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Havegooda
Quantum Cats Syndicate
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Posted - 2010.12.02 01:35:00 -
[31]
Originally by: Damar Rocarion
Originally by: Korg Leaf Caracal
Caracal is actually pretty awesome ship, I feel the need to say it (1000+ kills with it). Hookbill is also my favourite frigate but i'm sort of looking forward seeing how well good ol' kessie will fare, especially in FW if newer characters start to fly it as it offers pretty nice bang for buck regarding isk/sp requirements.
Also, CCP should fix t2 missiles and rockets. Why should javelin rockets give velocity penalty when javelin ammo does not give it?
D.R
You have no idea how hard this is for me to say, but Damar is right. The AML Caracal is pretty pwn for FW and lowsec. Believe me, I've been on the receiving side of his missiles more than I'd like to remember.
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ImmutableDark
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Posted - 2010.12.02 02:53:00 -
[32]
Originally by: Fastbikkel I can understand the frustration, but calling CCP losers without hearing their view on this is unfair. I would love to see the maller getting a damage bonus, but that doesnt make me hate CCP. Overall they do a great job i think, looking at how complex it all is.
From my understanding of CCP's view on Caldari PvP they wont make the Caldari good at pvp because players will whinge about how the caldari are both good at pvp and pve. I can PARTIALLY understand this but pve sucks and the Caldari are supposed to be good at fleet pvp and ... they aren't.
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ImmutableDark
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Posted - 2010.12.02 03:21:00 -
[33]
Originally by: Gypsio III Well, the PG on a HM Caracal is a bit of a pain, but it still works okay. At the range that it's supposed to operate it's mainly range-tanking anyway. As it is, you can get a MWD and LSE on with a RCU II, it's not intolerable, especially considering the limitations of its tier counterparts. Something like this is a well-rounded gang DPS- & ewar-support and ECM-suppression platform:
[Caracal, HML] Reactor Control Unit II Ballistic Control System II
Y-T8 MicroWarpdrive I Jobby Large F-S9 Regolith Shield Induction Sensor Booster II, Targeting Range Balmer Series Tracking Disruptor I, Optimal Range Disruption Balmer Series Tracking Disruptor I, Optimal Range Disruption
Heavy Missile Launcher II, Caldari Navy Scourge Heavy Missile Heavy Missile Launcher II, Caldari Navy Scourge Heavy Missile Heavy Missile Launcher II, Caldari Navy Scourge Heavy Missile Heavy Missile Launcher II, Caldari Navy Scourge Heavy Missile Heavy Missile Launcher II, Caldari Navy Scourge Heavy Missile
Medium Bay Loading Accelerator I Medium Anti-EM Screen Reinforcer I Medium Anti-Thermal Screen Reinforcer I
Warrior II x2
273 DPS (301 DPS with Fury) to 110 km on an agile and reasonably fast ship. The LSE is odd though, you get almost as much EHP using a DC, which then frees up the other lowslot for a BCS:
[Caracal, HML] Damage Control II Ballistic Control System II
Y-T8 MicroWarpdrive I Jobby Phased Weapon Navigation Array Generation Extron Sensor Booster II, Targeting Range Balmer Series Tracking Disruptor I, Optimal Range Disruption Balmer Series Tracking Disruptor I, Optimal Range Disruption
Heavy Missile Launcher II, Scourge Fury Heavy Missile Heavy Missile Launcher II, Scourge Fury Heavy Missile Heavy Missile Launcher II, Scourge Fury Heavy Missile Heavy Missile Launcher II, Scourge Fury Heavy Missile Heavy Missile Launcher II, Scourge Fury Heavy Missile
Medium Bay Loading Accelerator I Medium Warhead Rigor Catalyst I Medium Core Defence Field Extender I
Warrior II x2
As for the rocket Kestrel, yeah, you either have to choose between a full-tackle hull/armour-tanked MAX GANK ship, or a webless MSE buffer fit with Flare rigs. The 218 DPS overloaded at 8 km of the max gank version is kinda impressive though, although that's with Rage and obviously you won't get that against an ABing target.
Thank you I don't know what your point is but these are the kind of posts I like to see in actual discussions. I.e. analysis of fits and stats etc.
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Barrak
Caldari Agony Unleashed Agony Empire
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Posted - 2010.12.02 08:24:00 -
[34]
Originally by: NoLimit Soldier Edited by: NoLimit Soldier on 01/12/2010 15:05:58 Edited by: NoLimit Soldier on 01/12/2010 15:04:59 The caracal is broken by a LONG shot.
