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Akita T
Caldari Navy Volunteer Task Force
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Posted - 2011.06.05 18:40:00 -
[1]
The first step seems to have been taken. I haven't personally tested it yet, but apparently, on SiSi now we have the option to NOT load the CQ environment. This is a decent fallback for the people with less than stellar performance machines which would be overwhelmed by the extremely graphics of the CQ, but it's a very poor compromise for people that actually wanted to run the CQ environment.
A much better fallback however would be the option to maintain the current hangar view alongside the CQ environment. Sure, start off new players inside the CQ if you want, make the option to load the old hangar instead of CQ hard to accidentally find in the menu if you want, but allow the option to remain. It even makes far more RP sense - the boarding of a pod and subsequent exit from it is supposed to be a relatively slow process, and you're not supposed to look exactly tidy (all covered in pod goo and naked) the moment you get out of a pod, so getting out of it every time you dock makes very little sense. Keeping the current station environment alongside CQ should not be such a big deal (I mean, how hard it can be NOT to delete something), and it would go a long way towards appeasing some people that don't even know yet that they'll be annoyed by its absence (let's face it, not everybody knows what's coming, and you can fully expect a horde of angry people coming to the forums for the first time to complain).
But let's say that for some reason, you can't keep the old hangar environments, no matter what reason. The current compromise only allows us to select between CQ at same graphics detail as the rest of the game, or no CQ at all (just a blank screen with the neocom on it, from what I understand). The problem that should be obvious with that is the fact even the lowest detail level CQ has a noticeably worse framerate compared to the highest detail level current hangar or space environment. CQ and space need to have two completely separate sets of graphics options, and a much lower graphics detail option than the ones available now needs to be present. Ideally, you should be able to set it in such a way that inside CQ you can get roughly the same FPS as you can get while flying in space. Granted, some parts of CQ would look like crap under those conditions and at the current development level (heck, some parts look bad even on highest everything right now), but that's a different story.
So, to recap: * keep the CQ environment as the default enabled option * keep the ESC menu option to not load any environment at all * do not delete the current hangar environments AND make them an alternative (default disabled) via the ESC menu * separate the CQ from the non-CQ graphics detail settings into two completely separate groups which you can set differently * add some even lower graphics detail levels for CQ _
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KaarBaak
Minmatar No Option Intrepid Crossing
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Posted - 2011.06.05 18:44:00 -
[2]
No
Circumstances rule men; men do not rule circumstances. --Herodotus, Histories
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Irulan Corinno
Caldari 714th SQN - Snowflakes
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Posted - 2011.06.05 18:47:00 -
[3]
Edited by: Irulan Corinno on 05/06/2011 18:47:46
Originally by: Akita T * add some even lower graphics detail levels for CQ
New low res CQ:
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Akita T
Caldari Navy Volunteer Task Force
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Posted - 2011.06.05 18:47:00 -
[4]
Edited by: Akita T on 05/06/2011 18:57:17
Originally by: KaarBaak No
No what ? You WANT to be unable to adjust the graphics settings in such a way as to have roughly the same FPS while docked or in space ? You WANT to redline your graphics card (which was running at under a third capacity before) every time you are docked unless you want to stare at a black screen with an interface on it ?
Here's a quick comparison of the performance with the earlier Duality build... Machine - GPU 460 GTX with 5% factory overclock, CPU i5 760, latest NVIDIA drivers, Win7Ult64 Resolution - 1600x1024 fixed window on 1600x1200@85Hz desktop, no AA Idle card temp 37¦C with room temp around 26¦C
| detail&FPS, vsynch off | card temp, vsynch on (85 FPS max) ------------|------------------------|---------------------------------- Station TQ | min 490 ; max 230 | min 44¦C ; max 56¦C Char recust.| min 230 ; max 83 | min 47¦C ; max 69¦C Duality CQ | min 150 ; max 60 | min 64¦C ; max 72¦C
As you can see, CQ FPS at the same graphics detail setting is between a third and a quarter of the FPS obtained in space. More importantly, CQ FPS is worse than the character recustomization screen FPS, which already caused problems for quite a few people. And as you can clearly see, the absolute lowest graphics details for CQ still yield a worse FPS than the highest graphics details for the space part. Sure, it's not fully optimized yet, but is anybody actually expecting a tripling of FPS after optimizations ? _
Make ISK||Build||React||1k papercuts
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Jita Bloodtear
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Posted - 2011.06.05 18:51:00 -
[5]
If we no longer need to load the CQ stuff that would make me very happy. Yes I want to see it, and I have no problem with it being in the game. But most of the time I wouldn't use it at all, especially as it's in the single player form atm. That being said, what is the alternative to no CQ? Black screen? Current ship spinner? --------------------------- Full Explanation of the Industry Index System |
Mirabi Tiane
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Posted - 2011.06.05 18:52:00 -
[6]
I'm sure KaarBaak upgrades their GPU every six months.
+1 support for this thread, by the way. |
Xurr
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Posted - 2011.06.05 18:58:00 -
[7]
I support this thread as well.
If CCP wants to play barbie dolls for plex fine. Leave me out.
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Burn Jita Down
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Posted - 2011.06.05 18:58:00 -
[8]
Originally by: Akita T
The first step seems to have been taken. I haven't personally tested it yet, but apparently, on SiSi now we have the option to NOT load the CQ environment. This is a decent fallback for the people with less than stellar performance machines which would be overwhelmed by the extremely graphics of the CQ, but it's a very poor compromise for people that actually wanted to run the CQ environment.
I'm fairly certain having the option to enter to CQ was an element which has always been there, even mentioned years ago when the forum wars raged about certain people not wanting WiS only more space stuff. Acting as if it was something which CCP added after the fact due to player request in the last month or so I think is inaccurate. I don't think it was a compromise for anything.
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cerbus
Aliastra
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Posted - 2011.06.05 19:00:00 -
[9]
Edited by: cerbus on 05/06/2011 19:01:36 why are all these threads ****ting up the Eve General forum. where are the mods to move them to the f&I and JP and AH forums?
where is Selene to take Akita T away to beat at my leisure.
Originally by: Burn Jita Down
Originally by: Akita T
The first step seems to have been taken. I haven't personally tested it yet, but apparently, on SiSi now we have the option to NOT load the CQ environment. This is a decent fallback for the people with less than stellar performance machines which would be overwhelmed by the extremely graphics of the CQ, but it's a very poor compromise for people that actually wanted to run the CQ environment.
I'm fairly certain having the option to enter to CQ was an element which has always been there, even mentioned years ago when the forum wars raged about certain people not wanting WiS only more space stuff. Acting as if it was something which CCP added after the fact due to player request in the last month or so I think is inaccurate. I don't think it was a compromise for anything.
Correct. It was brought up by the 5th CSM last year, and I know it had come up even earlier than that.
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Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
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Posted - 2011.06.05 19:02:00 -
[10]
Originally by: Burn Jita Down I'm fairly certain having the option to enter to CQ was an element which has always been there
Well, apart from the fact that, for the longest time, the option wasn't there, and CCP pretty much said that there wouldn't be an optionà no.
Quote: Acting as if it was something which CCP added after the fact due to player request in the last month or so I think is inaccurate.
It matches what has happened, so it seems more accurate than any other way of describing it. ùùù ôIf you're not willing to fight for what you have in ≡v≡à you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.ö ù Karath Piki |
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Akita T
Caldari Navy Volunteer Task Force
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Posted - 2011.06.05 19:03:00 -
[11]
Edited by: Akita T on 05/06/2011 19:05:24
Originally by: Burn Jita Down I'm fairly certain having the option to enter to CQ was an element which has always been there, even mentioned years ago when the forum wars raged about certain people not wanting WiS only more space stuff. Acting as if it was something which CCP added after the fact due to player request in the last month or so I think is inaccurate. I don't think it was a compromise for anything.
The duality build lacked the option to NOT load the CQ environment. Whether that was an oversight, or whether the SiSi option for that was added after player complaints is of a very distant secondary importance. Also, in the old days you speak of, CCP promised Incarna would be fully optional. CQ is part of Incarna. Then at the latest fanfest, they said it would no longer be quite so optional, REPLACING the current station environment (clearly specified that the current hangar environment would get deleted).
THE POINT is that CQ is here to stay, and I have nothing against that, but certain MINIMALISTIC options need to be possible, or else CQ would end up an universally hated feature. _
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Mag's
the united Negative Ten.
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Posted - 2011.06.05 19:10:00 -
[12]
Edited by: Mag''s on 05/06/2011 19:11:42
I support this thread.
I think it's great that we have Incarna for players, but would like CCP to stick to their promise that it would be an option.
Not everyone wants this every time we dock, for many it will get old very quickly.
Edit: Also, we lose ship spinning!!! I mean WTF CCP, it's an Eve tradition.
Originally by: Allestin Villimar Also, if your bookmarks are too far out, they can and will ban you for it.
Originally by: Torothanax Low population in w systems makes afk cloaking unattractive.
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Burn Jita Down
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Posted - 2011.06.05 19:15:00 -
[13]
It could have not been on the Test server for any number of reasons. One I can think of off the top of my head is that they wanted players to test CQ. I'm sure you would know that what they put on the test server isn't wait oh I get it. You guys don't care, it's just an opportunity to make discussion threads.
The option to enter or not enter CQ wasn't something you guys dreamed up in the last couple of months and it wasn't something that CCP gave into because of you.
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Adunh Slavy
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Posted - 2011.06.05 19:18:00 -
[14]
Why does it need to be on the escape menu at all? When we dock, give a button next to "Undock" for "Enter CQ/Incarna/Station". It need not be so complicated and hidden behind menus and oddly worded options.
Here we are three six patches into fixing the last expansion, and we want to rely on fcking with a basic part of the game like docking and undocking, just to show some pretty lights and a platform for a cash shop?
Should call this one boots.ini
The Real Space Initiative - V7
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Akita T
Caldari Navy Volunteer Task Force
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Posted - 2011.06.05 19:20:00 -
[15]
Edited by: Akita T on 05/06/2011 19:21:51
Originally by: Burn Jita Down It could have not been on the Test server for any number of reasons. One I can think of off the top of my head is that they wanted players to test CQ. I'm sure you would know that what they put on the test server isn't wait oh I get it. You guys don't care, it's just an opportunity to make discussion threads. The option to enter or not enter CQ wasn't something you guys dreamed up in the last couple of months and it wasn't something that CCP gave into because of you.
You don't get the option to not enter CQ. You always enter the CQ. You get the option to not load the graphics, but that's a different thing from not entering CQ. Keeping the current station environment would be the option to not enter CQ. Are you saying that you are all of a sudden sure that the current hangar environment would remain ? Even if all the latest CCP communications indicate it will get simply deleted ? Neither of that matters anyway. I am simply stating the minimal set of things that need to be in place for people to NOT hate the CQ. Whether that was exactly CCP's plan all along, and they would do exactly that regardless of what any of us say, or whether they don't do it at all in spite of player pleas, that doesn't change facts. Facts being, without those options, people WILL end up hating CQ.
Originally by: Adunh Slavy Why does it need to be on the escape menu at all? When we dock, give a button next to "Undock" for "Enter CQ/Incarna/Station". It need not be so complicated and hidden behind menus and oddly worded options.
I can understand the desire CCP has to have as many people stress-test the CQ environment as a preparation for "the full Incarna to come". As such, I am just listing the minimal set of compromises CCP would need to make to eat their cake but still have it afterwards.
_
Make ISK||Build||React||1k papercuts
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Grey Stormshadow
Starwreck Industries
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Posted - 2011.06.05 19:20:00 -
[16]
I usually tend to agree with Akita T, but this time I gotta disagree.
It is really great that we have option to disable CQ from esc menu now. This will reduce the memory usage of "alternate" clients and also most likely prevent the "can not play at all"-thread from appearing to forums when Incarna is released.
However... Incarna is part of EVEs future and captains quarters is only the beginning. It is important that people try to get used to it, test it and give feedback from the experience.
Leaving old station spinning to game would only increase the client size, give additional thing to worry about to devs during future updates.
If something could be changed, after docking, I would rather like to see the hangar any my ship from balcony, pilot still in the ship (invisible ofc) and option to leave ship given to me. Some animation would be bonus.
Anyways... I'm grateful for the latest changes. Overally CCP devs have been doing awesome work during past year. Only single things like the shortcut fiasco have been below the industry standards. New UI is really fast and CQ looks great and well optimized.
Keep up the good work. ------------------------------------------------- Play with the best - die like the rest starwreck.com - support the cause :) |
Hannibal Ord
Minmatar Noir. Noir. Mercenary Group
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Posted - 2011.06.05 19:28:00 -
[17]
Originally by: Grey Stormshadow .
Leaving old station spinning to game would only increase the client size, give additional thing to worry about to devs during future updates.
This has to be an epic troll of a comment. Truly.
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Akita T
Caldari Navy Volunteer Task Force
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Posted - 2011.06.05 19:29:00 -
[18]
Edited by: Akita T on 05/06/2011 19:32:04
Originally by: Grey Stormshadow I usually tend to agree with Akita T, but this time I gotta disagree. It is really great that we have option to disable CQ from esc menu now. This will reduce the memory usage of "alternate" clients and also most likely prevent the "can not play at all"-thread from appearing to forums when Incarna is released.
You can be sure you'll still get a crapload of "where is my hangar" thread from the many people that simply choose to not load CQ at all. Given the current lack of separate graphics detail options and the abysmal FPS gap, even people that WANT to fiddle around with CQ will eventually end up NOT loading it most of the time.
Quote: However... Incarna is part of EVEs future and captains quarters is only the beginning. It is important that people try to get used to it, test it and give feedback from the experience.
How much more feedback do you think you'll get if most people end up just not loading it AT ALL ? Having separate graphics detail options AND access to a set of even lower graphics settings will INCREASE the number of people that will keep loading CQ once the novelty factor wears off.
Quote: Leaving old station spinning to game would only increase the client size, give additional thing to worry about to devs during future updates.
The current station environment files are negligible in size compared to the CQ graphics assets. And the added need for testing stuff would be minimal - afterall, the neocom is separate from the environment, so that one would get tested regardless of it, and they don't really have to alter anything about the current hangar environment.
Quote: If something could be changed, after docking, I would rather like to see the hangar any my ship from balcony, pilot still in the ship (invisible ofc) and option to leave ship given to me. Some animation would be bonus.
Isn't that pretty much a part of what I suggested would be necessary ?
_
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Burn Jita Down
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Posted - 2011.06.05 19:29:00 -
[19]
I'm just excited it's here \o/ I've been waiting on it from the beginning. Considering the first day I was in game a turquoise and maroon poster in rookie help said it was coming soonÖ all those years ago... Actually that's pretty messed up now that I think about it.
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Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
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Posted - 2011.06.05 19:29:00 -
[20]
Edited by: Tippia on 05/06/2011 19:33:07
Originally by: Burn Jita Down It could have not been on the Test server for any number of reasons. One I can think of off the top of my head is that they wanted players to test CQ.
àand providing an option to not load CQ would not have kept that from happening.
Quote: You guys don't care, it's just an opportunity to make discussion threads.
No. We care, that's why we make discussion threads.
Quote: The option to enter or not enter CQ wasn't something you guys dreamed up in the last couple of months.
Seeing as how it didn't exist for those months and as how CCP said it wouldn't be optional, yes. Yes we did.
Quote: it wasn't something that CCP gave into because of you.
Well, you have a choice to make here: which way were CCP stupid?
Were they stupid by not answering the question that was posed on multiple occasions whether the CQ would be optional or not (and were they really really stupid by, at the same time, more or less claiming that it wouldn't be)? Or were they stupid for not implementing the option to begin with, in spite of previous promises to the contrary, and then changing their minds again?
Either way, they've been insanely inept in handling this, and at this point, they don't carry enough trust to come out and say "yes, we meant it to be like this all along" ù that train has long since passed. If they meant it to be optional all along, they should have said so, all along, when asked. They didn't. They rather said the opposite.
When people found a way to forcibly disable CQ, they went for the "Sorry, Dave, I can't let you do that" routine, mixed up with "àbecause the higher-ups say so" ù the final nail in the huge coffin they had built for themselves by repeatedly refusing to answer the question "will it be optional?" with a simple "yes."
So no, I feel pretty darn confident in saying that I, personally, am responsible for pressuring CCP into giving us what we wanted all along (which, ridiculously enough, was a matter of retaining functionality rather than adding or stripping it). Aggrandizing crap? Yes. But that doesn't keep it from being all that far from the truth. They had no intention whatsoever to keep that option around. ùùù ôIf you're not willing to fight for what you have in ≡v≡à you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.ö ù Karath Piki |
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Mirabi Tiane
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Posted - 2011.06.05 19:32:00 -
[21]
Edited by: Mirabi Tiane on 05/06/2011 19:34:59
Originally by: Burn Jita Down I'm fairly certain having the option to enter to CQ was an element which has always been there, even mentioned years ago when the forum wars raged about certain people not wanting WiS only more space stuff. Acting as if it was something which CCP added after the fact due to player request in the last month or so I think is inaccurate. I don't think it was a compromise for anything.
Actually, no. Yes, requests and demands that Incarna be optional have a long history. Yes, CCP promised in the past that it would be optional. But around the time CQ arrived in Duality, they seemed to forget that promise. CQ was not optional in any way until a recent SiSi patch, and still, unless there is further change, we have lost access to the classic hangar view.
Oh and FYI I've been eagerly awaiting Incarna at least as long as you have. |
Raid'En
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Posted - 2011.06.05 19:32:00 -
[22]
Edited by: Raid''En on 05/06/2011 19:33:59
the option to not load CQ is from 266294 (friday) on sisi. there were nothing before.
btw there is already different settings for CQ and space... there's an option for character textures, and another for CQ environnement textures. you want to also have special options for shaders, anti aliasing and so on ?!
i strongly recommand you to have a look on sisi Akita T, CQ have evolved a lot since last duality release. on the last build i was able to run 2 clients inside CQ with +- medium options, at 24-30 fps with my 4 year old PC. i was at 12 fps on 1 client with low settings on the old duality build... as i said it has changed a lot.
however i'm for having the option to load current station environnement on future incarna build, cause we all agree on this ; we don't need to see our char each time we undock, and on each char... i must admit i liked my last try, had a good feeling, but having that anytime, and when you run x clients would be a pain.
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Hannibal Ord
Minmatar Noir. Noir. Mercenary Group
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Posted - 2011.06.05 19:36:00 -
[23]
Another point is that for gods sake, ship spinning is as iconic as the Raven hull or Aura saying "Warp drive Active" or something like that. Do we really want it gone? I will miss it.
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Burn Jita Down
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Posted - 2011.06.05 19:40:00 -
[24]
Originally by: tippia I feel pretty darn confident in saying that I, personally, am responsible for pressuring CCP into giving us what we wanted all along
Oh, this is probably why people weren't understanding me, some sort of zealotry revolving around an invisible crusade involving the test server build.
I was saying, literally, this debate has been going on for a long time and that being forced to render things which half the player base are unable or unwilling to isn't something which would be shot for.
Also, some of you may need to go outside.
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Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
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Posted - 2011.06.05 19:48:00 -
[25]
Edited by: Tippia on 05/06/2011 19:54:45
Originally by: Burn Jita Down Oh, this is probably why people weren't understanding me, some sort of zealotry revolving around an invisible crusade involving the test server build.
I was saying, literally, this debate has been going on for a long time and that being forced to render things which half the player base are unable or unwilling to isn't something which would be shot for
It's not just the test server build. It's several builds. Numerous Q&A threads. Fanfest '11. Official responses to work-around threads. Ever since, oh, January or so, the previous promise to keep CQ optional had been reneged on ù everything we've seen for the last six months points towards the horrid realisation that they did shoot for something people didn't want to/couldn't useà
The debate could have been ended in five seconds. They didn't. No matter what, that's a such a huge ****up on their part that they don't really deserve any kind of praise for the end result, regardless of whether it was the intended one or notà If anything, I'm being kind to them by saying that it was nice of them to listen to the player base, but that's as far as the praise should go on this issue.
Just to note:
I was there for the 2008 presentation and hands-on demo. It was very nice in its rough form. However, it is no longer a useful source of claims about what we'll get ù too much has changed since then. If we are to go by that presentation, they have still left a ton of stuff out from the CQ that, by all rights, should be there: no "enter CQ" button; the removal of a number of Neocom buttons; the removal of readily available sources of information; the removal of lore-correct CQ content (most notably the pod room); etc etc etc.
I want Incarna. But I don't want the game to become worse because of it. And I certainly don't want CCP to keep making these idiotic simple mistakes ù they need to learn this stuff. Now. ùùù ôIf you're not willing to fight for what you have in ≡v≡à you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.ö ù Karath Piki |
Akita T
Caldari Navy Volunteer Task Force
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Posted - 2011.06.05 20:02:00 -
[26]
Originally by: Raid'En i strongly recommand you to have a look on sisi Akita T, CQ have evolved a lot since last duality release.
Was already in the process of updating SiSi mid-thread.
