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AkJon Ferguson
JC Ferguson and Son Ltd
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Posted - 2010.11.07 01:56:00 -
[1]
5 PLEX = 6 months + transfer = 11mish SP toon = 3+B at current prices (if you train properly)
Not a bad ROI.
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Machete Visor
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Posted - 2010.11.07 02:11:00 -
[2]
 Originally by: AkJon Ferguson
5 PLEX = 6 months + transfer = 11mish SP toon = 3+B at current prices (if you train properly)
Not a bad ROI.
with the $20 fee waived, even shorter training times are worth looking at, if you look into specialized characters
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Nathan Jameson
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Posted - 2010.11.07 06:17:00 -
[3]
Edited by: Nathan Jameson on 07/11/2010 06:19:38
You can make more than 3B in 6 months with a fresh character in MD. But I guess that requires actual work.
EDIT: You also have to take the character transfer fee into account.
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Machete Visor
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Posted - 2010.11.07 06:25:00 -
[4]
as people catch on to this, i am guessing implants (+3s and +4s) especially for INT / MEM will see a nice bump.
those are needed to make the training path much quicker by more than a few days
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Rakshasa Taisab
Caldari
Sane Industries Inc.
Initiative Mercenaries
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Posted - 2010.11.07 07:00:00 -
[5]
Originally by: Machete Visor
as people catch on to this, i am guessing implants (+3s and +4s) especially for INT / MEM will see a nice bump.
Sitting here in MD all day, it's often difficult to remember how life is out there in the real world where pods go pop at mindblowing rates.
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PureMurder
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Posted - 2010.11.07 08:52:00 -
[6]
Is there any way to avoid paying RL$ to move the toon?
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Mme Pinkerton
United Engineering Services
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Posted - 2010.11.07 09:40:00 -
[7]
Edited by: Mme Pinkerton on 07/11/2010 09:43:09
I am wrong
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Mara Rinn
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Posted - 2010.11.07 10:28:00 -
[8]
Originally by: PureMurder
Is there any way to avoid paying RL$ to move the toon?
2 PLEX to transfer characters.
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[Aussie players: join ANZAC channel] |
Xanaan Zenithdul
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Posted - 2010.11.07 11:14:00 -
[9]
Originally by: Mara Rinn
Originally by: PureMurder
Is there any way to avoid paying RL$ to move the toon?
2 PLEX to transfer characters.
Can you really do that?
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Andrea Exerlauka
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Posted - 2010.11.07 11:20:00 -
[10]
Originally by: Xanaan Zenithdul
Originally by: Mara Rinn
Originally by: PureMurder
Is there any way to avoid paying RL$ to move the toon?
2 PLEX to transfer characters.
Can you really do that?
Yep, check this thread for details: http://www.eveonline.com/ingameboard.asp?a=topic&threadID=1411025
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Nathan Jameson
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Posted - 2010.11.08 04:23:00 -
[11]
Originally by: Andrea Exerlauka
Yep, check this thread for details: http://www.eveonline.com/ingameboard.asp?a=topic&threadID=1411025
An additional cost you have to factor in to your passive income equation. However, this development is great, since you can now make decent in-game money without having to spend IRL money.
I might have to try this sometime. One of my accounts has only traders and miners, and they're about maxed on all the skills they need. I might use a free slot to give this a try.
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Othran
Brutor tribe
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Posted - 2010.11.08 11:29:00 -
[12]
Originally by: AkJon Ferguson
5 PLEX = 6 months + transfer = 11mish SP toon = 3+B at current prices (if you train properly)
Not a bad ROI.
7 PLEX, not 5. You need 2 PLEX to transfer the character.
Assuming a low PLEX price of 350mill that's 2.5 bill near enough. Now add in +4s and (cheap) skill costs and you're at 2.7bill or so base cost.
10% return on a 6 month investment of a couple of bill is a pretty dreadful RoI.
For example my alt bought 4 Thanatos recently as the prices were down in the low 600s. Sold them ten days later making a net profit of just over 400mill. Didn't do anything other than buy them and sell them. Same with 10 Dommies I just unloaded after a couple of weeks - 40mill profit, peanuts I know but just over 10% net profit in 14 days or so for doing nothing.
Now yeah if you train the right thing and its still FoTM when you're done you'll make more than 10% but its not as profitable as it once was.
When PLEX jumped recently I converted one of my sale alts to a JF plan and I'm going to keep him - I'm simply not seeing realistic character prices when compared with PLEX prices. Still what goes around comes around so the other sale character now has a sale plan of 18-24 months and we'll see what we see.
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Raid'En
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Posted - 2010.11.08 12:04:00 -
[13]
power of 2 offer = 3 plex, not 5 :P
same psot as akita T
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** Wormhole Trading ** |
Nathan Jameson
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Posted - 2010.11.08 13:28:00 -
[14]
Originally by: Othran
10% return on a 6 month investment of a couple of bill is a pretty dreadful RoI.
In my case, I'd be training an alt of an account I'd be keeping active anyway, so it'd be worth it for me. 
