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Isnt it time to Nerf Low sec belt ratting?

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Backho	Posted - 2010.07.07 18:12:00 - [1] Hello. This is just my opinion. I think, to prevent insane ammounts of isk being poured into the system, CCP should start nerfing low sec belt ratting. Maybe Half all low sec battleship bounties, and instead drop more scrap metals, and loot. This way we can slow the isk faucet that is low sec ratting. This shoudnt affect missions. Afterall, Lv 4 mission with agents has a specialised ISK sink for the isk generated, because the LP store has near 1:1000 LP ISK of almost all items, and the most efficient way to mission run, generates dam near 1:1000 in terms of LP and ISK Lv 5 even better. 75000 LP generated and merely 10-20m terms of iskies on each generated means people running lv 5 will suk iskies out of the system. TLDR: low sec belt ratting = isk faucet lv 4 mission is OK and balanced = has a sink almost as large as the faucet. lv 5 missions are OK = large isk sink. therefore nerf low sec isk. Open for discussion.
Musical Fist Gallente NAP Coalition	Posted - 2010.07.07 18:13:00 - [2] 0/120 Worst trolling ever -- New NAP Coalition campaign started, want to be rich, powerful and elite? Join 'NAP Coalition' public channel for more info Bitter / mad, yup sounds about right
Rashmika Clavain Gallente	Posted - 2010.07.07 18:14:00 - [3] I am not sure what hallucinogenic substances you are consuming but I would certainly be interested in trying them.
Aiwha Caldari 101st Space Marine Force Gentlemen's Club	Posted - 2010.07.07 18:15:00 - [4] The "Buy Aihwa a Freighter" fund must respectfully decline backing your proposition. Respectfully, Aiwha, BAaF chairman I cannot heal stupid.
Celestine Santora	Posted - 2010.07.07 18:23:00 - [5] You mis-spelled "buff" And then mis-explained it
Ori Blake	Posted - 2010.07.07 18:28:00 - [6] You've never gone into lowsec in your life, have you?
Death Bliss Caldari	Posted - 2010.07.07 18:35:00 - [7] Originally by: Musical Fist 0/120 Worst trolling ever
Phaese	Posted - 2010.07.07 18:39:00 - [8] I believe Backho's "low sec" is actually referring to null sec. Now go reread the OP. The OP is saying that belt ratting is an isk faucet, which is correct, and that missions are both an isk faucet (via bounties) and an isk sink (via LP offers which require isk), which is also correct. I don't know if missions are a net isk faucet or a net isk sink, and I have no desire to run the numbers (especially since someone probably already has). It also is not clear to me how much isk should be coming into the system (the OP apparently believes the current amount is too much). Either way, the OP is not trolling.
Ranger 1 Amarr Dynaverse Corporation Sodalitas XX	Posted - 2010.07.07 18:45:00 - [9] Originally by: Phaese I believe Backho's "low sec" is actually referring to null sec. Now go reread the OP. The OP is saying that belt ratting is an isk faucet, which is correct, and that missions are both an isk faucet (via bounties) and an isk sink (via LP offers which require isk), which is also correct. I don't know if missions are a net isk faucet or a net isk sink, and I have no desire to run the numbers (especially since someone probably already has). It also is not clear to me how much isk should be coming into the system (the OP apparently believes the current amount is too much). Either way, the OP is not trolling. Well, if he actually means "null sec" the point in moot. Most folks in 0.0 do not belt rat. ===== If you go to Za'Ha'Dum I will gank you.
Phaese	Posted - 2010.07.07 18:58:00 - [10] Yes, the wording of the OP was literally "belt ratting". His point, however, is trivially extended to include any 0.0 NPCs with bounties.
Aiwha Caldari 101st Space Marine Force Gentlemen's Club	Posted - 2010.07.07 19:00:00 - [11] Originally by: Phaese Yes, the wording of the OP was literally "belt ratting". His point, however, is trivially extended to include any 0.0 NPCs with bounties. And my response remains unchanged. I cannot heal stupid.
