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Selling Skill points on NEX

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Maman Brigitte Licentia Ex Vereor Intergalactic Exports Group	Posted - 2011.06.29 15:51:00 - [31] Your SP don't make much difference to who wants you around. If someone with 100 million SP in combat and no killboard record applies to our corp, we reject their application offhand. On the other hand we routinely accept applications from far younger characters based on either their connections with existing members or demonstrated character. SP matters only in specialization. If you specialize you stop really noticing a difference between you and everyone else around 30 million SP. It takes no longer to get there than it does to gear up a level 80 what-have-you in WoW. "Switching Profession" at will would ruin this game. Specialization? Gone. Careers? Gone. Necessity of planning? Gone. People who have issues with the skill system generally have almost no SP at all, and a totally incorrect understanding of the way SP works. Young players spend about 20 million SP looking forward to their first titan, and the next 60 million SP (the 60 million after they figure out what titans are actually for) trying to come up with excuses to avoid setting foot in one. No one wants to be that poor bastard, and when someone sets foot in a titan they're not doing it for personal gain. They're doing it as a sacrifice to whatever group they're a part of.
Orpheus Ovid	Posted - 2011.06.29 15:53:00 - [32] Originally by: Xercodo anyone got feedback on my variation? :3 I think it is interesting, however, I believe it may be a too complicated. I have found that usually the simplest solution is usually the best one. That is not necessarily a truism, but it has worked well thus far.
Sylthi Minmatar Coreward Pan-Galactic Holy Empire of The Unshaven	Posted - 2011.06.29 16:08:00 - [33] Originally by: Xercodo anyone got feedback on my variation? :3 While interesting, and I am sure some would use it. For me, personally, I wouldn't. Because you aren't really "gaining" anything with your version, at least imho. You're only gaining "access" to it now, rather than later. For me, personally, I can wait and have access to it later for less money than having access to it "now". Summary, I wouldn't be willing to pay extra just to have instant gratification, so CCP wouldn't make any extra money off of me. And extra money for CCP, of course, is the exact reason they are doing any of this. Not that its right. In fact, in my opinion CCP wanting and thinking the deserve MORE money for Eve is very, VERY, wrong. But, it is what it is; and this is where we are at; like it or not. But, I digress. Anyway, you wanted feedback, so there you go. Sorry I couldn't be more supportive; but I can only speak as to whether "I" would use your system, and, frankly, I wouldn't. But, cheers for your participation in the discussion mate! * *
Xercodo Amarr Daj'Juntar	Posted - 2011.06.29 16:14:00 - [34] Originally by: Sylthi Originally by: Xercodo anyone got feedback on my variation? :3 While interesting, and I am sure some would use it. For me, personally, I wouldn't. Because you aren't really "gaining" anything with your version, at least imho. You're only gaining "access" to it now, rather than later. For me, personally, I can wait and have access to it later for less money than having access to it "now". Summary, I wouldn't be willing to pay extra just to have instant gratification, so CCP wouldn't make any extra money off of me. And extra money for CCP, of course, is the exact reason they are doing any of this. Not that its right. In fact, in my opinion CCP wanting and thinking the deserve MORE money for Eve is very, VERY, wrong. But, it is what it is; and this is where we are at; like it or not. But, I digress. Anyway, you wanted feedback, so there you go. Sorry I couldn't be more supportive; but I can only speak as to whether "I" would use your system, and, frankly, I wouldn't. But, cheers for your participation in the discussion mate! yes which is a good thing, thanks for that the exact goal of it is to cater to the "i want it now" kiddies while having enough restrictions that they don't gain any more then those of us that wait for it like we're supposed to which is the major concern i see for "SP for AUR" simply we don't want anyone to get ahead of us in the SP race simply cause they can buy the SP -------------------------------------------------- The drake is a lie
Imnothuman Brutor Tribe	Posted - 2011.06.29 16:19:00 - [35] it may be good for new people to the game to buy a skill piont set where it gives you a basic competcy in either shield or armour and 1 type of attack weaponary ie lvl 4 skills for all core skills, that would not make it over powered or overused.
