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How many EVE gamers are from the United States?

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Lilianna Star State War Academy Caldari State 68	Posted - 2012.08.15 03:50:00 - [1] - Quote It may seem like a strange thing to ask, but according to some unnamed game developers, American gamers see punishing the player as a problem with a game rather than admitting their own mistakes. So I want to know, what gamers here are from the U.S.? Why are you playing EVE despite how its problem of punishing players?
Micheal Dietrich Kings Gambit Black 635	Posted - 2012.08.15 03:56:00 - [2] - Quote What?
Lilianna Star State War Academy Caldari State 68	Posted - 2012.08.15 03:59:00 - [3] - Quote Micheal Dietrich wrote: What? If you're from the US, I want to know why you're playing EVE despite the "problem" of the game punishing the player for failure.
Tibus Massani Apoclypse Knights Semper Fidelis Coalition 6	Posted - 2012.08.15 04:07:00 - [4] - Quote Micheal Dietrich wrote: What? Seriously. This.
Micheal Dietrich Kings Gambit Black 635	Posted - 2012.08.15 04:08:00 - [5] - Quote Am I to understand that you are calling pistol packing, war mongering, fire and brimstone bible thumping, filling up the prisons, road raging, hate group creating, kill you for wearing the wrong colors Americans a bunch of carebears? Where, praytell, did you get this information from?
stoicfaux 1434	Posted - 2012.08.15 04:14:00 - [6] - Quote Lilianna Star wrote: It may seem like a strange thing to ask, but according to some unnamed game developers, American gamers see punishing the player as a problem with a game rather than admitting their own mistakes. So I want to know, what gamers here are from the U.S.? Why are you playing EVE despite how its problem of punishing players? I think you're confused with European games which tend to be more co-op and try to keep all the players in the game until the end. In contrast, US games tend to be more cutthroat and allow for players to be eliminated early. E.g. Settlers of Catan versus Monopoly. Also, this: Micheal Dietrich wrote: What? You can tell me what is and isn't Truth when you pry the tinfoil from my cold, lifeless head.
Lilianna Star State War Academy Caldari State 68	Posted - 2012.08.15 04:32:00 - [7] - Quote Out of respect I won't say who said it, but a game developer recently said that American MMO gamers can't deal with failure. I want to know if that's true or not.
Marie Hartinez Aries Munitions and Defense 82	Posted - 2012.08.15 04:37:00 - [8] - Quote Seriously, what problem? Surrender is still your slightly less painful option.
Lilianna Star State War Academy Caldari State 68	Posted - 2012.08.15 04:38:00 - [9] - Quote Marie Hartinez wrote: Seriously, what problem? Punishing players for failure is a problem among American gamers. Same with forcing gamers to read and providing anything but the most well designed and easy to use interface. European gamers can take it though.
Alara IonStorm 2972	Posted - 2012.08.15 04:41:00 - [10] - Quote Lilianna Star wrote: American MMO gamers can't deal with failure. Yeah when people say MMO in context to the industry they are talking about Wow and its 600 Clones. That little tiny chuck of the industry where EVE and games like EVE are, they are for context to their meaning "MMO's" in name only. We're the dark back alley of the industry. The people they are talking about hang out in that sunny park over there.
Alara IonStorm 2972	Posted - 2012.08.15 04:43:00 - [11] - Quote Lilianna Star wrote: Punishing players for failure is a problem among American gamers. Same with forcing gamers to read and providing anything but the most well designed and easy to use interface. European gamers can take it though. I see you added some speculation and decided the conjecture and opinion is absolute fact. Guess you made up your mind based on your hate boner. You should really let the upper brain do some thinking once and a while.
rodyas Tie Fighters Inc 635	Posted - 2012.08.15 04:55:00 - [12] - Quote It is kind of true, American games are alot different then european games. I had to play american games, until they got so ******, for so long,. That I can finally handle an european game. A lot of europeans do play WoW though, so the distinction is always hard to make. I will not be voting in the CSM election, so you need to go vote to make up for me.
Micheal Dietrich Kings Gambit Black 635	Posted - 2012.08.15 04:57:00 - [13] - Quote Lilianna Star wrote: Out of respect I won't say who said it Made it up, gotcha.
Shameless Avenger Can Preachers of Kador 468	Posted - 2012.08.15 05:17:00 - [14] - Quote 0/10 for lack of research before the troll. Afaik nobody loves brutal corporate capitalism more than us. "This is the Ninja. He will scan you down; he will salvage your wrecks and there shall be no aggro"
Lilianna Star State War Academy Caldari State 68	Posted - 2012.08.15 07:03:00 - [15] - Quote Micheal Dietrich wrote: Lilianna Star wrote: Out of respect I won't say who said it Made it up, gotcha. Fine, here you go. To be honest I am a little offended.
