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Natsett Amuinn
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
206
   |
Posted - 2012.08.09 02:29:00 -
[121] - Quote
MIrple wrote:Frying Doom wrote:MIrple wrote:I know I am going to get flamed for this but if the hulk got a role bonus of 5% better gank lin bonuses it would make it stan out more. So at max skills you wouldnt get 42.75% bouses from a rorq it would be 44.9% that would make it stand out more as a fleet ship. And make it hideously unbalanced. I dont see how 2% increase when in fleet would make it hideously unbalanced? It was an idea that is all.
Why does it need to stand out more?
From what I understand, a mack fit for max yeild is still not as good as a hulk that isn't fit.
And i'll be damned if the hulk with the orca backing it up, in the same belt as me this morning, didn't stand out as it ate half the damn belt in the same time it took me to go through like 5 roids.
|
MIrple
BSC LEGION
Tactical Narcotics Team
40
|
Posted - 2012.08.09 02:32:00 -
[122] - Quote
Natsett Amuinn wrote:MIrple wrote:Frying Doom wrote:MIrple wrote:I know I am going to get flamed for this but if the hulk got a role bonus of 5% better gank lin bonuses it would make it stan out more. So at max skills you wouldnt get 42.75% bouses from a rorq it would be 44.9% that would make it stand out more as a fleet ship. And make it hideously unbalanced. I dont see how 2% increase when in fleet would make it hideously unbalanced? It was an idea that is all. Why does it need to stand out more? From what I understand, a mack fit for max yeild is still not as good as a hulk that isn't fit. And i'll be damned if the hulk with the orca backing it up, in the same belt as me this morning, didn't stand out as it ate half the damn belt in the same time it took me to go through like 5 roids.
Ok it was a bad idea then. 2 ships working together mining more then 1 solo player. I would have to say working as intended. |
Pipa Porto
653
|
Posted - 2012.08.09 02:36:00 -
[123] - Quote
MIrple wrote:Ok it was a bad idea then. 2 ships working together mining more then 1 solo player. I would have to say working as intended.
Yep. 2 Mackinaws working together do, in fact, mine more than 1 Hulk. Working as intended.
EvE: Everyone vs Everyone
-RubyPorto |
Natsett Amuinn
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
206
|
Posted - 2012.08.09 03:09:00 -
[124] - Quote
MIrple wrote:Natsett Amuinn wrote:MIrple wrote:Frying Doom wrote:MIrple wrote:I know I am going to get flamed for this but if the hulk got a role bonus of 5% better gank lin bonuses it would make it stan out more. So at max skills you wouldnt get 42.75% bouses from a rorq it would be 44.9% that would make it stand out more as a fleet ship. And make it hideously unbalanced. I dont see how 2% increase when in fleet would make it hideously unbalanced? It was an idea that is all. Why does it need to stand out more? From what I understand, a mack fit for max yeild is still not as good as a hulk that isn't fit. And i'll be damned if the hulk with the orca backing it up, in the same belt as me this morning, didn't stand out as it ate half the damn belt in the same time it took me to go through like 5 roids. Ok it was a bad idea then. 2 ships working together mining more then 1 solo player. I would have to say working as intended.
If that's how you choose to look at things objectively, sure. Kind of a childish way of going about it, but ok.
Or we could say that one hulk mines more then one of ANYTHING even when anything is fitted to mine as much as it can.
Or we can ignore that in favor of the childish objectivety. |
Wrayeth
Inexorable Retribution
31
|
Posted - 2012.08.09 04:00:00 -
[125] - Quote
I'm just happy with my alt's 75k EHP skiff. It allows me to make some ISK (or get minerals to build with) while doing things around the house like cleaning. |
Incindir Mauser
EVE University
Ivy League
14
|
Posted - 2012.08.09 04:13:00 -
[126] - Quote
Natsett Amuinn wrote:Martineski wrote:thanks but i am not a moron, it is only marginally better than the mackinaw. and make note they took the hulks defenses, and its cargo but gave nothing back. and i am not asking for UBER mining bonuses, just make it the MOST efficient like they claim. the point i am trying to make is that the hulk got absolutely 0 bonuses in this patch. oh wait it got a whole 1% bonus to ice harvesting, big deal. but better mining bonuses on the hulk would be better. as i state before, not to make it OP, but make it REALLY stand out as a fleet miner.
this patch could have gone better if it were more of a give/take patch, but over all for the hulk it was only a TAKE patch. also remember this patch was supposed to make mining more efficient as a whole, but the only ships that got MORE efficient were the lower tier ships, the hulk is exactly the same. better mining bonuses is not too much to ask. May want to rethink your first sentence. They didn't take any of the defense away fromt he hulk, they actually gave you more because you don't have to worry about loading up with cargo expanders and cargo rigs. Now you can use those slots for real useful stuff like MLU's, damage controls, and rigs that increase defense or improve ice mining. Don't worry though. Everyone else will use their brains and then tell you how to fit your ship for you.