Del DelVechio Caldari Red Federation RvB - RED Federation	Posted - 2011.06.29 16:44:00 - [36] Originally by: Viibl Triibl I'd buy skill points. Older players still have the advantages of more wealth (usually) and more experiencing playing (usually), which matter more than skill points anyway. Just think, you could fly a Punisher instead of a Rifter. Del Best offer, 11.5 mil sp PVP caldari Positive wallet; Security; 0.0 Remap not done; Standings positive wih everyone; Good learning skills; 11 skills, 7 at lvl 5 - 4 at lvl 4 Starting At: 3 Bi
Capsuleer Newton Amarr	Posted - 2011.06.29 16:47:00 - [37] Originally by: Orpheus Ovid Edited by: Orpheus Ovid on 29/06/2011 15:06:05 I do like the idea of a 3-5 million sp skill pack. However, I am not sure giving 3-5 million sp to a brand new player a very good idea. As a new player you should be trying to experience all the awesome aspects of the sandbox. As a noob, I might just decide to put that 5 million in guns and ships, but as a noob I will have no clue about all the core skills that are necessary to support that awesome Battleship I just trained up for. No, as a noob, if you use half your brain and read some, you'd be able to check out the prequisites and recommended skills of a given ship, you work out a skill plan around this skills, and if you continue on reading, you'd then realize how essential core skills are to ship operation, not just to a specific ship. Being a time dependent skill base, you should have realized early on that "instant gratification" does not exist in eve...
Dirty Dishrag	Posted - 2011.06.29 17:05:00 - [38] Sounds good buying SP's for cash. I can cancel all my alt accounts and just pay to jack my main to 1000000000000000 sps for x amount and not need a plethora of differant accoutns :) Short term profit for CCP long term bad for lack of multiple subs. Good job. Plus now that I can do everything, I can just cancel when I am bored instead of letting it run for 2 or 3 months at a pop for skill training only. Saves me more money in the long run - makes them less, and makes me less attached to the game in general. I mean ** it I can bail for however long and just come in pay to cap whatever I want to do. WTF do I need to play for then? Oh for pvp right. I wonder how many people will pay a few hundrede dollars for a ship with tons of on it to go and lose it. I see the majority of people buying ships sitting in 1.0 systems all day long doing nothing but missions. (IF THAT) On the other hand I bet you will get suicide guys having a ton of fun killing these p2w ships likecrazy and CCP reacting to the new cash cow by altering the game play so that the Cash has priority. Such as NO ATTACKING ANYTHING in high sec etc. Canning War Dec to not work in .6 and above or something equally **ed. And if they make a **ton of money from RMT stuff don't think they wont consider safeguarding those players from the harshness that is EvE as we know it today. Think I will just pass from the get go.
Sook Statta Hahndah	Posted - 2011.06.29 17:15:00 - [39] Originally by: Xercodo anyone got feedback on my variation? :3 I don't hate it, but it's complex. I would prefer something simple. I'd like to see something that simply appeals to a new player to really jump into the game or an old player that's looking to change careers or just beef something up. Once annually, a player gets the option to purchase EXACTLY 1 mil SP for the price of a PLEX. No penalties. I say no penalties, because it's extremely likely that a n00b will not plan their training properly and find that they need a few skills to meet their needs. Essentially, you get roughly a month's worth of SP for the cost of one month's worth of play time. I think it would appeal to new and old players. I don't think a one month boost to one's SP would have a dramatic influence on the game other than to increase the enjoyment of new players (and possibly their retention) and give the old farts a little boost when they're bored of whatever they've been doing for years. Personally, I would do this on both accounts at least once a year. My lapsed main is a jack of all trades, and I can't tell you the number of times I would have loved to be able to PLEX for a million SP just to get started on the new career. I remember STRUGGLING as a new player just to figure things out. Once I finally got a clue and started to plan and train, it was a whole lotta "hurry up and wait." I'm all for vanity items... spendy paint jobs that require a ship as input, a gold plated codpiece or platinum chastity belt. Personally, I'd like to see a 1970's pimp outfit. There is a LOT of potential for MT where game play isn't affected adversely. That's why I'm really frustrated that CCP can't simply answer the question "yes" or "no"... even if it's qualified with "for at least 6 months," etc.
Jennifer Starling Imperial Navy Forum Patrol	Posted - 2011.06.29 17:27:00 - [40] Originally by: Xercodo Buy SP: Restriction: The SP can only be bought at an amount equivalent one month's time or up to whenever your account expires, whichever is shorter. This is calculated using current attributes and averaging them out. Once you buy this SP you can no longer train any skills until you've reached that point. So say I buy 2 years of subscription. That would allow me to get 48 million SP instantly but my training will come to a standstill for 2 years?. Sure!! Love the idea!! Another pro: I can take out my +5 impants and have not fear of podding or have to use JCs for PvP! It actually encourages PvP!!
Knug LiDi N00bFleeT	Posted - 2011.06.29 17:40:00 - [41] Let's assume that typical SP gain is 1.8 M sp per month. If you were to allow NEX for SP, then the absolute minimum I would see would be 1 PLEX for 1.8M SP. But CCP will want to keep pricing high, so it could be 1 PLEX for 600k SP So to train up to where I am from scratch would be 60 PLEX. $900 bucks for a 36M SP character? Not for me, thanks. How does this compare to the open market of PLEX for Toons ? (I have no idea, never looked) I do not have a problem of NEX for SP. ANYONE who gets into a ship before they have ingame experience for it, is simply going to be a better, juicier target. If anything, this decreases the market value for whole toons, and in my humble opinion, selling toons for ISK/PLEX should never have been allowed in the first place. I do not see the crashing of toon market as a negative. -------------- If only we could fall into another's arms, without falling into their hands.
