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Joshua Calvert
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Posted - 2005.01.23 18:01:00 -
[1]
I just declined a mission from my Level 4 agent with the result that my standing decreased from 8.49 to 8.17.
That's a little bit harsh, don't you think?
LEEEEERRRRRRRRRRROOOOOOOOOYYYYYYYYYYYYYYY! |
Daolin
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Posted - 2005.01.23 18:18:00 -
[2]
 Originally by: Joshua Calvert
I just declined a mission from my Level 4 agent with the result that my standing decreased from 8.49 to 8.17.
That's a little bit harsh, don't you think?
No, it's well deserved. You can't just pick the cherries from the cake, and leave the dirty missions for someone else 
Besides, such large downward corrections only occur if you have very high standing, when your standing is lower you get higher increases and less decreases.
If you want to keep ultra-high standings with your agent, you're supposed to work for it. 
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MOOstradamus
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Posted - 2005.01.23 18:20:00 -
[3]
Nope not harsh - just the way the % cookie crumbles
MOOrovingian "Following & supporting EVE (since Jan 2001) is like wiping your arse with sandpaper."
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Joshua Foiritain
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Posted - 2005.01.23 18:25:00 -
[4]
Edited by: Joshua Foiritain on 23/01/2005 18:25:53
Hehe you think thats bad? I went from 6.2 to 5.6 after cancelling the Silence the Informant mission. 
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[Coreli Corporation Mainframe] |
j0sephine
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Posted - 2005.01.23 18:31:00 -
[5]
"I just declined a mission from my Level 4 agent with the result that my standing decreased from 8.49 to 8.17.
That's a little bit harsh, don't you think?"
Nah, since you can make back just as much for doing a single mission (depending on the mission of course, but i had lvl.3 missions that increased the standings by more than that... would guess the standing hits are affected in similar way, some hurt you more than others. o.O
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Joshua Calvert
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Posted - 2005.01.23 18:36:00 -
[6]
Edited by: Joshua Calvert on 23/01/2005 18:47:23
It takes more than one mission to gain 0.32 standing, j0.
Received a 0.01 standing increase from my next mission.
That's WITH Social 5.
LEEEEERRRRRRRRRRROOOOOOOOOYYYYYYYYYYYYYYY! |
j0sephine
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Posted - 2005.01.23 19:39:00 -
[7]
"It takes more than one mission to gain 0.32 standing, j0.
Received a 0.01 standing increase from my next mission."
No, it really depends on the mission ^^;;
I think i got something like 0.5 standing increase for the Pirate Extravaganza lvl.3 mission, and that was with social at 3 or 4... while the 'small' missions involving the standard courier stuff indeed give very little standing increases. So am guessing the penalties can also be big and small, depening on the mission you reject... o.O
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Panzer Faust
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Posted - 2005.01.23 21:39:00 -
[8]
I had an effective standing with my agent of 10.0 (was 9.96 i think - rounded up)
then i got 1 pirate extravanganza... i decline it, no problem.. and i get a second.. i thought i'd lose some, but not that much, it has put me back to 9,1...
I agree thats a steep loss :/ but oh well, dunno if it even affects your missions anyway..
---
Proud Owner of a Navy Issue Raven. |
Dobra
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Posted - 2005.01.23 21:51:00 -
[9]
It's been talked about before but the losses gain are done with a formula.
With high standing you will gain little and lose much which it should be.
However you are allowed to decline one mission each 4 hours, so if you don't want to loose that standing you just have to wait 4 hours and do something else in the mean time.
And at 8.17 what does it actually matter? Anything above 7 is just for show.
/Dobra |
Joshua Foiritain
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Posted - 2005.01.23 22:10:00 -
[10]
Originally by: Dobra
And at 8.17 what does it actually matter? Anything above 7 is just for show.
You said it yourself, its for the show. 9.9 makes you look a hell of a lot cooler then 7.0
I believe standing also affects EQ...
