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Rainbow Room The 404 3	Posted - 2012.09.12 14:31:00 - [1] - Quote Hey, I've been toying with flying a Tengu for level 4 missions. I'm currently sat in a Navy Raven but figured I'd quite like a change. I've never flown a Tengu but I'm at the stage where all the subsystems are at level 4 and understand the concept that speed and movement is key for this ship. Are lvl 4 subsystem skills good enough for the to do lvl 4 missions or should I train them all to level 5? Thoughts? My initial fit would be running with T2 everything (so t2 mid slots, t2 Heavy Assaults or t2 heavy missile and t2 low slots). Something like: 5 x Heavy Assault Missile Launcher II Target Painter II Shield Boost Amplifier II 2 x T2 hardeners (npc specific) 10MN Afterburner 3 x Ballistic Control System II
Lucas41 Matrix Technologies Omega Vector 10	Posted - 2012.09.12 14:38:00 - [2] - Quote You are going to want to change your subs around to allow for 6 HML in the high slots. You can run lvl 4's in a tengu with all subs trained to 4. However, my personal preference is having them all to 5 as the ship really shines when the subs are maxed out.
Rainbow Room The 404 3	Posted - 2012.09.12 14:54:00 - [3] - Quote Thanks for the reply. Cool. I'll start puttng a ship together tonight then. I figured I'd train all to level 5 at some stage, probably now as in reality the train time isn't horrific. I think I worked out going from lvl 4 to 5 across all subsystem is about 20 days or slightly under.
BearJews Secure Arms Trade Coalition Secure Arms Trade Coalitions 54	Posted - 2012.09.12 14:54:00 - [4] - Quote If you don't want to train all your skills to lvl5, the missions are doable but I highly recommend you at least train the defense and offense to 5 for obvious reasons. And it doesn't take long at all. This is my personal fit, it's expensive but it works. Below is fitted for Guristas since the tengu Really shines when it comes to applying and defending against kinetic. [Tengu, Pve Lvl 4] Caldari Navy Ballistic Control System Caldari Navy Ballistic Control System Caldari Navy Ballistic Control System Caldari Navy Ballistic Control System Republic Fleet 10MN Afterburner Pithi A-Type Small Shield Booster Shield Boost Amplifier II Thermic Dissipation Field II Kinetic Deflection Field II Federation Navy Stasis Webifier Heavy Missile Launcher II, Scourge Fury Heavy Missile Heavy Missile Launcher II, Scourge Fury Heavy Missile Heavy Missile Launcher II, Scourge Fury Heavy Missile Heavy Missile Launcher II, Scourge Fury Heavy Missile Heavy Missile Launcher II, Scourge Fury Heavy Missile Heavy Missile Launcher II, Scourge Fury Heavy Missile Medium Warhead Rigor Catalyst II Medium Warhead Rigor Catalyst II Medium Warhead Flare Catalyst II Tengu Defensive - Amplification Node Tengu Electronics - Dissolution Sequencer Tengu Engineering - Augmented Capacitor Reservoir Tengu Offensive - Accelerated Ejection Bay Tengu Propulsion - Fuel Catalyst
Soundwave Plays Diablo Royal Amarr Institute Amarr Empire 123	Posted - 2012.09.12 17:15:00 - [5] - Quote Offense has to be at 5 or its not worth it IMHO. Defense is ok at 4 but I always used a deadspace SB. All 5's is clearly the end goal however.
Jack Traynor 1121 Holdings 1121 Ventures 53	Posted - 2012.09.12 19:26:00 - [6] - Quote Rainbow Room wrote: Hey, I've been toying with flying a Tengu for level 4 missions. I'm currently sat in a Navy Raven but figured I'd quite like a change. I've never flown a Tengu but I'm at the stage where all the subsystems are at level 4 and understand the concept that speed and movement is key for this ship. Are lvl 4 subsystem skills good enough for the to do lvl 4 missions or should I train them all to level 5? Thoughts? My initial fit would be running with T2 everything (so t2 mid slots, t2 Heavy Assaults or t2 heavy missile and t2 low slots). Something like: 5 x Heavy Assault Missile Launcher II Target Painter II Shield Boost Amplifier II 2 x T2 hardeners (npc specific) 10MN Afterburner 3 x Ballistic Control System II L4 is good enough, but you will actually see a difference in your performance with all L5 on the subsystems. I didn't think it would make a difference going to five, but it really is. Can't say this for other ships, personally.
