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Tia Aristoi
Caldari
School of Applied Knowledge
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Posted - 2011.03.07 20:19:00 -
[1]
The way combat is presented in EvE makes me feel like I'm flying a spreadsheet and not a ship in space.
One of the things that originally attracted me to EvE were the trailers featuring what I thought were these amazing ingame battles. I haven't found them. When I go into combat I'm looking at little read dots on my HUD. The ships themselves are often so distant I can't even see them in the space around me. Changing the camera view doesn't seem to help much. In combat all I really do is change targets when the little red dots disappear, pop a ability occassionally, and reload my guns. Nothing at all cinematic about the experience.
When I do see ships up close (like my own) they don't turn smoothly, but seem to swivel about almost frantically. There's almost no sense that ships have mass. It gets worse when I have set my ship to approach another target. I pass through the target, turn instantly, and bounce back like I'm a yo-yo. It's like my ship is on a string.
It would be nice if ships turned a bit more slowly and alot more smoothly...and were set so when auto-approaching a target your autopilot slows and turns the ship to avoid passing through it.
Anyway, just wondering if anybody feels the same?
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Tippex 1st
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Posted - 2011.03.07 20:24:00 -
[2]
Yes but cool stuff like that wont heappen because of :lag: in the "epic fleet battles" Ö that a whopping 3% of the playerbase participate in. Sorry bro, no cool stuff for us :/
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Tia Aristoi
Caldari
School of Applied Knowledge
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Posted - 2011.03.07 20:26:00 -
[3]
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Blacksquirrel
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Posted - 2011.03.07 20:31:00 -
[4]
Yeah dice rolls for anything is not as fun as actual skill, but what are you gonna do?
And combat is a bit "clunky". I think voice commands for ships would be cool like endwar, but other than that system is pretty ingrained.
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Teranul
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Posted - 2011.03.07 20:33:00 -
[5]
Edited by: Teranul on 07/03/2011 20:35:25
What class of ship are you flying? How long have you been playing?
Are you familiar with the concepts of optimal range, accuracy falloff, tracking speed, explosion velocity, explosion radius, and transversal/angular velocity?
The game works better when you understand the concepts behind the combat and exactly just how flergin' huge these ships actually get, IMO.
 Originally by: Blacksquirrel
Yeah dice rolls for anything is not as fun as actual skill, but what are you gonna do?
Something else people have to realize is that ships of the class you are flying cannot be piloted with a joystick properly. They're ginormous ships, waaay bigger than our seaborne vessels ever will be.
The way they are piloted in game is also the most realistic method of controlling a ship with a crew in the dozens, hundreds, or thousands (battleship class+).
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Zirse
Minmatar
ZED Industries
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Posted - 2011.03.07 20:36:00 -
[6]
Move to lowsec/nullsec and actually PvP, instead of running missions.
Running missions is NOT fun, nor is it EVE combat.
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Xercodo
Amarr
Daj'Juntar
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Posted - 2011.03.07 20:37:00 -
[7]
try doing L4s with a AC cane, get up in their face, orbiting, torpedoes going on on your hull, the ching-ching-ching of the 425s......ahhhhh
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The drake is a lie
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Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
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Posted - 2011.03.07 20:37:00 -
[8]
Well, yeah.
Engagement ranges tend to be in the 20û100km range these days. Just think how long it takes to drive that far!
à
sorryà 
ùùù
ôIf you're not willing to fight for what you have in ≡v≡à
you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.ö
ù Karath Piki |
FeralShadow
RipStar Mining Industries
United Front Alliance
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Posted - 2011.03.07 20:47:00 -
[9]
Yeah... Like someone said missions is zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz boring, and not at all cinematic like you say. Actual large scale fleet fights can get pretty freakin epic. Even if you only see dots, LOTS of those dots all shooting missiles and lasers and rail guns, well.. then you get what looks like a small swarm in the distance firing death at you. Much more fun. And then add in the capitals doing their thing while you're zooming around in an interceptor. tbh the most fun i've ever had in fleet fights was zooming around in interceptors while the battleship fleets slugged it out.
_______________________________________________
"If you want to taste the ground, feel free to attack." - Kenshin Himura
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Tia Aristoi
Caldari
School of Applied Knowledge
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Posted - 2011.03.07 20:48:00 -
[10]
Edited by: Tia Aristoi on 07/03/2011 20:49:45
Yeah I guess the main issues I have are:
1. Engagement ranges. Why do they have to be so big? Would anyone object if they were shortened?
2. Awkward ship movement and interaction between objects
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Feligast
Minmatar
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
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Posted - 2011.03.07 20:52:00 -
[11]
Originally by: Tia Aristoi
Yeah I guess the main issues I have are:
1. Engagement ranges. Why do they have to be so big? Would anyone object if they were shortened?
2. Awkward ship movement and interaction
1. Absolutely yes. The closer the engagement range, the higher the transversal and angular velocities, making larger weapon tracking far more difficult. Unless you want to rewrite the entire combat system code, the engagement ranges are fine.
2. As opposed to what? flying a space fighter? A hurricane is a half a kilometer long, a quarter mile. How graceful do you think it's going to be? As for your dislike of the approach function, I can see that. But by asking the ship to slow and turn before contact, you're taking away bumping as a tactic.
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Teranul
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Posted - 2011.03.07 20:54:00 -
[12]
Engagement range is determined by the combat situation.
In most missions you do NOT want to be smack dab in the middle of all the rats taking fire from everything in the room simultaneously, so you're going to wait to fight from a great distance.
Likewise, in PvP you want to pick the weapon most optimal for your most likely engagement range. You don't stick blasters on a BS, for example, because chances are fairly high your target(s) will be fighting at longer engagement ranges and blasters are only good if you're at point-blank range on a tackled target (and with BS speed, that's a pretty big liability).
That being said, you can choose to fight at close-to-point-blank ranges if you want to. You'd just have to deal with the consequences of doing so.
Physics, on the other hand, I agree with wholeheartedly... but they're simplified the way they are because physics are calculated server-side. Even the basic form of spaceship physics we have now is pretty taxing on the hardware.
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Blacksquirrel
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Posted - 2011.03.07 20:56:00 -
[13]
Quote:
Something else people have to realize is that ships of the class you are flying cannot be piloted with a joystick properly. They're ginormous ships, waaay bigger than our seaborne vessels ever will be.
The way they are piloted in game is also the most realistic method of controlling a ship with a crew in the dozens, hundreds, or thousands (battleship class+).
