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Typhon66
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Posted - 2011.05.11 18:21:00 -
[1]
But i have a curious question. It was a gate camp of about 3-4 guys. Not here to complain just a simple question.
I was in a prowler with my cloaking device on. And they locked onto me with my cloak on and killed me. How exactly is that possible?
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foksieloy
Minmatar Brutor Tribe
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Posted - 2011.05.11 18:28:00 -
[2]
Multiple possible reasons:
- You lagged a bit before activating cloak which allowed them to lock you.
- During the time it took you to warp they succeeded in decloacking you
- You landed next to a can or wreck they left which decloacked you. A corpse would do too (and most people do not have them on overview).
- You accidentally double clicked your cloak in panic and decloaked yourself.
A few more esoteric things are possible, but you have 99% chance to have your answer above. _______________________ The best thing in EvE is Barrage M. |
Malcanis
Caldari Vanishing Point. The Initiative.
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Posted - 2011.05.11 18:39:00 -
[3]
Some larger camps will have a remote sensor boosted interceptor specifically to catch covops-clocked ships. They'll have a scan res so high (3000+) that even the tiniest gap between decloaking and recloaking gives them a chance to lock you. Even if it doesn't lock you, there's a chance that it can burn towards you quickly enough to decloak you, giving the other campers a chance to lock you.
Malcanis' Law: Whenever a mechanics change is proposed on behalf of "new players", that change is always to the overwhelming advantage of richer, older players. |
Typhon66
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Posted - 2011.05.11 18:45:00 -
[4]
So then how would i get by something like that? Thats why i got the blockade runner. Isnt that the point of a blockade runnner? You sacrifice cargo capacity for the ability to get by stuff like that?
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Traejun DiSanctis
Caldari
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Posted - 2011.05.11 18:48:00 -
[5]
Originally by: Typhon66 So then how would i get by something like that? Thats why i got the blockade runner. Isnt that the point of a blockade runnner? You sacrifice cargo capacity for the ability to get by stuff like that?
There is an answer to everything in this game. And nothing is 100% guaranteed to work exactly as you think every single time you use it. Bottom line, whether it was lag, human error, or something the camp gang figured out that works to deal with cloaked ships...you got got.
Move on. Next time, it will probably work. No guarantees the same will be true the time after that.
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Typhon66
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Posted - 2011.05.11 18:55:00 -
[6]
Edited by: Typhon66 on 11/05/2011 18:55:18
Originally by: Traejun DiSanctis
Originally by: Typhon66 So then how would i get by something like that? Thats why i got the blockade runner. Isnt that the point of a blockade runnner? You sacrifice cargo capacity for the ability to get by stuff like that?
There is an answer to everything in this game. And nothing is 100% guaranteed to work exactly as you think every single time you use it. Bottom line, whether it was lag, human error, or something the camp gang figured out that works to deal with cloaked ships...you got got.
Move on. Next time, it will probably work. No guarantees the same will be true the time after that.
I understand that, thats why i am here, what is the answer to what they did to me?
What mistake did i make? What could go differently so that this doesn't happen again? (at least as much as possible)
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Surfin's PlunderBunny
Minmatar The Python Cartel. The Defenders of Pen Island
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Posted - 2011.05.11 18:55:00 -
[7]
It wasn't on an alt by the name of Gaiias Baltar was it? Also, if you come within 2000m of anything you get decloaked. Of course there's a delay for when you see your ship come back but everyone else sees it the second the cloak disengages
Originally by: Jada Maroo Many legitimate news stories over the past few years would not have been brought to the forefront if not for Fox News.
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Typhon66
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Posted - 2011.05.11 19:53:00 -
[8]
Originally by: Surfin's PlunderBunny It wasn't on an alt by the name of Gaiias Baltar was it? Also, if you come within 2000m of anything you get decloaked. Of course there's a delay for when you see your ship come back but everyone else sees it the second the cloak disengages
No it happened on this character and i honestly didn't see the names of who did it.
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Traejun DiSanctis
Caldari
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Posted - 2011.05.11 20:01:00 -
[9]
Originally by: Typhon66 Edited by: Typhon66 on 11/05/2011 18:55:18
Originally by: Traejun DiSanctis
Originally by: Typhon66 So then how would i get by something like that? Thats why i got the blockade runner. Isnt that the point of a blockade runnner? You sacrifice cargo capacity for the ability to get by stuff like that?
There is an answer to everything in this game. And nothing is 100% guaranteed to work exactly as you think every single time you use it. Bottom line, whether it was lag, human error, or something the camp gang figured out that works to deal with cloaked ships...you got got.
