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Ruby Khann	Posted - 2011.06.08 14:42:00 - [1] Quote: In a departure from the traditional subscription or one-time purchase model, DUST 514 will be supported by revenues from the in-game sale of virtual goods, allowing players to purchase advanced weaponry, battle gear and vehicles using both earned virtual currency and real money from their PlayStation wallet. "Cosmetic items only" to "advanced weapons for real money" in less than a month. Why should we believe anything CCP publishes when they're so willing to lie?
Jennifer Starling Imperial Navy Forum Patrol	Posted - 2011.06.08 14:43:00 - [2] Originally by: Ruby Khann Quote: In a departure from the traditional subscription or one-time purchase model, DUST 514 will be supported by revenues from the in-game sale of virtual goods, allowing players to purchase advanced weaponry, battle gear and vehicles using both earned virtual currency and real money from their PlayStation wallet. "Cosmetic items only" to "advanced weapons for real money" in less than a month. Why should we believe anything CCP publishes when they're so willing to lie? Ehm .. that's DUST, not EVE, DUST has no subscription fees!
Takseen	Posted - 2011.06.08 14:44:00 - [3] "Cosmetic items only" referred to Eve stuff only, right?
Ruby Khann	Posted - 2011.06.08 14:45:00 - [4] Originally by: Takseen "Cosmetic items only" referred to Eve stuff only, right? You can use those "advanced weapons" to destroy items in EVE.
Tippia Sunshine and Lollipops	Posted - 2011.06.08 14:47:00 - [5] Where's the lie? They've said all along that Dust would be MT-based, and I can recall ever seeing them say anything else. ùùù ôIf you're not willing to fight for what you have in ≡v≡à you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.ö ù Karath Piki
Simetraz	Posted - 2011.06.08 14:48:00 - [6] Originally by: Tippia Where's the lie? They've said all along that Dust would be MT-based, and I can recall ever seeing them say anything else. This
Hori To Masuat'aa Matari	Posted - 2011.06.08 14:48:00 - [7] Originally by: Jennifer Starling Originally by: Ruby Khann Quote: In a departure from the traditional subscription or one-time purchase model, DUST 514 will be supported by revenues from the in-game sale of virtual goods, allowing players to purchase advanced weaponry, battle gear and vehicles using both earned virtual currency and real money from their PlayStation wallet. "Cosmetic items only" to "advanced weapons for real money" in less than a month. Why should we believe anything CCP publishes when they're so willing to lie? Ehm .. that's DUST, not EVE, DUST has no subscription fees! One universe // One war Don't be Zippy.
Grimpak Gallente The Whitehound Corporation Frontline Assembly Point	Posted - 2011.06.08 14:48:00 - [8] Originally by: Ruby Khann Quote: In a departure from the traditional subscription or one-time purchase model, DUST 514 will be supported by revenues from the in-game sale of virtual goods, allowing players to purchase advanced weaponry, battle gear and vehicles using both earned virtual currency and real money from their PlayStation wallet. "Cosmetic items only" to "advanced weapons for real money" in less than a month. Why should we believe anything CCP publishes when they're so willing to lie? A) they said "cosmetic items only" for EVE, not Dust. B) Dust will be following a F2P model where you either buy stuff ingame with the ingame currency (which will you get thru contracts, since you're a merc afterall), or the PSN wallet, so how the heck will they get money to keep the game running? --- Quote: The more I know about humans, the more I love animals. ain't that right.
Kerrisone	Posted - 2011.06.08 14:49:00 - [9] Originally by: Ruby Khann Quote: In a departure from the traditional subscription or one-time purchase model, DUST 514 will be supported by revenues from the in-game sale of virtual goods, allowing players to purchase advanced weaponry, battle gear and vehicles using both earned virtual currency and real money from their PlayStation wallet. "Cosmetic items only" to "advanced weapons for real money" in less than a month. Why should we believe anything CCP publishes when they're so willing to lie? That was part of the appeal/point to a console where they can do whatever they want, ie EVE players aren't directly dealing with it. I'd be more 'concerned' with how their MT/pay to play affects our markets where they might be purchasing things and reselling them for isk as they are supposed to be linked 'one universe'.
Tres Farmer Gallente Federation Intelligence Service	Posted - 2011.06.08 14:49:00 - [10] Originally by: Ruby Khann Originally by: Takseen "Cosmetic items only" referred to Eve stuff only, right? You can use those "advanced weapons" to destroy items in EVE. Indirectly yes afaics.. when you're right, you're right. Get rid of Rooms with Doors - Shortrange Jumpdrives for everybody!
