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Khamelean
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Posted - 2011.06.25 04:06:00 -
[31]
Originally by: Black Dranzer Edited by: Black Dranzer on 25/06/2011 03:50:50 God damn it Navigator, you should've just kept your head down, but you didn't, did you?
Originally by: CCP Navigator Guys and girls,
The forum rules are quite explicit and our job, on the Community team, is to enforce those rules. Rule number nine states:
'Private communication between the Game Masters, Eve Team members, moderators and administrators of the forum and the forum users is not to be made public on these forums or by any other venue. You are not permitted to publicize any private correspondence (including petitions) received from any of the aforementioned.'
The rules are clear, posting any private communication from any member of CCP is not permitted on ths forums.
You do realise that rule number 9 would also apply if the communication in question was fake?
This confirms nothing.
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Laser Purification
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Posted - 2011.06.25 04:08:00 -
[32]
Is Hilmar on the Eve team for that to apply?
Given the current evidence it doesn't seem so.
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Ludger Brink
Caldari Velle Est Posse
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Posted - 2011.06.25 04:10:00 -
[33]
Navigator will be the next casuality in this war.....god bless you Navigator, I salute you o7
At least we have friends on the inside guys....they want to reach out to us.....they are silently saying, "hope is not lost".... 
I will not be surprised to see many more leaks, in their own different ways, before this is over. There has to be many other CCP employees that love and respect the game and are as hurt as the community in the direction the game is headed, and by how they are being well, (asked is too nice a word) to handle this publicly.
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Black Dranzer
Caldari
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Posted - 2011.06.25 04:19:00 -
[34]
Originally by: Khamelean You do realise that rule number 9 would also apply if the communication in question was fake?
If it were fake, it wouldn't be correspondence, and thus it wouldn't be covered by rule 9.
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Hans Jagerblitzen
Autocannons Anonymous
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Posted - 2011.06.25 04:21:00 -
[35]
THIS is metagaming at its finest. Spais, espionage, leaks, how incredibly EvE. Concord's authorization of Incarna, the reveal of the Noble Exchange, the 'sploding of New Edens public image, and subsequent podding of the trust of its majority player base have become a greater space opera on par with anything that could have happened inside the game....the high drama continues.
It pains me to see so much division and strife, but damn. This kind of story could only happen with a game like Eve.
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Norrin Ellis
Venture Racing
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Posted - 2011.06.25 04:23:00 -
[36]
Originally by: CCP Navigator Guys and girls,
The forum rules are quite explicit and our job, on the Community team, is to enforce those rules. Rule number nine states:
'Private communication between the Game Masters, Eve Team members, moderators and administrators of the forum and the forum users is not to be made public on these forums or by any other venue. You are not permitted to publicize any private correspondence (including petitions) received from any of the aforementioned.'
The rules are clear, posting any private communication from any member of CCP is not permitted on ths forums.
I do believe that Navigator's interpretation of this rule is faulty. The rule indicates communication between two specific parties, namely "Game Masters, Eve Team members, moderators, and administrators of the forum" (CCP) and "the forum users" (users). The communication being circulated is not a communication between CCP and users, but rather a communication between CCP and CCP, which users happen to have acquired. The rule stated doesn't technically apply.
Granted, CCP are the arbiters of their own rules, but I thought this was a case worth stating.
--- CEO, Venture Racing VRT: Public (In-game channel) VRT (Mailing list) |

Steph Wing
Gallente Transfixion Reverberation Project
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Posted - 2011.06.25 04:27:00 -
[37]
Guys.
Look at the wording of Navi's post.
He's throwing us a bone the only way he can; by citing that rule and giving us de fact confirmation of the email's legitimacy.
I for one thank him for doing his job so dilligently.
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Katrina Cortez
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Posted - 2011.06.25 04:28:00 -
[38]
Edited by: Katrina Cortez on 25/06/2011 04:29:29 nvm
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Black Dranzer
Caldari
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Posted - 2011.06.25 04:30:00 -
[39]
Originally by: Steph Wing Edited by: Steph Wing on 25/06/2011 04:29:52 Guys.
Look at the wording of Navi's post.
He's throwing us a bone the only way he can; by citing that rule and giving us de facto confirmation of the email's legitimacy.
I considered that.
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Arya Vonbrawn
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Posted - 2011.06.25 04:32:00 -
[40]
Originally by: Steph Wing Edited by: Steph Wing on 25/06/2011 04:29:52 Guys.
Look at the wording of Navi's post.
He's throwing us a bone the only way he can; by citing that rule and giving us de facto confirmation of the email's legitimacy.
I for one thank him for doing his job so dilligently.
Except, whatever the opposite of this is, is more likely true than this.
