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Hazen Koraka HK Enterprises 40	Posted - 2012.09.04 07:25:00 - [1] - Quote So, I completed my training for covert ops cloak so I can fully use the buzzard I bought a week or so back. So I started fitting it last night and just discovered... it has no drone bay.. wth? Isn't it supposed to be a T2 version of the heron which has 1 drone? I wanted to fit this for an all round explorer ship, but now I'm left with no drone to clear out radars etc that have rats in. It also only has 3 highs, so you either forgoe the covops cloak (not wise if you wanna do losec) or drop the salvager - ok so you can't do magsites now either... And you're left with what, 1 high slot for a weapon (after using covops, and a probe launcher). Kinda gimped no? I guess it's not what this class of ship is meant to be (cloaky scout) but leaves a big hole. I may as well just stick with a heron I guess?
Vigo Carpath Power Limited 4	Posted - 2012.09.04 07:41:00 - [2] - Quote Hazen Koraka wrote: So, I completed my training for covert ops cloak so I can fully use the buzzard I bought a week or so back. So I started fitting it last night and just discovered... it has no drone bay.. wth? Isn't it supposed to be a T2 version of the heron which has 1 drone? I wanted to fit this for an all round explorer ship, but now I'm left with no drone to clear out radars etc that have rats in. It also only has 3 highs, so you either forgoe the covops cloak (not wise if you wanna do losec) or drop the salvager - ok so you can't do magsites now either... And you're left with what, 1 high slot for a weapon (after using covops, and a probe launcher). Kinda gimped no? I guess it's not what this class of ship is meant to be (cloaky scout) but leaves a big hole. I may as well just stick with a heron I guess? Did you bother to look at the ship before you bought it and trained for it?
Hazen Koraka HK Enterprises 40	Posted - 2012.09.04 07:47:00 - [3] - Quote Any constructive comments? Fitting examples? Would be helpful.....
Darius Brinn Iberians Iberians. 87	Posted - 2012.09.04 07:54:00 - [4] - Quote Hazen Koraka wrote: Kinda gimped no? I guess it's not what this class of ship is meant to be (cloaky scout) but leaves a big hole. I may as well just stick with a heron I guess? So, AFTER you trained for the Buzzard, you bothered to read the ship description. And you're considering the T1 counterpart of a Covops because it has ONE light drone. 0/10.
Hazen Koraka HK Enterprises 40	Posted - 2012.09.04 07:56:00 - [5] - Quote Honestly, wtf is with these trolls? So I didn't notice it has no frickkin drone bay... yeah. And yes, I'm reconsidering it because of that fact.. I guess I could just not bother with the covops cloak which I dont really need in hisec, but makes this ship _pointless_ for losec exploration solo, as you can no way clear out losec rats with just a single weapon, it would take forever no? Anyone with _actual_ experience of this rather than pointless trolling? Honestly....
Darius Brinn Iberians Iberians. 87	Posted - 2012.09.04 08:02:00 - [6] - Quote Hazen Koraka wrote: Honestly, wtf is with these trolls? So I didn't notice it has no frickkin drone bay... yeah. And yes, I'm reconsidering it because of that fact.. I guess I could just not bother with the covops cloak which I dont really need in hisec, but makes this ship _pointless_ for losec exploration solo, as you can no way clear out losec rats with just a single weapon, it would take forever no? Anyone with _actual_ experience of this rather than pointless trolling? Honestly.... Exactly, WHEN did you consider that a single light drone would be the deciding factor when it came to judging the capabilities of a ship for low-sec solo exploration? Do you think that if the Buzzard had a light drone it would make a viable and appropiate solo low-sec exploration ship, able to clear rats in less time than it takes to die of boredom, and survive? YOU are pointlessly trolling, and with this I end my participation in this irrelevant thread. I suggest everyone to do the same and let this one be the last message. It's the only way to force trolls to make an effort.
Hazen Koraka HK Enterprises 40	Posted - 2012.09.04 08:07:00 - [7] - Quote I've asked this in completely faith I am NOT trolling. I find dps output with just 1 T2 hobgoblin far better than I can project just using a single missile launcher. If this ship has a 10m3 drone bay it would be much more viable, esp in losec where I would need to at least be able to clear cruisers. I guess this ship is only useful for being a cloaky scout and not an exploration ship as I was hoping, esp. with it's nice scanning bonuses. As for your trolling issues, just go post in a constructive thread instead of trying to derail others which are trying to either get help or have a useful discussion.