Move on. Next time, it will probably work. No guarantees the same will be true the time after that.
I understand that, thats why i am here, what is the answer to what they did to me?
What mistake did i make? What could go differently so that this doesn't happen again? (at least as much as possible)
It's very likely that it was lag or accidental double-click. Just seems more probable.
There is an outside chance that the gang posted a ship or some containers at the "exit point" of the Gate - that is, the spot that ships emerge into the system when coming through that gate. I believe that's usually 12km from the mouth of the gate. If you crate a field of cargo containers in that general vicinity, cloaks will be disrupted before the unsuspecting mark knows what's happening.
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Tel'me Am Peur
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Posted - 2011.05.11 21:19:00 -
[10]
Originally by: Typhon66
What mistake did i make? What could go differently so that this doesn't happen again? (at least as much as possible)
They covered that part already. Unless you have a video of yourself playing and fraps of the event taking place i'm not sure any of us could tell you definitively.
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Easy Target
Minmatar Noir. Noir. Mercenary Group
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Posted - 2011.05.11 21:32:00 -
[11]
If you look in your Character sheet under combat log, then losses It will tell you who was involved in the kill
Just eve-mail the one who got the final blow and ask how they got you. Keep it nice and polite and none whiny and in most cases you will get a response.
Of course if it was a gate camp and was a busy night they may not remember you at all. :) ----------------------------------------------- Please resize your signature to the maximum allowed of 400 x 120 pixels with a maximum file size of 24000 bytes. Navigator
No i'm |
Toshiro GreyHawk
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Posted - 2011.05.12 01:51:00 -
[12]
It's better not to rely on the blockade runner's cloak alone.
A lot of it could be - that while you had a solution for them - they had a solution for you - and because they had done this a lot - they were better prepared for you than you were for them. Essentially, they were more experienced and just beat you because of it.
One thing - you want to think about is - when - and - if - you're even going to go through that gate.
Look at your map - it may still be screwed up - but if you filter by ships or pods killed - and you get a big orange blob - then that may not be such a good gate to go through. Look at pilots in space and see what you're dealing with.
Then use a scout. Ideally, you've got a scout that can go through the gate just before your runner - but if not - you can just scout the gate yourself. If you use a really nimble ship, especially a covert ops ship - you may be able to warp off before they get you - or - get back to the gate. Mostly - except for places like Rancer which are almost always camped - the camps come and go. Thus you can scout out ahead of your runner and at least have some idea of what you're getting into.
A lot of this is experience. There are tricks to everything and anybody who's more experienced is going to be better off than someone who isn't.
If you get a chance, say in some small cheap ship (with a cloak of course) - you could position yourself out away from a gate camp you find and watch them work.
The best experience though - would be to be part of a few gate camps yourself.
EVE isn't supposed to be a twitch game - but - sometimes split seconds can really matter and the guy who clicks fastest can win because of it. Knowing what you're doing, having done it dozens if not hundreds of times and knowing all the little permutations that things can take - gives a veteran of some activity a real advantage. He doesn't have to stop and think about what he's going to do - he's anticipated a lot and recognizes things for what they are immediately - and then acts on them instantly. He doesn't have to stop and think - he KNOWS what to do. It may not always work - but he knows what to do and that gives him a good chance that it will work.
Now for me - most of the times I've been uncloaked it was because I just got plopped next to a can or something after jumping and couldn't even turn on my cloak. Once - I was headed out away from a camp (cheap cloak - couldn't jump) but foolishly headed out in the direction of my destination. Some guy who was going to the same place - warped right by me and uncloaked me. Fortunately ... I wasn't facing a really good gate camp or I'd have not gotten away but I was in a frigate, so I just warped and made it.
I've had guys try to uncloak me by flying at me - but they were using a slow ship and I was able to head away from where they were going and avoid them. I knew what they were trying to do - but they didn't have a quick enough ship to pull it off - so I was able to avoid them. If they'd had a better ship ... I'd have been toast.
One good bit of experience here - is running these gate camps in crappy ships. You gain some game experience and have to act smarter since your equipment isn't as good. That and it hurts less if you get popped.
That and when you actually get into a piece of good equipment you really appreciate it.
Scouting out your whole route is a good idea if you've not been there before - and sometimes even if you have. Just don't assume that things will be just as you left them when you come back with your runner and it's expensive cargo. That's why it's best to have a scout in a Covert Ops ship going through gates right ahead of you.