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Steph Wing
Gallente Transfixion Reverberation Project
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Posted - 2011.06.25 05:04:00 -
[41]
Edited by: Steph Wing on 25/06/2011 05:04:24 If anything has become apparent these last 24 hours, it's that CCP's ground-level employees, the GMs, the moderators, the devs, are not the problem. They can see the writing on the wall, they're just unable to do anything about it because upper management won't listen.
Navi has just, as I said, thrown us a bone the only way he can.
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Austherus Sialomaet
Amarr Secluded Stronghold Order
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Posted - 2011.06.25 05:11:00 -
[42]
"Innovation takes time to set in and the predictable reaction is always to resist change" - I loled at this, and cried. Innovation is a new engine, new graphics, new gameplay, better servers, etc, etc. What ccp is doing is just a greedy real money store thats going to break the sandbox that made eve awesome...
Money really make people blind...
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Ris Dnalor
Minmatar Fleet of Doom RaVeN Federation
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Posted - 2011.06.25 05:13:00 -
[43]
Originally by: Black Dranzer Edited by: Black Dranzer on 25/06/2011 03:50:50 God damn it Navigator, you should've just kept your head down, but you didn't, did you?
Originally by: CCP Navigator Guys and girls,
The forum rules are quite explicit and our job, on the Community team, is to enforce those rules. Rule number nine states:
'Private communication between the Game Masters, Eve Team members, moderators and administrators of the forum and the forum users is not to be made public on these forums or by any other venue. You are not permitted to publicize any private correspondence (including petitions) received from any of the aforementioned.'
The rules are clear, posting any private communication from any member of CCP is not permitted on ths forums.
WTF is he gonna do? ban us all? call the temp service to get help with forum admin? like he's gonna read the 9000+ page threadnaught and edit every post. bah he won't, and if he does, he'll be the only one.
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cytex malrone
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Posted - 2011.06.25 05:18:00 -
[44]
Originally by: Steph Wing Edited by: Steph Wing on 25/06/2011 05:04:24 If anything has become apparent these last 24 hours, it's that CCP's ground-level employees, the GMs, the moderators, the devs, are not the problem. They can see the writing on the wall, they're just unable to do anything about it because upper management won't listen.
Navi has just, as I said, thrown us a bone the only way he can.
I agree the devs are on our side .... Maybe they will make eve 2
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Tatiana Valenko
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Posted - 2011.06.25 05:21:00 -
[45]
I for one think CCP Navigator is on our side by saying this is a CCP legitimate email and at the same time covering his delicate behind by just doing his job.
So thank you CCP Navigator.
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Planetary Genocide
Gallente White Sail Anarchists
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Posted - 2011.06.25 05:40:00 -
[46]
I don't take it as de facto confirmation, but I do appreciate him actually saying something about it.
I also want to point out that "innovation" is NOT "copying what every other 2nd-rate MMO is doing with MT's", and Hilmar needs to donate his drugs to people who enjoy hallucinations of that magnitude.
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Shiangti
Caldari Revelation Exploration Inc. Without Remorse.
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Posted - 2011.06.25 05:49:00 -
[47]
Bump to keep this on the first page
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Teebee
XERCORE Indecisive Certainty
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Posted - 2011.06.25 07:17:00 -
[48]
They introduce plex to justify this sort of thing. I wonder how many FTP producers this noob ceo talked to.
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R2 D3
The Executives Executive Outcomes
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Posted - 2011.06.25 07:19:00 -
[49]
c-c-c-c-comedy gold that ccp navigator saying the mail is real while he is doing moderation.
Seriously first drink a cup of coffee and then decide with what words you lock/edit things out.
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Ishtanchuk Fazmarai
Amarr
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Posted - 2011.06.25 07:23:00 -
[50]
Obviously someone at CCP is not happy with the official stance and is leaking info.
THX to whoever corresponds and for the rest, have my signature: CCP Helmar: "this is one of the moments where we look at what our players do and less of what they say". Me: UNSUBBING NOW |
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Erid Tangor
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Posted - 2011.06.25 07:26:00 -
[51]
Originally by: Ishtanchuk Fazmarai Obviously someone at CCP is not happy with the official stance and is leaking info.
THX to whoever corresponds and for the rest, have my signature:
Yeah, well, based on the reviews of CCP over at glassdoor.com it doesn't seem like there is a shortage of malcontent in the ranks.
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Zindela
Caldari School of Applied Knowledge
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Posted - 2011.06.25 07:31:00 -
[52]
Originally by: larry hotter bigpants
Originally by: Iamien Edited by: Iamien on 25/06/2011 03:59:18
Originally by: Black Dranzer In retrospect I have some sympathy for him. He's probably going to get chewed out for this, and he's only doing his job. Ugh.
Noone chews out a CEO. He is CEO and owner of most of the company.
Not entirely true. CCP is a publicly funded corporation. Ultimitly he answers to his shareholders.
False. CCP is privately owned/operated. -------------------
Originally by: CCP Fallout This is not the booze you are looking for.
