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lag kills Voodoo Tactical Ghost Syndicate.	Posted - 2010.10.21 05:31:00 - [1] give me your wisdom. i'm looking to make the vagabond my ship of choice. haven't flown it too long or seen much action yet besides a few easy kills. i was looking for little things to watch out for or little tricks to deal with the big threats. just things you've picked up from first hand experience, so i can minimize the amount of things i learn the hard way. i know to run away from the curse/pilgrim and heavy neuts can ruin my day. any advice is appreciated... besides 'get a cynabal' or something like that. i want to get good with the vaga before i do that. :p ___________________________ not all who wander are lost.
Diomidis Mythos Corp RAZOR Alliance	Posted - 2010.10.21 06:20:00 - [2] You don't run away from Pilgrims they should be running away from u - you can safely orbit them @ range and your dmg projection is vastly superior to theirs. You basically use the Vaga aggressively. You engage pretty much anything that cannot neut / web you at the edge of point range (22-24km) and you avoid web/scram ranges completely, unless you are fighting vs. something that you would call "easy kill" - that is most cruisers, frigates, recons etc. Usually vagas are flown with 220s and a med neut + dmg drones, but many ppl switch to ECM drones or drop the neut (and possibly some tank) for 425mm ACs...you out-range most medium ships turret ships and you vastly out-maneuver / outrun anything bigger than a frig. Fast stuff with heavy neuts are your enemy - Tempests, Machs and such BSs are NOT an easy target to move against unless a heavy gang is REALLY close to support you. When not sure, you always engage from a distance, orbiting @ the edge of the disruptor range and gambling / knowing that you will be able to maneuver out of point range if you get heavy neuted or out-gunned. That is the safe approach most ppl use "solo" or as forward tacklers against stuff bigger than yourself. Usually you are able to warp out even against multiple foes, unless you get scram/webbed or come face to face with your natural enemies: curses that can kill your speed, and speed = life, or Rapiers that can do the same. Remember, that with proper ammo loaded, you vastly out-dmg a rapier @ point range and it cannot take you solo unless he TDs you at the same time or something like that. You even have good chances to drive solo curses to disengage unless they TD you. Vagas get decent DPS and pretty good tracking for a HAC, so against weaker opponents it's not uncommon to move as close as possible to your optimal for max dps. Dual LSE vagas are pretty resilient (combination of resists/EHP, relatively small sig, speed) and rigs + DC II can push it's tank above of that most HACs and Recons achieve, while at the same time you out-run and possibly out-dmg nearly all of them due to the huge falloff that allows you to exploit your speed advantage by kiting them. Join the Biggest Greek Corp! www.Mythos-eve.com - Join Mythos Channel in game!
lag kills Voodoo Tactical Ghost Syndicate.	Posted - 2010.10.21 06:54:00 - [3] Edited by: lag kills on 21/10/2010 06:55:37 Originally by: Diomidis You don't run away from Pilgrims they should be running away from u - you can safely orbit them @ range and your dmg projection is vastly superior to theirs. You basically use the Vaga aggressively. You engage pretty much anything that cannot neut / web you at the edge of point range (22-24km) and you avoid web/scram ranges completely, unless you are fighting vs. something that you would call "easy kill" - that is most cruisers, frigates, recons etc. Usually vagas are flown with 220s and a med neut + dmg drones, but many ppl switch to ECM drones or drop the neut (and possibly some tank) for 425mm ACs...you out-range most medium ships turret ships and you vastly out-maneuver / outrun anything bigger than a frig. Fast stuff with heavy neuts are your enemy - Tempests, Machs and such BSs are NOT an easy target to move against unless a heavy gang is REALLY close to support you. When not sure, you always engage from a distance, orbiting @ the