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Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 0 post(s) |
cyndrogen
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Posted - 2011.01.19 18:02:00 -
[31]
Before we start fixing and patching PI how about just a simple tutorial?
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Ahnsa Trahn
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Posted - 2011.01.19 18:06:00 -
[32]
+1
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Rensany
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Posted - 2011.01.19 18:13:00 -
[33]
+1
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Tactalan
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Posted - 2011.01.19 18:14:00 -
[34]
Well done CCP, you've totally screwed PI.
Thanks.
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Preks
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Posted - 2011.01.19 18:15:00 -
[35]
+1
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Ondola Tatranus
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Posted - 2011.01.19 18:20:00 -
[36]
+1
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Alexsei Miarmatov
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Posted - 2011.01.19 18:21:00 -
[37]
+1 FIX PI PLEASE!!!
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JItaray
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Posted - 2011.01.19 18:25:00 -
[38]
+1 Dude wheres my powergrid!
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Benjamin Xavier
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Posted - 2011.01.19 18:29:00 -
[39]
+1 i love you guys at ccp but seriously, as we say in fleets
`theres always one``
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jake Razr
Chaos Rendering
STR8NGE BREW
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Posted - 2011.01.19 18:45:00 -
[40]
+1
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Rupicolous
Higher Ground
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Posted - 2011.01.19 19:03:00 -
[41]
Like i've stated before on the "test server feedback" forum, before the patch, the new PI is trash.
You have extractors overlapping everthing else, that is still where it was before because in order to move it we have to tear it down and reassemble (at a cost). Tough to see anything clearly with the muddied extractor heads all over the place.
Would be nice to even move the CC now that with the same skills better hot spots are on the other side of the gad domn planet.
You have extraction rates that seem to match the previous amount of processors but not always on every planet type, just a few here and there that probably got the luck of the draw.
My impression is that we are sapposed to rebuild the Extractor hub every time in a new location that favors the scan results (costing 45k every time) not too much but it certainly adds up and then you have cpu issuse because now the link needs to be upgraded twice due to the distance involved.
The entire patch is CCP's idea of grieving the customer base: mandatory incursions, new less than desirable PI, and character poortraits that you have to recreate out of a half a$$ set of options. (no expressions)(lack of clothing options)why the hell are we even picking out lower options when the portrait shows the face only ? save it for the next patch or leave it out completly because without a character "preview" like with ships, there is no way to ever enjoy the full portrait of any players character in the first place.
Nuff said, you cripple learning skills and now hack the portraits up while reinventing PI so that it's worse than when you started. I'm disgusted with it. Stop trying to compete with other MMO's and stick with your roots.
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Zircalla
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Posted - 2011.01.19 19:13:00 -
[42]
I guess I am going to have to admit I kind of like the new PI. Yep., I can't produce what I could before, but I am betting prices will compensate. I like the more variable program length. The PI adds new caveats and considerations, deal with or just stop producing 
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Berikath
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Posted - 2011.01.19 19:58:00 -
[43]
 Originally by: Pyle Driver
@ Berikath,
Why would you upgrade a launch pad if you don't get any benefit or discount on the power grid or cpu? In other words it going to cost you the same to just build another, minus of course the link cost...
The issue is we are now getting far less from our PI, with more complicated input, more leg work. Thats effectively called a nerf as it was said before.
I am all for an upgradeable launch pad, but there should be an advantage to using an upgrade, like less grid or cpu.
Other issue is the site depleation in this patch seems to be coming at a higher rate. Depleating the resources of a given ECU area, therefore is becomes an issue, do you allow a higher grid use for a longer, bigger link when moving the ECU, or do you tear all your stuff down and move? isk vrs convenience...
Not all benefits have to be "I can fit more 'STUFF' on my things". There are many advantages to upgradable launchpads which primarily translate to ease-of-use improvements for factory planets.
