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Danna Hande	Posted - 2011.01.26 13:41:00 - [1] My friend picked Caldari, i picked Amarr. We are both going to BC¦s skills fast. He is skilling up T2 Heavy missiles for his Drake, i am skilling up T2 Medium laser turret. Oh wait, i wish i could. Because meanwhile for T2 missiles he only needs Standard Missiles III as prequisite, for T2 medium laser turret i need Small Energy Turret V!, than twice small specialization to IV!. What the hell? Why i am forced to train one skill to V and two to IV even if i will never use them? I could understand if i have had to train Small Energy Turret to III as prequisite to T2 Medium, but why V and than two specialization to IV? Yes he need Missiles Launcher V, but the skill helps him for Heavy Missiles as well, meanwhile Small Energy turret V and small specialization to IV are just wasted SP for me :/ (as i was told Amarr sub Cruiser ships suck) Any logical reason?
J1LT	Posted - 2011.01.26 13:49:00 - [2] sorry dude seriously cannot read that wall of text.
Cambarus The Baros Syndicate	Posted - 2011.01.26 13:50:00 - [3] Edited by: Cambarus on 26/01/2011 13:51:16 Missiles and guns are different, as they should be. If he wants to train heavy assault missiles he will need to get another skill up to 5 for t2, whereas you do not. Also gunnery support skills are used by every race, in almost every ship class. Missile support skills are not. EDIT: Originally by: J1LT sorry dude seriously cannot read that wall of text. M8 That's a paragraph. If you can't read that "wall" of text then you must absolutely hate things like books, newspapers, or just about anything with more than 2 sentances strung together in text form >_>
DarkAegix	Posted - 2011.01.26 13:52:00 - [4] Training something like large energy turret gives you both pulses and beams. However, missile users would need to train both cruises and torps.
Ticarus Hellbrandt	Posted - 2011.01.26 13:59:00 - [5] just remember, your guns will hit before his missile, your battleships are better than his.
Pod Amarr	Posted - 2011.01.26 14:19:00 - [6] Read up on the skills pre requisites again He has to train whatever missiles 5 to use the launcher and ammo. So what is the point ? Only difference is that you can pick it without training the tier 1 skill for small to 5 for the small lasers. Pod
Chainsaw Plankton IDLE GUNS IDLE EMPIRE	Posted - 2011.01.26 14:21:00 - [7] unfair, because life is unfair, so deal with it.
Zhilia Mann Tide Way Out Productions	Posted - 2011.01.26 14:23:00 - [8] This comes up on a pretty regular cycle; I'm sure it's well past due at this point. It always comes down to the same thing: missiles and gunnery are different. So on the one side you an train directly for any T2 missile system but have to go through smaller guns to get to T2. On the other hand, you get both gun subtypes but only one missile subtype once you hit T2 for a given size. On the other other hand, missile support skills are slightly higher ranked than gunnery support skills. Oh, and torpedos are a total anomaly; why the hell it's a rank 4 versus every other large weapon system being a rank 5 no one knows. And once all that is out in the open a vocal minority will rally against the iniquities and most people will argue in defense of difference and nothing will change. In the meantime we'll all be shooting one another to the best of our respective abilities and training away just like we would be anyhow.
Seriously Bored Minmatar	Posted - 2011.01.26 14:44:00 - [9] Originally by: Cambarus Originally by: J1LT sorry dude seriously cannot read that wall of text. M8 That's a paragraph. If you can't read that "wall" of text then you must absolutely hate things like books, newspapers, or just about anything with more than 2 sentances strung together in text form >_> ùùùùù Originally by: CCP Big Dumb Object When I nerf something, it takes 2-3 months for your dreams to be crushed.
Mavnas	Posted - 2011.01.26 14:51:00 - [10] Also, the Imperial Navy Slicer is made out of pure awesome and can make good use of those T2 small energy turret skills.