Using the exact same testing methodology I used last time with Duality (not moving from the spot I am default-spawned, shifting to the alternate camera angle, moving so the center of the character's head is smack-dab in the middle of on the main screen on the wall), the previous steady-ish 60 FPS at max details except AA and interval immediate have turned into a relatively stable 70-ish FPS on SiSi, and graphics card temperature dropped from 72C to about 70C. The VERY odd thing however is that before on Duality, turning to interval one, I could not see any noticeable drop in FPS, while the current SiSi build drops to about 55 FPS in that case (alongside a drop in video card temp to about 68 degrees Celsius). Switching graphics settings too much on the fly still crashes the client eventually (especially settings regarding the character creator). With minimal details, interval immediate, FPS wildly fluctuates between 145 and 175 at times, with 160 FPS being seemingly the norm, and the graphics card settling at around 66C (seems I am just about above the limit of a CPU core usage, one of them fluctuates near 100%, so the CPU became the bottleneck in this case). Switching to interval one locks the FPS to the steady 85 of my desktop refresh rate, dropping the video card to 60C.
Improvement, sure. But not THAT much of an improvement. And not quite consistently (the interval one oddity at max everything).
_
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Burn Jita Down
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Posted - 2011.06.05 20:10:00 -
[27]
Edited by: Burn Jita Down on 05/06/2011 20:11:11
Originally by: Tippia Edited by: Tippia on 05/06/2011 19:54:45
Originally by: Burn Jita Down Oh, this is probably why people weren't understanding me, some sort of zealotry revolving around an invisible crusade involving the test server build.
I was saying, literally, this debate has been going on for a long time and that being forced to render things which half the player base are unable or unwilling to isn't something which would be shot for
It's not just the test server build. It's several builds. Numerous Q&A threads. Fanfest '11. Official responses to work-around threads. Ever since, oh, January or so, the previous promise to keep CQ optional had been reneged on ù everything we've seen for the last six months points towards the horrid realisation that they did shoot for something people didn't want to/couldn't useà
The debate could have been ended in five seconds. They didn't. No matter what, that's a such a huge ****up on their part that they don't really deserve any kind of praise for the end result, regardless of whether it was the intended one or notà If anything, I'm being kind to them by saying that it was nice of them to listen to the player base, but that's as far as the praise should go on this issue.
Just to note:
I was there for the 2008 presentation and hands-on demo. It was very nice in its rough form. However, it is no longer a useful source of claims about what we'll get ù too much has changed since then. If we are to go by that presentation, they have still left a ton of stuff out from the CQ that, by all rights, should be there: no "enter CQ" button; the removal of a number of Neocom buttons; the removal of readily available sources of information; the removal of lore-correct CQ content (most notably the pod room); etc etc etc.
I want Incarna. But I don't want the game to become worse because of it. And I certainly don't want CCP to keep making these idiotic simple mistakes ù they need to learn this stuff. Now.
Oh I haven't been playing again until recently so if they took out any option to enter or not enter CQ/Incarna (to exist in the final iteration) I didn't know. I assumed they released a test server build without the option in order to test it and then people were clamoring to thank them when the implemented it. I wasn't aware they went back on their word. Considering that I remember you there in threads from a long time ago when the option was being discussed I was confused.
But yeah they always touted that it would be optional and I assumed it would be.
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Soden Rah
Gallente EVE University Ivy League
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Posted - 2011.06.05 20:11:00 -
[28]
+1 to this
A well written and reasoned argument for doing Incarna the way it was originally envisioned.
I would add to this that by doing away with the old hanger view and forcing the loading of CQ ,or a still background... CCP is forcing themselves to try to design a feature that appeals to those who want Incarna and would love to use it all the time
AND
those who hate the very idea of leaving their ships and just want to refit/re-arm as fast as possible
AND
those who Role Play and care deeply about eve's backstory and lore...
ALL at the same time.
If you keep the old hanger view, then you don't need to have all the functionality of being in the hanger when in CQ, Thus you Don't need to run to UI's at the same time.
Apart from anything else, it is a near universal law that any device/feature that tries to be all things to all people and does everything at once, will be outperformed by separate devices/features that specialise.
From that perspective alone I would recommend going with a separate hanger and CQ/Incarna.
PS: Please note that in my entire argument I never stated I didn't like Incarna, or That CCP shouldn't do it, That I was worried about performance, Or needed a new pc/graphics card...
I DO want incarna, I don't mind change... as long as it's change for the better... for example changing the fittings feature to server side and limiting to only 50 fits was a change... For the worse... You don't have to hate the game or CCP to be able to see that not everything they do they get right, and they do ask for our feedback.... __________________________________________________
Originally by: CCP Tuxford bugger, I need to have a closer look at this menu function
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Akita T
Caldari Navy Volunteer Task Force
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Posted - 2011.06.05 20:15:00 -
[29]
Edited by: Akita T on 05/06/2011 20:16:48
Originally by: Burn Jita Down [...]I wasn't aware they went back on their word.[...]But yeah they always touted that it would be optional and I assumed it would be.[...]
So you can see now why the current state of affairs is not pleasing us ; why Tippia, I, and a lot of others keep talking about it in a mild angry tone. _
Make ISK||Build||React||1k papercuts
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Scorpii Orion
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Posted - 2011.06.05 20:16:00 -
[30]
Originally by: Akita T botwhine
Just NO!
Kill the BOTS!
Force CQ!
Only botters use crappy PC's and good enough PC costs like 150$ and even in Africa they can afford on that.
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Burn Jita Down
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Posted - 2011.06.05 20:17:00 -
[31]
Originally by: Akita T
Originally by: Burn Jita Down But yeah they always touted that it would be optional and I assumed it would be.
So you can see now why the current state of affairs is not pleasing us...
Yeah now I do! I'm actually in the process of getting upset about it but considering I was a lot more behind then I thought I was I feel more lost than anything.
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Akita T
Caldari Navy Volunteer Task Force
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Posted - 2011.06.05 20:17:00 -
[32]
Edited by: Akita T on 05/06/2011 20:22:08
Originally by: Scorpii Orion
Originally by: Akita T botwhine
Just NO! Kill the BOTS! Force CQ! Only botters use crappy PC's and good enough PC costs like 150$ and even in Africa they can afford on that.
I surely hope you're attempting to make a joke. Or being sarcastic, but not getting it quite right. _
Make ISK||Build||React||1k papercuts
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Soden Rah
Gallente EVE University Ivy League
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Posted - 2011.06.05 20:19:00 -
[33]
Originally by: Akita T Edited by: Akita T on 05/06/2011 20:16:48
Originally by: Burn Jita Down [...]I wasn't aware they went back on their word.[...]But yeah they always touted that it would be optional and I assumed it would be.[...]
So you can see now why the current state of affairs is not pleasing us ; why Tippia, I, and a lot of others keep talking about it in a mild angry tone.
hey I don't get a name drop??? My petition's got to its fifth page now...
__________________________________________________
Originally by: CCP Tuxford bugger, I need to have a closer look at this menu function
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Grey Stormshadow
Starwreck Industries
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Posted - 2011.06.05 20:20:00 -
[34]
Originally by: Akita T
Originally by: Grey If something could be changed, after docking, I would rather like to see the hangar and my ship from balcony, pilot still in the ship (invisible ofc) and option to leave ship given to me. Some animation would be bonus.
Isn't that pretty much a part of what I suggested would be necessary ?
Naa... I was referring more to CQ balcony view without the toon in it... image stolen from other thread :)
Anyways was just another unimportant detail in the mix. |
Akita T
Caldari Navy Volunteer Task Force
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Posted - 2011.06.05 20:21:00 -
[35]
Originally by: Soden Rah hey I don't get a name drop??? My petition's got to its fifth page now...
We require more Vespean gas links !
Originally by: Jita Bloodtear That being said, what is the alternative to no CQ? Black screen? Current ship spinner?
A perpetual "LOADING" screen that never goes away. _
Make ISK||Build||React||1k papercuts
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Jacque Cruix
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Posted - 2011.06.05 20:31:00 -
[36]
Originally by: Akita T Edited by: Akita T on 05/06/2011 20:15:45 So you can see now why the current state of affairs is not pleasing us... and why me and Tippia keep talking about it.
I hope you're not so big on yourself that you are saying "us" as the entire Eve player-base, but only the "few" that have decided to complain about this.
Nothing can be so annoying than a self appointed "speaker" who thinks they have the pulse of the whole.
For your op; if you think about it, CCP has consistently been removing old assets from the game to allow their development time to be more focused on what the majority uses in regard to hardware. Players complaining about this new enviroment requiring newer hardware probably won't get much traction.
I support the static load screen that is currently on Sisi, but not retainig the old hanger assets. Players clinging to that are probably simply resisting change and they need to either suck it up or go somewhere else. Eve will always be about change, since there will probably never be an Eve Online II.
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Akita T
Caldari Navy Volunteer Task Force
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Posted - 2011.06.05 20:33:00 -
[37]
Edited by: Akita T on 05/06/2011 20:36:21
Originally by: Jacque Cruix stuff
See bottom part of previous post edited in.
Also, I would not consider a GTX 460 as "old hardware", not even close to the average of what the EVE player base uses, but above the average... yet still the performance of CQ with the current TQ "in space" settings is just barely acceptable while also fully utilizing the GPU. _
Make ISK||Build||React||1k papercuts
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Kerrisone
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Posted - 2011.06.05 20:35:00 -
[38]
It seems to me it wouldn't be so hard to leave old stuff as is with little or no updates as an option for players. CCP chooses to remove those things and move forward with new shiny regardless of player concerns or it seems their own issues in making a stable/quality product.
IT makes no sense to run the incarna engine/aspect of the client if I am not going to use it. Why force the run of it whenever we dock, waste of resources and increased risk of having bugs/issues come about when it won't be used. It makes as much sense as forcing open the market, wallet, character sheet, mail box, science and industry tab, contracts, map, browser etc when you dock if they were not open in the first place, suck up more memory/resources just because.
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Jacque Cruix
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Posted - 2011.06.05 20:44:00 -
[39]
I use a HD 4800 series card and it runs CQ fine.
One needs to expect that some level of re-optimization will need to be done when dealing with WIP on a test server.
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Soden Rah
Gallente EVE University Ivy League
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Posted - 2011.06.05 20:46:00 -
[40]
Originally by: Jacque Cruix
Originally by: Akita T Edited by: Akita T on 05/06/2011 20:15:45 So you can see now why the current state of affairs is not pleasing us... and why me and Tippia keep talking about it.
I hope you're not so big on yourself that you are saying "us" as the entire Eve player-base, but only the "few" that have decided to complain about this.
Nothing can be so annoying than a self appointed "speaker" who thinks they have the pulse of the whole.
For your op; if you think about it, CCP has consistently been removing old assets from the game to allow their development time to be more focused on what the majority uses in regard to hardware. Players complaining about this new enviroment requiring newer hardware probably won't get much traction.
I support the static load screen that is currently on Sisi, but not retainig the old hanger assets. Players clinging to that are probably simply resisting change and they need to either suck it up or go somewhere else. Eve will always be about change, since there will probably never be an Eve Online II.
I refer you to my earlier post in this thread.
It is entirely possible to argue convincingly for the keeping of the current hanger view (or use nice shiny new hangers, which would be even better) rather than trying to make CQ do the job of intro into incarna AND do everything the old hanger did so well. Without at any point mentioning performance... although the performance arguments are not without there own merit.
Plus on the having separate graphics settings front...
It is quite common to turn graphics settings right down for in space if you are expecting a big fleet fight in the near future and don't want to lag out at a crucial moment.
However you might want to run Incarna on higher settings as you're not worried about being poded if you lag, plus CQ is atm a solo environment, and in quite a few places the amount of in station traffic is likely to be quite low.
So you might want HIGHER graphics settings for in station than in space. As the client doesn't really like changing graphics settings on the fly, it usually likes you to re-log,
It makes sense to have separate graphics settings for both incarna and space so that you can move from one to the other without having to change your graphics settings and have both at your desired setting. __________________________________________________
Originally by: CCP Tuxford bugger, I need to have a closer look at this menu function
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Jacque Cruix
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Posted - 2011.06.05 20:52:00 -
[41]
Originally by: Soden Rah ...It is entirely possible to argue convincingly for the keeping of the current hanger view...
Yes, there are probably 20 different ways to implement this. Most players will probably be happy with 17 of those ways. Some would only be happy with a few.
But there are also some who would only be happy with "their" way.
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Mirabi Tiane
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Posted - 2011.06.05 20:57:00 -
[42]
Edited by: Mirabi Tiane on 05/06/2011 20:58:56
Originally by: Jacque Cruix Nothing can be so annoying than a self appointed "speaker" who thinks they have the pulse of the whole.
Originally by: Jacque Cruix Players clinging to that are probably simply resisting change and they need to either suck it up or go somewhere else.
Were you trying to demonstrate your own point?
...I for one have no problem with change. I have a problem with CCP doing a disservice to EVE's own lore/PF. |
Akita T
Caldari Navy Volunteer Task Force
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Posted - 2011.06.05 20:59:00 -
[43]
Originally by: Jacque Cruix But there are also some who would only be happy with "their" way.
And let me guess... you are oh so "subtly" implying that I or any others who have objections regarding the current CQ implementation would be part of this particular group, eh ? _
Make ISK||Build||React||1k papercuts
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Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
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Posted - 2011.06.05 21:01:00 -
[44]
Originally by: Jacque Cruix But there are also some who would only be happy with "their" way.
Yes. This is the group who really hate the idea of having the option not to load CQ. ùùù ôIf you're not willing to fight for what you have in ≡v≡à you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.ö ù Karath Piki |
Soden Rah
Gallente EVE University Ivy League
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Posted - 2011.06.05 21:04:00 -
[45]
Originally by: Jacque Cruix
Originally by: Soden Rah ...It is entirely possible to argue convincingly for the keeping of the current hanger view...
Yes, there are probably 20 different ways to implement this. Most players will probably be happy with 17 of those ways. Some would only be happy with a few.
But there are also some who would only be happy with "their" way.
Part of my argument was about what we as players might want... but a large part, that you ignored, is that its bad design to implement CQ the way they are currently doing it.
The fact that in this particular instance good design is safer, more flexible, easier to build and allows the greatest number of people to happily use the feature than the bad design.... actually no that's what good design is all about. __________________________________________________
Originally by: CCP Tuxford bugger, I need to have a closer look at this menu function
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Hannibal Ord
Minmatar Noir. Noir. Mercenary Group
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Posted - 2011.06.05 21:06:00 -
[46]
Edited by: Hannibal Ord on 05/06/2011 21:06:41
That's it in a nutshell. What we are proposing is like the finest solution to all the issues CQ creates. It caters to all without detracting from any.
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Soden Rah
Gallente EVE University Ivy League
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Posted - 2011.06.05 21:08:00 -
[47]
Edited by: Soden Rah on 05/06/2011 21:08:34 Damn... my eco is better spoken than I am...
EDIT: it was better before the edit __________________________________________________
Originally by: CCP Tuxford bugger, I need to have a closer look at this menu function
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Tonto Auri
Vhero' Multipurpose Corp
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Posted - 2011.06.05 21:24:00 -
[48]
The big problem with current CQ implementation, aside from being a vanity option forced into users hands. (Though now there's an option to disable it, now my docking process on SiSi even faster than on TQ.) Well, the problem. Is the ship floating in mid-air in front of the balcony. ANY camping manger would smack anyone trying to park their vehicle on the grass border under cottadge's windows. There's 3 landing pads visible from Amarr balcony, but ship isn't on the either of them. It's just... somewhere. -- Thanks CCP for cu |
Cailais
Amarr Dawn of a new Empire The Initiative.
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Posted - 2011.06.05 21:37:00 -
[49]
CQ is the point of sale portal for micro-transactions so I think its very unlikely that CCP will want players to circumvent that marketing tool.
All those screens in CQ are there for a reason - and that reason is to persuade you to get your credit card out. No marketing / sales strategy would want you to miss that vendor space so we can be 99% certain that CQ will be pretty much the only option available.
C.
the hydrostatic capsule blog
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Soi Mala
Whacky Waving Inflatable Flailing Arm Tubemen
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Posted - 2011.06.05 21:37:00 -
[50]
CCP could've saved so much time and effort if they'd have just bought the rights to the habbo hotel engine... And most people would've been just as happy
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Jacque Cruix
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Posted - 2011.06.05 21:39:00 -
[51]
Originally by: Tippia
Originally by: Jacque Cruix But there are also some who would only be happy with "their" way.
Yes. This is the group who really hate the idea of having the option not to load CQ.
I could agree with that.
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Nieero
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Posted - 2011.06.05 21:49:00 -
[52]
for me it is as simple as that:
Having the choice is fun. Being forced is immersion-breaking and therefore not fun.
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Jacque Cruix
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Posted - 2011.06.05 21:57:00 -
[53]
Originally by: Akita T
Originally by: Jacque Cruix But there are also some who would only be happy with "their" way.
And let me guess... you are oh so "subtly" implying that I or any others who have objections regarding the current CQ implementation would be part of this particular group, eh ?
I guess it would depend on if one is suggesting a change or demanding a change. Demanding too often will lead to future demands being frequently ignored.
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Ris Dnalor
Minmatar Fleet of Doom RaVeN Federation
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Posted - 2011.06.05 22:35:00 -
[54]
I think they think that by forcing everyone to look at their avatar, they'll make more money on their micro-transactions selling leisure suits.
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Takseen
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Posted - 2011.06.05 23:12:00 -
[55]
I think its somewhat immersion breaking to think my character hops out of their pod and gets all dressed up every time he goes for the Internet Spaceship equivalent of a refill of gas.
If I'm settling in for a bout of market trading or item hangar reorganisation or fitting a new ship, sure. But I don't want to have to do it every time I pop in to drop off my loot or ask my agent for a new mission.
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San Severina
Minmatar Autocannons Anonymous
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Posted - 2011.06.05 23:15:00 -
[56]
Akita, I agree.
I had hoped we would be able to load the old hangar instead of CQ.
I'm thinking I might have a few months off from EvE starting the 21st, just to let the devs sort out the incoming shoot storm of bug, complaints & issues.
Enjoy EvE for the next few weeks while you can because after incarna launches it's a different ball game, that much is very clear.
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Amber Accelerando
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Posted - 2011.06.05 23:24:00 -
[57]
Originally by: Nieero
for me it is as simple as that:
Having the choice is fun. Being forced is immersion-breaking and therefore not fun.
^^+1
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Don Pellegrino
Pod Liberation Authority HYDRA RELOADED
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Posted - 2011.06.05 23:25:00 -
[58]
Originally by: Akita T CQ and space need to have two completely separate sets of graphics options, and a much lower graphics detail option than the ones available now needs to be present.
THIS ____________________________________________
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Komen
Gallente The Night Crew
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Posted - 2011.06.05 23:49:00 -
[59]
I support optional CQ loading. I further support differentiated CQ quality settings. I further support game devs who don't break their promises. 'Incarna will never be mandatory' - many devs along the way. And that was the only reason I was willing to tolerate this foolishness.
Let me be blunt. **** Captain's Quarters. Having no option to NOT disembark my pod is greatly displeasing.
For those people who want to make use of the feature, fine. By all means. Let them. Just don't make ME do it too. Or have you guys forgotten what a sandbox is?
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Kogh Ayon
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Posted - 2011.06.06 00:00:00 -
[60]
As far as it perorms better than WOW. Anyone like to have a compare?
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Mara Rinn
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Posted - 2011.06.06 00:16:00 -
[61]
Originally by: Kogh Ayon As far as it perorms better than WOW. Anyone like to have a compare?
Umm ... What?
I can raid with 25 other players running WoW on my machine. I can't even walk in CQ on my machine, by myself, in one room. Docking is increased from ~20s to ~2m. The UI is non-interactable during the CQ loading period. No talking to agents, no interaction with the fitting window (which itself takes three or so minutes to load, thanks to the combination of rendering CQ and trying to render new turrets).
We can still admire the new turret artwork using existing station-spinning environment. I'd like the option to dock as we do presently, with the option of leaving the ship to enter TQ when I feel like it.
Don't worry, CCP, I'll be spending plenty of (someone else's) real money on Incarna vanity items, since my avatar doesn't mind when I just want to stand in front of the mirror and look at pretty clothes for an hour.
-- [Aussie players: join ANZAC channel] |
Royaldo
Gallente Kongsberg Vaapenfabrikk Amarr branch. Sev3rance
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Posted - 2011.06.06 01:00:00 -
[62]
Keep up the good work Akita
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Mortania
Minmatar No Compromise Gentlemen's Agreement
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Posted - 2011.06.06 02:51:00 -
[63]
CQ = the forums debacle writ large.
Options are essential.
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Namak Bulu
Gallente Villore Regional Industries
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Posted - 2011.06.06 03:17:00 -
[64]
Edited by: Namak Bulu on 06/06/2011 03:18:25 I don't yet have an opinion on the new CQ features really aside from one thing, the short-sighted arguements i've read here are astounding to me. Esspecially anything concerning vanity.
Pointless now? Yea perhaps... I'm just wondering for how long. Micro-transactions for cosmetic items won't be the only point to CQs, only a hook. Much more profound implications rest with CQs and the entire carbon project I think.
