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Na'Axin
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Posted - 2004.12.19 01:14:00 -
[31]
lol, POS'ses where meant to make the Tech II componenets cheaper, not more expensive.
and yes I know the stations aren't paying up for what it costs to run them, but making Tech II componenets more expensive is not the answer.... perhaps CCP should make it that the batches in which the station produces the components are increased
(\_/)
(O.o)
(> <) This is Bunny. Copy Bunny into your signature to help him on his way to world domination. |
Na'Axin
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Posted - 2004.12.19 01:14:00 -
[32]
lol, POS'ses where meant to make the Tech II componenets cheaper, not more expensive.
and yes I know the stations aren't paying up for what it costs to run them, but making Tech II componenets more expensive is not the answer.... perhaps CCP should make it that the batches in which the station produces the components are increased
(\_/)
(O.o)
(> <) This is Bunny. Copy Bunny into your signature to help him on his way to world domination. |
Fire Hawk
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Posted - 2004.12.19 11:28:00 -
[33]
One buddy was offered 1100 Quantum Microprocessor as bonus reward for a L4 mission.
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Fire Hawk
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Posted - 2004.12.19 11:28:00 -
[34]
One buddy was offered 1100 Quantum Microprocessor as bonus reward for a L4 mission.
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Aitrus
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Posted - 2004.12.19 14:11:00 -
[35]
 Originally by: Stryker Zee
I think your fear is exaggerated.
1) There is a HUGE demand for t2 components, which will only increase with time. I build Crows and have always thought it stupid to have to pay 200k + for my Graviton Reactors.
2) You have to let the smaller corps and individuals who cannot afford to build a POS have an opportunity to claim t2 components.
3) Only large corps and alliances will realistically be able to afford to supply a POS (the initial cost is nothing really), so not everyone is going to be able to make t2 components this way.
4) It actually takes several POS to make all the reactions for all the building blocks to make t2 components.
I feel there will be plenty of demand for t2 components, both built and acquired thru agents. The prices on the t2 ships are insanely high atm anyway, so anything that brings down the price, and increases my sales is beneficial IMHO.
As to the destruction of a POS, you should look about for some tales about the fate those fleets who have attempted it. A POS is about the cost of 2-3 BS, but the cost of taking one down is tremendous. The least of them, the Gallente Tower, has 35M shields, and the station guns do severe damage. I have heard of 30+ BS fleets being wiped out trying to take one down.
I've done a LOT of math.
Out of all the tech II components, there are about 4-6 that you could turn a profit on right now by building them. (Most notably, all 4 reactors)
All of the other components will generate net loss. Quite a bit net loss. Noone is going to produce armor plates for 5k each, as it will cost over twice that to produce it. With these things dropping in large quantities from agents, the price won't be able to equalize. Agent runners can drop the prices as low as they want to sell, as there's no cost of production for them. It's all profit.
Basically, the price of the stupid-expensive components (reactors) needs to come down a bit, and the price of the stupid-cheap components (everything else) needs to come up to a comparable level. Increasing loot drops just makes it harder for T2 component production to become viable. (Except reactor units, people will be making these)
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Aitrus
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Posted - 2004.12.19 14:11:00 -
[36]
Originally by: Stryker Zee
I think your fear is exaggerated.
1) There is a HUGE demand for t2 components, which will only increase with time. I build Crows and have always thought it stupid to have to pay 200k + for my Graviton Reactors.
2) You have to let the smaller corps and individuals who cannot afford to build a POS have an opportunity to claim t2 components.
3) Only large corps and alliances will realistically be able to afford to supply a POS (the initial cost is nothing really), so not everyone is going to be able to make t2 components this way.
4) It actually takes several POS to make all the reactions for all the building blocks to make t2 components.
I feel there will be plenty of demand for t2 components, both built and acquired thru agents. The prices on the t2 ships are insanely high atm anyway, so anything that brings down the price, and increases my sales is beneficial IMHO.
As to the destruction of a POS, you should look about for some tales about the fate those fleets who have attempted it. A POS is about the cost of 2-3 BS, but the cost of taking one down is tremendous. The least of them, the Gallente Tower, has 35M shields, and the station guns do severe damage. I have heard of 30+ BS fleets being wiped out trying to take one down.
I've done a LOT of math.
