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Ariz Black
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Posted - 2011.04.07 12:48:00 -
[31]
i've seen pretty much every rig in the game used sensibly on one setup or another, though not in all sizes. e.g. the powergrid upgrade cpu reduction rig, can be quite useful on some frigates, but you wouldn't want it on a battleship. same for cpu upgrades rig, though that only affects 2 modules i think? point is, they're not all useless, just that some are very much edge-case usage. just dont forget rigs are meant to be a botched job that's added extra to an already complete ship, so yea, of course, it won't always be awesome.
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Sarah Teladi
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Posted - 2011.04.07 13:00:00 -
[32]
Alright i'll bite,
Some rigs do not work now they are in 3 sizes and should be removed i'll agree.
For instance small sentry drone damage rigs anyone? Show me a frig that can use more than one sentry drone at a time... (worm and ishkur can use one sentry and the dps of one sentry compared to a flight of small drones is a little over half).
But reguardless most rigs have a theoretical use it's just in the battletesting of eve they have been proved non-optimal.
Hell i know peeps who fit warpspeed rigs to ceptors so they can move around highsec faster people do use the odd stuff they just dont use them often.
Anyways I realise I've broken the code of forum posting so please accept my recommendation that you either A. Pod yourself, B. give me your stuff then play myFluufyAnimalOnline, C. must have some deficency either mental or physical that stops you seeing my point of view so I therefore have to write abuse at you or D. U mad Bro?
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kanojo1969
Blue Midget Corporation
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Posted - 2011.04.07 13:09:00 -
[33]
Edited by: kanojo1969 on 07/04/2011 13:10:40
8% of rigs are trash... thereby following Sturgeon's law, just like everything else in the universe.
Wikipedia
It still shocks me that so few people know about it, and are therefore doomed to spend their lives trying to change what isn't broke.
Signature removed due to no EvE content and is not suitable in any way. Navigator |
Teccmo
Gallente
Silent Knight Industries - Virtual Tech
Slacker Trade Federation Unlimited
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Posted - 2011.04.07 13:13:00 -
[34]
I didn't take the time to read all the trolling but I got the general idea.
I agree with you that rigs could be taken to another level, specialized for different tasks or even adding new elements to the game... but I don't see the rigs that exist now as being useless. I've bought and used a lot of less common rigs for specialized ships I have, improved scanning strength, hybrid turret damage for an arazu, agility rigs, etc ... the less common ones are nice if you have some strength in armor and shields already or resistances trained up for a combat ship ... but yea, they could do a lot more with rigs. Kinda boring reply, just waiting for the server to start accepting connections...thx lol
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===There is an eerie calm in space, fragile minds shatter=== |
Cynner Nashington
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Posted - 2011.04.07 13:15:00 -
[35]
 Originally by: Zaruzada
Conclusions and figures were derived from studying recomended fits and market orders over a 6 month period. The post was initiated to glean enough information to make sugestions to CCP.
It sounded like you want rigs that will help you grief POS owners, and are using the popularity of some rigs over others as justification.
As someone who manufactured and sold rigs for a good 6 months, I can tell you that all rigs do sell. Sure, some sell more quickly than others, but they all sell.
90% of suggeested fits are for DPS ships, and those are the ships that die in largest numbers which drives demand.
By your criteria, any rig that goes on speciality ships rather than DPS ships are useless.
Most recommended fits use trimarks and extenders over hardener rigs because the modules for hardners give larger boosts than the rigs. Recommended fits ignore things like whether your fleets use logistics, whether you are trying to keep costs down, etc.
Salvage tackle rigs are VERY useful on salvage ships but are not used in large numbers
The remote repair/shield transfer are very useful on logistics/carriers, but don't sell in large numbers as logistcs ships die less often then DPS ships.
Cargohold rigs are VERY useful on industrial ships... oh, but those aren't the suggested fits you are looking at and don't die in the quantities that DPS ships do.
Increasing a ship's warp speed is VERY nice for a forward scout or tackle, oh, but those are usually small ships so you do not count them.
ewar rigs are VERY nice, oh, but again, those ships are limited recommended fits and do not die as much, therefore, they are useless by your definition.
I could go on all day.
How about you come up with 10 rigs that you would consider useless.
Then, justify why it should be easier to grief POS owners based on a direct argument for that instead of trying to justify it based on a fallacy that 80% of rigs are useless and therefore POS grief rigs should be added so that there are some useful rigs.
OH WAIT!!!!! A "Scan POS labs to see what BPOs are in there" rigs would mostly be fitted on a small ship.... It wouldn't die that often. It wouldn't be used on the majority of DPS fits.
Therefore, by your criteria of how often it showed up on recommended fits and sales quantity of the medium variety, your suggested rigs would be USELESS.
Originally by: Zaruzada
My initial thought was that it may help players yet unfortunately my inner belief was that this forum would not be the correct medium to express my views as it is perpetuated by anal wa nke rs. I should have listened to my inner self cos it's obvious that none of you jokers GAF about the game and would prefer to lurk on the forum like cottagers in the local toilet.
Wrong. You want to grief POS owners, and you want rigs to help you do it. You knew "I wants to see what's in you labs and stealz it" would not go over well, so you came up with a strawman that "80% of rigs are useless" and used highly flawed criteria to justify that flawed argument.... criteria that would catigorize your own suggested rigs as useless.
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ROXGenghis
Missions Mining and Mayhem
Merciless.