1. Currently you can have multiple launchpads on planet, but you have to import to/export from them individually. Having 2 or 3 launchpads is required to fit more than about 15 hours worth of raw materials on a factory planet, and the 10 second cooldown on importing and exporting means multiple launchpads takes several times longer.
2. It would simplify routing. If you can have a launchpad twice the size instead of 2 separate ones, you can route everything to/from the same pad.
2a. It would also remove the annoying instance where you import pad B's materials to pad A and vice versa, which if you don't catch it means your planets sit full but idle until you next check them.
3. It would allow for more complete utilization of the space. Materials don't work out to even multiples of 10,000 m3. Let's say 16 hours of production is 9400 m3 and 17 hours is 10100: if you have 2 separate launchpads, the max you can fit is 32 hours of production and you have 1200 left-over dead space. If you have 1 launchpad twice as big, you can fit 33 hours of production with 500 dead space. Sure, it's not a huge difference, but it is an improvement.
Upgradable launchpads without a discount are an ease-of-use change: doing your thing with planets isn't really any "easier", just MUCH less annoying. As far as I can see, there's not really an argument AGAINST doing it, other than the development time it would require (which, I would hope, is not a huge amount; after all, CCs are already upgradable. The only thing which I would expect might take any significant amount of time is if they were DOWNgradable too... but who cares about that, you can just demolish the structure and build another one).
Having the upgrade give a discount, however, is a balance change. It makes it so the same planets can do more stuff, which turns it into a much more thorny issue (what side effects would it have, how could people abuse the mechanic to get more out of it, etc etc etc). While I have no problem in PRINCIPLE with having upgrades cost less, I really just want them IMPLEMENTED and want to eliminate as many potential roadblocks as possible.
*** [ SIG] ***
Wish list for PI:
*One-click input routing
*Copy product, inputs & outputs in factories
*Launchpad upgrades: twice the space, twice the cost, half the hassle!
[ /sig ] |
Rupicolous
Higher Ground
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Posted - 2011.01.19 20:46:00 -
[44]
How about a constant on / off switch for other players structures - tired of having to click them off over and over again just to see my own colony.
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Marakin Darka
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Posted - 2011.01.19 22:44:00 -
[45]
+1
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Rattlesnake Axestomp
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Posted - 2011.01.20 03:13:00 -
[46]
+1
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mark wittekind
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Posted - 2011.01.20 03:19:00 -
[47]
Dynamic power and CPU gets my vote. Props to OP. PI was just nerfed...
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Mecinia Lua
Galactic Express
The Spire Collective
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Posted - 2011.01.20 04:54:00 -
[48]
I've been able to recreate my previous colonies in the new system, however admittedly I was mostly just mining 2 things at each colony to begin with and mostly making POS fuel and Self Harmonizing Power Cores, which already took several planets to make. I have an alt to do tomorrow though and she mines 4 things on most planets....that might be more painful to change.
I like many have noticed though that we get real close on the Power side but have way excess CPU, I have wondered if perhaps any defenses added for DUST will use primarily CPU and that's why we have so much excess CPU right now.
Thoughts expressed are mine and mine alone. They do not necessarily reflect my alliances thoughts.
Your signature is too large. Please resize it to a maximum of 400 x 120 with the file size not exceeding 24000 bytes. -Mitnal |
Sanne Allows
Caldari
4-25 AVN Regement
Sovereign Technologies
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Posted - 2011.01.20 05:57:00 -
[49]
I was using 3 accounts, and 8 Charecters from them, 5 planets each, for a total of 40 planets. I was making ALL the T4 items, and now can't even make robotics on a Plasma planet!!!!!!!!!
C'Mon guys, tell me you didn't REALY MEAN to nerf PI this bad!!!?
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Teh Minez0r
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Posted - 2011.01.20 13:31:00 -
[50]
Originally by: Sanne Allows
and now can't even make robotics on a Plasma planet!!!!!!!!!
this...
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Ender wiggans
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Posted - 2011.01.21 01:11:00 -
[51]
I have to agree with the masses.