Out of all the tech II components, there are about 4-6 that you could turn a profit on right now by building them. (Most notably, all 4 reactors)
All of the other components will generate net loss. Quite a bit net loss. Noone is going to produce armor plates for 5k each, as it will cost over twice that to produce it. With these things dropping in large quantities from agents, the price won't be able to equalize. Agent runners can drop the prices as low as they want to sell, as there's no cost of production for them. It's all profit.
Basically, the price of the stupid-expensive components (reactors) needs to come down a bit, and the price of the stupid-cheap components (everything else) needs to come up to a comparable level. Increasing loot drops just makes it harder for T2 component production to become viable. (Except reactor units, people will be making these)
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Raem Civrie
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Posted - 2004.12.19 15:54:00 -
[37]
I hope your face melts off, Crayathan! My Deimos cost me bleedin' 80 mil, I don't want to have to replace it with a 600 mil Deimos.
Plus people already quoted Zrakor on it. So... what they said.
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Raem Civrie
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Posted - 2004.12.19 15:54:00 -
[38]
I hope your face melts off, Crayathan! My Deimos cost me bleedin' 80 mil, I don't want to have to replace it with a 600 mil Deimos.
Plus people already quoted Zrakor on it. So... what they said.
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Galea Wildfang
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Posted - 2004.12.19 16:16:00 -
[39]
Did about 100 level 4 missions ..
got offered 900 shield emitter as time bonus once (and didn't make it)
got about 800 comps over all the other missions ..
I can assure you, comps mission reward isn't the reason to do them.
If it is expensive to run a station, just a handful of people will built them for that reason, if they drop the prizes or increase the outcome, more people will build some and thus turning the prizes for those components to a level where we can afford to buy some T2 Stuff.
I don't know how exactly the production runs, but we do need competitive prizes to keep eve fun, so increasing the output numbers seems alot more logical then dropping the mission rewards to zilch.
BTW, would like to recycle my station containers 
'Life on Earth might be expensive, but it does include an anual free trip around the sun' |
Galea Wildfang
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Posted - 2004.12.19 16:16:00 -
[40]
Did about 100 level 4 missions ..
got offered 900 shield emitter as time bonus once (and didn't make it)
got about 800 comps over all the other missions ..
I can assure you, comps mission reward isn't the reason to do them.
If it is expensive to run a station, just a handful of people will built them for that reason, if they drop the prizes or increase the outcome, more people will build some and thus turning the prizes for those components to a level where we can afford to buy some T2 Stuff.
I don't know how exactly the production runs, but we do need competitive prizes to keep eve fun, so increasing the output numbers seems alot more logical then dropping the mission rewards to zilch.
BTW, would like to recycle my station containers
'Life on Earth might be expensive, but it does include an anual free trip around the sun' |
Slithereen
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Posted - 2004.12.20 00:56:00 -
[41]
Edited by: Slithereen on 20/12/2004 00:57:32
The price of T2 ships needs to come down badly and for this to happen, the number of T2 components dropped should be increased significantly not decreased.
I personally don't mind earning less from T2 components once the component prices drop. It's about time T2 should---which has been in the game for almost a year now---to be even more widespread.
T2 Frigates should not cost over 10 million like they do now, and T2 cruisers should not cost over 20 million.
_______________________________________________
"Is it me or the bad guys just getting totally pathetic?"---Clover, Totally Spies,
"Hope is wasted on the Hopeless."---Mandy, The Grim Adventures of Billy and Mandy.
"Stars are holes in the sky from which the light of the Infinite shine through."---Confucius.
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Slithereen
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Posted - 2004.12.20 00:56:00 -
[42]
Edited by: Slithereen on 20/12/2004 00:57:32
The price of T2 ships needs to come down badly and for this to happen, the number of T2 components dropped should be increased significantly not decreased.
I personally don't mind earning less from T2 components once the component prices drop. It's about time T2 should---which has been in the game for almost a year now---to be even more widespread.
T2 Frigates should not cost over 10 million like they do now, and T2 cruisers should not cost over 20 million.
_______________________________________________
"Is it me or the bad guys just getting totally pathetic?"---Clover, Totally Spies,
"Hope is wasted on the Hopeless."---Mandy, The Grim Adventures of Billy and Mandy.