Reguardless of any of that, you can bet that there will be performance tweaks done before release, and most likely afterwards. And people need to understand that a game will not survive in one state forever, EVE is only changing again. Immersion is long overdue, and so is even more tweaks to easing new players into the very complex universe that is EVE Online. I won't even get into the list of fixes to gameplay that are long overdue either. I have simply taken a back seat to see where they go with it. Then I shall make my decisions on how I feel about it. Again it astounds me how many people get hung up on the word "pointless" as they seem to think this is the end of it.
But thats just my point of view. But I will say that micro-transactions for vanity items in a game like EVE very much strikes me as Odd...
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Joan Avon
Amarr Proletariat Manifesto The United Corporations
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Posted - 2011.06.06 03:45:00 -
[65]
Originally by: Cailais CQ is the point of sale portal for micro-transactions so I think its very unlikely that CCP will want players to circumvent that marketing tool.
All those screens in CQ are there for a reason - and that reason is to persuade you to get your credit card out. No marketing / sales strategy would want you to miss that vendor space so we can be 99% certain that CQ will be pretty much the only option available.
C.
This. How is the new micro-transaction market supposed to bring in revenue if people have the option to skip the market itself as well as the main showcase for it's products? that would be like renting a slot in a shopping mall, walling up the entrance from the inside of the mall and putting a new one in the back alley behind the mall.
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Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
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Posted - 2011.06.06 03:55:00 -
[66]
Originally by: Joan Avon How is the new micro-transaction market supposed to bring in revenue if people have the option to skip the market itself as well as the main showcase for it's products? that would be like renting a slot in a shopping mall, walling up the entrance from the inside of the mall and putting a new one in the back alley behind the mall.
No. It would be like renting a slot in a shopping mall, and then not hiring a press-gang to get people in the bar across the street visit the shop and instead letting people who come to the shopping mall discover the place at their leisure. ùùù ôIf you're not willing to fight for what you have in ≡v≡à you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.ö ù Karath Piki |
Joan Avon
Amarr Proletariat Manifesto The United Corporations
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Posted - 2011.06.06 03:58:00 -
[67]
Originally by: Tippia
Originally by: Joan Avon How is the new micro-transaction market supposed to bring in revenue if people have the option to skip the market itself as well as the main showcase for it's products? that would be like renting a slot in a shopping mall, walling up the entrance from the inside of the mall and putting a new one in the back alley behind the mall.
No. It would be like renting a slot in a shopping mall, and then not hiring a press-gang to get people in the bar across the street visit the shop and instead letting people who come to the shopping mall discover the place at their leisure.
How would that serve to increase revenue? your shop would be bankrupt and shuttered long before enough people "discovered" it and leisurely shopped in it
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Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
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Posted - 2011.06.06 04:05:00 -
[68]
Edited by: Tippia on 06/06/2011 04:06:23
Originally by: Joan Avon How would that serve to increase revenue? your shop would be bankrupt and shuttered long before enough people "discovered" it and leisurely shopped in it
It will be equally (or more) bankrupt since the people who get ripped away from the beer and darts they had planned to enjoy and who are now instead forced to look at shoes will beà let's call it disinclined to actually buy anything. They're more likely to just badmouth the place and its less than stellar promotional tactics to anyone who is willing to listen (and quite a few who aren't). ùùù ôIf you're not willing to fight for what you have in ≡v≡à you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.ö ù Karath Piki |
Salyut Hugs
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Posted - 2011.06.06 04:10:00 -
[69]
Edited by: Salyut Hugs on 06/06/2011 04:11:15 Edited by: Salyut Hugs on 06/06/2011 04:10:12 If CQ comes out as an option and it doesn't work properly or it's boring, time consuming. It will become synonymous with 'laggy piece of ****' anda lot of players will never want to bother with it again. It will get a horrible reputation, be unused and people will cry for CCP ro make it go away.
If CCP makes it an integral part of the game not only will players get used to it. But even CCP will be forced to improve it. So actually it's good considering CCP's track record of abandoning things.
I am right, everyone who disagrees with me is wrong!!
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Joan Avon
Amarr Proletariat Manifesto The United Corporations
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Posted - 2011.06.06 04:10:00 -
[70]
Originally by: Joan Avon How would that serve to increase revenue? your shop would be bankrupt and shuttered long before enough people "discovered" it and leisurely shopped in it
It will be equally (or more) bankrupt since the people who get ripped away from the beer and darts they had planned to enjoy and who are now instead forced to look at shoes will beà let's call it disinclined to actually buy anything. They're more likely to just badmouth the place and its less than stellar promotional tactics to anyone who is willing to listen (and quite a few who aren't).
then perhaps the solution is to take the shoes to the bar and offer a free drink or two with every shoe purchase.
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Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
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Posted - 2011.06.06 04:14:00 -
[71]
Originally by: Joan Avon then perhaps the solution is to take the shoes to the bar and offer a free drink or two with every shoe purchase.
àand as soon as Incarna is actually released (with some useful content), there will be plenty of "Show off your character/place/installation" threads ù and even competitions with prizes ù to do exactly that.
And either way, that's something completely different than forcing people to use stuff they don't want to use. ùùù ôIf you're not willing to fight for what you have in ≡v≡à you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.ö ù Karath Piki |
Culmen
Caldari Vigrior The Dominion Empire
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Posted - 2011.06.06 04:25:00 -
[72]
Originally by: Joan Avon
Originally by: Tippia No. It would be like renting a slot in a shopping mall, and then not hiring a press-gang to get people in the bar across the street visit the shop and instead letting people who come to the shopping mall discover the place at their leisure.
How would that serve to increase revenue? your shop would be bankrupt and shuttered long before enough people "discovered" it and leisurely shopped in it
You do realize the point of advertising is to Step 1: Bring Attention to your Product Step 2: Convince people to BUY IT
Alot of people get step 1 down, but not Step 2, despite step 2 being perhaps more important than step 1.
Forcing this mess down people's throats is not going make people say "Wow! I really want to get some Aurum!" It's going to make people say "Wow! This is crap and I'm not playing" The decision to force people into the store isn't going to make people want to buy stuff, it's going to make people go to a different mall.
and further more why do i even need a sig? |
Cpt Fina
Red Dwarf Mining Corporation space weaponry and trade
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Posted - 2011.06.06 04:41:00 -
[73]
I'm less worried about the few negative aspects of QC's implementation than I am of that CCP always have tried to cater to everyones playstyle, promoted diversity and have had new features being optional but now making an u-turn by force feeding the community with this even though it seems that it doesn't have to be like that, from an outsiders perspective atleast. Damn that's a long sentence.
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Taisha Noran Concordia
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Posted - 2011.06.06 04:43:00 -
[74]
* MANDATORY - separate the CQ from the non-CQ graphics detail settings into two completely separate groups which you can set differently * MANDATORY - keep the ESC menu option to not load any environment at all * STRONGLY PREFERRED - add some even lower graphics detail levels for CQ * OPTIONAL - do not delete the current hangar environments AND make them an alternative (default disabled) via the ESC menu
I can't emphasize how much I agree with every point here. CCP will have an immense number of people coming here to speak their mind if this isn't implemented. Why is that single room so demanding on resources? I think it's been severely overdone.
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Vice Admiral Spreadsheet
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Posted - 2011.06.06 06:29:00 -
[75]
Edited by: Vice Admiral Spreadsheet on 06/06/2011 06:32:59 I would like CQ to be completely enforced, with the UI disappearing and the player entering from the edge of the balcony. Accessing the market and hangar must be done in the main CQ room, after a 30 second walk from the balcony to the screens.
This will achieve 2 things: 1. Kill botting 2. Create enough whining to fill CCP's "Necessary whine quota" for the next 4 years.
Also,
Originally by: Mara Rinn The UI is non-interactable during the CQ loading period. No talking to agents, no interaction with the fitting window (which itself takes three or so minutes to load, thanks to the combination of rendering CQ and trying to render new turrets).
No. Wrong. You either ran a duality build which was released sometime last century, or encountered a bug which you should report instead of complaining about.
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Mirabi Tiane
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Posted - 2011.06.06 06:33:00 -
[76]
Originally by: Namak Bulu EVE is only changing again. Immersion is long overdue
Good job ignoring my arguments. The current implementation of CQ harms immersion. |
Vice Admiral Spreadsheet
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Posted - 2011.06.06 06:36:00 -
[77]
Originally by: Mirabi Tiane
Originally by: Namak Bulu EVE is only changing again. Immersion is long overdue
Good job ignoring my arguments. The current implementation of CQ harms immersion.
I agree EVE is completely immersive and 1000% better when all you see is a loading screen constantly there and CQ never finishes loading because why would a capsuleer get out of their pod every single time it makes no sense I mean a loading screen is so much more believable and immersive and better and I am glad CCP hate CQ as much as I do and let me not load station environments which break immersion loading screens are so much better.
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Mirabi Tiane
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Posted - 2011.06.06 06:43:00 -
[78]
Edited by: Mirabi Tiane on 06/06/2011 06:46:57
Originally by: Vice Admiral Spreadsheet
Originally by: Mirabi Tiane
Originally by: Namak Bulu EVE is only changing again. Immersion is long overdue
Good job ignoring my arguments. The current implementation of CQ harms immersion.
I agree EVE is completely immersive and 1000% better when all you see is a loading screen constantly there and CQ never finishes loading because why would a capsuleer get out of their pod every single time it makes no sense I mean a loading screen is so much more believable and immersive and better and I am glad CCP hate CQ as much as I do and let me not load station environments which break immersion loading screens are so much better.
That's why I have said that the current option is not enough and the classic hangar view should return as default with an unmissable "Decant" or "Enter CQ" button. Edit: Apparently I haven't said that in this thread, but you must be aware of the other threads, else you're missing out on trolling opportunities. |
Tres Farmer
Gallente Federation Intelligence Service
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Posted - 2011.06.06 07:21:00 -
[79]
Edited by: Tres Farmer on 06/06/2011 07:25:25 Interesting that CCP still didn't address this.. you'd think they would learn over the years.
PS: I love the CQ and welcome it. Wanted it since I heard from it the first time at Dec/2005. But the current implementation tries to be a jack of all trades, where a focused approach for a speciality tool would be more wise (see regular, small patches instead of one big expansion - same principle could be applied here). Keep simple ship hangar view for a grace period until you sorted out heavy load and bugs on TQ. Let's say 3 months.
+1
Get rid of Rooms with Doors - Shortrange Jumpdrives for everybody! |
MaiLina KaTar
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Posted - 2011.06.06 07:30:00 -
[80]
Edited by: MaiLina KaTar on 06/06/2011 07:35:21
Originally by: Grey Stormshadow However... Incarna is part of EVEs future and captains quarters is only the beginning. It is important that people try to get used to it, test it and give feedback from the experience.
Look.... there is one very important fact the "pro CQ" crowd around these forums needs to understand:
Most of the complaints around here do not criticise against Incarna per se. What they are criticising is the way it is being implemented. While the feature itself is all fine and most probably a great thing for the future of the game, it will be a deterrent and damaging to the game if it is rushed out and forced down people's throats. And by the looks of it this is exactly what CCP are doing right now. Whether that is intentional or not doesn't matter.
This is launching on June 21st. What that means is the stuff you see on Duality/SiSi right now is pretty much what you're gonna get come Incarna launch on Jun 21st. The people who are b****ing against CQ right now... most of them are actually the "pro CCP" guys warning them to be more careful and listen to their customers more, because they know that rushing features out like this is not cool and CCP's track record on that front isn't really the greatest either when it comes to fixing these things in a reasonable timeframe. Some of the bugs that have been here since game launch still haven't been touched. I know this for a fact... because I've been here watching their progress since early beta.
So please, guys, do yourselves a favor a stop flaming everyone who speaks out against launching CQ in its current form, because most of the critique is very very valid and should be a primary concern to CCP right now.
CQ in its current form = bad game design. It will do exactly the opposite of what CCP are planning, meaning that it will not increase the immersion but much rather bite away huge chunks of it, replacing it with black screens.
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Joan Avon
Amarr Proletariat Manifesto The United Corporations
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Posted - 2011.06.06 07:40:00 -
[81]
Originally by: MaiLina KaTar Edited by: MaiLina KaTar on 06/06/2011 07:34:18
Originally by: Grey Stormshadow However... Incarna is part of EVEs future and captains quarters is only the beginning. It is important that people try to get used to it, test it and give feedback from the experience.
Look.... there is one very important fact the "pro CQ" crowd around these forums needs to understand:
Most of the complaints around here do not criticise against Incarna per se. What they are criticising is the way it is being implemented. While the feature itself is all fine and most probably a great thing for the future of the game, it will be a deterrent and damaging to the game if it is rushed out and forced down people's throats. And by the looks of it this is exactly what CCP are doing right now.
This is launching on June 21st. What that means is the stuff you see on Duality/SiSi right now is pretty much what you're gonna get come Incarna launch on Jun 21st. The people who are b****ing against CQ right now... most of them are actually the "pro CCP" guys warning them to be more careful and listen to their customers more, because they know that rushing features out like this is not cool and CCP's track record on that front isn't really the greatest either when it comes to fixing these things in a reasonable timeframe. Some of the bugs that have been here since game launch still haven't been touched. I know this for a fact... because I've been here watching their progress since early beta.
So please, guys, do yourselves a favor a stop flaming everyone who speaks out against launching CQ in its current form, because most of the critique is very very valid and should be a primary concern to CCP right now.
CQ in its current form = bad game design. It will do exactly the opposite of what CCP are planning, meaning that it will not increase the immersion but much rather bite away huge chunks of it, replacing it with black screens.
Incarna is doing what CCP knows it needs to do which is break out of the current niche it's t****d in and open up eve to a wider audience by making Eve more accessable and interesting to the greater general public. Eve is no longer as spaceship only game because that alone is not enough to increase CCP's market share and subscription base beyond it's current small share.
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Cyaxares II
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Posted - 2011.06.06 07:44:00 -
[82]
Edited by: Cyaxares II on 06/06/2011 07:45:09
There are "too soon, take time to polish" complaints before every expansion...
Much like with movies there are only a couple of months in which you can release MMO expansions... if CCP doesn't get it out in June, they'll have to delay it until fall. No point releasing an expansion when all the potential new subscribers are hanging out on the beach...
You have to give them time to notice the game and get hooked up on it before they go on holidays...
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Jacob Holland
Gallente Weyland-Vulcan Industries Brotherhood Of The Sick and Twisted
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Posted - 2011.06.06 07:50:00 -
[83]
The early video of the exit from the pod suggested that it was something of a traumatic experience. That it was something you did because you had to, because there were things you couldn't do in your ship.
If every time we dock, have (no longer Scotty) shouting at us as we try to switch ships before the session change timer and undock immediately we get out, get dressed and wander into our CQ then that removes that trauma entirely.
I would agree that the CQ should be in addition to the existing station environment rather than instead of it. In an ideal world CQ would be encouraged by adding those things we cannot do in our ship but as there's no interactive area as yet... It makes sense as a business case to force people into CQ but it would be better from a story perspective to make it another layer. --
Originally by: cordy
Respect to IAC .Your one of the few people who truly deserve to own and live in the space you are in.
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Akita T
Caldari Navy Volunteer Task Force
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Posted - 2011.06.06 07:59:00 -
[84]
Originally by: Cyaxares II There are "too soon, take time to polish" complaints before every expansion...
And in the past two years, almost always justified and then some.
Quote: Much like with movies there are only a couple of months in which you can release MMO expansions... if CCP doesn't get it out in June, they'll have to delay it until fall. No point releasing an expansion when all the potential new subscribers are hanging out on the beach...
For paid-for polished expansions, sure, it might make some sense. For rushed free expansions however... it makes none.
Quote: You have to give them time to notice the game and get hooked up on it before they go on holidays...
Because, god forbid anybody should NOT be there when the buggiest of the possible versions go live to get a chance to be turned off by it, we can't have people coming in after it's been live for a few weeks or months and the most egregious bugs smoothed out...
_
Make ISK||Build||React||1k papercuts
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Anddeh McNab
Cadre Assault Force
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Posted - 2011.06.06 08:22:00 -
[85]
Originally by: Akita T Given the current lack of separate graphics detail options and the abysmal FPS gap, even people that WANT to fiddle around with CQ will eventually end up NOT loading it most of the time.
Also, CQ seems to load with max settings first time it boots. This effectively killed my laptop till I could turn it down and changing the settings at about half a frame a second was just plain painful.
There will be a huge torrent of "WTF is this?" threads from clueless people come the 21st, I'm placing bets on around ten ragequit threads within the first 24 hours of the servers coming back up. But I digress, if nothing else would be nice to be able to copy paste "Turn off Load Station Environments in Display and Graphics settings" for those that don't want to take part in CQ.
Afterall, EVE has an opt out option for everything else. Except PvP --- There are two sides to the EVE community; those that scream for change and those that scream against it. Often they are the same person. |
MaiLina KaTar
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Posted - 2011.06.06 08:39:00 -
[86]
Edited by: MaiLina KaTar on 06/06/2011 08:44:49
Originally by: Cyaxares II There are "too soon, take time to polish" complaints before every expansion...
This is not about polish, it's about the core design.
A good game designer would have realized right from the get go that taking away the hangar view and load CQ on every dock would be a bad idea. Not only does it not make sense in terms of roleplay... it forces the client to load high detail enviroments for features that the advanced player will not use most of the time. This is especially true for this first implementation of Incarna.
Forcing the client to load CQ every time does not make sense. CCPs design team should have realized this right from the start and personally I am criticising them harshly for this major flaw in their design process.
When you want to do stuff quickly in the game, you do not want features getting in your way that you might not use. This is true for everyone, newbie, advanced, pro, veteran, even GMs.
Quote: Much like with movies there are only a couple of months in which you can release MMO expansions... if CCP doesn't get it out in June, they'll have to delay it until fall. No point releasing an expansion when all the potential new subscribers are hanging out on the beach...
You have to give them time to notice the game and get hooked up on it before they go on holidays...
All fine and well... but this brings us to the next point:
If this was just some run of the mill optional content like P.I. for example, nobody would break a sweat. The potential damage caused by a flawed implementation of CQ, however, far outweighs anything CCP has done so far. As it turns out there are many clients who can't run CQ at all, or who find that it puts too much of a strain on their rig (see OP). CCP knows this, otherwise they wouldn't have put in in the option to effectively shut CQ down on this latest build.
Now, since CQ is not optional content but core content going by the way they are implementing it right now, CCP risk loosing a huge chunk of their playerbase if it isn't implemented properly. Everyone who might be running on an older rigs, multiboxers, etc might leave the game. And although that might not be many players, the damage to CCP's reputation would be far worse.
Incarna will be a core feature of the game. Slacking or "live beta testing" is not an option here. Trying to catch a summer release should not be a concern when you're talking core design.
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Le Skunk
Low Sec Liberators
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Posted - 2011.06.06 10:02:00 -
[87]
Edited by: Le Skunk on 06/06/2011 10:03:24
Originally by: Akita T
For rushed free expansions however... it makes none.
Rushed, yes
Free, no
All subscribers have been paying for this... monstrous carbuncle.... for years now
I SHOULD LIKE TO GRAB IT BETWEEN MY FINGERS AND PINCH DOWN HARD, SQUEEZING UNTIL IT EXPLODES, COVERING US ALL IN PUSS
SKUNK (o)
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Hannibal Ord
Minmatar Noir. Noir. Mercenary Group
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Posted - 2011.06.06 10:16:00 -
[88]
I just don't get why it's such a simple thing for them to do to make the world of difference to the game. If they don't actually do it it will make me question really all the times I've supported CCP on these forums because I believed in the game and their ability to improve EVE.
It's made me question the designers.
That said, maybe this is all a clever ruse, so on 21st we will have the hanger etc. And we will all raise our glasses to CCP over it.
I'm still hoping.
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Arec Bardwin
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Posted - 2011.06.06 11:05:00 -
[89]
Originally by: Akita T
So, to recap, you can keep the CQ environment as the default enabled option, but: * MANDATORY - separate the CQ from the non-CQ graphics detail settings into two completely separate groups which you can set differently * MANDATORY - keep the ESC menu option to not load any environment at all * STRONGLY PREFERRED - add some even lower graphics detail levels for CQ * OPTIONAL - do not delete the current hangar environments AND make them an alternative (default disabled) via the ESC menu
These points are way too logical and reasonable for CCP to implement all of them. Perhaps one or two of them, if we are lucky.
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Guttripper
Caldari State War Academy
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Posted - 2011.06.06 11:15:00 -
[90]
Conspiracy theory *queue X-Files music* -
I wonder if the release has anything to do with Nvidia subtly driving this forward to promote graphic cards?
"You can not run the latest expansion? Well we hooked up with Nvidia to bring you a special deal..."
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My Postman
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Posted - 2011.06.06 11:19:00 -
[91]
/supported
I don¦t want to end in my CQ eveytime i unload my hulk when mining (btw when mining gets profitable again, if ever). As Akita said, THIS DOES¦NT MAKE SENSE.
I could live with it when changing fittings or so, this might even make sense in a RP way.
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Soden Rah
Gallente EVE University Ivy League
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Posted - 2011.06.06 11:21:00 -
[92]
You still have keeping the hanger view and making CQ separate after docking as optional...
