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Why do people hate Miners so much?

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LHA Tarawa	Posted - 2011.01.19 23:49:00 - [31] Probably almost as many reasons to attack miners as there are people that attack them. Some may do it for economic reasons. There are many things that are needed to make the economy of EVE work... one of those things that are needed is lots of boom. If ships aren't getting blown up, then there aren't many replacement ships needed. Currently, the game has too much supply and not enough demand, which is why we're in deflation mode when not being supported by insurance fraud (people intentioanlly self-destructing ships for insurance). Killing miners is hitting two birds with one stone as it decreases supply of minerals(if only for an hour), while increasing demand when the miner has to replace their ship. Then there is the epeen aspect. Kill boards give ratings like ISK ratio. That is, killing lots of expensive while losing few cheap ships. People thinks it proves they are a god among men if they have a high ISK kill/loss ratio, even if they just gank a lot of hulks with cheap ships. Then the LOLs.... Some just like to beat up on weaklings. And, I think a part of it is that people think they can make carebears go out to lowsec and become PVP pilots where they can kill and be killed. See, a lot of EVE is just sitting around waiting for a fight, or roaming around looking for easy wins.... then running away when a bigger group comes along and starts thinking of you as an easy win. Oh, if only those high sec carebears would come stumbling out of high sec into low sec where we can kill them without CONCORD..... Hey, let's go kill them, and maybe they'll stop being high sec carebears and come out and fight us more....
ACY GTMI Veerhouven Group	Posted - 2011.01.20 10:47:00 - [32] Being serious for a moment, and trying not to take offense, I personally think 'pew pew' is a waste of time and ISK. My characters are not rained in combat skills and can't fly combat ships very well. Why should I give you a thrill for free? Just create a few alts and kill them whenever you get bored. Other people do it and it all looks the same on the killboards. Or you could pay me a billion ISK a ship and I will provide helpless targets for you. -------------------------------------------- "Better to burn than rot." -- Megan Cady from CJ Cheeryh's 'Hellburner'
Calfis Amarr F.R.E.E. Explorer The Initiative.	Posted - 2011.01.20 15:49:00 - [33] Originally by: ACY GTMI Being serious for a moment, and trying not to take offense, I personally think 'pew pew' is a waste of time and ISK. And a serious answer to your answer would be: then what is the point? Eve is heavily marketed as a PvP centered game (even though newbs find out after they buy the game that they need some training time to really get into it). Its one of its main selling points and something that CCP heavily shows off in its trailers. The whole idea of getting more isk is to get into bigger ships that can make more pew. Whats the point of hording isk if you are never going to use it for any fun? And don't sit there and tell me that staring at your hulk for hours as it shoots pretty lights at a rock is the pinnacle of fun in eve. Most miners I know are doing something else when they are having 'fun' mining, like watching tv. So if 'pew' is a waste of time then maybe you are wasting your time getting space rich and not actually playing the game.
Aldan Romar Amarr Imperial Academy	Posted - 2011.01.20 16:47:00 - [34] The Elite series wasn't PvP, and it was great fun (though I only seriously played First Encounters). Though even with EVE clearly marketed as PvP, there is more than enough precedence for those who like the (old) PvE experience and the roleplaying part.
Calfis Amarr F.R.E.E. Explorer The Initiative.	Posted - 2011.01.20 17:07:00 - [35] Originally by: Aldan Romar The Elite series wasn't PvP, and it was great fun (though I only seriously played First Encounters). Though even with EVE clearly marketed as PvP, there is more than enough precedence for those who like the (old) PvE experience and the roleplaying part. True, but many of these PvE guys decry PvP in Eve, especially when it gets forced upon them, as if not realizing they had signed up for an open sandbox universe.
Aldan Romar Amarr Imperial Academy	Posted - 2011.01.20 17:35:00 - [36] Originally by: Calfis True, but many of these PvE guys decry PvP in Eve, especially when it gets forced upon them, as if not realizing they had signed up for an open sandbox universe. I agree, one should be aware of the risks (and chances). I guess there may be a good deal of PvE players who do PvP as well. I'm personally looking forward to PvE from a background and character development perspective, but I do want to PvP sooner or later to put those skills to use... But getting OT here... Basically I jumped in on some of the absolute opinions about playing this game.