High yield planets, and you can't maintain enough materials to keep your production going.
The ECU take up FAR to much power for what they do, (not produce anything) and then you have to add drill heads which cost more power. I see they dropped the power demand, but you have to set up 10 drill heads to mak up for the power demand on the ECU.
Some of the functions of the ECU are nice, but making PI more time intensive and annoying was the idea behind the change, then you nailed it.
I can't produce anything near what i was before, and with the need to move the ECU around, becomes impossible.
And, it seems that planet resources are gone. As they can be mined out.
How does this work? Since the planet will be there forever, do you mine out a planet, and its now worthless for all time? Or does it "re-grow"? Not sure if this is "realistic" if that was also an intent.
ECU power demand should be very low, CPU should be higher. Storage and launch pads upgradeable would be great.
But at this pint, I would give up the upgradable command for it to go back to what it was.
Because what it has become, is near impossible to use, and with the depleated resources, worthless.
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lance goodtrusts
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Posted - 2011.01.21 03:25:00 -
[52]
n
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ssgt slaughter
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Posted - 2011.01.21 03:35:00 -
[53]
ok ok i after this patch have to run out and buy a new computer (not impressed) and for what a charater portrait graphics upgrade that is buged to hell EPIC FAIL BOYS.
over the last while ccp has made it clear that isk is something they do not want the players to have.
it has become never more apparant than the recent changes to planetary interaction.
the markets are sucking crap BECAUSE PEOPLE DO NOT HAVE THE ISK ANYMORE,and whenever ccp makes a mistake and players start making isk ccp quickly steps up and nerfs it.
that poaint was also made very clear by ccps nerf on the drone hoardes in the drone regions WHAT HELL WAS THAT?
the drone regions give no bountys the droen regions do not give faction tower/battleship/cruiser/even frigate bpc drops
and we find a way to make isk and nc pilots start to whine and you nerf the hoardes EPIC FAIL#2.
is it ccps wish to drive the player base out of the game is my question not much though was given to anything they do lately it seems.
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cyndrogen
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Posted - 2011.01.21 08:23:00 -
[54]
no it has not been nerfed at all... you now need to alterante and switch programs while keeping a steady supply. This means more storage is needed.
before you were stuck with whatever extractors you picked.
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NICK NG
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Posted - 2011.01.21 09:15:00 -
[55]
I think the main problem is that you can't put all buildings that you need to produce a tier 3 products.
I mean even if you put an elite comand center (with 19 000 power), 4 Basic Industrial Facilities (4 x 800 = 3 200 power), 3 advance (3 x 700 = 2 100 power), 1 lunchpad (700 power) and 4 Extractor Control Center with 1 head (4 x (2 600 + 550) = 12 600 power) there will be only 400 power for links and it is almost imposible to link all the buildings.
So if you want to produce tier 3 products you must put 3 Extractor Control Centers and changeing what they extract to get 4 different raw materials.
Anyway ... I will be happy if ccp only reduce the Extractor Control Center powergrid, lets say with 100 or 200 power, or better to make it 2 000 power or ...
or simply, like some one sad, make posible one Extractor Control Center to extract different raw materials with different heads in the same time
p.s.: sorry for my bad English
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Teh Minez0r
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Posted - 2011.01.21 12:38:00 -
[56]
Originally by: cyndrogen
no it has not been nerfed at all... you now need to alterante and switch programs while keeping a steady supply. This means more storage is needed.
before you were stuck with whatever extractors you picked.
Doesn't make a difference if I switch tbh. Simple example using elite command center + planet in low sec space:
Before the patch:
raw material 1 - 100% extraction (while 100% means enough extraction to store + supply basic processor using 23h mode)
raw material 2 - 100% extraction
raw material 3 - 100% extraction
raw material 4 - 100% extraction
After the patch:
raw material 1 - 100% extraction
raw material 2 - 100% extraction
raw material 3 - ~50% extraction (not enough power left for setting up enough extractor heads)
raw material 4 - --- not possible to set up a 4th ECU due to lack of power
conclusion - doesn't matter if I switch the production of the ECUs (what would mean MORE work btw as you have adjust the heads each time again) as the production decreased by ~35% - even if I switch, there are still 35% missing.
