicated, and the owners of the ships received insurance payouts for the losses. No game masters or CCP staff for that matter were involved with the revival of the ships in any way. The underlying issue has been examined and improvements implemented that should prevent similar situations in the future. Regarding fleet-battle reimbursement and GM intervention in them in general, we have been down that road before and it's not the way to go. This has been discussed in much detail and the consensus is that it is best to simply stay well clear of messing with fleet-battles; this fleet engagement is no exception and we will remain consistent in this stance. We will not be passing judgment on what should have happened during this battle nor alter the outcome in any way. Eat it Southern Coalition, eat it!!! Next time you come to mess with the best there is, has been and ever will be, you better rethink your strategy. :smug: Bottom line is the right thing has been done. I am also recommending those loss mails be removed from all kill boards now that the ships are officially blessed as being legit. So basically, the loss mails SC wave around are essentially, fake and irrelevant. Any kill board that claims to be legit should remove those kill mails now. For the rest of you empire dwellers, when your ready to be with the winners, check into the Northern Coalition. As you can see, we are invincible and destined to dominate this game now forever.
Batolemaeus Caldari Vauryndar Dalharil	Posted - 2010.07.02 18:11:00 - [125] Originally by: cyclobs Windows does not have a /dev/null You'd be surprised. (It does) (If you don't believe me: cmd; nslookup eveonline.com > nul ; watch the output)
Gnulpie Minmatar Miner Tech	Posted - 2010.07.02 18:12:00 - [126] First of all: Thank you very much for the update! It is good to see that promises are kept. The nature of the incident and other server troubles in the meanwhile might have delayed the investigation. But end good, all good Still it seems some questions remain. Originally by: GM Grimmi Here is an update regarding events which occurred during a large fleet engagement in 6NJ8-V which took place on June 16th. Some ships were destroyed during the engagement, yet they also managed to jump to safety. This resulted in the ships reappearing in-game some time after they were destroyed. Looks like the sever had the ships in both states then: Destroyed AND alive? Hopefully that drastic bug is fixed now. Originally by: GM Grimmi Our server-side logs represent both of the aforementioned circumstances and the final outcome was that the ships remained in game Why? Why did you let them in game and not remove them. Of course you can decide for either outcome, I am curious why you choose to let them stay in game and not let them stay destroyed. Both actions would be justified by the logs. Originally by: GM Grimmi the owners of the ships received insurance payouts for the losses. That doesn't sound right. The games stay in the game and the owner STILL get insurance? Insurance for what? The ships are not destroyed. Or maybe I misunderstood it. Originally by: GM Grimmi No game masters or CCP staff for that matter were involved with the revival of the ships in any way. That is good to know. Again, thanks for the update!
bongono	Posted - 2010.07.02 20:34:00 - [127] So correct me if iam wrong but essentially what CCP are saying here is "We didnt reimburse/replace any ships, but we have however turned a blind eye to the server duplicating objects ingame giving one side an advantage over another." ?
Liang Nuren Parsec Flux War.Pigs.	Posted - 2010.07.02 20:46:00 - [128] This looks like CCP just reimbursed a bunch of supercaps to me. #fail -Liang -- Liang Nuren - Eve Forum ***** Extraordinaire
RedLion Caldari State Constructions	Posted - 2010.07.02 22:55:00 - [129] bump - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - The Gallenteans must be destroyed - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
nouki	Posted - 2010.07.02 23:12:00 - [130] kinda remind me D2 when you had to lag out the server to dupe items :/ wonder how long till we see dupes up for sale on contract
Namira Sable Minmatar Pator Tech School	Posted - 2010.07.03 01:00:00 - [131] Can I haz Justice/Explanation plz?
Jovialmadness	Posted - 2010.07.03 02:42:00 - [132] SWEET SO FOR THE FIRST TIME IN THE HISTORY OF LAG.... CCP states that their logs infact showed something.
Unti	Posted - 2010.07.03 06:49:00 - [133] THIS Originally by: bongono So correct me if iam wrong but essentially what CCP are saying here is "We didnt reimburse/replace any ships, but we have however turned a blind eye to the server duplicating objects ingame giving one side an advantage over another." ? CCP what color is the sky where your from, planet Htrae in the bizaro system? If this is the kind of shenanigans you pull in this game, I'm sure as hell not buying DUST514.
