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reddot23
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Posted - 2011.03.15 04:45:00 -
[31]
i have to agree on that one point ccp devs are pvpers and that is why they are working a the 1 real pvp game from ccp dust 514 not eve 2
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Opertone
Caldari World - of - Empire Cassiopeia.
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Posted - 2011.03.15 05:28:00 -
[32]
worthless nonsense
USA time, forums look very degraded
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CCP Spitfire
C C P C C P Alliance
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Posted - 2011.03.15 08:26:00 -
[33]
Moved from 'EVE General Discussion', offtopic and trolling posts removed.
Please keep the discussion civil.
Spitfire Community Representative CCP Hf, EVE Online |
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Joe McAlt
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Posted - 2011.03.15 08:45:00 -
[34]
I do understand what the op is saying. I also understand that Eve is 1st a PvP game.
The problem with that is that most MMORPG players are not adrenalin junkies who only find fun in the threat of loss. Some of us find fun in exploring or building. Someone once said that the Wallet is a KB for bears and they were right.
As I see it Eve never will be as popular as the other MMO's due to this. It does have an appeal as the only decent ship based Sci Fi game and on that end it has no real competition.
I do believe that if another such game is developed well and does allow for more civilised game play many eve players will make haste to go there.
CCP would do well to consider the possibility
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Jaigar
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Posted - 2011.03.15 13:41:00 -
[35]
Originally by: Joe McAlt I do understand what the op is saying. I also understand that Eve is 1st a PvP game.
The problem with that is that most MMORPG players are not adrenalin junkies who only find fun in the threat of loss. Some of us find fun in exploring or building. Someone once said that the Wallet is a KB for bears and they were right.
As I see it Eve never will be as popular as the other MMO's due to this. It does have an appeal as the only decent ship based Sci Fi game and on that end it has no real competition.
I do believe that if another such game is developed well and does allow for more civilised game play many eve players will make haste to go there.
CCP would do well to consider the possibility
Theres a reason why EVE players aren't considered normal MMO players. EVE offers less-restricted interaction between players, and I know several people who play for this reason. What other game can you play in which you can actually take people's stuff, ransom them, negoiate terms, etc?
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Karl Planck
Walt Disney Productions
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Posted - 2011.03.15 14:11:00 -
[36]
I actually read this post hoping it would have more content than just the problem with industrial ships. Nonetheless, I don't get what your problem is man. Let go over this
1. Your dying in low sec in an industrial. 1A: you don't need to go to low sec in an industrial, even on autopilot. 1B: Even if your plan was implemented, your aggressors would simply follow you through the gate and kill you assuming you weren't about to jump to high sec. 1C: Hauling stuff through low sec is very doable, its just a little harder than high sec. There is a reason for this, if you want the quick route then there is a sacrifice. 1 conclusion: I don't even get how this is a problem
2. you want to be safer afk hauling in high sec 2A: Why are you afk hualing expensive stuff in high sec. People don't bother to gank you unless its worth the loss of your ship. IF you are carrying that much why wouldn't you protect it? 2B: IF you are spending this much time hualing, why don't you have other skill, like remote production or trading skills? People who haul all the time have remote skills for a reason. 2C: you say you cant higher people to escort?!?! really. You may not be able to preemptively strike a suicide ganker, but you can get safety in numbers. Higher cheap t1 jam frigs to follow you around. Higher a bunch of industrial filled with crap to follow you around. However, if your going to do this, why not just refer to 2A?
3: It would do you well to remember that everything you do as an industrialist in this game is to fuel pvp. The player driven economy is a fun aspect to this, but the end goal is to still make "shiny sand" for other people to blow you up with (because apparently you aren't using it).
Last point, how is this something that is breaking eve? Hauling? Really? You say there is a disconnect here between the eve universe and what people are doing. Well, I will point you to CVA, or any NRDS group. They strive NOT to shoot random people and draw more targets because of it. Still, take your efforts over there and immerse YOURSELF in the gameplay, this is after all, a sandbox. -------------------------------------------------
Don't debate with morons. They drag you down to their level, then beat you with experience. |
Cipher Jones
Minmatar
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Posted - 2011.03.15 14:41:00 -
[37]
Originally by: CCP Spitfire Moved from 'EVE General Discussion', offtopic and trolling posts removed.
Please keep the discussion civil.
In all sincerity you should alter the OP as to not insult the reader if you really intend on removing the trolling.
Yes, I know, discussion of moderation is not allowed.
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Neo Omni
Gallente
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Posted - 2011.03.23 02:08:00 -
[38]
Originally by: Joe McAlt I do understand what the op is saying. I also understand that Eve is 1st a PvP game.