. Orbiting vs. Kiting Faction Schools |
Serpents smile
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Posted - 2011.05.12 03:55:00 -
[13]
There's a lot of garbage fits on BC, this one however maybe of help to you. http://eve.battleclinic.com/loadout/18864-The-CORRECT-way-to-fit-a-Viator.html
It's for a viator but you can tweak it for your own blockade runner. Get evasive maneuvering to 5 and use your blockade runner *AS* a blockade runner and not a pimped down hauler and you'll slip through most camps.
GL!
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foksieloy
Minmatar Brutor Tribe
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Posted - 2011.05.12 06:00:00 -
[14]
Anyway, why it happened is covered by my post above.
How you could avoid it in the future? Keep calm.
Practice even. Have your corp mates make a gate camp and try to catch you. _______________________ The best thing in EvE is Barrage M. |
Hakkar'al Gallente
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Posted - 2011.05.12 06:31:00 -
[15]
Edited by: Hakkar''al Gallente on 12/05/2011 06:30:59
Originally by: foksieloy Multiple possible reasons:
- You lagged a bit before activating cloak which allowed them to lock you.
- During the time it took you to warp they succeeded in decloacking you
- You landed next to a can or wreck they left which decloacked you. A corpse would do too (and most people do not have them on overview).
- You accidentally double clicked your cloak in panic and decloaked yourself.
5. Gate campers burned towards your last known position and got lucky to uncloake you.
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foksieloy
Minmatar Brutor Tribe
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Posted - 2011.05.12 07:15:00 -
[16]
Originally by: Hakkar'al Gallente 5. Gate campers burned towards your last known position and got lucky to uncloake you.
That is covered by two :) _______________________ The best thing in EvE is Barrage M. |
Hakkar'al Gallente
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Posted - 2011.05.12 08:40:00 -
[17]
I fail at reading
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Azhpol
Gallente Casa Del Wombat
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Posted - 2011.05.12 09:16:00 -
[18]
1) From what I have heard biomasses no longer decloak, tho test that before you trust it(I don't enjoy flying covops so don't have huge amounts of experience)
2) when you just and see the neuts, draw a line from them through you(you have 30 sec of cloak when coming out of a gate) and make double click in space to fly in a line perpendicular to that line as you recloak... In other words, they will fly straight at you, get out of that line of flight to they are less likely to catch ya... once you have moved 5-10km out of that line then worry about warping away from the gate. This will not save you if they have a smart interceptor pilot dragging a cloud of drones, but under other situations it will increase your odds alot.
3) As I said, you have 30 seconds after coming through a gate where you are untouchable, as long as you don't try to move. Use it to get over the initial panic(no matter how many people tell you not to, your gonna panic) and then make your plan of escape based on what you see at the gate. With practice the time involved will drop to a couple seconds at most.
4) Your odds of survival are generally gonna be better if you try to get back to the gate to escape than trying to warp out. If you see your odds of getting your cloak up are low(basically, if there is a ceptor or other ship prone to fast locks within 40km of you) just run for the gate and hope you can make it through.
5) As said, practice. Get you a covops and go find gatecamps to try and run. Your gonna die alot learning it, but its the second best way to learn how to make it through a gate camp. Best way, once again, as already stated, is just to join a camp, listen to comms, and see what people do to escape you.
Good luck, and remember, all you can do is improve your odds, never can you be 100% safe in space.
----------------------------------------------- I don't post on an alt, I post on my forum main! |
Toshiro GreyHawk
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Posted - 2011.05.12 14:15:00 -
[19]
Edited by: Toshiro GreyHawk on 12/05/2011 14:18:22
Originally by: foksieloy
...
Practice even. Have your corp mates make a gate camp and try to catch you.
YES.
If you can get them to do it - YES.
Good experience all around at both camping and beating them.
Better if you have the skill set to swap roles so that each person can see the things that go with that role - and - since you're able to just keep doing it all you want - it's not nearly as boring as doing it for real - though ... doing it for real makes a difference too ...
Here ... once you all know what you're doing - make bets ... that will add a little tension to the situation.
. Orbiting vs. Kiting Faction Schools |
Terion Fierceglade
Gallente Shadow Directive
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Posted - 2011.05.13 08:25:00 -
[20]
Originally by: Toshiro GreyHawk He doesn't have to stop and think about what he's going to do - he's anticipated a lot and recognizes things for what they are immediately - and then acts on them instantly. He doesn't have to stop and think - he KNOWS what to do. It may not always work - but he knows what to do and that gives him a good chance that it will work.
Like a true Jedi Master.