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Johnny Astro Jr
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Posted - 2011.06.25 07:34:00 -
[53]
CCP Games Anonymous in Reykjavik (Iceland): (Past Employee - 2011) ôThe longer you stay the more it hurtsö 1 of 1 people found this helpful
Pros
The Reykjavik office is very family friendly and youÆll often find children running around the office. During lunch it is also acceptable to bring in spouses and children. If you have a family and want to spend additional time with them this could be a way.
ItÆs a place where anyone can get a start in the industry because turnover in departments like QA is still rather high. The way you talk matters more than your actual experience and you can take advantage of this during the interviews.
The Atlanta office is a different place and doesnÆt suffer from the serious unprofessionalism as much as the Reykjavik office. The sad thing is that they too pay the price by seeing their work halted for years at a time to jump ship and bandage EVE up.
Cons
The lack of professionalism is mind blowing. Procedures that are common in other companies are not used here and considered a waste of time. There is no solid vision for EVE which leaves employees with no other option than to start work and find out what is wanted by trial and error, this is what CCP means with Agile development.
Fun game play is not a priority, promises made to investors and aesthetics are. æIf it looks good then it is goodÆ is an often heard motto. CCP is committed to use technology in EVE as well as WoD and DUST, so certain features are made and used in EVE knowing they will not be fun, nor fit EVE and no one expects them to be appreciated by the playerbase. Alienating the playerbase of EVE further. Objections from employees who point this out are waved away.
CCP does not take criticism well and often ignores retrospectives. Criticism is considered to be a negative attitude and is severely frowned upon. A lot of effort goes into maintaining a good morale with a lot of internal PR. After all itÆs cheaper to print posters than pay an average salary to employees.
Several years now CCP has predicated insane subscriber goals that cannot be met. Naturally this is met with scepticism by the employees but it falls on deaf ears. The result is that the company is suffering because we cannot sustain the development of EVE, DUST and WOD. EVE is not creating enough revenue which means that solutions are sought, solutions that CCP was vehemently against a few years ago.
Career progression is nonexistent unless you become friends with the right clique of people and use the right corporate buzzwords. Hard work is not something that will set you apart, most people work hard until they become so disillusioned as they realise it makes no difference and slack off.
Combine this with the below average pay (CCP pays 30% to 50% less than other companies) and youÆll often hear a lot of frustration when work is discussed outside of the office by people who have been here for some time. The longer you stay the less you start to care about the game you develope, because no one else does.
Advice to Senior Management
Recruit very senior people from the games industry and actually listen to what they say. Stop believing your own hype
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Yo Boss
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Posted - 2011.06.25 07:34:00 -
[54]
Delusions of grandeur much? What CCP is doing with EVE is not spectacular or innovative, it is only what every other MMO has been doing or trying to do for the last year. This guy needs a reality check...maybe the profit loss of my three un subbed accounts will catch his attention????
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cyclobs
Minmatar
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Posted - 2011.06.25 07:40:00 -
[55]
wow, it's like watching a failcascade of a horrible alliance
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RensPriceChecker2
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Posted - 2011.06.25 07:54:00 -
[56]
only reynir can save eve now |

Takumi Shinano
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Posted - 2011.06.25 09:18:00 -
[57]
This sounds frighteningly plausible. I've run into something similar in the past, where Corporate culture is local and there's a big disconnect between the local admin/management/support staff and the hired in 'games' talent.
Because said company's don't have much competition within their own country (and changing country every other year is tiresome in the extreme) salaries are lower than industry average and what little pressure there is to develop functional processes tends to be driven by whatever management techniques are fashionable outside the industry within the host country.
Obviously the US office has to compete with the US industry and doesn't suffer from this.
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Vin Hellsing
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Posted - 2011.06.25 09:26:00 -
[58]
Originally by: Takumi Shinano This sounds frighteningly plausible. I've run into something similar in the past, where Corporate culture is local and there's a big disconnect between the local admin/management/support staff and the hired in 'games' talent.
Because said company's don't have much competition within their own country (and changing country every other year is tiresome in the extreme) salaries are lower than industry average and what little pressure there is to develop functional processes tends to be driven by whatever management techniques are fashionable outside the industry within the host country.
Obviously the US office has to compete with the US industry and doesn't suffer from this.
QFT. I can only imagine just how much of the pie the Icelanders have ruined so far.
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John Zenrael
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Posted - 2011.06.25 09:28:00 -
[59]
Does CCP remind anybody else of early 90's Commodore?
Joining-game-too-late fail (for me) :(
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Gnulpie
Minmatar Miner Tech
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Posted - 2011.06.25 09:32:00 -
[60]
Leave CCP Navigator alone!
He is an awesome dude. And he REALLY cares about the community in a good sense. But there is only so much he can do. Leave him alone! |
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