Lucas41 Matrix Technologies Omega Vector 10	Posted - 2012.09.12 20:22:00 - [7] - Quote Cool deal, glad we could be of assistance.
Anvil44 Independent Traders and Builders MPA 114	Posted - 2012.09.12 20:57:00 - [8] - Quote Also a shield Boost Amplifier without the shield booster is like carrying missles without a missle launcher. I run with Heavy Missle Launcher myself. I can hit out to about 115km or so and still put out over 500dps kinetic damage. I may not like you or your point of view but you have a right to voice it.
Zhilia Mann Tide Way Out Productions 653	Posted - 2012.09.12 21:20:00 - [9] - Quote Anvil44 wrote: I run with Heavy Missle Launcher myself. I can hit out to about 115km or so and still put out over 500dps kinetic damage. Honestly, you should be able to get 500 non-kinetic DPS out of any mission Tengu, especially any high sec build. Hell, I get 500 non-kinetic on a low sec exploration build. A brief look says that 724 is a pretty good baseline for a well-skilled mission Tengu provided you're running in high sec.
Belthazor4011 Battle BV I Know Right 51	Posted - 2012.09.13 01:12:00 - [10] - Quote Agreed 700 DPS should be doable, but its still crap compared to other solutions including the CNR you're currently in which can do equal and/or better DPS with a Cruise fit. Why people love the Tengu is beyond me. A tank that can handle level 4s is no big deal and can be done a lot cheaper then most Tengu's, add that to the relatively crap DPS and I dont get why anyone flies the damn thing for level 4s. The only thing might be the speed and agility of a cruiser hull, but there are not that many missions where that actually makes a difference. I do understand and respect the Tengu for other purposes btw, its not a totally useless ship...
Doddy Excidium. Executive Outcomes 146	Posted - 2012.09.13 11:15:00 - [11] - Quote He doesn't have a booster .......
Hazen Koraka HK Enterprises 40	Posted - 2012.09.13 12:16:00 - [12] - Quote BearJews wrote: If you don't want to train all your skills to lvl5, the missions are doable but I highly recommend you at least train the defense and offense to 5 for obvious reasons. And it doesn't take long at all. This is my personal fit, it's expensive but it works. Below is fitted for Guristas since the tengu Really shines when it comes to applying and defending against kinetic. [Tengu, Pve Lvl 4] Caldari Navy Ballistic Control System Caldari Navy Ballistic Control System Caldari Navy Ballistic Control System Caldari Navy Ballistic Control System Republic Fleet 10MN Afterburner Pithi A-Type Small Shield Booster Shield Boost Amplifier II Thermic Dissipation Field II Kinetic Deflection Field II Federation Navy Stasis Webifier Heavy Missile Launcher II, Scourge Fury Heavy Missile Heavy Missile Launcher II, Scourge Fury Heavy Missile Heavy Missile Launcher II, Scourge Fury Heavy Missile Heavy Missile Launcher II, Scourge Fury Heavy Missile Heavy Missile Launcher II, Scourge Fury Heavy Missile Heavy Missile Launcher II, Scourge Fury Heavy Missile Medium Warhead Rigor Catalyst II Medium Warhead Rigor Catalyst II Medium Warhead Flare Catalyst II Tengu Defensive - Amplification Node Tengu Electronics - Dissolution Sequencer Tengu Engineering - Augmented Capacitor Reservoir Tengu Offensive - Accelerated Ejection Bay Tengu Propulsion - Fuel Catalyst Isn't the 4th BCU kinda pointless? You get what, about an extra 1% out of the 4th after stacking penalities? Add something else, maybe even a DCU?
Zanarkand Enterprise Estonia Northern Coalition. 12	Posted - 2012.09.13 12:41:00 - [13] - Quote Hazen Koraka wrote: ... 1. 100% 2. 87% 3. 57% 4. 28% You still get about 6-7% dps boost, very much worth it in my opinion.