To the person who claims 1000+ kills in one I am assuming these were either fleet kills or frigate kills.
A single caracal, on a gate, can not catch a single thing and kill it besides industrials. It goes toe to toe with other ships in its class (vexor/rupture) it gets face stomped. It ISN'T the best anti-frigate platform. A neut vexor is insanely more anti-frigate. It is given this title because it is the only use anyone has ever found for it.
What is needed to compete: Agility. Make it like the caracal navy. Don't need tank if you can keep your distance. or More Midslots (Going E-war style) or More Lows (Could fit fitting mods) or A utility slot so it can fit a neut. (So it could be a REAL anti-frig platform)
Shame as the caracal is one of the coolest looking ships in eve. And I kinda understand what CCP wanted with most caldari ships. A fleet of guerrilla HML caracals would be cheap and damn scary but it is just to easy to make money in eve and people would rather fly more expensive things that are more effective.
As for the kestrel, its great for what it is. It was never meant to be a rifter killer. Nothing will ever compete with the rifter frigate wise. Although I do wish they balanced the ships in a C>G>M>A>C type thing where one faction(C) ****s another(G) one on one but is generally ****d by another(A) itself. Then no more of these mass one type of fleets.
Sorry its early, getting side tracked. The kestrel will always just be "ok" unless they made it fast/agile. Then everyone would just use SML kestrels and range kite.
I hear what you are saying, but not every ship is designed to be flown solo. The Caracal, with scram support, is an outstanding missile sniper. If you dont have scram support, its not!
Barrak
Talent does not count, its what you do with it that does |
Damar Rocarion
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Posted - 2010.12.02 11:20:00 -
[35]
Originally by: NoLimit Soldier To the person who claims 1000+ kills in one I am assuming these were either fleet kills or frigate kills.
Current statistics show 818 kills with regular caracal, 453 with navy issue.
Most of the kills are, if I can quess, against frigates or destroyers (or gangs of them). This is mainly because caracal requires certain finesse in keeping range and softening the enemy before going for tackle since last place you want to be is at optimal range of rupture/rax. I've soloed enough cruisers with caracal though, including the "better cruisers" from Gallente/Matar lineup.
D.R
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NoLimit Soldier
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Posted - 2010.12.02 14:14:00 -
[36]
Quote: I've soloed enough cruisers with caracal though, including the "better cruisers" from Gallente/Matar lineup
Can you link the killmails? I went a few pages back on battleclinic and couldn't find any.
You are a much more experienced PVPer than I though, I wish I could find fights that often. Most are low sec small gang, I must be in the wrong area.
Killmails on your board that suggest otherwise though: http://eve.battleclinic.com/killboard/killmail.php?id=10897312 http://eve.battleclinic.com/killboard/killmail.php?id=10498443 http://eve.battleclinic.com/killboard/killmail.php?id=10449146
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Damar Rocarion
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Posted - 2010.12.02 14:40:00 -
[37]
Originally by: NoLimit Soldier
Can you link the killmails? I went a few pages back on battleclinic and couldn't find any. Killmails on your board that suggest otherwise though:
From 1200 kills...not really. As far as those losses go, if ruppie scrams me, of course I get owned, nothing much there. Daredevil was actually a draw though, but I consider losing 12m caracal for 182m faction fitted frigate to be worth it.
D.R
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NoLimit Soldier
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Posted - 2010.12.02 20:27:00 -
[38]
Quote: From 1200 kills...not really. As far as those losses go, if ruppie scrams me, of course I get owned, nothing much there. Daredevil was actually a draw though, but I consider losing 12m caracal for 182m faction fitted frigate to be worth it.
I said what I said with as much sincerity as possible seeing as you have 10x the kills I do I feel like I should shut it.
I just honestly wanted to see a caracal do SOMETHING over 10 points.
The daredevil one is completely understandable by the way, them some mean buggers.
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Damar Rocarion
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Posted - 2010.12.02 22:17:00 -
[39]
Edited by: Damar Rocarion on 02/12/2010 22:20:04
Originally by: NoLimit Soldier I said what I said with as much sincerity as possible seeing as you have 10x the kills I do I feel like I should shut it.
I just honestly wanted to see a caracal do SOMETHING over 10 points.
