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Top ten reasons the protest failed

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Zey Nadar Gallente Unknown Soldiers B O R G	Posted - 2011.07.07 08:08:00 - [271] Edited by: Zey Nadar on 07/07/2011 08:09:14 Originally by: Jonathan Ferguson Originally by: Zey Nadar What makes the OT think the protest failed? Because Zulu, Mittens and I all agree that it achieved nothing? I was under impression it was one of the reasons that made CCP call for the emergency CSM meeting? I know I didnt expect anything to change, anything that was already released, anyway. I expected them to rethink their plans, and the changes would be invisible to us, revealed only in future releases. The actual protest was only a small part of the outcry, anyway. Did it make your life miserable in Jita? I would laugh for that..
Cashcow Golden Goose	Posted - 2011.07.07 08:31:00 - [272] Originally by: Mara Rinn Originally by: Cashcow Golden Goose Claiming it's not CCP policy is fine, except that CCP is a company comprising individuals. Ooops. Problem right there. Here is one strictly personal opinion Kristoffer Touborg wants you to show him the money: "I would like virtual goods sales in EVE. In fact, IÆd like to sell a lot more than vanity items." Who is Kristoffer Touborg, and what is his job? LEAD GAME DESIGNER. Now go read The Onion and see if you can find a parallel between the kind of "opinion" being floated in Fearless. The purpose of the extreme views expressed in Fearless is to encourage people to think about the issues: what is P2W? what is a balance issue? when does a vanity item become a power or concierge item? The entire publication is tongue-in-cheek humour. Read it again with that in mind and have a bit of a giggle. Then get back to work recognising that selling shirts and shoes for real money is not game-breaking. It says at the beginning that these are the views of the people who make the game. It then tells me their views. Then you tell me it's not their views. gf n1.
Marcus Vorenius Caldari Task Force 42	Posted - 2011.07.07 19:49:00 - [273] Edited by: Marcus Vorenius on 07/07/2011 19:54:32 From Twitter: Re thread http://t.co/9IFtcpM We did not fail, but the 'strong ties' should have used the 'weak ties' more http://t.co/rKnecBY \| #tweetfleet --------------------------- http://p3technocrat.blogspot.com/
Kalestia Barrak	Posted - 2011.07.07 19:51:00 - [274] Originally by: AkJon Ferguson Did I miss any? Yup. People vote with their wallets. In this case, they voted to keep paying.
Naradius DEATHFUNK	Posted - 2011.07.07 20:49:00 - [275] Originally by: White Tree If you knew anything about the living hell I've had to go through these last 5 days to get to Iceland and back you wouldn't be spouting what you're spouting now. A mixture of flight delays, missed flights, lost passports and more just so I could go to Iceland and shout at CCP for 48 hours only to crawl home (I'm STILL not home nearly 72 hours after the summit ended) and I get to come back to people sitting in their diapers crying about how we were 'bought' by CCP. You literally have no idea what you're talking about and I've actually put my physical health on the back burner for YOUR interests and so did the rest of the CSM so just chill out with the endless stream of nonsense you constantly fire at us. We're not superheroes and we made some serious sacrifices to be able to drop EVERYTHING to go to Iceland and hash this out. We didn't get drunk and we didn't have fun because quite frankly we were too tired, too stressed and too overworked to be able to stop for a moment and consider anyone's concerns other than yours. The same can be mirrored for CCP who were genuinely worried and concerned about the problems the players had. We sat and watched as THE greatest technical achievement the company has ever put forward was perpetually overshadowed by problems. I'm sorry if you didn't get everything you wanted exactly how you wanted it but your entitlements stretch far and beyond their reach so simmer down and think about what you're saying before you say it. Not the best post from a CSM, I've seen . I do really appreciate you putting yourself out to make the journey, but you, and only you, put yourself forward for the job, so don't start b*tching at others when things get tough...especially, don't alienate those that voted you in, and whose views you are suppose to represent in the first place.
