Pages: [1] :: one page |
|
Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 0 post(s) |

Vorekk
|
Posted - 2010.11.06 04:43:00 -
[1]
What ever the current method for getting new characters up to speed is, keep it that way. I *think* its 2x SP/Hour rate until x number of skill points. Whatever. That's fine.
But isn't the heart of the problem nestled in with the Learning skill tree? Why doesn't CCP simply double the amount of base attributes, permanently, and make each attribute half as effective regarding SP/Hour, and bump up the Learning skill from 2% to 4% per level.
I think this would benefit newer players without affecting older players too much. It would also nearly negate the issue of removing the Learning skill set.
If this has already been mentioned and shot down before, my apologies. If there's some glaring mistake I've made in my reasoning, point it out, 'cause I don't see it...
Otherwise, I want a cookie :D
- Vor
|

Yelan Zhou
Amarr Ba.theen Aljannatal Asaakitah
|
Posted - 2010.11.06 05:14:00 -
[2]
Well the simplest way would be to remove them entirely and give the charakter the SPs back.New characters enjoy accelerated training for some time and older ones enjoy the faster training they had over the years.Dunno, but as a new player I wouldnt care and as an older player I surely find something nice to invest a big pile of SPs. Win/win imo.
|

I likegirls
Minmatar
|
Posted - 2010.11.06 05:52:00 -
[3]
\o/ YAY! another one of these.
|

jerichot
Cutish Brunts
|
Posted - 2010.11.06 08:53:00 -
[4]
what about tripling or quadrupling them then ? why not after all ? Eve online is not a game where you SP grow depending on how many time you "bash, lockpick or cast a spell". It is based on time, no matter if you clic the same button 1 bazillion times or not. That's how it is .
CCP already made the effort to double speed the first 1.6 million , what do you want more than that ? I mean if you think it takes too much times to train those learning skills to 4/4 which is perfectly acceptable for at least 1 year if not 2, then I'm afraid you're not going to make it here.
When you gonna have to train those rank 8 skills like battleships, which takes 27 or 28 days in general, you re gonna go crazy. This IS NOT an instant gratification game and thats how games should be to be honest.
|

Drendel
|
Posted - 2010.11.06 11:31:00 -
[5]
I don't have fun playing basketball. The net is to high for me to dunk. They should lower all nets so I can have fun to.
|

shakedatazz
|
Posted - 2010.11.06 13:28:00 -
[6]
Originally by: Drendel I don't have fun playing basketball. The net is to high for me to dunk. They should lower all nets so I can have fun to.
terrible analogy. he's not talking about adjusting one universal thing that would equally affect everyone.
its actually a pretty good idea. o7
|

Luminos
|
Posted - 2010.11.06 14:31:00 -
[7]
Originally by: jerichot CCP already made the effort to double speed the first 1.6 million
And do you remember why they did that?
|

Socio Stan
|
Posted - 2010.11.06 16:26:00 -
[8]
Originally by: Luminos
Originally by: jerichot CCP already made the effort to double speed the first 1.6 million
And do you remember why they did that?
It was because all the ugly achura were uglying up their game... or was that a seperate problem? |

Pantload
Gallente The Underpants Gnomes Deep Space Engineering
|
Posted - 2010.11.06 17:09:00 -
[9]
Originally by: shakedatazz
Originally by: Drendel I don't have fun playing basketball. The net is to high for me to dunk. They should lower all nets so I can have fun to.
terrible analogy. he's not talking about adjusting one universal thing that would equally affect everyone.
its actually a pretty good idea. o7
It's a fantastic analogy. What do you mean the OP is not talking about adjust something universal that affects everyone? He's talking about altering training speeds and the effects of Learning skills. That effects everyone. His suggestion is terrible.
TUG: The Underpants Gnomes. Buy Corps here
|

Mutant Caldari
Caldari Percussive Diplomacy
|
Posted - 2010.11.06 17:48:00 -
[10]
Originally by: jerichot what about tripling or quadrupling them then ? why not after all ? Eve online is not a game where you SP grow depending on how many time you "bash, lockpick or cast a spell". It is based on time, no matter if you clic the same button 1 bazillion times or not. That's how it is .
CCP already made the effort to double speed the first 1.6 million , what do you want more than that ? I mean if you think it takes too much times to train those learning skills to 4/4 which is perfectly acceptable for at least 1 year if not 2, then I'm afraid you're not going to make it here.
When you gonna have to train those rank 8 skills like battleships, which takes 27 or 28 days in general, you re gonna go crazy. This IS NOT an instant gratification game and thats how games should be to be honest.
I do quite well with 4/3 learning skills.    Yeah I am a pirate. What are you gonna do about it? Killboard link is not allowed to be used in a signature.Applebabe
|
|

