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KOTMC and their hosting of Sansha loyalists

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Rek Jaiga Minmatar Crimson Path Shaktipat Revelators	Posted - 2011.03.22 23:06:00 - [121] Originally by: Gosakumori Noh To spell it out, I am suggesting one slave-owning militaristic empire with a strong history of cybernetic augmentation gains an advantage in its efforts to Reclaim by dropping the pretense of horror at the activities of another slave-owning militaristic empire with a strong history of cybernetic augmentation. An Amarrian theologian would tell you the difference between Nation and the Amarr Empire is the treatment of the human soul and identity. In the Empire, slavery is a path to eternal salvation through God. The same Amarrian would regard Nation's "slavery" as something that takes the soul away and deprives it of salvation. While I do not agree with this view (I could explain why, if you wish to contact me privately), I have heard them in theology discussions.
Lyn Farel Knighthood of the Merciful Crown	Posted - 2011.03.22 23:38:00 - [122] Edited by: Lyn Farel on 22/03/2011 23:39:30 Originally by: Mel Lifera Edited by: Mel Lifera on 22/03/2011 22:12:53 My objection isn't to your policy of nonviolence in your establishment - it is a very sensible rule. My objection is to why Nation loyalists are free to enter and, indeed, even invited into, your "Keep" if they are truly your enemies. Frankly, your nebulous explanations of how things are "different" because they're not in their spaceships rather courageously defy logic. Nebulous ? I find them rather pretty clear. As Paladin Mintor said above, if they are free to come on Athra, that means the very Amarr Empire itself is allowing it. And I am told, the other Empires too. We are in a capsuleer world, Mel Lifera. Under CONCORD's rule, backed with the 4 major empires. Would it be mindless Sansha minions, I think our policy would be totally different, though they would probably be arrested before even entering atmosphere. Originally by: Laerise To quote a great man: 'Monkey see, monkey do. You hardly disappoint.' Another one said : 'A witty saying proves nothing.' Are you seriously willing to go this road ? Originally by: Sinjin Mokk First Eran, when you take a capsuleer out from his pod that is exatly the time when he regains his mortality. Hence it is the perfect time to arrest, chip, torture or otherwise kill an enemy of the Empire. If you're trying to gain intel from them you can get a lot more done with a TCMC and a blow torch than a glass of wine. Disection is also a favored option. Well lord Mokk, please show me the way to proceed.
Gosakumori Noh	Posted - 2011.03.22 23:43:00 - [123] Edited by: Gosakumori Noh on 22/03/2011 23:43:35 Originally by: Rek Jaiga An Amarrian theologian would tell you the difference between Nation and the Amarr Empire is the treatment of the human soul and identity. In the Empire, slavery is a path to eternal salvation through God. The same Amarrian would regard Nation's "slavery" as something that takes the soul away and deprives it of salvation. As an "Amarrian theologian," I understand the soul is given by God; and, that God alone may take it. If the body is enslaved through technological means so damaging that the soul departs, that soul nevertheless continues on its own path toward enlightenment. The fate of any man's body should stand as no barrier to political realignments of obvious benefit. To insist otherwise is to place the interests of the Empire's slaves before the interests of the Empire.
Rek Jaiga Minmatar Crimson Path Shaktipat Revelators	Posted - 2011.03.22 23:51:00 - [124] Originally by: Gosakumori Noh As an "Amarrian theologian," I understand the soul is given by God; and, that God alone may take it. If the body is enslaved through technological means so damaging that the soul departs, that soul nevertheless continues on its own path toward enlightenment. Well yes, precisely. Nation and the soul are not mutually exclusive. Hence, those that try to say the relationship between the Covenant and Nation (and thus by extension Sani Sabik faith and Nation) is farcical are, well, wrong. You get it, good sir.