Gypsio III Dirty Filthy Perverts	Posted - 2011.01.26 15:51:00 - [11] If you were to train all subcapitals weapons and support skills, you'd find that the skill queue for missiles is a lot longer than that for guns - but you can start the missile plan at different places. Missiles only really get screwed at the capital level, where they get the worst of both worlds - not only are there two skills for Citadel Cruise and Torps, but training both requires training Torps and Cruise to V, as opposed to the single skill of Large Hybrid/Laser/Projectile Turret. Torps being rank IV is an anomaly to match the one of Standard Missiles being rank II.
Two Shots Caldari GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation	Posted - 2011.01.26 16:52:00 - [12] It's Not Fair Two Shots Goonwaffe *Goonswarm Federation* Official Recruiting Officer
Paikis Blue Republic	Posted - 2011.01.27 03:36:00 - [13] Look on the bright side. You armor tanking skills are alot easier to train for. Lower modifiers and also less skills overall.
Swynet	Posted - 2011.01.27 03:46:00 - [14] Originally by: Paikis Look on the bright side. You armor tanking skills are alot easier to train for. Lower modifiers and also less skills overall. Are you really sure? -I have a caldari mob and gallente one, i don't see where it's a lot easier or less time training, mabe a few hours. And is it realy smart to not train 2 important skills that increase your overall shield and decrease the recharge rate? Every free hit point on your shield either by his capacity or his recharge rate is a won hitpoint without damage to your armor, I agree this is not essencial but your final EHP has a little boost, that little boost can save your ass some times and it costs you 0mods 0cpu 0PG 0Cap so wy not train it?
Korg Leaf Time Bandits.	Posted - 2011.01.27 08:50:00 - [15] Originally by: Swynet Edited by: Swynet on 27/01/2011 03:58:05 Originally by: Paikis Look on the bright side. You armor tanking skills are alot easier to train for. Lower modifiers and also less skills overall. Are you really sure? -I have a caldari mob and gallente one, i don't see where it's a lot easier or less time training, mabe a few hours. And is it realy smart to not train 2 important skills that increase your overall shield and decrease the recharge rate? Every free hit point on your shield either by his capacity or his recharge rate is a won hitpoint without damage to your armor, I agree this is not essencial but your final EHP has a little boost, that little boost can save your ass some times and it costs you 0mods 0cpu 0PG 0Cap so wy not train it? @OP yes gunnery is something you'll hate after a few months of training, yes you've well read me, months, for all beams lvl5 then advanced(T2) to lvl4 - lvl5 is better then pulses to lvl5 then advanced to lvl4 -lvl5 better And don't forget every skill in gunnery related to your guns up to 4, lvl5 OC is better but you can skip for a few time, specialy weapons upgrades to 5 and advanced weapon upgrades to 4 -lvl5 a "must have" when you play Amarr/Gallente While your friend can train exactly what he needs in just a few weeks That missile user will need to get his supports to lvl 4 or 5 as well. He will also need AWU 4 at least as caldari ships are also anaemic on the powergrid front. If you spend months training gunnery skills and he only spends a few weeks on missiles, you will be in much better shape on the damage output front whereas he will have 1 possibly 2 sets of tech 2 missiles and terrible support skills.
James Tiberius Kirk	Posted - 2011.01.27 09:00:00 - [16] Edited by: James Tiberius Kirk on 27/01/2011 09:01:42 On grand scheme of things, when the gunnery pilot reaches T2 BS guns, he will also be able to use any T2 variant of the smaller guns, while missile pilot has to train from scratch twice to be able to use smaller T2 missile. Plus, gunnery support skills are much more valuable than missile skills as the most common weapon system in the whole universe are guns. Key point is the variety. If missiles and guns where identical there wouldn't be any point giving them 2 different names.