"Stars are holes in the sky from which the light of the Infinite shine through."---Confucius.
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Polaris Lumine
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Posted - 2004.12.20 11:15:00 -
[43]
Quote:
T2 Frigates should not cost over 10 million like they do now, and T2 cruisers should not cost over 20 million.
*nods in agreement*
--
Polaris Lumine
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Polaris Lumine
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Posted - 2004.12.20 11:15:00 -
[44]
Quote:
T2 Frigates should not cost over 10 million like they do now, and T2 cruisers should not cost over 20 million.
*nods in agreement*
--
Polaris Lumine
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Aitrus
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Posted - 2004.12.21 15:07:00 -
[45]
Originally by: Slithereen
Edited by: Slithereen on 20/12/2004 00:57:32
The price of T2 ships needs to come down badly and for this to happen, the number of T2 components dropped should be increased significantly not decreased.
I personally don't mind earning less from T2 components once the component prices drop. It's about time T2 should---which has been in the game for almost a year now---to be even more widespread.
T2 Frigates should not cost over 10 million like they do now, and T2 cruisers should not cost over 20 million.
No, the number of drops does not need to increase. There is now a mechanism in game for players to produce these things. Theres your increased supply.
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Aitrus
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Posted - 2004.12.21 15:07:00 -
[46]
Originally by: Slithereen
Edited by: Slithereen on 20/12/2004 00:57:32
The price of T2 ships needs to come down badly and for this to happen, the number of T2 components dropped should be increased significantly not decreased.
I personally don't mind earning less from T2 components once the component prices drop. It's about time T2 should---which has been in the game for almost a year now---to be even more widespread.
T2 Frigates should not cost over 10 million like they do now, and T2 cruisers should not cost over 20 million.
No, the number of drops does not need to increase. There is now a mechanism in game for players to produce these things. Theres your increased supply.
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Harisdrop
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Posted - 2004.12.21 15:25:00 -
[47]
The problem is as it always been. There will be corps and alliances not making these tech II components availible to the genral public. If you own a POS just make your product and sell to the highest bidder.
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Garsh ma it soo cool killing people in there space thingies |
Harisdrop
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Posted - 2004.12.21 15:25:00 -
[48]
The problem is as it always been. There will be corps and alliances not making these tech II components availible to the genral public. If you own a POS just make your product and sell to the highest bidder.
--------------------------
Garsh ma it soo cool killing people in there space thingies |
X'Alor
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Posted - 2004.12.21 17:29:00 -
[49]
As opposed to decreasing our payout yet again.
This is a two part equation not just agent side.
the missons have to be rewarding enough for people to do them being the game DEV's have decided to wrap up so much content into them. Now they are trapped being characters like myself have devoted my entire time to mission running.
Agreed that high rewards for missions can hurt the POS market just as badly as taking a mission runners payscale away.
Ok leave missions alone then what needs to be adusted.
I'd say adjust the recycling and rewards from POS.
why adjust something that has been a certain standard since game release as opposed to balncing the output of the new release. that just makes no sense to me.
POS are the new thing in eve, adjust the output of the new thing is normally the standard. not nerfing something that had a good structure and incentive to begin with.
You POS owners are barking up the wrong tree here. EVE'n you guys have been beat up with a nerf batt so much that you also inturn say nerf.
Enough nerf on economy itmes. balance the new item to correspond with current outlets already standardized.
Nerfing income for time spent is the worst thing in eve.
Mission payout is good currently for time invested. POS running is not. the output of that needs to be adjusted not mission runner output.
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X'Alor
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Posted - 2004.12.21 17:29:00 -
[50]
As opposed to decreasing our payout yet again.
This is a two part equation not just agent side.
the missons have to be rewarding enough for people to do them being the game DEV's have decided to wrap up so much content into them. Now they are trapped being characters like myself have devoted my entire time to mission running.
Agreed that high rewards for missions can hurt the POS market just as badly as taking a mission runners payscale away.
Ok leave missions alone then what needs to be adusted.
I'd say adjust the recycling and rewards from POS.
why adjust something that has been a certain standard since game release as opposed to balncing the output of the new release. that just makes no sense to me.
POS are the new thing in eve, adjust the output of the new thing is normally the standard. not nerfing something that had a good structure and incentive to begin with.
