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mazzilliu
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Posted - 2010.09.26 21:40:00 -
[1]
CCP should add liquid ozone as allowable ship cargo in the ship maintenance array. Ammunition was allowed in the cargo specifically because it's something every ship has, and it's not typically something people like to haul long distances, so allowing it in the SMA is not very abusable. I believe liquid ozone also falls under this category, because its uses are largely limited to cyno fuel and pos fuel- and people generally only haul liquid ozone alone only as cyno fuel.
having to go through a bunch of liquid ozone cargo bs with your cyno frigates is really annoying
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K'racker
Minmatar
Brutor tribe
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Posted - 2010.09.27 00:09:00 -
[2]
ammo and charges are allowed so you can carry a combat ready ship. that's one of the intended uses of an sma.
an itty 5 with rigs and expanders can hold over 96k liquid ozone. carrying that much cargo in an sma is not an intended use. it is the very reason the change to sma's was made.
roll back the change completely, or leave as is. an exception for one item is pandering to a very small part of the playerbase.
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xttz
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
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Posted - 2010.09.27 09:23:00 -
[3]
This was added to forcibly encourage people to use Rorquals and later JF's when they were introduced. Not only is there is no need for it anymore, but it doesn't prevent people using carriers to import minerals compressed as torps and such.
The ideal solution of course is to allow any ship with any cargo inside an SMA provided it is not over a set limit (i.e. 1000m3).
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mazzilliu
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Posted - 2010.09.27 10:23:00 -
[4]
 Originally by: xttz
This was added to forcibly encourage people to use Rorquals and later JF's when they were introduced. Not only is there is no need for it anymore, but it doesn't prevent people using carriers to import minerals compressed as torps and such.
The ideal solution of course is to allow any ship with any cargo inside an SMA provided it is not over a set limit (i.e. 1000m3).
i like that 1km3 idea too. i dont know if ccp wants to change how it works, but i think ill add that as an alternate possibility instead of using a whitelist for items. because people often put weird stuff in their ships like exotic dancers and bongs, and if they have to store their ships in a carrier the lovely ladies are left out in the cold.
liquid ozone is not really compressible, and if you want to carry a lot of it as pos fuel in a carrier you still have to make a jf jump to carry all the other pos fuels too. so i dont really see a whole lot of carriers gearing up to haul liquid ozo in mass because of this, and if they do, its still really inefficient.
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CommanderData211
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Posted - 2010.09.27 21:33:00 -
[5]
When are you at an SMA where there is not a CHA right next to you? They're the slightly more blocky ugly thing floating in space next to the huge ugly stick. I hear told they have a bit of room in them.
Sarcasm aside, allowing ships with charges in them, this makes sense. You want to be able to respond to an enemy potentially before they jump through and having your different ammo types already prepared is a good thing. This also applies to extra ships brought into battle by a carrier. But for the liquid ozone, how hard is it to keep some spare in the CHA and spend 1 minute to pop it in your bay.
I see where you were going with this but I just can't give it support.
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xttz
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
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Posted - 2010.09.28 14:26:00 -
[6]
Edited by: xttz on 28/09/2010 14:32:41
Originally by: CommanderData211
When are you at an SMA where there is not a CHA right next to you?
Quite often.
Also non-corp members can't see inside or take from CHA's. If I want to launch a cyno ship for another alliance member I need to **** around with launching a can, change overview settings to find it and put ozone inside. And that's assuming the can appeared in transfer range of my ship - they quite often don't for larger capitals.
Originally by: CommanderData211
But for the liquid ozone, how hard is it to keep some spare in the CHA and spend 1 minute to pop it in your bay
About as hard as keeping ammo in a CHA. It's an extra and entirely unecessary mechanic that only serves to waste time and complicate matters. It needs to go.
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EdFromHumanResources
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
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Posted - 2010.09.28 14:36:00 -
[7]
Originally by: CommanderData211
When are you at an SMA where there is not a CHA right next to you? They're the slightly more blocky ugly thing floating in space next to the huge ugly stick. I hear told they have a bit of room in them.
