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Nicole Genebin
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Posted - 2011.03.22 08:46:00 -
[121]
 Originally by: Krythas
Originally by: Nicole Genebin
The only technical way to proof viaris donations going through is ccp confirming or denying it.
And this is the very point. CCP will NOT verify anything. As a result, there is 0 trust here, we all have to believe the word of someone that is likely to be a scammer and has shown in this thread alone that they reneg on their word. And that's not even looking into past history, which, when a cursory glance was made seemed to indicate that they wouldn't even have the original 50bn in the first place.
Originally by: Nicole Genebin
If they nevertheless choose to not do so for whatever reasons, then i guess we'll just have to deal with it, like we have to with other trusted third parties. You take a look at the verifiable information available ingame, see what the person has to loose if banned and judge if the risk you take compared to selling on market against that.
And you know that that's never going to happen.
If it's never going to happen then what do you have to loose by pledging a few mio in case it does indeed happen ?
You wouldn't ever have to pay it if you were right.
Even if you were right you could edit it out and say you've never ever said it,
but still you're not willing to do so, maybe you fear risking your so much loved forum trust by having witnesses remember you said something like this ?
Originally by: Krythas
Its almost impossible to call out and would be VERY easy to fudge if CCP ever investigated.
The actual donation process would be very easy to verify by ccp as they only have to check that for every plex contracted to viaris there is a plex contracted to ccp for good in the given timeframe, no isk and partial donations involved.
This is not an operation running several months so he wouldn't need to do private plex trading at the same time either.
Originally by: Krythas
This is why its been called out as a SCAM amongst many other reasons, all in this thread, but seeing as the Alt army defending it are seemingly incapable of reading they keep bringing up the same arguments over and over.
What alt army ? i'm just a corpmate of his that's convinced he's doing a legit donation to help japan.
Saying that anyone supporting viaris is reality just an alt of him is rather weird.
I've put my stake in by contracting a plex in to viaris, if he's scamming he'll have scammed me too, but he'd loose my support ingame and that of lots of other corpmates for a meager 30 mio or so.
But so far i'm just seeing people asserting me of "trusted third parties" here in the forum while at the same time saying to not trust anyone as they're all scammers.
Not even a single pledge of a few mio in case ccp does confirm.
And tons of insults and namecalling.
Originally by: Krythas
Um, VVs fund alone has raised 85bn to date and is still going strong, with every last ISK of that going to PLEX for good.
surely you can at least point me to a listing or balance or something proofing this ?
oh i have to dig through x threads with only a few dozen pages to find it myself ? verrrrrry transparent and straightforward.
Originally by: Krythas
OP has raised what ? 2.3bn with no promise of actually sending the topiced amount.
He raised 7 plex with public donation of around 24mio per plex (he payed out 333mio per plex) and claims to have contracted 7 full plex to ccp already.
Not verifiable for us players without ccp of course, but you can't even be bothered to pledge a few mio let alone a full plex.
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Nicole Genebin
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Posted - 2011.03.22 08:50:00 -
[122]
Originally by: Krythas
Barbicane alone as also pledged 50bn which would put 'others' at 135bn and your glorious leader at 2.3bn (if we believe him)
which he isn't willing to pay out partially even if ccp confirms some plexes being donated.
Should the full donation happen i hope the trusted forum members will look to it that he does indeed pay up on his promise or loose this vlauable trust if he doesnt.
Originally by: Krythas
(also, if the original OP is really only worth 15% of 300bn, that'd make him a little short on actually donating the 50bn in the first place.. it is becoming a lot clearer now as to why he is trying to weasel out of it.)
Originally by: Krythas
Originally by: Nicole Genebin
Interesting, would you please explain how this information comes to be and how it can be verified ?
Learn to read forum threads ?
Point me to it please.
I'm not aware how it would be possible to find out how much wealth someone has, and would be very interested how this could be done.
While no ultimate proof, screenshots do sound like a good start to dispell some doubt. I'd appreciate it =)
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Breaker77
Gallente
Reclamation Industries
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Posted - 2011.03.22 10:16:00 -
[123]
Edited by: Breaker77 on 22/03/2011 10:16:30
Originally by: Nicole Genebin
I'm not aware how it would be possible to find out how much wealth someone has, and would be very interested how this could be done.
While no ultimate proof, screenshots do sound like a good start to dispell some doubt. I'd appreciate it =)
It's called a full API key.
With that, someone can verify wallet transactions/journal and assets.
Screenshots can be photoshopped, the API can not be altered.
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Nicole Genebin
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Posted - 2011.03.22 10:17:00 -
[124]
Originally by: Krythas
Um, VVs fund alone has raised 85bn to date and is still going strong, with every last ISK of that going to PLEX for good.
If said fund is as transparent as claimed, you or someone knowing the fund well should be able to point me to at least a list/balance or something to indicate this.
Please do, it'd be very interesting to see.
If indeed done this is also a very significant donation, and much appreciated.
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Nicole Genebin
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Posted - 2011.03.22 10:19:00 -
[125]
Originally by: Breaker77
It's called a full API key.
With that, someone can verify wallet transactions/journal and assets.