edge of the disruptor range and gambling / knowing that you will be able to maneuver out of point range if you get heavy neuted or out-gunned. That is the safe approach most ppl use "solo" or as forward tacklers against stuff bigger than yourself. Usually you are able to warp out even against multiple foes, unless you get scram/webbed or come face to face with your natural enemies: curses that can kill your speed, and speed = life, or Rapiers that can do the same. Remember, that with proper ammo loaded, you vastly out-dmg a rapier @ point range and it cannot take you solo unless he TDs you at the same time or something like that. You even have good chances to drive solo curses to disengage unless they TD you. Vagas get decent DPS and pretty good tracking for a HAC, so against weaker opponents it's not uncommon to move as close as possible to your optimal for max dps. Dual LSE vagas are pretty resilient (combination of resists/EHP, relatively small sig, speed) and rigs + DC II can push it's tank above of that most HACs and Recons achieve, while at the same time you out-run and possibly out-dmg nearly all of them due to the huge falloff that allows you to exploit your speed advantage by kiting them. awesome awesome post. thanks a lot. i've actually been able to fly the ship for a long time but soon after i had it trained i took a two year break. so, i have the basic principles down, just not much in-game experience or knowledge in specific matchups. things are a little different now with neuts, tracking enhancers, ACs getting some love. what i use is this. the diagnostic is there because even with perfect skills, a suitcase or nano won't fit without an implant that would replace my current 'rogue' speed implant. so i put on a polycarb, instead of a second extender. slowly saving the LP for a republic fleet disruptor. [Vagabond, vag] Gyrostabilizer II Gyrostabilizer II Power Diagnostic System II Tracking Enhancer II Tracking Enhancer II Large Shield Extender II Large Shield Extender II Y-T8 Overcharged Hydrocarbon I Microwarpdrive Warp Disruptor II 220mm Vulcan AutoCannon II 220mm Vulcan AutoCannon II 220mm Vulcan AutoCannon II 220mm Vulcan AutoCannon II 220mm Vulcan AutoCannon II 50W Infectious Power System Malfunction Medium Polycarbon Engine Housing I Medium Core Defence Field Extender I EC-300 x5 ___________________________ not all who wander are lost.
Alara IonStorm Agent-Orange	Posted - 2010.10.21 07:24:00 - [4] Edited by: Alara IonStorm on 21/10/2010 07:26:58 Originally by: Diomidis You don't run away from Pilgrims they should be running away from u - you can safely orbit them @ range and your dmg projection is vastly superior to theirs. Though this is true pay extra attention, if a Pilgram uncloaks next to you. Get past 15km because a good Pilgram fit will Scram, Web, TD, Nuet and have an Afterburner that will help it keep pace with your shut down MWD 60% webbed ship. Though it's locking time should let you get to a safe range before this happens if you keep awake. If he does get tackle and locks you right next to him shoot the drones, his Nuets and ECM drones means he can deagress and when you have 0 DPS thats usually the time. -- I am now on a Crusade to Fix the Omen! For Great Justice!
ThrashPower Gallente Genos Occidere HYDRA RELOADED	Posted - 2010.10.21 08:18:00 - [5] Originally by: lag kills what i use is this. the diagnostic is there because even with perfect skills, the neut makes it so a suitcase or nano won't fit without an implant that would replace my current 'rogue' speed implant. [Vagabond, dc fit] Gyrostabilizer II Gyrostabilizer II Tracking Enhancer II Tracking Enhancer II Damage Control II Y-T8 Overcharged Hydrocarbon I Microwarpdrive Large F-S9 Regolith Shield Induction Large Shield Extender II Warp Disruptor II 220mm Vulcan AutoCannon II, Republic Fleet EMP M 220mm Vulcan AutoCannon II, Republic Fleet EMP M 220mm Vulcan AutoCannon II, Republic Fleet EMP M 220mm Vulcan AutoCannon II, Republic Fleet EMP M 220mm Vulcan AutoCannon II, Republic Fleet EMP M Medium Unstable Power Fluctuator I rigs and drones to taste, requires AWU5 SU5, no implants over 3k more ehp than your fit.