Don't engage in a battle of wits with the unarmed.
They'll drag you down to their level and beat you with experience. |
Gorinia Sanford
Sons of Russ
51
|
Posted - 2012.08.09 04:15:00 -
[127] - Quote
Hiyora Akachi wrote:I logged in today at around 8am Central. Switched to the Help channel and -DROWNED- in the miner tears.
Apparently, making anything besides the Hulk a viable miner is like punching a baby repeatedly.
Eh, I logged on today and check out the changes to my ships. Currently, I have 2 Retrievers, 1 Mackinaw, 1 Covetor and 2 Hulks. Right now, I'm checking out (and enjoy immensly) the changes to the Mack. At some point, I'm going to throw on a pair of strip miners and see how she does mining normal ore.
Tears? Not from this miner. So far, I'm loving the changes to the barges. Well, as far as the Mack goes. I'll to put the other ships through their paces to see how they work now.
And if any miners are crying, I'll just quote from a great movie "Improvise, adapt, overcome".
That is all. |
Tanlinara
LightBender Mining and Research Corp
4
|
Posted - 2012.08.09 04:21:00 -
[128] - Quote
Procurer had 20k ehp before i even put anything on it :-)
Was a bit of a tight fit it could use a bit more power grid for those of us with less than full skills but i managed to get 48k ehp out of it.
Capacitor is good even with dcu and invuls and strip miner running it never went below 1/4 used.
Im really liking it much better than a frigate :-)
Doesnt work well on small asteroids though , the rocks dont hold enough for even one cycle. |
Gorinia Sanford
Sons of Russ
51
|
Posted - 2012.08.09 04:25:00 -
[129] - Quote
Tippia wrote:Lilianna Star wrote:I thought miners got a significant upgrade in the patch. They did. Nothing makes them more upset. 
Bleh. Speak for yourself. Only thing I miss is the 2 ice units per cycle per harvester that Mackinaws used to enjoy. Eh, but the reduction in cycle time more than makes up for it.  |
Natsett Amuinn
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
206
|
Posted - 2012.08.09 04:30:00 -
[130] - Quote
Incindir Mauser wrote:Natsett Amuinn wrote:Martineski wrote:thanks but i am not a moron, it is only marginally better than the mackinaw. and make note they took the hulks defenses, and its cargo but gave nothing back. and i am not asking for UBER mining bonuses, just make it the MOST efficient like they claim. the point i am trying to make is that the hulk got absolutely 0 bonuses in this patch. oh wait it got a whole 1% bonus to ice harvesting, big deal. but better mining bonuses on the hulk would be better. as i state before, not to make it OP, but make it REALLY stand out as a fleet miner.
this patch could have gone better if it were more of a give/take patch, but over all for the hulk it was only a TAKE patch. also remember this patch was supposed to make mining more efficient as a whole, but the only ships that got MORE efficient were the lower tier ships, the hulk is exactly the same. better mining bonuses is not too much to ask. May want to rethink your first sentence. They didn't take any of the defense away fromt he hulk, they actually gave you more because you don't have to worry about loading up with cargo expanders and cargo rigs. Now you can use those slots for real useful stuff like MLU's, damage controls, and rigs that increase defense or improve ice mining. Don't worry though. Everyone else will use their brains and then tell you how to fit your ship for you. Don't engage in a battle of wits with the unarmed. They'll drag you down to their level and beat you with experience.
Not really sure who you're claiming would be beat, but wit is a sign of intelligence.
I have a hard time believing anyone who isn't smart enough to figure out how to use a shift key is going to win in a battle of wits. I am, just not that stupid. |
Eugene Kerner
TunDraGon
82
|
Posted - 2012.08.09 04:44:00 -
[131] - Quote
Miners got the single most boost for their kind in history to mine relativly save in High sec...first they do is set out to low sec in hordes....to die in a fire... |
Alavaria Fera
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
1259
|
Posted - 2012.08.09 04:50:00 -
[132] - Quote
Eugene Kerner wrote:Miners got the single most boost for their kind in history to mine relativly save in High sec...first they do is set out to low sec in hordes....to die in a fire...
