Pages: [1] :: one page |
|
Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 0 post(s) |
mistersparky
Estrale Frontiers
|
Posted - 2011.04.13 10:31:00 -
[1]
Edited by: mistersparky on 13/04/2011 10:31:20 The subject of neutral logistics and agro/docking/jumping mechanics has been brought up many times in the past. Many people would agree that it is an issue, and many would also say that its something thatÆs getting noticeably worse. ItÆs quite common in the main market hubs to see gangs getting into fights with more neutral logistics ships than combat ships. WhatÆs more, its very common place to see people using very expensive ships and setups in what is not too far from ôrisk free PvPö û which to many, including myself, seems unbalanced, and far from what Eve aspires to be.
IÆm not going to throw any extra ideas into the mix with regards to game mechanics, as it seems like many good ideas have already been presented. From simple solutions such as remote assistance modules resulting in a docking/jumping timer, to sharing whatever timers the receiving party has, to some more complicated but interesting solutions that revolve around new timers when ships providing support are aggressed.
Instead of all of this, I just wanted to know - does CCP and or the CMS consider the current mechanics of logistics, in particular neutral logistics, docking and jumping mechanics, to be an issue? In turn, is it something that CCP or the CMS plan to look at some point in the foreseeable future?
Thanks in advance for taking the time to read my post, and for any comments or feedback you might have on it.
|
Jerick Ludhowe
Tri-gun Auctorita Alliance
|
Posted - 2011.04.13 11:09:00 -
[2]
Neutral logistics is and will be an issue until the current mechanics are addressed. Remote repping and other logistical support should 100% cause a timer, no reasonable argument against it.
|
Pegasus IX
|
Posted - 2011.04.13 16:00:00 -
[3]
It certainly is an issue, and dealing with players that like to make use of these sort of mechanics is dreadfully annoying.
You can even look as far as neutral bumpers when it comes to mechanics exploits - but I am sure there is no way CCP would even think about trying to do something with that.
I believe it was mentioned at one point that they were going to implement some kind of changes to the undock mechanics that would stop people from de-aggressing and docking up, combined with the ability to see outside of the station while docked, but it has probably not been mentioned again by them in over a year... Not promising
|
Suitonia
Gallente Genos Occidere HYDRA RELOADED
|
Posted - 2011.04.13 16:12:00 -
[4]
http://wiki.eveonline.com/en/wiki/Docking_games_fix_%28CSM%29
It was raised and passed unanimously a year and a half ago... And still hasn't been addressed by CCP unfortunately. It doesn't seem to be something that would require a lot of work to implement either.
I think theres also a 14 page thread full of support raised by The Pitboss somewhere here in the assembly hall. ---
|
Pegasus IX
|
Posted - 2011.04.13 16:28:00 -
[5]
Originally by: Suitonia http://wiki.eveonline.com/en/wiki/Docking_games_fix_%28CSM%29
It was raised and passed unanimously a year and a half ago... And still hasn't been addressed by CCP unfortunately. It doesn't seem to be something that would require a lot of work to implement either.
I think theres also a 14 page thread full of support raised by The Pitboss somewhere here in the assembly hall.
Yes! The changes proposed would be AMAZING - and increase the amount of ships PWNT which is something CCP wants. I hope that the CSM can step up and follow the lead of their predecessors to advocate for this change.
|
Crazy KSK
|
Posted - 2011.04.13 17:24:00 -
[6]
Edited by: Crazy KSK on 13/04/2011 17:25:07
Originally by: Jerick Ludhowe Neutral logistics is and will be an issue until the current mechanics are addressed. Remote repping and other logistical support should 100% cause a timer, no reasonable argument against it.
I totally agree that there should be a station aggression timer for aiding someone with aggression
how ever gate timers would make it extremely hard to roam with logis in low sec as they have to keep repairing each other against gate guns they get shot by by having gcc so in order to move one gate they would have to wait out their gcc just to have to rep someone else in the next system and have to wait it out again to be able to move on
|
Hirana Yoshida
Behavioral Affront
|
Posted - 2011.04.13 17:46:00 -
[7]
Neutral assistance represents the same problem that a hot-drop does: An unscoutable additional force that can not be countered except by one of your own .. naturally it is being abused to no end.
I no longer engage known alt users at all, be it logis, boosters or cynos. Kind of running low on pew because of that though .. so many damn alts around
|
Swynet
|
Posted - 2011.04.14 19:45:00 -
[8]
Edited by: Swynet on 14/04/2011 19:48:15
Originally by: Jerick Ludhowe Neutral logistics is and will be an issue until the current mechanics are addressed. Remote repping and other logistical support should 100% cause a timer, no reasonable argument against it.