Sobaan Tuan	Posted - 2011.01.20 22:21:00 - [37] Originally by: Disastro Unlike mission runners and traders they pretty much have to do their money making in a belt exposed to the world and totally vulnerable. It is easy to find them. It is easy to put an out of corp alt in the same belt as a warp in. And miners tend to play the game semi-afk watching TV or otherwise similarly distracted. The real answer is because Eve's pvp is extremely boring. Last night have roaming around not finding a single thing to shoot- I was literally put to sleep. Most pvp roams end up with nothing exciting. If you're in 0.0, attacking or defending an objective, thats different. But for a lot of Eve, you need hulks to kill to bridge the gap. Miners tend to play the game semi-afk, and thats smart, (I do it) that way you don't get too bored while playing. I mine in Rairomon semi-afk in a hulk all the time. Come and blow it up, see what its like
michaelws	Posted - 2011.01.20 22:24:00 - [38] Edited by: michaelws on 20/01/2011 22:26:35 Seeing as how this has just affected me...and as I feel I might represent a small faction of players in this sandbox, I thought I should pipe in my two cents. I am one of the "older" players here. I am 62. I find "shooter" games that require a twitch impulse that I am not competitive at anymore, maybe never was, not very enjoyable. I am a professional illustrator animator painter and love visuals. Eve intrigued me simply by the enticing graphics I saw while browsing the internet and seeing the ads. Remember the space game Homeworld? I loved the mining sequence in that game even though it only lasted for a few short minutes before one had to engage in combat. But I kept thinking how nice it would be to have an online environment where one could simply lose oneself in the virtual reality of the environment...and not be required to outshoot someone or constantly look over one's shoulder. Once in a while, but not full time. AFK, if it means away from keyboard, applies to me...but it is not because I am watching TV. I am painting, which takes about 15 hours a day or more (I am lucky I am selling my work). But I want to earn enough money (ISK) and level up my skills so that I can maneuver around EVE better. But I have extremely limited time. I have been wordy enough. But I am no carebear yet I do not have the skills nor the equipment in EVE to even survive the "Burn the Hive" mission from Sister Alitura. I want to...but I need to read more to learn the tactics necessary to survive. So, until then, I do want to log on and enjoy the environment that I am paying for and that means my options are limited...and mining was recommended as a way for someone like me to level up and to make some money. Sure it is boring...but it is still a beautiful setting to be bored in. Anyhow, I got ganked last night and lost my Osprey, which I could definitely not afford to lose...was probably my fault. A guy came into .8 space and shot up my jetcan and then his icon turned red and I thought that meant he was shooting me...so I locked him, fired, and he stopped me from warping and destroyed me. I know it is just the nature of the game...but it was rough to lose that much money in equipment. I have only played now for over a month, and only an hour or two a night. But there are some of us out there mining who are truly enjoying the experience as boring as it might be to others...but if you think mining is boring...try painting a canvas with lots of detail...that gets pretty repetitious also. There is my two cents. I love the game and hope to survive long enough to master more of the nuances required to excel in it. Thanks for reading
Kahega Amielden T.R.I.A.D	Posted - 2011.01.20 23:11:00 - [39] Quote: Anyhow, I got ganked last night and lost my Osprey, which I could definitely not afford to lose...was probably my fault. A guy came into .8 space and shot up my jetcan and then his icon turned red and I thought that meant he was shooting me...so I locked him, fired, and he stopped me from warping and destroyed me. For clarification, turning red just means you have the rights to shoot him. When he's locking you, you'll see yellow brackets around his icon on the overview. When he's shooting you, that will turn red. Until you see the blinking red brackets, no one is attacking you.