Yeee hawww~~~
It's camping time !
Those who cannot adapt become victims of Evolugalbugaslugakjlwsdhvbzxd
Click for old school EVE Portraits: http://jadeconstantine.web44.net/Maison.htm |
Nicolo da'Vicenza
Divine Power.
Cascade Imminent
1462
|
Posted - 2012.08.09 05:02:00 -
[133] - Quote
MY SKIFF
NOOOOOOO |
doffmann
astroidbangers
0
|
Posted - 2012.08.09 05:06:00 -
[134] - Quote
Not this trend again gankers winining about the new barges i love you guys miners never bitches as much as these gank bears buuuhuu i cant kill miners anymore with a triel char maybe grow a pair and go into low sec |
Ned Black
Driders
49
|
Posted - 2012.08.09 05:40:00 -
[135] - Quote
Hiyora Akachi wrote:Cycle of this Patch
Miner tears > Ganker Tears > Miner tears
Conclusion: Miners cry about everything.
Considering that the gankers cried twice as hard I would still call it even... |
Katran Luftschreck
Royal Ammatar Engineering Corps
12
|
Posted - 2012.08.09 06:00:00 -
[136] - Quote
Meh, I looked at the changes, put away my Hulk, took one of the old Retrievers out of storage and said "Cool now I can hold three times the rocks in a ship that, while more gankable, would cost less to replace than what I keep stuffed in my sock."
Looks to me like CCP did the right thing. Hulk is still Teh Awesome if you've got a buddy with an Orca and maybe someone to cover your butt. Which means you'll see fewer solo Hulks, and since solo Hulks was the prime target of gankers, this is actually a very good thing. Solo miners can just use Retrievers and Mackinaws instead, which take less time to learn anyway. This bodes nothing but good news for independent & solo miners, as they can hit their own personal "end game" much sooner than before (read: they skip the Hulk training marathon entirely).
Even the Retriever itself is awesome now. Okay it's slightly less room than the Mackinaw, and still has crap for EHP, but so what? At under 20mil each it has the best anti-gank defense system of all: It's not worth ganking. A Retrieve can pay for itself in one pass through a belt.
Only downside I see is that with mining made so much easier now that mineral prices may drop, but then I mostly mine to produce things to sell rather than sell directly, so I'm not terribly concerned. |
Antisocial Malkavian
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
207
|
Posted - 2012.08.09 06:05:00 -
[137] - Quote
Hiyora Akachi wrote:I logged in today at around 8am Central. Switched to the Help channel and -DROWNED- in the miner tears.
Apparently, making anything besides the Hulk a viable miner is like punching a baby repeatedly.
If miners arent crying CP is doin it wrong lol
http://gizmodo.com/5913381/season-your-food-with-salt-from-real-human-tears
you will be harvested |
Hypercake Mix
Magical Rainbow Bakery
8
|
Posted - 2012.08.09 06:35:00 -
[138] - Quote
And with miners flying Retrievers, gankers can browbeat miners into paying them to gank competing miners and their pods!
And their pods.
And their... AFK people don't really warp off... and I'm pretty sure there's plenty of time anyway. |
Eugene Kerner
TunDraGon
82
|
Posted - 2012.08.09 06:39:00 -
[139] - Quote
doffmann wrote:Not this trend again gankers winining about the new barges i love you guys miners never bitches as much as these gank bears buuuhuu i cant kill miners anymore with a triel char maybe grow a pair and go into low sec
http://eve-kill.net/?a=kill_detail&kll_id=14276541
they are quite gankable still....you just need more people and by boosting the exhumers you brought together the most antisocial scum of New Eden ( I <3 You ) to work in a team.
Congratulations on that.
Ganking is far beyond dead...I have a dream...where random people group together on Ts and having a blast planning single kills and succeeding with it... |
Antisocial Malkavian
Aliastra
Gallente Federation
207
|
Posted - 2012.08.09 06:54:00 -
[140] - Quote
Eugene Kerner wrote:doffmann wrote:Not this trend again gankers winining about the new barges i love you guys miners never bitches as much as these gank bears buuuhuu i cant kill miners anymore with a triel char maybe grow a pair and go into low sec http://eve-kill.net/?a=kill_detail&kll_id=14276541they are quite gankable still....you just need more people and by boosting the exhumers you brought together the most antisocial scum of New Eden ( I <3 You ) to work in a team. Congratulations on that. Ganking is far beyond dead...I have a dream...where random people group together on Ts and having a blast planning single kills and succeeding with it...