Mel Lifera Gallente	Posted - 2011.03.23 00:43:00 - [125] Originally by: Lyn Farel Edited by: Lyn Farel on 22/03/2011 23:39:30 Nebulous ? I find them rather pretty clear. As Paladin Mintor said above, if they are free to come on Athra, that means the very Amarr Empire itself is allowing it. And I am told, the other Empires too. We are in a capsuleer world, Mel Lifera. Under CONCORD's rule, backed with the 4 major empires. So, unable to think or make decisions for yourselves, then. Reminds me of something, not sure what... Or are you able, but unwilling to make the decisions for yourselves? There's a word for that, but I would think it a rather un-Amarran word.
Sinjin Mokk Khanid Provincial Vanguard Vanguard Imperium	Posted - 2011.03.23 01:07:00 - [126] The moralistic differences between Khanid slavery vs. SanshaÆs Nation slavery through the use of implants. TCMCs were developed by Ishukone and were allowed to be legally used and sold with a helpful nudge from the Jovians. TCMCs and other cybernetic systems used by the Nation bear certain similarities, but are not exactly the same (according to current research). There is no documentation that shows their systems are in any way legal anywhere. TCMCs used by Khanid and others effect brain function, allowing for easy ôbehavior modification.ö Current intel suggests the Nation systems effect a good deal more and is generally viewed as ôpermanent behavioral alteration.ö To end behavior modification through the use of standard TCMCs, all one needs to do is remove the chip. To our best knowledge removal of a TCMC from a Nation loyalist has no effect and does not return the subject to their baseline brain-wave patterns. When the Khanid take slaves, they are generally culled from prisoners of war, heretics and criminals. The use of TCMCs is seen as a kinder and more efficient technique than the use of VITOC or other, crueler methods. The subject retains much of his original personality and the chip enhances brain-waves along certain patterns (for example, sociopaths begin to feel remorse for their actions). The Nation takes slaves in far greater numbers and purposefully targets civilian populations. Once taken, the subjectÆs original personality is erased and replaced with a new one. This is true ôdeath of personality.ö Some Nation slaves might appear to retain aspects of their original personality, but tests to date show that this could be subroutines in the programming. Khanid chips do not cause organic brain damage or alteration. It has yet to be determined if the same goes for Nation methods. There are, of course, theological reasons. LetÆs just keep it to ôA man may not serve two masters.ö I hope this will demonstrate that while Khanid and Sansha practices appear similar, the devil is indeed in the details. This is why it is ill-advised to consider the possibility of redemption in people who have been altered by the Nation. This is why we say that those who were lost are dead. New Tales of the Dark Amarr
Sinjin Mokk Khanid Provincial Vanguard Vanguard Imperium	Posted - 2011.03.23 01:15:00 - [127] Originally by: Revan Neferis Edited by: Revan Neferis on 22/03/2011 21:35:17 Originally by: Sinjin Mokk Sani Sabik... Neither of them are responsible for the abduction and death of SEVERAL MILLION AMARR CITIZENS Note for you: Mabnen. Catastrophe strikes amarr planet. Advice: Study the history of the enemies you intend to pretend knowledge about otherwise it might just give the impression that Amarrian loyalists are not only highly conflicted in their midst but also very Ignorant. Just a remark to correct your false information. Now do carry on with the thread, it's highly entertaining. RN Thrice-Illustrious Sovereign Sani Sabik I'm well aware of Mabnen. Add a few dozen additional worlds to that list and develop wormhole generation and then you too can be an arch-villian. I know this will go unheeded Milady, but keep in mind that Sansha most assuredly has a chip with your name on it. Do you really think you can get to him before he gets to you? In the meantime, please be patient. The Empire will deal with the Sani Sabik in the fullness of time. I don't suppose you'd care to repent now? New Tales of the Dark Amarr
Gosakumori Noh	Posted - 2011.03.23 01:30:00 - [128] Originally by: Sinjin Mokk This is why it is ill-advised to consider the possibility of redemption in people who have been altered by the Nation. This is why we say that those who were lost are dead. It is "ill-advised" to claim redemption depends upon how a soul comes to stand before God. Artificial trinkets applied in life will not thwart the will of Heaven in death.