Yes and this a video game... And i've yet to see it sold as "space ship simulation" Furthermore ships today are in fact piloted by a joystick or wheel... Done via a fellow called a helmsman... or in the case of a subs and other ships 2-3. And
Dice rolling still not as good of system as skill You can make the argument of "well your gunners suck" or "Lucky shots" but a hit is still up to the computer rather than actions I take or the other person EG: I roll or dodge to avoid fire, I target specifics on their ship... etc etc.
I understand why this is impossible in eve (Though specific system targeting could be implemented) doesn't mean I have to be a fan of it.
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Teranul
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Posted - 2011.03.07 21:04:00 -
[14]
Originally by: Blacksquirrel
Yes and this a video game... And i've yet to see it sold as "space ship simulation" Furthermore ships today are in fact piloted by a joystick or wheel... Done via a fellow called a helmsman... or in the case of a subs and other ships 2-3.
And this is an awfully inefficient mechanism that would be blatantly inferior in a fully 3D environment like deep space to a single individual mentally controlling the ship and using other objects in space as points of reference to determine engagement ranges and movement patterns.
RL examples really don't work very well here...
Originally by: Blacksquirrel
Dice rolling still not as good of system as skill You can make the argument of "well your gunners suck" or "Lucky shots" but a hit is still up to the computer rather than actions I take or the other person EG: I roll or dodge to avoid fire, I target specifics on their ship... etc etc.
Your ship is controlled by your character... who is mentally linked to the ship and controls it like they control their own body.
Believe it or not, it is still a role-playing game, not a dogfighting action game or any other thing people want it to be despite it most definitely never, ever being advertised as such. (Not to mention trying to shoot people across kilometers of distance manually would be a friggin' nightmare. What kinda fun is that?)
Originally by: Blacksquirrel
I understand why this is impossible in eve (Though specific system targeting could be implemented) doesn't mean I have to be a fan of it.
Of course. You're entitled to your opinion. I agree that it is not the most fun or exciting form of combat available, but it is certainly the most realistic.
If you want a game with more fun and exciting one-on-one combat, you can play an offline sci-fi sim, as they're actually designed for it. EVE is simply not that kind of game.
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Tia Aristoi
Caldari
School of Applied Knowledge
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Posted - 2011.03.07 21:09:00 -
[15]
Edited by: Tia Aristoi on 07/03/2011 21:14:13
I'm not asking to fly my ship like its a starfighter with a joystick. Actually it's the opposite.
I would prefer if ships turned more slowly across the board. I would also prefer that they shorten the weapon ranges across the board so I could actually see my enemy. Basically I thought I was going to play a space MMO with amazing space combat similiar to Homeworld. Naive I know but that's what I got from the trailers.
But as folks said this would mean alot of recoding by CCP and could be just plain impossible anyway given the limitations of the server(s). So yeah I can see now how thats not gonna happen. Bummer.
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Teranul
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Posted - 2011.03.07 21:18:00 -
[16]
Like I said before... what ship class are you flying?
I think you'll find battleship+ class ships are very slow-moving huge chunks of metal with obscene levels of power. The change going from frigates to cruiser, and then from cruisers to battlecruisers, and then from battlecruisers to battleships, and even further into capital ships is quite a transformation. If you haven't worked your way up to those classes of ship yet, you should withhold your judgment.
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Tia Aristoi
Caldari
School of Applied Knowledge
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Posted - 2011.03.07 21:28:00 -
[17]
I think I'm in a cruiser. Honestly I'm really bad with names so I can't remember which ship exactly. I'll look at up when I get home.
And I completely believe what you said about the bigger ship classes. I just don't think I've got the stamina to grind though the hours and hours of dull combat to get to that point.
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Zyress
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Posted - 2011.03.07 21:45:00 -
[18]
Edited by: Zyress on 07/03/2011 21:50:16
Originally by: Teranul
Edited by: Teranul on 07/03/2011 20:35:25
What class of ship are you flying? How long have you been playing?
Are you familiar with the concepts of optimal range, accuracy falloff, tracking speed, explosion velocity, explosion radius, and transversal/angular velocity?
The game works better when you understand the concepts behind the combat and exactly just how flergin' huge these ships actually get, IMO.
Originally by: Blacksquirrel
Yeah dice rolls for anything is not as fun as actual skill, but what are you gonna do?
Something else people have to realize is that ships of the class you are flying cannot be piloted with a joystick properly. They're ginormous ships, waaay bigger than our seaborne vessels ever will be.
The way they are piloted in game is also the most realistic method of controlling a ship with a crew in the dozens, hundreds, or thousands (battleship class+).
We could end this whole joystick argument pretty quickly by letting them try it. You try navigating an orbit around an object moving at several hundered meters a second maintaining a range of between say 7 - 8 kms constantly while traveling at several hundered meters a sec yourself, while watching your overview and maintaining situational awareness.
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Aunt margret
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Posted - 2011.03.07 22:20:00 -
[19]
Originally by: Zyress
try navigating an orbit around an object moving at several hundered meters a second maintaining a range of between say 7 - 8 kms constantly while traveling at several hundered meters a sec yourself, while watching your overview and maintaining situational awareness.
Ahh, we have a fan of elite frontier then
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Lady Skank
Ban Evasion inc
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Posted - 2011.03.07 22:39:00 -
[20]
Originally by: Blacksquirrel
Quote:
Something else people have to realize is that ships of the class you are flying cannot be piloted with a joystick properly. They're ginormous ships, waaay bigger than our seaborne vessels ever will be.
The way they are piloted in game is also the most realistic method of controlling a ship with a crew in the dozens, hundreds, or thousands (battleship class+).
Yes and this a video game... And i've yet to see it sold as "space ship simulation" Furthermore ships today are in fact piloted by a joystick or wheel... Done via a fellow called a helmsman... or in the case of a subs and other ships 2-3.
Yes a helmsman controls the heading and speed of a ship but that's all he does in most cases he cant even really see anything at all and is reliant on navigational RADAR operators and visual observers as the eyes and he has nothing at all to do with planning a course or deciding his heading that's all up to the Coxswain and/or the navigator.
Not even counting the multitude of other tasks like weapons operation, tactical RADAR operation and the dozens of other crew stations that need to be manned and not even counting maintenance duties.
The helmsman doesn't sit there pressing buttons operating everything.
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Shiarra Bloom
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Posted - 2011.03.07 22:51:00 -
[21]
Okay looked it up. I'm currently flying a Moa cruiser.
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ivar R'dhak
Minmatar
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Posted - 2011.03.07 23:09:00 -
[22]
Yep OP, you summed up EVE¦s "Battle-engine" in a nutshell.
