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The new Mackinkaw takes the old hulks role, and is an afk mining machine.

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Suddenly Boom Royal Amarr Institute Amarr Empire 18	Posted - 2012.08.12 11:41:00 - [1] - Quote Nobody has pointed out that the mackinkaw now holds more ore than an industrial hauler? How has nobody seen the fail logic in this? It takes the role of miner and hauler and does both better.
Suddenly Boom Royal Amarr Institute Amarr Empire 18	Posted - 2012.08.12 11:47:00 - [2] - Quote Tippia wrote: Suddenly Boom wrote: Nobody has pointed out that mackinkaw now holds more ore than an industrial hauler? How has nobody seen the fail logic in this? Seeing as how you can't use the Mack as an industrial hauler, the fail logic lies in comparing it to one. That was the entire reason for giving it a specific ore hold: so it can't be used that way, because all it ever will (and can) carry is space-wasting ore. If you want to haul stuff, the best ship for it is an industrial, since they can carry far more (both in terms of stuff and in terms of variety) than a simple mining ship can. Unless you're using that industrial ship to haul ore from the belt, which is more its primary use.
Suddenly Boom Royal Amarr Institute Amarr Empire 18	Posted - 2012.08.12 21:30:00 - [3] - Quote While scouting for gank targets today I made screenshots of every ship in the belt over a dozen systems. Anyone wondering which barges players are mining in, here are the results. See for yourself http://img442.imageshack.us/img442/3889/vaurent.jpg http://img26.imageshack.us/img26/4728/oppold.jpg http://img600.imageshack.us/img600/1461/misneden.jpg http://img836.imageshack.us/img836/4369/kinfield2.jpg http://img685.imageshack.us/img685/1443/kinfield1.jpg http://img442.imageshack.us/img442/3065/eygm.jpg http://img805.imageshack.us/img805/4093/elona.jpg http://img835.imageshack.us/img835/2774/dant.jpg http://img443.imageshack.us/img443/7449/brapelle.jpg http://img542.imageshack.us/img542/4291/ardall.jpg http://img836.imageshack.us/img836/6778/abudban.jpg http://img846.imageshack.us/img846/2702/aakari.jpg Overwhelming majority are in untanked macs and retties. Plenty of orcas too, but hulks were rare. Yes I scanned a lot of people.
Suddenly Boom Royal Amarr Institute Amarr Empire 18	Posted - 2012.08.12 23:04:00 - [4] - Quote Deise Koraka wrote: James 315 wrote: You look around the highsec belts and see the extinction of the hulk in favor of the mackinaw. Check the market and note the price changes, too. Didn't I just say it's now the ship of choice for high-sec solo miners... Well, "The Market" is high sec and....of course that's going to happen, people want to make money off these changes. Out in 0.0 I'm sure the Hulk will live on, where it has the support of raquals etc. Even in High sec, with the support of a orca, hulk is still preferable for yield. People in hi-sec with orcas seem to prefer macs, see my screenshots of mac/rettie dominance in the belts on the previous page.
Suddenly Boom Royal Amarr Institute Amarr Empire 18	Posted - 2012.08.13 00:21:00 - [5] - Quote Vaerah Vahrokha wrote: Tigress Tionese wrote: Mackinkaw: 287m sell/263m buy Hulk: 224m sell/170m buy Skiff: 190m sell/164m buy I thought the intention of the barge buff was to remove one barge being best. That being the Hulk. The Mackinkaw has taken the Hulks old roll as king of the barges, the yield is almost as good as the Hulk, it has better tank, and it has a massive ore hold which is the primary thing that's making it so overpowered. When I said it before the patch, like here and here was welcome with denial if not utter derision. Glad to see once again I was right and they wrong. And the denial doesn't end here either ;) even though the screenshots i posted on the previous page paint a clear picture of just how popular the mac is and how unpopular the hulk has become. I think someone pointed out that market price reflects this too?