Ashimat Reconfiguration Nation Transmission Lost 55	Posted - 2012.09.04 08:45:00 - [8] - Quote The covert ops are kinda a support ship focused on information. It's a scout, a information-gatherer, it's covert (!) stealthy, hard to catch and perfect to keep eyes on enemy. On top of all this it's the most efficient ship to find stuff you need to probe for. It's not meant to be used offensively. The most drastic thing you do is the occasional hero tackle or cyno. For all this things it's the perfect ship. If people was regarding information in the same way they did tank or dps, they would be crying for a nerf of covert ops. They are really that good. As fun as fitting guns on a cov ops and killing other cov ops is, i think you are just looking at it the wrong way. http://rnat-postmortem.blogspot.se
Hazen Koraka HK Enterprises 40	Posted - 2012.09.04 09:08:00 - [9] - Quote So I guess it's not wasted training, I'm sure it will come in handy some time, but I guess it won't work as I'd hoped as an exploration frigate. I guess I could wait until the winter rebalance of exploration frigates (T1) to see if that makes it any better. There's always the arbitrator or such like for exploration, but I dislike cruisers because they are too slow to align, esp when to be used in losec. I could use the buzzard in hisec I guess, as rats are only frigates or destroyers which I could kite and take out at range. Shame I can't also use the covops cloak if I do this. I guess the heron is still the best choice (would be an imicus but then there isn't enough mids to have both analyser, codebreaker and propulsion.
John Ratcliffe Sausy Sausages 6	Posted - 2012.09.04 09:38:00 - [10] - Quote Hazen Koraka wrote: Honestly, wtf is with these trolls? I think he's trying to say that you f*cked up, son. It isn't trolling if it's true. Back to the drawing board for you. The men waved their hats, the ladies their umbrellas. One felt they would have liked to touch the steel muscles of the most courageous champions since antiquity. Who will carry off the first prize, entering the pantheon where only supermen may go?
Marc Callan Interstellar Steel Templis Dragonaors 21	Posted - 2012.09.04 09:45:00 - [11] - Quote The common way to use something like a Buzzard in exploration is to use it to probe down sites - which it can do faster than the Heron - and then come back in a ship fit to run the sites. You won't find a full-fledged all-around explorer ship unless you're looking at T2 cruisers like the Ishtar, maybe a pirate cruiser like the Gila, or a Tech-III strategic cruiser like the Tengu. In the meantime, like they've said above, the Buzzard has a lot of uses beyond simple exploration. Probing down hostile players (not just sites), advanced intel ahead of fleets, and the Buzzard makes a truly nifty high-speed courier. Get practice with transitioning from gate-cloak to covops-cloak, and you'll be about 97.284%* gank-proof. *Plus or minus 4 percent or so.
Hazen Koraka HK Enterprises 40	Posted - 2012.09.04 09:58:00 - [12] - Quote Marc Callan wrote: The common way to use something like a Buzzard in exploration is to use it to probe down sites - which it can do faster than the Heron - and then come back in a ship fit to run the sites. You won't find a full-fledged all-around explorer ship unless you're looking at T2 cruisers like the Ishtar, maybe a pirate cruiser like the Gila, or a Tech-III strategic cruiser like the Tengu. In the meantime, like they've said above, the Buzzard has a lot of uses beyond simple exploration. Probing down hostile players (not just sites), advanced intel ahead of fleets, and the Buzzard makes a truly nifty high-speed courier. Get practice with transitioning from gate-cloak to covops-cloak, and you'll be about 97.284%* gank-proof. *Plus or minus 4 percent or so. I've tried fitting the Gila, and it's a tough one to fit, being tight on CPU. I guess it would be fine for running radars/mags but I think it would have trouble running DED 5/10s? If I fit for an explorer fit, it would be losing two midslots (codebreaker/analyser) which would seriously gimp it's tank. Do you have a good exploration Gila fit? I've asked elsewhere, but didn't get any hits. Also, I guess I can't have it all, cause like all cruisers, takes a while to align, so I could be caught at gates (need to practice the MWD cloaky trick more I guess).
Jack Miton Bite Me inc Elysian Empire 535	Posted - 2012.09.04 10:03:00 - [13] - Quote and the award for the single dumbest topic I have ever seen on the forums goes to....