That¦s why Trek Online was such a revelation to me(even in the current "beta" stage). MMO space battles that are actually fun, have (somewhat) of a line of sight and are more tactical and strategic through the use of different ship energy levels, shield quadrants and "powers".
The only thing that makes EVE battles even remotely exciting is the risk of permanent loss of real value items one the destruction of your ship.
Either learn to love it or move on. I¦m pretty sure the wiggling backsides expansion called Incarna will not solve your problem at all.
BTW, Cognitive Dissonance meet Eve-Fanbois.
Jeez guys. 
______________
Mal-¦Appears we got here just in a nick of time. What does that make us?¦
Zoe-`Big damn heroes, sir.`
Mal-¦Aint we just.¦ |
Boltorano
Fourth Circle
Total Comfort
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Posted - 2011.03.07 23:13:00 -
[23]
Edited by: Boltorano on 07/03/2011 23:16:41
The sad thing is, if engagement ranges were "realistic" in terms of what we could expect from real-world future space combat, we would be attacking each other with missiles and grasers from hundreds of thousands to millions of kilometers away, not 0-350km, while moving at dozens to hundreds of KPS.
It's one of the sacrifices EVE makes for combat to actually be fun.
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Barakkus
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Posted - 2011.03.08 00:33:00 -
[24]
You can get the cinematics you want, you just have to actually do it. Use "look at" and "set focus" or whatever that **** is to keep the camera on your targets and zoom out, play with the camera etc. I do it when I get really bored grinding missions for standings.
Would be nice if you could save some sort of camera settings/behavior so stuff like that would just automatically load instead of having to fool with it all the time. You can get some pretty nice looking action if you want to mess with it.
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[SERVICE] Corp Standings For POS anchoring
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Lady Skank
Ban Evasion inc
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Posted - 2011.03.08 00:47:00 -
[25]
Originally by: Boltorano
Edited by: Boltorano on 07/03/2011 23:16:41
The sad thing is, if engagement ranges were "realistic" in terms of what we could expect from real-world future space combat, we would be attacking each other with missiles and grasers from hundreds of thousands to millions of kilometers away, not 0-350km, while moving at dozens to hundreds of KPS.
It's one of the sacrifices EVE makes for combat to actually be fun.
EVE combat is relatively short ranged, films and TV shows tend to show battles where you can see both sides in one frame mainly for cinematic reasons but generally the harder SF does have battles where opposing fleets are thousands of kilometres apart.
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Kijo Rikki
Caldari
Swarm of Angry Bees
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Posted - 2011.03.08 01:48:00 -
[26]
Edited by: Kijo Rikki on 08/03/2011 01:48:20
I remember the commercials years and years ago on TV. It looked so epic, particularly in one cinematic where two ships were side by side trading blows moving linearly in the same direction towards the screen. I thought, wow, I have got to play that.
Then the reality of it hit.
Of course, being Caldari, I really wouldn't want to see another ship close up, that's usually a bad thing for me!
>
WHILE SIG<AWESOME DO
LOOP
there is no escape from my crappy sig. |
Goose99
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Posted - 2011.03.08 01:48:00 -
[27]
They should bring the nano back.
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Freyja Asynjur
Folkvangr
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Posted - 2011.03.08 01:58:00 -
[28]
Actually, the more you dig into the combat system, the more it reveals its richness. You can go on the test server and learn the ropes by yourself (usually by first losing hundreds of (free) ships). There's much much more than approaching, orbiting, hitting some buttons on an interface.
Once you want to master tracking, damage reduction/optimization, range control and such, the game is suddenly more dynamic. Add to this the massive amount of parameters you have to mentally process once you know how ship X should be used against ship Y depending on circumstances Z, it gets really interesting. Not to talk about micro-management of mods and overloading on some ships.
What, I, I'd like to see is the opposite of what you want : I'd like a real 3D tactical display without any shiny graphics, just informations for a good spatial and velocities visualization.
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Herrring
Amarr
Caldari Internal Revenue Service
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Posted - 2011.03.08 03:31:00 -
[29]
Yeah thats what i thought tooo.
But eve combat(pvp wise at least) is a lot more than orbit + lock target and shoot
Alot of it is counter fitting the opponent if possible and your piloting skills, that is if you have similar skill points(which a lot of people say it doesnt matter but it does matter, alot, in small gang pvp.)
The only thing i would like to see in eve combat is the projectiles and laser beams and missiles and such get blocked by collidable objects or other ships.
But it would strain the server too much and probably wont happen in another 2 decades.
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Teranul
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Posted - 2011.03.08 06:32:00 -
[30]
Edited by: Teranul on 08/03/2011 06:32:08
Originally by: Lady Skank
EVE combat is relatively short ranged, films and TV shows tend to show battles where you can see both sides in one frame mainly for cinematic reasons but generally the harder SF does have battles where opposing fleets are thousands of kilometres apart.
This bears repeating.
EVE actually does make some concessions for the sake of gameplay. They just don't go the full monty with obscene engagement ranges and full newtonian physics (which are so much more difficult to grasp than the space-is-like-water physics we have now).
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Rip Marley
Minmatar
Power-Overwhelming
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Posted - 2011.03.08 06:56:00 -
[31]
Originally by: Kijo Rikki
Edited by: Kijo Rikki on 08/03/2011 01:48:20
Of course, being Caldari, I really wouldn't want to see another ship close up, that's usually a bad thing for me!
Then fit torps and crack skulls!
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Hieronimus Rex
Minmatar
Infinitus Sapientia
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Posted - 2011.03.08 06:58:00 -
[32]
EVE is not an FPS space game and never will be. Those are the only games you will ever get a sense of closeness in comebat, because in those games combat is always close - it has to be since in a twitc game you usually have to see your opponent's ship so you can shoot it.
EVE takes the more "realistic" approach - distances in space are vast and if you're lobbing projectiles at a target 100km away of course you won't be able to see them.
I agree though it couldn't hurt to smooth out ship movement.
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Acac Sunflyier
Gallente
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Posted - 2011.03.08 07:01:00 -
[33]
It'd be better if there were more particle effects. If Lasers flared and then dimmed before fading. If missile explosions looked better and actually had their explosion effects flare out in the direction of the impact. Have you ever noticed how shield missiles hit the shield and fly off from front to back even if they hit you on the side?
Frankly, if you're in a battle, there should be cluttered chaos. Its one thing Star Wars III got really right. The space battles were far more epic than here in EVE.
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Niccolado Starwalker
Gallente
Shadow Templars
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Posted - 2011.03.08 07:11:00 -
[34]
Originally by: Tia Aristoi
Anyway, just wondering if anybody feels the same?
nope. The only thing I feel is the adrenaline rush. Plus the anger when I lose and the need to gloat when I win ofcource.