/agree
Seems that Eve game's about consequences of the choices you make, so this one is completely broken and decision=consequences image gets a good slap...
The actual mechaninc is totaly screwed, you can rep has neutral without being bodered but you can't rep your own corp/alli guys without seeing the pos shoot your ship (after engagements, something already repported)
Isn't that awesome? ________________________________________________
Originally by: Goose99 In EVE, PVE can happen anywhere, anytime. Whenever you undock, you subject yourself to involuntary PVE.
|
Gizznitt Malikite
Agony Unleashed
|
Posted - 2011.04.14 23:37:00 -
[9]
Be careful here... RR is an important part of small gangs, big fleets, and POS/sov operations. The proposed changes will have a significant rippling affect.
Should remote repping someone cause aggression??? I can see a legit argument for chaining down aggression, but I don't think this is "easy" to implement. Especially with the current mechanics!
If you notice current GCC mechanics, repping a ship with a GCC resets your GCC. In essence, two logies that previously ascertained a GCC can NOT get rid of the GCC as long as they are repping each other.
Now, if repping a ship with aggression resets your aggro timers too (the ones that prevent you from docking/jumping), then 2 logistics that previously incurred an aggression timer could NEVER de-aggress while repping each other. This would be TERRIBLE for fleet fights. Essentially, any fleet that tries to deaggress because the battlefield changed against them would either leave behind all of their logistics to die, or give up logistics for the time it takes to deaggress.
If the mechanics can be altered so RR'ing doesn't reset the timers, but just transfer's the current timer (!!!!Reliably!!!!!), then you can transfer docking/jumping aggro timers too, but not until then!
Note: While this change makes some sense, your essentially giving logistics pilots hell in doing so. Gate/docking mechanics are one of the few saving graces a logi pilot has to mitigate the risk to their fairly expensive ship. Risking 150m isk ships to save the typical BC hull is often just not worth it! Especially since they are typically primaried!
|
Ganthrithor
Caldari GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation
|
Posted - 2011.04.14 23:57:00 -
[10]
Edited by: Ganthrithor on 14/04/2011 23:59:43 Edited by: Ganthrithor on 14/04/2011 23:59:26 Edited by: Ganthrithor on 14/04/2011 23:58:46
Originally by: Jerick Ludhowe Neutral logistics is and will be an issue until the current mechanics are addressed. Remote repping and other logistical support should 100% cause a timer, no reasonable argument against it.
This. It would also stop the "gang jumps into another gang, all ships reapproach gate, logistics ships rep until they get to low health, then jump out and return a minute later" phenomenon. If you're contributing to a fight, you should be aggressed, simple as that.
Originally by: Gizznitt Malikite Note: While this change makes some sense, your essentially giving logistics pilots hell in doing so. Gate/docking mechanics are one of the few saving graces a logi pilot has to mitigate the risk to their fairly expensive ship. Risking 150m isk ships to save the typical BC hull is often just not worth it! Especially since they are typically primaried!
"What do you mean I might have to risk my ship expensive ship when fighting in it! Ridiculous!"
By your logic maybe we'd see fewer drake / scimitar gangs... definitely a plus in my book.
|
|
Gizznitt Malikite
Agony Unleashed
|
Posted - 2011.04.15 00:31:00 -
[11]
Originally by: Gizznitt Malikite
Now, if repping a ship with aggression resets your aggro timers too (the ones that prevent you from docking/jumping), then 2 logistics that previously incurred an aggression timer could NEVER de-aggress while repping each other. This would be TERRIBLE for fleet fights.
This is my main point!!!! And MUST be addressed before giving neutral reppers an aggression timer!!!!
|
King Rothgar
Autocannons Anonymous
|
Posted - 2011.04.15 13:02:00 -
[12]
I think it would be great. Out in low sec, neutral logi isn't an issue, it's openly hostile logi jumping in and out every 30s and there isn't a damn thing you can do about it unless you split your fleet in half to camp both sides of a gate. And that just encourages even more blobbing. Any remote effect, positive or negative, should result in a 1 minute aggro timer preventing docking and jumping by stargate. The current mechanics on WH's and jump drives are fine I think.
A related issue is people docking ships inside orca's and carriers while engaged. It goes back to that risk free pvp thing. Since the orca/carrier never shoots anything, it can just hump the station and instantly dock. A 1 minute aggro timer should be applied to it in addition to any timers the docking ship has. Thus far you shall read, but no further; for this is my sig. |
|
|
|
Pages: [1] :: one page |
First page | Previous page | Next page | Last page |