You POS owners are barking up the wrong tree here. EVE'n you guys have been beat up with a nerf batt so much that you also inturn say nerf.
Enough nerf on economy itmes. balance the new item to correspond with current outlets already standardized.
Nerfing income for time spent is the worst thing in eve.
Mission payout is good currently for time invested. POS running is not. the output of that needs to be adjusted not mission runner output.
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Arcticblue2
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Posted - 2004.12.21 17:34:00 -
[51]
At one lvl 4 mission I was offered 1400 tech 2 equipment.
----------------------------------------------
"When I was a child, I spoke as a child, I felt as a child, I thought as a child: now that I am become a man, I have put away childish things."
1 cor. 13:11 |
Arcticblue2
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Posted - 2004.12.21 17:34:00 -
[52]
At one lvl 4 mission I was offered 1400 tech 2 equipment.
----------------------------------------------
"When I was a child, I spoke as a child, I felt as a child, I thought as a child: now that I am become a man, I have put away childish things."
1 cor. 13:11 |
Mistress D'Malice
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Posted - 2004.12.21 18:59:00 -
[53]
Perhaps a temporary solution would be to increase the drop rate on the comps that POS owners cant make for reasonable prices, ie armor plates.
That way the mission runners will get more cash but it wont effect the POS market.
Just a quick idea...
Black Lotus Official Forums - www.blacklotusclan.com
Contact Me - [email protected] |
Mistress D'Malice
|
Posted - 2004.12.21 18:59:00 -
[54]
Perhaps a temporary solution would be to increase the drop rate on the comps that POS owners cant make for reasonable prices, ie armor plates.
That way the mission runners will get more cash but it wont effect the POS market.
Just a quick idea...
Black Lotus Official Forums - www.blacklotusclan.com
Contact Me - [email protected] |
Aitrus
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Posted - 2004.12.21 20:17:00 -
[55]
Originally by: X'Alor
As opposed to decreasing our payout yet again.
I'm not saying decrease mission payout. I'm saying eliminate the T2 components and replace them with something of equal value. (isk, trade goods, mods, etc)
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Aitrus
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Posted - 2004.12.21 20:17:00 -
[56]
Originally by: X'Alor
As opposed to decreasing our payout yet again.
I'm not saying decrease mission payout. I'm saying eliminate the T2 components and replace them with something of equal value. (isk, trade goods, mods, etc)
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BATT
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Posted - 2004.12.21 21:55:00 -
[57]
Edited by: BATT on 21/12/2004 21:56:59
I disagree, dropping more t2 components will drive the price down ,additionally the number of POS will increased so the T2 components production..as a result ,T2 products will be more affordable,more will be sold...the way it should be..
right now the T2 product market is wrong.. a crow interceptor should not be valued at 14 or 16 mil..but more like 3 or 4 mil..less even if you look at platinum inssurance..
everything will balanced aout in a couple of months ..i am sure of that..
and NO..don't stop dropping T2 components thought agent missions..
for the whinners who wants a monopole..they will not succeed..
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BATT
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Posted - 2004.12.21 21:55:00 -
[58]
Edited by: BATT on 21/12/2004 21:56:59
I disagree, dropping more t2 components will drive the price down ,additionally the number of POS will increased so the T2 components production..as a result ,T2 products will be more affordable,more will be sold...the way it should be..
right now the T2 product market is wrong.. a crow interceptor should not be valued at 14 or 16 mil..but more like 3 or 4 mil..less even if you look at platinum inssurance..
everything will balanced aout in a couple of months ..i am sure of that..
and NO..don't stop dropping T2 components thought agent missions..
for the whinners who wants a monopole..they will not succeed..
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BATT
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Posted - 2004.12.21 22:01:00 -
[59]
"""replace them with something of equal value. (isk, trade goods, mods, etc)""
The true NPC value of T2 components are very low..only the players drove the price that high..
If CCp were to exchange them for something of equal value as you suggest..
the agent runner would be ****ed.
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BATT
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Posted - 2004.12.21 22:01:00 -
[60]
"""replace them with something of equal value. (isk, trade goods, mods, etc)""
The true NPC value of T2 components are very low..only the players drove the price that high..
If CCp were to exchange them for something of equal value as you suggest..
the agent runner would be ****ed.
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