Originally by: Dianabolic
Your tears are absolutely divine, like a fine fine wine, rolling down your cheeks until they flow down the river of LOL. |
Lokaas
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Posted - 2011.03.08 07:27:00 -
[35]
Testify! I quit worrying about PVP because I kept getting stuck in mostly gate camps, station camps or just plain hurry up and wait mechanics. I don't have the time or patience to worry with trying to hop into a battle the way I'd like to. If it does happen, I'm not going to sit around and wait.
I thought about making a video comparing the EVE trailers for combat to actual combat situations in game. You see the EVE trailer then switch to a bunch of battleships sitting on a gate with crickets chirping in the back ground.
Somebody already made a video of the slideshow presentation that big fleet battles turn into.
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ivar R'dhak
Minmatar
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Posted - 2011.03.08 11:33:00 -
[36]
Originally by: Lokaas
Testify! ...
Thank you!
Pondered to make a post with exactly these arguments but couldn¦t be bothered in face of the Ozom pvp gods and their skillz in this thread.
______________
Mal-¦Appears we got here just in a nick of time. What does that make us?¦
Zoe-`Big damn heroes, sir.`
Mal-¦Aint we just.¦ |
Herrring
Amarr
Caldari Internal Revenue Service
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Posted - 2011.03.08 11:40:00 -
[37]
Originally by: ivar R'dhak
Originally by: Lokaas
Testify! ...
Thank you!
Pondered to make a post with exactly these arguments but couldn¦t be bothered in face of the Ozom pvp gods and their skillz in this thread.
Yes PVP in EVE can be very time consuming and involves alot of afking sometimes too.
But that feeling you get when you know that you just ****ed someone off on the other side of the internet cable is the only reason i play eve and its very rewarding.
IRL, i can't be an ******* anymore because I don't feel like going to prison anytime soon, but with eve, blowing ships up and knowing that I ruined some KM *****'s day makes me fuzzy inside.
So I dont undock unless I have a gross advantage or i know how they fit and fit my ship to counter them, and in the end I win most of the time.
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Corozan Aspinall
Party Time Inc.
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Posted - 2011.03.08 11:51:00 -
[38]
Originally by: Zirse
Running missions is NOT fun, nor is it EVE combat.
What's next? Hawk the Slayer is "rubbish"? 
----------------------------------
This character is for sale. 6 days 23 hrs remaining. b/o 5.4bn. |
Tecnicolor Yawn
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Posted - 2011.03.08 12:10:00 -
[39]
Originally by: Tia Aristoi
Edited by: Tia Aristoi on 08/03/2011 03:06:56
The way combat is presented in EvE makes me feel like I'm flying a spreadsheet and not a ship in space.
One of the things that originally attracted me to EvE were the trailers featuring what I thought were these amazing ingame battles. I haven't found them. When I go into combat I'm looking at little red dots on my HUD. The ships themselves are often so distant I can't even see them in the space around me. Changing the camera view doesn't seem to help much. In combat all I really do is change targets when the little red dots disappear, pop a ability occassionally, and reload my guns. Nothing at all cinematic about the experience.
When I do see ships up close (like my own) they don't turn smoothly, but seem to swivel about almost frantically. There's almost no sense that ships have mass. It gets worse when I have set my ship to approach another target. I pass through the target, turn instantly, and bounce back like I'm a yo-yo. It's like my ship is on a string.
It would be nice if ships turned a bit more slowly and alot more smoothly...and were set so when auto-approaching a target your autopilot slows and turns the ship to avoid passing through it.
Anyway, just wondering if anybody feels the same?
Got to say, I agree. The marketing is, of course, greater than the reality of it. Most of the work for a fleet goes into the tactics, placement, and fittings of the fleet. Beyond that, its F1, or possibly a few other buttons and clicks on the overview. Pretty boring crud when it comes down to it really. Generally its 3 hours of waiting, for 10 minutes of click and F1.
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Orc A
Interstellar eXodus
BricK sQuAD.
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Posted - 2011.03.08 12:17:00 -
[40]
Edited by: Orc A on 08/03/2011 12:19:54
OP -
You don't need to grind to get anywhere in this game.
Just logging on and changing skills to the point where you have 3 mil is enough to see 0.0 magnificent fleet battles.
Find a 0.0 corp in a 0.0 alliance that PvPs a lot, market yourself as an uber tackler. get a t1 frigate fit with MWD, warp disruptor and all the speed mods you can get. In fact, get like, 20 of those ready to fight at moments notice. Sooner or later, you will be called to arms as a member of that corp / alliance, and you will be able to participate in them magnificent battles you were talking about.
Sure, you may die a lot, but the cost of a t1 frig is... ridiculous.
You will be contributing more than you think to the battle, using just that mwd and warp disruptor.
Since you'l be engaging at extremely close ranges, you will be able to "see" the ships in the fight. Or at least the ones you are engaging.
The stuff you see in trailers like Dominion, or whatever they called it, is really an attempt to show you what 0.0 fleet battles are like. If you pretend the **** they say on comms in what you hear on alliance Teamspeak, it's actually almost believable.
Here's what I'm trying to say...
You sound pretty new to the game. The real beautiful combat in eve in 0.0 warfare, with battleships and capitals and "all the panoply of war" is not very far from you. You really shouldn't judge the game until you've played it.
Unfortunately most people don't understand that one has not really played the game until one has participated in 0.0 warfare, on any scale.
Many of the reviews of EvE really ****ed me off because of this exact reason.
Some douche reporter fires of a 14 day trial and then writes about his experience in those 14 days in the review... The game doesn't begin till like, at least a couple of months in.
My 2 cents.
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Sentient Blade
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Posted - 2011.03.08 12:19:00 -
[41]
I agree with the premise of the OP which is that the navigation system in EvE is quite poor. I for one might actually put aside my beloved missiles and start using guns if I were able to manually fly the ship - to effectively plot an intercept and attack angle that gave me the greatest time on target with the least traversal velocity rather than orbiting around the bugger.
Also: Trying to manipulate the visuals when in combat has only ended one way for me; with my ship exploding. By the time you've got a decent visual you find yourself in a pod because some tiny little 10x10 pixel icon has appeared to indicate "oh noes, your capacitor is being pwnt and will be gone in about 5 seconds... kiss your shield rep goodbye".
Combat views need a huge overhaul, some things I can think of:
- Manual control of ships with something, anything better than the clicky click click method.
- Hover over an enemy target to see a picture-in-picture of them - I found this incredibly helpful when I used to be on F22 DID because you could easily tell how the enemy was manoeuvring on the IRST without completely losing sight of everything in front of you.