Shameless Avenger Can Preachers of Kador 468	Posted - 2012.08.15 07:33:00 - [16] - Quote Lilianna Star wrote: Fine, here you go. To be honest I am a little offended. Don Daglow? He worked a decade for EA. That alone makes him irrelevant. Wanna look at the games he helped develop? "Tony La Russa Baseball"? "Old Time Baseball"? Oh Please... This guy has been trying to call attention to himself for years, in order to sell his books (he claims to be a writer too). He's so full of himself that he probably wrote his own Wikipedia entry. PS: Yup... he actually did wrote his own wiki entry. Using his own books as references... lol "This is the Ninja. He will scan you down; he will salvage your wrecks and there shall be no aggro"
dexington Red Federation RvB - RED Federation 133	Posted - 2012.08.15 07:40:00 - [17] - Quote Lilianna Star wrote: To be honest I am a little offended. If you are that easily offended, maybe your should no start a thread that stereo type a hole nation. Because some americans have a gaming related character flaw, does not mean that everyone has it. Most people playing eve are probably not having any problems with being punished for their mistakes, most may even be quick to learn from their on and others mistakes. GÇ£The best way to keep something bad from happening is to see it ahead of time, and you can't see it if you refuse to face the possibility.GÇ¥-á
Shameless Avenger Can Preachers of Kador 468	Posted - 2012.08.15 07:44:00 - [18] - Quote Again... in case in wasn't clear the first time: Don Daglow is a TROLL. "This is the Ninja. He will scan you down; he will salvage your wrecks and there shall be no aggro"
Akita T Caldari Navy Volunteer Task Force 1236	Posted - 2012.08.15 09:07:00 - [19] - Quote The only difference between the "American gamer" and the "European gamer" or the "Asian gamer" or any other "ThisGenericRegion gamer" is how much attention to unjustified temper tantrums the developer gives, and how badly the playerbase reacts when their temper tantrums go ignored for too long. That is to say, there's always some crybabies on all sides of each of the oceans, it's only a matter of degree. So, I guess, if you really want to get down to the splittiest of the hairs, the geezer is sort of right - a slightly larger proportion of USA gamers are somewhat more likely to feel a bit more entitled, make more noise when they really shouldn't, and the USA-centric devs more likely to cave in to their demands or even pre-emptively design to minimize those complaints from the word go even if it saps on the power of some of the fun parts of the game itself. http://wiki.eveonline.com/en/wiki/User:Akita_T http://eve-search.com/stats/Akita_T T2 BPO poll : https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=114789
Elias Greyhand Potentially Irresponsible 11	Posted - 2012.08.15 10:49:00 - [20] - Quote He looks like a Russian clone of old Bob Hopkins.
dexington Red Federation RvB - RED Federation 133	Posted - 2012.08.15 11:10:00 - [21] - Quote Akita T wrote: ...which is pretty damn strong as far as USA player totals go, more than one third of the playerbase, more than double of any other nation, and more than every smaller-than-2% nation combined. Not really a relevant comparesion you are just showing that the biggest country has the most players, not really a big surprise. The number should either be the EU population compared to the US, which was how the OP stated the difference, or the percentage should be in relation to population of that country. GÇ£The best way to keep something bad from happening is to see it ahead of time, and you can't see it if you refuse to face the possibility.GÇ¥-á
Akita T Caldari Navy Volunteer Task Force 1236	Posted - 2012.08.15 12:33:00 - [22] - Quote dexington wrote: [quote=Akita T]Not really a relevant comparesion you are just showing that the biggest country has the most players, not really a big surprise. The number should either be the EU population compared to the US, which was how the OP stated the difference, or the percentage should be in relation to population of that country. USA population ~312 mil, EVE subs 37% (~8.4 mil per percentage point) - no localization needed UK population ~62 mil, EVE subs 14% (~4.4 mil per percentage point) - no localization needed Germany population ~82 mil, EVE subs 8% (~10 mil per percentage point) - localization available, allegedly of decent quality, but a lot of people know English decently anyway France population ~65 mil, EVE subs ~2.5% (~26 mil per percentage point) - localization NOT available and English is not in very high regard Russia population ~142 mil, EVE subs ~5.5% (~26 mil per percentage point) - localization available but of questionable accuracy, English a bit more difficult to learn for a slavic language speaker Sweden population ~9.5 mil, EVE subs ~2.3% (~4.1 mil per percentage point) - localization not available but unlikely to be needed due to most population being sufficiently proficient in English