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Selena Dualle
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Posted - 2011.01.21 18:04:00 -
[57]
cyndrogen is right, if you think you have PG problems you are clearly not thinking
CCP:
The extractor output "per hour" and the "total" is calculated from the last segment of the extraction curve. It would be more helpful if the average "per hour" and the added "total" was presented instead. |
Barakkus
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Posted - 2011.01.21 18:22:00 -
[58]
Edited by: Barakkus on 21/01/2011 18:24:52
Originally by: Teh Minez0r
2. With the ECUs, there's a lack of a command's center power output now. Before the update I was able to produce enough raw materials (23h cycles all of em) with extractors to fill 6 basic processors permanently (+ some stored raw materials), that again filled 3 advanced processors permanently. Now I can't even set up a 3rd ECU to extract a 3rd raw material - and I'm talkin about low sec planets, in this case 0.2 + elite command centers. And here is my suggestion how to fix this. As the ECU itself is the "brain" of the extracting process, it shouldn't use 2600mw power but imho an ECU should use 2600 of CPU. Like that the problem with using launchpads as storage facilities wouldn't be that easy neither.
I run 11-12 hour cycles and won't have to refil any of my planets anymore except robotics. The fact that it takes 2 or 3 minutes per character to do my extractors now is a great trade off and allows me to not have to do 23 hour cycles. While only touching PI once a day is nice, having more flexibility fixes the problem I was having keeping my facilities running at 100% all the time without having to drop off more p0 and p1 materials. I'm absolutely loving the new extractors, instead of taking an hour to do 3 characters it takes less than 10 minutes.
I would like to see the cpu/power tweaked a little on the planetary installations though.
If you're getting "less" materials out of PI, you should really experiment more with it. With how it's working now (I'm only doing POS fuel) I'm seeing a ~50% increase out of my facilities.
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[SERVICE] Corp Standings For POS anchoring
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Selena Dualle
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Posted - 2011.01.21 20:06:00 -
[59]
Originally by: cyndrogen
Before we start fixing and patching PI how about just a simple tutorial?
Great idea. Since nobody has picked up on it yet, I guess I will have to do. Feel free to suggest any changes and corrections.
1: Use 1 extractor, add all 10 heads. If you still have PG, place another extractor and add as many extra heads as possible.
2: When placing the heads, don't look at the pretty dancing graph, look at "extractor head units" and maximize the number for each one (this is an assumption, not verified)
3: Always check that the routing is active, always. If you don't it can cost you a day of resources.
4: Use enough storage. Route harvested resources into the storage, use routes out from the storage to the processors.
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Berikath
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Posted - 2011.01.21 20:25:00 -
[60]
Originally by: Selena Dualle
Originally by: cyndrogen
Before we start fixing and patching PI how about just a simple tutorial?
Great idea. Since nobody has picked up on it yet, I guess I will have to do. Feel free to suggest any changes and corrections.
1: Use 1 extractor, add all 10 heads. If you still have PG, place another extractor and add as many extra heads as possible.
2: When placing the heads, don't look at the pretty dancing graph, look at "extractor head units" and maximize the number for each one (this is an assumption, not verified)
3: Always check that the routing is active, always. If you don't it can cost you a day of resources.
4: Use enough storage. Route harvested resources into the storage, use routes out from the storage to the processors.
IMHO-
Players can figure it out and write guides for people.
Players cannot fix stuff that's broken.
If ya can't do both at once, get it working before making tutorials.
*** [ SIG] ***
Wish list for PI:
*One-click input routing
*Copy product, inputs & outputs in factories
*Launchpad upgrades: twice the space, twice the cost, half the hassle!
[ /sig ] |
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