Steve Thomas Minmatar	Posted - 2011.01.21 01:24:00 - [40] /shrugs I poped a couple of can flipers for S&G a while back, realy easy to do. somehow they never ever quite realise that (1) that odd can with a few bits of ore was bait (2) that that hauler over there seemingly AFK mining was actualy scooping up the cans as I needed to replace them (3) that there were 2 people in the same corp as the jetcanner in or near the system but not in the belt(4) that you actualy can fit tackling gear to an orespray and 4 that BC and destroyer flying into range is fit specificaly to pop your silly little frigate thank you very mutch.
michaelws	Posted - 2011.01.21 02:30:00 - [41] Edited by: michaelws on 21/01/2011 02:35:02 Kahega...yes...I learned that last night...the hard way. He baited me and he won. I paid a high price to learn that. Steve, can you elaborate on how to fit an osprey or whatever in order to fight back successfully and still mine? Or point me to a good thread on the subject? Thanks
Calfis Amarr F.R.E.E. Explorer The Initiative.	Posted - 2011.01.21 07:26:00 - [42] Originally by: michaelws Edited by: michaelws on 21/01/2011 02:35:02 Kahega...yes...I learned that last night...the hard way. He baited me and he won. I paid a high price to learn that. Steve, can you elaborate on how to fit an osprey or whatever in order to fight back successfully and still mine? Or point me to a good thread on the subject? Thanks Remember that what they flip is never worth losing your ship over, ignore em next time and move on to a different belt. Enjoy your new ship and buy insurance. My act of goodwill for the year.
Watak Hunt	Posted - 2011.01.21 08:04:00 - [43] Originally by: Sanai Nobuseri What I would like to know is why? Why? Because not enough mine in low sec any more.
Watak Hunt	Posted - 2011.01.21 08:10:00 - [44] Originally by: michaelws I am one of the "older" players here. I am 62. I find "shooter" games that require a twitch impulse that I am not competitive at anymore, maybe never was, not very enjoyable. AFK, if it means away from keyboard, applies to me...but it is not because I am watching TV. I am painting, which takes about 15 hours a day or more (I am lucky I am selling my work). But I want to earn enough money (ISK) and level up my skills so that I can maneuver around EVE better. But I have extremely limited time. Pardon me for asking this but if you play mainly AFK what is the point? You mine AFK so that you have the resources to mine some more AFK? Doesn't that make it sound like a bit of a waste of money? You could record the sound of mining lasers, play it in a loop over your speakers, cancel your subscription and save all that money.
Renkari Amarr	Posted - 2011.01.21 12:09:00 - [45] Edited by: Renkari on 21/01/2011 12:11:50 Originally by: michaelws Anyhow, I got ganked last night and lost my Osprey, which I could definitely not afford to lose...was probably my fault. A guy came into .8 space and shot up my jetcan and then his icon turned red and I thought that meant he was shooting me...so I locked him, fired, and he stopped me from warping and destroyed me. A good lesson, and a typical trap you fell into. Originally by: michaelws I know it is just the nature of the game...but it was rough to lose that much money in equipment. To avoid such 'rough losses' in the future read up on some of the mechanics of the game before getting yourself a new cruiser. Also ensure your ship. Originally by: michaelws Edited by: michaelws on 20/01/2011 22:26:35 But there are some of us out there mining who are truly enjoying the experience as boring as it might be to others. Since you spent that much time to type that post, you could probably afford to spend 20 minutes of your time reading some of these. http://wiki.eveonline.com/wiki/Criminal_Flagging_System http://wiki.eveonline.com/wiki/Kill_Rights If you know what strategies your enemies use to kill you, you can avoid them much easier. A brilliant video of a miner showing his teeth: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ndWUlntJ58U You've said you're no carebear, right?
ACY GTMI Veerhouven Group	Posted - 2011.01.21 13:04:00 - [46] There's nothing safe or boring about mining in Hi Sec or 0.0. In Hi Sec a rat attack might destroy a low skill pilot's Retriever in less time than it takes to warp out. Even if you really aren't worried about losing a ship right away, you may lose quite a bit of mining time getting everything started up again. There's also the usual system dirt. Can flippers, griefers and derelict Hulk pilots who seem to think they own whatever belt they jump into. In 0.0 it may take an hour to take care of a rat attack and get the lasers started again. You don't see can flippers or other idiots very much, though. As far as AFK and macro miners go, I believe they should both be banned permanently. Sorry to sound so negative, but the extended downtime has me on edge. I should be . . . mining.