Rek Jaiga Minmatar Crimson Path Shaktipat Revelators	Posted - 2011.03.23 03:53:00 - [129] I have a problem with so limited a concept of "salvation". There is no soul beyond salvation, simply because the power of "God" (I use parentheses not out of disrespect, but rather to point out that any name for or characterization of "God" would fall miserably short to capture its brilliance and glory) is infinite, or rather transcends comprehension. Enlightenment lies in the self, and the realization of "God" (or "It", or "the True Path", or any number of such names describing the highest ultimate power and reality). It follows that the common human tendencies to pigeon-hole "God" into a particular set of properties is the wrong approach and we should revise our way of thinking about "God". Master Kuvakei offers such an alternative approach. He's rightfully called himself a Messiah.
Ashar KorAzor Order of the Blessed Sisters of Amarr	Posted - 2011.03.23 09:47:00 - [130] Comms discipline. Someone exercise it.
Mra Rednu Amarr PIE Inc.	Posted - 2011.03.23 11:50:00 - [131] Originally by: Ashar KorAzor Comms discipline. Someone exercise it. Indeed, also any chance of a summary of whats going on. I stumbled onto this very late and apart from a glance at page 3 to see some loon hero worshiping Admiral Blake ( not saying someone worshiping him makes them a loon, far from it, just saying that Revan whatsit seems a loon ) I not feel like wading through 5 pages just to find out someones butthurt about not getting an invite. btw I not got an invite.........
Niraia Zaratha Zarati Shaktipat Revelators	Posted - 2011.03.23 12:31:00 - [132] Edited by: Niraia on 23/03/2011 12:31:33 Originally by: Mra Rednu any chance of a summary of whats going on Originally by: Mra Rednu someones butthurt about not getting an invite Well done! The rest seems mostly irrelevant. I'm sad that there are no pictures of JiaLei dressed for the event being requested as proof of her attendance! - shipsofeve.com eohpoker.com sanshasnation.net
Lucius Vindictus Amarr East Khanid Trading	Posted - 2011.03.23 12:42:00 - [133] Edited by: Lucius Vindictus on 23/03/2011 12:44:29 Originally by: Mra Rednu Indeed, also any chance of a summary of whats going on. I stumbled onto this very late and apart from a glance at page 3 to see some loon hero worshiping Admiral Blake ( not saying someone worshiping him makes them a loon, far from it, just saying that Revan whatsit seems a loon ) I not feel like wading through 5 pages just to find out someones butthurt about not getting an invite. btw I not got an invite......... The long and short of it... The KoTMC uses an open-door policy in their public hall (which has been the case ever since it was first openened). Apparently all of a sudden this became a scandal after a masquerade was held there. Rather than handling the issue in closed chambers as one would expect of Amarrians, we are instead making a spectacle of ourselves. Bio Blog
Morwen Lagann Gallente Veto Corp	Posted - 2011.03.23 17:03:00 - [134] To be honest, I think the real issue here is that Seriphyn is just jealous that he wasn't invited to the ball (and apparently, was explicitly told not to come), and that on top of not being able to find a date when he decided to show up anyway after the event officially ended, none of the women still present were inclined to interact with him despite his so very crude comments and behavior in an attempt to rectify that. There's probably also some jealousy about the ability (or lack thereof) of his own organization to put on a high-class party of the caliber and style that the Knighthood managed this past weekend. I suppose I should thank him, though, considering his crude behavior chased Miss Lian over to me; the basse danse I shared with her was quite enjoyable and refreshing, after the rather exhausting (but still equally enjoyable) series of forms that I went through with Abbess Kor-Azor earlier in the evening. A few suggestions for next time, Seriphyn: - When you're told not to come to an event, don't. It makes you look even more like an ass than you do already. - Most women don't really react well, or appreciate, the crude sort of comments you were making about their clothing and appearance. Maybe it works with the *****s you're used to, but it won't work with any woman with some amount of self-respect, Nation loyalist or no. - As far as this stupid "space lesbian" conspiracy crap you keep spewing goes, did it ever occur to you that perhaps the reason many women aren't interested in you is the actual common factor in those situations? Namely, you? Anyway, all that aside and out of the way, my thanks to those who organized the ball, as well as the few people I had the opportunity to dance with while there. It was a lot of fun, and I've missed going to this sort of event - I'm eagerly looking forward to the next one.
