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PI in high sec - 24m isk/hour or a PLEX per character per month

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Princess Strawberry	Posted - 2011.02.08 14:02:00 - [1] Been experimenting a bit with the new PI, and in high sec space it seems quite possible to make 2m isk per planet per day, and with 6 planets on a character that makes for 360m isk a month, or enough for one PLEX. More detail in my blog. My own "best performing" planet makes 2.8m isk/day, so reaching an average of 2m isk/day across all my planets seems a very achieveable goal. At the moment I'm largely producing P1 on each planet (including the "best" planet) and that minimises the hauling and thus the amount of effort. Seems like I need to empty each planet every other day, using 24h cycles. So I reckon I spend an average of half an hour a day on each character just to set up new cycles, shift extractor heads and haul. The initial setup took longer of course but that's a one off time sink, although clearly I'm going to have to swap around a few planets to reach an average of 2m/planet/day since some are as low as 1.5m/day right now. So I suppose once it is all running smoothly, 15 hours to make 360m works out at 24m isk/hour, actually not a million miles away from running L4 missions. It doesn't scale in the same way though - I won't get more than 360m a month per character doing PI whereas I can do as many L4 missions as I want. Very interested to know what results others are achieving. -------------------------------- http://eveonomics.blogspot.com/
Invictra Atreides Caldari	Posted - 2011.02.08 17:54:00 - [2] Is that for the highest profitable item ? The same method used in a WH does give from 1 bil to 1,5 bil per month. I belive ur numbers are possible in high sec. ≡√≡ ≡√≡
Lain Umi	Posted - 2011.02.08 18:34:00 - [3] right now im gettin 10mill a day from 4 planets in low sec, producing transmitters. this is a 0.4 system, so the planets arent too great. once i start up another alt in a 0.2 system, i should be making about 25mill/day which would essentially eliminate the need for the L4 grind for me. in any case, with 2 alts, i'll have enough for plex and a few T2 ships each month =)
trjcquee	Posted - 2011.02.08 18:44:00 - [4] The "delightful" Princess Strawberry LOL. Not a very attractive toon, she could use a few beauty tips from Invictra there (although Invictra looks like she could use a bath).
Princess Strawberry	Posted - 2011.02.08 18:48:00 - [5] Originally by: Invictra Atreides Is that for the highest profitable item ? The same method used in a WH does give from 1 bil to 1,5 bil per month. I belive ur numbers are possible in high sec. That puts a wormhole at about 3x to 5x better than high sec space, if that's the output from 12 planets. Or is that per planet? So just to explain, I'm trying out a few different products right now. My most productive planet is producing about 2.8 million isk per day (84m per month). I think it is very realistic that after some further tweaking I'd reach a reliable, consistent 2m/day average across all my planets, so 12m/day from 6 planets, which is about equivalent to a PLEX per character per month. -------------------------------- http://eveonomics.blogspot.com/
Princess Strawberry	Posted - 2011.02.08 19:00:00 - [6] Originally by: Lain Umi right now im gettin 10mill a day from 4 planets in low sec, producing transmitters. this is a 0.4 system, so the planets arent too great. once i start up another alt in a 0.2 system, i should be making about 25mill/day Nice. So that puts even 0.4 low sec about 4x better than high sec, and you expect doubling that or more from lower security systems. That sounds like a decent estimate - for the record I am using three high sec systems, I think all are 0.6 security. -------------------------------- http://eveonomics.blogspot.com/
Zircalla	Posted - 2011.02.08 19:02:00 - [7] Edited by: Zircalla on 08/02/2011 19:02:31 I have not done much hi-sec PI (a little processing, that is it), but in a wh, I typically run 3- to 4-day runs, averaging maybe 40-50 thousand units of P0 per hour per planet. It varies, as some planets are still going to P2, whereas some of the P1 only planets do two P1s and some do two. In any case, the p1s probably average about 450 isk per unit? I don't really keep up, since I produce multiple P1s and process them up to P2 and P3, but assuming you didn't, you are getting 450 isk per P1 x (45,000/6,000*40) P1 units/P0 unit x 24 hours per day, or 3.25 mil per day per planet. With 5 planets, that is just over 16 mil per day or 486 mil per month. I use the 6th planet to process and add about 20-25% to the p1 value, so somewhere in the 550 mil+ range. There are POS costs, but since we share that cost as a corp, it is pretty minimal (a bit of logistics for the ice product is more of an issue). I could probably crank up the P0/P1 production significantly if I felt like spending more time on shorter cycles/faster depletion instead of the 3/4 day times and pretty muted depletion (very little moving required).
