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Cearain
The IMPERIUM of LaZy NATION
53
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Posted - 2011.09.26 18:44:00 -
[1] - Quote
Disastro wrote:Destiny Corrupted wrote:When two opposing sides are of equal strength, a battle would be too costly, or not yield significant advantages for either. Sometimes, both. The military history of the world, in its entirety, consists of battles fought between the advantaged and the disadvantaged, and the occasional (and surprising) triumph by the latter.
When you said that "PVP in eve is non Existent," did you mean arena PvP? Because if so, I regret to inform you that it never existed in the first place. ^^^ This. Exactly. I get sick and tired of idiots coming on the forums and complaining about getting blobbed. Do you really think that anyone is going to choose to fight at a disadvantage if they do not have to do so? The way PVP happens in EVE Online is not really that different than how militaries all over the world choose to engage enemies in real life....
Thats about as far as I got and had to stop.
Consider World war 2. Did theRussian, English, Americans, Chinese and other allies pile all their military soldiers and material into one large blob and then go as one huge force fighting around the world until the met the big blob that had all the german italian and Japanese soldiers and material?
No in the real wars armies have to be spread out. In real wars there are many battles being fought in the same time periods in different places. In real wars strategic decisions have to be made about who and what to send where. Eve its always the same answer. Get in the blob.
IMO eve should have systems where people are constantly fighting smaller scale battles thoughout the relevant regions. Blobs are fine for null sec. Blob warfare makes the headlines for eve and brings in new players. But low sec and faction war in particular should have mechanics for smaller scale pvp battles.
And no, I'm not talking about arenas. Make faction war occupancy pvp instead of pve https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=53815&#post53815
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Cearain
The IMPERIUM of LaZy NATION
53
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Posted - 2011.09.27 17:20:00 -
[2] - Quote
Regardless of history the EVE game mechanics almost always tend to lead rational people to blob up. CCP should figure out some mechanics where fighting forces need to be deployed trhoughout a region or several regions at the same time. It would offer those who don't care for blob warfare something to do pvp wise. Make faction war occupancy pvp instead of pve https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=53815&#post53815
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Cearain
The IMPERIUM of LaZy NATION
53
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Posted - 2011.09.28 14:02:00 -
[3] - Quote
Taurean Eltanin wrote:I have a confession to make:
My blog (see my signature), which provides details of dozens of solo and small gang fights backed up by API verified killmails is a hoax. Regardless of what you might think, it's all fake.
It must be, after all, because as the OP has correctly pointed out, this kind of pvp does not exist in Eve. It's imaginary, just like elves, and faries, and Eskimos.
I would agree they exist. But they take a really long time to find. Of course, "really long time" is a relative term.
Some people might think its great that they find a decent fight after 3 hours of forming/warping. For me, thats a bit too much boredom for the short thrill. I think ccp should make mechanics where I can get decent solo and small scale pvp fights at the rate of about 4-6 per hour.
Since your plugging your sig, I'll say the proposal in my sig would do it.
Make faction war occupancy pvp instead of pve https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=53815&#post53815
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Cearain
The IMPERIUM of LaZy NATION
55
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Posted - 2011.09.28 18:10:00 -
[4] - Quote
Boston Six wrote:Cearain wrote:Taurean Eltanin wrote:I have a confession to make:
My blog (see my signature), which provides details of dozens of solo and small gang fights backed up by API verified killmails is a hoax. Regardless of what you might think, it's all fake.
It must be, after all, because as the OP has correctly pointed out, this kind of pvp does not exist in Eve. It's imaginary, just like elves, and faries, and Eskimos. I would agree they exist. But they take a really long time to find. Of course, "really long time" is a relative term. Some people might think its great that they find a decent fight after 3 hours of forming/warping. For me, thats a bit too much boredom for the short thrill. I think ccp should make mechanics where I can get decent solo and small scale pvp fights at the rate of about 4-6 per hour. Since your plugging your sig, I'll say the proposal in my sig would do it. Yeah. And make it so I can kill 4-5 MR's an hour too. CCP you need to make it so all I have to do is log in and then spam my skills button over and over to get leet kills and pvps. Maybe hire people to log in when I do and float around in ships so I can target lock POW them, it would be even better if I didn't have to leave a station. Please thanks.