Wardeneo Minmatar	Posted - 2011.01.27 10:46:00 - [17] Originally by: Danna Hande My friend picked Caldari, i picked Amarr. We are both going to BC¦s skills fast. He is skilling up T2 Heavy missiles for his Drake, i am skilling up T2 Medium laser turret. Oh wait, i wish i could. Because meanwhile for T2 missiles he only needs Standard Missiles III as prequisite, for T2 medium laser turret i need Small Energy Turret V!, than twice small specialization to IV!. What the hell? Why i am forced to train one skill to V and two to IV even if i will never use them? I could understand if i have had to train Small Energy Turret to III as prequisite to T2 Medium, but why V and than two specialization to IV? Yes he need Missiles Launcher V, but the skill helps him for Heavy Missiles as well, meanwhile Small Energy turret V and small specialization to IV are just wasted SP for me :/ (as i was told Amarr sub Cruiser ships suck) Any logical reason? Guns for Pro's And at least u wont be another puppet to the masses ( /Me Looks Out My Ship Window To See Yet Another Drake Fleet ) *Yes I Like To Fly Ships That Arnt F.O.T.M :) Also You Picked Well - IMO; U Cant Play A Space Game Without Lasers!!! . - Wardeneo - - Elite Forum Ninja -
Wardeneo Minmatar	Posted - 2011.01.27 10:52:00 - [18] Edited by: Wardeneo on 27/01/2011 10:54:22 Originally by: Cambarus Edited by: Cambarus on 26/01/2011 13:51:16 Missiles and guns are different, as they should be. If he wants to train heavy assault missiles he will need to get another skill up to 5 for t2, whereas you do not. Also gunnery support skills are used by every race, in almost every ship class. Missile support skills are not. EDIT: Originally by: J1LT sorry dude seriously cannot read that wall of text. M8 That's a paragraph. If you can't read that "wall" of text then you must absolutely hate things like books, newspapers, or just about anything with more than 2 sentances strung together in text form >_> I LOL'd Originally by: Chainsaw Plankton unfair, because life is unfair, so deal with it. Lol Chill Out :) - U Should Encourage A Fellow Amarrian - After All U Fly Amarr Ships Alot (Especially Amarr BS ^^ ) Originally by: Mavnas Also, the Imperial Navy Slicer is made out of pure awesome and can make good use of those T2 small energy turret skills. Agreed [+1] Originally by: Ticarus Hellbrandt just remember, your guns will hit before his missile, your battleships are better than his. Agreed [+1] . - Wardeneo - - Elite Forum Ninja -
Paikis Blue Republic	Posted - 2011.01.27 11:16:00 - [19] Edited by: Paikis on 27/01/2011 11:17:02 Originally by: Swynet Are you really sure? -I have a caldari mob and gallente one, i don't see where it's a lot easier or less time training, mabe a few hours. And is it realy smart to not train 2 important skills that increase your overall shield and decrease the recharge rate? Every free hit point on your shield either by his capacity or his recharge rate is a won hitpoint without damage to your armor, I agree this is not essencial but your final EHP has a little boost, that little boost can save your ass some times and it costs you 0mods 0cpu 0PG 0Cap so wy not train it? You say every free hitpoint on the shield... it works the same way with every free hitpoint on the armor. I took a look at the number of SP required to get max tanking skills between the two types (not including compensation skills as they're the same) and for max shields (plus mechanic and Hull Upgrades) you will need 2,816,000 SP. For max Armor (plus shield management, shield operation, hull upgrades) it is only 2,048,000 SP. If you don't include the armor/hull skills in a shield tank it comes out to 2,048,000 SP, And if you don't include the shield skills for an armor tanker, it comes out to only 768,000 SP. So yeah, armor tankers get it VERY easy. Especially since shield tankers HAVE to train Hull upgrades and mechanic anyways to get access to rigs and damage controls. I'm not saying you shouldn't train them all... but it is MUCH easier/faster to train the armor skills, and you ont really lose that much tank by not training your shield skills as an armor tanker.. Also, DCs give more benefit to armor than to shields... your shields will melt so fast it's hardly worth training for them, certainly not until after you have T2 guns and T2 armor tank, plus all the cap skills, plus navigation, drones etc etc etc.
M'ktakh	Posted - 2011.01.27 13:06:00 - [20] T2 gun support prerequisite skills useful for: hybrid, lasers, projectile weapons. T2 missile skills useful for: T2 missiles. Its fair.