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Toshiro GreyHawk
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Posted - 2011.05.13 09:43:00 -
[21]
Originally by: Terion Fierceglade
Originally by: Toshiro GreyHawk He doesn't have to stop and think about what he's going to do - he's anticipated a lot and recognizes things for what they are immediately - and then acts on them instantly. He doesn't have to stop and think - he KNOWS what to do. It may not always work - but he knows what to do and that gives him a good chance that it will work.
Like a true Jedi Master.
Ha! Ha! Yes ... just without the added boost from The Force ... (Jedi's cheat ...).
One thing I didn't have the space to mention was Proficiency.
Fighter Pilots - have to fly a certain number of hours per month to maintain their Proficiency. This is a certain level of competence at what they do - that allows them to do things the right way - without thinking about it - they just do it.
Proficiency can pretty much only come with flight time - or in the case of games - playing time - and can be lost ... sometimes quickly.
Story ...
When I was playing Planetside - I had multiple computers and multiple accounts. One of the Empires - the NC had a tank called the Vanguard - where the driver could control the tank with the keyboard from one computer and the gunner could control the gun with the mouse from another. Thus, this particular vehicle really lent itself to multi boxing.
By playing 4 hours a night during the week (I was still working then) and 10 hours a day on week ends - I developed a certain level of Proficiency with that weapon (as long as that was the only weapon I used). We worked an odd schedule that gave us 80 hours a pay period - but by working eight 9 hour days and one 8 hour day - we got every other Friday off. That meant every other week end - I had 3 days off and on Holidays I had 4 days off in a row - which meant - that I could, on occasion, play 4 ten hour (or more) days in a row.
Doing that - I noticed that after playing several 10 hour days - my Proficiency got really good. I could lob the shot from that 150mm gun on the Vanguard right where I wanted it. Now - this wasn't a straight line shot - you had to lob it up in a high trajectory with your sights well above your target - but I could do that. I could put those rounds right through the doors of towers from a good distance away - while I was moving at full speed. I could pop an armored Max unit standing on the peak of a hill with one shot while moving - I could shoot aircraft out of the sky with shots from that main gun. I was really ****ing good.
Then - I would have to go back to work - and my proficiency fell off ... Only playing 4 hours a night - wasn't good enough. But - when the weekend came - after I got in that first 10 hour day ... I was back in the zone ...
Now ... I don't do that any more ... Ha! Ha! ... I'm lucky if I get my skill queues updated now ... but I tell that story - to give people an idea of just how much of a difference playing time can make.
Another point about that story was that - I was NOT one of the really good players of that game ... there were guys who were much, MUCH better than I was.
The point of all that being - that there are people playing games - who are really, really good. Often - it is natural ability that contributes to their success - but it is more often, natural ability plus ... one hell of a lot of playing time that makes them as good as they are. Of course ... a lot of these people don't have that much of a life outside of the game ... but when they're in the game - they do very well.
If you run into one of these people in a pvp situation - you really need to be at the top of your own game - or you're toast.
Now of course - EVE isn't a shooter - so there's a degree to which this doesn't translate - but there is a degree to which it does.
*shrug*
. Orbiting vs. Kiting Faction Schools |
Azhpol
Gallente Casa Del Wombat
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Posted - 2011.05.16 11:53:00 -
[22]
PLANETSIDE!!!!!
My outfit specialized in wraiths... 9 Artillery pieces scattered around the map, one dude with a targeting laser and a cloak calling targets and giving us aim adjustments(5 degrees up, 3 left... I SAID LEFT, DAM YOU! I WAS 3 DEGREE RIGHT OF IT!!! ) we dominated every courtyard our armies had to take, and it got to where everyone took exactly 2 targeting shots during the spool up faze(one to see where it actually landed, and one to confirm you were on target. you never want to just open up until after you are confirmed on target, especially when you are running a full arty unit). After a couple months we decided to try doing black ops type stuff(we would wait for an army to commit on one continent and go start speed hacking entire continents to force them to break up their force) and when you tried to do the artillery thing again after about 5 days, we could barely get on target enough to hit the base walls, much less manage to keep all the vehicle pads unusable.
So yeah, planetside ruled, and you do have to practice constantly to keep skills in working order. ----------------------------------------------- I don't post on an alt, I post on my forum main! |
Toshiro GreyHawk
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Posted - 2011.05.18 12:41:00 -
[23]
Yeah, there's a number of ex-planetside players in EVE.
At one time, with my 3 accounts, I could put one guy in a Flail, spot for it with a stealther and cover it with an AA Max. There were times when I got a lot more kills with the AA Max than the Flail! Ha! Ha!
Orbiting vs. Kiting Faction Schools |
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