- A radar... omfg what kind of combat game or space ship does not have a radar? Gimmie a fricken 2D map up in the top corner showing the position of my fleet and the enemy fleet. Overview sucks for this, because as I mentioned above, you need that main view for other things. Radar is low hanging fruit and would be a hugeee benefit.
Anyway, there are more things. But I live in hope.
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Terrible Damage
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Posted - 2011.03.08 12:25:00 -
[42]
Originally by: Teranul
The way they are piloted in game is also the most realistic method of controlling a ship with a crew in the dozens, hundreds, or thousands (battleship class+).
I somewhat agree, what I think would increase the immersion Factor somewhat wouldbe "Walking in Ships" and a Bridge View.
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Hoya en Marland
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Posted - 2011.03.08 12:54:00 -
[43]
Well, that's the best you can get with "point-and-click-lock-target-turn-on-the-modules-and-wait-for-spreadsheets-to-calculate-the-outcome" combat mechanics with no line of sight, no ship damage models, no friendly fire, no physics... nothing but plain old numbers crunching.
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Istvaan Shogaatsu
Caldari
Rogue Drone Systems
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Posted - 2011.03.08 13:10:00 -
[44]
I have just about given up on Eve combat.
The amount of ISK in circulation has made loss meaningless.
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Miss Connolly
Public Relations Corp
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Posted - 2011.03.08 13:24:00 -
[45]
Originally by: Tia Aristoi
Edited by: Tia Aristoi on 08/03/2011 03:06:56
The way combat is presented in EvE makes me feel like I'm flying a spreadsheet and not a ship in space.
One of the things that originally attracted me to EvE were the trailers featuring what I thought were these amazing ingame battles. I haven't found them. When I go into combat I'm looking at little red dots on my HUD. The ships themselves are often so distant I can't even see them in the space around me. Changing the camera view doesn't seem to help much. In combat all I really do is change targets when the little red dots disappear, pop a ability occassionally, and reload my guns. Nothing at all cinematic about the experience.
When I do see ships up close (like my own) they don't turn smoothly, but seem to swivel about almost frantically. There's almost no sense that ships have mass. It gets worse when I have set my ship to approach another target. I pass through the target, turn instantly, and bounce back like I'm a yo-yo. It's like my ship is on a string.
It would be nice if ships turned a bit more slowly and alot more smoothly...and were set so when auto-approaching a target your autopilot slows and turns the ship to avoid passing through it.
Anyway, just wondering if anybody feels the same?
It's because CCP think it's a good idea to bait new victims.. uhm I mean customers by releasing super high quality videos of space battles and "action scenes" that simply don't exist in the game. They don't only do what normal game companies do (use faked textures and artists to make their videos look better) they actually go as far as to simply invent large parts of the content they present in their bait-videos (such as ships being able to move in an agile manner or the camera being able to move in a non-******ed fashion).
I guess they think that most people play EVE because of the great graphics and action-loaded gameplay (lol) so it makes perfect sense to bait people with those wonderful features.
___________________
"It was mentioned by CCP that the data does not seem to support that polished quality sells better than new features."
These are the people you are giving your money to. |
Nypheas Azurai
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Posted - 2011.03.08 13:41:00 -
[46]
Agree with OP. I gave up on PVP (and EVE in general) after being disillusioned with some of the ideas I thought were possible (coming from Freelancer here) that don't transfer to EVE (which is less a space-sim, and more of an RPG in space).
Battles come down to nothing but lock, activate some mods, orbit, rinse repeat. Because the majority of the "battle" actually happens in planning a fit, etc, but none of that adds to sheer epicness of a true a space simulation battle when you feel "in control" of everything that happens. The navigation in this game is so pathetic you can't even orbit a target at an arbitrary range (how hard would it be to add a text box to enter in an orbit range?).
Anyways, I've just learned to ignore it, much with so many of the immersion shatters that come with EVE in general (and too conveniently and often explained away as necessary to avoid lag... uggh).
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Reonetii
Gallente
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Posted - 2011.03.08 13:44:00 -
[47]
Originally by: Shiarra Bloom
Okay looked it up. I'm currently flying a Moa cruiser.
And there my friend is your fail.
Moa.
Try something else, anything else but the Moa. It's the ship you skip on the path of learning.
As for the cinemagraphic trailers, they are done with enhanced clients at super resolutions (there was an old thread explaining it some time ago ) and then reduced to normal video 1080i or such appearance, causing rendering compression of the video and giving it that shine.
Unless you have one of the best later video sli setups and a rip snorting CPU and memory and ssd HD etc etc, you can kiss that sort of view goodbye for practical flying and fighting, it would just lag out too much to be effective.
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Tia Aristoi
Caldari
School of Applied Knowledge
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Posted - 2011.03.08 14:30:00 -
[48]
Edited by: Tia Aristoi on 08/03/2011 14:35:56
Originally by: Orc
Many of the reviews of EvE really ****ed me off because of this exact reason.
Some douche reporter fires of a 14 day trial and then writes about his experience in those 14 days in the review... The game doesn't begin till like, at least a couple of months in.
Yeah, but I think there's something important to be learned from that review which is that most people wont hang around past 14 days to get to the "good stuff". And really why would you expect them to? Consumers are busy, and are particular about what they spend their money on. Now as a person who has taken the time and gotten to the good stuff you may not be sympathetic of folks who are less patient than you, but from a business perspective I'm not sure it makes sense for CCP to think that way.
What I'm saying is people play games to have fun, so the game better be fun from day one, hour one. And it needs to continue to be fun on day two, and three, and day 100. People want cinematic combat. If they didn't CCP wouldn't advertise the game that way. I guess I'm just saying they should do more to bring us closer to what they advertise.
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ivar R'dhak
Minmatar
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Posted - 2011.03.08 14:42:00 -
[49]
Originally by: Sentient Blade
- A radar... omfg what kind of combat game or space ship does not have a radar? Gimmie a fricken 2D map up in the top corner showing the position of my fleet and the enemy fleet. Overview sucks for this, because as I mentioned above, you need that main view for other things. Radar is low hanging fruit and would be a hugeee benefit.
Yeah, the game had a honest to god Elite type 3D(-ish) radar in the beginning and nobody used it, as this game is fought in that little overview box in the upper right corner.
Actually I agree with killing the radar and moving it onto the mainview by hitting that "plane-overlay-thingy" button and zooming out. Was the best upgrade to the UI Eve ever had.
______________
Mal-¦Appears we got here just in a nick of time. What does that make us?¦
Zoe-`Big damn heroes, sir.`
Mal-¦Aint we just.¦ |
Reachok
Amarr
Holchek Mining
Severed Hand.