However I would say that making CQ do the job of being the hanger and the entry point into Incarna is such bad design that borks not only the docking process but the rest of incarna too, And that the huge extra resources and time needed to make it work, justify making it mandatory too. It's the problem that causes almost all the other problems.
A lot of the issues it causes are on CCP's end but the effects are felt by us, saying the very design itself is flawed and makes implementation much harder may sound esoteric, but it manifests itself on our end in reduced content, more bugs, less flexibility, less immersion, slower development cycles, more downtime, and inherently less performance than separate features would provide.
For these reasons I would say that the most important thing for CCP to do is to separate out Incarna and the rest of eve by having a disembark button in the normal hanger view. This makes most of the other issues liveable with till they are fixed. And it frees up the Incarna design team to do things with CQ and the rest of Incarna they couldn't do if it has to be able to perform as the hanger as well. Simply being able to run 1 UI instead of two would be a huge step forward. __________________________________________________
Originally by: CCP Tuxford bugger, I need to have a closer look at this menu function
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Zora'e
Nasty Pope Holding Corp Talocan United
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Posted - 2011.06.06 11:32:00 -
[93]
The current CQ build on SiSi shoves my CPU and GPU processor's into overheat. I go from a Tranquility running temperature of 38c to nearly 50c running at minimum graphics on sisi. That is just the PROCESSOR temperatures. My GPU goes from a Tranquility running temperature of roughly 41c to 74c on sisi (one client)... I normally run 3 clients on tranq and don't get those kind of temperatures.
CQ looks like it is going to have the potential to burn my GPU and CPU Processor's up unless some serious optimizing gets done in the next few days.
My Thermaltake CLP0564 Frio fan just can't pull the heat away fast enough from the CPU and the Zalman VF3000F is struggling to dump the heat from the GPU. With 4 120mm case fans, I don't have those types of heat issues with anything I run, but I'm having them with CQ. This makes Zora'e an unhappy camper. -
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MaiLina KaTar
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Posted - 2011.06.06 11:55:00 -
[94]
Originally by: Zora'e The current CQ build on SiSi shoves my CPU and GPU processor's into overheat. I go from a Tranquility running temperature of 38c to nearly 50c running at minimum graphics on sisi. That is just the PROCESSOR temperatures. My GPU goes from a Tranquility running temperature of roughly 41c to 74c on sisi (one client)... I normally run 3 clients on tranq and don't get those kind of temperatures.
CQ looks like it is going to have the potential to burn my GPU and CPU Processor's up unless some serious optimizing gets done in the next few days.
My Thermaltake CLP0564 Frio fan just can't pull the heat away fast enough from the CPU and the Zalman VF3000F is struggling to dump the heat from the GPU. With 4 120mm case fans, I don't have those types of heat issues with anything I run, but I'm having them with CQ. This makes Zora'e an unhappy camper.
That alone is more than enough reason to keep CQ 'optional' in form of a "leave ship" button on the hangar view. So to everyone who'd be reading this discounting it as whining, think again. There is a lot of validity in the criticism posed here in the forum and CCP better HTFU, listen and implement it the way it is requested by a lot of people i.e. the way it makes sense.
Forcing CQ to load on every dock will do more harm than good, especially when the intial featureset doesn't compensate the loss in performance in form of features that are useful to everybody, not just the newbies.
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Soden Rah
Gallente EVE University Ivy League
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Posted - 2011.06.06 12:00:00 -
[95]
At the moment it doesn't have features useful to anybody, due to the fact that the new 3d UI opens up the same old windows that bury CQ and mean you can only really practically use the old Neocom that doesn't get buried. I would suggest adding a proper UI that does stuff actually in the CQ/Incarna environment should be on the list of must have features. As it is CQ is totally useless. (except for entering the NCC which is the only feature you can no longer access from the neocom) __________________________________________________
Originally by: CCP Tuxford bugger, I need to have a closer look at this menu function
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Namak Bulu
Gallente Villore Regional Industries
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Posted - 2011.06.06 12:45:00 -
[96]
Originally by: Mirabi Tiane
Originally by: Namak Bulu EVE is only changing again. Immersion is long overdue
Good job ignoring my arguments. The current implementation of CQ harms immersion.
I suppose when I said that I don't yet have an opinion* on CQs didn't mean anything either. I was not refering to the current build on the test servers anyway. Nor was my post just about CQs by itself. Good job not reading my post. But I will say that if it goes live like it is now then I think your right.
But my original post had little to do with the way its currently working on the test servers or weather or not I agree with you.
*aside from those I think don't see the big picture
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Mirabi Tiane
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Posted - 2011.06.06 12:49:00 -
[97]
Originally by: Joan Avon Incarna is doing what CCP knows it needs to do which is break out of the current niche it's t****d in and open up eve to a wider audience by making Eve more accessable and interesting to the greater general public. Eve is no longer as spaceship only game because that alone is not enough to increase CCP's market share and subscription base beyond it's current small share.
It can do that without being mandatory. In fact, it can probably accomplish that better if it's optional. Bludgeoning people over the head with something does not make them appreciate it. |
Mara Rinn
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Posted - 2011.06.06 13:27:00 -
[98]
Originally by: Guttripper You can not run the latest expansion? Well we hooked up with Nvidia to bring you a special deal..."
They gave us a special 10% discount offer at FanFest, which expired long before CQ hit the streets. Someone in the marketing department is a sly bugger - "we'll give them a discount, but make sure the offer expires before they actually want to use it!"
-- [Aussie players: join ANZAC channel] |
Akita T
Caldari Navy Volunteer Task Force
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Posted - 2011.06.06 16:50:00 -
[99]
Edited by: Akita T on 06/06/2011 16:52:25
Originally by: Mara Rinn They gave us a special 10% discount offer at FanFest, which expired long before CQ hit the streets. Someone in the marketing department is a sly bugger - "we'll give them a discount, but make sure the offer expires before they actually want to use it!"
Meh, it was a discount on already slightly overpriced (and not that powerful) graphics cards. IIRC, the most powerful card in the offer listing was a GTX 460 SE (or was it a GTX 450?), which is noticeably slower than a "regular" GTX 460, and even a GTX 460 isn't exactly *that* great with CQ (actual numbers on first page). _
Make ISK||Build||React||1k papercuts
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Akita T
Caldari Navy Volunteer Task Force
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Posted - 2011.06.08 02:59:00 -
[100]
How funny that in all this DUST madness (for something that will take almost another year to happen) we forget what is to come in just two weeks from now... _
Make ISK||Build||React||1k papercuts
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Atticus Fynch
Gallente The Scope
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Posted - 2011.06.08 03:03:00 -
[101]
Originally by: Akita T Edited by: Akita T on 05/06/2011 21:18:57
A much better fallback however would be the option to maintain the current hangar view alongside the CQ environment.
Akita, you realize that statment makes waaaay too much sense, thus will never be implemented for reasons unknown.
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Sig Sour
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Posted - 2011.06.08 07:53:00 -
[102]
I want to be able to shoot at the station and make alarms go off and have the camera shake and lights flickering and really just make it very stressful for everyone who refuses to undock.
Particularly for outposts.
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Hyperforce99
Gallente The Scope
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Posted - 2011.06.08 08:49:00 -
[103]
I agree, the CQ needs to be implemented but only as an optional environment. The player SHOULD be able to switch out between the current hangar view and the CQ at will.
We really need this choice, I personally do not want to have to end up on the hangar balcony every time I dock. Its immersion breaking and we will lose our ship spinning capabilities :(
This should be simple enough with an additional dock button (dock and disembark) and a toggle switch in the NeoCom. --------------------------------------------- Somewhere beyond happyness and sadness, I need to calculate what creates my own madness o/ |
Lexxxii
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Posted - 2011.06.08 12:22:00 -
[104]
Originally by: Soden Rah You still have keeping the hanger view and making CQ separate after docking as optional...
For these reasons I would say that the most important thing for CCP to do is to separate out Incarna and the rest of eve by having a disembark button in the normal hanger view.
Soooooo many people have said this, for once CCP please listen.
How hard can it be. Seriously.
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Soden Rah
Gallente EVE University Ivy League
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Posted - 2011.06.08 12:44:00 -
[105]
Originally by: Akita T How funny that in all this DUST madness (for something that will take almost another year to happen) we forget what is to come in just two weeks from now...
Didn't forget about it... just moved discussion out of general ;-) it got a bit too noisy in here. __________________________________________________
Originally by: CCP Tuxford bugger, I need to have a closer look at this menu function
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Khavi Kitamatsu
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Posted - 2011.06.08 13:19:00 -
[106]
I hope eventually we can customize our CQ's and even invite friends in. It would be cool to be able to personalize our characters CQ's.
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Sig Sour
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Posted - 2011.06.08 16:04:00 -
[107]
Originally by: Khavi Kitamatsu I hope eventually we can customize our CQ's and even invite friends in. It would be cool to be able to personalize our characters CQ's.
And that novelty is interesting for how long?
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Culmen
Caldari Vigrior The Dominion Empire
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Posted - 2011.06.08 16:08:00 -
[108]
I think at this point we can pretty much write off having the old hanger environment for the immediate term.
CCP has just replaced the place holder loading station environment thingy with an actual image of a station interior. Implying that the removal of the hanger is indeed permanent.
It's a shame really. and further more why do i even need a sig? |
Fix Lag
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Posted - 2011.06.08 16:20:00 -
[109]
Fix lag by not forcing players to use "content" (and I have to stretch the definition of that word to fit Incarna...christ it's a screen on a wall, thanks for spending 18 months on that) that will leave anyone with a laptop SOL and anyone with a PC older than three years SOL.
Summer of Rage II.
Fix Lag! |
Akita T
Caldari Navy Volunteer Task Force
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Posted - 2011.06.11 12:20:00 -
[110]
Originally by: Atticus Fynch
Originally by: Akita T A much better fallback however would be the option to maintain the current hangar view alongside the CQ environment.
Akita, you realize that statment makes waaaay too much sense, thus will never be implemented for reasons unknown.
Yeah, most likely _
Make ISK||Build||React||1k papercuts
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Tres Farmer
Gallente Federation Intelligence Service
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Posted - 2011.06.11 12:33:00 -
[111]
Edited by: Tres Farmer on 11/06/2011 12:35:00 might be just me.. but loading times on the latest Sisi build for the CQ are way faster now.. Version: 7.10.269603 Could you run another timing on your machine Akita and compare with your earlier stats?
Get rid of Rooms with Doors - Shortrange Jumpdrives for everybody! |
Dr Karsun
Gallente Coffee Lovers Brewing Club
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Posted - 2011.06.11 12:34:00 -
[112]
Well, my pc runs up to 3 clients in their CQs as it does in the normal station, the frame rate doesn't drop below any margin which would make any VISUAL change... I mean, sure, the digits get a lil' bit down, but it doesn't make any problem as far as gaming goes.
My PC (box only) cost me something around 350 bucks... And I bought it around a year ago... It's really not that bad. I run win 7, 64 bits, with 4GB of ram, a 1024 radeon hd5770 and an amd quad core 2ghz... So it's not all top-shelf stuff.
I'm all for CQ, it runs smooth and it WILL make my player exeriance far, far better. I am really waiting for it. SISI that has the CQ now makes it look totally awesome, can't wait.
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Akita T
Caldari Navy Volunteer Task Force
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Posted - 2011.06.11 12:39:00 -
[113]
Edited by: Akita T on 11/06/2011 12:40:44
Originally by: Dr Karsun Well, my pc runs up to 3 clients in their CQs as it does in the normal station, the frame rate doesn't drop below any margin which would make any VISUAL change... I mean, sure, the digits get a lil' bit down, but it doesn't make any problem as far as gaming goes.
But have you been watching your video card temperature ?
Quote: SISI that has the CQ now makes it look totally awesome, can't wait.
Except the lighting is kinda' "meh" in most of the CQ, but that's another story...
Originally by: Tres Farmer might be just me.. but loading times on the latest Sisi build for the CQ are way faster now.. Version: 7.10.269603 Could you run another timing on your machine Akita and compare with your earlier stats?
I wasn't particularly bothered with the loading times to begin with... I suppose people that dock/undock often will just disable CQ loading and be done with it (and re-enable it only when they want to). I'll retest it later on... _
Make ISK||Build||React||1k papercuts
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Tres Farmer
Gallente Federation Intelligence Service
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Posted - 2011.06.11 12:59:00 -
[114]
Originally by: Akita T
Originally by: Dr Karsun Well, my pc runs up to 3 clients in their CQs as it does in the normal station, the frame rate doesn't drop below any margin which would make any VISUAL change... I mean, sure, the digits get a lil' bit down, but it doesn't make any problem as far as gaming goes.
But have you been watching your video card temperature ? *snip*
HD 4670 512MB stock clock 780MHz, all settings in client high, windowed 1440x900 idle with some processes open, 17% usage, 45degC sisi, sitting on couch from behind + above, 99% usage, 62degC, 18fps_avg tq, hangar view + above, 85% usage, 56degC, 50fps_avg
Was a nice low power card 2-3 years ago.. time doesn't stand still.
Get rid of Rooms with Doors - Shortrange Jumpdrives for everybody! |
Halcyon Ingenium
Caldari Bene Gesserit ChapterHouse Sanctuary Pact
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Posted - 2011.06.11 13:21:00 -
[115]
Originally by: Akita T
So, to recap, you can keep the CQ environment as the default enabled option, but: * MANDATORY - separate the CQ from the non-CQ graphics detail settings into two completely separate groups which you can set differently * MANDATORY - keep the ESC menu option to not load any environment at all * STRONGLY PREFERRED - add some even lower graphics detail levels for CQ * OPTIONAL - do not delete the current hangar environments AND make them an alternative (default disabled) via the ESC menu
+1, especially the optional. On the other hand has anyone really been far even as decided to use even go want to do look more like? ________________________________________________
Huh? |
Scorpii Orion
Scorpii Orion Corp
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Posted - 2011.06.11 13:36:00 -
[116]
Originally by: Akita T Edited by: Akita T on 05/06/2011 20:22:08
Originally by: Scorpii Orion
Originally by: Akita T botwhine
Just NO! Kill the BOTS! Force CQ! Only botters use crappy PC's and good enough PC costs like 150$ and even in Africa they can afford on that.
I surely hope you're attempting to make a joke. Or being sarcastic, but not getting it quite right.
Couldn't be more serious.
These RMT losers are the ones who are really wanting option to disable it.
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Jasdemi
Deep Core Mining Inc.
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Posted - 2011.06.11 13:38:00 -
[117]
Just buy a new computer and stop playing with that 10 years old relic, whiners.
------ "Phat Lewt Couriers" mailing list/channel for high value, low volume courier contracts |
Scorpii Orion
Scorpii Orion Corp
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Posted - 2011.06.11 13:39:00 -
[118]
Edited by: Scorpii Orion on 11/06/2011 13:39:33
Originally by: Jasdemi Just buy a new computer and stop playing with that 10 years old relic, whiners.
Yeah, world is not static, no matter how much they whine.
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Akita T
Caldari Navy Volunteer Task Force
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Posted - 2011.06.11 13:50:00 -
[119]
Originally by: Scorpii Orion These RMT losers are the ones who are really wanting option to disable it.
It's already disableable, so you don't have a point anymore. Unless you are actively campaigning to REMOVE the recently re-added "load station environment" checkbox ?
Originally by: Jasdemi Just buy a new computer and stop playing with that 10 years old relic, whiners.
If I'd be using a 60Hz LCD screen with vsynch on I'd almost always have max FPS in CQ even with max details, but since I'm at 85Hz I get the occasional fluctuation. That doesn't mean I like having my graphics card burning the full 160-170W or however much power it usually burns at full load, heating up in the process, JUST to display something I have very little interest in displaying at THAT particular graphic detail, especially when it doesn't even look that good to begin with. I'd much rather prefer to have the option to let it burn only 60-70W or thereabouts, as it usually does now in stations. _
Make ISK||Build||React||1k papercuts
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Abriael VonRosen
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Posted - 2011.06.11 15:34:00 -
[120]
Just a partly unrelated heads up, if your GTX460 gets to 72 degrees with ANY game (or to 56 with something as light as the stations), either your video card fan is damaged, or you need to work on the airflow in your case. Tuck away excess cables, add more fans on the case, or get a better case (there are very cheap ones around with fantastic airflows like the Antec 300, provided that all the optional fans are installed).
72 degrees for a GTX460 seriously risks to damage it, or at the very least increase wear and tear by a LOT.
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Taedrin
Gallente The Green Cross Controlled Chaos
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Posted - 2011.06.11 16:00:00 -
[121]
The issue for CCP isn't that it is hard to not delete something. The issue is that it is hard to maintain two sets of code which accomplish the same thing. If they keep both the old and new station environments active in the code at once, that is twice as much testing that needs to be done. Every change in their code now has one more additional thing that they can break, so they have to do all the more QA testing to make sure it doesn't break.
IMO, what CCP should do is what they did with the trinity engine release: Temporarily maintain both sets of code, while you give players a chance to upgrade. Schedule the code for deletion, but give players a significant amount of warning before you do so. Several months at least. ----------
Originally by: Dr Fighter "how do you know when youve had a repro accident"
Theres modules missing and morphite in your mineral pile.
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Soden Rah
Gallente EVE University Ivy League
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Posted - 2011.06.11 16:13:00 -
[122]
Originally by: Taedrin The issue for CCP isn't that it is hard to not delete something. The issue is that it is hard to maintain two sets of code which accomplish the same thing. If they keep both the old and new station environments active in the code at once, that is twice as much testing that needs to be done. Every change in their code now has one more additional thing that they can break, so they have to do all the more QA testing to make sure it doesn't break.
IMO, what CCP should do is what they did with the trinity engine release: Temporarily maintain both sets of code, while you give players a chance to upgrade. Schedule the code for deletion, but give players a significant amount of warning before you do so. Several months at least.
this only makes sense if you have the Hanger and CQ do the same thing.... But they shouldn't do the same thing.
The whole point is that they are trying to make one feature perform to different functions with often mutually contradictory requirements... Take a look at this post for one tiny example.
Also this thread deals with the issue.
And on the amount of testing needing to be done and such, They will be iterating on space and the in space UI, they will be iterating on Incarna and the In Incarna UI, If the hanger and CQ are separate then those changes don't overlap and don't interfere with each other... If CQ is made to do both then they do overlap and can both affect each other. __________________________________________________
Originally by: CCP Tuxford bugger, I need to have a closer look at this menu function
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Tobiaz
Spacerats
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Posted - 2011.06.11 16:38:00 -
[123]
Originally by: Hannibal Ord Another point is that for gods sake, ship spinning is as iconic as the Raven hull or Aura saying "Warp drive Active" or something like that. Do we really want it gone? I will miss it.
CCP cares little. They changed the Scorpion into this symmetrical and ridiculous looking bug, and now the Maller and Sacrilege are being 'upgraded' as well to look like a shinier version of the Minmatar design.
How long until the Raven is smooth and symmetrical all races's ships have the same style except for a different color and all T2-bits are gone?
Seriously though: CCP should just make the docking a 2 phase process. First you dock and you get the 'old' interface with ship-spinning and 2 sec loading time. And from there you can 'unpod' loading the CQ interface.
I can't think of any good argument against this. If you're going to lounge in your CQ, the additional 2 secs really don't matter and if you're just changing ships, you skip everything that people are now so ****ed about.
EVE always had a big benefit of not being insane on the hardware specs. In that view CQ is a stupid move and can REALLY hurt their subscriptions (since a lot of the 50k logged in users are multiboxed alts. In this light it's tempting to be pro-CQ though
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Andreus Ixiris
Gallente Mixed Metaphor
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Posted - 2011.06.11 16:44:00 -
[124]
Make CQ optional. ----- Andreus Ixiris CEO, Mixed Metaphor
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Akita T
Caldari Navy Volunteer Task Force
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Posted - 2011.06.11 16:50:00 -
[125]
Edited by: Akita T on 11/06/2011 16:54:22
Originally by: Abriael VonRosen Just a partly unrelated heads up, if your GTX460 gets to 72 degrees with ANY game (or to 56 with something as light as the stations), either your video card fan is damaged, or you need to work on the airflow in your case.
The near 30-ish degrees Celsius ambient temperature was/is the problem... my room peaks at over 40C during summer afternoons - windows are facing westwards and always open (smoking in the room, AC would be nigh-useless), no buildings nor trees obstructing the sun until very late in the afternoon, up to 700W (or maybe even 800W) worth of gear churning away nearly constantly (my desktop, big CRT, household server and the LAN switch, big room fan, speakers), heavy curtain and fan does very little to compensate. Heck, I get a relatively steady +5 Celsius mid-winter nights with the windows slightly cracked open and fan running on low speed, when outside it's full of snow ! _
Make ISK||Build||React||1k papercuts
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Syphon Lodian
Gallente
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Posted - 2011.06.11 18:29:00 -
[126]
Edited by: Syphon Lodian on 11/06/2011 18:30:00 In this thread:
A bunch of people who neglect the fact that CCP had a 'vision' prior to starting their development of EVE, and "space only" was a compromise because tech and funding wasn't there to start what we are just now seeing; Avatars, CQ and so on. EVE was never intended to be space-only. This is the first real move into a "non-space" addition, and you people go ape-****.