Ruby Khann	Posted - 2011.06.08 14:49:00 - [11] Originally by: Tippia Where's the lie? They've said all along that Dust would be MT-based, and I can recall ever seeing them say anything else. Originally by: CCP So this thing is vanity items only? Yes Paying real money to help destroy other players items is a bit more than vanity.
Lidia Prince Caldari	Posted - 2011.06.08 14:51:00 - [12] Edited by: Lidia Prince on 08/06/2011 14:52:57 Well, it makes sence, since they want to evolve Dust further after release, and that requires money simple retail can't provide. But it also kinda kills the buzz, I don't want another Point Black or World of Tanks... sigh. Hope they won't be THAT advanced. Paid subscription after first 2-3 months please?
Tippia Sunshine and Lollipops	Posted - 2011.06.08 14:53:00 - [13] Originally by: Ruby Khann Originally by: CCP So this thing is vanity items only? Yes Source? And more importantly: context? Quote: Paying real money to help destroy other players items is a bit more than vanity. Doesn't answer the question: we've known since day 1 that Dust would be MT-based, so where's the lie? ùùù ôIf you're not willing to fight for what you have in ≡v≡à you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.ö ù Karath Piki
JC Anderson Caldari Noir. Noir. Mercenary Group	Posted - 2011.06.08 14:55:00 - [14] Edited by: JC Anderson on 08/06/2011 14:56:37 I have a feeling that the only reason AU was introduced was to have a currency that exists both in EVE and DUST. Especially since they've hinted at the fact that EVE players will be the one hiring the DUST ground guys to go on attacks. Originally by: Lidia Prince Edited by: Lidia Prince on 08/06/2011 14:52:57 Well, it makes sence, since they want to evolve Dust further after release, and that requires money simple retail can't provide. But it also kinda kills the buzz, I don't want another Point Black or World of Tanks... sigh. Hope they won't be THAT advanced. Paid subscription after first 2-3 months please? I think the worry some people in the thread are expressing is over the fact that DUST players will in fact be able to attack our PI infrastructure. And that they will be doing so with equipment they purchased via RMT. :/
Ruby Khann	Posted - 2011.06.08 14:56:00 - [15] Originally by: Tippia Originally by: Ruby Khann Originally by: CCP So this thing is vanity items only? Yes Source? And more importantly: context? http://www.eveonline.com/devblog.asp?a=blog&bid=913 Quote: Doesn't answer the question: we've known since day 1 that Dust would be MT-based, so where's the lie? Are you illiterate? It's not about the existence of microtransactions, it's about what those microtransactions buy. They've switched positions because you can use microtransactions to buy in-game advantages in EVE.
Takseen	Posted - 2011.06.08 14:59:00 - [16] So you mean Eve players could buy a PS3, get Dust 514, buy the in-game equipment for real money, and then use it to advance their Eve character or corporation somehow? How is that different from just buying another Eve account and doing the same thing?
Kerrisone	Posted - 2011.06.08 15:04:00 - [17] Originally by: Ruby Khann Originally by: Tippia Originally by: Ruby Khann Originally by: CCP So this thing is vanity items only? Yes Source? And more importantly: context? http://www.eveonline.com/devblog.asp?a=blog&bid=913 Quote: Doesn't answer the question: we've known since day 1 that Dust would be MT-based, so where's the lie? Are you illiterate? It's not about the existence of microtransactions, it's about what those microtransactions buy. They've switched positions because you can use microtransactions to buy in-game advantages in EVE. You should really understand the points you are arguing because you are setting up the opposing POV all too well, unless that was your point in the first place. We can look forward to the same arguments being spouted over again and again based on Dust514 which isn't eve even if it is 'one universe/one war' etc. How does a dust514 person buying a weapon that is comparable to those that could be bought for isk w/o paying extra to get it 'created' for $$ get in game advantages in EVE for EVE players?
Tres Farmer Gallente Federation Intelligence Service	Posted - 2011.06.08 15:04:00 - [18] Edited by: Tres Farmer on 08/06/2011 15:05:30 Originally by: Takseen So you mean Eve players could buy a PS3, get Dust 514, buy the in-game equipment for real money, and then use it to advance their Eve character or corporation somehow? How is that different from just buying another Eve account and doing the same thing? On the battlefield of Dust another Eve Account doesn't matter.. but advanced weaponry (what does this mean?) does, if it's advantageous over the stuff you can get without AUR. The other thread about it highlighted this point and implied that this 'advanced stuff' for AUR would only look different, but wouldn't be advantageous.. Only CCP knows currently. @OP.. where did the quote in the OP come from, please? Get rid of Rooms with Doors - Shortrange Jumpdrives for everybody!