I didn't say kills/hour. I said fights. Why do you act like its impossible that ccp could make a game that had a bit more action than 1 solo/small scale fight every 2-3 hours?
Did you even read the proposal in my sig? Make faction war occupancy pvp instead of pve https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=53815&#post53815
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Cearain
The IMPERIUM of LaZy NATION
55
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Posted - 2011.09.30 15:33:00 -
[5] - Quote
Goose99 wrote:Zoe Alarhun wrote:If you are getting 1 battle every 2-3 hours then you are roaming in a location that's not pvp orientated or populated enough. If you live in the more well travelled routes and systems you can get fights in minutes if that's what you are after. By "fights," he must have meant catching a noob ratter at a belt, as opposed to getting ganked at a gate. 
I meant neither.
Zoe I realize I can engage a battlecruiser in a frigate and get a fight that way within minutes. But I mean a fight of decent quality not just suicide.
Where are you that you are getting decent pvp fights in minutes?
Other than rvb I have never heard anyone even make such a claim. Make faction war occupancy pvp instead of pve https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=53815&#post53815
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Cearain
The IMPERIUM of LaZy NATION
55
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Posted - 2011.10.01 17:33:00 -
[6] - Quote
Mocam wrote:There is plenty small gang PvP going on all the time. http://eve.battleclinic.com/killboard/combat_record.php?type=corp&name=Agony+UnleashedThat's the battlclinic info on one group. Take a good look at it. Go back a few PAGES of kills. You'll find like 3 entries with 11-14 on page 2 and going back to around page 7, you'll find that they jumped into fights with larger groups and what not. That group specializes in small gang PvP but the cool part - they'll TEACH you how to do it successfully. They run classes on the topic. So if you're finding it difficult - check out Agony's class schedule and learn how to find such small-gang fights. IMO that'd beat the hell out of being ticked off that you can't find it successfully. Take a class and learn how from folks that I do see as experts on the topic as well as training how its done.
I think you need to do/know more than just look at a killboard to determine whether there is "plenty" decent gang pvp going on all the time. Killboards don't tell you how long people had to wait to get those kills. They also don't tell you who was in gang when.
IMO there is far from "plenty" decent gang pvp in eve. How many decent fights per hour do you think is plenty? I think 3-5 would be plenty. (but ccp should strive for mechanics that bring even more than that)But that is extremely rare to find in eve outside rvb. Often I will fly around for an hour or 2 and not find anything. Make faction war occupancy pvp instead of pve https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=53815&#post53815
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Cearain
The IMPERIUM of LaZy NATION
55
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Posted - 2011.10.02 17:51:00 -
[7] - Quote
Mocam wrote:Cearain wrote:Mocam wrote:There is plenty small gang PvP going on all the time. http://eve.battleclinic.com/killboard/combat_record.php?type=corp&name=Agony+UnleashedThat's the battlclinic info on one group. Take a good look at it. Go back a few PAGES of kills. You'll find like 3 entries with 11-14 on page 2 and going back to around page 7, you'll find that they jumped into fights with larger groups and what not. That group specializes in small gang PvP but the cool part - they'll TEACH you how to do it successfully. They run classes on the topic. So if you're finding it difficult - check out Agony's class schedule and learn how to find such small-gang fights. IMO that'd beat the hell out of being ticked off that you can't find it successfully. Take a class and learn how from folks that I do see as experts on the topic as well as training how its done. I think you need to do/know more than just look at a killboard to determine whether there is "plenty" decent gang pvp going on all the time. Killboards don't tell you how long people had to wait to get those kills. They also don't tell you who was in gang when. IMO there is far from "plenty" decent gang pvp in eve. How many decent fights per hour do you think is plenty? I think 3-5 would be plenty. (but ccp should strive for mechanics that bring even more than that)But that is extremely rare to find in eve outside rvb. Often I will fly around for an hour or 2 and not find anything. Not to be overly rude about this but... .... If you actually are an ADD "gotta be in a fight every 5 minutes!" type - go find a lobby/arena style game and play that. This game is different and no I really don't see a reason to cater to the "20 min online, where's my PvP!" mindset.