Suddenly Boom Royal Amarr Institute Amarr Empire 18	Posted - 2012.08.13 00:23:00 - [6] - Quote ashley Eoner wrote: Suddenly Boom wrote: Vaerah Vahrokha wrote: Tigress Tionese wrote: Mackinkaw: 287m sell/263m buy Hulk: 224m sell/170m buy Skiff: 190m sell/164m buy I thought the intention of the barge buff was to remove one barge being best. That being the Hulk. The Mackinkaw has taken the Hulks old roll as king of the barges, the yield is almost as good as the Hulk, it has better tank, and it has a massive ore hold which is the primary thing that's making it so overpowered. When I said it before the patch, like here and here was welcome with denial if not utter derision. Glad to see once again I was right and they wrong. And the denial doesn't end here either ;) even though belt statistics paint a clear picture of just how popular the mac is and how unpopular the hulk has become. One could also draw the conclusion that solo mining is far more popular in highsec than fleet mining... nawww that makes sense and doesn't jibe with the whole OMG MACK IS THE BESTES TTHING EVA NO ONE FLIES HULKS!!!111 Some of the belts I screenshotted had over a dozen orcas yet no hulks, so much for orca support groups using hulks.
Suddenly Boom Royal Amarr Institute Amarr Empire 18	Posted - 2012.08.13 01:03:00 - [7] - Quote I'm going to laugh my ass off when ice has crashed to an all new low, and all the miners are bitching on the forum. Bring back hulkageddon And even I can see that the mac is the new top barge on the block.
Suddenly Boom Royal Amarr Institute Amarr Empire 18	Posted - 2012.08.13 23:56:00 - [8] - Quote Melodee619 wrote: Jorma Morkkis wrote: Tippia wrote: And why does the Mack need to be nerfed? Check Pipa's posts before and right after the 1.2 patch. A lot of "facts" how Mackinaw's tank and ore bay render Skiff's/Procurer's role useless. It makes all the other ships useless, Last night 1 hulk in over 30 macks in 3 hours I found, an today those macks are still botting away an not one single hulk.... That alone says volumes. Naturally enough CCP will say its a feature, because they dont like to be wrong. So they will say Mack was designed to be the new ship of choice for aspirating botters everywhere. You talking about normal belts? Must be, if you checked the ice fields there's 30 macs and 0 hulks PER belt :) All hail our new afk mining barge overlord!
Suddenly Boom Royal Amarr Institute Amarr Empire 19	Posted - 2012.08.14 21:53:00 - [9] - Quote Terraferma K10 wrote: Why aren't there Hulks in the sea of Macks? Would you park your lambo in a ghetto surrounded by hondas? Just look at how most of you guys are reacting: "Must find hulk must find hulk must find hulk." Most of my ganker friends are feverishly jumping from system to system looking for hulks. Knowing this, would you be driving one of the most sought after targets or would you just bite the X% yield loss to have T-Rexs gloss over you in their "wtf another mack" rage? Given my island bordering losec, I'll eat a little less yield to not have the insta-kill "hulk" label while PvPers are going crazy looking for blood during this time of change. I recognize most mack-ers aren't using this mentality, but I posit that there are many hulk-ers (those with 2-3 accounts, orca/hauler support) abiding by this idea. Hell, I've never used a mack before and I bought 10-12 as soon as CCP wrote about their intended changes. There's no reason for hulks to be sought after over macs, since the patch their market prices have switched places, mackinkaws are now the expensive ship that is going to cause the most loss to a miner when ganked.