Screenshots can be photoshopped, the API can not be altered.
The full api also reveals personal dealings of whole account.
If you say this is not a problem, then i'd ask to see the api keys of all characters involved in the 85b donation that has been claimed as a show of goodwill please.
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Breaker77
Gallente
Reclamation Industries
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Posted - 2011.03.22 10:31:00 -
[126]
Originally by: Nicole Genebin
Originally by: Breaker77
It's called a full API key.
With that, someone can verify wallet transactions/journal and assets.
Screenshots can be photoshopped, the API can not be altered.
The full api also reveals personal dealings of whole account.
If you say this is not a problem, then i'd ask to see the api keys of all characters involved in the 85b donation that has been claimed as a show of goodwill please.
Well then go ahead and ask them, nothing is stopping you from asking.
However keep in mind there is no contract API, so there is no way to verify exactly what a private contract was for or who it was from/to. You can only see the ISK amount through the wallet journal.
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Nicole Genebin
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Posted - 2011.03.22 10:39:00 -
[127]
Originally by: Breaker77
Well then go ahead and ask them, nothing is stopping you from asking.
I just did. But so far i have not been given any info who donated how much.
Originally by: Breaker77
However keep in mind there is no contract API, so there is no way to verify exactly what a private contract was for or who it was from/to. You can only see the ISK amount through the wallet journal.
Then asking viaris his api key is pointless as well, what is to be verified is viaris contracting plex to the ccp account.
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Breaker77
Gallente
Reclamation Industries
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Posted - 2011.03.22 10:44:00 -
[128]
I'm pretty sure that the ISD will do a story on VV's donation if it is that significant which will more than likely have some confirmation from CCP in it as well.
There are not many people/corps/alliances that will just hand out 85 billion ISK even to CCP.
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Viaris
Global Economy Experts
Stellar Economy Experts
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Posted - 2011.03.22 12:19:00 -
[129]
Originally by: Malcorian Vandsteidt
I have a simple solution to solve.. some issues.
How about screen shots of the following:
1. Viorsis Personal account Showing the 50B
2. A screen Shot for the Contract screen for Every Single Contract COMPLETED, which was sent to CCP.
3. A Contract of His personal Wallet as well as the4 Corps wallet for EVERY Contract Accepted "Plex" as well as Every Transaction Dealing with any ISK transfers between teh 5th of march and the 31st of march.
I think this is sufficient data to at least... Get started with proving you are not scamming anyone. And it requires NO RISK on your part. Only Screenies.
So how about it?
Refuse this Digital Audit, and you are in Fact a Scamer and everyone on here and in the world of Eve will forever know your characters your alliance and anyone related to you is scum.
What do you think Kryth?
I took the liberty to make every ingame window transparent with my Legion in the bacground to counter your likely suspicioun of a photoshop job. If this does not satisfy you, I don't know what will.
My Loging Screen:
My Character Sheet:
My Wallet Transactions:
My Wallet Journal:
My Wallet Orders:
Completed Contracts:
Contract #1:
Contract #2:
Contract #3:
Contract #4:
Contract #5:
Contract #6:
Contract #7:
Contract #8:
Contract #9:
Mail To "CCP PLEX for GOOD" character asking for confirmation to the rest of the public:
EveHQ Personal Asset Worth approximate Evaluation based on market prices across both of my accounts:
This should be proof enough. Seek any further confirmations from CCP if you like.
Cheers,
Viaris
Chief Executive Officer
Global Economy Experts
Stellar Economy Experts
Viaris Japan Donation Drive |
Viaris
Global Economy Experts
Stellar Economy Experts
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Posted - 2011.03.22 12:23:00 -
[130]
Everything I have claimed to have done so far on this thread, I have really done. Those who deny it from now on are full of s-h-i-t, including Malcorian Vandsteidt and Krythas himself who claim:
Originally by: Krythas
Originally by: Nicole Genebin
Originally by: Krythas
(also, if the original OP is really only worth 15% of 300bn, that'd make him a little short on actually donating the 50bn in the first place.. it is becoming a lot clearer now as to why he is trying to weasel out of it.)
Interesting, would you please explain how this information comes to be and how it can be verified ?
Learn to read forum threads ?
Originally by: Malcorian Vandsteidt
I have several sources telling me that the.. Nicole Genebin Who has been Defending Viaris left and right is a member of His Corporation, in Fact she is a Director, and My Sources claim that she is one of his Alts, either on a Different account, or on the same one.
I am not sure whether this information is accurate or not (However I did look her up in game and she is a director in his corp), I am actually trying to get some screen shots of API accounts (But I doubt I will attain them)As part of this investigation.
However I thought everyone should know.
In addition if you look at Nicole's type structure and her wording, she uses the exact same words, phrases, and sentences to defend Viaris that Viaris uses himself.
I have also Discovered that Viaris's so called Large Alliance and Corp, Is not 8 years old The Corp was founded in 2005 on september 15th. This is Only 5 1/2 years, not 8 so he is lieing about this. The Corps member count is 130.
His Alliance Stellar economy Experts" Was formed in 2007 on August 17th and is 4 years old. and Has 8 other corps besides the executors.