Jennifer Starling Imperial Navy Forum Patrol	Posted - 2011.06.29 17:47:00 - [42] Originally by: Tippia Originally by: Jennifer Starling So basically people just play on for the SP because EVE's boring for the rest and the content alone just wouldn't make them stay? No. People play on for a number of reasons, one of the more notable of which is goal-setting, development, and achievement. SP is one of the primary mechanics for that, and unlike pretty much every other game, it manages to serve this purpose without creating vast chasms between the haves and have-nots. People don't just play for the SP, but you can bet that many play for the next thing around the corner, and they would get far less out of the game if there were no corners to walk around (or choose between). Just look at you: you're just itching to get the next thing on your list! But Tippia .. you (or anyone else) don't HAVE to buy SP even if it's available for AUR! All the features will stay for those who love it, nothing is taken away. If you enjoy to walk the slow road to glory by all means walk it!
Shadow Wind Gallente Aliastra	Posted - 2011.06.29 17:55:00 - [43] I am all for respeccing skillpoints.
DBxExotic Dancer	Posted - 2011.06.29 17:56:00 - [44] Originally by: Shadow Wind I am all for respeccing skillpoints. me too
Xercodo Amarr Daj'Juntar	Posted - 2011.06.29 17:57:00 - [45] Originally by: Jennifer Starling Originally by: Xercodo Buy SP: Restriction: The SP can only be bought at an amount equivalent one month's time or up to whenever your account expires, whichever is shorter. This is calculated using current attributes and averaging them out. Once you buy this SP you can no longer train any skills until you've reached that point. So say I buy 2 years of subscription. That would allow me to get 48 million SP instantly but my training will come to a standstill for 2 years?. Sure!! Love the idea!! Another pro: I can take out my +5 impants and have not fear of podding or have to use JCs for PvP! It actually encourages PvP!! there highlighted the important part, at most you can gain a month worth -------------------------------------------------- The drake is a lie
Jennifer Starling Imperial Navy Forum Patrol	Posted - 2011.06.29 17:59:00 - [46] Originally by: Xercodo there highlighted the important part, at most you can gain a month worth Oops ... well now that wouldn't really make a lot of difference would it?
Ivoto Gallente Blue Republic RvB - BLUE Republic	Posted - 2011.06.29 18:00:00 - [47] This thread reeks of fail. The second CCP introduces buying SP/Remap SP, is the second they will see more than half of their player base leave. Dumb posters are dumb.
Ariel Nova	Posted - 2011.06.29 18:12:00 - [48] everyone that supports buying SP. you are forgetting one thing, it's a matter of EFFORT the NeX store (if it sells no-vanity items) by passes someone somewhere, and their effort. PLEX to ISK to Character Bizarre is not P2W because someone trained that toon you are trading ISK for. there is still effort in place. I would say that exchanging the points spent would be ok because it doesn't effect the effort. I spent the time training and therefore moving the skill points around doesn't alter that. Keep in mind that the pre-Incarna PLEX system benefited 2 parties within the game, through trade and all effort mechanics were unaltered. The NeX store benefits (if you can call it a benefit) 1 player and CCP, and if it introduces items that bypass effort, it ruins the game.
Jennifer Starling Imperial Navy Forum Patrol	Posted - 2011.06.29 18:26:00 - [49] Originally by: Ariel Nova I would say that exchanging the points spent would be ok because it doesn't effect the effort. I spent the time training and therefore moving the skill points around doesn't alter that. I'm very much ok with this. It would be fun to merge my main and alt!
Tippia Caldari Sunshine and Lollipops	Posted - 2011.06.29 18:27:00 - [50] Originally by: Shadow Wind I am all for respeccing skillpoints. That's an even worse idea. ùùù ôWe want to try this thing called micro-transactions, but we don't know what it is. Can anyone explainà aw screw it, let's just do it! What could go wrong?ö ù ÇÇP
Vincent Athena	Posted - 2011.06.29 18:32:00 - [51] Any comments on my method? (Post #21).