Mel Lifera Gallente	Posted - 2011.03.24 22:45:00 - [135] Originally by: Morwen Lagann To be honest, I think the real issue here is that Seriphyn is just jealous that he wasn't invited to the ball (and apparently, was explicitly told not to come) Declaring loyalty to Kuvakei is sure to prevent any future "not invited" problems Seriphyn might face at The Keep. Just an independent observation.
Eran Mintor Minmatar Knighthood of the Merciful Crown	Posted - 2011.03.24 23:23:00 - [136] Independent my ass. WHO DO YOU WORK FOR?!?!?!?!?!?! ------------------------------------------------ Please re-size your signature to a maximum of 400 x 120 with the file size not exceeding 24000 bytes.Applebabe
Medarr Amarr ZeroSec	Posted - 2011.03.25 18:04:00 - [137] Originally by: Rek Jaiga Originally by: Niraia You must be the first person to see Jia-Lei and complain about it rather than wish she was on top of you, one way or another. Oh God, Niraia.. Have you been peeking into my personal logs? * browses the IGs a bit, then stumbles across this quotation line, grins a moment and makes a note in his log. * Toaster loyalists have a sence of humor... unexpected, must update knowledge base on them some time.
Mel Lifera Gallente Ambrye Logistics Ltd.	Posted - 2011.03.28 22:40:00 - [138] Originally by: Eran Mintor Independent my ass. WHO DO YOU WORK FOR?!?!?!?!?!?! Myself, just current.
Seriphyn Inhonores Gallente Eleutherian Guard	Posted - 2011.03.30 14:23:00 - [139] Well, former Nation loyalist pilot by the callsign of "Mister Screwball" is in the Knighthood, now. Remember to check for True Slave infiltrator implants. You can never tell who is implanted, and who isn't. ------------ Lum Gen Seriphyn Inhonores FDU Commanding Officer, Eleutherian Guard
Aldrith Shutaq Amarr Knighthood of the Merciful Crown	Posted - 2011.03.30 17:56:00 - [140] Ah, glad that you have noticed, M. Inhonores. Yes, after baffling this individual with our near-insane levels of openness and kindness we have managed to confuse him enough that he has found himself inducted into our organization as a penitent. We shall now attempt to bring him into the Light through service to our Empire. And don't worry about the implants, that's what bone saws and soup spoons are for. The Amarr Empire: assimilating through old-fashioned lobotomy since 20371 AD.
Mel Lifera Gallente Ambrye Logistics Ltd.	Posted - 2011.03.31 20:20:00 - [141] Originally by: Seriphyn Inhonores Well, former Nation loyalist pilot by the callsign of "Mister Screwball" is in the Knighthood, now. Predictable, really.
Kazuma Ry Amarr Knighthood of the Merciful Crown	Posted - 2011.03.31 22:35:00 - [142] Originally by: Mel Lifera Predictable, really. Please enlighten us on how this is "Predictable". Predictable in the fact that our "more or less" open door policy in the Public Hall of the Keep, has managed to show a Former Nation Loyalist that he was going down the wrong path, and brought him within our fold to go start his live anew as a follower of the Amarrian Faith.