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Posted - 2011.03.08 14:57:00 -
[50]
Going way back up top to the OP: If the engagement is smallish (<50 total pilots) and you've got the horsepower to do so, you can scroll in and see the game ALMOST as the trailers depict. I haven't tried targeting in battle after pressing CTRL-F9 but I have watched a battle using that method after choosing someone and viewing them. Looked pretty cool up until my viewpoint changed to a station hangar.
________________________________________________
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Teranul
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Posted - 2011.03.08 15:43:00 -
[51]
Edited by: Teranul on 08/03/2011 15:43:59
Originally by: Sentient Blade
I agree with the premise of the OP which is that the navigation system in EvE is quite poor. I for one might actually put aside my beloved missiles and start using guns if I were able to manually fly the ship - to effectively plot an intercept and attack angle that gave me the greatest time on target with the least traversal velocity rather than orbiting around the bugger.
Er... but you CAN manually fly the ship just by double-clicking anywhere in space.
How long have you been playing to not know this?
Originally by: Terrible Damage
I somewhat agree, what I think would increase the immersion Factor somewhat wouldbe "Walking in Ships" and a Bridge View.
Eh, this is (unfortunately) incompatible with the lore, where you're hooked up to the ship in a goo-filled hydrostatic pod. They're not changing that bit anytime soon, either.
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Sentient Blade
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Posted - 2011.03.09 01:02:00 -
[52]
Originally by: Teranul
Er... but you CAN manually fly the ship just by double-clicking anywhere in space.
How long have you been playing to not know this?
I've been playing for long enough to have grown to hate this particular method of navigation. Anyone else ever had those WTF moments where you've been working in your cargo, scanners, PI etc only to find your ship has seemingly taken off on its own accord and is now 100k away from where you left it?
Homeworld had a pretty decent method of navigating in 3D space, although it would need some tweeks for EvE like "orbit current location" etc. C&C like fleet formations wouldn't hurt either.
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Ma'Kahn
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Posted - 2011.03.09 09:58:00 -
[53]
Whatever pieces of code control ship movement in Eve haven't changed all that much since the game was launched. It should be overhauled. That won't happen, however, because of the probable impact that would have on game balance. Pretty much all ship variables would have to be re-evaluated and adjusted.
Same goes for camera control. There's really no way to get better and / or more exciting camera angles and the (advanced) camera controls also haven't evolved at all since they were introduced.
What you see in trailers is most likely scripted and done in a sandbox client, unfortunately.
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Raneru
Euphoria Released
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Posted - 2011.03.09 12:49:00 -
[54]
I urge the OP to fly frigates (ceptors, pirate frigs, rifter) in PVP situations if he wants some excitement.
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Gaia's Wrath
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Posted - 2011.03.09 13:00:00 -
[55]
Just want to grab my pic :)
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Diesel47
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Posted - 2011.03.09 13:10:00 -
[56]
Originally by: Tia Aristoi
Edited by: Tia Aristoi on 08/03/2011 14:43:28
Originally by: Orc
Many of the reviews of EvE really ****ed me off because of this exact reason.
Some douche reporter fires of a 14 day trial and then writes about his experience in those 14 days in the review... The game doesn't begin till like, at least a couple of months in.
Yeah, but I think there's something important to be learned from that review which is that most people wont hang around past 14 days to get to the "good stuff". And really why would you expect them to? Consumers are busy, and are particular about what they spend their money on. Now as a person who has taken the time and gotten to the good stuff you may not be sympathetic of folks who are less patient than you, but from a business perspective I'm not sure it makes sense for CCP to think that way.
What I'm saying is people play games to have fun, so the game better be fun from day one, hour one if you want them to stick around. And it needs to continue to be fun on day two, and three, and day 100. People want cinematic combat. If they didn't CCP wouldn't advertise the game that way. I guess I'm just saying they should do more to bring us closer to what they advertise.
Ahem, Quit missions... Start PVP.
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Joe Skellington
Minmatar
JOKAS Industries
Matari Legion
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Posted - 2011.03.09 14:03:00 -
[57]
No.
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Tia Aristoi
Caldari
School of Applied Knowledge
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Posted - 2011.03.09 14:07:00 -
[58]
sorry, I don't think I'm going to make it to PvP. Just requires too much grinding.
We'll see.
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Tejal Charu
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Posted - 2011.03.09 15:03:00 -
[59]
Originally by: Tia Aristoi
sorry, I don't think I'm going to make it to PvP. Just requires too much grinding.
Hahaha... wait, seriously? |
Tia Aristoi
Caldari
School of Applied Knowledge
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Posted - 2011.03.09 15:51:00 -
[60]
PvP requires money does it not? For a good ship and all it's gear? And you have to have the money not only to buy those things but enough money so that if you lose them it's not a big deal.
So how do you get the money for that? My assumption was you had to pve grind for the money - mining, missions, etc. That means hours and hours of pve combat which I find dull.
Is there another way that's more interesting?
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SerratedX
Hyvat Pahat ja Eric
The Polaris Syndicate
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Posted - 2011.03.09 16:01:00 -
[61]
Edited by: SerratedX on 09/03/2011 16:00:49
Originally by: Tia Aristoi
PvP requires money does it not? For a good ship and all it's gear?
Yes, but if you have zero pvp experience don't go around flying 'expensive' ships. Go with t1 frigates which are practically free to learn the ropes.
And yes you will propably have to grind pve to have isk to lose ships when you start flying more expensive ships. I usually end up sitting in sanctums/havens for a few hours a week, to build some ISK buffer.
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ChironV
Caldari
Deep Core Mining Inc.
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Posted - 2011.03.09 17:03:00 -
[62]
There are times when flying my Blarpy for the fun of it I reset the camera and just enjoy the coolness of the graphic effects. Thats fun. There are advantages to using the "Click Fly" method to "Tack" your way to an enemy keeping an optimal transversal. Once Im in optimal range I just orbit, keep the webbie on, keep the AB running, and have pewfun.
However, at longer ranges I would prefer a tactical UI. In a fleet or Gang, information is more important than "ooh shiny!!".
Information such as ship type listed with expandable windows showing ship racials what resists are running. A simple 2-d map in the background showing ranges to evil enemies. Effective ranges to my weapons and so on. Perhaps a tactical UI might even reduce lag. Although I doubt it, because most fleet conflicts are just CPU database transaction cycles of "in system" inventory.
________________________________________________
It is by caffeine alone I set my mind in motion,
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Nomaar
Caldari
Stellar Aberration
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Posted - 2011.03.09 22:09:00 -
[63]
The engagement distances are good as they are -- it makes me feel like I'm actually fighting in outer space.