Sure I can dig something up (quite a few mails were lost when caldari boards switched over) but what is the point in them really? I am sure people will happily analyze and deconstruct the mails and then just announce stuff like "has module x instead of y, cannot be counted as proper fight"
Anyway, here is a recording of how 1 rupture and 3 caracals can do against a bigger gang of raxes and vexors (the caracal on our end was a needless loss though, rupture being somewhat doomed to die due to much worse range it has)
D.R
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Von Kroll
Caldari Kroll's Legion
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Posted - 2010.12.02 22:32:00 -
[40]
Originally by: ImmutableDark
From my understanding of CCP's view on Caldari PvP they wont make the Caldari good at pvp because players will whinge about how the caldari are both good at pvp and pve.
Do you have a source that backs this statement up? Because if you do, I'd love to see it.
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ImmutableDark
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Posted - 2010.12.03 00:06:00 -
[41]
Originally by: Von Kroll
Originally by: ImmutableDark
From my understanding of CCP's view on Caldari PvP they wont make the Caldari good at pvp because players will whinge about how the caldari are both good at pvp and pve.
Do you have a source that backs this statement up? Because if you do, I'd love to see it.
Yes I do but discussion of it here is against the forum rules.
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Von Kroll
Caldari Kroll's Legion
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Posted - 2010.12.03 13:29:00 -
[42]
So, there's been no public statement by CCP that Caldari are supposed to suck at PvP because they have the best PvE ships? That's what I thought.
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hjgjgfgfgsj
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Posted - 2010.12.03 14:09:00 -
[43]
Originally by: Von Kroll So, there's been no public statement by CCP that Caldari are supposed to suck at PvP because they have the best PvE ships? That's what I thought.
This.
But they don't suck at pvp.
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NoLimit Soldier
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Posted - 2010.12.03 14:10:00 -
[44]
I got these just for this thread last night.
http://eve.battleclinic.com/killboard/killmail.php?id=11868636 http://eve.battleclinic.com/killboard/killmail.php?id=11868633
Also there was a merlin I beat but I ran out of ammo with him in half structure...I thought 300 rockets would be enough, it was not.
Kestrels are much better now than they were. It has come down to you overloading your AB and trying to spend as long as you can at more than 7-9km. Once you're caught it is a race of DPS.
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ButtChugger
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Posted - 2010.12.04 07:17:00 -
[45]
Hey bro for sure lyk the kestrul aint no overpowers you seen the dominix?
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Hirana Yoshida
Behavioral Affront
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Posted - 2010.12.06 13:47:00 -
[46]
Originally by: NoLimit Soldier I got these just for this thread last night....
Good stuff, pretty decent fits you were up against as well. Just goes to show that the only way to truly evaluate a ships potential is go out and die/kill in it after all
PS: Hookbill, which is the supercharged Kestrel, is having a field day with the new rocks thanks to its insane amount of midslots .. so many variations flying around.
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Damar Rocarion
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Posted - 2010.12.06 14:32:00 -
[47]
Originally by: Hirana Yoshida PS: Hookbill, which is the supercharged Kestrel, is having a field day with the new rocks thanks to its insane amount of midslots .. so many variations flying around.
Yeah. Utility midslot allows for extra web, td, invul, anything. Soloed two stabbers while back and then had enyo for dessert.
Oh and I also just got rocket spec V too
Damar Rocarion Brigadier General
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X Gallentius
Quantum Cats Syndicate
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Posted - 2010.12.06 16:52:00 -
[48]
Apparently Caldari are the new Minmatar.
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NoLimit Soldier
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Posted - 2010.12.06 20:23:00 -
[49]
Quote: Apparently Caldari are the new Minmatar.
Hardly.
Toe to toe a rifter still will tear apart a kestrel. And its faster to.
Dram or daredevil will kick the crap out of a worm/hookbill.
In both of my killmails had the rifter heated the AB on approach it would have been game over for me. Or just realized I might kite him and back off, I couldn't catch him if I wanted to.
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Ulstan
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Posted - 2010.12.07 00:06:00 -
[50]
Originally by: X Gallentius Apparently Caldari are the new Minmatar.
Whoah, they buffed the kestrel, cormorant, AND moa to be the best solo ships in their class?
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hjgjgfgfgsj
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Posted - 2010.12.07 02:45:00 -
[51]
Originally by: Ulstan
Originally by: X Gallentius Apparently Caldari are the new Minmatar.
Whoah, they buffed the kestrel, cormorant, AND moa to be the best solo ships in their class?
Actually they already were some real good ships. Every one is just too stupid to notice.
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