Daniel Plain Science and Trade Institute Caldari State 349	Posted - 2012.09.13 13:52:00 - [14] - Quote Hazen Koraka wrote: Isn't the 4th BCU kinda pointless? You get what, about an extra 1% out of the 4th after stacking penalities? Add something else, maybe even a DCU? Edit: Hmm not sure on the actual amount, but I think 4th stacking penalty is pretty harsh. Anyone got the exact formula? the tengu's base properties are so good that it is actually difficult not to overtank it. that's why you can and should commit as many slots to DPS as you possibly can. also notice how rate of fire stacks in EVE. if you could get to 100% increased RoF, you would be shooting your whole rack at once. this means that the more RoF you stack, the more useful it becomes. at some point this effect starts to counteract the stacking penalties by a significant amount. "I don't troll, I just give overly blunt responses that annoy people who are wrong but don't want to admit it. It's not my fault that people have sensitive feelings" -MXZF
BearJews Secure Arms Trade Coalition Secure Arms Trade Coalitions 54	Posted - 2012.09.13 15:24:00 - [15] - Quote Hazen Koraka wrote: BearJews wrote: If you don't want to train all your skills to lvl5, the missions are doable but I highly recommend you at least train the defense and offense to 5 for obvious reasons. And it doesn't take long at all. This is my personal fit, it's expensive but it works. Below is fitted for Guristas since the tengu Really shines when it comes to applying and defending against kinetic. [Tengu, Pve Lvl 4] Caldari Navy Ballistic Control System Caldari Navy Ballistic Control System Caldari Navy Ballistic Control System Caldari Navy Ballistic Control System Republic Fleet 10MN Afterburner Pithi A-Type Small Shield Booster Shield Boost Amplifier II Thermic Dissipation Field II Kinetic Deflection Field II Federation Navy Stasis Webifier Heavy Missile Launcher II, Scourge Fury Heavy Missile Heavy Missile Launcher II, Scourge Fury Heavy Missile Heavy Missile Launcher II, Scourge Fury Heavy Missile Heavy Missile Launcher II, Scourge Fury Heavy Missile Heavy Missile Launcher II, Scourge Fury Heavy Missile Heavy Missile Launcher II, Scourge Fury Heavy Missile Medium Warhead Rigor Catalyst II Medium Warhead Rigor Catalyst II Medium Warhead Flare Catalyst II Tengu Defensive - Amplification Node Tengu Electronics - Dissolution Sequencer Tengu Engineering - Augmented Capacitor Reservoir Tengu Offensive - Accelerated Ejection Bay Tengu Propulsion - Fuel Catalyst Isn't the 4th BCU kinda pointless? You get what, about an extra 1% out of the 4th after stacking penalties? Add something else, maybe even a DCU? Edit: Hmm not sure on the actual amount, but I think 4th stacking penalty is pretty harsh. Anyone got the exact formula? It's a matter of 2 volleying an NPC cruiser, or 3 Volleying it. Also this is quite the tight fit and i'm not sure a DCII would fit and it's complete unnecessary. I honestly don't think there is anything else you can but in that slot that gives you an advantage. Hell even picking a utility module in the mids was a challenge. You don't even need that web, but it makes killing off SPider drone II a lot faster since they are your worst enemy in any mission. You can go ahead and replace that with more tank if you want (you really really don't need it though).
Scoto Timta EveMerc's 14	Posted - 2012.09.13 15:50:00 - [16] - Quote BearJews wrote: ... I honestly don't think there is anything else you can put in that slot that gives you an advantage. Against Guristas, a sensor backup array may be useful instead of 4th BCU. I don't get jammed a lot without it, but it would be nice to not get jammed at all. I usually use a sig amp myself, just to give me really long-range targeting and lock the stuff up a little bit faster. Maybe the 4th BCU would be better, but I just didn't like that stacking penalty.
Zhilia Mann Tide Way Out Productions 656	Posted - 2012.09.13 19:50:00 - [17] - Quote Hazen Koraka wrote: Isn't the 4th BCU kinda pointless? You get what, about an extra 1% out of the 4th after stacking penalities? Add something else, maybe even a DCU? Edit: Hmm not sure on the actual amount, but I think 4th stacking penalty is pretty harsh. Anyone got the exact formula? 0.5^((([order in stacking penalty]-1)/2.22292081)^2) Fourth navy BCU gives you 7.27% over the third or 12.82% increase on base.