Mimiru Minahiro
|
Posted - 2010.11.06 19:45:00 -
[11]
Edited by: Mimiru Minahiro on 06/11/2010 19:47:29
Originally by: Vorekk But isn't the heart of the problem nestled in with the Learning skill tree? Why doesn't CCP simply double the amount of base attributes, permanently, and make each attribute half as effective regarding SP/Hour, and bump up the Learning skill from 2% to 4% per level.
I think this would benefit newer players without affecting older players too much. It would also nearly negate the issue of removing the Learning skill set.
Umm doesnt this actually make skill times longer and thus make it harder for new players? As near as I can tell training time for a rank 8 skill, like BS V, goes from 25d 15hrs(ish) to 31d 15hrs(ish) under the best scenario of max'd learning, remap, and +5 implants.
|

omgfreemoniez
|
Posted - 2010.11.06 23:05:00 -
[12]
But as a bitter vet I want noobs to stay useless so I can pwn them.
|

ZeJesus
|
Posted - 2010.11.07 11:14:00 -
[13]
Originally by: omgfreemoniez But as a bitter vet I want noobs to stay useless so I can pwn them.
FukYeah
|

Forum Guy
|
Posted - 2010.11.10 02:52:00 -
[14]
Originally by: jerichot CCP already made the effort to double speed the first 1.6 million , what do you want more than that ?
They've not given anything away there. The previous character creation system was better for new players imo, at least they could start with some good mining skills or combat or business. You used to start with about 800,000 sp now you just get some basic general skills and have to spend sometime training to even get to a stage where you used to start at.
The new system only really benefits players that want to have a limited specialist alt where they train it up whilst not playing it.
It was definetly a backward move, makes you wonder who they listen to.
|

Thrasymachus TheSophist
|
Posted - 2010.11.10 03:23:00 -
[15]
Originally by: jerichot what about tripling or quadrupling them then ? why not after all ? Eve online is not a game where you SP grow depending on how many time you "bash, lockpick or cast a spell". It is based on time, no matter if you clic the same button 1 bazillion times or not. That's how it is .
CCP already made the effort to double speed the first 1.6 million , what do you want more than that ? I mean if you think it takes too much times to train those learning skills to 4/4 which is perfectly acceptable for at least 1 year if not 2, then I'm afraid you're not going to make it here.
When you gonna have to train those rank 8 skills like battleships, which takes 27 or 28 days in general, you re gonna go crazy. This IS NOT an instant gratification game and thats how games should be to be honest.
Circular reasoning. You can keep pretending like its resasonable to expect the game to grow when new players are looking at a 1-2 year commitment to be able to fly competitively in a T2 ship. But I'd suggest thats just not the way ti is anymore. People now play 6-7 months and move on. The best you can hope for is that they come back and play antoher round.
I've said it before, I'll say it again: They should jigger the skill system so you get up to 20 million SP in 6 months. Then taper it off so that getting up to things like captials and super capitals still require a ton of time. This would permit players to ramp up within 6 months to a fully t2 fitted cruiser or 2.
Or if 20 mill is too much, adjust it, but just make it so that a player can "max" for almost all purposes (not heat, not boosters, but all mods)one, maybe 2 different t2 cruisers, within 6 months.
its good for everyone.
|

Luminos
|
Posted - 2010.11.10 04:05:00 -
[16]
Originally by: Forum Guy The new system only really benefits players that want to have a limited specialist alt where they train it up whilst not playing it.
Not entirely true. From what I remember the old system didn't let you focus that free 800,000 SP in learning skills, so you still needed to spend a few weeks on skilling up the brain meats regardless.
|

Misanthra
|
Posted - 2010.11.10 06:03:00 -
[17]
Edited by: Misanthra on 10/11/2010 06:03:14
Originally by: I likegirls \o/ YAY! another one of these.
I blame ccp marketting for this...posting that ad all over the place. Brings in new muppets all the time. They left games not like eve because they hated them....then try to bring everything from the games they hated into eve. Cause you know..it will work better with caldari and gallente than elves and dwarves 
For mmo's its eve or wow as top choice...sadly eve gets the people sick of wow so we get stuck with them. I can't speak for world of tanks (someone gonna say it lol)....never got word back about getting into beta :( .
|

Forum Guy
|
Posted - 2010.11.10 11:38:00 -
[18]
Edited by: Forum Guy on 10/11/2010 11:45:40 Edited by: Forum Guy on 10/11/2010 11:38:54
Originally by: Luminos
Originally by: Forum Guy The new system only really benefits players that want to have a limited specialist alt where they train it up whilst not playing it.
Not entirely true. From what I remember the old system didn't let you focus that free 800,000 SP in learning skills, so you still needed to spend a few weeks on skilling up the brain meats regardless.
With the last system (there have been earlier ones ofc) I think you did start with two rank 1 learning skills which one of those was at lvl 4 or 5.
You did have to train the learning skills still but at least before you had some good skills to be going on with in the area that you chose (i.e. mining).
If the argument was lets change the system so that you are able to learn all the learning skills first, well that's just plain stupid. Would have been much better to just get rid of the learning skills. I mean the only people that really like them are the sort of people that get satisfaction out of watching paint dry.
|

