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McDeth
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Posted - 2010.11.08 17:32:00 -
[1]
Hi, is the Myrmidon any good for solo PVP? What about the Brutix? How do they compare?
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Aerilis
Gallente Percussive Diplomacy
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Posted - 2010.11.08 17:48:00 -
[2]
Myrmidon is awesome solo ship, probably my favorite solo BC. Brutix is very loldps, but it doesn't have much practical use, solo or in gangs.
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wizard87
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Posted - 2010.11.08 17:54:00 -
[3]
Wrong forum. They are both good solo ships.
Relying on drones for a good chunk of your DPS is personally not my preference because drones are clumsy, slow and can be destroyed or outran.
Turrets are instant DPS so I favour the brutix, normally along with 5 EC-600s which can swing a fight at any stage with some lucky jams.
However there's no doubt the Myrmidon has a superior tank, either active or buffer shield or armour, hence the additional tier/cost.
TLDR: if you're looking for quick ganks use a Brutix. If you're looking to fight longer and grind down opponents use a Myrmidon. Avoid using a Myrmidon under sentry fire.
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Spectre3353
Gallente The Python Cartel. The Jerk Cartel
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Posted - 2010.11.08 19:29:00 -
[4]
In virtually all situations, a Myrm is a better ship. In specific situations, the Brutix can be a nice, cost-efficient glass cannon. The only Brutix setup I feel that is even worth using is shield tanked with as much damage and gank piled on as humanly possible. The Myrm on the other hand has a variety of viable setups. ----- My Blog |
Mutnin
Amarr Mutineers
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Posted - 2010.11.08 20:09:00 -
[5]
Edited by: Mutnin on 08/11/2010 20:14:33 Myrm vs Brutix is much the same as Vexor vs Thorax.
Both Vexor & Myrm are awesome solo ships and the Brutix & Thorax both make for great high DPS gang ships. (drawback is of course they have to burn to the target to apply that DPS)
The only draw back to a Myrm over the Brutix, is you really need to be well skilled to take full advantage of what it has to offer. The Myrm is one of he ships that BC V can make a very big difference, much less maxed out capacitor & tank skills.
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Alara IonStorm
Agent-Orange Nabaal Syndicate
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Posted - 2010.11.08 21:20:00 -
[6]
Edited by: Alara IonStorm on 08/11/2010 21:21:23
Originally by: Spectre3353 In virtually all situations, a Myrm is a better ship. In specific situations, the Brutix can be a nice, cost-efficient glass cannon. The only Brutix setup I feel that is even worth using is shield tanked with as much damage and gank piled on as humanly possible. The Myrm on the other hand has a variety of viable setups.
Saw this, went to EVE Newb for updates...
Left dispointed.
As for the Myrm it is one of the most useful Battlecruisers to do any role but not the best when wanting to out do the ships that specialize in it.
The Myrm can be dual rep tanked for solo or small gangs, buffer armored with a 1600mm plate and even Sheild tanked with 2 LSE and an Invun with maximum gank/tracking in the lows.
With the Drone Dmg bonus it can do similar DPS as the others and can be laser, autocannon or blaster fit. It can fill the role of RR or full nuet boat while still mantaining good DPS and tank. It's large Drone Bay means you can fit spare drones such as ECM or Logi(Nuetral RR) depending on what you want to acomplish while having spare Combat drones to boot.
Finally it's slot layout may not allow for say Nuet+gun fits unless you are willing to loose a slot. Even then with a large % of Dmg being drones you do not loose to much. With it's generous mid slot layout you have room for duel Cap Boosts, or Duel Webs, Sebo's, TD or Tracking Computers.
In all it isn't a good large fleet ship but as a Sole or Small Gang Boat it is a great ship.
-- I am now on a Crusade to Fix the Omen!
For Great Justice!
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McDeth
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Posted - 2010.11.08 21:45:00 -
[7]
Sorry if this sounds like a noob question, but how can a ship be good in small gangs but not large ones?
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Maz3r Rakum
Gallente Deus Imperiosus Acies
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Posted - 2010.11.08 22:12:00 -
[8]
Originally by: McDeth Sorry if this sounds like a noob question, but how can a ship be good in small gangs but not large ones?
In large gangs the target will die before you can take advantage of your high dps weapons of drones or blasters.
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Ka Jolo
The Tuskers
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Posted - 2010.11.09 00:22:00 -
[9]
Originally by: McDeth Sorry if this sounds like a noob question, but how can a ship be good in small gangs but not large ones?
There are several ways.