Lain Umi	Posted - 2011.02.08 21:26:00 - [8] Originally by: Princess Strawberry Edited by: Princess Strawberry on 08/02/2011 19:14:57 Originally by: Lain Umi right now im gettin 10mill a day from 4 planets in low sec, producing transmitters. this is a 0.4 system, so the planets arent too great. once i start up another alt in a 0.2 system, i should be making about 25mill/day Edit: I misunderstood slightly... So that puts even 0.4 low sec only a bit better than high sec (your average of 2.5m/day versus about 2m a day I think is going to be the high sec maximum but I do admit I haven't reached that yet), and you expect doubling that or more from lower security systems. That sounds like a decent estimate - for the record I am using three high sec systems, I think all are 0.6 security. i dont think i'll double it. i was actually stating the total from the 2 alts' profits, or at least what i think they'll be. with 5 planets, i dont think you can go much higher than 15-ish mill a day producing the best selling P2 good. P3 might be a different story. but yeah you'll be surprised...if you can find a quiet 0.1-0.3 system you'll be good. the difference is huge between 0.1 and 0.4. i snuck into 0.0 the other day, and i didnt notice much of a difference between 0.0 planets and the adjacent 0.1 planets.
Thenoran Caldari Tranquility Industries	Posted - 2011.02.09 09:18:00 - [9] Originally by: Lain Umi Originally by: Princess Strawberry Edited by: Princess Strawberry on 08/02/2011 19:14:57 Originally by: Lain Umi right now im gettin 10mill a day from 4 planets in low sec, producing transmitters. this is a 0.4 system, so the planets arent too great. once i start up another alt in a 0.2 system, i should be making about 25mill/day Edit: I misunderstood slightly... So that puts even 0.4 low sec only a bit better than high sec (your average of 2.5m/day versus about 2m a day I think is going to be the high sec maximum but I do admit I haven't reached that yet), and you expect doubling that or more from lower security systems. That sounds like a decent estimate - for the record I am using three high sec systems, I think all are 0.6 security. i dont think i'll double it. i was actually stating the total from the 2 alts' profits, or at least what i think they'll be. with 5 planets, i dont think you can go much higher than 15-ish mill a day producing the best selling P2 good. P3 might be a different story. but yeah you'll be surprised...if you can find a quiet 0.1-0.3 system you'll be good. the difference is huge between 0.1 and 0.4. i snuck into 0.0 the other day, and i didnt notice much of a difference between 0.0 planets and the adjacent 0.1 planets. Hauling may be a little hazardous though, luckily I have a Blockade Runner for that, I'll see about going lower than 0.4 systems. ------------------------ Low-sec is like sailing along the coast of Somalia...
Terghon Tu Amarr DarkNet Node Fanaticus	Posted - 2011.02.10 01:54:00 - [10] I have six planets in a 0.5 system producing two different POS fuels (Coolant and Mechanical Parts). I use lazy 3-day cycles and only move my ECU heads if needed (going from two to three day cycles seems to keep me under the depletion limits). I spend about 15 minutes every 3 days to manage this setup and another 15 minutes once a month to haul the finished stuff to station. With this fairly lazy approach I get about 120M per month. That's 4M/day for six planets, or 667k per planet per day. Much less than I get from running L4 missions (which I actually enjoy doing) but still a respectable hunk of the cost of my monthly PLEX for the account. If you figure out the isk/hour using my average time spent, it's in the very respectable neighborhood of 40M/hour. ---------- The right to do something doesn't make doing it right.

Princess Strawberry	Posted - 2011.02.10 22:18:00 - [11] Thanks for the extra info, added it to the first post with the other results. FYI I'm running 24h cycles myself, depletion is definitely a factor though even on 24h cycles so I think for the "lazy" approach your longer cycles help minimize the amount of work you have to do.n Going to experiment a bit on cycle length myself and will post results. -------------------------------- http://eveonomics.blogspot.com/
Marac Factar Gallente Hypergolic	Posted - 2011.02.10 22:30:00 - [12] Edited by: Marac Factar on 10/02/2011 22:31:19 I make just slightly less than 20M/day in WH space per character.