Paikis Lycosa Syndicate Surely You're Joking 144	Posted - 2012.09.04 11:08:00 - [14] - Quote Jack Miton wrote: and the award for the single dumbest topic I have ever seen on the forums goes to.... This guy
Enderri Enderas State War Academy Caldari State 0	Posted - 2012.09.04 15:12:00 - [15] - Quote I don't get why people troll posts for the sakes of it. This guy obviously just wants to make an exploration ship out of a covops frigate, I don't see why that shouldn't be possible? After all, it has a lot of scanning bonuses no?
Zhilia Mann Tide Way Out Productions 636	Posted - 2012.09.04 15:43:00 - [16] - Quote Not a particular fan of the Gila, but this would do fine for Angel space: [Gila, exploration] Drone Damage Amplifier II Drone Damage Amplifier II Beta Reactor Control: Shield Power Relay I Beta Reactor Control: Shield Power Relay I Federation Navy 10MN MicroWarpdrive Large Shield Extender II Large Shield Extender II Adaptive Invulnerability Field II Pithum C-Type Explosive Deflection Amplifier Omnidirectional Tracking Link II Sisters Core Probe Launcher, Sisters Core Scanner Probe I Improved Cloaking Device II Prototype 'Arbalest' Light Missile Launcher, Mjolnir Light Missile [empty high slot] [empty high slot] Medium Core Defense Field Purger I Medium Core Defense Field Purger I Medium Core Defense Field Purger I Berserker II x5 Bouncer II x5 Garde II x5 Warrior II x5 Decent scanning skills and an AR-806 should mean you're able to pin anything with practice. I can't imagine it having trouble in Red Light District. Modifications needed for other rats, of course.
Hazen Koraka HK Enterprises 40	Posted - 2012.09.04 16:56:00 - [17] - Quote Thanks Zhilia for that fit, but if I wanted to specifically do both radars and magsites, as well as potential DED sites, the Gila I think wouldn't be viable? What could I drop to free 2 med slots? The tracking link and a shield extender? Would that gimp the tank too much?
Zhilia Mann Tide Way Out Productions 636	Posted - 2012.09.04 17:00:00 - [18] - Quote Hazen Koraka wrote: Thanks Zhilia for that fit, but if I wanted to specifically do both radars and magsites, as well as potential DED sites, the Gila I think wouldn't be viable? What could I drop to free 2 med slots? The tracking link and a shield extender? Would that gimp the tank too much? That's what your cargo hold is for. Most people who use T3s in low sec have a combat fit and a probing/professional site fit; do the same with your Gila. I'd drop the invuln and the omni for professional sites/probing and carry them to refit for a combat site if/when you find one.
Jack Miton Bite Me inc Elysian Empire 535	Posted - 2012.09.04 17:12:00 - [19] - Quote oh ffs... get a tengu like everyone else.
Miregar Shakor Brutor Tribe Minmatar Republic 21	Posted - 2012.09.04 17:38:00 - [20] - Quote Quoting Ship Description: Name: Buzzard Hull: Heron Class Role: Covert Ops Frigate Designed for commando and espionage operation, its main strength is the ability to travel unseen through enemy territory and to avoid unfavorable encounters. End quote. I don't really see the problem. Well, that's a lie - I see it rather clearly. The problem lies with OP's inability to use The Brain, thinking a scalpel is as good of a tool for logging trees as a chainsaw. Oh how I wish for an animated facepalm emoticon sometimes... Bonus stuff: [Buzzard, peek-a-boo] Micro Auxiliary Power Core I Damage Control II 1MN Afterburner II Warp Scrambler II Stasis Webifier II Stasis Webifier II Tracking Disruptor II, Optimal Range Disruption Script Covert Ops Cloaking Device II Rocket Launcher II, Caldari Navy Scourge Rocket Rocket Launcher II, Caldari Navy Scourge Rocket Small Warhead Calefaction Catalyst I Small Bay Loading Accelerator I
Hazen Koraka HK Enterprises 40	Posted - 2012.09.05 07:10:00 - [21] - Quote Miregar Shakor wrote: Quoting Ship Description: Name: Buzzard Hull: Heron Class Role: Covert Ops Frigate Designed for commando and espionage operation, its main strength is the ability to travel unseen through enemy territory and to avoid unfavorable encounters. End quote. I don't really see the problem. Well, that's a lie - I see it rather clearly. The problem lies with OP's inability to use The Brain, thinking a scalpel is as good of a tool for logging trees as a chainsaw. Oh how I wish for an animated facepalm emoticon sometimes... Bonus stuff: [Buzzard, peek-a-boo] Micro Auxiliary Power Core I Damage Control II 1MN Afterburner II Warp Scrambler II Stasis Webifier II Stasis Webifier II Tracking Disruptor II, Optimal Range Disruption Script Covert Ops Cloaking Device II Rocket Launcher II, Caldari Navy Scourge Rocket Rocket Launcher II, Caldari Navy Scourge Rocket Small Warhead Calefaction Catalyst I Small Bay Loading Accelerator I How about the above poster only spoonfed descriptions and inability to adapt and think of other ways of doing things? Possible? No, I didn' think so.