Skex Relbore Gallente Red Federation RvB - RED Federation	Posted - 2011.06.29 18:39:00 - [52] Originally by: Ariel Nova everyone that supports buying SP. you are forgetting one thing, it's a matter of EFFORT the NeX store (if it sells no-vanity items) by passes someone somewhere, and their effort. PLEX to ISK to Character Bizarre is not P2W because someone trained that toon you are trading ISK for. there is still effort in place. I would say that exchanging the points spent would be ok because it doesn't effect the effort. I spent the time training and therefore moving the skill points around doesn't alter that. Keep in mind that the pre-Incarna PLEX system benefited 2 parties within the game, through trade and all effort mechanics were unaltered. The NeX store benefits (if you can call it a benefit) 1 player and CCP, and if it introduces items that bypass effort, it ruins the game. Paying to respec undermines the point of planning out ones remaps at which point you might as well just do away with attributes entirely and set a static level of SP gain + a % depending on implants. It's a bad idea IMO because it removes the value of making good choices and the cost of poor choices. I'd almost be willing to accept remaps for plex but honeslty I think remaps should be a bit more frequent than yearly anyway. Accelerated learning is also kind of tricky personally I think this games training speed is about double what it should be, but it's also part of what gives it it's longevity and provides a large portion of the satisfaction factor of finishing a hard won goal. Part of the problem with a cash shop in EVE period is that this is a game that generally requires and rewards patience and MT runs counter to that.
Patient 2428190 DEGRREE'Fo'FREE Internet Business School	Posted - 2011.06.29 18:42:00 - [53] The only way I could accept it is if you get skillpoints at 5 times what it costs to train it. Something like 350K for a PLEX, knock yourself out. ...Then when you stopped to think about it. All you really said was Lalala.
jelinna	Posted - 2011.06.29 19:07:00 - [54] Edited by: jelinna on 29/06/2011 19:09:05 Threads like these are exactly what CCP wanted to happen while they delay answering the players.
Ripley Nostromo	Posted - 2011.06.29 19:23:00 - [55] Originally by: Tippia Originally by: Jennifer Starling If it provides no advantage, why not give it out freely and royally? Because it ruins customer retention. Quote: If it provides no advantage, why not bisomass your character every month and start anew? Because it ruins customer retention. Broke losers with no money who play for ISK by buying PLEX. Who needs crummy customers like that?
Zagdul Gallente Shadowed Command Fatal Ascension	Posted - 2011.06.29 19:24:00 - [56] I have heard this rumor ... Stopped reading There.
StillBorn CrackBaby	Posted - 2011.06.29 19:25:00 - [57] Originally by: Dirty Dishrag WAH WAH WAH...Think I will just pass from the get go. Good bye, good riddance...
Zero GodOfDestruction	Posted - 2011.06.30 03:08:00 - [58] Edited by: Zero GodOfDestruction on 30/06/2011 03:10:42 Edit: I see that pyrox already purposed this idea, I suppose great minds think alike. Originally by: Orpheus Ovid I have heard this rumor that they will be selling skill points on NEX. So, I was at first horrified about this idea...but now I am not so sure. Anyways, some pros and cons I have been thinking about. pro-I could hop careers easier. I trained up to be to an awesome miner, but now I am interested in exploration. So, I get some Skill points off the NEX and give it a shot. con-I am a noob and I want to fly a battleship. con-We are in an instant gratification society, and EVE rewards time and patience. Feel free to add more...pros and cons Next, I am thinking about restrictions and ideas Can't buy skill points till you have reached 10 million skill points or whatever amount. The point is restrict newbie players from getting crazy loads of skill points. Perhaps don't sell skill points, but be able to move them around. For instance, I am a really awesome miner, now I want to explore...so i go to nex and rearrange my skills so i can be an awesome miner, however, i am no longer and awesome miner, i am an awesome explorer. Anyways, I can see both sides. Feel free to add your thoughts. It would be more practical to have a "skillpoint reset" available for purchase, as it wouldn't allow noobs to buy experience, but it would allow for correction of bad training choices. That is, if it wasn't ridiculously overpriced, like the current nex prices. I think about a half to 1 bil in isk or equivalent would be fair. This video is brilliant and is a must watch for anyone angry with what CCP has done and will do .
Ethan Bejorn Caldari Provisions	Posted - 2011.06.30 03:12:00 - [59] I'd like to buy a remap for $20 US. Thanks CCP.
MyjoHe	Posted - 2011.06.30 04:00:00 - [60] The con of buying skillpoints is simply this: Instant gratification, in this case skillpoints that are bought, has very little if any meaning. Why? You didnt earn it. To understand this, log on to the test server, buy and lose 100 tech2 fit battleships that only cost 100isk. Pretty boring eh? PVP on the test server has no meaning because the supply of stuff is nearly limitless. Earning something in a game through time invested has much more meaning and keeps subscribers. If you dont think so, think about what the game would be like if the following occured when you first open your account: Your character was maxed out skillpoint wise. Your character had an unlimited supply of isk. Your character had an unlimited supply of every single mod in game. Your character had an unlimited supply of every single ship in game, you Titan flying noob you. All on your first day. What would be the point of playing the game?

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