Thanks for all your advice. If I wanted to get eve pvp advice from someone who doesnGÇÖt know about eve pvp I would have asked my wife.
IGÇÖm not looking for an arena or a lobby to fight in. So again thanks for your advice but it doesnGÇÖt apply.
But while you are being so generous with your wisdom let me ask you a question: Why is it that people who donGÇÖt know anything about pvp in eve, feel the need to slobber all over threads regarding pvp?
Make faction war occupancy pvp instead of pve https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=53815&#post53815
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Cearain
The IMPERIUM of LaZy NATION
55
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Posted - 2011.10.02 17:51:00 -
[8] - Quote
Zoe Alarhun wrote:Cearain wrote:Goose99 wrote:Zoe Alarhun wrote:If you are getting 1 battle every 2-3 hours then you are roaming in a location that's not pvp orientated or populated enough. If you live in the more well travelled routes and systems you can get fights in minutes if that's what you are after. By "fights," he must have meant catching a noob ratter at a belt, as opposed to getting ganked at a gate.  I meant neither. Zoe I realize I can engage a battlecruiser in a frigate and get a fight that way within minutes. But I mean a fight of decent quality not just suicide. Where are you that you are getting decent pvp fights in minutes? Other than rvb I have never heard anyone even make such a claim. I base out or Aurohunen (because it's near jita so my hauler doesn't have to go far for replacement ships). Aurohunen, Mara, Rakapas, Oldman star, Tama and it's adjacent systems - I normally fly up that route. I usually find a pew between 1-4 jumps from my starting system. It's very busy stretch so you see haulers coming and going all times of day (if you want to randsom the buggers for isk), auro normally has some clueless people wandering into it from high sec to mine/rat/explore, mara/oldman/tama normally have tons of pirates and the occasional anti pirate there if you are looking for more "even" fights. It really depends on your area. Also there's a bunch of people who mission here - so scanning them down provides some lulz too.
Thanks for the response. I may check that area out. Make faction war occupancy pvp instead of pve https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=53815&#post53815
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Cearain
The IMPERIUM of LaZy NATION
60
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Posted - 2011.10.15 13:20:00 -
[9] - Quote
Of course some people like larger fleets and blob "tactics." But if eve just turned fw,or some other mechanic,into something that created lots of small scale pvp - because forces had to be spread out to accomplish goals - people could still have large fleets and bait and blob ganks.
For those who say there is "penty" of small gang pvp, I want to know how much. How many good fights per hour? And I'm not talking about ganking people as they come through a gate. In my experience your going to get about 1 qualtiy fight per 1.5 hours. Sure sometimes you will have 2 or 3 fights in a half hour. But that is going to be extremely rare. Your going to have maybe 10 stretches where you go 2 hours with no fight in between. (thats not say no kills in that time but no real quality fights)
For some, a quality pvp fight every 1.5 hours may be "plenty." I think its really weak.
Oh and please enough with the claims eve bait and blob "tactics" aree real world combat tactics. Make faction war occupancy pvp instead of pve https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=53815&#post53815
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Cearain
The IMPERIUM of LaZy NATION
61
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Posted - 2011.10.16 01:52:00 -
[10] - Quote
Mara
Deer hunting sounds incredibly boring to me.
I have a sense of how long it takes to find fights because with certain fits I use boosters. They wind down 60 minutes.
I guess from sort of a role play perspective of what eve offers us as immortals you can choose several different things. You can be merchant. You can be a pirate that preys on ships that can't effectively fight back. You can be a politico and go for power in null sec.
But the game sort of fails at what I want. I just want to be a pilot constantly being thrown into combat. I would like to be good at being a combat pilot. I would like the fact am good at being a combat pilot make *some* difference in the outcome of the battles. Eve doesnGÇÖt really offer this.
Taram Caldar wrote:GǪGǪ Win or lose we have a fun time flying together and chatting it up on TS when not in combat. That's the whole point of the game. EVE wasn't designed to be played alone. Get a group of friends or join a corp that seems like a good fit and make some friends and go out and have fun together.