Doddy Burning Vendetta	Posted - 2011.01.31 03:10:00 - [21] Originally by: Danna Hande meanwhile Small Energy turret V and small specialization to IV are just wasted SP for me :/ (as i was told Amarr sub Cruiser ships suck) Lies! Retribution owns
Joss56 Gallente Unleashed' Fury	Posted - 2011.01.31 17:20:00 - [22] Edited by: Joss56 on 31/01/2011 17:23:11 Originally by: Korg Leaf That missile user will need to get his supports to lvl 4 or 5 as well. He will also need AWU 4 at least as caldari ships are also anaemic on the powergrid front. Yes i agree, where you gain tremendous time is not in those, is just that you can skip any smaller missile to train direcly heavy's or cruise's while in gunnery it's impossible. Let's forget 2sec all the support skills and take only the prerequisites. We can add also all the support then and see those are equivalent. You can't use large rails or blasters T2 without: Small -medium -large railguns lvl5 Small-medium Advanced railguns up to 4 if i want large ones Large hybrid advanced up to 1 to use T2's Small-medium blaster specialisation up to 4 if i want to use T2 large blasters Large blaster specialisation up to 1 Gunnery lvl5 Motion prediction lvl5 Sharpshooter lvl5 While if i want to train cruise T2: Missile loucher operation lvl5 Standart missile 3 Heavy missile 3 Cruise missiles 5 Advanced Cruise missile 1 For HML's it's mutch more easy, so yes it's mutch easy to train missiles even with support skils than Hybrids for example. You can try with evemon, make your self 2plans with target 1 HML's t2 or cruise ones, and then Large rails T2 or T2 blasters Quote: If you spend months training gunnery skills and he only spends a few weeks on missiles, you will be in much better shape on the damage output front whereas he will have 1 possibly 2 sets of tech 2 missiles and terrible support skills. No i don't, we have the same cargo in a BS's sized hull while you need 1500missiles in your cargo to completly clean any world collide lvl4 i'l need close/over 4000 Ammo witch it's a lot of my cargo space. I can't switch my dmg type, i only have the choice between Kinetic/thermal and Kinetic/thermal, while in the same cargo, the missile boat pilot can perfectly carry all dmg type of ammo and swap or mixx the dmg type. HML's fury in a raven for ex it's a full rack of them that output more dmg than i can ever do even if i could put 10railguns in my ship. I wouldn't mind to have a +5% signature radius on my T2 ammo instead of seeing my tracking reduced whereas rails already have tracking problems (aka multiplier 0.45). ________________________________________________ "You do realise you live on a globe, right? And that there places outside the USA/UK?"
Kylira Ulfrinn Blackstaff Logistics	Posted - 2011.01.31 18:22:00 - [23] Yeah but... Look at the Raven then look at the Abaddon. Caldari have no style.
Ansol Gallente Origin Synthetic Industries	Posted - 2011.01.31 18:41:00 - [24] Currently training up T2 Large Projectiles because screw Gallente. I can get behind this thread. It'll take me a vurry long time to get to that Vargur from my Kronos. I wasn't aware that you could just train up T2 Cruises without T2 standards and heavies. All I have to say to this is.. wtf? Golem ftw. The dead remember our silence, The dead remember our indifference.