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Phoebe Halliwel
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Posted - 2010.11.08 17:09:00 -
[15]
This change could just as easily devalue characters even further couldn't it? Plenty of people have spare alts they could sell, the only thing holding them back may be RL costs. 1 plex to transfer an alt you don't use is really not that much, particularly for people who already plex their accounts. I wouldn't jump straight onto training characters for ISK without monitoring the overall character market for a while to see how it reacts to this change.
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Machete Visor
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Posted - 2010.11.08 17:25:00 -
[16]
Originally by: Phoebe Halliwel
This change could just as easily devalue characters even further couldn't it? Plenty of people have spare alts they could sell, the only thing holding them back may be RL costs. 1 plex to transfer an alt you don't use is really not that much, particularly for people who already plex their accounts. I wouldn't jump straight onto training characters for ISK without monitoring the overall character market for a while to see how it reacts to this change.
2 plex
If the number of characters coming to market on the low end (less than 3B) - which is the market that could be tapped using a Power of 2 - is really that high... wouldn't it push up the price of the plex instead of devaluing the players?
After all, SP are still time dependent and a constrained commodity. Plex are liquid and responsive to supply / demand.
I could see it affecting higher end characters if an army of high end alts is suddenly released by wealthy characters with ISK to burn on plex. The plex to SP ratio for the transfer (2 plex to transfer a 70M SP alt is much different than 2 plex for a 5M SP alt) is pretty low compared to the low end.
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Leksi Bar'zuk
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Posted - 2010.11.08 17:30:00 -
[17]
This is new and exciting and I hope everyone jumps on it.
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Diomedes Calypso
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Posted - 2010.11.08 17:39:00 -
[18]
Originally by: Phoebe Halliwel
This change could just as easily devalue characters even further couldn't it? Plenty of people have spare alts they could sell, the only thing holding them back may be RL costs. 1 plex to transfer an alt you don't use is really not that much, particularly for people who already plex their accounts. I wouldn't jump straight onto training characters for ISK without monitoring the overall character market for a while to see how it reacts to this change.
the cost is 2 plex btw,
But I agree with you. There is no question in my mind that this will increase the supply of characters on the market, with a pronounced increase in the 10 million sp range .
However if the increased uses for plex drive the price of plex up the cost side of the equation for creating chracters will rise .
Its really hard for me to wonder if the increased amount of isk the "plex creators" get per plex will increase their demand because of better value for their money(to buy fancy ships and stuff), or decrease their demand because their Isk needs were met with fewer plex sales . Personally, as I've argued in other threads, the "plex creators" use real $ based more on thier interest in the game rather than some eleastic value equation. Whether or not more people get interested enough in the game to use extra real money to buy isk is a huge question which I don't have a clue about...
Dozens of people in my PVP corp have been losing interest in the pvp game lately (as am I0 and without that pvp value setting up the context for the value of isk , the the lure of trading becomes less interesting to me too. I like the process of trading yet, part of the carrot is that the large piles of ISK have a latent pvp power in them. Whetherh or nto my copr is just going through a natural life-cycle or whether thee is more widespread loss of interest is beyond me
but, loss of interst means less people wanting characters... yet a higher price of creating characters.
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Phoebe Halliwel
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Posted - 2010.11.08 17:42:00 -
[19]
Woops crossposted you there with the correction.
Actually high end characters are already "devalued" compared to prices a few years ago and overall plex costs, also as more people hit very high SP the novelty has worn off and people simply are not prepared to pay as much. I'm no expert in this but I did a lot of research on characters a couple of years back, the power of two offer does periodically create surges in cheap characters, same thing when a particular race is nerfed or boosted (as with the speed nerf/missile nerfs a while back). There are a few people who turn over a decent margin training very focused low sp alts, but that market may be easily swamped if everyone has the same idea.
I'm wondering if this plex transfer process may encourage older players to dump things like lab alts or builders they dont really use anymore. I'm sure there is potential profit on training characters for profit, but the barrier of paying for transfers with RL cash has just been removed. I'd think that would initially benefit older players with a lot of unused alts and ISK who may wish to get rid of some accounts, rather than people trying to run a profitable business training low end focused alts. Should be interesting to see either way.
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Leksi Bar'zuk
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Posted - 2010.11.08 18:07:00 -
[20]
Originally by: Phoebe Halliwel
FOTM and specialty have more weight than age. Turning out low sp alts to sell is a low-margin buisness. Buying up fotm (minmatar, amarr, nyx) characters, polishing them up for a few months or so, and re-listing at a masive profit is the business to be in.
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Raid'En
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Posted - 2010.11.08 18:17:00 -
[21]
there's something else here to count ;
some of the guys using the plex for that won't sell the char after.
some guys will use the power of 2 plex offer, create a new alt, and after the 6 months will transfer it to another of their account as a new alt.
they can also transfer one alt to new po2 account, train it, and retransfer it later.
it's a posisbility to have another training char without spending real money at all, so some people with lot of isk will do it for sure.
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** Wormhole Trading ** |
Brock Nelson
Caldari
Flux Technologies Inc
SRS.
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Posted - 2010.11.08 18:22:00 -
[22]
I've looked into doing this ask a mean to get some additional passive profit.