This isn't a new plan, or surprising at all. We knew this was coming for years, and years.
An optional CQ would be reasonable, if they made the option RP. -- When you dock, "Do you wish to disembark or would you like to load the hangar API, pilot?" -- Possibly allow "Remember Choice".
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Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
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Posted - 2011.06.11 18:56:00 -
[127]
Originally by: Taedrin The issue for CCP isn't that it is hard to not delete something. The issue is that it is hard to maintain two sets of code which accomplish the same thing.
But that's just it: it wouldn't be two sets of code ù it would be one set of code used in two places. All the UI elements will be retained in both environments and will look exactly the same: going into the market interface in Incarna will look just like going into the market interface outside of Incarna.
Sure, at some point in the future, there might be Incarna-specific UI elements, eg. when we get bars and the like, but there will still not be any duplication of effort for the simple reason that they are Incarna-specific ù there is no need (and indeed, no point) to duplicate it to the non-Incarna environment.
The situation with Trinity was almost completely different: they had to make all 3D assets twice. That is not the case here. They only have to do things once, and either display it in two places, or simply not display it at all in once for those who don't want to deal with it. ùùù ôIf you're not willing to fight for what you have in ≡v≡à you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.ö ù Karath Piki |
Raimo
Genos Occidere HYDRA RELOADED
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Posted - 2011.06.11 19:15:00 -
[128]
Supporting the OP ----------
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Akita T
Caldari Navy Volunteer Task Force
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Posted - 2011.06.12 21:04:00 -
[129]
Originally by: Syphon Lodian In this thread: A bunch of people who neglect the fact that CCP had a 'vision' prior to starting their development of EVE, and "space only" was a compromise because tech and funding wasn't there to start what we are just now seeing; Avatars, CQ and so on.
I don't know about the others, but I personally like the idea of having more than just the spaceship part. I just don't like the fact we HAVE to "get out of the pod" every time we dock.
Quote: An optional CQ would be reasonable, if they made the option RP. -- When you dock, "Do you wish to disembark or would you like to load the hangar API, pilot?" -- Possibly allow "Remember Choice".
Well, they (more or less recently) said that they'll also make it so that you can select WHERE in the CQ you get materialized when you dock or login or whatever (right now, when you dock, you're on the balcony, but when you login you're near the couch, with no way to change that). I suppose having an extra default selection of "hangar view" available would be the simplest way. But that would mean they'd keep the hangar view, which (lately) they repeatedly said they're going to just delete.
Oh well... _
Make ISK||Build||React||1k papercuts
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Salpun
Gallente Paramount Commerce
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Posted - 2011.06.12 21:11:00 -
[130]
Edited by: Salpun on 12/06/2011 21:12:24 I think we will get our desired ship spinning view back. ie camera drone view it will just take some time.
Having the cameria point towards the hanger or towards the rest of the CQ needs to be a choise to.
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Razin
The xDEATHx Squadron Legion of xXDEATHXx
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Posted - 2011.06.12 21:30:00 -
[131]
Originally by: Salpun Edited by: Salpun on 12/06/2011 21:12:24 I think we will get our desired ship spinning view back. ie camera drone view it will just take some time.
Having the cameria point towards the hanger or towards the rest of the CQ needs to be a choise to.
The problem here is to get CCP to leave the ship-spin view in the game before they are through taking it out completely. Otherwise this will turn into another engine trail or the AF's 4-th bonus deal - years will go by with nothing being done. ... If you like choice please support this topic in the Assembly Hall. Thanks.
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Soden Rah
Gallente EVE University Ivy League
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Posted - 2011.06.13 19:54:00 -
[132]
bump, Incarna release is getting close and this thread has good points in it that need addressing. __________________________________________________
Originally by: CCP Tuxford bugger, I need to have a closer look at this menu function
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Tugrath Akers
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Posted - 2011.06.13 20:27:00 -
[133]
I sure hope they retrofit all of the Customs offices with hangers and ship fitting capabilities.
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Abdiel Kavash
Caldari Paladin Order Fidelas Constans
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Posted - 2011.06.13 21:10:00 -
[134]
Edited by: Abdiel Kavash on 13/06/2011 21:10:36 Just want to add my voice in here.
I am looking forward to Walking in Stations, I have been ever since I heard of it. Most of all I would like to see my in-game friends "face to face" some day.
HOWEVER, I am NOT looking forward to having to load all that crap every time I need to dock to change ships or buy ammo or pick up cargo. What used to be "dock, drag an icon from one pile to another, undock" will now get interrupted by a long-ass loading screen loading something I have no intention of using.
"Get a better computer" you say. I have had this machine for about 1.5 years, and it runs EVE in all its current glory very well, and I expected it to do so for at least another year or so. However even the character creator runs at about 1 FPS for me. And I am not sure whether walking around in my own little closet is worth a hardware upgrade just yet. ---
Originally by: Sporked EVE IS DYING RUN TO THE HILLS! WE MIGHT HAVE TO ENGAGE WITH OTHER PEOPLE IN THIS MMO! THEY MIGHT SHOOT AT US WHILE WE ARE BUSY HOLDING HANDS AND FROLICKING! AAAAAAAAAAAAAAA
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Cloora
APEX Unlimited APEX Conglomerate
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Posted - 2011.06.13 22:32:00 -
[135]
OP is right.
Keep the current hanger view.
Petition signed ------------------------------------------
CEO and Major Shareholder of the APEX Conglomerate Producer of Starsi brand softdrinks and Torped-Os! brand cereal as well as many other fine products |
Brujo Loco
Amarr Brujeria Teologica
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Posted - 2011.06.13 22:59:00 -
[136]
Hmmm, I have mixed feelings, I have a decent enough GPU/CPU combo to support CQ, and to consider peoples crap puters into not running the client efficiently is something Im not either against or in favor.
Keeping computer specs low for some people MIGHT be ok, but honestly, I think they are in a minority, this reminds me of the old shader model being made obsolete and the ruckus in the forums back in the day, when practically everything was retextured, or when back in the day EQ stopped supporting Win95 .
I think we must consider this isnt WOW nor a Blizzard game made for computers as old as grandma. In a year most 100$ or less gpus will run CQ optimally anyway and several mid priced GPUS can run it now np either.
Leaving an option for not loading CQ and just using the old system might seem ok. But I think backwards compatibility with older systems is more of a step in the wrong direction. Change is good, for better or worst, in the long run is always for the better. --- Viva VENEZUELA!!! Archipelago Theory
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Andreus Ixiris
Gallente Mixed Metaphor
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Posted - 2011.06.13 23:08:00 -
[137]
I would like to remind everyone in this thread, if you didn't already know, that this expansion will permanently remove the following functionality:
- Drag-and-drop ship to main screen to activate a ship - Double-click on main screen to access active ship cargo hold - Right-click on main screen to access active ship drop-down ----- Andreus Ixiris CEO, Mixed Metaphor
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Soden Rah
Gallente EVE University Ivy League
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Posted - 2011.06.13 23:18:00 -
[138]
Originally by: Andreus Ixiris I would like to remind everyone in this thread, if you didn't already know, that this expansion will permanently remove the following functionality:
- Drag-and-drop ship to main screen to activate a ship - Double-click on main screen to access active ship cargo hold - Right-click on main screen to access active ship drop-down
you forgot ship spinning, the ability to drag drop things into ship, the ability to do anything other than peer at your ship from a great distance from the balcony. Have a safe, stable, low CPU/grfx intensive simple easy to use environment upon docking, instead of an unstable, Highest cpu/grfx intensive environment upon docking.
It also totally screws those who want Incarna by tying the Incarna UI to the in space UI. So instead of getting a proper UI that works in the environment, and is optimised to work in stations, you get the old UI, that isn't optimised for anything, but is designed for space, and being in hanger, and covers up everything you want/need to see in Incarna with windows.
It doesn't matter if you do, or do not, want incarna, or could care less either way. removing the old hanger view and replacing it with CQ is detrimental, both in the short and long terms. In fact it gets worse as time goes on. __________________________________________________
Originally by: CCP Tuxford bugger, I need to have a closer look at this menu function
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Obsidian Hawk
RONA Legion RONA Directorate
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Posted - 2011.06.14 00:37:00 -
[139]
Damnit akita you had to do this before it was release rather than 2 weeks ago.
Supported.
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Akita T
Caldari Navy Volunteer Task Force
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Posted - 2011.06.18 08:48:00 -
[140]
3 more days until massive hate floods the forums _
Make ISK||Build||React||1k papercuts
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Doctor Deals
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Posted - 2011.06.18 09:35:00 -
[141]
The China server should still have ship spinning.
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Tres Farmer
Gallente Federation Intelligence Service
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Posted - 2011.06.18 10:01:00 -
[142]
Originally by: Akita T 3 more days until massive hate floods the forums
Who do you think will be the most ****ed? Miners? Mission Runners? PVPers? Traders? Roleplayers?
Get rid of Rooms with Doors - Shortrange Jumpdrives for everybody! |
Akita T
Caldari Navy Volunteer Task Force
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Posted - 2011.06.18 11:00:00 -
[143]
Originally by: Tres Farmer
Originally by: Akita T 3 more days until massive hate floods the forums
Who do you think will be the most ****ed? Miners? Mission Runners? PVPers? Traders? Roleplayers?
Station-spinners _
Make ISK||Build||React||1k papercuts
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Zora'e
Nasty Pope Holding Corp Talocan United
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Posted - 2011.06.18 11:15:00 -
[144]
The newest build on SISI isn't terribly bad. On low settings I can handle three clients in space reasonably well. However, trying to dock all three at the same time took 1 1/2 minutes instead of the less than 15 seconds docking three clients on TQ takes. As this was the test server and there wasn't anybody around to see how long my ship hung in space, I have no idea if I docked immediately (normally) and the delay was due to loading CQ or if I hung in space that entire time.
On SISI: My GPU used 900 megs off the 1 gig available on it. It used 65-75% of the GPU's overall processing power, and my temps stayed down between 60-70c running three clients.
On TQ: My GPU used 285 megs off the 1 gig available on it. It used 50-54% of the GPU's overall processing power, and my temps stayed down between 55-60c running three clients.
On SISI: My computers processor (overclocked 10%)... was buried at 100% utilization the entire time after loading the second client, docked or in space.
On TQ: My computers processor (overclocked 10%)... was at 37% utilization and only jumped to 75% after undocking (this was running three clients).
Thankfully this evening is cool as it is only 22c instead of my normal 30-32c.
But... what this does show is that I will be able to run 3 clients in space, docking however will be a pita.
~Z -
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Akita T
Caldari Navy Volunteer Task Force
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Posted - 2011.06.19 09:51:00 -
[145]
TWO more days to crapstorm. Oh, come on, CCP, so very little you have to do for us to not end up hating this junk, yet...
_
Make ISK||Build||React||1k papercuts
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Tres Farmer
Gallente Federation Intelligence Service
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Posted - 2011.06.19 10:13:00 -
[146]
Edited by: Tres Farmer on 19/06/2011 10:15:12
Originally by: Akita T TWO more days to crapstorm. Oh, come on, CCP, so very little you have to do for us to not end up hating this junk, yet...
You're still hoping, don't ya?
I think the first time this really dawned on me and I lost my virginity in this regard was your post about screwed T3 drops and then later again that post about tech. Man, that T3 stuff is now 2 years ago, isn't it?
Get rid of Rooms with Doors - Shortrange Jumpdrives for everybody! |
Dasola
Minmatar
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Posted - 2011.06.19 10:22:00 -
[147]
Originally by: Taedrin The issue for CCP isn't that it is hard to not delete something. The issue is that it is hard to maintain two sets of code which accomplish the same thing. If they keep both the old and new station environments active in the code at once, that is twice as much testing that needs to be done. Every change in their code now has one more additional thing that they can break, so they have to do all the more QA testing to make sure it doesn't break.
IMO, what CCP should do is what they did with the trinity engine release: Temporarily maintain both sets of code, while you give players a chance to upgrade. Schedule the code for deletion, but give players a significant amount of warning before you do so. Several months at least.
Since when has ccp done even basic play testing, etc? Newer, they let their customers test it.
This is my opinion based on little things like ship flying backwards after last extension + tons of other crap theyr QA should have catched before releases multiply times.
Its no trouble at all to maintain two station eviroments, after all current one is well tested by now after years of use. Unless of course ccp devs comments about codebase being better shape then ever is lie and its full of spagethy code...
Sadly ccp has strong history of makeing promises and then failing to uphold them. After all they did promise that all this station walk stuff would be optional.
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Akita T
Caldari Navy Volunteer Task Force
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Posted - 2011.06.19 10:52:00 -
[148]
Edited by: Akita T on 19/06/2011 10:53:03
Originally by: Tres Farmer I think the first time this really dawned on me and I lost my virginity in this regard was your post about screwed T3 drops and then later again that post about tech. Man, that T3 stuff is now 2 years ago, isn't it?
What about the one about a reworking of the way minerals are obtained ? That's almost 4 years old. Granted, parts of it were implemented. Tiny parts. The least relevant parts. _
Make ISK||Build||React||1k papercuts
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Arec Bardwin
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Posted - 2011.06.19 10:59:00 -
[149]
Originally by: Akita T TWO more days to crapstorm. Oh, come on, CCP, so very little you have to do for us to not end up hating this junk, yet...
Originally by: Tres Farmer
You're still hoping, don't ya?
I think the first time this really dawned on me and I lost my virginity in this regard was your post about screwed T3 drops and then later again that post about tech. Man, that T3 stuff is now 2 years ago, isn't it?
Oh, man! I forgot about that
Incarna/Captain's Quarters WILL be mandatory. It's the only way people will actually use it. Crapstorm definitely incoming.
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Mocam
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Posted - 2011.06.19 11:11:00 -
[150]
Originally by: Akita T
Originally by: Tres Farmer
Originally by: Akita T 3 more days until massive hate floods the forums
Who do you think will be the most ****ed? Miners? Mission Runners? PVPers? Traders? Roleplayers?
Station-spinners
Beyond this - the fun one might be buy order pickup traders. Players may see a smaller buy ranges.
50+ stations in your buy range... Yeah the extra slowdown may have them shrink that range a bit in some areas. The current load times are onerous enough if you have a ton of stops to pick the stuff up, let alone taking longer with CQ.
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Sirinda
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Posted - 2011.06.19 11:19:00 -
[151]
Edited by: Sirinda on 19/06/2011 11:19:56 I estimate about 60 hours to go until the fecal matter hits the rotating air distribution device....sorry, meant Incarna hits the servers.
June 22, 01:20 or so. Sounds about right, yes?
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Ashlyn Shi'jun
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Posted - 2011.06.19 11:24:00 -
[152]
I totaly agree with the OP, i want the CQ to be optional (button on the side like it was shown 2 years or so ago).
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LordInvisible
Gallente Nova Ardour
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Posted - 2011.06.19 11:27:00 -
[153]
Akita T, you out of all should know, that CCP doesnt give sh.it about their players. They wanna test their new fancy sims in space stuff on us before they lunch fail DUST and vampires.
Not a single reply from dev in this 10 pages long thread, that says everything.. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Quote: "For me EvE wasn't that much fun, many ppl refer to it as a nicely designed database front-end and that |
Fearless Worthless
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Posted - 2011.06.19 11:41:00 -
[154]
The thing that ****es me off about this thread (no offense) is that if Akita wasn't the one posting it, it would be just some random person whining.
I've felt this way for a long time (necessity for two options)... even just for
I would really love CCP to open the UI for player design, similarly to "that other game" so that we can have some control over how we interact with the server... keep in mind that most of the new UI developed in that game in recent years has been just polished-up stuff that was already player-designed.
CCP really is crippling innovation (of their own product) by not allowing us to do this.
/rant.
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Madcow
Minmatar Sebiestor Tribe
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Posted - 2011.06.19 12:13:00 -
[155]
Originally by: Mocam
Originally by: Akita T
Originally by: Tres Farmer
Originally by: Akita T 3 more days until massive hate floods the forums
Who do you think will be the most ****ed? Miners? Mission Runners? PVPers? Traders? Roleplayers?
Station-spinners
Beyond this - the fun one might be buy order pickup traders. Players may see a smaller buy ranges.
50+ stations in your buy range... Yeah the extra slowdown may have them shrink that range a bit in some areas. The current load times are onerous enough if you have a ton of stops to pick the stuff up, let alone taking longer with CQ.
Dont get how it can take longer load time is max 20 a 30 secs but while you load you can use the neocom interface so at worst case you undock before it has loaded. ______________________ I am just a crazy cow |
Halcyon Ingenium
Caldari Bene Gesserit ChapterHouse Sanctuary Pact
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Posted - 2011.06.19 13:03:00 -
[156]
Captain's Quarters need a suicide booth, for when you're ready to delete your character. You can just step in, insert your 1000 AUR coin, and opt out.
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Akita T
Caldari Navy Volunteer Task Force
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Posted - 2011.06.20 06:40:00 -
[157]
Originally by: Halcyon Ingenium Captain's Quarters need a suicide booth, for when you're ready to delete your character. You can just step in, insert your 1000 AUR coin, and opt out.
Oh, Bender, you're so funny
Unrelated : ONE MORE DAY UNTIL EXCREMENT FALLS ON ROTATING BLADES !
_
Make ISK||Build||React||1k papercuts
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Akita T
Caldari Navy Volunteer Task Force
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Posted - 2011.06.21 14:23:00 -
[158]
Just a few more hours until Chocolate Rain _
Make ISK||Build||React||1k papercuts
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Akita T
Caldari Navy Volunteer Task Force
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Posted - 2011.06.21 23:41:00 -
[159]
Edited by: Akita T on 21/06/2011 23:41:58
And so, it begins
At least there's quite a few other things people can complain about except CQ... _
Make ISK||Build||React||1k papercuts
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Soden Rah
Gallente EVE University Ivy League
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Posted - 2011.06.21 23:48:00 -
[160]
and to add to this... here are three petitions, that every newly disgruntled player should know about...
bring back the hanger
[Petition] Allow Character recustomiseation without creating Portrait
and this still to be fixed longer standing issue
[Petition] The Great Ship Fittings Nerf
also I recommend checking out the test server feedback forums for more info on what's broken
this and this thread are good places to start. --------
By Grfmsv÷tn, Eyjafjallaj÷kull, Vatnaj÷kull, and Hekla itself... THIS is my sig.
Support Optional CQ
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Bustin Jieber
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Posted - 2011.06.21 23:49:00 -
[161]
I honestly wasn't expecting much from Incarna but it's so, so bad. wtf ccp
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Ewa White
Dosadi Inc. Xenology Federation
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Posted - 2011.06.22 00:05:00 -
[162]
ok very nice that was fun for about 5 mins , bring back ship spinning ... this is boring as hell and useless (for now) |
Obsidian Hawk
RONA Legion RONA Directorate
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Posted - 2011.06.22 00:13:00 -
[163]
Bump for great justice, and This topic will be hot linked at the top of the list for hot topics of the assembly hall.
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Daelorn
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Posted - 2011.06.22 00:15:00 -
[164]
I want the old view back when we dock.
Then a separate button for us to disembark from the ship.
Makes everyone happy, and even makes more sense from an RP perspective.
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Wacktopia
Dark Side Of The Womb
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Posted - 2011.06.22 00:21:00 -
[165]
Posting again in one of these threads.
Please make it...
Dock > Ship Spin > CQ.
Simples.
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Juziri
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Posted - 2011.06.22 00:22:00 -
[166]
CQ is useless, unfinished and ****ing unoptimized. It burns out my graphic card on lowest settings and looks absolutly like **** at the same time. Give us back the old station spinning instead of an ugly wallpaper! Make CQ completely optional.
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Londo Cebb
Official Market Discussions Troll
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Posted - 2011.06.22 00:24:00 -
[167]
* MANDATORY - do not delete the current hangar environments AND make them an alternative (default disabled) via the ESC menu
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heyItradestuff
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Posted - 2011.06.22 00:28:00 -
[168]
Originally by: Ashlyn Shi'jun I totaly agree with the OP, i want the CQ to be optional (button on the side like it was shown 2 years or so ago).
this is how it should be.
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dermannmitdemkoks
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Posted - 2011.06.22 00:33:00 -
[169]
no more activating ships by drag and drop to station background as well? why? cry for me argentina.
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Vandrion
Gallente The Collective B O R G
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Posted - 2011.06.22 00:37:00 -
[170]
Originally by: dermannmitdemkoks no more activating ships by drag and drop to station background as well? why? cry for me argentina.
Why? I will tell you why:
If you don't load the shiney JAIL cell that CQ is you won't be able to see the MONEY store and thus won't allow CCP to open a wormhole in your wallet!
I posted in the CQ feedback thread and in the make CQ optional thread... JAIL CELLS SUCK!
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Mater Dolorosa
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Posted - 2011.06.22 00:37:00 -
[171]
Edited by: Mater Dolorosa on 22/06/2011 00:38:26 My graphic card & cpu fans are now spinning loudly, I could barely hear them before. Add Lower fps and this is what I call a fail patch...
Give us the old hangar (with the ship instead of the closed door) while you invent way not to destroy our graphic cards and cpus...