Suddenly Boom Royal Amarr Institute Amarr Empire 19	Posted - 2012.08.15 00:56:00 - [10] - Quote Melodee619 wrote: Suddenly Boom wrote: Terraferma K10 wrote: Why aren't there Hulks in the sea of Macks? Would you park your lambo in a ghetto surrounded by hondas? Just look at how most of you guys are reacting: "Must find hulk must find hulk must find hulk." Most of my ganker friends are feverishly jumping from system to system looking for hulks. Knowing this, would you be driving one of the most sought after targets or would you just bite the X% yield loss to have T-Rexs gloss over you in their "wtf another mack" rage? Given my island bordering losec, I'll eat a little less yield to not have the insta-kill "hulk" label while PvPers are going crazy looking for blood during this time of change. I recognize most mack-ers aren't using this mentality, but I posit that there are many hulk-ers (those with 2-3 accounts, orca/hauler support) abiding by this idea. Hell, I've never used a mack before and I bought 10-12 as soon as CCP wrote about their intended changes. There's no reason for hulks to be sought after over macs, since the patch their market prices have switched places, mackinkaws are now the expensive ship that is going to cause the most loss to a miner when ganked. except hulks can be killed (if your really lucky). I attacked a hulk other night with blasters, an he just ignored me, I did scratch damage top him. Yes hulks can be killed but there's no longer a reason to target them specifically, hulks are now the cheaper ship because everyone is switching to asteroid solo pwnmobile macs.
Suddenly Boom Royal Amarr Institute Amarr Empire 19	Posted - 2012.08.15 11:35:00 - [11] - Quote Jojo Jackson wrote: Zishy wrote: Tikera Tissant wrote: Tigress Tionese wrote: For belt hauling, the mackinkaw beats primary haulers at their own role. Forget the rest, i'm talking about belt hauling. There's no need to use a hauler anymore, infact even if you're mining in a team, you're better of mining with all mackinkaws, a hauler is not going to increase your yield, infact it will decrease, you're better off with all mackinkaws and no hauler. It's far easier, and you get more ore. The imbalance here is plain as day, no mining ship should be able to haul ore as well as or better than an actual dedicated hauler does. If you really want a dedicated hauler anyway, just use another Mackinkaw, it can mine between hauling sessions. If you're going to do that though you may aswell just use each miner as its own hauler anyway. God, this is so dumb. You are dead wrong. When mining in a team you are mining in hulks. They dump their load to the orca, and the orca either takes the ore to the station, or you are using another orca to transfer the ore to the station. There is absolutely no reason to use mackinaws in a team ops. Even when not tanked they will not do as much m3/hour as a tanked hulk with a booster orca. No need to go and dump your load means lots more cycles dedicated to mining than flying to station, which makes the ops a hell of alot more efficient. Using macks in a team is very in-efficient. For a solo miner, its retriever->mackinaw. For a group miner its retriever->hulk. For a null miner its mainly a skiff. what kind of bullshit are you writing here. solo miner = mackinaw group miner = mackinaw>hulk null miner = mackinaw>hulk LOL??? Did you read the DEV-Blog? In a group where you have Haulers Hulk>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Mackinaw. If you mine in dangures areas Skif >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Mackinaw. If you are to lazy anything >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> YOU The numbers don't lie. You do! The numbers don't lie, almost all orca mining groups are using macs, even group miners don't want the hulk. See for yourself all the orcas in the belts in these screens and the mac dominance even in the presence of many orcas. Almost all players will take the huge convenience the mac offers over the hulk. http://img442.imageshack.us/img442/3889/vaurent.jpg http://img26.imageshack.us/img26/4728/oppold.jpg http://img600.imageshack.us/img600/1461/misneden.jpg http://img836.imageshack.us/img836/4369/kinfield2.jpg http://img685.imageshack.us/img685/1443/kinfield1.jpg http://img442.imageshack.us/img442/3065/eygm.jpg http://img805.imageshack.us/img805/4093/elona.jpg http://img835.imageshack.us/img835/2774/dant.jpg http://img443.imageshack.us/img443/7449/brapelle.jpg http://img542.imageshack.us/img542/4291/ardall.jpg http://img836.imageshack.us/img836/6778/abudban.jpg http://img846.imageshack.us/img846/2702/aakari.jpg