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[Coreli Corporation Mainframe] |
Daolin
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Posted - 2005.01.23 22:22:00 -
[11]
Originally by: Joshua Foiritain
You said it yourself, its for the show. 9.9 makes you look a hell of a lot cooler then 7.0
I believe standing also affects EQ...
Yeah, 9.9 makes you look mighty cool, so you should work for it
And yes, each full 1.0 standing raises EQ by 1, but the effect on missions and rewards is negligible.
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Shinca
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Posted - 2005.01.23 22:56:00 -
[12]
Edited by: Shinca on 23/01/2005 22:58:20
It works the way it works but at least now you can decline a mission every four hours or so without losing standings. Just enable the warnign message and you will be informed if you try to decline another mission before the 4 hours passed. Just be sure you check the journal since I found a few times I recieved offers without actualy talking to the agent. And if an offer times out, you do lose standings.
And btw, when you have high standings you have to do a lot of missions to gain what you lose from just one, since all the % changes are calculated from your current position to either +10 for increase or -10 for decrease. So if you are at 9.0, you will lose 19 times as much as you will gain for the same type of mission.
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(\_/)
(X.x)
(> <) WTB cookbook with bunny recipes |
Sorja
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Posted - 2005.01.24 03:52:00 -
[13]
What is 'EQ' ?
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Stryker Zee
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Posted - 2005.01.24 04:52:00 -
[14]
I think EQ is Effective Quality. Someone correct me if I'm wrong.
I have encountered this situation as well, however I have adjusted by finding several agents in the general vicinity to work for. If I have already turned down a mission for the agent I'm currently working for, then I just go to one of my other agents nearby to work for them while the timer runs til I can turn down the mission without losing standing.
I know it isn't optimal, but it's the best solution I've found. Sometimes it is even beneficial to work for different agents during the day, as there seems to be some cycle in which various npc corps give better rewards than others at different times.
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Excavation Svcs
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Posted - 2005.01.24 06:17:00 -
[15]
Penalties are way too harsh at the moment. Decline one cargo container mission (no way in hell I'm ever gonna do one of those), and you get -5%. Way over the top.
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Arthur Guinness
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Posted - 2005.01.24 07:33:00 -
[16]
standing above 6.7 is useless anyway, so just ignore it. |
X'Alor
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Posted - 2005.01.24 15:36:00 -
[17]
Well with the new pop up are you sure you wanna decline feature should have explained that.
I mean now they let you decline one lvl 3 mission every 3 or to 5 hours.
the first one is free without any penalty.
The second one or more in that time limit is what hurts ya.
Plus they even implemented a pop up "hey if you decline this mission befor X date Y time then your going to take a security hit of Z if you do"
Do you still wish to decline the mission?
Accept
Decline.
I guess if you said don't bother me again without reading and accepted, you got what they said you were going to get.
And that feature has been working all weekend.
Not sure when it was implemented, had to be last week some time.
LVL 4 agents do the same but it's only one mission decline every day and a half or so.
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Cirle
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Posted - 2005.01.24 15:46:00 -
[18]
Edited by: Cirle on 24/01/2005 15:47:46
Originally by: j0sephine
"I just declined a mission from my Level 4 agent with the result that my standing decreased from 8.49 to 8.17.
That's a little bit harsh, don't you think?"
Nah, since you can make back just as much for doing a single mission (depending on the mission of course, but i had lvl.3 missions that increased the standings by more than that... would guess the standing hits are affected in similar way, some hurt you more than others. o.O
PE is roughly an 9% increase, which for the above case gives a (10.0 - 8.17) * 0.09 addition per mission. Roughly 0.165 increase, which would be two and a bit PE missions to get back to that state... which is indeed rather harsh.
One of the original complaints with the decline/failure percentage drop was because it was applied to (percentage -> 0), not (10 - percentage), and thus gave a very uneven drop at higher levels.