The effects of force multipliers are lessened in larger fleets. While a Falcon does a great job of shutting down an enemy gang of 3-4 ships, for example, imagine 10 Falcons trying to coordinate to shut down a enemy fleet of 50-60 ships; chances are, enough DPS ships will slip through the cracks to start taking out the Falcons.
A ship that relies on, for example, dual reps to live long enough against 2-3 other ships, may find itself one-volleyed when primaried by 20 other ships.
Weapons systems such as drones and missiles are fine for killing opponents close enough to get tackles, but it takes them a long time to apply DPS when the enemy is sniping from over 100km away.
It is a simple matter for a lone interceptor to speed-tank a single battleship; but in a 50-on-50 battle, there's bound to be multiple ships that can track and kill the interceptor orbiting one of their own.
I'll bet there are even more ways in which the differences between small-gang and large-fleet PVP can make an awesome ship worth less.
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McDeth
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Posted - 2010.11.09 05:31:00 -
[10]
That's just prime.
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Space Pinata
Amarr Discount Napkin Industries
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Posted - 2010.11.09 05:55:00 -
[11]
Originally by: McDeth Sorry if this sounds like a noob question, but how can a ship be good in small gangs but not large ones?
Very simply. The Myrm has a lot of factors that make it ideal for small gangs.
Five midslots means you can have a lot of tackle. Point Scram Web? You bet. Or, a sensor boosters and two tackle. Or lots of ewar. Whatever you want, really. In larger gangs this is less important as you have dedicated ships for all of this.
Active rep bonus: A good myrm can easily negate 500 dps of your enemies. How much DPS are you taking? If you're taking anywhere from 0-750 the Myrm will last an eternity.
It evens out with a buffer armor tank at about 1000~ dps taken. That is to say, how long you survive is the same. So against 1-3 enemy ships (depending on class) the myrm can either survive for a very long time, or indeed nullify incoming damage. It wont die to slow constant damage over time. A drake is harmless to you.
..But with lots of DPS, you dont have time to rep, and the bonus is wasted.
Your weapons: Blasters or Autocannons. Close range, and the Myrm is slow. Ogres are slow and are the bulk of your drone dps. (2 ogre / 2 hammer / 1 hob).
So it takes a while to get into damage range. tl;dr? Big gangs favor ships without a lot of versatility, but with the ability to deal damage instantly from rangen. Small gangs favor versatility and staying power; more max DPS potential, less "convenient dps potential".
------
The brutix: Not a bad ship. Better than the Deimos. The only real strike against it is that the Megathron basically does everything a brutix can, but better. The mobility doesnt matter much when you have to burn into 2km range. |
McDeth
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Posted - 2010.11.09 18:49:00 -
[12]
Edited by: McDeth on 09/11/2010 18:49:04 Sounds like a pretty cool ship
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Tusen Takk
Guy Fawkes Trust Fund 31ST Reliables Division
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Posted - 2010.11.09 18:51:00 -
[13]
the brutix is great until you get blasted into tiny tiny pieces
myrm has more tank but less gank and is also dronier/sexier
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Ti'jitsu
Gallente Spais Of The Federation
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Posted - 2010.11.10 02:49:00 -
[14]
Lets face it the Myrm just looks sexier too. And who wants to fly an ugly ship..
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Bluejacket CT
Percussive Diplomacy
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Posted - 2010.11.10 06:19:00 -
[15]
[Brutix, PvP] Tracking Enhancer II Magnetic Field Stabilizer II Magnetic Field Stabilizer II Magnetic Field Stabilizer II Damage Control II
Large Shield Extender II Stasis Webifier II Warp Scrambler II 10MN MicroWarpdrive II
Heavy Ion Blaster II, Caldari Navy Antimatter Charge M Heavy Ion Blaster II, Caldari Navy Antimatter Charge M Heavy Ion Blaster II, Caldari Navy Antimatter Charge M Heavy Ion Blaster II, Caldari Navy Antimatter Charge M Heavy Ion Blaster II, Caldari Navy Antimatter Charge M Heavy Ion Blaster II, Caldari Navy Antimatter Charge M Heavy Ion Blaster II, Caldari Navy Antimatter Charge M
Medium Anti-EM Screen Reinforcer I Medium Anti-Thermal Screen Reinforcer I Medium Core Defence Field Extender I
Hammerhead II x5
+1 FOR BOOM HEADSHOT ~
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Noskill McCheese
Minmatar
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Posted - 2010.11.11 01:07:00 -
[16]
Hrrrr don't fly the brutix myself but fiddling with EFT I think it'll be something to try out.