Arnakoz
|
Posted - 2010.11.10 13:13:00 -
[19]
Edited by: Arnakoz on 10/11/2010 13:14:25
Originally by: Misanthra Edited by: Misanthra on 10/11/2010 06:03:14
Originally by: I likegirls \o/ YAY! another one of these.
I blame ccp marketting for this...posting that ad all over the place. Brings in new muppets all the time. They left games not like eve because they hated them....then try to bring everything from the games they hated into eve. Cause you know..it will work better with caldari and gallente than elves and dwarves 
For mmo's its eve or wow as top choice...sadly eve gets the people sick of wow so we get stuck with them. I can't speak for world of tanks (someone gonna say it lol)....never got word back about getting into beta :( .
The problem here isn't about you. or WoW even. What it is about is how the game makes new players feel as if they wont actually be able to do much (and they can't really) for another month.
yes, there ARE things they can do - they just "need to explore." it is just a matter of initial impression. but that is a bit like trying to force caviar down someones throat - yes at some point it becomes awesome, but the initial reaction isn't likely to make them a believer. only those who stick with it despite it not being "the most awesome thing ever" get to that point.
so what do we get? not people trying to make eve like WoW... but people who see the potential in eve, and "can't wait to be able to finally start actually playing it." (still talking impression here guys) and since they can't do anything to get there any faster they come here and bring up these ideas - the only they can do to potentially help their cause. Only those who manage to hang on for a couple of months (way to long for any game) finally get it. but for the mean time eve is stuck with a horrid retention rate due to this very matter.
not sure why i even care that CCP gets a good following. but there's my take regardless.
|

Cathy Drall
Royal Amarr Institute
|
Posted - 2010.11.10 13:34:00 -
[20]
Originally by: Forum Guy If the argument was lets change the system so that you are able to learn all the learning skills first, well that's just plain stupid. Would have been much better to just get rid of the learning skills. I mean the only people that really like them are the sort of people that get satisfaction out of watching paint dry.
Well you can always play Starcraft for the first few months to get in the sci fi space mood! 
|
|

Luminos
|
Posted - 2010.11.10 14:30:00 -
[21]
Originally by: Forum Guy Would have been much better to just get rid of the learning skills. I mean the only people that really like them are the sort of people that get satisfaction out of watching paint dry.
You know, you might be on to something there. 
|

Bernard Schuyler
|
Posted - 2010.11.10 15:17:00 -
[22]
Originally by: Luminos
Originally by: Forum Guy The new system only really benefits players that want to have a limited specialist alt where they train it up whilst not playing it.
Not entirely true. From what I remember the old system didn't let you focus that free 800,000 SP in learning skills, so you still needed to spend a few weeks on skilling up the brain meats regardless.
Yes, but the point was you had enough skills to actually play the game even if you only trained Learning skills for the first two months.
However, I think the Queue for skills more than makes up for any added inconvenience. In ye olde days you had to train short skills while you played, and then swap to long skills when you logged out to make sure the skill wouldn't end while you were offline. So in the end you had a lot more partially trained skills and it took longer to actually complete the skills as you bounced around.
|

Flapkonijn
BLACK LIGHTNING MINING CREW
|
Posted - 2010.11.11 12:55:00 -
[23]
YAY \0/ it's the 50th "New players to train faster" thread of 2010 
You win a free +2 Willpower implant to be collected in Jita. 

|

FireT
Gallente Royal Advanced Industries Imperial Crimson Legion
|
Posted - 2010.11.11 16:26:00 -
[24]
Ok I want to join the beating of the dead horse: Why is it that this hyper individualized perception emorages constantly?
What makes Eve so fantastic is that I can have a new player, completely fresh out of the noobplanet, join me in a level 4 and say 'have fun kid'. Seriously what other MMO can people list where people can start of and join a group of high end players right from the beginning?
Hate to say it, and it seriously becoming my life motto for stupid people, appreciate what you have and what you are given and not what you don't have (yes you can work - note the word WORK - for those things you don't have).
|

Srioghal moDhream
|
Posted - 2010.11.11 19:32:00 -
[25]
Too many posts to read so I hope this was not said already.
One person mentioned that this whole thing of doubling the attributes and returning all the sp spent on learning skills back to the players would make everything all right.
But what about all the sp they lost because they did not have those attributes to start with? Over the course of 2-7 years that is a sizeable number.
|
|
|
|
Pages: [1] :: one page |
First page | Previous page | Next page | Last page |