Norway population ~5 mil, EVE subs ~1.43% (~3.5 mil per percentage point) - similar to Sweden Finland population ~5 mil, EVE subs ~1.05% (~5 mil per percentage point) - similar to Swe/Nor, but English a bit more difficult for a native speaker of finno-hungric languages Netherlands population ~16.5 mil, EVE subs ~2.3% (~7 mil per percentage point) - localization not available but less likely to be needed due to a significant percentage of the population being proficient in English Belgium population ~11 mil, EVE subs ~0.75% (~15 mil per percentage point) - theoretically same situation as the Netherlands, but apparently not really Romania population ~21.5 mil, EVE subs ~0.67% (~32 mil per percentage point) - no localization and somewhat lower standard of living compared to any of the previous countries, even if theoretically English is taught in school and you'd expect people to want to use it on the Internet, its popularity is in decline lately Spain population ~47 mil, EVE subs ~0.59% (~80 mil per percentage point) - no localization, and English is not a very popular language in Spain compared to other parts in the EU Brazil population ~197 mil, EVE subs ~0.31% (~635 mil per percentage point) - no localization, English not very popular, and also noticeably lower standard of living and/or access to the Internet ... So, EVE is almost twice as popular in the UK than in the USA (with localization issues unlikely to play any effect), and EVE being even more popular in Sweden, and still more popular in the Netherlands (compared to the USA) but not by very much, while EVE is more popular in the USA than in Germany (in spite of an alleged decent localization), while popularity in France and Russia is about equally low despite (not very successful) localization efforts for Russia. It looks like lack of localization and socio-economic factors are a far more important than the continent the typical gamer comes from. Also, no asian country even registers as a blip as far as total subs go, but then again, you have a separate server for China, data from Japan is not quite in yet, and India probably doesn't have a large enough portion of its population that can be bothered with playing online games for fun. http://wiki.eveonline.com/en/wiki/User:Akita_T http://eve-search.com/stats/Akita_T T2 BPO poll : https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=114789
Dorian Tormak Brutor Tribe Minmatar Republic 62	Posted - 2012.08.15 12:45:00 - [23] - Quote Alara IonStorm wrote: Lilianna Star wrote: American MMO gamers can't deal with failure. Yeah when people say MMO in context to the industry they are talking about Wow and its 600 Clones. That little tiny chuck of the industry where EVE and games like EVE are, they are for context to their meaning "MMO's" in name only. We're the dark back alley of the industry. The people they are talking about hang out in that sunny park over there. Yo
Jim Era Viziam Amarr Empire 743	Posted - 2012.08.15 14:50:00 - [24] - Quote OP you are severely ill informed.
Micheal Dietrich Kings Gambit Black 636	Posted - 2012.08.15 15:03:00 - [25] - Quote Lilianna Star wrote: Micheal Dietrich wrote: Lilianna Star wrote: Out of respect I won't say who said it Made it up, gotcha. Fine, here you go. To be honest I am a little offended. You wouldn't have to be if you had simply posted the sources the first time, that was your own fault. So here's to answer your question(s): First of all, learn the definition of Tongue-in-cheek. It is used often throughout that entire article and you appear to have done the exact opposite of its meaning. 2nd You adjusted it from gamer to mmo gamer. If you would be so kind, please take a look at this list and show us how many mmo's this guy has worked on. 3, you seem to have made the classic fallacy of grouping everybody as a whole, but as Alara pointed out you put a bit of a hate boner on the whole spin so I'm thinking this was intentional just to get a rise out of players. But since players are unique, you will get a percentage who can handle failure. In this case I was going to pull up Akita's stats and show that not only do many Americans play eve and can handle failures, we appear to make up almost %40 of the player base. On top of that, several of the largest alliances in the game are led by or co-led by Americans. 4. You took the word of one man's opinion and made it fact. This is also a common problem with internet users. Now had you provided a national study (with sholastic links, not wikipedia) providing the same information all of this may be a tad bit more credible. To answer your question on a personal level, I came back after a break because I found other mmo's to be too easy and mindless. *We still have yet to classify what failure even means in eve. Is it a loss of a ship/structure/corporation? Is it not being able to complete a mission (couldn't keep a straight face on that one)? Is it not being at a comparative competitive level against other players?