Suddenly Boom Royal Amarr Institute Amarr Empire 19	Posted - 2012.08.15 12:06:00 - [12] - Quote Zishy wrote: Jojo Jackson wrote: Zishy wrote: Tikera Tissant wrote: Tigress Tionese wrote: For belt hauling, the mackinkaw beats primary haulers at their own role. Forget the rest, i'm talking about belt hauling. There's no need to use a hauler anymore, infact even if you're mining in a team, you're better of mining with all mackinkaws, a hauler is not going to increase your yield, infact it will decrease, you're better off with all mackinkaws and no hauler. It's far easier, and you get more ore. The imbalance here is plain as day, no mining ship should be able to haul ore as well as or better than an actual dedicated hauler does. If you really want a dedicated hauler anyway, just use another Mackinkaw, it can mine between hauling sessions. If you're going to do that though you may aswell just use each miner as its own hauler anyway. God, this is so dumb. You are dead wrong. When mining in a team you are mining in hulks. They dump their load to the orca, and the orca either takes the ore to the station, or you are using another orca to transfer the ore to the station. There is absolutely no reason to use mackinaws in a team ops. Even when not tanked they will not do as much m3/hour as a tanked hulk with a booster orca. No need to go and dump your load means lots more cycles dedicated to mining than flying to station, which makes the ops a hell of alot more efficient. Using macks in a team is very in-efficient. For a solo miner, its retriever->mackinaw. For a group miner its retriever->hulk. For a null miner its mainly a skiff. what kind of bullshit are you writing here. solo miner = mackinaw group miner = mackinaw>hulk null miner = mackinaw>hulk LOL??? Did you read the DEV-Blog? In a group where you have Haulers Hulk>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Mackinaw. If you mine in dangures areas Skif >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Mackinaw. If you are to lazy anything >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> YOU The numbers don't lie. You do! sweety i mine with full rorqual boosts and 6hulks. 6macks actualy are better then 6 hulks because you can just drop a full can every 10minutes instead of having to drag **** from your cargohold every 104seconds. my hulks yield is over 5k per cycle so in order for me not to drop stripminers i have to click every single account and drag the ore out into a can. with macks all this trouble is nonexistent. i dont know what you publords are doing in empire space but in null where the big boys and girls live its very different This guy spelled it out right here. With the hulk he has to drop the ore every 104 seconds, with the mack you can mine for a much longer period without worrying about ore overflow, you can have afk breaks. Over a long period a mac user will mine more than a hulk user because they can mine and relax at the same time, resulting in much longer mining sessions.
Suddenly Boom Royal Amarr Institute Amarr Empire 19	Posted - 2012.08.15 12:23:00 - [13] - Quote Sarton Wells wrote: Suddenly Boom wrote: This guy spelled it out right here. With the hulk he has to drop the ore every 104 seconds, with the mack you can mine for a much longer period without worrying about ore overflow, you can have afk breaks. Over a long period a mac user will mine more than a hulk user because they can mine and relax at the same time, resulting in much longer mining sessions. And that's why gankers have no reason to fear for the safety of their job. I am a huge ganker of miners, with two top dps catalysts at my disposal. 2 is only enough for zero tank macks, semi tanked or greater requires 3-4 catalysts and i'm not sure if i want to invest in 2 more accounts just so i can clear the belts again :) people in the minmatar hi-sec ice fields will know me well :)
Suddenly Boom Royal Amarr Institute Amarr Empire 19	Posted - 2012.08.15 22:37:00 - [14] - Quote edit
Suddenly Boom Royal Amarr Institute Amarr Empire 24	Posted - 2012.08.16 19:17:00 - [15] - Quote Idris Helion wrote: Barbara Nichole wrote: Lame and somewhat inacurrate title. The Mack actually does not mine as fast for ice as it used to. The Hulk still out performs the mack based on yield. The size of the Mack ore hold makes it nice for solo mining; it's not invinicible the tank is still within reach of many ganks.. and what's more, miners still don't tank like survival is job one.... I find the Mack nice.. but not royal. Yup. Pretty soon the gankers are going to come up with a loadout that kills paper-tanked Macks the way they used to take out paper-tanked Hulks, and that'll be the end of the love-affair with the Mack for a lot of people. More tank, less gank, kids. There's no such loadout, only teams of 4 max dps catas. You can't improve the loadout, you can only increase the number of gankers it requires to counter the HP, which is 4 max dps catas vs a decent mack tank.

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