stoicfaux Gallente	Posted - 2011.01.31 19:59:00 - [25] Yes, it is odd that you can beeline for a specific T2 missile weapon with minimal prerequisites, but that you cannot do so for T2 guns. However, T2 gunnery also gets you T2 small and medium guns. If you train missiles to include T2 standard, heavy, cruise, torps, and TP skills with relevant supports skills to IV, then you have equivalent training times compared to T2 large guns (both short and long ranged, i.e. blasters and railguns.) If you add in T2 rockets and HAMs, then the missile plan takes longer. You might want to wander over to the Assembly Hall forum (player representative forum aka CSM) and the Features and Suggestions forum and bring up the issue. ----- "Are you a sociopathic paranoid schizophrenic with accounting skills? We have the game for you! -- Eve, the game of Alts, Economics, Machiavelli, and PvP"
Cipher Jones Minmatar	Posted - 2011.01.31 21:32:00 - [26] Quote: Because meanwhile for T2 missiles he only needs Standard Missiles III as prequisite Primary Skill required Missile Launcher Operation IV Secondary Skill required Heavy Missile Specialization I Missile Launcher Operation I Heavy Missiles V Missile Launcher Operation III Standard Missiles III
Chainsaw Plankton IDLE GUNS IDLE EMPIRE	Posted - 2011.01.31 22:04:00 - [27] Originally by: Wardeneo Originally by: Chainsaw Plankton unfair, because life is unfair, so deal with it. Lol Chill Out :) - U Should Encourage A Fellow Amarrian - After All U Fly Amarr Ships Alot (Especially Amarr BS ^^ ) Best I had a the time, and come to think of it I don't really have anything better to add. I dealt with it and hey I can use every single t2 turret in game. being awesome is its own reward
Zhilia Mann Tide Way Out Productions	Posted - 2011.01.31 23:18:00 - [28] Originally by: Zhilia Mann This comes up on a pretty regular cycle; I'm sure it's well past due at this point. It always comes down to the same thing: missiles and gunnery are different. So on the one side you an train directly for any T2 missile system but have to go through smaller guns to get to T2. On the other hand, you get both gun subtypes but only one missile subtype once you hit T2 for a given size. On the other other hand, missile support skills are slightly higher ranked than gunnery support skills. Oh, and torpedos are a total anomaly; why the hell it's a rank 4 versus every other large weapon system being a rank 5 no one knows. And once all that is out in the open a vocal minority will rally against the iniquities and most people will argue in defense of difference and nothing will change. In the meantime we'll all be shooting one another to the best of our respective abilities and training away just like we would be anyhow. Sigh.
Songbird	Posted - 2011.02.01 01:28:00 - [29] Liang's tengu gives you 800 dps at 115 km(or w/e your target range is ) with t2 heavies. on top of that you can go directly for the t2 missiles without having to train light missiles or rockets to 5. No - it is not fair. The good news - if it's so unfairly easy to train nothing stops you from training it yourself :) Go for it capsuleer - train that solopwnmissionmobile
Headerman Minmatar Metanoia. Test Alliance Please Ignore	Posted - 2011.02.01 01:41:00 - [30] Originally by: M'ktakh T2 gun support prerequisite skills useful for: hybrid, lasers, projectile weapons. T2 missile skills useful for: T2 missiles. Its fair. This. And in the grand scheme of things, it is ballanced pretty well.
Songbird	Posted - 2011.02.01 02:01:00 - [31] actually prerequisites for t2 missiles give you range, dps ,explosion velocity? , in short they want you to use t2 missiles to their full potential before you are able to equip em, while oth you may never need to use t2 small lasers , yet you will need them if you wanna have t2 mediums. Imagine if you wanted to have that torpedo golem and you had to start your specialization from t2 rockets. That's exactly what every gun user goes through. Every BS tachyon laser user knows how to use small frig size lasers. He most likely would never need em(especially if he's just cross training for fleet amarr battle ships) but he has to go through it.
Mona X Caldari Caldari Provisions	Posted - 2011.02.01 02:34:00 - [32] Originally by: Songbird Imagine if you wanted to have that torpedo golem and you had to start your specialization from t2 rockets. That's exactly what every gun user goes through. Every BS tachyon laser user knows how to use small frig size lasers. He most likely would never need em(especially if he's just cross training for fleet amarr battle ships) but he has to go through it. Now you imagine, that you want to use some Pulses, and now have to train another rank 5 skill. Join Eve-Online, meet interesting people, grief them.