Blane Xero The Firestorm Cartel 51	Posted - 2012.08.15 15:16:00 - [26] - Quote Thread is under the misconception that it is a phenomenon limited to Americans. It's mostly just people with a higher sense of entitlement in general, not geographical location based. It just is more pronounced in America due to sample size. Resident Haruhiist since December 2008. Laying claim to Out of Pod Experience since 2007, plain and simple. Keep the trash out of Out Of Pod Experience, If it's EVE Related or deserves a Lock, it does not belong here.
FloppieTheBanjoClown The Skunkworks The Marmite Collective 2221	Posted - 2012.08.15 15:32:00 - [27] - Quote Lilianna Star wrote: Punishing players for failure is a problem among American gamers. Umm...no. Seeing as we were the driving market behind the evolution of video games in the 80s and 90s, I'd suggest that the "dumbing down" of games came as the international market gained a foothold. The Skunkworks is recruiting. -áhttps://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=1540711#post1540711
FloppieTheBanjoClown The Skunkworks The Marmite Collective 2221	Posted - 2012.08.15 15:49:00 - [28] - Quote [quote=Lilianna Star]Fine, here you go./quote] "Students aren't exposed to the idea of academic failure until they reach 17 and begin applying for colleges." I guess he didn't go to the same public schools I did. Because where I come from, failure results in additional work, denial of privileges, and loss of extracurricular activities. There are a lot of kids who only pass in school because they can't play the sport of their choice if they don't. "Finally he points out that Americans tend to have a limited knowledge of world history due to the way the subject is taught in US schools." Quote: He then summarized his presentation with six tips on how to sell games to American online gamers: Craft the opening minutes to hold attention. Use a simple, clear interface. Minimize text: show, don't tell in tutorials. The player is a celebrity, give them unique customization. Recognize that we're in the queue and the user is the master. History rarely sells and is often unknown 1) That's the approach with ALL media: TV shows have to have good pilots. Movies have to have engaging opening sequences. Books have to grab your attention in the first chapter. It's about immersing you in the content so that you want to see where it goes. 2) In an increasingly diverse market, this means less translation and fewer potential cultural misunderstandings. Also, the alternative to a "simple, clear interface" is a "cluttered, confusing interface." Why would you EVER favor the latter? 3) See the first part of #2, and then realize that most people learn better by doing than being told how to do. Half-Life's tutorial is a great example of doing it right. 4) Why do I have to be "a celebrity" to enjoy making my character look how I want? The "make your avatar" minigame is simply a part of the narrative. 5) The user is the CUSTOMER, and you want them to buy your stuff. So make stuff they want to buy. 6) This...doesn't even make sense. The Skunkworks is recruiting. -áhttps://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=1540711#post1540711
Serria Mau BREAKING-POINT Primal Force 11	Posted - 2012.08.15 16:55:00 - [29] - Quote So, assuming the OP is actually from the United Kingdoms; you are an excellent example of how the people of cultures are diverse. Such as you're the portion of the UK which thinks the Euro is the only real currency, like very few people in the United States believe the dollar is the only real currency. Not literally by the way, but hopefully you're bright enough to get the point. Not everyone is a bigot in the United States, similar to how not everyone is a bigot in the United Kingdoms. There are just a few, like you. And you, the bigot, are the people who make some stereotypes. Luckily before now however the bigots in the United Kingdoms for some reason were smart enough to keep quiet, in contrast to the American. - Mau
Blane Xero The Firestorm Cartel 51	Posted - 2012.08.15 17:00:00 - [30] - Quote Serria Mau wrote: So, assuming the OP is actually from the United Kingdoms; you are an excellent example of how the people of cultures are diverse. Such as you're the portion of the UK which thinks the Euro is the only real currency, like very few people in the United States believe the dollar is the only real currency. Not literally by the way, but hopefully you're bright enough to get the point. Not everyone is a bigot in the United States, similar to how not everyone is a bigot in the United Kingdoms. There are just a few, like you. And you, the bigot, are the people who make some stereotypes. Luckily before now however the bigots in the United Kingdoms for some reason were smart enough to keep quiet, in contrast to the American. - Mau You really shouldn't tear into someone if you refer to the United Kingdom as/in plural. Ninja edit because I'm not sure whether to use as or in, so I'll use both and damn those who would correct me, I'm tired and prepping for 8 hours of rickety backwater bus routing tomorrow. Resident Haruhiist since December 2008. Laying claim to Out of Pod Experience since 2007, plain and simple. Keep the trash out of Out Of Pod Experience, If it's EVE Related or deserves a Lock, it does not belong here.

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