I was under the (mistaken by the looks of it) impression that this had been changed so that failing a mission would result in a harsh penalty, but not 10+ missions worth still... (PE is an extreme...). Maybe it has though, and this is considered reasonable now? Either way, I'm glad the gentleman has mentioned it before falling foul of this myself :)
Cirle |
Fto Cruise
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Posted - 2005.01.25 00:10:00 -
[19]
I dropped from 9.8 to 9.3 not realising that, after you have accepted the mission, the 4 hour rule does not apply.
Manufacturers of the 425mm Railgun II |
Lucre
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Posted - 2005.01.25 13:00:00 -
[20]
Originally by: Joshua Calvert
Edited by: Joshua Calvert on 23/01/2005 18:47:23
It takes more than one mission to gain 0.32 standing, j0.
Received a 0.01 standing increase from my next mission.
That's WITH Social 5.
Yes, Josh, but remember the disadvantage that Social 5 is labouring under... 
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X'Alor
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Posted - 2005.01.25 17:28:00 -
[21]
try negotiations 5
social doesn't do squat for ya except give you braggingrights and having any possible req skill for advanced negotions when they come.
negotiations skill is the one boosts your income and standing increases.
And for the guy that accepted a mission ........
once you accept any mission you have no choice but to complete it or fail.
if you just read it and ask for more details you can decline it.
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Nemiona
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Posted - 2005.01.25 18:19:00 -
[22]
I lost 2.2% to agent and 1.2% to the agent corp because an offered mission timed out.. I though offers didnt give you penality, guess I was wrong there 
------
The future, according to some scientists, will be exactly like the past, only far more expensive.
John Sladek |
X'Alor
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Posted - 2005.01.25 19:12:00 -
[23]
Loyalty Point offers do not give you any penalties.
Declining too many missions(more than one per time alotment pending agent lvl), failing mission, or timing out on mission offers DOES.
two completely different things.
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Nemiona
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Posted - 2005.01.25 19:35:00 -
[24]
Edited by: Nemiona on 25/01/2005 19:36:03
well, this offer had a 24h timeout, I got the offer last night, but decided to wait to accept it as the game lagged too much, and I logged off. As I was late home from work, the mission offer timed out, and I lost the standings. So I did not reject any other missions in the meantime from any agents...
If I had logged in early enough and rejected it, I would not loose standings.. seems a little odd to me..
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The future, according to some scientists, will be exactly like the past, only far more expensive.
John Sladek |
X'Alor
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Posted - 2005.01.25 19:56:00 -
[25]
And what you are saying if anyone wanted to decline a mission without any penalty should be able to just wait till it is to time out and just stay logged off and it should reset so that we all can turn down missions that we don't want just by letting them time out and say "ooooops" I couldn't get here. my bad.
sorry but way to exploitable.
And what's the concern here about......agent standing?????
or should i say.
AGENT STANDING! OMIGODITHINKIMGONNAPUKE
Can someone remind me what bonus privaledges comes with high lvl 9.99 "agent standing"
other than having a very very slight increase to your effective quality(minimal barely noticable).......ABSOLUTELY NOTHING.
Does not earn you access to other agents.
Does not affect your recycling capabilities or yeilds.
Does not increase your chance of any certain mission.
All high lvl agent standing does is give you the personal satisfaction of seeing the number say 9.anything.
And all 9.anything allows you to do is turn down more than one mission without it affecting your overall standing and overall agent access.
Only need be concerned with corp and faction standings.
And ultimately right now without lvl 5 agents. Not a single sole needs to worry about any standing over 7.00.
any standing above 7.00 is strictly bragging rights.
once lvl 5's come out then you will need corp and or faction standings up around 8.00 or higher for full access I predict.