Georn VIRTUAL LIFE VANGUARD Black Star Alliance	Posted - 2011.02.01 03:08:00 - [33] It's fair because guns rule! Instant dmg = instant Gratification You cant' get an instapop with missiles (c; ____________ nerf metagaming, boost fun
Chuc Morris	Posted - 2011.02.01 04:40:00 - [34] Originally by: Georn It's fair because guns rule! Instant dmg = instant Gratification You cant' get an instapop with missiles (c; Nor with any other weapons system other than Arty's
Target Painter Minmatar	Posted - 2011.02.01 04:57:00 - [35] Originally by: Georn You cant' get an instapop with missiles (c; I dunno know about anyone else, but I've had more than one ceptor that turned into a capsule upon meeting my CN Scourge (thanks Strong Crash booster and faction web!).
Sullen Skoung	Posted - 2011.02.01 05:34:00 - [36] Edited by: Sullen Skoung on 01/02/2011 05:35:18 Originally by: Danna Hande Any logical reason? Guns and missiles are different. Sucks later on though... 12D plus to get T2 Heavy missiles and when you just move on to Cruise/Torps on a battleship far faster than that lol Would kinda like them to standardize the lvl IV/lvl V requirements for T2 stuff. Make it all either lvl IV or all lvl V again
Omara Otawan	Posted - 2011.02.01 05:38:00 - [37] On the other hand, missile systems generally dont even require t2 training to be effective, unlike turrets where access to the t2 ammo is mandatory. For day-to-day usage, you'll do just fine with named launchers (apart from the hilariously expensive arbalest HMLs).
Von Kroll Caldari Kroll's Legion	Posted - 2011.02.01 17:10:00 - [38] Originally by: Songbird Liang's tengu gives you 800 dps at 115 km(or w/e your target range is ) with t2 heavies. on top of that you can go directly for the t2 missiles without having to train light missiles or rockets to 5. No - it is not fair. You think you're going to realize that 800 dps in-game with only the prerequisite missile skills for Heavy Missile Spec I? Try training up all missile support skills to V, along with Heavy Missile Spec V and see how that compares to your favorite flavor of T2 medium guns and all applicable Lvl V gun support skils. For example, not counting AWU and, for Minmatar, not counting Controlled Burst at all. There is balance...
Wet Ferret	Posted - 2011.02.01 19:13:00 - [39] Edited by: Wet Ferret on 01/02/2011 19:15:01 Originally by: Von Kroll Originally by: Songbird Liang's tengu gives you 800 dps at 115 km(or w/e your target range is ) with t2 heavies. on top of that you can go directly for the t2 missiles without having to train light missiles or rockets to 5. No - it is not fair. You think you're going to realize that 800 dps in-game with only the prerequisite missile skills for Heavy Missile Spec I? Try training up all missile support skills to V, along with Heavy Missile Spec V and see how that compares to your favorite flavor of T2 medium guns and all applicable Lvl V gun support skils. For example, not counting AWU and, for Minmatar, not counting Controlled Burst at all. There is balance... You forget about the 5% RoF and heavy missile implants, faction damage mods, and nevermind that furies can be speed tanked by a carrier (maybe slight exaggeration).
Haniblecter Teg F.R.E.E. Explorer The Initiative.	Posted - 2011.02.01 19:30:00 - [40] Its part of the balance, besides, he'll have frigate t2 guns whilst you'll have to train for standards still.
Plus 1	Posted - 2011.02.01 19:47:00 - [41] Originally by: Songbird actually prerequisites for t2 missiles give you range, dps ,explosion velocity? , in short they want you to use t2 missiles to their full potential before you are able to equip em, while oth you may never need to use t2 small lasers , yet you will need them if you wanna have t2 mediums. Imagine if you wanted to have that torpedo golem and you had to start your specialization from t2 rockets. That's exactly what every gun user goes through. Every BS tachyon laser user knows how to use small frig size lasers. He most likely would never need em(especially if he's just cross training for fleet amarr battle ships) but he has to go through it. Huh? What missiles have GMP, TNP, bombardment, or projection as pre reqs?
stoicfaux Gallente	Posted - 2011.02.01 19:54:00 - [42] Edited by: stoicfaux on 01/02/2011 19:55:29 Edited by: stoicfaux on 01/02/2011 19:55:03 Originally by: Plus 1 Huh? What missiles have GMP, TNP, bombardment, or projection as pre reqs? T2 Fury missiles if you actually want to hit for more damage than their T1 counterparts. Bombardment and projection are important for torps, and help keep volley counting and defender spam (aka potential DPS loss) to a minimum for non-torps.