lol though... Tanking vs suicide ganker has always been a losing proposition. You tank more they bring more friends.
http://gizmodo.com/5913381/season-your-food-with-salt-from-real-human-tears
you will be harvested |
Pipa Porto
653
|
Posted - 2012.08.09 07:07:00 -
[141] - Quote
Eugene Kerner wrote:doffmann wrote:Not this trend again gankers winining about the new barges i love you guys miners never bitches as much as these gank bears buuuhuu i cant kill miners anymore with a triel char maybe grow a pair and go into low sec http://eve-kill.net/?a=kill_detail&kll_id=14276541they are quite gankable still....you just need more people and by boosting the exhumers you brought together the most antisocial scum of New Eden ( I <3 You ) to work in a team. Congratulations on that. Ganking is far beyond dead...I have a dream...where random people group together on Ts and having a blast planning single kills and succeeding with it...
That's not at all a well tanked fit. There's a Yield mod in the mids and an Empty Midslot. Nor was it well flown (he was using the same fit a week and a half ago in the same system when the same people ganked him).
Anyway, the way to tank ganks now is to use a Skiff (or Mack, while it still has it's great tank [the 3rd Low is for a DCII)).
The others presume your method of survival is more active, so you don't need a brick tank.
Ships aren't balanced based on the worst fits you can slap on them.
EvE: Everyone vs Everyone
-RubyPorto |
Jorma Morkkis
State War Academy
Caldari State
137
|
Posted - 2012.08.09 07:21:00 -
[142] - Quote
Pipa Porto wrote:Ships aren't balanced based on the worst fits you can slap on them.
No, ships are balanced around ganking. If it can't be ganked profitably it's not balanced. |
pussnheels
511
|
Posted - 2012.08.09 07:33:00 -
[143] - Quote
Hiyora Akachi wrote:I logged in today at around 8am Central. Switched to the Help channel and -DROWNED- in the miner tears. Apparently, making anything besides the Hulk a viable miner is like punching a baby repeatedly.
I think you are in denial only miners whinning are those that never read the devblogs and the patch notes , sadly too many of them
If there are people acting like crybabies it is those ' elite pvp' who cry just about anything on here
WWHHHAAA my toranado costing me more than 78 mil iskies how cann i gank miners cheap
WWHHAAAA they buffing barges how can i gank a miner now with my 2 mil lolfit destroyer
WWHHAAA the rebalancing gate guns in low sec , sure i never go into low sec because real people shooting at me out there but i need to whine about something right
WWHHAAA i got a sec rating of - 10 and faction navy in high sec is molesting me i demand unrestricted acces to highsec so i can gank in peace and quiet
WWHHAA CCP is allowing people to play how they want to play and not how i wantthem to play how unfair
etcetcetc
makes me wonder who the real crybabies are and who the real carebears are
I do not agree with what you are saying , but i will defend to the death your right to say it...... Voltaire |
Eugene Kerner
TunDraGon
82
|
Posted - 2012.08.09 07:34:00 -
[144] - Quote
Pipa Porto wrote:Eugene Kerner wrote:doffmann wrote:Not this trend again gankers winining about the new barges i love you guys miners never bitches as much as these gank bears buuuhuu i cant kill miners anymore with a triel char maybe grow a pair and go into low sec http://eve-kill.net/?a=kill_detail&kll_id=14276541they are quite gankable still....you just need more people and by boosting the exhumers you brought together the most antisocial scum of New Eden ( I <3 You ) to work in a team. Congratulations on that. Ganking is far beyond dead...I have a dream...where random people group together on Ts and having a blast planning single kills and succeeding with it... That's not at all a well tanked fit. There's a Yield mod in the mids and an Empty Midslot. Nor was it well flown (he was using the same fit a week and a half ago in the same system when the same people ganked him). Anyway, the way to tank ganks now is to use a Skiff (or Mack, while it still has it's great tank [the 3rd Low is for a DCII)). The others presume your method of survival is more active, so you don't need a brick tank. Ships aren't balanced based on the worst fits you can slap on them.
http://eve-kill.net/?a=kill_detail&kll_id=14276676
Another one...semi tanked but less effort to kill it. |
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
8960
|
Posted - 2012.08.09 07:39:00 -
[145] - Quote
Pipa Porto wrote:Anyway, the way to tank ganks now is to use a Skiff (or Mack, while it still has it's great tank [the 3rd Low is for a DCII)). Sir, I must point out the fallacy in your thinking and correct your blasphemous ways.