Terghon Tu Amarr DarkNet Node Fanaticus	Posted - 2011.02.11 06:24:00 - [13] I'm curious as to the various setups being used. I'll start. On each planet I extract two different P0 materials, create two different P1 materials from them and, also on site, create a single P2 product from those. Example: Barren planets: Extract Base Metals and Noble Metals. Produce Reactive Metals from Base Metals and Precious Metals from Noble Metals. Produce Mechanical Parts from Reactive Metals and Precious Metals. Export and sell Mechanical Parts My setup is one ECU for each resource. The rare one (Noble metals in this case) usually gets all 10 heads. The more common one (Base Metals) gets 5 or 6. Each ECU routes through the launchpad to two different Basic Industry pins per material. Those four (2 pins x 2 materials) route to an Advanced Industry pin which routes back to the launchpad. Now the key is I can do this while a bazillion jumps away. In fact, I'm missioning about 20 jumps away most of the time. When I need to collect the finished products I either fly over or jump clone to that system. Otherwise, I don't need to be anywhere nearby. Setups that have me extracting resources on one planet and transporting them somewhere else to be manufactured would mean I'd need to be in the system at least once per extraction program cycle (currently 3 days, but most of you seem to be operating on 1-day cycles). So how is everyone else set up? Are low and null-sec/WH setups markedly different? ---------- The right to do something doesn't make doing it right.
Jason Farstrider	Posted - 2011.02.11 09:36:00 - [14] Edited by: Jason Farstrider on 11/02/2011 09:41:26 Originally by: Terghon Tu So how is everyone else set up? Are low and null-sec/WH setups markedly different? For Hi-Sec yeah, ECU(10), ECU(3-5), 4xBIS, 2xAIS, 1xLP seems pretty standard, with the trick being to balance the extraction of the two materials as closely as possible. On a better planet, you'd expect to see fewer heads and more processors. On the best planets you might be able to put a single ECU covering hotspots for both P0s and extract them on alternate cycles while still keeping all your processors running. I think 2.5M per planet per day in hi-sec is optimistic, however 1.5M per planet per day is trivial. That means two characters with CCU4 + IPC4 + RS1 can basically fund an account with near zero effort. I doubt that's sustainable.
Princess Strawberry	Posted - 2011.02.11 12:40:00 - [15] Originally by: Jason Farstrider For Hi-Sec yeah, ECU(10), ECU(3-5), 4xBIS, 2xAIS, 1xLP seems pretty standard, with the trick being to balance the extraction of the two materials as closely as possible. That's how most of my planets are set up right now, and it's how I tend to start out on a planet before optimising. I am experimenting a bit with other setups as well but that seems best so far. The most productive planet actually has 2 ECUs, 6 basic and 3 advanced processors. I seem to have discovered a pretty good planet/spot on that planet and there is enough material to keep those 3 advanced running consistently, and for 10 days solidly now so depletion hasn't been a problem there so far (unlike some of my other planets). That is the one that produces 2.8m isk per day at current market prices for the P2 it produces. There really is obviously a fair bit of variety in high sec - all of mine are in 0.6 systems but all the others only have 2 advanced and the average for them is more like 1.7m isk per day right now. -------------------------------- http://eveonomics.blogspot.com/
tpwh21	Posted - 2011.02.11 12:40:00 - [16] with my best current efforts with 4/4/4/4 PI skills running 24 hr cycles in wh space i am making 3.1m per planet in using p0-->p1 p1-->p3 factory planet. i am making 3.3m per planet using p0-->p2 on planet. Basically - i am not running the p0-->p1 planets to max efficiency. would make around 4.1m per planet if running at 100% efficiency - with current p2/p3 prices. However the depletion mechanics make running at anywhere close to 100% efficiency impossible. I have completely rebuilt my planetary installations 2X now. Depletion really eats time - chasing the difference between lowest possible yield on a ****ty resource- using as p0-->p2 on single planet strategy (2.5m per planet per day) and p1-->factory planet 4.1m per day - is just (for me) not worth the 3x the amount of time the more efficient strategy will take. The days of being able to earn a nice easy passive income from PI are over. depletion really eats time, for me at least. It is either take around a 30% hit on old yields and run a passive strategy or make fractionally more for a lot more time.... I am now looking for ways to make more from PI using less time - probably means moving WH - and trying to make a finished product in WH... or just hauling the most valuable P1 straight to jita.
Jason Farstrider	Posted - 2011.02.11 16:30:00 - [17] Edited by: Jason Farstrider on 11/02/2011 16:36:07 Originally by: Princess Strawberry The most productive planet actually has 2 ECUs, 6 basic and 3 advanced processors. You've got a hi-sec planet supporting 3 AIFs? Lucky you! That's the thing, though: Even at 5k ISK per unit you only need ~20 AIFs to make a PLEX every month. Doesn't sound so hard... Originally by: tpwh21 I am now looking for ways to make more from PI using less time - probably means moving WH - and trying to make a finished product in WH... or just hauling the most valuable P1 straight to jita. The trick I'm finding is it doesn't really matter if you're nowhere near 100% efficiency. Try the following:- Drop a processor so you can make longer links to your ECUs. That way when you deplete a hotspot, you just need to rebuild the ECU and route to the launchpad. Converting to P2 on-world should let you haul less often, even if you use one ECU and alternate what P0 it's pulling Longer cycles cause less depletion, and also mean you don't have to babysit them as often Really, you can get 80% of the output with 20% of the effort... For the record, I'm making 1.5m per planet per day in 0.7 with pretty much no micromanagement.