Vandrion Gallente The Collective Against ALL Authorities	Posted - 2011.06.08 15:04:00 - [19] "RPS: So, if IÆm an EVE player, how is my game going to change after DUST is released? Torfi: Well, you have the ability to be more strategic when you are conquering planets and solar systems, in nulsec. Those are the main touchpoints. Highsec carebears need not worry. The same for lowsec. The main touchpoint upon the launch of DUST, will be in nulsec, will be in sovereignty, will be in inflicting damage and destruction and death upon your enemies, destroying their infrastructure and their means to survive, either by means or scorched earth or by stealing their installations on the surfaces of planets. There will be more going on on the surfaces of planets. WeÆve introduced mechanics allowing people to manufacture goods on the planets, but planets will play a more pivotal role in sovereignty mechanics further down the line." Snippet of the RPS interview on Dust 514 So not only will the dust players spend RL cash to buy an advantage in their game, they will be using that RL cash purchase to buy an advantage in OUR sov warfare. This is why a lot of us don't want MT of any form in Eve. Our concerns do not matter as CCP has already planned the future and it is RL cash transactions to buy an advantage........
Remiel x	Posted - 2011.06.08 15:06:00 - [20] Originally by: Tres Farmer Edited by: Tres Farmer on 08/06/2011 15:05:30 Originally by: Takseen So you mean Eve players could buy a PS3, get Dust 514, buy the in-game equipment for real money, and then use it to advance their Eve character or corporation somehow? How is that different from just buying another Eve account and doing the same thing? On the battlefield of Dust another Eve Account doesn't matter.. but advanced weaponry (what does this mean?) does, if it's advantageous over the stuff you can get without AUR. The other thread about it highlighted this point and implied that this 'advanced stuff' for AUR would only look different, but wouldn't be advantageous.. Only CCP knows currently. @OP.. where did the quote in the OP come from, please? Did you miss the part where you can also purchase those in-game items with in-game currency?
Tippia Sunshine and Lollipops	Posted - 2011.06.08 15:11:00 - [21] Originally by: Ruby Khann Originally by: Tippia Source? And more importantly: context? http://www.eveonline.com/devblog.asp?a=blog&bid=913 So in other words, it has nothing to do with Dust. Quote: Are you illiterate? It's not about the existence of microtransactions, it's about what those microtransactions buy. They buy stuff in Dust. This is not news. It is in fact ancient history. Quote: They've switched positions because you can use microtransactions to buy in-game advantages in EVE. No. They've maintained the position that you can use MT to buy vanity stuff in EVE and weapons and stuff in Dust. ùùù ôIf you're not willing to fight for what you have in ≡v≡à you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.ö ù Karath Piki
Tres Farmer Gallente Federation Intelligence Service	Posted - 2011.06.08 15:11:00 - [22] Originally by: Remiel x Originally by: Tres Farmer Originally by: Takseen So you mean Eve players could buy a PS3, get Dust 514, buy the in-game equipment for real money, and then use it to advance their Eve character or corporation somehow? How is that different from just buying another Eve account and doing the same thing? On the battlefield of Dust another Eve Account doesn't matter.. but advanced weaponry (what does this mean?) does, if it's advantageous over the stuff you can get without AUR. The other thread about it highlighted this point and implied that this 'advanced stuff' for AUR would only look different, but wouldn't be advantageous.. Only CCP knows currently. @OP.. where did the quote in the OP come from, please? Did you miss the part where you can also purchase those in-game items with in-game currency? No, I didn't.. What I did read in the interview on RPS was that some items will be available for ISK and some exclusively for AUR. This means, those will spawn in our Eve-World (where Dust is part of) by real money purchase only. It also sounded as those items for AUR wouldn't be advantageous, but the OP does sound different. Get rid of Rooms with Doors - Shortrange Jumpdrives for everybody!
Kerrisone	Posted - 2011.06.08 15:11:00 - [23] Originally by: Tres Farmer Edited by: Tres Farmer on 08/06/2011 15:05:30 Originally by: Takseen So you mean Eve players could buy a PS3, get Dust 514, buy the in-game equipment for real money, and then use it to advance their Eve character or corporation somehow? How is that different from just buying another Eve account and doing the same thing? On the battlefield of Dust another Eve Account doesn't matter.. but advanced weaponry (what does this mean?) does, if it's advantageous over the stuff you can get without AUR. The other thread about it highlighted this point and implied that this 'advanced stuff' for AUR would only look different, but wouldn't be advantageous.. Only CCP knows currently. @OP.. where did the quote in the OP come from, please? http://www.dust514.com/en/news/article/1982/press-release7th paragrapth What is not clear to me is if CCP means that the sale of items for isk is after they are bought for real money as is the case in 'vanity items' in invarna with aurum, the 'paywall' where these things don't exist UNTIL they are paid for with real money.