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Akita T
Caldari Navy Volunteer Task Force
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Posted - 2011.06.22 00:47:00 -
[172]
Originally by: Akita T And so, it begins...
...
Originally by: HeIIfire11 LMAO
http://www.eveonline.com/ingameboard.asp?a=topic&threadID=1532859
http://www.eveonline.com/ingameboard.asp?a=topic&threadID=1533071
http://www.eveonline.com/ingameboard.asp?a=topic&threadID=1533015
http://www.eveonline.com/ingameboard.asp?a=topic&threadID=1533025
http://www.eveonline.com/ingameboard.asp?a=topic&threadID=1532978
http://www.eveonline.com/ingameboard.asp?a=topic&threadID=1532988
http://www.eveonline.com/ingameboard.asp?a=topic&threadID=1533039
http://www.eveonline.com/ingameboard.asp?a=topic&threadID=1532932
http://www.eveonline.com/ingameboard.asp?a=topic&threadID=1532997
http://www.eveonline.com/ingameboard.asp?a=topic&threadID=1532959
http://www.eveonline.com/ingameboard.asp?a=topic&threadID=1532957
http://www.eveonline.com/ingameboard.asp?a=topic&threadID=1532940
http://www.eveonline.com/ingameboard.asp?a=topic&threadID=1532946
http://www.eveonline.com/ingameboard.asp?a=topic&threadID=1533109
http://www.eveonline.com/ingameboard.asp?a=topic&threadID=1533120
Too many to link... oh the tears
Ditto. _
Make ISK||Build||React||1k papercuts
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Zom Bo
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Posted - 2011.06.22 01:27:00 -
[173]
I for one welcome our new wardrobe overlords
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Arya Greywolf
|
Posted - 2011.06.22 01:36:00 -
[174]
Edited by: Arya Greywolf on 22/06/2011 01:36:35 I support these REQUIRED changes.
+1 more - Give us a double click open cargo button!
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Sha Dar
eXceed Inc. No Holes Barred
|
Posted - 2011.06.22 01:39:00 -
[175]
Signed x 5 accounts. |
heheheh
Phoenix Club
|
Posted - 2011.06.22 01:43:00 -
[176]
Its going to need some monumental improvements if we are ever going to interact in a station in Jita, thats for sure.
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Agrikaan
Amarr Defensores Fidei Curatores Veritatis Alliance
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Posted - 2011.06.22 01:44:00 -
[177]
SIGNED x 4 accounts since 7 years.
Actually CQ implementation was good. When running 4 accounts I used to have 10-20% system resources left. Now when I got bored of the eye candy after 2 mins and turned them all off, I have 33% system resources left! THANKS!
2 clients with CQ on: laggy 3 clients: 1fps 4 clients: System crash.
Don't EVER make CQ or walking in stations mandatory. That means at least 3 accounts cancelled for my part.
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Selinate
Amarr Mocking Birds
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Posted - 2011.06.22 01:45:00 -
[178]
Originally by: Irulan Corinno Edited by: Irulan Corinno on 05/06/2011 18:47:46
Originally by: Akita T * add some even lower graphics detail levels for CQ
New low res CQ:
Made me laugh. Needed a reply.
Will there be holes in the ground that make you start back at the ship hangar?
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Angel HUN
Spricer Raiden.
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Posted - 2011.06.22 01:48:00 -
[179]
+1 (in the Agree meaning)
Originally by: CCP Oveur
We. Will. Never. Leave. EVE.
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BBJ Shepard
Thunderwaffe Goonswarm Federation
|
Posted - 2011.06.22 01:51:00 -
[180]
aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa )0) \0/ (0( |
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Kavin Alavandar
Extropy Dianoetics
|
Posted - 2011.06.22 01:52:00 -
[181]
CQ loads faster than the station environments did, and you can do everything through the same old UI without taking one step. Not understanding the hate.
Video card overheating? You think this is EVE's fault? lawl _______________________________________________ æA planet is the cradle of mind, but one cannot live in a cradle forever.Æ ùKonstantin Tsiolkovsky |
Liva Daril
Caldari
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Posted - 2011.06.22 01:52:00 -
[182]
Love the new low res CQ!
And ATM just reduced to random giggles by the Noble shop.
Even CQ doesn¦t seem so bad, although most of my multiaccount friends are doing the Cartman "Screw this I¦m ..."
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Akita T
Caldari Navy Volunteer Task Force
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Posted - 2011.06.22 01:56:00 -
[183]
Edited by: Akita T on 22/06/2011 01:58:26
Originally by: Kavin Alavandar Video card overheating? You think this is EVE's fault? lawl
"Overheating" might have been an unfortunate word to use. But it was shorter than saying "experiencing higher temperatures compared to old hangar view" or "additional heat generated compared to before". Then again, it was described in detail the very next post, but I guess that's too much to ask for you to read what you're actually deriding.
And yes, it is "EVE's fault". The old hangar view kept the GPU at around 40% usage. CQ kicks it up to 100%. 40% usage generates less heat and eats less power compared to 100% usage. Q.E.D. _
Make ISK||Build||React||1k papercuts
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Karsa Egivand
Minmatar
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Posted - 2011.06.22 01:58:00 -
[184]
Its fine for me dual-boxing and i dont have a high-end setup. I also could keep multi-tabbed Firefox and Eclipse running in the background. I suspect gfx-RAM is the main-issue, try reducing texture size.
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Onyx Nightshine
Pro Lucror
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Posted - 2011.06.22 01:58:00 -
[185]
* OPTIONAL BUT HIGHLY DESIRABLE - do not delete the current hangar environments AND make them an alternative (default disabled) via the ESC menu
or, pref and
* MANDATORY - separate the CQ from the non-CQ graphics detail settings into two completely separate groups which you can set differently
seconded
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Jerry Pepridge
|
Posted - 2011.06.22 02:00:00 -
[186]
is this the thread that akita keeps linking everywhere? i cbf checking _________________________________________________
Misty McGinnity Doesn't have an iPhone. |
Malice Redeemer
|
Posted - 2011.06.22 02:01:00 -
[187]
* add some even lower graphics detail levels for CQ
* Restore the old hangar environments and make them an alternative (default disabled) via the ESC menu
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Karsa Egivand
Minmatar
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Posted - 2011.06.22 02:03:00 -
[188]
Originally by: Onyx Nightshine
* separate the CQ from the non-CQ graphics detail settings into two completely separate groups which you can set differently
That does make a lot of sense.
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Akita T
Caldari Navy Volunteer Task Force
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Posted - 2011.06.22 02:04:00 -
[189]
Edited by: Akita T on 22/06/2011 02:05:09
Originally by: Karsa Egivand Its fine for me dual-boxing and i dont have a high-end setup. I also could keep multi-tabbed Firefox and Eclipse running in the background. I suspect gfx-RAM is the main-issue, try reducing texture size.
Depends what you mean by "fine".
I'm getting 60-ish FPS with max possible detail in a 1600x1024 window, with 100% GPU usage, at 46C above ambient. But at the same time, in the old hangar view, I used to get either 230 FPS (interval immediate) or a very steady 85 FPS with video card temp at only 30C above ambient and around 40% GPU usage.
I want to be able to maintain the same low GPU usage (and video card teperature, and electric power usage) if I want to by reducing CQ graphics detail while NOT altering "in-space" graphic detail. I would like it even more if CQ as a whole would be optional.
Originally by: Karsa Egivand
Originally by: Onyx Nightshine * separate the CQ from the non-CQ graphics detail settings into two completely separate groups which you can set differently
That does make a lot of sense.
It's kind of in the OP... _
Make ISK||Build||React||1k papercuts
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Brujo Loco
Amarr Brujeria Teologica
|
Posted - 2011.06.22 02:05:00 -
[190]
No really, WHAT THE HELL CCP? Incarna is GOOD (in the future perhaps) but FORCING it upon is just to test the uber crap sluggish environment is AWFUL, also the lack of a proper NON INCARNA environment is just adding insult to injury. I very rarely agree with akita, but he's right, control is awful, the room itself is just an useless timesink (in a game where you have thousands of those already) And forcing everything to be "doable" by WALKING TO a screen to do it , as you jerkily move around in a drugged state is awful.
It's your game blah blah, you want to fleece money from us blah blah, good good, but gives us the choice to not load your Millions of $$$ research and man hour "creation" to simply experience the game as it WAS as you turn the awful Incarna environment into a more streamlined client. I have a pretty decent rig and it's not about gpu lag or lack of memory, game is just sluggish, the environment is for some reason a kind of CRYSIS test module.
FIne tune it, but in the interim please give us back ship spinning for the sake of faster redeployment and more efficient use.
I don't berate INCARNA, I honestly still believe it will bring good things to the game, but not now. Also don't FORCE US to use it. If EVE went F2P I would understand it, but not now.
---Archipelago Theory---
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Soden Rah
Gallente EVE University Ivy League
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Posted - 2011.06.22 02:05:00 -
[191]
Originally by: Karsa Egivand
Originally by: Onyx Nightshine
* separate the CQ from the non-CQ graphics detail settings into two completely separate groups which you can set differently
That does make a lot of sense.
yes, that is why ccp responded to that point like THIS
Originally by: CCP Manifest Can we have separate graphics settings for the two totally different environments CQ/Incarna and Hanger/space? Why would this matter to you? You were prefer higher graphics in station and lower ones outside I am guessing? Not a bad idea, but I don't know what goes into programming that sort of thing.
--------
By Grfmsv÷tn, Eyjafjallaj÷kull, Vatnaj÷kull, and Hekla itself... THIS is my sig.
Support Optional CQ
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Diomedes Calypso
|
Posted - 2011.06.22 02:07:00 -
[192]
once again Akita calls it.
You'd almost think they'd use his comments as a start to an internal vetting process prior to release.
If they can't reach a 90% consensus internally that the issues he raises are insignificant (with people from other development teams doing the vetting..not those that designed the features) they should postone release or adopt something that meets suggestions somewhere in the middle between original intent and his suggestions.
He's not infalliable though..
Akita lost the bet on the mineral price basket before the simialtaneus changes in insurance and mission loot drops . CCP balancing department did manage to pin the drop rates or have sufficient tools in place to make adjustments to make it work. (there were other issues like the rise of mission botting instead of mining botting but still the point is that the doom forcast did not arise.. or perhaps the change encouraged the rat-bot problem?)
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Soden Rah
Gallente EVE University Ivy League
|
Posted - 2011.06.22 02:12:00 -
[193]
Originally by: Diomedes Calypso once again Akita calls it.
You'd almost think they'd use his comments as a start to an internal vetting process prior to release.
If they can't reach a 90% consensus internally that the issues he raises are insignificant (with people from other development teams doing the vetting..not those that designed the features) they should postone release or adopt something that meets suggestions somewhere in the middle between original intent and his suggestions.
He's not infalliable though..
Akita lost the bet on the mineral price basket before the simialtaneus changes in insurance and mission loot drops . CCP balancing department did manage to pin the drop rates or have sufficient tools in place to make adjustments to make it work. (there were other issues like the rise of mission botting instead of mining botting but still the point is that the doom forcast did not arise.. or perhaps the change encouraged the rat-bot problem?)
Well listening and responding to the feedback of the many people who test stuff on SiSi and post in test server feedback would be nice. We may not be as famous as Akita... but we caught a lot of the issues everyone is complaining about up to weeks ago (not had long to actually test on Duality/SiSi.)
--------
By Grfmsv÷tn, Eyjafjallaj÷kull, Vatnaj÷kull, and Hekla itself... THIS is my sig.
Support Optional CQ
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AkJon Ferguson
JC Ferguson and Son Ltd Ferguson Alliance
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Posted - 2011.06.22 02:12:00 -
[194]
CQ was 'kinda cool' for maybe 5 minutes or so. If I never see it again I won't miss it. Is that really what CCP has been spending all of its development resources on instead of making the best (but oh WAY far from perfect) Internet Spaceships game even better (less buggy even?)
Maybe CCP could sell me my old avatar back. I'd pay a few aurum for that.
The only thing that isn't horrible about this expansion is that they haven't seemed to have broken something in the economy to the tune of tens or hundreds of billions of ISK, but if I wait a few hours I'm sure I'll discover that they have.
Recently we had someone dethroned in a contest that they dominated for a while. Yes, I'm talking about Hydra dethroning CCP as the biggest douches in EVE. But CCP has reclaimed the throne, much sooner than anybody anticipated.
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Constantinus Maximus
Paxian Expeditionary Force
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Posted - 2011.06.22 02:12:00 -
[195]
This was so obvious that you'd hope people in CCP said "this is ****ing dumb".
We can hope that it was just the management who are trying so hard to kill this game off.
Either way it's only getting worse.
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Jerry Pepridge
|
Posted - 2011.06.22 02:13:00 -
[196]
Originally by: Diomedes Calypso once again Akita calls it.
You'd almost think they'd use his comments as a start to an internal vetting process prior to release.
If they can't reach a 90% consensus internally that the issues he raises are insignificant (with people from other development teams doing the vetting..not those that designed the features) they should postone release or adopt something that meets suggestions somewhere in the middle between original intent and his suggestions.
He's not infalliable though..
Akita lost the bet on the mineral price basket before the simialtaneus changes in insurance and mission loot drops . CCP balancing department did manage to pin the drop rates or have sufficient tools in place to make adjustments to make it work. (there were other issues like the rise of mission botting instead of mining botting but still the point is that the doom forcast did not arise.. or perhaps the change encouraged the rat-bot problem?)
is akita giving you reach around fanboi? _________________________________________________
Misty McGinnity Doesn't have an iPhone. |
Constantinus Maximus
Paxian Expeditionary Force
|
Posted - 2011.06.22 02:15:00 -
[197]
Originally by: AkJon Ferguson CQ was 'kinda cool' for maybe 5 minutes or so. If I never see it again I won't miss it. Is that really what CCP has been spending all of its development resources on instead of making the best (but oh WAY far from perfect) Internet Spaceships game even better (less buggy even?)
You must remember that Incarna has very little to do with EveOnline.
It's a beta test for World of Darkness so it doesn't really matter if it is a waste of time for Eve.
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Locii
|
Posted - 2011.06.22 02:16:00 -
[198]
ive spent my whole evening telling my corp members how to turn off the station environment.
please leave that option there
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Brujo Loco
Amarr Brujeria Teologica
|
Posted - 2011.06.22 02:17:00 -
[199]
Originally by: Diomedes Calypso once again Akita calls it.
You'd almost think they'd use his comments as a start to an internal vetting process prior to release.
If they can't reach a 90% consensus internally that the issues he raises are insignificant (with people from other development teams doing the vetting..not those that designed the features) they should postone release or adopt something that meets suggestions somewhere in the middle between original intent and his suggestions.
He's not infalliable though..
Akita lost the bet on the mineral price basket before the simialtaneus changes in insurance and mission loot drops . CCP balancing department did manage to pin the drop rates or have sufficient tools in place to make adjustments to make it work. (there were other issues like the rise of mission botting instead of mining botting but still the point is that the doom forcast did not arise.. or perhaps the change encouraged the rat-bot problem?)
Didnt you read the latest CCP analysis? They are as fractured as bone from a clown rodeo driver badly welded again by a poor cellular regeneration process that leaves the bone deformed and makes the appendage useless.
For some reason the HIger ups at CCP think everything is alright, the middle ups each work at cross purposes and the lower strata of corporate slaves just barely do the work to avoid getting whipped.
It's obvious that CCP needs a new reorganization of the Company Duties tree with a new way of communication between departmnents.
They just working on so much stuff at so many levels and all them working without real communication. See the nature of the whines of today to the nature of the whines years ago. It was mostly game mechanics, today is sheer EVERYTHING, from Performance Issues, Crashes, PR Fiascos, Lack of Foresight, lame IP protection schemes, and on an on.
Honestly, High ups in the Company really need to step out of their own orifices and smell the air of reality instead of seeing their wallets money.
/rant off
---Archipelago Theory---
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XIRUSPHERE
Gallente The 8th Order
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Posted - 2011.06.22 02:28:00 -
[200]
You reap what you sow when you employ people like zinfindel.
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Demian Starr
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Posted - 2011.06.22 02:50:00 -
[201]
Originally by: Joan Avon
Originally by: Cailais CQ is the point of sale portal for micro-transactions so I think its very unlikely that CCP will want players to circumvent that marketing tool.
All those screens in CQ are there for a reason - and that reason is to persuade you to get your credit card out. No marketing / sales strategy would want you to miss that vendor space so we can be 99% certain that CQ will be pretty much the only option available.
C.
This. How is the new micro-transaction market supposed to bring in revenue if people have the option to skip the market itself as well as the main showcase for it's products? that would be like renting a slot in a shopping mall, walling up the entrance from the inside of the mall and putting a new one in the back alley behind the mall.
The people that will disable CQ wouldn't buy micro transasction items anyways so what the point forcing it on them.
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Mr Kidd
|
Posted - 2011.06.22 02:52:00 -
[202]
Originally by: Demian Starr
The people that will disable CQ wouldn't buy micro transasction items anyways so what the point forcing it on them.
To get them to buy microtransactions, of course!
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Ping Pong Wong
|
Posted - 2011.06.22 02:52:00 -
[203]
I don't understand why you poor people are whining about this its a great change personally it keeps my room hotter a few degree which I can definitely feel and is something I had not experienced since I had to ditch my athlon xp palomino core 10 years ago. And its so beautiful.
Good videocard I highly recommend it it has a 30$ rebate and for a limited time a FREE copy of photoshop elements which is rad if you want to modify the screenshots you take in CQ's. Takes about 2sec to load with 2 of those SLI'd.
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Zora'e
Nasty Pope Holding Corp Talocan United
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Posted - 2011.06.22 02:55:00 -
[204]
Originally by: Ping Pong Wong I don't understand why you poor people are whining about this its a great change personally it keeps my room hotter a few degree which I can definitely feel and is something I had not experienced since I had to ditch my athlon xp palomino core 10 years ago. And its so beautiful.
Good videocard I highly recommend it it has a 30$ rebate and for a limited time a FREE copy of photoshop elements which is rad if you want to modify the screenshots you take in CQ's. Takes about 2sec to load with 2 of those SLI'd.
I've bought CARS cheaper than that. -
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Ping Pong Wong
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Posted - 2011.06.22 02:57:00 -
[205]
Originally by: Zora'e
Originally by: Ping Pong Wong I don't understand why you poor people are whining about this its a great change personally it keeps my room hotter a few degree which I can definitely feel and is something I had not experienced since I had to ditch my athlon xp palomino core 10 years ago. And its so beautiful.
Good videocard I highly recommend it it has a 30$ rebate and for a limited time a FREE copy of photoshop elements which is rad if you want to modify the screenshots you take in CQ's. Takes about 2sec to load with 2 of those SLI'd.
I've bought CARS cheaper than that.
Was it made of cardboard or the little hot wheels ones?
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Constantinus Maximus
Paxian Expeditionary Force
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Posted - 2011.06.22 02:58:00 -
[206]
Originally by: Demian Starr The people that will disable CQ wouldn't buy micro transasction items anyways so what the point forcing it on them.
That IS the point of forcing (apart from testing World of Darkness).
Idiots who want to play barbie will be laughed at too hard if it's only them who sees their new clothes. Without everyone being forced into this load of crap, it would turn into a massive joke and never go anywhere.
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Portmanteau
CTRL-Q
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Posted - 2011.06.22 03:01:00 -
[207]
Originally by: Hannibal Ord Another point is that for gods sake, ship spinning is as iconic as the Raven hull or Aura saying "Warp drive Active" or something like that. Do we really want it gone? I will miss it.
this...i already hate CQ, do not force it upon CCP pls
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Zora'e
Nasty Pope Holding Corp Talocan United
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Posted - 2011.06.22 03:01:00 -
[208]
Edited by: Zora''e on 22/06/2011 03:02:39
Originally by: Ping Pong Wong
Originally by: Zora'e
Originally by: Ping Pong Wong I don't understand why you poor people are whining about this its a great change personally it keeps my room hotter a few degree which I can definitely feel and is something I had not experienced since I had to ditch my athlon xp palomino core 10 years ago. And its so beautiful.
Good videocard I highly recommend it it has a 30$ rebate and for a limited time a FREE copy of photoshop elements which is rad if you want to modify the screenshots you take in CQ's. Takes about 2sec to load with 2 of those SLI'd.
I've bought CARS cheaper than that.
Was it made of cardboard or the little hot wheels ones?
Naw, 1977 Toyota Cellica and a 1987 Honda Prelude. Both running and would pass emissions. Bodies.. not so great, but no rust. Interiors, not so great but not trashed either. I Wrecked the Cellica in the process of avoiding a multi car pileup (drove it into a concrete retaining wall as my only option to not broadside a car full of kids and tore off the left front wheel assembly), and the Honda got stolen and wrecked by some jacked up dope fiend. -
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Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
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Posted - 2011.06.22 03:03:00 -
[209]
Originally by: Demian Starr
Originally by: Joan Avon This. How is the new micro-transaction market supposed to bring in revenue if people have the option to skip the market itself as well as the main showcase for it's products? that would be like renting a slot in a shopping mall, walling up the entrance from the inside of the mall and putting a new one in the back alley behind the mall.