The problem with that is that most MMORPG players are not adrenalin junkies who only find fun in the threat of loss. Some of us find fun in exploring or building. Someone once said that the Wallet is a KB for bears and they were right.
As I see it Eve never will be as popular as the other MMO's due to this. It does have an appeal as the only decent ship based Sci Fi game and on that end it has no real competition.
I do believe that if another such game is developed well and does allow for more civilised game play many eve players will make haste to go there.
CCP would do well to consider the possibility
Thanks for understanding what I am trying to get at and posting a reasonable reply. NO, this is not a troll thread. Just observations and wishful thinking for the future of EVE. I dont want to take away from the hardcore PvPers, but the carebears in the game a long overdue for a release focusing just on them for a change. As for an adrenalin rush?
Watching your stock investments go up and down on the EVE stock exchange as corps fight it out would have me hooked in a far more different manner to this game. It would also prompt me to invest resources into different corps to keep them afloat without necessarily having to join them. It would take EVE to new heights politically as battles are not just fought in space, but in boardrooms and game run financial institutions/banks.
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Hieronimus Rex
Minmatar Infinitus Sapientia New Eden Research.
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Posted - 2011.03.23 02:52:00 -
[39]
Where are the constructive suggestions in the OP?
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raney ilara
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Posted - 2011.03.23 04:32:00 -
[40]
Originally by: Cailais Dear OP,
You're confusing the idea of a "sandbox game" as a private sandbox in your back yard.
It's not. It's more like you're on the beach and if someone wants to kick your castle over they can.
Once you except this truth EVE will become more fun for you.
C.
I like your sig; it's pretty.
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MorliDots22
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Posted - 2011.03.23 11:28:00 -
[41]
Actually you are right.
EvE is now mostly a chaos not an order. Small corps have no chances to rise up because a big alliance can immediatly hire some mercenaries and prevent that corp from evolving. Also you cant do anything against blobs. I speak for myself now but security is the first thing a human need, also a average player.
1 ) Autopilot warp should be possible at least in Empire to zero. In nullsec its possible to put bubbles so whats the point ?
2) Wardeclarations can be only done if there was an act of aggression from somebody and should be also possible to npc corps. This will improve the roleplay because now you will need a provocation to declare a War like in RL
3) A CONCORD should have some kind of organization like UN which should help to attack aggressive corps or alliances who just attack players without reason also in their claim territory. This change would make it possible that a group of small corps could actually overwhelm a big alliance if they were attacked without reason.
3) EvE has now a offskill system. It should be also possible to build a security intel towers which dont shoot but report to corp chat alien ships which are without autorization in the claim territory. They should built at the gates and direct scan the system.
4) Unauthorized presence in alien claim with a number and size of ships >X is a wardeck reason. Also with 1 ship but in constant time amount >X
5) To enter a claimterritory you will need a Visa from a claimholder. With this it would be possible to regulate and improve the trade in the claim, as we all know - more competition - low price
6) It should be possible to make secured loan contracts where you can give ships structures etc. as a security for isk.
7) PvP without risk of a wardeck or security status penalty in low and alien claim is allowed if "nobody knows" - which mean if only one ship had escaped back to Empire and report this accident to CONCORD COUNCIL - if its in low the attackers are red for concord unless they pay a double platinum insurance fee to those they destroyed and if they podded them a 5x platinum isurance fee.
If this was a unsuccessful claim attack than it should be like in Drizzt Saga - Concord invades their territory in 24h. After another 24h all systems are ready to be claimed again but not by their previous owners. First come first served.
Please comment
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Neo Omni
Gallente
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Posted - 2011.03.26 11:14:00 -
[42]
I think one thing that does need to change is unauthorized scanning of ships.
If your ship is scanned without your consent in hi-sec, it should be treated the same as if someone has just opened fire on you.
Obviously someone wants to know if your cargo is worth the suicide, and there is no protection from that In EVE.
A definite flaw in the game.
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Aglais
Caldari
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Posted - 2011.03.26 15:01:00 -
[43]
I think EVE lost a bit of it's luster once I was told that in order to not die horribly in a fire in PvP I had to train for cookie-cutter fit ruptures and vagabonds, and if I wanted to stay with my Caldari ships I was EWAR or else I wasn't in fleet. Or drake. Which I like flying just as much as I like flying ewar.
I'd rathter sustain a head injury than fly ewar.
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Corina's Bodyguard
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Posted - 2011.03.26 16:07:00 -
[44]
Originally by: Aglais I think EVE lost a bit of it's luster once I was told that in order to not die horribly in a fire in PvP I had to train for cookie-cutter fit ruptures and vagabonds, and if I wanted to stay with my Caldari ships I was EWAR or else I wasn't in fleet. Or drake. Which I like flying just as much as I like flying ewar.