Grimpak Gallente The Whitehound Corporation Frontline Assembly Point	Posted - 2011.06.08 15:12:00 - [24] Originally by: Tres Farmer Edited by: Tres Farmer on 08/06/2011 15:05:30 Originally by: Takseen So you mean Eve players could buy a PS3, get Dust 514, buy the in-game equipment for real money, and then use it to advance their Eve character or corporation somehow? How is that different from just buying another Eve account and doing the same thing? On the battlefield of Dust another Eve Account doesn't matter.. but advanced weaponry (what does this mean?) does, if it's advantageous over the stuff you can get without AUR. The other thread about it highlighted this point and implied that this 'advanced stuff' for AUR would only look different, but wouldn't be advantageous.. Only CCP knows currently. @OP.. where did the quote in the OP come from, please? afaik, it seems that you can buy said weaponry even without investing a single RL cent. "buying" your way into the game has the only advantage of decreasing time to get it. this probably means they will be using the same method as Global Agenda, which is free to play and everything is available for you to buy with ingame currency, but you can also use RL currency to buy said items, thus needing less time to grind. --- Quote: The more I know about humans, the more I love animals. ain't that right.
Katrina Cortez	Posted - 2011.06.08 15:13:00 - [25] I will never play a game where you have to spend money to win... not that i was going to play dust anyway. I am not an FPSer and I dont have (nor will I buy) a console. There was another game I played that went to that model and I just quit playing it. I think CCP is going to find out that the FPS market is a bit like Jita. :) There are so many FPS games out there and there are some good ones that are completely free...
Scarlet des Loupes Gallente University of Caille	Posted - 2011.06.08 15:13:00 - [26] Ehm .. good troll? ♪ ♫ ♪
Takseen	Posted - 2011.06.08 15:15:00 - [27] PLEX. PLEX!! PLEX!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Sorry, had to get that out of my system. PLEX can be bought for real money. PLEX can be exchanged for ISK. PLEX can be exchanged for AU. Therefore, ISK can be exchanged for AU. I really don't see why everyone is getting excited about being able to turn RL cash into in-game shinies when you've been able to do this for BLOODY YEARS ALREADY.
Florestan Bronstein draketrain Test Alliance Please Ignore	Posted - 2011.06.08 15:17:00 - [28] Edited by: Florestan Bronstein on 08/06/2011 15:17:15 Originally by: Jennifer Starling Originally by: Ruby Khann Quote: In a departure from the traditional subscription or one-time purchase model, DUST 514 will be supported by revenues from the in-game sale of virtual goods, allowing players to purchase advanced weaponry, battle gear and vehicles using both earned virtual currency and real money from their PlayStation wallet. "Cosmetic items only" to "advanced weapons for real money" in less than a month. Why should we believe anything CCP publishes when they're so willing to lie? Ehm .. that's DUST, not EVE, DUST has no subscription fees! Originally by: Thomas Farrer But to say that the two games are linked is a misnomer. TheyÆre one.
Tres Farmer Gallente Federation Intelligence Service	Posted - 2011.06.08 15:17:00 - [29] Originally by: Tippia snip Quote: They've switched positions because you can use microtransactions to buy in-game advantages in EVE. No. They've maintained the position that you can use MT to buy vanity stuff in EVE and weapons and stuff in Dust. Eve > pay cash > PLEX > AUR > transfer to Dust > buy weapons via MT > fight with those weapons in Dust > influence Sov in Eve That is the chain of events the OP does try to draw on the wall. Simplified: Eve > MT > influence Sov Get rid of Rooms with Doors - Shortrange Jumpdrives for everybody!
Patient 2428190 DEGRREE'Fo'FREE Internet Business School	Posted - 2011.06.08 15:17:00 - [30] Dust 514 was stated from nearly the beginning that it would be MT fueled, F2P. Before any of the MT nonsense descended onto to EVE. If I remember correctly, ISK could flow from EVE to Dust, so you could use fake internet spaceship money to fund your mercs rather than buying them. Yes, non-vanity items will come to the MT store for EVE at some point. Just brace yourself. ...Then when you stopped to think about it. All you really said was Lalala.
REiiGN15 Caldari	Posted - 2011.06.08 15:17:00 - [31] What has me irked is how much you guys care at all for Dust. Many of you have called it DOA, so why do you even talk about it? MT are here, in about a thousand games in many genres, across all platforms. I bet they won't even charge a whole lot. Anything has to be cheaper than what Facebook games or Activision makes you shell out for extra stuff in their games. Don't even sweat this DUST stuff now anyways. Got almost a whole year for it to come out. Just let CCP tell us when they want to. They already said more info is coming. ================================================= What is right is not always popular, and what is popular is not always right.