[Brutix, amidoinitrite] Magnetic Field Stabilizer II Magnetic Field Stabilizer II Magnetic Field Stabilizer II Damage Control II Reactor Control Unit II
Y-T8 Overcharged Hydrocarbon I Microwarpdrive Warp Scrambler II Invulnerability Field II Large Shield Extender II
Heavy Neutron Blaster II, Federation Navy Antimatter Charge M Heavy Neutron Blaster II, Federation Navy Antimatter Charge M Heavy Neutron Blaster II, Federation Navy Antimatter Charge M Heavy Neutron Blaster II, Federation Navy Antimatter Charge M Heavy Neutron Blaster II, Federation Navy Antimatter Charge M Heavy Neutron Blaster II, Federation Navy Antimatter Charge M Heavy Neutron Blaster II, Federation Navy Antimatter Charge M
Medium Anti-EM Screen Reinforcer I Medium Core Defence Field Extender I Medium Core Defence Field Extender I
Warrior II x5 Hornet EC-300 x5
Some stats: 660/759 turret dps with blaster spec 4 51.5k EHP (not glass) 5.4km effective range :P 1578 m/s overloaded mwd
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Malkon Gevitz
Minmatar
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Posted - 2010.11.11 08:01:00 -
[17]
Edited by: Malkon Gevitz on 11/11/2010 08:02:38 I've seen fmercury doing some serious damage/tanking in a myrm and brutix with dual rep. in one of his videos. Does that fit totally depend on the boosters or crazy implants?
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Annie Anomie
Shadows Of The Federation
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Posted - 2010.11.11 23:41:00 -
[18]
Edited by: Annie Anomie on 11/11/2010 23:43:25 The Myrm is a better all round hull.
It has several viable fits. You can make use of the rep bonus without totally gimping your DPS (active tanking armour tanking gunboats have this problem). You can shield gank fit it and it has more mids. You can cross-dress the guns. You can triple rep it or passive shield tank it. You can fit a neut in a high (big issue for solo pew pew) without it being fail.
This is a big theme with gallente hulls tbh. The drone hull tends to be the popular one. The blaster hull tends to be one that "works in gangs". Blasters just ain't that great a weapon due to their range (less of an issue solo because you pretty much need to have them well enough tackled for blasters to keep them there to kill them). Nowadays you have issues with smaller ships too as a frigate can happily get under your tracking point blank. Not so much with a neut and warrior IIs on him.
The Brutix isn't much cop for bigger gangs either unless you rail fit it. I suppose in that regard it's better than the Myrm.
The Brutix can get more paper DPS than the Myrm (but it's hard to apply) and isn't reliant on poppable, sentrygun vulnerable drones for DPS which may be a big issue if you're pirating.
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Nursultan
Pyrotechnics Inc.
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Posted - 2010.11.12 09:42:00 -
[19]
Edited by: Nursultan on 12/11/2010 09:43:26
Originally by: Noskill McCheese Hrrrr don't fly the brutix myself but fiddling with EFT I think it'll be something to try out.
[Brutix, amidoinitrite] Magnetic Field Stabilizer II Magnetic Field Stabilizer II Magnetic Field Stabilizer II Damage Control II Reactor Control Unit II
Y-T8 Overcharged Hydrocarbon I Microwarpdrive Warp Scrambler II Invulnerability Field II Large Shield Extender II
Heavy Neutron Blaster II, Federation Navy Antimatter Charge M Heavy Neutron Blaster II, Federation Navy Antimatter Charge M Heavy Neutron Blaster II, Federation Navy Antimatter Charge M Heavy Neutron Blaster II, Federation Navy Antimatter Charge M Heavy Neutron Blaster II, Federation Navy Antimatter Charge M Heavy Neutron Blaster II, Federation Navy Antimatter Charge M Heavy Neutron Blaster II, Federation Navy Antimatter Charge M
Medium Anti-EM Screen Reinforcer I Medium Core Defence Field Extender I Medium Core Defence Field Extender I
Warrior II x5 Hornet EC-300 x5
Some stats: 660/759 turret dps with blaster spec 4 51.5k EHP (not glass) 5.4km effective range :P 1578 m/s overloaded mwd
I'd go with
[Brutix, shield gank] Magnetic Field Stabilizer II Magnetic Field Stabilizer II Magnetic Field Stabilizer II Magnetic Field Stabilizer II Damage Control II
Y-T8 Overcharged Hydrocarbon I Microwarpdrive Large Shield Extender II Large Shield Extender II Warp Scrambler II
Heavy Neutron Blaster II, Caldari Navy Antimatter Charge M Heavy Neutron Blaster II, Caldari Navy Antimatter Charge M Heavy Neutron Blaster II, Caldari Navy Antimatter Charge M Heavy Neutron Blaster II, Caldari Navy Antimatter Charge M Heavy Neutron Blaster II, Caldari Navy Antimatter Charge M Heavy Neutron Blaster II, Caldari Navy Antimatter Charge M Heavy Neutron Blaster II, Caldari Navy Antimatter Charge M
Medium Ancillary Current Router I Medium Ancillary Current Router I Medium Core Defence Field Extender I
Hammerhead II x5
730/839 turret dps with blaster spec 4 45.5k EHP -----
Nursultan's Pirate Blag |
Aerilis
Gallente Percussive Diplomacy
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Posted - 2010.11.12 12:02:00 -
[20]
Squeezing neutrons onto a Brutix will actually decrease your DPS in most cases.