Nhi'Khuna Sandman Inc.	Posted - 2011.02.11 18:04:00 - [18] Hi Folks, Thought I'd chime in here. With fully upgraded Command Centres on 6 planets I am producing a little less than 495 million ISK per month in a C2 W-hole system. I'm producing a range of P2 products. If I were producing just Transmitters as I had been in 0.0 one could increase that amount to almost 713mil ISK/Month which I feel is a decent profit for passive production. These are on 24/48 hour cycles requiring emptying about every 3-4 days or so. Generally my colonies can be built with two ECUs running between 3-4 heads each, upgraded pipelines to the launchpad. Around the launchpad I have 6 Basic Processors and 3 advanced. Pretty standard layout I think. Each colony runs around 8.5mil ISK to fully setup.
sinamrali	Posted - 2011.02.11 18:30:00 - [19] I'm producing POS fuels on two accounts with both characters trained to Level 4 on Consolidation and CC upgrades. I have a surplus of fuels right now but just got my first taste of the high depletion rates so that might change. I'm in high sec. I'm just wondering if it's even worth it to take the skills up to Level 5, which is 20 days each skill. I know Dust is on the horizon at some point and I'm not sure what's exactly involved with that but I think it's paying console players to defend your PI installations? Just wouldn't want to regret training all these skills just to abandon PI in the end. But for short term, could Level 5 on each skill make a huge difference to be worthwhile?
Nhi'Khuna Sandman Inc.	Posted - 2011.02.11 18:39:00 - [20] My thought on Dust is great concept but the console players are notoriously short-lived in their attention spans. I see that impacting PI markets in a very short-term basis where we'd see some crazy stuff like colonies exploding, etc etc... But eventually i think all activity would drop off. It's not as if Dust is going to be the next Halo, IMHO. I wish it was, but I have my doubts.

Zircalla	Posted - 2011.02.11 18:42:00 - [21] Quote: If I were producing just Transmitters as I had been in 0.0 one could increase that amount to almost 713mil ISK/Month Unfortunately, we are in a wh too, and transmitters (while selling for high isk) are worth less then the P1 required to build them. Hauling sucks, but taking a significant hit to bottom line, sucks, too....
Nhi'Khuna Sandman Inc.	Posted - 2011.02.11 19:10:00 - [22] Originally by: Zircalla Quote: If I were producing just Transmitters as I had been in 0.0 one could increase that amount to almost 713mil ISK/Month Unfortunately, we are in a wh too, and transmitters (while selling for high isk) are worth less then the P1 required to build them. Hauling sucks, but taking a significant hit to bottom line, sucks, too.... I completely agree. When I was looking at the numbers I decided that ease and convenience were factors I was willing to sacrifice profit for. Gotta enjoy what we're doing, right? Otherwise that interactive screen saver of a game we love so much becomes a second job. ;)
Princess Strawberry	Posted - 2011.02.12 01:42:00 - [23] Originally by: Nhi'Khuna I completely agree. When I was looking at the numbers I decided that ease and convenience were factors I was willing to sacrifice profit for. Gotta enjoy what we're doing, right? Otherwise that interactive screen saver of a game we love so much becomes a second job. ;) Sounds like the people in WH space are ending up paying what amounts to a "shipping charge" - going to slightly less profitable but easier to haul P2 or P3. If the planets are more productive (which they certainly seem to be from the results so far) are you doing things like (for example) rotating ECUs on something like say, a plasma planet to produce P3 such as robotics on a single planet and avoid a "double whammy" of import/export taxes as well? Might almost be an idea to create P3 or P4 to haul less often. Reminds me a bit of when people in 0.0 used to make particular modules which took up less space than the equvalent minerals. http://wiki.eveonline.com/en/wiki/Mineral_Compression Shame you can't do the same with PI goods - reprocess them and go back to the constituent P1 or P0 once the hauling's done. -------------------------------- http://eveonomics.blogspot.com/
Ptifinay	Posted - 2011.04.14 12:53:00 - [24] Over the last month, I averaged about 9M per day per planet, and have 10 planets that I manage with level 4/5 ccu/ic in highsec. It requires twice a day maintenence of about 2 hours per session, for 4 game hours per day, and this includes freight time. I do not extract. This makes for a rate of 22.5M per hour of gameplay time, which isn't bad for highsec. PI is my primary game activity.