Quendishir Caldari The Immortal Dawn	Posted - 2010.10.21 08:30:00 - [6] [Vagabond, Perm MWD] Gyrostabilizer II Gyrostabilizer II Damage Control II Overdrive Injector System II Overdrive Injector System II 10MN MicroWarpdrive II Large Shield Extender II Warp Disruptor II Large Capacitor Battery II 220mm Vulcan AutoCannon II, Republic Fleet EMP M 220mm Vulcan AutoCannon II, Republic Fleet EMP M 220mm Vulcan AutoCannon II, Republic Fleet EMP M 220mm Vulcan AutoCannon II, Republic Fleet EMP M 220mm Vulcan AutoCannon II, Republic Fleet EMP M [empty high slot] Medium Polycarbon Engine Housing I Medium Polycarbon Engine Housing I Hornet II x5 Contrary to the name, the MWD does not run permanently. You get roughly six minutes of cap time if you run everything and aren't neut'd to death. Your speed - with good navigation skills - is roughly 450 m/s without the MWD running, and 3134 m/s with it running. With six minutes to engage your target, you should never have to worry about being outpaced. As has been said, 220's give excellent tracking and damage. Your optimal with EMP is 1.3 km, and a falloff of 14. With good gunnery skills, you can get 376 DPS and 844 volley. I am also running implants, so I'm counting those right now. Barrage will give you 2.6 km optimal and 21 km falloff. Combat should focus on maintaining a steady orbit outside scram range. Doing this will allow you to dictate the engagement. If his backup arrives, you can quickly deagress, get out of dodge, and warp once his point is off you. Tracking distrupters hurt, admittedly, but with six minutes...a lot of ammo will be wasted, but you should be able to handle the target.
Azbuga Amarr Bloody Amarr's	Posted - 2010.10.21 09:27:00 - [7] vaga, cynabal and stabber fleet issue shine with at last true sansha warp disruptor. price about 90-100m and you got 28km point, 30 with domination. And with barrage you still give nice dps. With faction disruptor you dont affraid heavy neuts. good idea is to have faction depleted uranium or titanium sabot ammo in cargo. 20% tracking bonus is great when any interceptor engaging you.
TaluxA	Posted - 2010.10.21 09:27:00 - [8] Thrashpower's fit is the cookie cutter one and is basically the one you want to base off. You can put two Meta 4 shield extenders if you don't have AWU 5.
Petrov Kreigt Caldari Project Nemesis	Posted - 2010.10.21 09:48:00 - [9] Originally by: Quendishir [Vagabond, Perm MWD] Gyrostabilizer II Gyrostabilizer II Damage Control II Overdrive Injector System II Overdrive Injector System II 10MN MicroWarpdrive II Large Shield Extender II Warp Disruptor II Large Capacitor Battery II 220mm Vulcan AutoCannon II, Republic Fleet EMP M 220mm Vulcan AutoCannon II, Republic Fleet EMP M 220mm Vulcan AutoCannon II, Republic Fleet EMP M 220mm Vulcan AutoCannon II, Republic Fleet EMP M 220mm Vulcan AutoCannon II, Republic Fleet EMP M [empty high slot] Medium Polycarbon Engine Housing I Medium Polycarbon Engine Housing I Hornet II x5 Contrary to the name, the MWD does not run permanently. You get roughly six minutes of cap time if you run everything and aren't neut'd to death. Your speed - with good navigation skills - is roughly 450 m/s without the MWD running, and 3134 m/s with it running. With six minutes to engage your target, you should never have to worry about being outpaced. As has been said, 220's give excellent tracking and damage. Your optimal with EMP is 1.3 km, and a falloff of 14. With good gunnery skills, you can get 376 DPS and 844 volley. I am also running implants, so I'm counting those right now. Barrage will give you 2.6 km optimal and 21 km falloff. Combat should focus on maintaining a steady orbit outside scram range. Doing this will allow you to dictate the engagement. If his backup arrives, you can quickly deagress, get out of dodge, and warp once his point is off you. Tracking distrupters hurt, admittedly, but with six minutes...a lot of ammo will be wasted, but you should be able to handle the target. My vagabond has about 1 minute something of cap... dont need to perma run it, just dictate range but pulsing every now and again
Lady Thanatos Nomadic Shadows	Posted - 2010.10.21 10:42:00 - [10] I've come back after a year hiatus and have noticed more vaga's dropping the two nanofibers and putting in TE's instead. Why the extra DPS/Range vs speed?
VanNostrum	Posted - 2010.10.21 10:53:00 - [11] Originally by: Diomidis You don't run away from Pilgrims they should be running away from u - you can safely orbit them @ range and your dmg projection is vastly superior to theirs. Run away from a Vaga in my Pilgrim? I'd like to see a Vaga kite me with it's 5km falloff lol
Wacktopia Bi-Tech Theory Focused Intentions	Posted - 2010.10.21 15:17:00 - [12] I like using 2 t.enh and 2 gyro's. The importance of the 2 t.enh is that you can hit reasonably well at 20km with the close-range ammo - so you can therefore change damage type at range. Without the 2nd t.enh you need to be more like 15-16km from your target, which is close to web range... close to getting neuted or scrammed.