Use Ions, 3x MFS, 1x TE. You'll track a hell of a lot better, which is very important when you're in blaster range. It'll allow you to fit a full shield tank too. |
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Nursultan
Pyrotechnics Inc.
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Posted - 2010.11.12 12:25:00 -
[21]
Originally by: Aerilis Squeezing neutrons onto a Brutix will actually decrease your DPS in most cases.
Use Ions, 3x MFS, 1x TE. You'll track a hell of a lot better, which is very important when you're in blaster range. It'll allow you to fit a full shield tank too.
I agree, it's situational, was thinking about cases where target's mobility isn't an issue. -----
Nursultan's Pirate Blag |
TaluxA
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Posted - 2010.11.12 14:11:00 -
[22]
I think the myrm does the shield gank job a little better overall with the ability to fit 3 damage mods and 2 tracking enhancers along with either a better tank or a utility midslot. Only has about 100dps less than the brutix I think but the range and tracking are better too.
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Bluejacket CT
Percussive Diplomacy
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Posted - 2010.11.13 10:31:00 -
[23]
Originally by: TaluxA I think the myrm does the shield gank job a little better overall with the ability to fit 3 damage mods and 2 tracking enhancers along with either a better tank or a utility midslot. Only has about 100dps less than the brutix I think but the range and tracking are better too.
Yes but it doesn't have the style that brutix has. ~
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Mutnin
Amarr Mutineers
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Posted - 2010.11.13 11:54:00 -
[24]
Originally by: Aerilis Squeezing neutrons onto a Brutix will actually decrease your DPS in most cases.
Use Ions, 3x MFS, 1x TE. You'll track a hell of a lot better, which is very important when you're in blaster range. It'll allow you to fit a full shield tank too.
This is one of the flaws of Blasters IMHO.. The fact that you really can't even use the largest cruiser gun on any ship in a meaningful way. On the other hand you can fit HAL's on Drakes, you can fit 425's on Canes and Heavy Pulse's on Harbi all of which can also have a reliable ship fit with a reasonable tank.. Then you have Heavy Neutrons that are pretty much useless on any decent fit.
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Alara IonStorm
Agent-Orange Nabaal Syndicate
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Posted - 2010.11.13 13:21:00 -
[25]
Edited by: Alara IonStorm on 13/11/2010 13:22:45
Originally by: Mutnin This is one of the flaws of Blasters IMHO.. The fact that you really can't even use the largest cruiser gun on any ship in a meaningful way. On the other hand you can fit HAL's on Drakes, you can fit 425's on Canes and Heavy Pulse's on Harbi all of which can also have a reliable ship fit with a reasonable tank.. Then you have Heavy Neutrons that are pretty much useless on any decent fit.
Well I agree about the Drake and the Cane, a Heavy Pulse Armor Harb, the Sheild fit is near the same as the Brutix.
There is also the point that you are comparing the Blaster Boat to the Teir 2 model ships. The Myrmidon gets Drones as it's main weapon and that works out rather well.
That said with all the common Armor fits being only able to fit Electrons instead of even Ions for Cruisers and Battlecruisers is pretty bad. It also doesn't help that the Brutix does have the slot layout to support it's tank bonus.
If only they moved a High slot to a Low slot and gave it a small grid boost it would be a much better ship. and it could actually Active Tank effectively.
Modified Brutix with -1 High +1 Low and a bit more Grid.
6 Ion Blasters
1 Med Cap Boost 1 MWD 1 Stasis Web 1 Warp Dis/Scram
2 Medium Reps 1 EANM 1 DCU II 2 Mag Stabs
1 Nanobot Accels 1 Nanobot Pump
Oh well
-- I am now on a Crusade to Fix the Omen!
For Great Justice!
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