I'd rathter sustain a head injury than fly ewar.
Whoever told you that is a moron. There are plenty of fits that kill cookie cutter fits. They just tend to be rather expensive...
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Xarissa de Tolnos
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Posted - 2011.03.26 17:50:00 -
[45]
Originally by: CCP Spitfire Moved from 'EVE General Discussion', offtopic and trolling posts removed.
Please keep the discussion civil.
How does this belong in the ideas section? The Warp-to Zero is under the commonly proposed ideas section.
Also - this guy wants it due to losses in lowsec (apparently) ... lowsec is designed for combat ... now who wanted scanners removed? can't find it ... sure it was there ... well, if we're now supposed to be customs, that's going to be very difficult to introduce, I'd say just add in a better buffer tank if you're worried about the suicide gankers.
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Johnny Lou
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Posted - 2011.03.27 02:51:00 -
[46]
The problem with eve is not that it's a sandbox but the fact that only certain groups of players get to decide the "rules" (aka "acceptable game mechanics") of this sandbox.
For example: mission runners might want the wrecks attributed to them and anyone who salvages their wreck flagged the same way as if they stole the loot but the ninja salvagers don't like that. Ninjas win.
And the list could go on and on and on.
The only true advantage EVE has over other MMO's is the technology. From a technological point of view it's the best space game out there so far. And they've been around long enough to create a very vast game world which is not easy to achieve by a new game.
If ccp were to make the technology available to another company and allow them to create a different sandbox with it's own game mechanics which wouldn't be so ******* oriented, then EVE would have some serious competition... but that goes against the eve policy.
It's a shame they don't allow certain groups of players to decide for certain areas of space. (The same way different countries have different rules decided by the people who live there).
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Iris Saavedra
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Posted - 2011.03.27 16:40:00 -
[47]
I wonder if this is how you people act at FanFest...
I really do like the prison yard analogy, better than the sandbox. I think it really captures the sort of might-makes-right mentality prevalent amongst the EVE population, and especially the forum population. The problem with the whole argument is that it rests on one person's definition of fun. What's fun for Neo might not be fun for me or for Tippia. Everyone has a different idea of what's fun for them. For the griefer, disrupting or ruining another player's experience is fun. For the troll, ****ing someone off online is fun. For the PvPer, winning a battle against another player is fun. For the social player, chatting with other people and potentially making new friends is fun. For the mission runner, blowing up mindless NPC ships is fun (maybe). It all depends.
The problem on this forum is that everyone expects that their idea of fun is the only correct one and that anyone playing EVE should be playing for that reason alone. That's the impression that I get anyway. |
Neo Omni
Gallente
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Posted - 2011.03.27 17:12:00 -
[48]
Edited by: Neo Omni on 27/03/2011 17:15:26 Edited by: Neo Omni on 27/03/2011 17:13:15
Originally by: Iris Saavedra I wonder if this is how you people act at FanFest...
I really do like the prison yard analogy, better than the sandbox. I think it really captures the sort of might-makes-right mentality prevalent amongst the EVE population, and especially the forum population. The problem with the whole argument is that it rests on one person's definition of fun. What's fun for Neo might not be fun for me or for Tippia. Everyone has a different idea of what's fun for them. For the griefer, disrupting or ruining another player's experience is fun. For the troll, ****ing someone off online is fun. For the PvPer, winning a battle against another player is fun. For the social player, chatting with other people and potentially making new friends is fun. For the mission runner, blowing up mindless NPC ships is fun (maybe). It all depends.
The problem on this forum is that everyone expects that their idea of fun is the only correct one and that anyone playing EVE should be playing for that reason alone. That's the impression that I get anyway.
Good reply.
I'm just wondering if making EVE "fun" for everyone will infringe on some other player's idea of "fun" as well.
For example, up until recently the flaws in the contract system allowed for bogus contracts based solely on a player's misreading 100,000 for 100,000,000. They are still out there, but now very OBVIOUS to spot. A lot of people (those benefiting from it) said it was part of game-play and if you were too stupid to misread 100k for 1000k then it's your fault.
Would auto-WTZ infringe on the gate-camper's idea of fun if I happen to forget to WTZ in a low sec area?
Would an EVE central bank and stock exchange infringe on player's "fun" because honest assessment of their stock would become accurate knowledge instead of guess-timations.
It's as if this sandbox/"card" game is only fun for those that know the cards are marked and also has an extra Ace of Spades in there if they can locate it in the deck.
That is where the "sandbox" definition starts getting blurred.