Vandrion Gallente The Collective Against ALL Authorities	Posted - 2011.06.08 15:18:00 - [32] Originally by: Remiel x Originally by: Tres Farmer Edited by: Tres Farmer on 08/06/2011 15:05:30 Originally by: Takseen So you mean Eve players could buy a PS3, get Dust 514, buy the in-game equipment for real money, and then use it to advance their Eve character or corporation somehow? How is that different from just buying another Eve account and doing the same thing? On the battlefield of Dust another Eve Account doesn't matter.. but advanced weaponry (what does this mean?) does, if it's advantageous over the stuff you can get without AUR. The other thread about it highlighted this point and implied that this 'advanced stuff' for AUR would only look different, but wouldn't be advantageous.. Only CCP knows currently. @OP.. where did the quote in the OP come from, please? Did you miss the part where you can also purchase those in-game items with in-game currency? Only if the person who spent RL money to get the advantage sells it for isk........... The problem is that the only way to get these items is to purchase them initially with RL money. You won't be able to grind them up. You can't earn the items in game. You have to open your wallet to get them. If CCP wants to do this with Dust I say great! DON'T LET IT IMPACT OUR GAMEPLAY THOUGH! CCP- You committed to not altering our game play with RL money MT. Live up to your commitment.....
Tres Farmer Gallente Federation Intelligence Service	Posted - 2011.06.08 15:20:00 - [33] Originally by: Grimpak Originally by: Tres Farmer Originally by: Takseen So you mean Eve players could buy a PS3, get Dust 514, buy the in-game equipment for real money, and then use it to advance their Eve character or corporation somehow? How is that different from just buying another Eve account and doing the same thing? On the battlefield of Dust another Eve Account doesn't matter.. but advanced weaponry (what does this mean?) does, if it's advantageous over the stuff you can get without AUR. The other thread about it highlighted this point and implied that this 'advanced stuff' for AUR would only look different, but wouldn't be advantageous.. Only CCP knows currently. @OP.. where did the quote in the OP come from, please? afaik, it seems that you can buy said weaponry even without investing a single RL cent. "buying" your way into the game has the only advantage of decreasing time to get it. this probably means they will be using the same method as Global Agenda, which is free to play and everything is available for you to buy with ingame currency, but you can also use RL currency to buy said items, thus needing less time to grind. Quote/Link please to support those claims? Get rid of Rooms with Doors - Shortrange Jumpdrives for everybody!
Doc Fury Caldari	Posted - 2011.06.08 15:23:00 - [34] Dee slope, she is a slippery one... It will be interesting to see how this all pans-out next year when any of this DUST stuff actually means anything. A lot can happen in a year, Sony could be pushed or shamed out of the console biz, or someone could buy-out CCP in the meantime. Also, the RaptureÖ was rescheduled for Oct 21, so we have to get past that too, but I don't think CCP will become too short-handed if it does go down. The accumulated filth of all their sex and murder will foam up about their waists and all the ho's and politicians will look up and shout 'Save us!' and I'll look down, and whisper 'no.'
Vandrion Gallente The Collective Against ALL Authorities	Posted - 2011.06.08 15:25:00 - [35] Originally by: Tres Farmer Originally by: Grimpak Originally by: Tres Farmer Originally by: Takseen So you mean Eve players could buy a PS3, get Dust 514, buy the in-game equipment for real money, and then use it to advance their Eve character or corporation somehow? How is that different from just buying another Eve account and doing the same thing? On the battlefield of Dust another Eve Account doesn't matter.. but advanced weaponry (what does this mean?) does, if it's advantageous over the stuff you can get without AUR. The other thread about it highlighted this point and implied that this 'advanced stuff' for AUR would only look different, but wouldn't be advantageous.. Only CCP knows currently. @OP.. where did the quote in the OP come from, please? afaik, it seems that you can buy said weaponry even without investing a single RL cent. "buying" your way into the game has the only advantage of decreasing time to get it. this probably means they will be using the same method as Global Agenda, which is free to play and everything is available for you to buy with ingame currency, but you can also use RL currency to buy said items, thus needing less time to grind. Quote/Link please to support those claims? I qoute CCP Shadow from the PS3 blog on Dust514: "Hi Vorlord. DUST 514 wonÆt have a monthly subscription like a number of MMOs. DUST 514 will have virtual goods sales though, that allow you to buy various types of gear used in combat." "Hey Shoryukenll, YouÆve asked a few things I canÆt delve too deeply into, but what I can comment on is what you said about virtual items and real money. DUST 514 will support purchases made through both in-game earned currency and real money currency." http://blog.us.playstation.com/2011/06/06/introducing-dust-514-a-persistent-shooter-from-ccp/ Qouted from the Beginnings Blog on the Dust514 site: "DUST 514 will, as EVE Online does, have a dynamic virtual economy and market that offers the tools that will give you a competitive edge, when used skillfully. Players are able to purchase different gear to equip before deploying into battle, using InterStellar Kredits (ISK), the in-game earned currency of the EVE universe, or through real money currency, called Aurum (AUR). This provides players with flexibility and adaptability in how they approach a combat scenario. Certain items are only available through ISK transactions, while others are only available through AUR. These are then traded freely on a player-driven secondary marketplace." So... CCP is including AUR in DUST which further ties it into Eve and explains why CCP isn't listening to the feedback from the players. CCP also clearly states that AUR is purchased with RL money........ There should be absolutely ZERO arguments that AUR comes from anything other then RL cash money...... http://www.dust514.com/en/news/?article=1980 For those that want to bring up that PLEX is the same thing, I for one would happy to have it eliminated from the game.