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Doc Pox
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Posted - 2005.01.25 20:13:00 -
[26]
Quote:
standing above 6.7 is useless anyway, so just ignore it
I think it does
Is their a "wait period" before a LvL 4 Agent will start to talk to you again ......... dropped from 6.8 to 6.7 and now see refuses to issue any mission ?
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X'Alor
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Posted - 2005.01.25 20:49:00 -
[27]
Not sure how you only lost a 0.1 at a lvl 4 agent lvl as the higher the lvl the greater the loss.
in that unfortunate situation however you will have to revert to another agent in that corp, either lvl 3 or lvl 4 and increase your corp standing which should get you access again.
If you only need 0.1 to get access again, I would think less than 10 missions at lvl 3 would do it. Lvl 4 for sure.
to only loose .1 at a lvl 4 agent is very very odd. I would think it is a derived modification from doing something you shouldn't have someplace.
Only things that come to mind ...... convoy hunting, shooting someone or someplace your not supposed too. Possibly running a mission for an enemy's corp.
Flopping between corps and factions can do that also.
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Nemiona
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Posted - 2005.01.25 21:32:00 -
[28]
Originally by: X'Alor
And what you are saying if anyone wanted to decline a mission without any penalty should be able to just wait till it is to time out and just stay logged off and it should reset so that we all can turn down missions that we don't want just by letting them time out and say "ooooops" I couldn't get here. my bad.
sorry but way to exploitable.
And what's the concern here about......agent standing?????
or should i say.
AGENT STANDING! OMIGODITHINKIMGONNAPUKE
Can someone remind me what bonus privaledges comes with high lvl 9.99 "agent standing"
other than having a very very slight increase to your effective quality(minimal barely noticable).......ABSOLUTELY NOTHING.
Does not earn you access to other agents.
Does not affect your recycling capabilities or yeilds.
Does not increase your chance of any certain mission.
All high lvl agent standing does is give you the personal satisfaction of seeing the number say 9.anything.
And all 9.anything allows you to do is turn down more than one mission without it affecting your overall standing and overall agent access.
Only need be concerned with corp and faction standings.
And ultimately right now without lvl 5 agents. Not a single sole needs to worry about any standing over 7.00.
any standing above 7.00 is strictly bragging rights.
once lvl 5's come out then you will need corp and or faction standings up around 8.00 or higher for full access I predict.
heh... What did I do to you ?
I find your replies kinda hostile... anyway what Im saying is that I loose standing if I dont log into the game the next 24 hours, BUT if I do log in and REJECT the offer, I dont loose standing... thats puzzles me alittle.. (and it is completely legal to turn down a mission every 4 hours or so..)
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The future, according to some scientists, will be exactly like the past, only far more expensive.
John Sladek |
Trevedian
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Posted - 2005.01.26 06:16:00 -
[29]
Originally by: Joshua Calvert
I just declined a mission from my Level 4 agent with the result that my standing decreased from 8.49 to 8.17.
That's a little bit harsh, don't you think?
YES, that is TOOO HARSH!
Fix it CCP!
Sex0r > you're bounty turns me on.. you seem like the kind of amarrian to dominate me
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Ramov Tinoga
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Posted - 2005.01.26 09:37:00 -
[30]
Originally by: Nemiona
what Im saying is that I loose standing if I dont log into the game the next 24 hours, BUT if I do log in and REJECT the offer, I dont loose standing... thats puzzles me alittle.. (and it is completely legal to turn down a mission every 4 hours or so..)
You ask your agent for a job and he offers you one and waits for your answer.
Just walking away and leaving him without any explanation is quite impolite. So after 24h he'll be unhappy about that.
On the other hand, "I'm sorry, I can't do that because I don't have time for it. (or whatever)" will be accepted as an apology.
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Novarei
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Posted - 2005.01.26 11:07:00 -
[31]
Not sure if i'm correct but it seemed to me that I got a smaller standing decrease for accepting and then cancelling a mission than I did rejecting a mission outright... Still have to test this.