Shade Millith Caldari Macabre Votum Morsus Mihi	Posted - 2010.07.03 07:27:00 - [134] Originally by: Unti THIS Originally by: bongono So correct me if iam wrong but essentially what CCP are saying here is "We didnt reimburse/replace any ships, but we have however turned a blind eye to the server duplicating objects ingame giving one side an advantage over another." ? CCP what color is the sky where your from, planet Htrae in the bizaro system? If this is the kind of shenanigans you pull in this game, I'm sure as hell not buying DUST514. It's probably closer to "Ships jumped out, loaded safe system, then logged out, and got magically teleported back to a hostile system. If we were going to interfere with the outcome of the battle, we'd have to interfere with two problems, the ships getting teleported back to combat, and the ships respawning. Basicly remove them, then give them back" We can't expect them to deal with one of the problems, and not the other now can we? Either they don't do anything, and the respawned titans are still in game, or they deal with both issues, and the titans that jumped to safety are returned. Take your pick vOv ------------------------
Ravenlokk	Posted - 2010.07.03 08:01:00 - [135] Originally by: Shade Millith Originally by: Unti THIS Originally by: bongono So correct me if iam wrong but essentially what CCP are saying here is "We didnt reimburse/replace any ships, but we have however turned a blind eye to the server duplicating objects ingame giving one side an advantage over another." ? CCP what color is the sky where your from, planet Htrae in the bizaro system? If this is the kind of shenanigans you pull in this game, I'm sure as hell not buying DUST514. It's probably closer to "Ships jumped out, loaded safe system, then logged out, and got magically teleported back to a hostile system. If we were going to interfere with the outcome of the battle, we'd have to interfere with two problems, the ships getting teleported back to combat, and the ships respawning. Basicly remove them, then give them back" We can't expect them to deal with one of the problems, and not the other now can we? Either they don't do anything, and the respawned titans are still in game, or they deal with both issues, and the titans that jumped to safety are returned. Take your pick vOv Its easier to justify this if its in your favor, to the average player that has nothing to do with either side however, this looks extremely shady. If the shoe was on the other foot, I'm certain you would be singing a different toon. My opinion would still remain the same.
Liang Nuren Parsec Flux War.Pigs.	Posted - 2010.07.03 08:59:00 - [136] Originally by: Shade Millith We can't expect them to deal with one of the problems, and not the other now can we? Either they don't do anything, and the respawned titans are still in game, or they deal with both issues, and the titans that jumped to safety are returned. Take your pick vOv There are killmails for the titans, and it seems pretty shady that the titans were jumped out after they were killed. IMO, this is just as bad if not worse than T20. -Liang -- Liang Nuren - Eve Forum ***** Extraordinaire
Batolemaeus Caldari Vauryndar Dalharil	Posted - 2010.07.03 09:02:00 - [137] The capitals had jumped out and had long (>15m) logged off before they were killed, FYI.
Cheap Dude	Posted - 2010.07.03 09:23:00 - [138] First I like to thank CCP for an update. Everybody has an opinion about the matter and it will be long talked about it. But now it's clear what action CCP will take in the future. I am sure CCP will do it's best to tackle the lagmonster. Again, thanks for the update on the matter.
Khasmina	Posted - 2010.07.03 11:36:00 - [139] I assume White Noise will be getting the Titan they found back then? If there is meant to be no GM intervention of favouritism returning that Titan to the NC can't be right, can it? I'm sure CCP know the titans should be dead, afterall if they had jumped out they would still have all their modules and their pilots, right? Equally, I can see that there is little alternative other to let things stand - doing the right thing would require ~effort~ Still, I'm surprised the insurance remains and a Titan was returned to NC by a GM - those things should be resolved.
Lili Lu	Posted - 2010.07.03 14:07:00 - [140] Edited by: Lili Lu on 03/07/2010 14:07:34 But I suppose it's just an event decision in keeping with what's going on in game in general to favor the NC. Change sov system to favor defenders- Instead of having to win two engagments due to a pos ri timer lets make that an i-hub with another timer so now attackers have to win 3 engagements to knock down sov. Revamp moon min situation- Make tech moons the new passive income ****, since they occur in Caldari low and null sec, no favoritism here. Is correcting the new moon gold paradigm even on CCP's to fix (again) list? Now we get No NC Titan Left Behind. T20 was just unsophisticated. The logs they show something
RedLion Caldari State Constructions	Posted - 2010.07.04 00:30:00 - [141] wise ruling by ccp. - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - The Gallenteans must be destroyed - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
Caldrion Dosto Svea Rike Controlled Chaos	Posted - 2010.07.04 15:53:00 - [142] Im confused and/or my English skills is lacking my question is as follows: Have the duplicated ships/mods been removed from the game?
Rebnok H A V O C Against ALL Authorities	Posted - 2010.07.04 17:57:00 - [143] This whole deal is rather disgusting, NC-SC crap beside, This is a big screw up. I feel that These SC pilots worked and farmed for years to accure these ships and to loose them threw no fault of there own is poo. The only thing im running is my mouth
AmarrTradeAlt9876	Posted - 2010.07.06 09:51:00 - [144] Thank you ccp for making the right choice. BFF.
RC1136 Darman	Posted - 2010.07.08 16:16:00 - [145] Quote: Have the duplicated ships/mods been removed from the game?
BrundleMeth Caldari Temporal Mechanics	Posted - 2010.07.08 16:30:00 - [146] I lost a ship once due to heavy missiles. Can I get reinbursed?
Xtover Suicide Kings	Posted - 2010.07.08 16:56:00 - [147] Originally by: Rebnok This whole deal is rather disgusting, NC-SC crap beside, This is a big screw up. I feel that These SC pilots worked and farmed for years to accure these ships and to loose them threw no fault of there own is poo. Maybe ask the devs in COL to give you guys ships for compensation?
Namira Sable Minmatar Pator Tech School	Posted - 2010.07.08 22:00:00 - [148] Originally by: RC1136 Darman Quote: Have the duplicated ships/mods been removed from the game?

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