Zondrail Formic Hive	Posted - 2011.06.08 15:27:00 - [36] I don't understand why people are freaking out about something that's been possible for a long time. So the weapons are introduced as for sale using ISK instead of Aurum. A player can just as easily use RLM to buy a Plex and sell it to get the ISK to buy the gun. The only thing this scenario does for CCP is create an immediate pressure on the PLEX market (good for their business) and prevent the huge ISK pool that exists in EVE from funding the newly created DUST ISK demand, which would inevitably also add to Plex purchases and demand, but much slower and with a huge ISK buffer. A player who doesn't want to RMT can still use ISK that they earned to buy the Aurum needed to buy the items. This just means the demand for Plex/Aurum will be more immediate and constant for CCP (rather than all ISK transactions that demand more ISK, but could technically have demands met with already existing ISK). MY big complaint is that these items being on the Aurum market makes them a seeded item. Which is something CCP has been working pretty hard at getting rid of in the game. No one in EVE will be manufacturing these items, prices won't change with demand (the re-seeded ones will, but not the Aurum prices). That's a pretty big beef with me. I understand making everything cost ISK would not drive the PLEX/Aurum market like they wanted right away, but in the long-run it would have I think (if they managed the sinks and faucets well).
Katrina Cortez	Posted - 2011.06.08 15:27:00 - [37] Its going to be funny... sov wars are going to revolve around console FPS releases. "Well cant take sov cause Gears of War 15 just came out..."
Tippia Sunshine and Lollipops	Posted - 2011.06.08 15:28:00 - [38] Originally by: Tres Farmer Eve > pay cash > PLEX > AUR > transfer to Dust > buy weapons via MT > fight with those weapons in Dust > influence Sov in Eve That is the chain of events the OP does try to draw on the wall. Simplified: Eve > MT > influence Sov àwhich is not news since we've known about that since day one, nor is it nearly as direct a chain as that. By that logic, we already have MT for sov in EVE: buy PLEX, exchange for ships, win sov. So, again, where is the lie? ùùù ôIf you're not willing to fight for what you have in ≡v≡à you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.ö ù Karath Piki
Takseen	Posted - 2011.06.08 15:32:00 - [39] Originally by: Katrina Cortez Its going to be funny... sov wars are going to revolve around console FPS releases. "Well cant take sov cause Gears of War 15 just came out..." They've said that they wanted each system to be able to function independently of each other in case of stuff like that. Its been confirmed that Dusters can still get contracts from NPCs if they can't find an Eve corp to hire them. Presumably Eve corps will also be able to hire NPC dusters if there's not enough real people playing the FPS>
Vandrion Gallente The Collective Against ALL Authorities	Posted - 2011.06.08 15:33:00 - [40] Edited by: Vandrion on 08/06/2011 15:33:44 Originally by: Tippia Originally by: Tres Farmer Eve > pay cash > PLEX > AUR > transfer to Dust > buy weapons via MT > fight with those weapons in Dust > influence Sov in Eve That is the chain of events the OP does try to draw on the wall. Simplified: Eve > MT > influence Sov àwhich is not news since we've known about that since day one, nor is it nearly as direct a chain as that. By that logic, we already have MT for sov in EVE: buy PLEX, exchange for ships, win sov. So, again, where is the lie? Gotta have the skills to fly the ship! Plex has been an issue since the day it came out... Make it go away.