Taram
Yeah IGÇÖm really not looking to eve as a means to meeting new friends. Wife, kids, and other responsibilities makes the possibility of me spending allot of time socializing and maintaining friendships on the internet pretty remote.
I think eve is a sandbox. That is people should be able to do with it what they want. If people donGÇÖt really want to while away the hours GÇ£chatting it upGÇ¥ on ts that shouldnGÇÖt mean eve is not for them. Unless they want to rule out people like me. Again I think itGÇÖs great that some people do make friends on eve. But not everyone looks to a computer game as some sort of new social media time sink.
Yes, of course, group efforts can and should be able to do things people on their own canGÇÖt. But ccp is really starting to get annoying with this cramming GÇ£socializingGÇ¥ down our throats bit. I socialize allot irl, I am not looking to computer spaceship game to do more socializing. If I am going to dedicate more time to socializing itGÇÖs going to be with my family, relatives and friends.
Look at the stupid pay outs for incursions. GÇ£Three of you did the work of seven pilots in clearing out the sansha? Great but we are not going to pay you for the doing the work of 7 people. In fact we are not even going to pay you for the work of 3. Because we think we are your mother and we think you donGÇÖt socialize enough. So you need to start talking with everyone else in eve and not just shoot at ships for a few hours a week. We are going to punish you unless you start taking the time to develop these internet friendships in addition to the time you are actually playing the game." There is no other realistic explanation for why they donGÇÖt give the full pay to the smaller group that accomplishes the same task.
Again thatGÇÖs great that you think eve is all about making friends. But there is no reason it shouldnGÇÖt be an enjoyable game for someone who would rather not sign up for a whole new social media time sink. Really I want to fly internet spaceships, not chat it up. There is no reason eve canGÇÖt offer something for both of us. Make faction war occupancy pvp instead of pve https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=53815&#post53815
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Cearain
The IMPERIUM of LaZy NATION
61
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Posted - 2011.10.17 00:58:00 -
[11] - Quote
Taram Caldar wrote: It is a sandbox but it's also an MMORPG which is, by definition, a game that's meant to be played with other people. Whether you want to make friends in the game or not is up to you and it's entirely ok if you just want to go out and do stuff on your own. The bottom line is that it's STILL a game. And, yes, it's a sandbox in which you can do whatever you like. But at the end of the day it's a game that's designed, from the ground up, to be a team oriented experience. .
You are conflating 2 things. As a mmo that means you are interacting with other players (as opposed to computer scripted npcs). But that does not necessarilly mean you need to work with teams. Its very common for people to confuse these two seperate notions.
Taram Caldar wrote: If you choose not to play it that way that's cool but you shouldn't expect to get quite the same experience as those who are playing it in the way it was actually designed to be played. .
Again don't forget that just becasue it is a mmo that does not mean that it must be a team only game or even designed to be a team game at all.
Taram Caldar wrote: I'm not saying you should consider it a social medium or that it's even required to have fun. But if you just want to solo and such you shouldn't be surprised when things get boring from time to time in a game that's entirely designed and built around the idea of player interactions. .
Again same as above. Of course, all pvpers interact with players. So do people who sell stuff on the market. The problem I get is when the game starts to demand that I spend the time required to keep up friendships over the internet. Its not that I wouldn't like to do that. Its just that is not really feasible.
Taram Caldar wrote:
Honestly it sounds like you want arena-style combat and EVE just isn't a place where you're going to get that outside of planned tourney type events or pre arranged fights with another player or group of players. As for PVE? I don't see how you can say incursions don't reward you for doing the same work with fewer people. The fewer folks in the group the more isk you get since the payout is static and the payout is split equally amongst the pilots present. They do limit max payment for player, however, but that is basically to prevent people from being able to farm far too much isk from them. Frankly incursions already pay more than they should.
No I dont' want arenas. I am looking for ccp to implement some mechanics that yield frequent, quality, small scale pvp. There are many ways to do this without resorting to arenas. It really just takes a bit of thought and some effort. Just require people to be in more than one place at the same time and you have split up blobs. My signature offers one way it could be done.