The Alliances Combined estimated wealth is no where near 300 Billion, It's Wealth (Looking at economical Activity) is estimated around only 15% of that.
In addition the Alliances Owns No Sovereignty in any Space.
Scam? I think so.
As for what you have "discovered to be a lie", if you were not so full of s-h-i-t, mate, you would have actually read exactly what I posted on the very first page BEFORE your post, and I am quoting myself here:
Originally by: Viaris
I am well aware of the scams happening left and right and the extra caution that you exercise is well founded. While you can not truly trust anyone completely I would like to point out that if I was really trying to scam anyone here, I would be committing a virtual suicide in the face of a direct violation of CCP PfG guidelines. Whether I am likely to plot such a suicide is the main question. As I have pointed out, I have too much to lose: 8 year old 130m SP account and another one just like it, my reputation and credibility in the face of hundreds of my friends and peers in eve, the 6 years of hard work building a strong corporation and alliance, 300b isk in personal assets earned through honest labour over the years. Do you think it is worth losing all that in a bannable scam for a small gain of a mere 4b isk or 1.3% of my total worth? I will let you answer that question.
Originally by: Malcorian Vandsteidt
Character assassination? Yes.. I do this, and I do it well, In fact I do it so well that usually the evidence is so Concrete, people don't even bother denying it when I air their dirty laundry. (Viaris certainly hasn't... yet.)
EVERYONE no matter who you are in eve has Dirt. I am the one who finds it, and I am the one who can destroy you.
Consider yourself destroyed, Malcorian Vandsteidt. Your dirty laundry smells miles away.
I could keep quoting everyone else here who is full of s-h-i-t as a matter of fact. I will not waste any more time on scum like you.
Now where is YOUR proof of all your acclaimed good will and all that you have done? Where is proof that funds like VV or third parties like Chribba are handling all your donations as they claim that they do? |
Shar Tegral
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Posted - 2011.03.22 13:09:00 -
[131]
After my one addition I've stayed away from this thread simply because there is no way to say if this is a scam or not a scam. However I had not noticed this statement so I'll sidestep the topic to make this challenge: Originally by: Malcorian Vandsteidt
EVERYONE no matter who you are in eve has Dirt. I am the one who finds it, and I am the one who can destroy you.
I'll give you 1 billion isk if you can find any dirt on me sir. Without hesitation. Have at it.
Wealth, howsoever got, in Eve makes
Lords of morons and gentlemen of thieves;
Aptitude and intellect are needless here;
'Tis impudence and money that grants fame. |
Tutskii
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Posted - 2011.03.22 14:10:00 -
[132]
Thanks for posting the screenshots, Viaris, and for doing a good job :)
Best of luck with your initiative.
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Elise DarkStar
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Posted - 2011.03.22 14:37:00 -
[133]
1) :screenshots:
2) He will still come out on top even after shelling out for 7 plexes or whatever it is
3) This entire idea is fundamentally MORONIC. I can donate a plex to ccp and KNOW it will get there, or I can donate a plex to some other guy and it might get there.
How ****ing stupid do you have to be? Seriously. The fact that people are willing to go five pages with bull**** on this subforum just blows me away.
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Caldariftw123
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Posted - 2011.03.22 14:39:00 -
[134]
Originally by: Elise DarkStar
1) :screenshots:
2) He will still come out on top even after shelling out for 7 plexes or whatever it is
3) This entire idea is fundamentally MORONIC. I can donate a plex to ccp and KNOW it will get there, or I can donate a plex to some other guy and it might get there.
How ****ing stupid do you have to be? Seriously. The fact that people are willing to go five pages with bull**** on this subforum just blows me away.
People aren't donating an entire plex, they are donating (assuming this is legit) 30+- million isk having sold him the plex for 333mill. At least criticise accurately.
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Elise DarkStar
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Posted - 2011.03.22 14:48:00 -
[135]
Originally by: Caldariftw123
People aren't donating an entire plex, they are donating (assuming this is legit) 30+- million isk having sold him the plex for 333mill. At least criticise accurately.
Poor wording on my part. The point stands. I can donate directly or I can give money to someone who might donate it. The potential advantage of allowing people who don't have enough money to donate is in no way balanced with the potential that the money won't go anywhere but his pockets.
It's a fundamentally stupid idea.
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Krythas
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Posted - 2011.03.22 14:49:00 -
[136]
Hey Viaris,
Thanks for the screen shots, they seriously, do a lot toward showing this is a valid iniative.
Obviously, this is not practical going forward.
While I seriously think you are approaching this from the wrong way, I'll remove my SCAM notices for the moment, but man, you could have done this so much easier.
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CCP Zymurgist
Gallente
C C P
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Posted - 2011.03.22 15:00:00 -
[137]
Hi everybody,
We are locking this thread for the sales of PLEX on the forums. There are methods in game to do this and we currently don't allow it on the forums. We support Viaris's support of the PLEX for Good drive and encourage everyone to participate if they want. Please feel free to continue these purchases in-game via contracts and market.
Zymurgist
Community Representative
CCP NA, EVE Online
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