+--------------------------------------------+
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Kunming
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Posted - 2005.01.26 13:27:00 -
[32]
I agree with JC that its way too harsh. I did a lvl 3 deadspace mission, cleared everything gone back to my agent, he tells me something is missing, I go through the gates again nothing... I lose the bonus (some T2 components), my corp was already impatiently waiting for me, so thinking "What can I lose, the insulting amount of ISK he offers + some standing" I cancel the mission and watch my standing go from 7.39 to 6.8, I'm like "Wow dude if that mission was so important, you should have told me before".
I jump to the petition window but cant remember the name of the mission, tbh its not really a big deal but very annoying when missions get bugged while u'r in a hurry. Sometimes you have to cancel a mission, cause u dont have enough time, its bugged or something else, and the effect on standing is more than just dissapointing.
Intercepting since BETA |
Joshua Calvert
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Posted - 2005.01.26 14:44:00 -
[33]
18 missions later, without rejecting a single one, I have gained my standings back.
Won't be doing THAT again..................
LEEEEERRRRRRRRRRROOOOOOOOOYYYYYYYYYYYYYYY! |
AngelGrinder
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Posted - 2005.01.26 16:02:00 -
[34]
I was doing lvl 4 pirate extravaganza, I started it about 9.30pm in the evening, it reached 12.30 and I had got to the 4th level, killed those rats, and due to my being very tired, I logged off and decided to continue it the next day.
When I logged back on, I found *everything* had respawned, and I'd been shunted all the way back to the first gate. This really annoyed me, I spent 3 hours working on the mission the previous night, to have all that effort reset is just damn annoying - in my frustration I went home and declined the mission - I dropped from 6.8 to 6.2...cant use the agent anymore, really annoying.
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Stregone
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Posted - 2005.01.26 19:30:00 -
[35]
Originally by: AngelGrinder
I was doing lvl 4 pirate extravaganza, I started it about 9.30pm in the evening, it reached 12.30 and I had got to the 4th level, killed those rats, and due to my being very tired, I logged off and decided to continue it the next day.
When I logged back on, I found *everything* had respawned, and I'd been shunted all the way back to the first gate. This really annoyed me, I spent 3 hours working on the mission the previous night, to have all that effort reset is just damn annoying - in my frustration I went home and declined the mission - I dropped from 6.8 to 6.2...cant use the agent anymore, really annoying.
Well, for future reference, missions completely respawn if you leave them active over a DT.
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X'Alor
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Posted - 2005.01.26 22:14:00 -
[36]
Darn I'd hat to get the ganza lvl 4 mission twice and be forced to play for up to 6 hours and yeild 20+ mill in bounties and not to mention loot.
Pity.
As far as standing goes it has not changed one bit from release and has worked the same since.
You guys are so stressed about the agent standing penalty that none of you have probably even cared to check transactions at the corp lvl when that happens to see how much of a derived corp penalty given for the agent of that corp giving a penalty.
All that are upset about Agent standing.......it doesn't do crap for you except to SLIGHTLY ...... ever so slightly increases your effective quality. Your effective quality only has a slight affect on your actual income.
For those of you worried about agent standings.......
Do any of you have negotiations trained to lvl 5 yet??????
you should. one lvl of negotiations trained has a better affect on your agent standings than having an agent at a standing of 9.99.
so at negotions lvl 5 your 5 times better thna an agent at 9.99 without any negotiations trained.
And multiply that by the amounts of rewards at the lvl 4 agent lvl times negotiations lvl 5.....you are talking about the difference of millions of a period of a week if not 10's of millions pending on how active you are.
Agent standing gives you no bonus.
Corp standing allows you to increase your recycling efficiency and yields, your access to R&D agents, and access to agents within that corp. I believe 6.67 corp standing for next to perfect yield recycling and 6.95 to have access to all non R&D agents of that corp up to best available lvl 4's.