Denuo Secus	Posted - 2010.10.21 16:25:00 - [13] Very great advice here! Plz let me throw in a question. How should a Vaga be handled when facing.. - a HM ship - another similar Vaga Considering especially HMs I've doubts I can survive long enough in a Vaga! Thanks - Save the missiles from the glowing blob :S R ----------> * A --------> * V --------> * E -------> * N ---------> *
Duke o'DeliMeats	Posted - 2010.10.21 17:43:00 - [14] Originally by: VanNostrum Run away from a Vaga in my Pilgrim? I'd like to see a Vaga kite me with it's 5km falloff lol heh. dies to a vaga shooting barrage 20km away To the OP, be careful engaging a drake or tengu solo in a vaga. You will always be able to gtfo and not die, but 9 times out of 10 you just won't be able to kill them. They do kinetic damage, which is your weakest resist, and tend to have a ** ton of ehp with resists that are fairly high against barrage. Also, missiles, tracking, etc. You can always try and see if they are complete -fit and a horrible pilot so you can use rf emp and get close, but chances are that they can get you to off with their kinetic missile damage before you can really do anything. Cerbs are similar except they have **ty ehp, so you should be able to kill them.
Famine Aligher'ri V i L e	Posted - 2010.10.21 18:04:00 - [15] Vaga's who kite me 20km away just make me MWD up to the gate and I jump out the system. Range is good, but good luck finding someone who is going to battle you till the death at 20km+ and not run away. V i L e - Recruiting Pirates
Carniflex Fallout Research Fallout Project	Posted - 2010.10.21 18:30:00 - [16] It has been a while - but back when I lived in the south character called nMeh harassed the area in that kind of setup. It was quite effective overall - granted he was picking his fight with care and was relatively patient. Seems in line with other suggestion in this thread. I dont fly vaga myself so cant give first hand experience based suggestions.
Famine Aligher'ri V i L e	Posted - 2010.10.21 18:49:00 - [17] Edited by: Famine Aligher''ri on 21/10/2010 18:52:05 Similar to the setup I fly solo. It's good for getting deep in enemy space with the option of cloak/dagger. The problem though is as mentioned previously. The top setups for Vaga's are designed for kiting and speed. Finding targets that simple will just MWD up to a gate or station is SUPER common. The only other alternative is finding people in belts. Over the years, Vaga's have shown more colors to being a good squad ship to run with your mates. V i L e - Recruiting Pirates
Tippia Sunshine and Lollipops	Posted - 2010.10.21 19:08:00 - [18] Edited by: Tippia on 21/10/2010 19:11:23 Originally by: Lady Thanatos I've come back after a year hiatus and have noticed more vaga's dropping the two nanofibers and putting in TE's instead. Why the extra DPS/Range vs speed? Because of the boost that TEs and tracking computers got last winter, where they now improve your autocannons' (or, well, any turrets, but probably ACs benefit from it the most) falloff range. This means you can maintain the same range as before and do a fair bit more damage, not just because you're not quite as far into falloff as before, but also because of the improved hit quality from the extra trackingà àso when your gyros start being heavily stacking penalised, TEs come in and add add more effective and applied damage. Alternatively, they let you stay much farther away than before and still do the same damage (and if the enemy hasn't fitted TEs to mach, he now has problems hitting you back), and have have some extra GTFO buffer should things turn ugly. The choice between that and the no-longer-that-great benefit you get from nano after the speed nerf makes TEs a very tempting choice. ùùù ôIf you're not willing to fight for what you have in ≡v≡à you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.ö ù Karath Piki
Wacktopia Bi-Tech Theory Focused Intentions	Posted - 2010.10.21 19:17:00 - [19] Originally by: Denuo Secus Very great advice here! Plz let me throw in a question. How should a Vaga be handled when facing.. - a HM ship - another similar Vaga Considering especially HMs I've doubts I can survive long enough in a Vaga! Thanks VS another Vaga I would switch to Fleet Fusion (high damage and hits weakest two resists: kin exp). Overload your mwd and get in to about 5km, where you will hit massive damage. Put your drones on him and overheat guns (do not burn them out!). Watch his velocity on you overview; if it rises you should try an overloaded pulse of your mwd to keep close. That works for me mano a mano - admittedly on sisi as practicing this ship myself.