The third lowslot is obviously for more MLUs. 
GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥
CONCORD spawns: quick enough to save you?
|
Dave stark
Black Nova Corp.
412
|
Posted - 2012.08.09 07:40:00 -
[146] - Quote
Tippia wrote:Pipa Porto wrote:Anyway, the way to tank ganks now is to use a Skiff (or Mack, while it still has it's great tank [the 3rd Low is for a DCII)). Sir, I must point out the fallacy in your thinking and correct your blasphemous ways. The third lowslot is obviously for more MLUs.
of course it is, else you may as well use a skiff with 2x mlus and still have more tank.
Reading my posts is like panning for gold; most it will be useless, but occasionally you'll find a nugget of gold. |
Illest Insurrectionist
Federal Navy Academy
Gallente Federation
6
|
Posted - 2012.08.09 07:43:00 -
[147] - Quote
Eugene Kerner wrote:Pipa Porto wrote:Eugene Kerner wrote:doffmann wrote:Not this trend again gankers winining about the new barges i love you guys miners never bitches as much as these gank bears buuuhuu i cant kill miners anymore with a triel char maybe grow a pair and go into low sec http://eve-kill.net/?a=kill_detail&kll_id=14276541they are quite gankable still....you just need more people and by boosting the exhumers you brought together the most antisocial scum of New Eden ( I <3 You ) to work in a team. Congratulations on that. Ganking is far beyond dead...I have a dream...where random people group together on Ts and having a blast planning single kills and succeeding with it... That's not at all a well tanked fit. There's a Yield mod in the mids and an Empty Midslot. Nor was it well flown (he was using the same fit a week and a half ago in the same system when the same people ganked him). Anyway, the way to tank ganks now is to use a Skiff (or Mack, while it still has it's great tank [the 3rd Low is for a DCII)). The others presume your method of survival is more active, so you don't need a brick tank. Ships aren't balanced based on the worst fits you can slap on them. http://eve-kill.net/?a=kill_detail&kll_id=14276676Another one...semi tanked but less effort to kill it.
Less effort pfff... I put plenty of effort into that :D |
Pipa Porto
653
|
Posted - 2012.08.09 07:44:00 -
[148] - Quote
Jorma Morkkis wrote:Pipa Porto wrote:Ships aren't balanced based on the worst fits you can slap on them. No, ships are balanced around ganking. If it can't be ganked profitably it's not balanced.
Quote and Link where I said all ships must be profitable to gank.
Or Stop Lying.
Seriously, straw man arguments are better if they're not entirely transparent.
In the meantime, the Barges should be balanced with an eye towards how risky they are to fly vs what reward they bring.
The Hulk brings in high rewards with high effort, and should be high risk.
The Mack brings in medium rewards with low effort, so probably should also be high risk (the low effort is worth a fair bit).
The Skiff brings in low rewards with low effort, so probably should be low risk (and what a tank it can fit. 88k Omni with 73.1k vs PP, with 2 MLUIIs)
[Skiff, Tanking Skiff] Please note, I spent about a minute on this fit. I'm sure it can be improved.
Mining Laser Upgrade II
Mining Laser Upgrade II
Medium Shield Extender II
Medium F-S9 Regolith Shield Induction
Adaptive Invulnerability Field II
Adaptive Invulnerability Field II
Limited 'Anointed' EM Ward Field
Modulated Deep Core Strip Miner II, Mercoxit Mining Crystal II
Medium Core Defense Field Extender I
Medium Core Defense Field Extender I
Hobgoblin II x3
EvE: Everyone vs Everyone
-RubyPorto |
Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
8960
|
Posted - 2012.08.09 07:45:00 -
[149] - Quote
Dave stark wrote:of course it is, else you may as well use a skiff with 2x mlus and still have more tank. GǪand get less ore as a result.
GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥
CONCORD spawns: quick enough to save you?
|
Pipa Porto
653
|
Posted - 2012.08.09 07:46:00 -
[150] - Quote
Dave stark wrote:Tippia wrote:Pipa Porto wrote:Anyway, the way to tank ganks now is to use a Skiff (or Mack, while it still has it's great tank [the 3rd Low is for a DCII)). Sir, I must point out the fallacy in your thinking and correct your blasphemous ways. The third lowslot is obviously for more MLUs. of course it is, else you may as well use a skiff with 2x mlus and still have more tank.
But less cargo. Costs and Benefits.
EvE: Everyone vs Everyone
-RubyPorto |
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