Playing with loaded dice is not much fun, and for now the lack of "balance" in all aspects of EVE-play makes it feel as such.
EVE does not revolve around PVP alone. I wish someone would understand that at CCP.
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HomeGrownBudZ
modro R.A.G.E
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Posted - 2011.03.27 19:38:00 -
[49]
This is ridiculous. Surprised its not locked yet.
The thought that you guys think EvE/CCP is all about PvP. Your wrong, Consider the placement of all the current players in eve. Now, how many live in Empire/Hisec? Remember when W @ 15 was replaced with 0, Your welcome carebears. Why would they worry about the (assuming) less than 20% of the players who PvP? In the last few patches they have been trying to get you guys out of empire and into 0.0. Dominion Sov upgrades made it easier and more appealing for smaller groups to get into 0.0 They added and re-buffed many missions (for you carebears), Fixed the contracts for all you Jita monkeys. This game revolves around empire carebears, since that is the majority of CCPs paycheck. If you had a list of 10 things to do, would you start with the least important? This game will go nowhere if CCP is constantly tending to carebear tears. How bout we take a step back, and let them develop their own game how they want it. you don't HAVE to play it, while your at it, make ur own space game where nobody can shoot you and you can haul useless stuff around all day to your hearts content.
As far as 'small groups' not being able to do anything, absurd. Make friends, force people to be your friends, prove your better than everyone else, or GTFO. Don't expect everything to get handed to you because this game is 'too hard'. You think the NC/BoB/IT/RUS just formed overnight with that many players? Its a growing and building experience. Rome wasn't built in a day.
Make a name for yourself, make allies, and do something that YOU think matters or is fun. isn't THAT supposed to be the whole point of this game? if what you want to do is haul $h!t around empire all day, and your just bad at it; Why are you complaining?
HTFU.
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Johnny Lou
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Posted - 2011.03.27 20:22:00 -
[50]
Originally by: HomeGrownBudZ
The thought that you guys think EvE/CCP is all about PvP. Your wrong, Consider the placement of all the current players in eve.
placement and pvp are two different things
Originally by: HomeGrownBudZ
In the last few patches they have been trying to get you guys out of empire and into 0.0.
same as before; besides, the only reason anyone wants that is to have more pvp fights.
Originally by: HomeGrownBudZ
They added and re-buffed many missions
what are you talking about? (besides the l4 epic arcs which was so long ago)
Originally by: HomeGrownBudZ
This game revolves around empire carebears
what game have you been playing?
Originally by: HomeGrownBudZ
force people to be your friends
yeah, that's just dumb but comes as no surprise after all you've said so far.
Originally by: HomeGrownBudZ
prove your better than everyone else
yet another dumb concept since only one can be better than everyone else; again, no surprise.
Originally by: HomeGrownBudZ
Rome wasn't built in a day.
here's another saying for you: "to each his own" give it some thought
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Cassus Temon
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Posted - 2011.03.27 23:32:00 -
[51]
Originally by: CCP Spitfire Moved from 'EVE General Discussion', offtopic and trolling posts removed.
Please keep the discussion civil.
I think you missed some I wouldn't have known they were removed; until you mentioned it, in this post
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Cassus Temon
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Posted - 2011.03.27 23:38:00 -
[52]
Originally by: okst666 Edited by: okst666 on 14/03/2011 23:11:33 if eve does not like you, why are you still here?
You don't have to be a courier..try something else....
We had our first lowsec trip tonight...OMG it was so filled with adrenaline..
6 lowsec systems full of nothing (except a minmatar-bc...who warped away as he saw we were three)..
In the last system we were naughty and waited for the blob...they have got one of us(wreck+pod)...but it was total fun.
I can say for myself, I am almost stunned in pvp situations..I shot hundrets of void M, but I can't remember I clicked to orbit the target.
They outnumbered us and 2 of us made it out..poor corpmate who lost his pod and implants.. But nevertheless it was better fun than shipspinning@forcefields.
One of the few posts, that doesn't count as trolling; but, manages to highlight the whole point of the OP. EVE isn't supposed to be 100% PvP; and that shouldn't be what is required, to have fun. If that is the case; then there is something wrong.
With regards to the poster: So, what do you do; when you run out of ISK, losing ships?
As for the rest: Thank's Riedle, you highlighted perfectly; what an ignorant PvP addict looks like. The rest of you; don't look much better.
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Cassus Temon
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Posted - 2011.03.27 23:57:00 -
[53]
So, that being said, and with the major portion of this threads content and opinions; I think we should go to this thread, and just agree, that all income should be passive, so we can get back to PvP. Something which, by what I've garnered here; is the only real reason, to play EVE.
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