One thing's for sure, you're more likely to sell a specialized character than a non-spec. I looked at a 6 month long plan including the int and mem +4 implants along with using 1 remap.
The plan was to have all of the invention skills (t2 skills only) to level 3, advanced lab ops to 4, cybernetics to v, production eff to v, metallurgy to v, pos defense to iv.
That came to about 8.2m sp in a span of 160 days give or take few hours. Total skillbook cost is 253.9m.
Profit = (250m * 8.2msp) - (3plex + 2plex)
Profit = 175m
Current plex price is about 375m, (3 for the 6 months deal and 2 for transfer). Unless I'm doing something wrong, it isn't worth it. The 250m per 1m skillpoint is just a rough estimate based on the going rates in character sale forum.
Originally by: Brock Nelson
OP's question is translated as: Help, I'm a female stuck in a man's body, can Incarna help?
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Alice Celadon
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Posted - 2010.11.09 02:00:00 -
[23]
In other news: Character prices are about to drop about 20% --> permanently.
A huge barrier to character sales is the $20 cash that needs to be plunked down. Expect a lot of characters up on the sales forum to follow this formula:
unwanted_character_price > 2*plex_price --> sell character
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Machete Visor
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Posted - 2010.11.09 02:57:00 -
[24]
Edited by: Machete Visor on 09/11/2010 02:59:43
Edited by: Machete Visor on 09/11/2010 02:58:57
Originally by: Alice Celadon
In other news: Character prices are about to drop about 20% --> permanently.
A huge barrier to character sales is the $20 cash that needs to be plunked down. Expect a lot of characters up on the sales forum to follow this formula:
unwanted_character_price > 2*plex_price --> sell character
...this only makes sense for two types of players:
A - Tycoon
1) Ultra rich in eve
2) Ultra poor in RL
3) Has a high SP player
B - Worthless Alts
1) Has ****ty 10M sp characters
For A, it works because the person was not paying for their account in eve since they were rich. If they were paying for their account in eve, they would have done the math:
Wasted Alt ISK/370M ISK - $20 < 12 months * $15
and already sold the character.
if they had $20 to spare in real life, they would ahve sold the character already to monetize the SP.
I don't doubt there are a lot of "A's" out there, just saying it isn't every player on the block.
There may be more "B's". People with crappy alts half trained that are worth more than 700M ISK. 8M-10M SP is the most likely. If all those come to market, the people who make out are the people who buy 3 plex, setup 6 month training time for 1B, and sell at 10M SP higher in 6 month for 3x the ISK.
SP are still the only constrained resource in Eve. They can only be acquired through the passage of time. I think it may change the dynamics of the character market (and may make it harder to sort through), but prices will mostly fluctuate in plex.
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Richard Royce
Caldari
Abh Empire
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Posted - 2010.11.09 04:37:00 -
[25]
Originally by: Leksi Bar'zuk
This is new and exciting and I hope everyone jumps on it.
ROTfLMAO, not one in 10 will understand your comment. Nicely done.
I don't have a cool signature, sorry. |
Ambraciot
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Posted - 2010.11.09 23:23:00 -
[26]
With the cash fee gone, I finally care enough to ask these questions.
Is there a market for relatively low skill characters with access to level 4 missions?
How much of a premium do you think I could get for an alt that has 7+ faction standings with both the Republic and Federation?
When making alts for myself I have gained these standings in a month (with help from my other 4 accounts), will this be a booming new commission business like corp/alliance creation were?
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volhar
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Posted - 2010.11.09 23:46:00 -
[27]
I could see low skilled alts with great standings commanding a premium... I'd pay more for it if I was in the market. Certainly it'd be a great way to differentiate yourself from the other 10,000 hulk pilots or whatever else
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Leksi Bar'zuk
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Posted - 2010.11.10 00:00:00 -
[28]
Originally by: Ambraciot
With the cash fee gone, I finally care enough to ask these questions.
Is there a market for relatively low skill characters with access to level 4 missions?
How much of a premium do you think I could get for an alt that has 7+ faction standings with both the Republic and Federation?
When making alts for myself I have gained these standings in a month (with help from my other 4 accounts), will this be a booming new commission business like corp/alliance creation were?
Effective skilling and focus means a **** lot more than standings (which, in my experience are weighted below most every other variable). This won't be a booming business, but it will be halarious to watch idiots fail at it (no offense) and 10mil sp alts go for virtually nothing as they storm the character bazaar all at once. |
Ambraciot
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Posted - 2010.11.10 00:28:00 -
[29]
I don't know what currently affects character sale prices, but in terms of ability to earn isk, standings count more than skills.
I can (and do) make 50 million isk an hour with a <900,000 SP shuttle pilot in losec.
The key is having 7+ faction standings to talk to the dozens of L4 Q20 agents.
My mains have 30-40 million SP, but they have never really used it and have definitely never needed it.
Back in the old days (with proper standings) you could continuously and very rapidly run L4 hisec courier missions in a shuttle, pulling in more isk than most marauder pilots with a lot less effort.
Getting a storyline offer every 40 minutes is why the chars I used back then have perfect 10.00 Minmatar standings.
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