Hazen Koraka HK Enterprises 40	Posted - 2012.09.05 07:11:00 - [22] - Quote Zhilia Mann wrote: Hazen Koraka wrote: Thanks Zhilia for that fit, but if I wanted to specifically do both radars and magsites, as well as potential DED sites, the Gila I think wouldn't be viable? What could I drop to free 2 med slots? The tracking link and a shield extender? Would that gimp the tank too much? That's what your cargo hold is for. Most people who use T3s in low sec have a combat fit and a probing/professional site fit; do the same with your Gila. I'd drop the invuln and the omni for professional sites/probing and carry them to refit for a combat site if/when you find one. Ok I guess I could do that, thanks Zhilia, your about the only one in this thread with anything constructive to say. 90% trolls in a thread, this forum is really gone to ****.
Deena Amaj Community for Justice Resurrection by Election 32	Posted - 2012.09.06 00:36:00 - [23] - Quote Hazen Koraka wrote: Honestly, wtf is with these trolls? So I didn't notice it has no frickkin drone bay... yeah. And yes, I'm reconsidering it because of that fact.. I guess I could just not bother with the covops cloak which I dont really need in hisec, but makes this ship _pointless_ for losec exploration solo, as you can no way clear out losec rats with just a single weapon, it would take forever no? Anyone with _actual_ experience of this rather than pointless trolling? Honestly.... It is unfortunately a standard to receive troll replies (or whatever tone and level of douchebag-ness) on Eve forums. Indeed, there are no drones. Just to give you a heads up, the T1 variants may be receiving some 5 drones as according to the exploration frigate sticky @ Feature and Idea section. I see you posted there already. That said, I guess you really might be better off waiting for that patch to hit. Covops as they currently are are really for the espionage part. Regarding the commando part, it can be used for a few fun ideas: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=97DjUru5Xw0 I'm guessing the concept did not involve drones because they would interfere with re-cloaking and/or bumping you out of cloak. confirthisposmed I'm probably typing on a Tablet too, which means the auto-correct is silly and fixing typos is a pain. I ain't fixing them.
Klymer Hedion University Amarr Empire 38	Posted - 2012.09.06 01:15:00 - [24] - Quote I used a variation of the following with good results in high and low sec. The ship is cheap enough that I don't mind losing it in gate camps. My Buzzard I save for nullsec scouting duty. http://eve.battleclinic.com/loadout/53739-vexor-all-in-one-exploration-on-the-cheap.html Once I have Amarr trained up I'm going to give this a try. http://eve.battleclinic.com/loadout/32439-Pilgrim-All-in-one-Low-Sec-exploration.html
Hazen Koraka HK Enterprises 40	Posted - 2012.09.06 07:17:00 - [25] - Quote Kylmer, have you tried your vexor with DED 5/10s? I've never really tried running these yet, though I once had a slight go with a similar arbitrator fit. Saying that, it got completely owned as it was gurista's space, and I got overpowered by incoming missile fire, when the rats were at like 120km away, too far for drones, and my tank just couldn't handle it. I've also heard that you need something on the order of 500 dps to be able to break the overseers tank in a 5/10.