I do agree on your point about ship movement. In EVE, supposedly massive ships don't move as such. They spin and jerk around too quickly, even if they have a slow movement speed, and don't give you the feeling you're flying a behemoth. The capital ships in Homeworld, by comparison, have that slow, grinding kind of movement you associate with massive ships.
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Val'Dore
Word Bearers of Chaos
Word of Chaos Undivided
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Posted - 2011.03.09 22:26:00 -
[64]
EvE's combat and navigation systems are convoluted and add more to the lag problem than anything else
~No matter what happens, somebody will find a way to take it too seriously.~
Tiericide |
Bane Loppknow
Pel Industries
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Posted - 2011.03.10 00:47:00 -
[65]
It would be nice to be able to more specifically control your ship, like executing rolls or turns instead of just double clicking. It wouldn't be hard to set up the controls, but the server-side calculations would be immense.
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Sentient Blade
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Posted - 2011.03.10 06:36:00 -
[66]
Well you don't necessary need to have the server do all the calculations on how the movement is done, that can be offloaded to the client and leave the server to check that the commands given are within bounds.
It's more of a real-time processing system though, rather than the polling system the server architecture uses now. Ultimately they're going to need to move towards it, but it's a huge change.
That said, I personally look forward to being able to jink around missiles and strafe my target's engines with fixed autocannons, to knock out their warp drive.
EvE combat requiring reaction times and real life skill? Yes please.
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Kyra Felann
Gallente
The Scope
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Posted - 2011.03.10 06:56:00 -
[67]
It sounds like you want some type of action-based space-fighter sim. We are not flying X-Wings or Vipers. We are piloting huge ships. I think it should feel slow and strategic rather than visceral. Enemy ships in combat should be distant. In fact, combat ranges in EVE are ridiculously short as it is.
I don't want "cinematic" combat. I would like to see more tactical depth, though.
TL;DR: you're playing the wrong game if you want action-based "cinematic" combat.
-----WARNING SIGNATURE BELOW-----
Bring back the NeoNeoCom! |
Kijo Rikki
Caldari
Point of No Return
Waterboard
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Posted - 2011.03.10 13:04:00 -
[68]
Originally by: Kyra Felann
It sounds like you want some type of action-based space-fighter sim. We are not flying X-Wings or Vipers. We are piloting huge ships. I think it should feel slow and strategic rather than visceral. Enemy ships in combat should be distant. In fact, combat ranges in EVE are ridiculously short as it is.
I don't want "cinematic" combat. I would like to see more tactical depth, though.
TL;DR: you're playing the wrong game if you want action-based "cinematic" combat.
Yet huge ships bounce off others like they're high energy rubber. I ran into a carrier with my griffin yesterday, hilarious actually. Boing. So they obviously wasted the effort to have collision detection in the game so players can feel more like they're piloting bumper cars.
Also, rather large ships actually do act like vipers. When you execute a 180 deg turn, instead of making slow, graceful arcs the ships tend to flip end over end while turning, making rather unrealistic movements.
As far as ranges go, I'd be curious the actual range and potency of alot of weapon systems, lasers with divergence, artillery with that kind of distance on moving targets that can change course, missles with the size you'd need for it to travel and track a target over 100 km and how many you could carry on board a given ship. Railguns are the only ones I think have true range success.
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Tia Aristoi
Caldari
School of Applied Knowledge
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Posted - 2011.03.10 14:45:00 -
[69]
Edited by: Tia Aristoi on 10/03/2011 14:48:06
Yeah that's a good point. "Realistic" ranges for anything other than missiles would be quite short. Anyway realism in this area is just conjecture. If you decided you wanted realism then designing ships that behaved as if they had mass would probably be one of the first things you'd want to do.
However is combat fun is my question? Would shortening the ranges and modifying how ships move and turn so that it more resembled something similiar to Homeworld add or remove depth to the combat?
It seems hard for me to accept that you'd be removing tactical depth if you gave players more control of piloting their ships. What I think frightens isn't that they'd lose choices but that they'd now have to deal with not only the tactical/strategic elements of combat but also the added dimension of twitch combat.
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Lord Tempist
Caldari
Council of Lords
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Posted - 2011.03.10 15:48:00 -
[70]
I'd like to see them introduce "Ramming" into the skill set for combat. Like missiles or railguns, but a skill where you fit modules for crashing into other ships so you can see the body's floating out into space when you crack their hull open. You could even have different rams like an electromagnetic ram, a kinetic ram, a thermic ram, etc to satisfy continuity of combat skills.
No man ever got killed by his wife while giving her a footrub. Rubbing someone elses wife's feet, well... *Fill in the blank* |
Dorian Tormak
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Posted - 2011.03.10 15:56:00 -
[71]
They can't introduce every single game feature at a time. They wanted to be able to walk in stations at the very beginning but it was too much work so they saved it for later. I would guess that in time the space flight will all become much more realistic. In the future you will be able to crash into people and **** :O Also ATM ships/crews reaction times are rediculous, you can double click in space a hundred times before the ship actually does something, or if you're outside of a station and click "keep at range 20" your stupid crew flies right into the station which is frusterating for newer players (just happened to a friend of mine). So if that's what you're talking about I agree.
As for combat, it doesn't feel distant or awkward to me at all. To me it feels very involved and intense; the best pvp in a game I've ever played. But bumping into other ships is pretty stupid.
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Grim Vandal
Burn Proof
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Posted - 2011.03.10 19:02:00 -
[72]
What really IS embarrassing is that there is so much talk about the industry leading avatar creation, physically correct hair aso ...
and than you undock and bump into spaceships warp through stations your guns hit the VERY same spot of a ship over and over again even so while you actually miss it, you can spam missiles like a standard weapon which takes away the whole tactic of a missile ...
in this regard bombs are what missiles should be like ... and yes I know about missiles splash dmg back then ...
and NO LOS system OMG ... shooting through asteroids ... shooting through stations ... docking on the wrong side of the station is also no problem in eve ...
fukc destiny
sounds harsh and it is meant to be so
Grim
Greetings Grim |
Zyress
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Posted - 2011.03.10 19:43:00 -
[73]
Originally by: Bane Loppknow
It would be nice to be able to more specifically control your ship, like executing rolls or turns instead of just double clicking. It wouldn't be hard to set up the controls, but the server-side calculations would be immense.