Sarcasm aside, allowing ships with charges in them, this makes sense. You want to be able to respond to an enemy potentially before they jump through and having your different ammo types already prepared is a good thing. This also applies to extra ships brought into battle by a carrier. But for the liquid ozone, how hard is it to keep some spare in the CHA and spend 1 minute to pop it in your bay.
I see where you were going with this but I just can't give it support.
What's that? The dissenting cry of someone who's never owned or operated a carrier for anything beyond missions?
Shut up
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Joe Richter
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
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Posted - 2010.09.28 14:40:00 -
[8]
Also agree. LO is used to fuel jump bridges as well, so most of my ships have a quantity on LO in the cargohold as well. That, and the cyhoships end up being a real pain with having to manually remove LO before putting a ship in an SMA (and remembering to take the LO again afterwards)
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steave435
SniggWaffe
GoonSwarm
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Posted - 2010.09.29 02:03:00 -
[9]
Yes.
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FT Diomedes
The Fimbriani
Shadow of xXDEATHXx
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Posted - 2010.09.29 04:00:00 -
[10]
Definite quality of life improvement for cyno ships.
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This doesn't even seem to be a regular case of rats fleeing the sinking ship. Seems more like the rats are on fire, the ship is on fire, and the sea is full of drunk Russians. - Jacob Etienne |
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CommanderData211
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Posted - 2010.09.29 08:30:00 -
[11]
The fact that non-corp members cannot pull out of a CHA is not the issue and adding liquid ozone to the list of appropriate items to be stored in a ships cargo while in an SMA is not the answer. I will refer back to a previous example with the rigged Iteron being packed with LO. That's not an intended mechanic and would serve to shrink EVE even further. You would have an extra 30k worth of fuel to jump very far distances very quickly. I think that logistics should be tough to manage and if you need more fuel to get where you are going then you should invest in Black Ops and Transport Ships.
As to me not using my carrier outside of missions, well I don't run missions and I most certainly don't use them for anomalies or complexes. But that doesn't really have any bearing on the discussion.
CCP changed this mechanic for a reason that I happen to agree with and while it may make life easier, this change is not necessary.
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JitaCitizen 4756
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Posted - 2010.09.29 13:37:00 -
[12]
Originally by: CommanderData211
I will refer back to a previous example with the rigged Iteron being packed with LO. That's not an intended mechanic and would serve to shrink EVE even further. You would have an extra 30k worth of fuel to jump very far distances very quickly.
No one is trying to do this. There is even a post above asking for the limit to be changed to a set 1k m3 instead of using an arbitrary whitelist of items. Actually I think you might just be trolling - no one sane would suggest the use of Black Ops BS and Transports to move ozone.
I think the most ironic part is that people still use carriers + iterons to import minerals compressed as citadel torps. CCP's mechanic does not prevent that at all, yet it's exactly what it was introduced to stop.
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Kazuo Ishiguro
House of Marbles
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Posted - 2010.09.29 17:41:00 -
[13]
Originally by: JitaCitizen 4756
I think the most ironic part is that people still use carriers + iterons to import minerals compressed as citadel torps. CCP's mechanic does not prevent that at all, yet it's exactly what it was introduced to stop.
There are much better options available if you use a JF, FYI 
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34.4:1 mineral compression |
CommanderData211
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Posted - 2010.09.29 17:44:00 -
[14]
Well I guess where I live in crazy-land it's not insane to use transports to move fuel.
I'm not trolling and my ideas aren't completely unhinged. I would just rather not see LO in SMA's. There is a fuel bay inside of carriers specifically for the purpose of holding fuel, and if you are staging caps at a POS then you better have a CHA there.
And just because there is one "exploitable" mechanic by bringing in torps and melting them does not mean we need another one.
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Fournone
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Posted - 2010.09.29 23:14:00 -
[15]
Edited by: Fournone on 29/09/2010 23:14:51
Is it just me, or all the supporters from goonswarm? EDIT: well, all exept me 
One problem I have is that people will just cyno 50 supercarriers on your 5 man BS gang from fuel stashes in pos, wait, people are already doing that.
Actually, I see no reason to not allow LO inside SMAs, its put them in there or just leave a ton of iteron 5s inside the POS's bubble shield and cuase lag.
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