Plus 1	Posted - 2011.02.01 20:07:00 - [43] Originally by: stoicfaux Edited by: stoicfaux on 01/02/2011 19:55:29 Edited by: stoicfaux on 01/02/2011 19:55:03 Originally by: Plus 1 Huh? What missiles have GMP, TNP, bombardment, or projection as pre reqs? T2 Fury missiles if you actually want to hit for more damage than their T1 counterparts. Bombardment and projection are important for torps, and help keep volley counting and defender spam (aka potential DPS loss) to a minimum for non-torps. That's not a prerequisite.
stoicfaux Gallente	Posted - 2011.02.01 20:28:00 - [44] Edited by: stoicfaux on 01/02/2011 20:28:16 Originally by: Plus 1 That's not a prerequisite. Never said they were. However, if you want to actually take advantage of T2 ammo or otherwise put out a useful amount of DPS with missiles, then they are "mandatory" skills to train. However, an advantage to missiles is that Cruise and Siege launchers don't require you to train a support skill to level V like Large Turrets do. You can also use TPs or rigs to avoid training the missile support skills to level V (Golem notwithstanding.)
Junkie Babe	Posted - 2011.02.01 20:39:00 - [45] Originally by: Mona X Originally by: Songbird Imagine if you wanted to have that torpedo golem and you had to start your specialization from t2 rockets. That's exactly what every gun user goes through. Every BS tachyon laser user knows how to use small frig size lasers. He most likely would never need em(especially if he's just cross training for fleet amarr battle ships) but he has to go through it. Now you imagine, that you want to use some Pulses, and now have to train another rank 5 skill. What are you on about dude? To Use Large Mega Pulse II Small Energy Turret 5 Small Laser Pulse Spec 4 Medium Energy Turret 5 Medium Laser Pulse Spec 4 Large Energy Turret 5 Large Laser Pulse Spec 1 And you also need Gunnery 5 Motion Prediction 5 So yes you do need other things other than the lasers skills to use T2 varients
Plus 1	Posted - 2011.02.01 20:49:00 - [46] Originally by: stoicfaux Never said they were. The poster I replied to did. Anyway, the big difference between guns and missiles is that missiles are really a secondary weapon in the game. Sure, Caldari lean toward them, but hybrid ships are a big chunk of their lineup. This is like comparing guns to drones.
Omara Otawan	Posted - 2011.02.01 21:11:00 - [47] Originally by: Junkie Babe And you also need Gunnery 5 Motion Prediction 5 So yes you do need other things other than the lasers skills to use T2 varients Dont forget - sharpshooter - rapid firing - surgical strike - controlled bursts (for the cap using turrets) - trajectory analysis (for projectiles + blasters)
Cipher Jones Minmatar	Posted - 2011.02.01 23:01:00 - [48] Originally by: Chuc Morris Originally by: Georn It's fair because guns rule! Instant dmg = instant Gratification You cant' get an instapop with missiles (c; Nor with any other weapons system other than Arty's You mean projectiles. AC's can do it too.
Shoa Jinn	Posted - 2011.02.01 23:54:00 - [49] Originally by: Cipher Jones Originally by: Chuc Morris Originally by: Georn It's fair because guns rule! Instant dmg = instant Gratification You cant' get an instapop with missiles (c; Nor with any other weapons system other than Arty's You mean projectiles. AC's can do it too. So can tachs.
Omara Otawan	Posted - 2011.02.01 23:54:00 - [50] Originally by: Shoa Jinn Originally by: Cipher Jones Originally by: Chuc Morris Originally by: Georn It's fair because guns rule! Instant dmg = instant Gratification You cant' get an instapop with missiles (c; Nor with any other weapons system other than Arty's You mean projectiles. AC's can do it too. So can tachs. And blasters

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