Tippia Sunshine and Lollipops	Posted - 2010.07.07 19:16:00 - [12] Originally by: Phaese I don't know if missions are a net isk faucet or a net isk sink Faucet. Not only do some LP offers not require ISK, but, as he states, the cost for ISK-req items is usually 1 LP:1000 ISK, but a mission that gives you 1000 LP will also give you more than 1M ISK, so you end up with more ISK than you can get sink into the LP store. When you get into L5 missions, the situation changes since they spew LP from every available orifice, but aren't quite as spectacular in terms of raw ISK, but since the OP specifically stated L4s, this is largely besides the point. ùùù ôIf you're not willing to fight for what you have in ≡v≡à you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.ö ù Karath Piki
Ranger 1 Amarr Dynaverse Corporation Sodalitas XX	Posted - 2010.07.07 19:28:00 - [13] Originally by: Phaese Yes, the wording of the OP was literally "belt ratting". His point, however, is trivially extended to include any 0.0 NPCs with bounties. So by "null sec" he means "no sec", and by "belt ratting" he means "anomalies and belts". You should hire yourself out as his personal interpreter, as apparently there is little in his post that actually means what he posted. ===== If you go to Za'Ha'Dum I will gank you.
Captain Yifan Shadows Of The Requiem Everto Rex Regis	Posted - 2010.07.07 19:36:00 - [14] OP is either a: 0/120 worst idiot ever or Originally by: Musical Fist 0/120 Worst trolling ever
War Kitten	Posted - 2010.07.07 19:37:00 - [15] Originally by: Phaese I don't know if missions are a net isk faucet or a net isk sink, and I have no desire to run the numbers... Well then neither you nor the OP are qualified to post on the subject. LP is considered income from missions by anyone who does them seriously. Nobody would do missions if they were an isk sink - they're not that fun after a while. Quote: Either way, the OP is not trolling. He is, he just may not know it yet.
Phaese	Posted - 2010.07.07 19:39:00 - [16] Edited by: Phaese on 07/07/2010 19:46:37 Edited by: Phaese on 07/07/2010 19:44:45 I try to give people the benefit of the doubt, especially when "troll!" gets called so quickly. Edit: @War Kitten, "isk sink" refers to isk being removed from the player economy. If you spend a million isk on some faction item in the LP store and sell it for three million: (1) A million isk is removed from the player economy. (This is what makes it an "isk sink".) Double Edit: @Messoroz, that is actually an isk faucet due to the insurance payout. (2) You make two million isk in personal profit
Messoroz	Posted - 2010.07.07 19:44:00 - [17] The isk sink for low sec ratting: your ship getting blown up by pirates.
Abdiel Kavash Caldari Paladin Order Fidelas Constans	Posted - 2010.07.07 20:22:00 - [18] Edited by: Abdiel Kavash on 07/07/2010 20:23:04 Originally by: Messoroz The isk ~~sink~~ faucet for low sec ratting: your ship getting blown up by pirates. I hope this is what you meant. If no, please re-read the definition of an "ISK sink". Edit: Phaese: whoa, time-travel post!
Nobzy	Posted - 2010.07.07 20:28:00 - [19] Originally by: Messoroz The isk sink for low sec ratting: your ship getting blown up by pirates. Learn the meaning of an isk sink please.
Messoroz	Posted - 2010.07.07 20:44:00 - [20] Edited by: Messoroz on 07/07/2010 20:44:15 Originally by: Abdiel Kavash Edited by: Abdiel Kavash on 07/07/2010 20:23:04 Originally by: Messoroz The isk ~~sink~~ faucet for low sec ratting: your ship getting blown up by pirates. I hope this is what you meant. If no, please re-read the definition of an "ISK sink". Edit: Phaese: whoa, time-travel post! Hey, If I lose my ship, its a isk sink, someone gets some isk out of it? It's a isk faucet for them. It's all relative.
Phaese	Posted - 2010.07.07 20:51:00 - [21] It's true that the terms are initially ambiguous, which is why there is a constant confusion surrounding them. I guess if you want to just redefine what phrases mean I can't stop you, but be aware that any informed discussion will be using those terms "relative" to the entire player economy. They have nothing to do with individual players' balances.
Ghoest	Posted - 2010.07.07 20:54:00 - [22] Edited by: Ghoest on 07/07/2010 20:54:08 0/10 Wherever you went - Here you are.