The people that will disable CQ wouldn't buy micro transasction items anyways so what the point forcing it on them.
And even beyond thatà
How is the MT market supposed to bring in revenue when there is no point in having vanity items that no-one will see and which therefore will fail to feed that vanity? How is it going to create a market when the pricing structure is such that there is exactly zero room for a secondary market because going that route is both more costly and more cumbersome?
Without a secondary market, the velocity of these items will be close to zero, and there will be no need to move them about so none will be destroyed, which only serves to further depress the demand and drastically reduce the need to sink more PLEX into the store.
Everything about this is wrong-headed. ùùù ôIf you're not willing to fight for what you have in ≡v≡à you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.ö ù Karath Piki |
Captain Torgo
The Geedunk Expedition
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Posted - 2011.06.22 03:30:00 -
[210]
Edited by: Captain Torgo on 22/06/2011 03:36:06
Originally by: Tippia
Originally by: Demian Starr
Originally by: Joan Avon This. How is the new micro-transaction market supposed to bring in revenue if people have the option to skip the market itself as well as the main showcase for it's products? that would be like renting a slot in a shopping mall, walling up the entrance from the inside of the mall and putting a new one in the back alley behind the mall.
The people that will disable CQ wouldn't buy micro transasction items anyways so what the point forcing it on them.
And even beyond thatà
How is the MT market supposed to bring in revenue when there is no point in having vanity items that no-one will see and which therefore will fail to feed that vanity? How is it going to create a market when the pricing structure is such that there is exactly zero room for a secondary market because going that route is both more costly and more cumbersome?
Without a secondary market, the velocity of these items will be close to zero, and there will be no need to move them about so none will be destroyed, which only serves to further depress the demand and drastically reduce the need to sink more PLEX into the store.
Everything about this is wrong-headed.
It's all wrong-headed because CQ is unkind to people with mid to lower end PC's (which is a LOT of players). The RL economy is in a slump. Many people are on shoestring budgets. Players cannot go running out purchasing upgrades/new computers every time CCP raises the games PC requirements.
Now CCP wants to create a MT market ingame that solely relies on a new game mechanic that many of the players struggle just to run? Bad bad bad
CCP is in a tough spot now:
-Keep CQ mandatory means many players will have to leave the game. Can't play = no point in subscription. The MT market and the overall game itself suffers from a mass exodus of players.
-Make CQ optional means MT purchases are a waste. Nobody can see their vanity items. What's the point of a vanity item if nobody else can see it?
-A compromise. Dumb down the CQ graphics to the point where all players who currently play EvE (pre CQ EvE) won't need to upgrade or purchase a new PC. As much as it pains me to say it, simple LotRO/WHO/DDO/Game-That-We-Do-Not-Speak-Of graphics would be about right.
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Diomedes Calypso
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Posted - 2011.06.22 04:25:00 -
[211]
Originally by: Soden Rah
Originally by: Diomedes Calypso once again Akita calls it.
You'd almost think they'd use his comments as a start to an internal vetting process prior to release.
If they can't reach a 90% consensus internally that the issues he raises are insignificant (with people from other development teams doing the vetting..not those that designed the features) they should postone release or adopt something that meets suggestions somewhere in the middle between original intent and his suggestions.
He's not infalliable though..
Akita lost the bet on the mineral price basket before the simialtaneus changes in insurance and mission loot drops . CCP balancing department did manage to pin the drop rates or have sufficient tools in place to make adjustments to make it work. (there were other issues like the rise of mission botting instead of mining botting but still the point is that the doom forcast did not arise.. or perhaps the change encouraged the rat-bot problem?)
Well listening and responding to the feedback of the many people who test stuff on SiSi and post in test server feedback would be nice. We may not be as famous as Akita... but we caught a lot of the issues everyone is complaining about up to weeks ago (not had long to actually test on Duality/SiSi.)
Yeah .... sorry about that... there are many other voices of wisdom , many who put things in a more graceful , less extremist way .
I just like to ponder how decisions get made as much as anything and it's sometimes baffling to me . (lets create a very high resolution avatar that moves less smoothly than things gamers have been accustomed to for over 10 years and release it when it can only sit in a locked room ?)
I don't think people really "get" me. MMO's are a fascination of mine, as are lots of other things. ... I sort of like to guess at motives for why people do the things they do, and how social, legal, and organizational structures alter end results like a concrete berm might affect teh flow of a river.
The outcome is only a fraction of my interest, and my comments aren't really gripes but sort of what i'll admit is arm chair quaterbacking (you should hear me watching a football game talkinga about what a coach or quarterback did correctly or what they hypothetically could have done.. or what in hindsight was a mistake, or what they should do in the next drive... thats how I enjoy watching American football.
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Stick Cult
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Posted - 2011.06.22 04:32:00 -
[212]
For serious: bring back the old station environment as an option, CQ is cool and all, but sometimes, especially when dualboxing, I want the old environment.
Originally by: CCP Tuxford my bad. Rest assured I'm being ridiculed by my co-workers.
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Tyana Oro
Akashwani
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Posted - 2011.06.22 05:04:00 -
[213]
Where is the pod goo ?
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bob Regyri
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Posted - 2011.06.22 06:29:00 -
[214]
Support the ability to keep the old environment!
CQ is getting in the way of the pew pew! if eves not about the pew pew then what is it?
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Sathiran Endis
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Posted - 2011.06.22 08:08:00 -
[215]
+1, CQ makes even the most routine and simple task more complicated - more clicks or walking to open a cargo, drone bay, but it's even worse now when the CQ is off, you have to do everything via ships menu. Oh and there's no way to see your active ship other than fitting screen. So when dualboxing, you have to make a lot of guesses to do things that were very simple in the previous versions... Also CCP give us back rotating ships in hangar!
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LordInvisible
Gallente Nova Ardour
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Posted - 2011.06.22 08:21:00 -
[216]
Not only old environment was easier on our PCs, it was also more agile and less hassle to get stuff done.
Where is double click to open ships cargo? Where is drag and drop onto ship? I cannot spin my ship anymore!! -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Quote: "For me EvE wasn't that much fun, many ppl refer to it as a nicely designed database front-end and that |
Tarasina
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Posted - 2011.06.22 08:28:00 -
[217]
Incarna is a totally new game in Eve. You can walk around, you can click graphical windows...best game evah!
/Sarcasm
Ship-spinning was more exciting than Incarna, now that feature is gone. What ever happened to iterating?
Forcing Incarna down our throats? Good luck with that...
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Lost Hamster
Hamster Holding Corp
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Posted - 2011.06.22 08:32:00 -
[218]
In the moment, when CQ will be mandatory, I will cancel both of my account.
Give us back the old hangar! -------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Shields are like pants, they're supposed to come off. Armor is like the condom once its gone ur ****ed |
Constantinus Maximus
Paxian Expeditionary Force
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Posted - 2011.06.22 09:00:00 -
[219]
Originally by: Diomedes Calypso
I just like to ponder how decisions get made as much as anything and it's sometimes baffling to me .
Take into account that DUST was good as finished a long time ago, cost a lot of money, and is on the shelf while they have to go further on the integration at time of launch.
DUST can not be released until they have a functioning Incarna.
Add this pressure buildup to your thinking and it will be less baffling.
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Marcus Vorenius
Caldari Instant Annihilation
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Posted - 2011.06.22 09:43:00 -
[220]
/support
Quote: Hell, ideally entering CQ would be a button in the old hangar !
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ELementX Creator
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Posted - 2011.06.22 10:10:00 -
[221]
Originally by: Sathiran Endis +1, CQ makes even the most routine and simple task more complicated - more clicks or walking to open a cargo, drone bay, but it's even worse now when the CQ is off, you have to do everything via ships menu. Oh and there's no way to see your active ship other than fitting screen. So when dualboxing, you have to make a lot of guesses to do things that were very simple in the previous versions... Also CCP give us back rotating ships in hangar!
+2 i hope they'll read this.
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Alucard Shadows
Mystic Legion Darkmatter Initiative
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Posted - 2011.06.22 10:40:00 -
[222]
If people would have gone round saying oh this new patch is pretty cool, its everything the player has needed I'd be okay with not been able to play. But because there's a allot of people saying wtf is this piece of turd you just dropped on my door step that ****es me off.
Im pretty sure that CCP has lost a fair amount of players who helped this game grow, who probably spend 8 years worth of cash on eve only to be told bye bye, you've done your time here, now go, pretty much after been told I quote from here
Linkage
"Please note that although we are discontinuing support of Shader Model 2 we will not actively block those cards from running the client. It is therefore possible that players with that hardware will be able to run EVE for some time afterward. We do, however, urge them to update their graphics cards as soon as possible."
If this isnt activly blocking then wtf do you call not been able to enter the game CCP?
And for these new players who have only played a few weeks too, I feel sorry for them that went out and bought plexes and GTC, without no warning that SM3 was going to be implemented.
Last time I checked this was a space MMORPG where you go around blowing up stuff, making isk getting bigger ships, corps, etc, not some sims dress up game where people look in the mirror for days deciding which shade of deformed looks best on there face.
You should probably talk to Sony as well about linking up with them to do the sims side of eve too and get back to focusing on what this game is really about
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LiquidatorBrunt
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Posted - 2011.06.22 10:40:00 -
[223]
i would also like to voice my concerns that this is just a gimmick, and I am perfectly happy with it if it is OPTIONAL
it was pretty fun for 5 minutes as I went through my ships but I am bored of it now and it makes my 3 clients run slow :(((
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LiquidatorBrunt
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Posted - 2011.06.22 10:43:00 -
[224]
omg i take that back apparently this ****ing update means I now need shader model 3, well thank you ccp
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Akita T
Caldari Navy Volunteer Task Force
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Posted - 2011.06.22 11:06:00 -
[225]
Originally by: LiquidatorBrunt omg i take that back apparently this ****ing update means I now need shader model 3, well thank you ccp
Well, to be fair, they were considering requiring shader model 3 cards over a year ago, and they delayed it quite a while. You MIGHT be able to run an "emulation" of SM3 via the bit of software called 3D-Analyze though. And for now, as long as they don't remove the "don't load CQ" option YET, it should sort of work halfway decently. _
Make ISK||Build||React||1k papercuts
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Maken Cheese
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Posted - 2011.06.22 11:09:00 -
[226]
Originally by: bob Regyri if eves not about the pew pew then what is it?
Dressing up your dolls. IN SPACE.
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Slatiska Wolfovna
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Posted - 2011.06.22 11:11:00 -
[227]
If only we could dress it up, but at these prices...
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Akita T
Caldari Navy Volunteer Task Force
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Posted - 2011.06.22 11:20:00 -
[228]
Originally by: Maken Cheese
Originally by: bob Regyri if eves not about the pew pew then what is it?
Dressing up your dolls. IN SPACE.
With virtual clothes that cost more than some similar REAL LIFE clothes _
Make ISK||Build||React||1k papercuts
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Valeria Crossroads
Caldari Terra Incognita Intrepid Crossing
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Posted - 2011.06.22 13:04:00 -
[229]
Edited by: Valeria Crossroads on 22/06/2011 13:07:22
If i wanted a doll house i would have played Barbie online. My bpc shop: click here for stock and prices. |
Louis deGuerre
Gallente Malevolence. Imperial 0rder
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Posted - 2011.06.22 13:11:00 -
[230]
I think CQ is cool and a step towards something which can become awesome. Sadly, my hardware is not up to these demands so I turned it off right away, leaving me looking at a bland and boring screen and making me , but at least it is working.
My only concern is that if they make CQ mandatory I will have to upgrade my 2-year-old machine, which was respectable if not state of the art at the time, which I can't afford to do. I don't want to stop playing EVE, but there is a limit to how much RL cash I can afford to spend on this game. I can only imagine what the laptop players are going trough with their generally crappy graphics cards. My sympathies.
So yes, all proposals strongly supported. ----- Malevolence. is recruiting. Dive into the world of 0.0 !
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KilABitcH
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Posted - 2011.06.22 13:17:00 -
[231]
I agree with OP all the way!
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Shikal
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Posted - 2011.06.22 13:22:00 -
[232]
Originally by: Scorpii Orion
Originally by: Akita T botwhine
Just NO!
Kill the BOTS!
Force CQ!
Only botters use crappy PC's and good enough PC costs like 150$ and even in Africa they can afford on that.
So, you live in Africa, like in the slums of Nairobi? And you earn more then US$ 150,00 a week, in Africa? Yuh must be one of dem bwad bways, huh
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Sragir
Kshatriyas
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Posted - 2011.06.22 13:29:00 -
[233]
Originally by: Louis deGuerre I think CQ is cool and a step towards something which can become awesome. Sadly, my hardware is not up to these demands so I turned it off right away, leaving me looking at a bland and boring screen and making me , but at least it is working.
My only concern is that if they make CQ mandatory I will have to upgrade my 2-year-old machine, which was respectable if not state of the art at the time, which I can't afford to do. I don't want to stop playing EVE, but there is a limit to how much RL cash I can afford to spend on this game. I can only imagine what the laptop players are going trough with their generally crappy graphics cards. My sympathies.
So yes, all proposals strongly supported.
Totally agreeing with you. Only I had to abandon EVE on my pc (which I bought nearly 7 years ago,when I started to play EVE) after the Incursion patch.
Since then playing on my laptop , with a crappy graphic chip. Will see for how long.
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Arya Greywolf
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Posted - 2011.06.22 13:48:00 -
[234]
Ready...CCP? I just spent the last week with a group of 10 scientists figuring out a way to make everyone happy, while allowing you to keep your CQ. It took a lot of coffee, hard work, and deep theory.
From what my scientists tell me (forgive me because it's extreme science and involves many complicated equations) apparently you can create a button that lets you load the hanger view TWO different ways.
They claim it is very simple, but I'm not sure if I believe them. Anyway, the scientists - screw it, this is so dumb...
CCP give us the option to enable the OLD HANGER VIEW!
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Ghurthe
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Posted - 2011.06.22 13:50:00 -
[235]
Edited by: Ghurthe on 22/06/2011 13:50:37 Give us the old hangar view, re-enable older video cards to log in.
Or at least stop the game from simply telling us 'No you can't even try to load the game'
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Zief
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Posted - 2011.06.22 13:57:00 -
[236]
Originally by: Xurr I support this thread as well.
If CCP wants to play barbie dolls for plex fine. Leave me out.
Well put sir. Give us a big "leave us out" button on the neocom.
Also support this thread, +1
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Tippia
Sunshine and Lollipops
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Posted - 2011.06.22 13:58:00 -
[237]
àand for the ubiquitous (and inevitable, should they ever answer) counter-argument that they don't want to maintain two different sets of graphical assets, I'd like to see CCP perform and report back on¦ the following experiment:
Create a CQLite view that loads the absolute bare minimum. No actual quarters. No room textures. No screens, no mirror, no fancy lights, no character model, no balconyà nothing except the hangar and the ship and the auxiliary assets to display them. Then check the loading time and memory footprint of that compared to loading the entire CQ.
No need to duplicate anything. Yes, a tiny need to maintain a different content load path (but not a different render path). But the graphics assets will remain the same and any update and to them will automagically propagate to the Lite view.
¦ àand yes, I know. Reporting back is the thing CCP is apparently gengineered not to do, but come on guys ù you can fight the urge! ùùù ôIf you're not willing to fight for what you have in ≡v≡à you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.ö ù Karath Piki |
MaiLina KaTar
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Posted - 2011.06.22 14:06:00 -
[238]
Originally by: Tippia àand for the ubiquitous (and inevitable, should they ever answer) counter-argument that they don't want to maintain two different sets of graphical assets, I'd like to see CCP perform and report back on¦ the following experiment:
Create a CQLite view that loads the absolute bare minimum. No actual quarters. No room textures. No screens, no mirror, no fancy lights, no character model, no balconyà nothing except the hangar and the ship and the auxiliary assets to display them. Then check the loading time and memory footprint of that compared to loading the entire CQ.
No need to duplicate anything. Yes, a tiny need to maintain a different content load path (but not a different render path). But the graphics assets will remain the same and any update and to them will automagically propagate to the Lite view.
¦ àand yes, I know. Reporting back is the thing CCP is apparently gengineered not to do, but come on guys ù you can fight the urge!
F* all that!
What they should've done is actually pimp the hangar view to make it look even better and put in the "enter CQ" button everyone is and has been asking for, right away.
If this is all about "immersion" then they need to put their money where their mouth is, literally.
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Razin
The xDEATHx Squadron Legion of xXDEATHXx
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Posted - 2011.06.22 14:19:00 -
[239]
Originally by: MaiLina KaTar
F* all that!
What they should've done is actually pimp the hangar view to make it look even better and put in the "enter CQ" button everyone is and has been asking for, right away.
If this is all about "immersion" then they need to put their money where their mouth is, literally.
Exactly my sentiment.
There is no excuse for the current implementation except for forcing their overpriced trinkets on a captive customer base. I really expected better from CCP. ... If you like choice please support this topic in the Assembly Hall. Thanks.
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Manc
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Posted - 2011.06.22 14:22:00 -
[240]
This expansion has done more damage to my will to stop playing EVE than any previous act by CCP.
The guns don't even make up for the blunder that is CQ.
Give me my hold hangar back.
Does CCP care? I don't think so, they're gonna get way more income with this from new players and people buying Monocles with Aurum. For every vet they lose, they gain 5+ new players... as long as they make bank, they don't care.
What you need to do is create an environment that gets people to UNDOCK not one that makes them stay docked more often...
+1 for everything in the OPS post.
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Arya Greywolf
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Posted - 2011.06.22 14:25:00 -
[241]
Quote: Hell, ideally entering CQ would be a button in the old hangar!
/Thread.
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Korinne
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Posted - 2011.06.22 14:33:00 -
[242]
Originally by: Xurr I support this thread as well.
If CCP wants to play barbie dolls for plex fine. Leave me out.
^this^
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Joahna Gramer
Gallente Advanced Laser Technologies Confederate Economic Enterprises
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Posted - 2011.06.22 14:36:00 -
[243]
/signed +1 for the thread. Totally needs to be done that way.
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Cipher Jones
Minmatar
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Posted - 2011.06.22 14:40:00 -
[244]
Apologies for not reading all 9 pages but after playing last night i noted the following:
Running one client with CQ was playable, even 24-30 fps in Jita.
Running the client with CQ turned off boosted the performance to higher than before the expansion.
Leaving it as optional so that dual and more clients can be run seems to be the only sane option as it is going to cost CCP a lot of money if we all drop our alts.
Our alts are more than half of their income, so yeah.
dual core AMD 4000, 2 gig ram, 440 card half a gig od ram. . Adapt and overcome or become a monkey on an evolution poster.
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Commissar Kate
Revenent Defence Corperation Ishuk-Raata Enforcement Directive
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Posted - 2011.06.22 14:41:00 -
[245]
Edited by: Commissar Kate on 22/06/2011 14:44:31 I still say a disembark capsule option on the neocom, like in the older incarna videos is still the best option to make the CQ optional and it does not hide it anything the ESC menu.
It should be DOCK > HANGER VIEW > CLICK BUTTON ON NEOCOM (if you so desire to) > Captains Quarters/Incarna
Oh and separate GFX options please.... Post processing kills my video card in the CQ but not in space.
And please optimize your new shiny GFX engine, I got other games that look better and run smoother and use less GPU
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Mart Sturmer
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Posted - 2011.06.22 14:46:00 -
[246]
It sux. I WANT a rollback to the way things were. We're grown men, and we do NOT need a barbie to look at, men like shiny vehicles!! Video card issues, desktop crashes, slow as hell, no ship visible anymore, just CRAP. thx CCP, want to chase us off?
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Butzewutze
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Posted - 2011.06.22 15:32:00 -
[247]
+1
I want my old station view back!
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Zed Jackelope
Original Sin.
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Posted - 2011.06.22 15:33:00 -
[248]
Originally by: Irulan Corinno Edited by: Irulan Corinno on 05/06/2011 18:47:46
Originally by: Akita T * add some even lower graphics detail levels for CQ
New low res CQ:
confirming i actually want this option. I am not one of Awesome Possum's alts |
Skipid
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Posted - 2011.06.22 15:51:00 -
[249]
I want to spin mah ships again : ((((((((
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S'qarpium D'igil
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Posted - 2011.06.22 15:56:00 -
[250]
Put your money where your mouth is:
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Crunchmeister
Gallente Sick Tight BricK sQuAD.
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Posted - 2011.06.22 17:02:00 -
[251]
As I posted in another thread:
I wandered around looking at stuff, trying the different functions, etc. Cool? Yeah. For a bit it is. However, in its current state, the only benefit of the CQ is for CCP to test their character rendering in a live environment. Honestly, I'd rather spin my ship than use this in its current state. I can see this having future potential, but currently, it's pretty useless to the end user.
So yeah, I turned it off too. Once we can actually leave the CQ, I'll re-enable it. For the time being, it's pointless.
As for the 'vanity items', whoever came up with those prices needs to be taken out behind the woodshed and beaten with a flaming 2x4 wrapped in barbed wire. I can buy a shirt, or for the same isk, I can buy 6-7 fully T2 fit battlecruisers to fight with. Seriously, the price scale is ludicrous. I obviously won't be buying a shirt. The clothing in game, when you convert the isk to dollars, costs more than buying a shirt in real life.