On incursions, actually, I think they said they structured payouts to force people to team up. I'm not in favor of these sorts of artificial mechanisms. Make faction war occupancy pvp instead of pve https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=53815&#post53815
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Cearain
The IMPERIUM of LaZy NATION
61
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Posted - 2011.10.17 13:25:00 -
[12] - Quote
Legate Lanius wrote:I don't understand why this topic even exists.
It exists because some people like pvp and it takes a long time (about 1.5hours/ fight) to find decent pvp in eve.
Tamiya Sarossa wrote:When I was playing regularly I would log on, fly around by myself or one or two other corpies, and generally find 4-5 fights in a two-three hour play session. I probably could have averaged more but it takes a bit to reship after dying....
I'm not sure when this was. It may have been like that years ago. But I don't think its like that any longer.
As far as what I do: I am in faction war. I roam the mainlines and off the mainlines of the fw area. I usually log on about 8pm with several ships already fully fitted. I usually will get about 1 fight before I log off about 10. Sometimes though I won't even get that. Then its just a wasted 2 hours. And I am counting fights where no one even dies like if ecm drones save at the last minute or someone can warp out due to the other dropping point due to range or cap. But I am only counting situations where both sides are actually firing. Not counting gate camps or times when as soon as you engage a falcon warps in and you are perma-jammed out.
Your saying 4 fights per 2 hours would be possible on some nights but that would be very rare. You would have several nights, looking for 2 hours, with no pvp in between the nights where you get 4 decent fights per 2 hours.
Make faction war occupancy pvp instead of pve https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=53815&#post53815
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Cearain
The IMPERIUM of LaZy NATION
61
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Posted - 2011.10.17 20:16:00 -
[13] - Quote
Tamiya Sarossa wrote:Cearain wrote:Tamiya Sarossa wrote:When I was playing regularly I would log on, fly around by myself or one or two other corpies, and generally find 4-5 fights in a two-three hour play session. I probably could have averaged more but it takes a bit to reship after dying....
I'm not sure when this was. It may have been like that years ago. But I don't think its like that any longer. It was about a month ago, I think. I'd recommend getting the hell out of FW, to be honest. FW attracts the wrong kind of people for gudfites, in general, unless you're taking advantage of plex mechanics. Try Minmatar/Amarr lowsec near hubs, that's where I've had the most success. Fit to be able to fight outnumbered or disengage, so kiting/boosted tanking ships. Yes, there will be some slow nights, and some where you seem to have a fight every system you jump into, but on average I consistently got much more than one fight every ninety minutes. It also helps to get a local network of people in an informal intel channel. Saved me a lot of time roaming around myself when someone would report 'flashy hurricane chasing me in the belts of x system' - you hop on over and get a goodfight right there. These informal networks are generally best made via shooting people, so you'll have to chill in one area for a bit to get them set up. Again, not saying you're doing it wrong, just letting you know it's definitely possible.
Thanks for the information.
I do faction war because it gives me more targets that I can engage on gates and at stations. Actually I don't see how leaving faction war can do anything except decrease the amount of pvp.
I do use the plexes to find fights allot. It is the most effective way I have found for fights yet.
I don't really use intel channels. The intel channels I used to be a part of have dried up. I left eve for a bit and most of the people I used to know have gone. I don't log on enough lately to really get into the new intel channels. But I think your right that could increase the amount of pvp I get.
Other than that though I think I'm doing it. I fly outside amamake. Make faction war occupancy pvp instead of pve https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=53815&#post53815
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Cearain
The IMPERIUM of LaZy NATION
61
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Posted - 2011.10.18 13:36:00 -
[14] - Quote
Beckett Firesnake
Looking at battleclinic, I see you have 1 kill and 22 losses. Yet you want eve to be even more unfair?
Goddess Ishtar wrote:Cearain wrote:Legate Lanius wrote:I don't understand why this topic even exists. It exists because some people like pvp and it takes a long time (about 1.5hours/ fight) to find decent pvp in eve. Only if you're dumb.