Race faction standing above 7.00 allows you access to all non R&D agents of that race no matter what corp it is. With a caldari standing of 7.00 or greater, you can dock at any caldari station and have an agent available and I beielve you get some recycling benefits for high faction standing as well(not sure if it's still that way)
Don't let your agents walk all over you by getting them up to superb standing as it hampers your rebound if you do fail a mission.
Keep your agents in line and respectable and kick them where it hurts....... in their standings
If you keep your agent standing between 6.00 and 8.00 you will be able to more readily decline missions and still be able to bounce back after taking a penalty much faster than someone that has their agent standing at 9.93.
Someone who fails a mission at 9.93 will have to run thousands of misions to make it up.
someone who fails at 7.73 will only have to run maybe a 100.
Agent standing really is next to worthless and has almost no bonus affect for having high standings.
If you do something at agent lvl like fail a mission then the corp also hits you.
do something wrong at the corp lvl....... like wtfpwn a fat convoy outside your mission station for CBD corp. The corp will hit you hard like when the agent fails except at the corp standing lvl and that also gets a main faction hit as well..... the main faction hit can come from corp or from empire....not sure which
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Bolkar
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Posted - 2005.01.27 09:51:00 -
[37]
Originally by: Stregone
Originally by: AngelGrinder
I was doing lvl 4 pirate extravaganza, I started it about 9.30pm in the evening, it reached 12.30 and I had got to the 4th level, killed those rats, and due to my being very tired, I logged off and decided to continue it the next day.
When I logged back on, I found *everything* had respawned, and I'd been shunted all the way back to the first gate. This really annoyed me, I spent 3 hours working on the mission the previous night, to have all that effort reset is just damn annoying - in my frustration I went home and declined the mission - I dropped from 6.8 to 6.2...cant use the agent anymore, really annoying.
Well, for future reference, missions completely respawn if you leave them active over a DT.
They will respawn during the mission objective. I was doing a level 2 Deadspace mission, and using a kessie for fun. On a number of occasions I had to warp out to save my ship, and when I came back at least 1 rat had respwaned, but not the mission objective rats, blood raider spies :)
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Joshua Calvert
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Posted - 2005.02.07 20:44:00 -
[38]
Today, for various reasons, I could not complete a mission which I started yesterday. These reasons were that I have a life and a job.
The mission cost me a negative adjustment to my CN standings of -2.5679%. Not only is this more than 5 times the positive increase of the standings for an average completed mission, the adjustment penalty is made much larger by the way standings are calculated (being an adjustment of the different between your standing and 10 means all increases get smaller over time whereas any decreases get correspondingly larger).
Can I make a suggestion that penalties for failure/declining are adjusted so they are less harsh or that there is some leniency for the odd failure (more frequent failures produce a bigger decrease)?
Either that or make the default time for missions to be accepted/completed to 48/72hrs.
Powergmers are catered to far too much in this game as it is so let's show a bit of leniancy for those who can't play 23/7.
LEEEEERRRRRRRRRRROOOOOOOOOYYYYYYYYYYYYYYY! |
Joshua Calvert
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Posted - 2005.02.09 10:24:00 -
[39]
I'm curious as to why Standings losses can be shared across agents (i.e, cancel 1 lvl 4 missions from 2 different lvl 4 agents within 4 hours and you take a standing penalty) but you have to keep LP's seperate?
LEEEEERRRRRRRRRRROOOOOOOOOYYYYYYYYYYYYYYY! |
MOOstradamus
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Posted - 2005.02.09 12:22:00 -
[40]
Quote:
I'm curious as to why Standings losses can be shared across agents (i.e, cancel 1 lvl 4 missions from 2 different lvl 4 agents within 4 hours and you take a standing penalty)
Never happened to me EVER and I run around 20 agents in only a handful of corps
MOOrovingian  "Following & supporting EVE (since Jan 2001) is like wiping your arse with sandpaper."
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