VanNostrum	Posted - 2010.10.21 20:14:00 - [20] Originally by: Duke o'DeliMeats Originally by: VanNostrum Run away from a Vaga in my Pilgrim? I'd like to see a Vaga kite me with it's 5km falloff lol heh. dies to a vaga shooting barrage 20km away And how does a Vaga shoot from 20km? A vaga with T2 425s and 2xT2 TE using barrage ammo with full skills gets 7.5km falloff vs pilgrim with 2xT2 TDs.
Tippia Sunshine and Lollipops	Posted - 2010.10.21 20:24:00 - [21] Originally by: VanNostrum And how does a Vaga shoot from 20km? With its guns? Quote: A vaga with T2 425s and 2xT2 TE using barrage ammo with full skills gets 7.5km falloff vs pilgrim with 2xT2 TDs. I think you need to update your EFTà 425mm II + 2× TE + Barrage = 3.9km optimal + 44km falloff. It's not even half into falloff at 20km. ùùù ôIf you're not willing to fight for what you have in ≡v≡à you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.ö ù Karath Piki
Suyer	Posted - 2010.10.21 20:37:00 - [22] Originally by: Tippia 425mm II + 2+ TE II + Barrage M = 3.9km optimal + 44km falloff at all V. It's not even half into falloff at 20km. Hell, even the fit shown with a screenshot above (using piddling 220mm with short-range ammo) has 1.8 + 22km. Sure, 44km before the 60% reduction in falloff due to 1 TD on a pilgrim. And if they have two, then yes, the vaga will have 7.5km falloff. I troll vagas in my curse all day long, I just sit at 20km and lol while they do zero damage becuase of the one TD im sticking on their ass.
Sidus Isaacs Gallente	Posted - 2010.10.21 20:40:00 - [23] Never seen so many fail vagas in a thread before :( Vaga is all about speed. Use it. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- http://desusig.crumplecorn.com/sigs.html
Hidris Beggars Banquet	Posted - 2010.10.21 20:47:00 - [24] Edited by: Hidris on 21/10/2010 20:50:02 I would highly advise you to practice piloting the vagabond on the test server first. 1/ always fit a medium neut, its essential against frig hull if youre scrambled and web ( warp scrambler will kill your MWD ) and if you get into a taranis blaster optimal range, you re gonna be in for a rough ride if he still have cap 2/ never go into scrambler range unless you re sure your opponent is almost dead 3/ practice on test or with stabber first Personnally i sck at piloting it ( i think it fly like a brick ), always end up too far away or too close and get scrambled Drakes are annoying, so are the harbinger, they will force you to get the fck out of disruptor range if they re not too dumb and warp away.
lag kills	Posted - 2010.10.23 07:39:00 - [25] welp, i got the power implant and replaced the diagnostic with the damage control and only lost like 12m/s in non mwd speed. wondering if having two polycarbs is worth the hp loss from losing an extender. thanks for the tips. feels free to keep them coming :D ___________________________ not all who wander are lost.
Intigo Amarr Genos Occidere HYDRA RELOADED	Posted - 2010.10.23 09:54:00 - [26] Originally by: Tippia Edited by: Tippia on 21/10/2010 20:31:07 Originally by: VanNostrum And how does a Vaga shoot from 20km? With its guns? Quote: A vaga with T2 425s and 2xT2 TE using barrage ammo with full skills gets 7.5km falloff vs pilgrim with 2xT2 TDs. I think you need to update your EFTà 425mm II + 2+ TE II + Barrage M = 3.9km optimal + 44km falloff at all V. It's not even half into falloff at 20km. Hell, even the fit shown with a screenshot above (using piddling 220mm with short-range ammo) has 1.8 + 22km. You literally can't read. ___________________
Tippia Sunshine and Lollipops	Posted - 2010.10.23 10:02:00 - [27] Originally by: Intigo You literally can't read. You literally don't know what "literally" means. ùùù ôIf you're not willing to fight for what you have in ≡v≡à you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.ö ù Karath Piki

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