Now that we have someone from goose swarm calling others dumb, the thread is complete. Thanks for your contribution. But mother goose is calling you back to your carebearing and to make her rich. So you better run along now.
Make faction war occupancy pvp instead of pve https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=53815&#post53815
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Cearain
The IMPERIUM of LaZy NATION
61
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Posted - 2011.10.18 17:59:00 -
[15] - Quote
Mara Abraham wrote:Good day, Cearain:
"I do faction war because it gives me more targets that I can engage on gates and at stations. Actually I don't see how leaving faction war can do anything except decrease the amount of pvp."
I left Minmatar Faction Warfare after a year because of the types of PVP -- station games, mainly fighting on gates, inconsistent small gang activity, etc.
When there were large fights, it reminded me of watching or reading about Civil war fights were each side stood near the other side, and just lobbed away until one side remained; then stating GF in local.
While there was solo activity in FW, over the eleven months in FW, the number of solo pilots on each side dwindled; and when opportunities came up, often times a fleet would be present to interrupt the event.
Since I've left faction warfare for piracy, I've seen an huge increase in PVP -- consistent small gangs that rarely run away from larger gangs (yesterday was 3 v 6 (no losses), 8 v 17 (2 losses), and 13 v ___ (counter lost count) (no losses).
Add solo where most of the time, the solo is not interrupted; and, at least speaking for myself, I've more fun than in FW.
We do fight on gates (with and without gate guns depending on the situation), in dead space, in plexes, at belts, and sometimes (more rare than not) at stations.
Thank you.
I'm not sure why you couldn't do everything a piracy corp does (except be in an alliance) and still be in fw. Its not like when you are in faction war concord comes if you engage anyone other than the opposing militia.
If you get more targets because you can engage both militias that would make some sense. Are there any other opportunities to pvp that being outside fw allows that you couldn't do in fw?
So many of my current fights are at plexes or at gates (in ships that can't tank the gate guns) it seems hard to believe I would get more fights if I eliminated them.
I understand there may be role play reasons or reasons having to do with being in an alliance why pirate corps don't join fw. But from a purely most pvp per hour perspective it doesn't make sense to me. You can just fight more stuff in more situations if you join fw.
If you are in fw then you can use plex mechanics to help get fights. You can also engage more wartargets at gates and stations without having to wait out gccs.
If you are in an alliance with an equally large number of wartargets in the area then I guess it would be more or less of a wash. What is the view on this? Make faction war occupancy pvp instead of pve https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=53815&#post53815
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Cearain
The IMPERIUM of LaZy NATION
61
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Posted - 2011.10.18 20:44:00 -
[16] - Quote
I guess this is the question: If the tuskers joined faction war they would get fewer fights?
Not that they would join fw. Just, theoretically, why would joining faction war reduce the amount of pvp they would get? I would think it could only increase it. (assuming they are in fw space that is)
Scanning through your blog and seeing what sorts of fights your getting with the tuskers, it would seem you could do that if you were in fw - plus if you want them you would get the fw fights as well. Make faction war occupancy pvp instead of pve https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=53815&#post53815
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Cearain
The IMPERIUM of LaZy NATION
67
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Posted - 2011.10.22 04:10:00 -
[17] - Quote
Joan Avon wrote:Cearain wrote:Goose99 wrote:Zoe Alarhun wrote:If you are getting 1 battle every 2-3 hours then you are roaming in a location that's not pvp orientated or populated enough. If you live in the more well travelled routes and systems you can get fights in minutes if that's what you are after. By "fights," he must have meant catching a noob ratter at a belt, as opposed to getting ganked at a gate.  I meant neither. Zoe I realize I can engage a battlecruiser in a frigate and get a fight that way within minutes. But I mean a fight of decent quality not just suicide. Where are you that you are getting decent pvp fights in minutes? Other than rvb I have never heard anyone even make such a claim. Then Perhaps you Should join RvB? Just a thought.
I have been in rvb its decent. But they make the rules by arranged agreement. Thats not right. CCP should create the mechanics to make for a fun game. The fact that rvb exists proves ccp could do better when it comes to small scale pvp. Make faction war occupancy pvp instead of pve https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=53815&#post53815
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