Aaron Greil Royal Imperial Navy Reserves 20	Posted - 2012.09.06 19:44:00 - [26] - Quote OP you got troll comments because (perhaps without realizing it) you asked a very dumb question. No ship was designed with the capabilities to solo exploration sites. Some ships, like the tengu, can be jury rigged to get the job done, but there is no ship class intended to both scan down, and complete low or zero sec sites by itself. This was intended as something to do as a small gang, or at very least, a pair. Eve has always been very hard on solo players. You are evidently new if you are just getting covertops for the first time, so nothing against you for not knowing. In low sec, you will likely fight battlecruiser and battleship sized rats in those sites. There is a snowball's chance in hell that two drones and a rocket could scratch a battleship. More likely, you won't be able to bust through a battleship's tank. You need about 150 dps (at a painfully slow minimum) to run sites. There are very few ships that can do this effectively, the ishtar and gila have both been named already, but both take some guts to fly in lowsec (especially for a new player). My personal recommendation is a covert proteus or a pilgrim. Both can explore decently well and be nice and safe doing it. Good luck.
Zhilia Mann Tide Way Out Productions 639	Posted - 2012.09.06 19:48:00 - [27] - Quote Hazen Koraka wrote: Kylmer, have you tried your vexor with DED 5/10s? I've never really tried running these yet, though I once had a slight go with a similar arbitrator fit. Saying that, it got completely owned as it was gurista's space, and I got overpowered by incoming missile fire, when the rats were at like 120km away, too far for drones, and my tank just couldn't handle it. I've also heard that you need something on the order of 500 dps to be able to break the overseers tank in a 5/10. That Vexor will diaf in a 5/10.
Bill Serkoff2 Tachyon Technology 64	Posted - 2012.09.06 20:50:00 - [28] - Quote Hazen Koraka wrote: Ok I guess I could do that, thanks Zhilia, you and Marc Callan are the only ones in this thread with anything constructive to say. 90% trolls in a thread, this forum is really gone to ***. 90%? Wow, this forum got less trolls? "The Cyclone and the Drake are two ships which will basically never be good for shield tanking, primarily because they have almost no lowslots in addition to shield tanking bonuses. "* *-Iam Widdershins*
Malcanis Vanishing Point. The Initiative. 4540	Posted - 2012.09.06 20:53:00 - [29] - Quote Hazen Koraka wrote: So, I completed my training for covert ops cloak so I can fully use the buzzard I bought a week or so back. So I started fitting it last night and just discovered... it has no drone bay.. wth? Isn't it supposed to be a T2 version of the heron which has 1 drone? I wanted to fit this for an all round explorer ship, but now I'm left with no drone to clear out radars etc that have rats in. It also only has 3 highs, so you either forgoe the covops cloak (not wise if you wanna do losec) or drop the salvager - ok so you can't do magsites now either... And you're left with what, 1 high slot for a weapon (after using covops, and a probe launcher). Kinda gimped no? I guess it's not what this class of ship is meant to be (cloaky scout) but leaves a big hole. I may as well just stick with a heron I guess? Try the Manticore. Malcanis' Law: Any proposal justified on the basis that "it will benefit new players" is invariably to the greater advantage of older, richer players. Things to do in EVE:-áhttp://swiftandbitter.com/eve/wtd/
Zan Shiro Alternative Enterprises 15	Posted - 2012.09.07 00:03:00 - [30] - Quote Hazen Koraka wrote: Ok I guess I could do that, thanks Zhilia, you and Marc Callan are the only ones in this thread with anything constructive to say. 90% trolls in a thread, this forum is really gone to ****. they aren't trolling actually, jsut not candy coating the fact you backed the wrong pony on this one. Cov Ops you find and BM the site, go back and get the ship that will actually run the site. Or you run the CO on an alt. Your "all in one" explorers would be t3's like tengu. Can fit the subs to probe and run them half decent. But even here, if solo the ideal method is probe, bm, dock, rearm for combat and run the site. Myabe bc's like drake. Or you can do this with frigate runs it must be frigs by doing the following:. worm. lots of drones, can have some high slot deeps and a probe luancher maybe caldari af's. The rockets don't thrill me for this to be honest. x-train winmatar, run jag/wolf. they have the 3/4 high slots for guns. left over high slot launcher can be the probe launcher. Stick whatever the site needs in mid and tank the rest to your liking. I prefer jag for pve personally. Won't have the deeps of the wolf but you get better fitting flexibility. And she speed/sig tanks nice imo. this option if shooting drones alot I'd go 150 AC max. I find it a decent mix of deeps and tracking. Probably be easier fitting for probe luancher as well (cba to eft one atm lol). yes...you don't get probe bonii with non CO frigate options. But as youa re seeing with your CO, you are getting that but not offensive ability. Gonna have to pick your poison here. Longer probe times but can run the site, or fast find time and you can't run the site worth a damn.

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