Narisa Bithon Caldari The Motley Crew Reborn	Posted - 2011.06.08 15:35:00 - [41] Edited by: Narisa Bithon on 08/06/2011 15:35:55 so can dust player's buy planet based doomsdays? that hardly seems fair if they can nuke an eve online player's moros by paying real money for a planet doomsday installation
Mister Rocknrolla	Posted - 2011.06.08 15:50:00 - [42] Originally by: Vandrion Edited by: Vandrion on 08/06/2011 15:33:44 Originally by: Tippia Originally by: Tres Farmer Eve > pay cash > PLEX > AUR > transfer to Dust > buy weapons via MT > fight with those weapons in Dust > influence Sov in Eve That is the chain of events the OP does try to draw on the wall. Simplified: Eve > MT > influence Sov àwhich is not news since we've known about that since day one, nor is it nearly as direct a chain as that. By that logic, we already have MT for sov in EVE: buy PLEX, exchange for ships, win sov. So, again, where is the lie? Gotta have the skills to fly the ship! Oh...there's a forum for that already, too. You can purchase pilots the same way. Originally by: Vandrion Plex has been an issue since the day it came out... Make it go away. This will never, ever happen. If this is the true point of your rant, you will never win.
Adunh Slavy	Posted - 2011.06.08 16:00:00 - [43] Here's my guess what the quote from the OP means, along with the scenario laid out on the Dust site blog - DustBunnies buy an "advanced weapon/thing BPO" from the cash shop with Aurum. They can then make in-game items from the BPO and sell them on the market for ISK. Eve players will finance their DustBunny friends via Merc Contracts or direct transfers of ISK. Those DustBunnies may then purchase those Dust created items with ISK if they have not them selves purchased the BPO. What the blog and quote do not go into is the materials needed to create these items. If one reads through the comment thread of the recent Dust announcement blog, there appear to be contradictory statements, although I suspect they are not, so much as reveal the nature of the relationship between Dust and Eve. ref, posts 65 and 130. If the two games can stand alone, then each apparently would need its own resource and production tree/chain, not to mention logistics. Dustbunnies can magically clone jump all over the place I suspect, what about their materials, inventories, blueprints? If the games can stand alone, DustBunnies sure don't need JoeShmo and his Badger II. Also there seems problem, or perhaps a lack of good information with regards to the cycle of ISK across the two platforms. Unless DustBunnies can generate ISK them selves, via an ISK faucet, then their only source of ISK is Eve players. Do Dustbunnies have an ISK source other than Eve players? If they do not, then how does the ISK sent to Dust, by Eve players, get sent back to Eve by Dust players? What incentive would DustBunnies have to send ISK back 'upstairs'? Since, since both games can stand alone, there can not be too much of a dependency on Eve generated resources, and like wise not too much of a dependency in Eve on Dust generated resources. What is the 'cross-platform' life cycle of ISK? Will Dust become a huge ISK sink that eats ISK from the Eve economy? The implications of that are troubling. The Real Space Initiative - V7
Vandrion Gallente The Collective Against ALL Authorities	Posted - 2011.06.08 16:05:00 - [44] Originally by: Mister Rocknrolla Originally by: Vandrion Edited by: Vandrion on 08/06/2011 15:33:44 Originally by: Tippia Originally by: Tres Farmer Eve > pay cash > PLEX > AUR > transfer to Dust > buy weapons via MT > fight with those weapons in Dust > influence Sov in Eve That is the chain of events the OP does try to draw on the wall. Simplified: Eve > MT > influence Sov àwhich is not news since we've known about that since day one, nor is it nearly as direct a chain as that. By that logic, we already have MT for sov in EVE: buy PLEX, exchange for ships, win sov. So, again, where is the lie? Gotta have the skills to fly the ship! Oh...there's a forum for that already, too. You can purchase pilots the same way. Originally by: Vandrion Plex has been an issue since the day it came out... Make it go away. This will never, ever happen. If this is the true point of your rant, you will never win. Plex isn't the point. Just an answer to the question. The real Rant comes into play when you realize that CCP is taking Eve down a road that many in the community feel will ruin what the game was/is/could be. The MT issue is a major step in that direction. Many have voiced their opinions ,like I have, only to be ignored (0 responses to many legitimate concerns posted in the feedback threads by many Eve players). The frustration of watching something you have invested years into is beginning to show throughout these forums. The community is vocalizing their concerns the best way we can-- The forums. Unfortunantly it appears our concerns are falling on deaf ears.........