Ana Vyr	Posted - 2011.04.14 14:56:00 - [25] Edited by: Ana Vyr on 14/04/2011 15:00:05 I have 2 characters, both 5/5, doing PI in a 0.5 system. So that's 12 planets with elite command centres. I'm supporting a small POS with fuel from this operation. I extract on a 23.75 hour cycle time. I'm getting about 90 million a week from the components I do sell (P2 stuff like rocket fuel, supertensile plastics and so on)...so approximately 360 million a month.
Cergorach Amarr The Helix Foundation	Posted - 2011.04.14 20:46:00 - [26] In High-sec the profit is anywhere from 2.5M/planet/day to 5M+/planet day, but with around a 20M/planet/day investment, very dependent on prices of the products involved (these are pure factory planets). In low-sec the best profit is around 3.6M+/planet/day to around 2.6M/planet/day. Investment is only 2-3M/planet/day, a lot more stable because I'm not purely refining a product, I'm also delving a product.
Anodod	Posted - 2011.04.14 22:55:00 - [27] Technically on my one high sec planet I make about 16 million per day refining the planetpoo I have coming from low sec. Overall I make 3.6 mil/planet/day, essentially from .1 security systems. Total profit per month is around 1.2 bil, with about 20-25 hours per month of time invested. Gives me about 48 mil/hour spent in game. Required a significant amount of set up, though.
Chong Woon	Posted - 2011.04.15 02:16:00 - [28] My own setup produces around 500 mil a month (this based on a Jita buy order prices) on 10 planets with 2 chars both with max command center. I use a variation of the factory world supply chain and all of the production is done on .1 systems. (p2 and p3) So doing the math it's around 8 mil per day for me if I factor in the alt.
Satchils	Posted - 2011.04.15 03:32:00 - [29] I make about 1.4m a day using 3 P1 processors and 2 12 hour cycles. i think the planet is in .4 space. they are producing precious metals on a plasma planet
STONED OPERATOR	Posted - 2011.04.15 08:30:00 - [30] At least 600mil a month on one account, for doing P3 out of P2 products based on jita prices. Check this thread for the HINT: http://www.eveonline.com/ingameboard.asp?a=topic&threadID=1492598&page=1

Lutz Major	Posted - 2011.04.15 09:12:00 - [31] Edited by: Lutz Major on 15/04/2011 09:18:12 Originally by: STONED OPERATOR At least 600mil a month on one account, for doing P3 out of P2 products based on jita prices. Check this thread for the HINT: http://www.eveonline.com/ingameboard.asp?a=topic&threadID=1492598&page=1 I doubt that. If you really make Robotics based on Jita you do somewhere around ~ 180M per month: Sell price for Robotics (per cycle): 3x ISK 56,076.23 Buy price for Mechanical Parts (per cycle): 10x ISK 7,009.19 Buy price for Consumer Electronics (per cycle): 10x ISK 7,950.35 Total sell value for one cycle: ISK 168,228.69 Total buy value for one cycle: ISK 149,595.40 Profit per cycle: ISK 18,633.29 One cycle is 1 hour, so 672 cycles per four weeks: ISK 12,521,570.88 672 cycles * 3 characters * 5 planets: ISK 187,823,563.20 profit Re-evaluate your math! Edit: ah ... forgot, that you can have more than one advanced factory on a planet ... haven't done the new PI yet. Forget about my skepticism
Wilddragon25	Posted - 2011.04.15 10:42:00 - [32] I run PI on roughly 25 planets, I do P0 to p1 on planet, the export to another to do P2 then export to anoter for P3 and so on to p4, then build control towers, am I one of the few who does this, nets me about 700 mill a month plus produces enough extra fuel to fuel a large tower.
Potato IQ	Posted - 2011.04.15 13:18:00 - [33] Edited by: Potato IQ on 15/04/2011 13:20:13 Originally by: Wilddragon25 I run PI on roughly 25 planets, I do P0 to p1 on planet, the export to another to do P2 then export to anoter for P3 and so on to p4, then build control towers, am I one of the few who does this, nets me about 700 mill a month plus produces enough extra fuel to fuel a large tower. That is surely low for that many planets? I'm new at it and still gathering weekly output data and adding the lvl 5 skills for grid, but a conservative estimate at the moment is app. 75m per week for 5 plants on each pilot, so combined for the month is 600m on 10 planets Edit: My bad. Just noticed the HS bit in the title


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