Tippia Sunshine and Lollipops	Posted - 2010.07.07 21:10:00 - [23] Edited by: Tippia on 07/07/2010 21:10:46 Originally by: Messoroz Hey, If I lose my ship, its a isk sink, someone gets some isk out of it? It's a isk faucet for them. It's all relative. No it's not. It is, however, slightly unintuitive. The terms "faucet" and "sink" denote whether ISK is added or removed from the entire game supply of ISK ù their effects on your personal wallet are entirely irrelevant. If something causes ISK to be spawned out of thin air, it is a faucet, no matter what causes this to happen. If something causes ISK to be nuked from existence, it is a sink. If it's just transferred from one player to another, it's neither. If you just "lose your ship," then nothing happens to the ISK supply. You have just lost a ship, no more no less. If your ship gets blown up and insurance kicks in, Pend will spawn some ISK out of their NPC rear ends and hand them to you ù completely new ISK is created, and it is therefore an ISK faucet. If, on the other hand, you insure your ship, but fail to get it blown up in time, you have handed over ISK to Pend, and they are gone form the game economy ù there is no "NPC budget" that it gets added to, it just vanishes. This unused insurance payment is therefore an ISK sink. ùùù ôIf you're not willing to fight for what you have in ≡v≡à you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.ö ù Karath Piki
Drykor Minmatar Aperture Harmonics K162	Posted - 2010.07.07 21:31:00 - [24] reverse psychology ftw
Rebal 88 Minmatar INGEN Industries The Kadeshi	Posted - 2010.07.07 21:32:00 - [25] Originally by: Death Bliss Originally by: Musical Fist 0/120 Worst trolling ever This statement stands correct. And finally, I must say you've read my sig.
Backho	Posted - 2010.07.07 21:37:00 - [26] Every plex is pouring isk into the system we really need to nerf the ISK generated and change it into faction loot instead. Any non-mision rats also pours more ISK into the system, and without the LP system, its practically an isk faucet with nothing to move it out with. ratting,plexing and mission running should be an activity that generates faction items into the market. not generate unnecesary isk The reason why T2 is still considered "standard" instead of faction even after 7 years, is simply because isk value is too low due to all the isk being threwn into the system, and too few faction items to fullfill demand. Something needs to be done so that more people go mission running instead of doing all this pointless isk materealising activities.
Phaese	Posted - 2010.07.07 21:41:00 - [27] I tried.
Yuki Kulotsuki	Posted - 2010.07.07 21:49:00 - [28] Edited by: Yuki Kulotsuki on 07/07/2010 21:50:34 Originally by: Backho Every plex is pouring isk into the system we really need to nerf the ISK generated and change it into faction loot instead. No. Try again. Quote: Any non-mision rats also pours more ISK into the system, and without the LP system, its practically an isk faucet with nothing to move it out with. Somewhat true. It is a faucet. Nothing to move it out with... have you seen the prices of minerals? Quote: ratting,plexing and mission running should be an activity that generates faction items into the market. not generate unnecesary isk The reason why T2 is still considered "standard" instead of faction even after 7 years, is simply because isk value is too low due to all the isk being threwn into the system, and too few faction items to fullfill demand. It wouldn't be because faction items are supposed to be somewhat rare and expensive? That's half the balancing factor. Quote: Something needs to be done so that more people go mission running instead of doing all this pointless isk materealising activities. Ok now you's trolling. Originally by: CCP Lemur THIS IS GOD: ... IF YOU HAVE ANY MORE REQUESTS I'M AVAILABLE SUNDAY FROM 10:30 TO 12:00 TO RECEIVE YOUR PRAYERS.
War Kitten	Posted - 2010.07.07 21:49:00 - [29] Originally by: Phaese Edited by: Phaese on 07/07/2010 19:48:12 Edited by: Phaese on 07/07/2010 19:44:45 I try to give people the benefit of the doubt, especially when "troll!" gets called so quickly. Edit: @War Kitten, "isk sink" refers to isk being removed from the player economy. If you spend a million isk on some faction item in the LP store and sell it for three million: (1) A million isk is removed from the player economy. (This is what makes it an "isk sink".) (2) You make two million isk in personal profit Double Edit: @Messoroz, that is actually an isk faucet due to the insurance payout. I suppose if you erroneously ignore the fact that the item you just bought also has an isk value, sure. Otherwise your 1M isk sink has a 2M isk leak. "Here's your sign." - Bill Engvall
Tippia Sunshine and Lollipops	Posted - 2010.07.07 21:54:00 - [30] Edited by: Tippia on 07/07/2010 21:56:21 Originally by: War Kitten I suppose if you erroneously ignore the fact that the item you just bought also has an isk value, sure. It may have a value that can be expressed in terms of ISK, but it is not ISK in and of itself. Quote: Otherwise your 1M isk sink has a 2M isk leak. No. His 1M ISK sink also has an item faucet, but that faucet does not affect the ISK supply (because, again, it's an item ù not ISK). The fact that you can trade this item for 3M ISK affects neither the ISK or the item supply since it is just that: a trade. The two are exchanged; nothing goes away (ok, not strictly true ù it's an ISK sink since you have to pay taxes, but close enough). The end result is that 1M ISK has been removed form the system; one item as spawned; and one item and 3M ISK have changed hands. No ISK has been created. ùùù ôIf you're not willing to fight for what you have in ≡v≡à you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.ö ù Karath Piki

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