Tau Cabalander Retirement Retreat Working Stiffs 967	Posted - 2012.09.13 21:01:00 - [18] - Quote My alt did level 4 in this fit with minimal missile skills. Orbit the warp-in beacon at 5 km or the next gate at 500 m (gates are huge), and shoot smallest to largest, giving priority to webbers. I ignored triggers and had no problems. You can use T1 launchers, but that really is a crime on a Tengu. This isn't the best fit (one can do a LOT better with more ISK and skill points), but it works: [Tengu, Basic] Power Diagnostic System II Ballistic Control System II Ballistic Control System II Ballistic Control System II Shield Boost Amplifier I Dread Guristas Photon Scattering Field Invulnerability Field II Invulnerability Field II 10MN Afterburner II Medium Shield Booster II Heavy Missile Launcher II, Scourge Fury Heavy Missile Heavy Missile Launcher II, Scourge Fury Heavy Missile Heavy Missile Launcher II, Scourge Fury Heavy Missile Heavy Missile Launcher II, Scourge Fury Heavy Missile Heavy Missile Launcher II, Scourge Fury Heavy Missile Heavy Missile Launcher II, Scourge Fury Heavy Missile Medium Capacitor Control Circuit I Medium Capacitor Control Circuit I Medium Capacitor Control Circuit I Tengu Defensive - Amplification Node Tengu Electronics - Dissolution Sequencer Tengu Engineering - Augmented Capacitor Reservoir Tengu Offensive - Accelerated Ejection Bay Tengu Propulsion - Fuel Catalyst
Shaotuk Sin City Enterprises 9	Posted - 2012.09.14 03:35:00 - [19] - Quote Belthazor4011 wrote: Agreed 700 DPS should be doable, but its still crap compared to other solutions including the CNR you're currently in which can do equal and/or better DPS with a Cruise fit. Why people love the Tengu is beyond me. A tank that can handle level 4s is no big deal and can be done a lot cheaper then most Tengu's, add that to the relatively crap DPS and I dont get why anyone flies the damn thing for level 4s. The only thing might be the speed and agility of a cruiser hull, but there are not that many missions where that actually makes a difference. I do understand and respect the Tengu for other purposes btw, its not a totally useless ship... Coming from a pilot that has flown both, I can say, without a doubt, a Tengu is much faster at clearing missions compared to a CNR. You might want to learn the difference between max DPS and applied DPS.
Dennis Gregs Dawn of Fire 65	Posted - 2012.09.14 03:55:00 - [20] - Quote Just the fact that I have to 'worry' about frigates offputs me from Tengu in missions, I prefer to semi afk with my Raven tbh. It might be cool for a change of pace though, ymmv.
Paikis Lycosa Syndicate Surely You're Joking 162	Posted - 2012.09.14 04:40:00 - [21] - Quote Shaotuk wrote: Coming from a pilot that has flown both, I can say, without a doubt, a Tengu is much faster at clearing missions compared to a CNR. You might want to learn the difference between max DPS and applied DPS. Coming from a pilot that has flown both, you need to get some Rigor and Flare rigs on your CNR. The CNR is a fair bit infront of the CNR for most missions. The only ones where the Tengu is going to be better are missions with long travel distances, and they are few and far between. Having said that, guns are just plain better for everything. OP, train for a Nightmare (or machariel /puke), and thank me later.
Shaotuk Sin City Enterprises 9	Posted - 2012.09.14 05:46:00 - [22] - Quote Dennis Gregs wrote: Just the fact that I have to 'worry' about frigates offputs me from Tengu in missions, I prefer to semi afk with my Raven tbh. It might be cool for a change of pace though, ymmv. Put 2 rigors and 1 flare rigs and you don't have to worry at all about frigates.
Daniel Plain Science and Trade Institute Caldari State 351	Posted - 2012.09.14 15:08:00 - [23] - Quote Shaotuk wrote: Dennis Gregs wrote: Just the fact that I have to 'worry' about frigates offputs me from Tengu in missions, I prefer to semi afk with my Raven tbh. It might be cool for a change of pace though, ymmv. Put 2 rigors and 1 flare rigs and you don't have to worry at all about frigates. this is true. with good skills and equipment, you can oneshot frigs and twoshot elite frigs. "I don't troll, I just give overly blunt responses that annoy people who are wrong but don't want to admit it. It's not my fault that people have sensitive feelings" -MXZF
Velarra Ghost Festival Naraka. 109	Posted - 2012.09.14 17:32:00 - [24] - Quote Dennis Gregs wrote: Just the fact that I have to 'worry' about frigates offputs me from Tengu in missions, I prefer to semi afk with my Raven tbh. It might be cool for a change of pace though, ymmv. You can easily brick tank a Tengu however sharing such fits may get some negative feedback from DPS is tank pilots. At the same time, if you're a CNR pilot, who wants to try something different yet have RL interruption options you may want to take a look at the Scorpion Navy Issue.
Kitty Bear Disturbed Friends Of Diazepam Disturbed Acquaintance 29	Posted - 2012.09.16 18:32:00 - [25] - Quote A mission tengu basically needs Augmented Capacitor Reservoir Accelerated Ejection Bay for 6x launcher slots then fill up with (or whatever else takes your fancy) Amplification Node Fuel Catalyst Dissolution Sequencer to give you 6 mids and 4 lows.