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Posted - 2011.04.07 13:16:00 -
[36]
Originally by: kanojo1969
Edited by: kanojo1969 on 07/04/2011 13:10:40
8% of rigs are trash... thereby following Sturgeon's law, just like everything else in the universe.
Wikipedia
It still shocks me that so few people know about it, and are therefore doomed to spend their lives trying to change what isn't broke.
Great minds think alike.
- sig |
Sixtina KL
The Shoop Group
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Posted - 2011.04.07 13:34:00 -
[37]
Edited by: Sixtina KL on 07/04/2011 13:34:35
Edited by: Sixtina KL on 07/04/2011 13:34:12
So! If I understood correctly, the thread went from...
Quote:
We only find 20% of rigs to be useful. The rigs should be rebalanced in order to encourage a more varied use and a higher number of viable possibilities and arrangements.
to...
Quote:
WAAAAAH WAAAAAAAAH I WANT AN I WIN BUTTON CUZ I R STUPID FOOROOM UZAR NOOB!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!1111111111!!1!!!!111!!!1!!?!?1?!?1/!/1/1//11/!/!
gg, community. You never let me down. 
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Kesshisan
Minmatar
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Posted - 2011.04.07 13:37:00 -
[38]
Originally by: Teccmo
but I don't see the rigs that exist now as being useless.
Small Warhead Rigor Catalyst
A lot of rigs have their place in a non-FOTM ship. But I cannot find a reason to ever use a small rigor rig. Especially the small rigor II.
Perhaps someone smarter than me can come along and point out where a small rigor rig can be used to make maximum use of its 100 calibration (and 150 calibration for the small rigor II.)
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Garett Opiloi
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Posted - 2011.04.07 14:06:00 -
[39]
Semiconductor Memory Cell.
I can't think of a situation off the top of my head where CCC isn't better.
The issue isn't so much that some rigs are *useless*, it is that they are astronomically less useful than a set of common rigs (CCC, Rigors, Core Purger, Nanopump, Polycarb, the turret tracking\falloff\optimal rigs...). When was the last time you saw a Thermal Shielding rig instead of a Polycarb? Or a SMC instead of a CCC?
The LAST thing we need are *new* rig types - we need the existing, less useful, rigs to get a boost in utility.
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Doddy
Excidium.
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Posted - 2011.04.07 14:19:00 -
[40]
op doesn't understand that demand is not driven by how good something is but by how often it needs replaced. Rigs used in pve, be they aux nano, hacking, salvage whatever don't need replaced. Rigs which only have a point in pvp (trimarks, extender especially)need replaced constantly. Even within pvp rigs on ships which die less (cov ops with scanning rigs for example) have less demand. Demand does not in any way equate to usefelness. The ops examples of possible other rigs would also have very low demand (though as ships using them would die alot killed by pos guns the demand might rise) so by his logic would be fail also. Regardless both of them would surely be better covered (if they should be covered at all) by a module than a rig anyway so i think the op doesn't understand the "rig" concept.
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Patient 2428190
DEGRREE'Fo'FREE Internet Business School
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Posted - 2011.04.07 14:28:00 -
[41]
While I'm sure Ishkurs with 1x Garde II will become stylish... 
I think the Small Sentry Damage Augmentor is not very useful.
...Then when you stopped to think about it. All you really said was Lalala. |
Doddy
Excidium.
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Posted - 2011.04.07 14:38:00 -
[42]
Originally by: Garett Opiloi
Semiconductor Memory Cell.
I can't think of a situation off the top of my head where CCC isn't better.
When you are being neuted or are running something thats cap unstable for a short period of time. Specialist sure but useful at times none the less. The real problem with smc is in the cost balancing. It is more expensive than ccc, yet far less useful generally speaking. If they were reversed it would be just right. Thermal sheilding rig also has a specific purpose ( and idk why you compare it to poly which does totally different thing rather than dynamic fuel valve) in making mwd cap stable.
There are far less useful rigs than these. Someone already pointed out the small sentry rig but you should also consider liquid cooled electronics (afaik it reduces cpu use of sig amp and thats it). signal disruption amplifier which as far as i can tell is inferior to just fitting a ccc at all times. Warp core optimizer isn't much use unless you fly recons and live in space with 200 au jumps. Powergrid subroutine maximiser i cant see a setup where you would need that except for some wacky oversize cap battery stuff. Thats far less then "80% of rigs are useless" crap though.
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Lubomir Penev
Dark Nexxus
S I L E N T.
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Posted - 2011.04.07 14:38:00 -
[43]
It goes well with 80% of ships not being worth flying, and the 80% of modules only worth reprocessing... Dire state of balance you say?
There are no macrominers in EVE |
HeIIfire11
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Posted - 2011.04.07 14:42:00 -
[44]
I'd be happy if they let us remove them without destroying them.Its ******ed.
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Doddy
Excidium.
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Posted - 2011.04.07 14:45:00 -
[45]
Originally by: Kesshisan
Originally by: Teccmo
but I don't see the rigs that exist now as being useless.
Small Warhead Rigor Catalyst
A lot of rigs have their place in a non-FOTM ship. But I cannot find a reason to ever use a small rigor rig. Especially the small rigor II.
Perhaps someone smarter than me can come along and point out where a small rigor rig can be used to make maximum use of its 100 calibration (and 150 calibration for the small rigor II.)
Well i would go out on a limb and suggest trying to kill someone flying a wolf in a wolf-rayet c6 who has halos fitted, taking x-instinct and getting loki sig reduction bonus for a total sig radius of 8 (according to eft, no idea if that is accurate). Now that is specialist.
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