Sinjin Mokk Khanid Provincial Vanguard Vanguard Imperium	Posted - 2011.04.01 00:48:00 - [143] Edited by: Sinjin Mokk on 01/04/2011 00:48:49 I would be very interested indeed in knowing exactly how the miracle of his "cure" has occured. If a Nation loyalist can be brought back from thier re-programming, then this technique offers hope to tens of millions of people and their families. Those who were lost can be found and returned to us! It also gives us a way to apply this "cure" to each and every Nation member and thus completely reduce the population of Sansha loyalists to zero. So please, old friend. Please specify exactly how you have been able to obtain this individual's complete and utter loyalty to Amarr and the method by which you've been able to counter the programming that no one since Sansha's first rise to power has been able to do. New Tales of the Dark Amarr
Rytha Main Amarr PIE Inc.	Posted - 2011.04.01 01:19:00 - [144] Originally by: Sinjin Mokk Edited by: Sinjin Mokk on 01/04/2011 00:48:49 I would be very interested indeed in knowing exactly how the miracle of his "cure" has occured. If a Nation loyalist can be brought back from thier re-programming, then this technique offers hope to tens of millions of people and their families. Those who were lost can be found and returned to us! It also gives us a way to apply this "cure" to each and every Nation member and thus completely reduce the population of Sansha loyalists to zero. So please, old friend. Please specify exactly how you have been able to obtain this individual's complete and utter loyalty to Amarr and the method by which you've been able to counter the programming that no one since Sansha's first rise to power has been able to do. I too would like to know. And perhaps Mister Screwball could speak of his current situation and journey firsthand as well Amarr shall triumph for God is her Hero, and we are His champions.
Ryven Krennel Caldari Knighthood of the Merciful Crown	Posted - 2011.04.01 01:35:00 - [145] I can't speak authoritatively on "how.". I would suggest however that the power of Almighty God is greater than that of Kuvakei, wouldn't you agree? Or have these incursions shaken our faith? "I retrofitted my ships to fire produce. It's all the rage."
Kazuma Ry Amarr Knighthood of the Merciful Crown	Posted - 2011.04.01 05:04:00 - [146] Edited by: Kazuma Ry on 01/04/2011 05:06:51 Lord Mokk, I would like to be able to answer your questions, but alas I am not privy to that information, since I am not part of Mr Screwball's Enlightenment. But I would venture to state that he is not or has been an implanted Sansha slave. Partially since if we had found a way to reverse the implants put into a True Slave, we would have shared that information by now to the Amarrian Bloc.
Kahar Dex Amarr Defensores Fidei Curatores Veritatis Alliance	Posted - 2011.04.01 16:08:00 - [147] Originally by: Ryven Krennel I can't speak authoritatively on "how.". I would suggest however that the power of Almighty God is greater than that of Kuvakei, wouldn't you agree? Or have these incursions shaken our faith? Such faith. Modifying this statement a bit, and it could serve as a rallying cry for Amarr. pauses to consider
Mel Lifera Gallente Ambrye Logistics Ltd.	Posted - 2011.04.01 20:51:00 - [148] Originally by: Kazuma Ry Originally by: Mel Lifera Predictable, really. Please enlighten us on how this is "Predictable". Predictable in the fact that our "more or less" open door policy in the Public Hall of the Keep, has managed to show a Former Nation Loyalist that he was going down the wrong path, and brought him within our fold to go start his live anew as a follower of the Amarrian Faith. You truly believe that's what happened? You're more naive than I originally suspected.
Kazuma Ry Amarr Knighthood of the Merciful Crown	Posted - 2011.04.01 21:31:00 - [149] Originally by: Mel Lifera You truly believe that's what happened? You're more naive than I originally suspected. Interesting that prior to myself making a comment in this post, you thought I was "naive". Also, how does it make me "Naive" when I look upon a man and praise him for changing his life around, by accepting God. Like Squire Krennel stated: "Power of Almighty God is greater than that of Kuvakei."
Lyn Farel Knighthood of the Merciful Crown	Posted - 2011.04.02 12:25:00 - [150] It would be a very bad move to send a knwon Sansha sympathizer in infiltration in loyalist amarrian ranks, instead of someone totally unknown of everyone, looking like the perfect candidate in the first place. Anyway, time will tell, again, but we do not have a lot to lose, only things to gain. The former Sansha sympathizer in question has already started to work actively for us by defending the Amarrian territory. Time will tell if we were right, or if we were wrong. You cant gain or achieve something if you never try.

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