Rainbow Room The 404 3	Posted - 2012.09.18 09:51:00 - [26] - Quote Velarra wrote: Dennis Gregs wrote: Just the fact that I have to 'worry' about frigates offputs me from Tengu in missions, I prefer to semi afk with my Raven tbh. It might be cool for a change of pace though, ymmv. You can easily brick tank a Tengu however sharing such fits may get some negative feedback from DPS is tank pilots. At the same time, if you're a CNR pilot, who wants to try something different yet have RL interruption options you may want to take a look at the Scorpion Navy Issue. That's actually where I'd kinda started in terms of Battleships. I've personally not got a lot of love for the Scorp when it comes to PvE. Nightmare is another option but one I'm taking my other alt down (purely as they're T2 laser trained and have a fair amount of shield skills while this account is more or less missiles and hyrbids). I'll play around with fittings and see what I can come up with. Currently trawling though lvl 2 missions as attempting to get a corp in every faction to lvl 4. Will pickup a tengu at lvl 3 agents
MarvinOne Zilog Enterprises 1	Posted - 2012.09.18 10:41:00 - [27] - Quote In a L4 Tengu You really want to get frigs down very fast (especially when they web u) and I prefer 3 lows and 7 mids: with 2 painters u can paint and shoot at 2 frigs at the same time Low: Caldari Navy Ballistic Control System Caldari Navy Ballistic Control System Caldari Navy Ballistic Control System Mid: Pithi A-Type Small Shield Booster Shield Boost Amplifier II Dread Guristas EM Ward Field Adaptive Invulnerability Field II Republic Fleet 10MN Afterburner Phased Weapon Navigation Array Generation Extron Phased Weapon Navigation Array Generation Extron High : Heavy Missile Launcher II,Scourge Fury Heavy Missile Heavy Missile Launcher II,Scourge Fury Heavy Missile Heavy Missile Launcher II,Scourge Fury Heavy Missile Heavy Missile Launcher II,Scourge Fury Heavy Missile Heavy Missile Launcher II,Scourge Fury Heavy Missile Heavy Missile Launcher II,Scourge Fury Heavy Missile Rigs: Medium Warhead Rigor Catalyst II Medium Warhead Rigor Catalyst II Medium Warhead Flare Catalyst II Modules: Tengu Defensive - Amplification Node Tengu Engineering - Augmented Capacitor Reservoir Tengu Electronics - Emergent Locus Analyzer Tengu Offensive - Accelerated Ejection Bay Tengu Propulsion - Fuel Catalyst
sakara123 in Retiarii Trifectas Syndicate 0	Posted - 2012.09.20 17:26:00 - [28] - Quote Jack Traynor wrote: Rainbow Room wrote: Hey, I've been toying with flying a Tengu for level 4 missions. I'm currently sat in a Navy Raven but figured I'd quite like a change. I've never flown a Tengu but I'm at the stage where all the subsystems are at level 4 and understand the concept that speed and movement is key for this ship. Are lvl 4 subsystem skills good enough for the to do lvl 4 missions or should I train them all to level 5? Thoughts? My initial fit would be running with T2 everything (so t2 mid slots, t2 Heavy Assaults or t2 heavy missile and t2 low slots). Something like: 5 x Heavy Assault Missile Launcher II Target Painter II Shield Boost Amplifier II 2 x T2 hardeners (npc specific) 10MN Afterburner 3 x Ballistic Control System II L4 is good enough, but you will actually see a difference in your performance with all L5 on the subsystems. I didn't think it would make a difference going to five, but it really is. Can't say this for other ships, personally. yeah trust me level 5 is worth it, got an extra 105 dps on my tengu when i did
Ishen Villone GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation 35	Posted - 2012.09.20 19:26:00 - [29] - Quote You want Offensive V for the DPS increase You want Defensive V for the tank increase You want Propulsion V for the speed increase (which is itself a tank increase) You want Electronics V for the sensor strength increase You want Engineering V for the capacitor increase (which is itself a tank increase)
Byron Squared FCI Solvents 2	Posted - 2012.09.22 18:49:00 - [30] - Quote Really? No comment about the proposed heavy missile nerf? Wouldn't think that this is the right time for anyone to be buying a new tengu/training for it........ https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=155029 25% range nerf and 20% damage nerf........+ TD (from sansha etc) kill your range/ability to hit small targets.......

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