Aderata Nonkin	Posted - 2011.01.21 14:40:00 - [47] Originally by: Renkari Also ensure your ship. You mean "insure". Big difference, tough guy.
Renkari Amarr	Posted - 2011.01.21 14:56:00 - [48] Originally by: ACY GTMI As far as AFK and macro miners go, I believe they should both be banned permanently. What's wrong with AFK miners? Do you imply people should just watch those mining lasers cycle and never alt-tab? Originally by: Aderata Nonkin You mean "insure". Thanks.
ACY GTMI Veerhouven Group	Posted - 2011.01.21 16:43:00 - [49] An 'AFK' miner is a miner who spends the majority of his/her time Away From the Keyboard, or doing something not related to the game while sitting at or near the keyboard. If you don't enjoy the game, don't play it. If you find mining boring, don't mine. If you can't afford a new Tengu every other day without a mining alt, stop losing Tengus.
Sarina Berghil Minmatar New Zion Judge Advocate Multiple Sargasm	Posted - 2011.01.21 17:32:00 - [50] Originally by: Calfis The whole idea of getting more isk is to get into bigger ships that can make more pew. Whats the point of hording isk if you are never going to use it for any fun? And don't sit there and tell me that staring at your hulk for hours as it shoots pretty lights at a rock is the pinnacle of fun in eve. Most miners I know are doing something else when they are having 'fun' mining, like watching tv. That remark may be the perfect answer to the question. We all have our own ideas of what is fun and what the game is about, and then when someone else does something totally different we fail to understand it. "They are playing it wrong" we think. "Why do they play it wrong? They must be evil, or mentally challenged or botters" Calfis assumes mining isn't fun, and for most players it isn't. But for some that is genuinely what they like to do. Please don't take this wrong Calfis I don't mean to troll you or offend you, you just happened to make the perfect example of what is sometimes going on in our minds.
Aya Otosaki Titan Indurstrial	Posted - 2011.01.21 23:44:00 - [51] Remember. this is eve. if people hate you your doing it right. ----- Ignorance is my strength.
michaelws	Posted - 2011.01.22 01:03:00 - [52] Edited by: michaelws on 22/01/2011 01:04:06 Funny how that seems to prevail in our divisive society today. Hate seems to be quite the neurotoxin so many strive for. NOT what I joined Eve to experience. But best of luck to you, in the game and in your real life. Maybe I can be privileged one day to be among those who reinforce that you are doing great here in EVE. My new lesson learned...and my last post in an opinion-related thread.
M4U53R Gallente The Aussie Connection Corp	Posted - 2011.01.22 01:42:00 - [53] Because Miners have more fun =)
Kruullien	Posted - 2011.01.22 05:48:00 - [54] Originally by: Salliene Originally by: Sanai Nobuseri I am relatively new to the game, and I wanted to Mine, Build ships, stations etc for other people and every where I turn theres people saying miners are scum, there hated, theres organised alliances that hunt and just kill miners, and even a yearly competiton someone told me about called hulkageddon where you kill as many miners as you can for prizez. What I would like to know is why? Doesnt the game need people to mine in order to provide the materials for the entire community? Miners are stupid. Pirates are stupid. Market traders are stupid. Mission runners are stupid. Explorers are stupid. Nullsec armchair generals are stupid. Role players are stupid. Basically anyone who doesn't play EVE the way I think it should be played is stupid and should be shot on sight (in game). * The EVE Mindset in a nutshell. ** Help, help! I'm in a nutshell. Im sure glad ninja looting isnt stupid.
Aya Otosaki Titan Indurstrial	Posted - 2011.01.22 12:38:00 - [55] Originally by: michaelws Edited by: michaelws on 22/01/2011 01:04:06But best of luck to you, in the game and in your real life. thank you. if you try to excell, to live to your fullest potential you will inevitably come in to conflict with other people. my post in an opinion-related thread. :) anyway good luck in eve and have fun. ----- Ignorance is my strength.

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