I don't know if it's just me, but for a "major expansion", there's absolutely no new content of substance added. It's just a bit of eye candy and some filler material. Some would argue that the CQ is a major addition, but there's not much point to it if you can't do anything with it. It's kind of like being given a brand new Ferarri without an engine.
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Arec Bardwin
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Posted - 2011.06.22 18:38:00 -
[252]
Akita T is always right, so deal with it.
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Charlie Jacobson
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Posted - 2011.06.22 19:26:00 -
[253]
Originally by: Arya Greywolf
Quote: Hell, ideally entering CQ would be a button in the old hangar!
/Thread.
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Akita T
Caldari Navy Volunteer Task Force
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Posted - 2011.06.22 20:02:00 -
[254]
Walking in stations ?
More like WALKING ON COUCHES !!!
Yes, stomp on me, baby, harder, harder !
Damn cheap 90$ couch, that should teach you to mess with me ! _
Make ISK||Build||React||1k papercuts
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S'qarpium D'igil
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Posted - 2011.06.22 20:47:00 -
[255]
I support this movement.
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Oriana Cain
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Posted - 2011.06.22 21:54:00 -
[256]
WTB old station environment (or lack thereof) including all shortcuts it had
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Soden Rah
Gallente EVE University Ivy League
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Posted - 2011.06.22 22:06:00 -
[257]
I'm sorry but I can't help it, I keep doing this... (You tube link)
Why do you ask?
well this post...
relevant bit copied below...
EDIT: oh and I am obliged to say.... Going into Hanger view on docking instead of CQ still not available... When we get to patch day, and you still haven't fixed this, The mac client still doesn't work, and half your customers get borked every time they dock, the forums explode in a flame war, and you have to roll-back before finally installing the option to load CQ...
DON'T say we didn't warn you...
They haven't done a roll-back (yet) but the rest seems pretty prescient...
BTW if CCP is hiring and would like someone to tell them the right way out of this mess... well you can guess the rest...
Pity they don't do more than read the feedback and just carry on anyway. --------
By Grfmsv÷tn, Eyjafjallaj÷kull, Vatnaj÷kull, and Hekla itself... THIS is my sig.
Support Optional CQ
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Ianus
Caldari Geminus Gateway
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Posted - 2011.06.23 00:28:00 -
[258]
I was wondering why my little gtx285 was making so much noise lately... Though the hardware is the least of my concerns, tbh. It just doesn't really make any sense to *always* exit your ship, as the OP as stated.
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Akita T
Caldari Navy Volunteer Task Force
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Posted - 2011.06.23 00:58:00 -
[259]
Originally by: Zindela In a 27C(80.6F) room, my GTX 275 tops out at 77C(170F) , and my i7 920 at 58C (136F). This is in my CQ with ALL settings to High, except medium AA. All on air, in an Antec 900, with the factory standard cooling systems. (no aftermarket processor coolers) I get between 40-60FPS, at 1920x1080, depending on where in my CQ I am. [...] Incarna isn't any harder on my machine than any other modern game. I spent $1200 on it, 2 years ago.
Tests from earlier today on TQ from my machine... 24-26C room (not absolutely sure), interval one selected (85 Hz desktop refresh rate), getting 85 FPS in quite a few places and 42.5 in others, much less places where I get anything in between, resolution only 1600x1024 (not radically lower than yours), selected the exact same graphical settings you said you used, STOCK air cooling on everything... the GTX 460 topped at around 66C when hanging around in a place where the FPS was 42.5 (GPU load 79%-83%) and around 68C elsewhere (GPU load 90%-99%), CPU cores hovering around 56C in places with 42.5 FPS (CPU usage 40%-50%) and around 59C elsewhere (CPU usage 50%-60%).
You know what ? I DON'T LIKE IT. I don't enjoy having my CPU at half power and GPU at near full power CONSTANTLY. Briefly, sure, but not constantly.
Even if temperatures were mostly lower than yours, I am still worried on the long-term effects on both CPU and GPU. I plan to keep using this machine for at least another 2 years, preferably 3, and when I'm done with it, I want the person I give it to to be able to also use it for a couple of years minimum. Maybe you don't appreciate the value of real-life money, but I certainly do.
Or, to use a real-life analogy... just because your car CAN reach speeds of up to 120 mph (190+ kph), and even if you drive on long empty roads, that doesn't mean it's a good idea to keep driving at 110-120 mph for hours on end.
_
Make ISK||Build||React||1k papercuts
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CyberGh0st
Minmatar Blue Republic RvB - BLUE Republic
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Posted - 2011.06.23 01:02:00 -
[260]
Nice OP, I support this. http://www.mmodata.net Favorite MMO's : DAoC Pre-TOA-NF / SWG Pre-CU-NGE / EVE Pre-Incarna |
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Akita T
Caldari Navy Volunteer Task Force
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Posted - 2011.06.23 17:10:00 -
[261]
I wonder... how much would you guys pay for the old hangar view in the NEX ? I'd gladly pay 35k AUR or more if it gets me the old hangar view permanently _
Make ISK||Build||React||1k papercuts
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Angel HUN
Spricer Raiden.
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Posted - 2011.06.23 17:11:00 -
[262]
It should be DOCK > HANGER VIEW > CLICK BUTTON ON NEOCOM (if you so desire to) > Captains Quarters/Incarn
Originally by: CCP Oveur
We. Will. Never. Leave. EVE.
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S'qarpium D'igil
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Posted - 2011.06.23 19:28:00 -
[263]
This is a bump. derp
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Akita T
Caldari Navy Volunteer Task Force
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Posted - 2011.06.24 13:54:00 -
[264]
Hell, I'd pay 70k AUR too _
Make ISK||Build||React||1k papercuts
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Crellion
Parental Control HELL4S
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Posted - 2011.06.24 14:00:00 -
[265]
I suggest we offer to pay all our AUR to buy a rollback to before AUR.
Arguably my opinions represent to an extent the opinions of my alliance and in particular circumstances give rise to a valid "casus belli" claim. |
Yonaquel
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Posted - 2011.06.24 19:51:00 -
[266]
I support this post.
It is reasonable that if EVE was REAL LIFE and we were docking and undocking multiple times an hour; think Mining Ice; Hauling Ore for Corp Mining Ops, Salvaging; picking up purchases, there is no way we would be getting in and out of our pod to just dump ore or pick up cargo.
The code is already all there and essentially "bug" free for the station environment. The code has now been added for CQ's. Could it be as simple as having the menu from which we choose to dock get an option called "Cargo Dock"? Choose this and you go into the old Station Hanger mode vs. your Captain's Quarters.
Or - has someone else has suggested make the default station entry be the old environment with a button or prompt to choose to further go into CQ vs. just docking remaining in ship. I'm pretty certain the "intent" of having Incarna and CQ and "walking around stations" in the future is to continue to push the "immersion" experience. It's cool and fun and I look forward to playing with it to make it 2nd nature which it isn't right now - but it has to be "consistent" with the overall story/background of the game - and in/out/in/out of pod whilst mining certainly isn't realistic.
Finally I want to be another voice of reason re: CCP and their intent. This is an amazing and awsome game and we have several different broad "types" of players. Keeping 350K happy with all things at all times is next to impossible but I think CCP at least tries to do so.
PS - I love to spin too!!! I had no idea it was so prevalent!!!
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Akita T
Caldari Navy Volunteer Task Force
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Posted - 2011.06.26 04:19:00 -
[267]
Edited by: Akita T on 26/06/2011 04:19:52
Ok, now that we're all sore after all the action we had that required proper lubing, and that the MT-related noise has somewhat subsided, can we get back to something that's even remotely within the realm of "this can actually be salvaged", namely, those minor but vital iterations with regards to the CQ environment specifics ?
_
Make ISK||Build||React||1k papercuts
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nota spyalt
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Posted - 2011.06.26 04:21:00 -
[268]
it's mandatory so you have to look at your avatar, when you look at your avatar they hope you think "I want to buy him a new dress" so you spend money in their store, its pretty simple, why else force everyone into it?
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Akita T
Caldari Navy Volunteer Task Force
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Posted - 2011.06.26 04:42:00 -
[269]
Originally by: nota spyalt it's mandatory so you have to look at your avatar, when you look at your avatar they hope you think "I want to buy him a new dress" so you spend money in their store, its pretty simple, why else force everyone into it?
All I see is an unmoving picture of a closed door, how does that make me want to buy a new dress ?
_
Make ISK||Build||React||1k papercuts
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ALLYOURMONEY BELONGTOUS
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Posted - 2011.06.27 06:25:00 -
[270]
Originally by: Korinne
Originally by: Xurr I support this thread as well.
If CCP wants to play barbie dolls for plex fine. Leave me out.
^This^
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Miss Primium
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Posted - 2011.06.27 12:31:00 -
[271]
+1 ( I donÆt like to be forced to use something I canÆt use )
They already forced me to make a face for my MAIN characters, it took me 2 hours to finish then. My Geforce 6200 just canÆt handle it.
===============================================
Yes I want the old hanger back !
I donÆt know why but I like to sit in station and just look at my ship in all its glory. Sometimes I buy new en expensive ships just to look at them, and spin them around. Even fitting them out makes me happy, that way I can check out the guns and stuff.
Why I donÆt like the current inside of the station: 1.My PC cant handle the character creation engine and station environment 2.I donÆt like looking at a rusty wall in the station.
When I am in the station it feels like I am not really in the station. I even feel disconnected from the game and my precious ships.
PS: I play this game on a Geforce 6200, if I would upgrade my PC to run EVE properly, then I would stop playing EVE and go back to RPGÆs and play other DX11 games.
LOL, and NO ONE would get my stuff so donÆt ask for it, I keep it until the game gets a proper hanger, If I even return. |
Miss Rabblt
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Posted - 2011.06.27 12:45:00 -
[272]
Edited by: Miss Rabblt on 27/06/2011 12:47:05 Edited by: Miss Rabblt on 27/06/2011 12:46:35
Originally by: Miss Primium
+1 ( I donÆt like to be forced to use something I canÆt use )
you are not forced yet. Only rumors say you will be forced.
Originally by: Miss Primium They already forced me to make a face for my MAIN characters, it took me 2 hours to finish then. My Geforce 6200 just canÆt handle it.
it took me 5 minutes to load creator, press button "random", proceed to next step and make a photo for avatar.
Originally by: Miss Primium
Yes I want the old hanger back !
i want jump bridges back!
Originally by: Miss Primium
I donÆt know why but I like to sit in station and just look at my ship in all its glory. Sometimes I buy new en expensive ships just to look at them, and spin them around. Even fitting them out makes me happy, that way I can check out the guns and stuff.
try to discover ship info window. You will find (surprise!!!) big icon on the top-left corner. Just press left mouse button on it and you will have ship ready for spinning. The same you can make from fitting window as far as i remember.
Originally by: Miss Primium
Why I donÆt like the current inside of the station: 1.My PC cant handle the character creation engine and station environment
put it off
Originally by: Miss Primium
2.I donÆt like looking at a rusty wall in the station.
open chat window little wider =) usually i have 50+% of Eve window covered by chat windows. Corp, alliance, local, fleet, trade.....
Originally by: Miss Primium
When I am in the station it feels like I am not really in the station. I even feel disconnected from the game and my precious ships.
well. i feel the same here.
Originally by: Miss Primium PS: I play this game on a Geforce 6200, if I would upgrade my PC to run EVE properly, then I would stop playing EVE and go back to RPGÆs and play other DX11 games.
LOL, and NO ONE would get my stuff so donÆt ask for it, I keep it until the game gets a proper hanger, If I even return.
anyway: canihazustuff?
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E man Industries
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Posted - 2011.06.28 15:23:00 -
[273]
I woudl like to say I like CQ.
But i do not need it every time I dock!
I stop buy to recharge shield or grab ammo and boom I'm out of my pod. Why? My alt docks up to drop loot boom CQ...my PC goes into over drive and the fans max out to cope with heat. My main lags out as I rush to undock or turn of CQ(i hate to turn it of..it is nice.)
This is just wrong. My player should only get out of his capsule when I want to! ______ Hello WoW players. Look at your toon, now back to me. Sadly it isn't me, but if it wasn't simplistic pre scripted linear mono dimensional game you could look like me. I'm in a Paladin |
Nude Thought
Minmatar White Nova Industries AAA Citizens
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Posted - 2011.06.29 12:10:00 -
[274]
+1 OP
Originally by: Akita T
Hell, ideally entering CQ would be a button in the old hangar !
I don't need to get out of my capsule and in to my CQ to drop some loot or recharge my shields !
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Akita T
Caldari Navy Volunteer Task Force
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Posted - 2011.07.04 20:05:00 -
[275]
So we're allegedly getting back ship spinning in some form or another some day. Which might be in 1 month, or it might be next year.
MEANWHILE
Can we at least get the separate graphics settings ? _
Make ISK||Build||React||1k papercuts
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Olleybear
Minmatar I R' Carebear
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Posted - 2011.07.04 21:20:00 -
[276]
Originally by: Akita T So we're allegedly getting back ship spinning in some form or another...
Untill performance improves for CQ, I truly hope so. My rig is only 1 year old and the CQ slows down my entire Eve experience. It annoys me enough that I have turned CQ off. Dont get me wrong, it is pretty, but when I can turn my avatar around so I can see from the CQ down the hallway to the ship and notice a drop from 60fps to 30fps, it gets a little silly.
There appears to be some very bad memory leaks with CQ as I notice I go from 2.4gig memory usage to 3.1gig memory usage over time with 2 clients running. After docking and undocking a few times I notice my flying in space fps dropping and the clients getting laggy, which of course doent happen now that I stopped loading the CQ environment.
Heres to hoping the kinks get worked out.
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Sevarus James
Minmatar Meridian Dynamics
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Posted - 2011.07.04 21:29:00 -
[277]
Edited by: Sevarus James on 04/07/2011 21:30:35 I spin around my ship due to cameras orbiting the ship giving me the view as I'm encased in goo.
I dock and now...
I spin around my head as well.
For me this alone = immersion breaker. I'd much rather walk up to a mirror to see "me". Ahh well.
At least via linux, the CQ environment framerate is the same as win7...which surprised me a bit, but its bad either way.
CQ is useless as anything currently except a tech demo or "alpha" test. I turned it off after a quick look about.
At this rate of development, I do believe that George R.R. Martin will have finished 'A Song of Ice and Fire' before we see our first bar scene/strippers/players other than ourselves. ...then....
Updated Arch64 Compiz-Linux Desktop Who is John Galt? |
Mr Epeen
It's All About Me
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Posted - 2011.07.04 23:56:00 -
[278]
I remember the last time there was a graphics up grade (ship models), the forums were full of the same whining. CCP kept both temporarily, iirc, and moved on. Same should be applied to Incarna.
Games are the sole force behind companies like nVidia and ATI being here. The most basic modern card will run this game just fine in space and CQ acceptably. With each client update, they are optimizing the code to make it run even better. I can currently run 3 clients at 1920x1200 with max graphics and four clients if I'm willing to sacrifice some eye candy or frame rate. I expect to be able to run four full out soon enough. The fans in my system are barely ticking over most of the time. Fallout New Vegas stresses my system more than CQ.
So really people buy a better card. Get a can of air and blow out the old one. Don't do nothing and whine.
I'm inclined to see the programers focused, not split up. How in God's name ship spinning went from being an insult to a must have feature is beyond me. And coding what becomes, two games in one is a waste of manpower.
Incarna is here. It's not goning away. I and many others have been waiting three years for it and don't want to see it held up so a couple of whiners with antique systems can play in wire frame mode.
Mr Epeen
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David Fightmaster
Gallente The Black Legionnares Fidelas Constans
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Posted - 2011.07.27 17:14:00 -
[279]
No, Being able to disable the CQ is good enough for me. Only improvement I care to see is maybe have the option when I enter the station to load the cq or not instead of disabling it on my logon page.
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centurion zulu
Phantom Squad Atlas.
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Posted - 2011.07.27 18:13:00 -
[280]
+1
I support all threads that is related to CCP's failure with this release.
Once NVIDA gets there quota of card sales off of this.......perhaps then they will make the change. You all know they are in bed with NVIDA, have been for some time now.
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Meryl SinGarda
Caldari Belligerent Underpayed Tactical Team
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Posted - 2011.07.27 19:35:00 -
[281]
Why do these old topics keep coming back? Find the necromancer and stop him! Fly safe, Die hard |
Daenerys Fire Targaryen
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Posted - 2011.07.27 19:59:00 -
[282]
Love to Akita, well wrote post, i agree 100% and this would be perfect:
Originally by: Akita T Hell, ideally entering CQ would be a button in the old hangar !
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Barbelo Valentinian
Gallente The Scope
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Posted - 2011.07.27 20:12:00 -
[283]
Edited by: Barbelo Valentinian on 27/07/2011 20:12:41
Originally by: Meryl SinGarda Why do these old topics keep coming back? Find the necromancer and stop him!
Perhaps because it's a fairly important topic.
+10 for the OP, and for me it's the lore thing that p***es me off most (more for the fact that CCP seem to take their own lore so lightly in this). My preference would be Hangar by default, and CQ (which I like, or at least like the potential of) as a button beside "undock". For Christmas, I'd also like a little graphic of the pod moving from ship to CQ, preferably slotting into the outside wall so that de-podding can be a private affair indoors like in the earlier videos.
The two sets of settings isn't necessary for me, but I can see it might be important for a fair number of people, so supported too. *****
"To wake up is to wake the world up" - D.E. Harding |
Meryl SinGarda
Caldari Belligerent Underpayed Tactical Team
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Posted - 2011.07.27 20:18:00 -
[284]
Originally by: Barbelo Valentinian Edited by: Barbelo Valentinian on 27/07/2011 20:12:41
Originally by: Meryl SinGarda Why do these old topics keep coming back? Find the necromancer and stop him!
Perhaps because it's a fairly important topic.
+10 for the OP, and for me it's the lore thing that p***es me off most (more for the fact that CCP seem to take their own lore so lightly in this). My preference would be Hangar by default, and CQ (which I like, or at least like the potential of) as a button beside "undock". For Christmas, I'd also like a little graphic of the pod moving from ship to CQ, preferably slotting into the outside wall so that de-podding can be a private affair indoors like in the earlier videos.
The two sets of settings isn't necessary for me, but I can see it might be important for a fair number of people, so supported too.
The issues have been addressed. Whoever brought this back is just attempting to preserve the "instahate"(something a disgruntled wow player would say) that it brought the 1st week of Incarna, when this thread originally appeared. Fly safe, Die hard |
Speaker4 theDead
Caldari
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Posted - 2011.07.27 20:21:00 -
[285]
Originally by: Meryl SinGarda
Originally by: Barbelo Valentinian Edited by: Barbelo Valentinian on 27/07/2011 20:12:41
Originally by: Meryl SinGarda Why do these old topics keep coming back? Find the necromancer and stop him!
Perhaps because it's a fairly important topic.
+10 for the OP, and for me it's the lore thing that p***es me off most (more for the fact that CCP seem to take their own lore so lightly in this). My preference would be Hangar by default, and CQ (which I like, or at least like the potential of) as a button beside "undock". For Christmas, I'd also like a little graphic of the pod moving from ship to CQ, preferably slotting into the outside wall so that de-podding can be a private affair indoors like in the earlier videos.
The two sets of settings isn't necessary for me, but I can see it might be important for a fair number of people, so supported too.
The issues have been addressed. Whoever brought this back is just attempting to preserve the "instahate"(something a disgruntled wow player would say) that it brought the 1st week of Incarna, when this thread originally appeared.
Issues have been addressed? By whom? Logged on this weekend, and it's just as laggy as before.
Current Subscription6 Months- Canceled Account Expires09 August 2011 - 4:04 am (in 14 days) |
Jonas Xiamon
Caldari
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Posted - 2011.07.27 20:33:00 -
[286]
Post this in the Assembly Hall, and you'll have my axe.
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Meryl SinGarda
Caldari Belligerent Underpayed Tactical Team
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Posted - 2011.07.27 20:34:00 -
[287]
Originally by: Speaker4 theDead
Originally by: Meryl SinGarda
Originally by: Barbelo Valentinian Edited by: Barbelo Valentinian on 27/07/2011 20:12:41
Originally by: Meryl SinGarda Why do these old topics keep coming back? Find the necromancer and stop him!
Perhaps because it's a fairly important topic.
+10 for the OP, and for me it's the lore thing that p***es me off most (more for the fact that CCP seem to take their own lore so lightly in this). My preference would be Hangar by default, and CQ (which I like, or at least like the potential of) as a button beside "undock". For Christmas, I'd also like a little graphic of the pod moving from ship to CQ, preferably slotting into the outside wall so that de-podding can be a private affair indoors like in the earlier videos.
The two sets of settings isn't necessary for me, but I can see it might be important for a fair number of people, so supported too.
The issues have been addressed. Whoever brought this back is just attempting to preserve the "instahate"(something a disgruntled wow player would say) that it brought the 1st week of Incarna, when this thread originally appeared.
Issues have been addressed? By whom? Logged on this weekend, and it's just as laggy as before.
You also can't read, apparently. Fly safe, Die hard |
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