I'm fine with no Joystick but I really would like to specify when I click orbit which direction I orbit in 3 dimensions like the default orbit distance textbox only you can enter 0 - 359, enter 90 to orbit right, 180 or 0 for a vertical orbit, 270 for a left orbit. Also the Freelancer mouse navigation that didn't involve double clicking, the ship just followed the cursor was a better more precise method of freehand steering.
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Bane Loppknow
Pel Industries
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Posted - 2011.03.11 00:15:00 -
[74]
Yeah. I don't think anyone really want a flight sim style, but being able to adjust your course pitch and yaw would make things more interesting. Tip your carrier on its side so that your fighters don't get annihilated by missiles while they launch, that sort of thing.
The one place I could see having a flight sim style would be for fighters controlled by players. DUST players, i would say. but that would be insanely taxing on the server.
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Nova Fox
Gallente
Novafox Shipyards
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Posted - 2011.03.11 00:20:00 -
[75]
In short answer No.
In long answer acceptable yes.
Eve is a farily unique game it terms of limitations and size of combat, with no gaurantee to cap on combat the individual tatcial level is nearly impossible.
HOWEVER this doesnt neglect Stragetic, operational, and theatrical levels of warfare. Usually operation and theatrical warfares dont exist in any other mmos with the execption of eve. In eve you can play out an entire war see the entire picture and the big pictures much more easily and dont have to worry as much about the nitty gritty individual 1v1 basis.
Pre-order your Sisters of ≡v≡ Exploration ship today, Updated 25FEB11
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Jaik7
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Posted - 2011.03.11 02:00:00 -
[76]
Originally by: Tia Aristoi
Edited by: Tia Aristoi on 08/03/2011 03:06:56
The way combat is presented in EvE makes me feel like I'm flying a spreadsheet and not a ship in space.
quote]
i didnt get the spreadsheet feel when i fought in pvp stuff, i got the feel of 'oh crap, the last month of effort is about to get blown up'
hard to notice shakey combat when your hands are shaking
for missions, yeah, you are flying a spreadsheet and it is totally unrealistic. i still don't understand how the swarms i deal with on a regular basis either smack against my shields like a bug against a windsheild, that is, if they ever get in range. pve is not the height of eve combat, and anyone who tells you that is either ignorant or high on something.
trust me, level pvp gives a combat high like no other game i've ever played.
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Infinity Ziona
Minmatar
Cloakers
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Posted - 2011.03.11 02:51:00 -
[77]
Originally by: Hieronimus Rex
EVE is not an FPS space game and never will be. Those are the only games you will ever get a sense of closeness in comebat, because in those games combat is always close - it has to be since in a twitc game you usually have to see your opponent's ship so you can shoot it.
EVE takes the more "realistic" approach - distances in space are vast and if you're lobbing projectiles at a target 100km away of course you won't be able to see them.
I agree though it couldn't hurt to smooth out ship movement.
Ummm righttttt!
EvE is so unrealistic it sometimes makes me want to vomit.
There are so many stupid things in combat I don't know where to start. But I'll give you a couple of the top absurdities.
* Orbiting a stationary target and tracking speed. Self explanatory.
* Drone control ranges. Think US Predator drone range vs EvE drone range.
* Targeting ranges and lock speeds. Think F22 Raptor vs any ship in EvE.
---------------------------------------------
I AM BETTER THAN YOU. |
Sisohiv
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Posted - 2011.03.11 03:39:00 -
[78]
Lock times are kind of silly.
dew-dew-dew-dew-dew-dew-dew-dew for 45 seconds on the frigate with a battleship. Then miss anyway. If tracking speeds determing my hit, why did I need to lock the target? My weapons don't have cpu to adjust for velocity and moving targets?
All that said though, I'd like to see a test server day with no overview. Where you had to lock on screen to target people. Of course they would need to redesign the square star system so a battleship one didn't look identical to a HAC. It would certainly redifine the primary and blob the dps system we have now. |
Selinate
Amarr
Red Water Syndicate
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Posted - 2011.03.11 05:46:00 -
[79]
Edited by: Selinate on 11/03/2011 05:46:11
I would rather eve be point and click shooting for fighting, or joy stick.
Oh well, the spreadsheet lovers will always win over me, though.
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Idicious Lightbane
Percussive Diplomacy
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Posted - 2011.03.11 10:39:00 -
[80]
Originally by: Tia Aristoi
Edited by: Tia Aristoi on 10/03/2011 15:02:18
Yeah that's a good point. "Realistic" ranges for anything other than missiles would be quite short. Anyway realism in this area is just conjecture. If you decided you wanted realism then designing ships that behaved as if they had mass would probably be one of the first things you'd want to do.
However is combat fun is my question? Would shortening the ranges and modifying how ships move and turn so that it more resembled something similiar to Homeworld add or remove depth to the combat?
It seems hard for me to accept that you'd be removing tactical depth if you gave players more control of piloting their ships. What I think frightens people isn't that they'd lose choices but that they'd now have to deal with not only the tactical/strategic elements of combat but also the added dimension of twitch combat.
I would recommend trying out some pvp (it doesn't have to cost you anything really if you stick to T1 frigates for the time being, small ships like that are needed in fleets for fast tackle, scouting etc) The pvp side of EVE is mostly strategic, and yes most battles the outcome is already decided before the fight starts, but that is due to superior intel and planning on the winning side.
The adrenaline rush a good pvp battle in eve gives is something I've never had any other game even come close to, on top of that you can control those 'dice rolls' by a good amount by manually keeping your traversal high while optimizing tracking for yourself and taking advantage of your opponents weapon range + tracking to your advantage.
For example approaching a ship in a straight line (approach button) is generally a terrible idea as even larger ships can hit a small one coming at them with 0 traversal (straight line) so if you have to fly out to tackle some-one you will have to manually control your approach to reduce incoming damage etc, then once tackled concentrate on staying alive (killing off drones first generally) and keeping situational awareness so your target doesn't manually break your orbit and manage to escape.
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GizzyBoy
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Posted - 2011.03.11 11:44:00 -
[81]
Id like to watch an epic big balls to the wall space battle, But once your popped your not around to watch anymore, Would be nice if they got that camera recording thing happening.
Id prefer something that used the ingame engine to replicate the fight somewhat, so you can zoom around and check the diffrent angles etc
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Dorian Tormak
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Posted - 2011.03.11 14:08:00 -
[82]
Originally by: GizzyBoy
Id like to watch an epic big balls to the wall space battle, But once your popped your not around to watch anymore, Would be nice if they got that camera recording thing happening.
Id prefer something that used the ingame engine to replicate the fight somewhat, so you can zoom around and check the diffrent angles etc
Like Call of Duty Theatre Mode! That would be epic! Review your battles and make epic videos of it omg.
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