Grimpak Gallente The Whitehound Corporation Frontline Assembly Point	Posted - 2011.06.08 16:06:00 - [45] Originally by: Adunh Slavy Here's my guess what the quote from the OP means, along with the scenario laid out on the Dust site blog - DustBunnies buy an "advanced weapon/thing BPO" from the cash shop with Aurum. They can then make in-game items from the BPO and sell them on the market for ISK. Eve players will finance their DustBunny friends via Merc Contracts or direct transfers of ISK. Those DustBunnies may then purchase those Dust created items with ISK if they have not them selves purchased the BPO. What the blog and quote do not go into is the materials needed to create these items. If one reads through the comment thread of the recent Dust announcement blog, there appear to be contradictory statements, although I suspect they are not, so much as reveal the nature of the relationship between Dust and Eve. ref, posts 65 and 130. If the two games can stand alone, then each apparently would need its own resource and production tree/chain, not to mention logistics. Dustbunnies can magically clone jump all over the place I suspect, what about their materials, inventories, blueprints? If the games can stand alone, DustBunnies sure don't need JoeShmo and his Badger II. Also there seems problem, or perhaps a lack of good information with regards to the cycle of ISK across the two platforms. Unless DustBunnies can generate ISK them selves, via an ISK faucet, then their only source of ISK is Eve players. Do Dustbunnies have an ISK source other than Eve players? If they do not, then how does the ISK sent to Dust, by Eve players, get sent back to Eve by Dust players? What incentive would DustBunnies have to send ISK back 'upstairs'? Since, since both games can stand alone, there can not be too much of a dependency on Eve generated resources, and like wise not too much of a dependency in Eve on Dust generated resources. What is the 'cross-platform' life cycle of ISK? Will Dust become a huge ISK sink that eats ISK from the Eve economy? The implications of that are troubling. now this is a better post to understand the issue better. in all honesty, anything we say atm is no more than pure conjecture, since we don't know nothing yet, besides what you said and the stuff said in the interviews and blogs. --- Quote: The more I know about humans, the more I love animals. ain't that right.
Ranger 1 Amarr Paragon Fury Cascade Imminent	Posted - 2011.06.08 16:07:00 - [46] There has been no lie. The only thing that changed was that people are finally thinking through the ramifications of the connection between the new games. I think it is worth mentioning that DUST activities planetside is only one way that SOV can be influenced. If you can't/choose not too/or suck at using DUST bunnies to influence SOV, you will have traditional EVE based means at your disposal as always. How that balances out should be interesting. The quote above did spell out the telling point in this argument. Some (probably non-vanity) items will be available for original purchase only with RL money in DUST (not EVE). However, all of those items can then be traded on the open market for in game currency. So you, the person with more money than skill, has to decide if you want to use those items yourself (to further your ambitions) or sell them to others for in game currency (to further your ambitions). I'm not seeing much of a problem, or much difference from EVE as we know it now. ===== The world will not end in 2012, however there will be a serious nerf to Planetary Interaction.
Tres Farmer Gallente Federation Intelligence Service	Posted - 2011.06.08 17:17:00 - [47] Edited by: Tres Farmer on 08/06/2011 17:25:25 Originally by: Tippia Originally by: Tres Farmer Eve > pay cash > PLEX > AUR > transfer to Dust > buy weapons via MT > fight with those weapons in Dust > influence Sov in Eve That is the chain of events the OP does try to draw on the wall. Simplified: Eve > MT > influence Sov àwhich is not news since we've known about that since day one, nor is it nearly as direct a chain as that. By that logic, we already have MT for sov in EVE: buy PLEX, exchange for ships, win sov. So, again, where is the lie? I'm not talking about a lie here.. I'm just pointing out the not so obvious: Your example for Today's possibilities to buy ships from other players for PLEX has a finite source - ships created by players. Or the ore they are made out of has had to be harvested by players (or their macros). Show me where you can buy unlimited ships or minerals from CCP for real world money and I'll follow your argumentation. Yes, I'm discussing about the principle and the bigger theoretical picture here. I have no clue how the real numbers look like nor what kind of ramifications there really are (stockpiles, thousands of miners, etc pp). This is theoretical. Get rid of Rooms with Doors - Shortrange Jumpdrives for everybody!
Tres Farmer Gallente Federation Intelligence Service	Posted - 2011.06.08 17:29:00 - [48] Originally by: Ranger 1 snip The quote above did spell out the telling point in this argument. Some (probably non-vanity) items will be available for original purchase only with RL money in DUST (not EVE). However, all of those items can then be traded on the open market for in game currency. So you, the person with more money than skill, has to decide if you want to use those items yourself (to further your ambitions) or sell them to others for in game currency (to further your ambitions). I'm not seeing much of a problem, or much difference from EVE as we know it now. The OP stated that those items you can only buy for AUR are 'advanced'. I wonder what would happen if you could buy a T2 Nyx for AUR? Or a T2 Control Tower BPC for AUR? Get rid of Rooms with Doors - Shortrange Jumpdrives for everybody!
Herping yourDerp	Posted - 2011.06.08 17:32:00 - [49] excuse me as a DD the titan in orbit with a $2 microctransaction
Asuka Smith Gallente The 8th Order	Posted - 2011.06.08 17:36:00 - [50] ITT a lot of people are hoping that if they say it hard enough it must be true.

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