Alpheias Euphoria Released HYDRA RELOADED	Posted - 2011.07.08 10:50:00 - [276] Originally by: Naradius Originally by: White Tree If you knew anything about the living hell I've had to go through these last 5 days to get to Iceland and back you wouldn't be spouting what you're spouting now. A mixture of flight delays, missed flights, lost passports and more just so I could go to Iceland and shout at CCP for 48 hours only to crawl home (I'm STILL not home nearly 72 hours after the summit ended) and I get to come back to people sitting in their diapers crying about how we were 'bought' by CCP. You literally have no idea what you're talking about and I've actually put my physical health on the back burner for YOUR interests and so did the rest of the CSM so just chill out with the endless stream of nonsense you constantly fire at us. We're not superheroes and we made some serious sacrifices to be able to drop EVERYTHING to go to Iceland and hash this out. We didn't get drunk and we didn't have fun because quite frankly we were too tired, too stressed and too overworked to be able to stop for a moment and consider anyone's concerns other than yours. The same can be mirrored for CCP who were genuinely worried and concerned about the problems the players had. We sat and watched as THE greatest technical achievement the company has ever put forward was perpetually overshadowed by problems. I'm sorry if you didn't get everything you wanted exactly how you wanted it but your entitlements stretch far and beyond their reach so simmer down and think about what you're saying before you say it. Not the best post from a CSM, I've seen . I do really appreciate you putting yourself out to make the journey, but you, and only you, put yourself forward for the job, so don't start b*tching at others when things get tough...especially, don't alienate those that voted you in, and whose views you are suppose to represent in the first place. I'd like to see you try being civil to anyone after a mixture of flight delays, missed flights, misplaced passports and whatnot.
Aralello	Posted - 2011.07.08 11:26:00 - [277] Edited by: Aralello on 08/07/2011 11:26:42 The general EvE populace have to be the biggest ***** whiners in this god damn universe. Knee-jerk reactions to every single thing and you lot will never be happy and spout about how this would be easy to implement this that and the next thing. Barely any of you understand business (or the English language half the time) and the amount of time needed to plan/develop/test and implement. You are all consumers. You consume their product, don't like it? Tough **. Just be glad they have listened long enough now and actually there are no game-breaking mechanics, just expensive vanity items. None of you take the whole picture into account and are in fact: spoiled and ungrateful little brats. Reality check and a breath of fresh air is needed for a lot of you I believe.
Jenshae Chiroptera	Posted - 2011.07.08 14:51:00 - [278] Originally by: Aralello You are all consumers. You consume their product, don't like it? Consumers You are American aren't you?
Alu Utukku	Posted - 2011.07.08 17:54:00 - [279] Top 5 - 5) People say alot of things, and in a large enough number of cases do the opposite of what they say. 4) the game isn't quite on the precipice everyone who protested seems to think it is. 3) A large portion of people engage in busy work just to make it look good, there's a lot of 'busy work' at CCP just to see what sticks to the wall when thrown. 2) The ability to protest in a virtual world is rather limited. spiking a statue with webs and laser beams is not a protest, it's a waste. 1) CCP really couldn't give a crap. If the number of botting accounts approaches even 30% of the number people like to think it is, and that the DRF has financed itself and its' operations via this method, then why the f*** would you believe they'd care about 2% of the gaming population of Eve having a stroke over MT? (the above may or may not include moments of satire, it is up to the reader to decide what is and isn't real ;p)
Mag's the united Negative Ten.	Posted - 2011.07.08 18:01:00 - [280] Originally by: Alpheias Originally by: Naradius Originally by: White Tree whaaaaaaaa Not the best post from a CSM, I've seen . I do really appreciate you putting yourself out to make the journey, but you, and only you, put yourself forward for the job, so don't start b*tching at others when things get tough...especially, don't alienate those that voted you in, and whose views you are suppose to represent in the first place. I'd like to see you try being civil to anyone after a mixture of flight delays, missed flights, misplaced passports and whatnot. Don't post then, sorted.

Aralello	Posted - 2011.07.08 18:49:00 - [281] Originally by: Jenshae Chiroptera Originally by: Aralello You are all consumers. You consume their product, don't like it? Consumers You are American aren't you? No. I'm not. I'm from Scotland.
Cipher Jones Minmatar	Posted - 2011.07.08 18:52:00 - [282] Originally by: Kalestia Barrak Originally by: AkJon Ferguson Did I miss any? Yup. People vote with their wallets. In this case, they voted to keep paying. So you get your connection statistics from somewhere that is not the EvE API? Because that system indicates the opposite of what you are saying, and it is the official source. Link please and thank you. I say that because I know you are not trolling numbers out of thin air.
Jonathan Ferguson JC Ferguson and Son Ltd Ferguson Alliance	Posted - 2011.07.13 18:52:00 - [283] http://www.eveonline.com/ingameboard.asp?a=topic&threadID=1419106&page=12#343 Originally by: AkJon Ferguson God, some of you are so dense I can't tell if you're trolling, CCP alts, or are actually dumb enough to believe the crap you're spewing. First, to those who say 'but you can already buy a character with $, why not buy SP with $?' The issue is scarcity. That's what makes something valuable. If someone transfers their 100M SP toon to somebody else, they haven't made my 100M SP toon (if I had one) less valuable. If CCP starts allowing someone (or dozens of someones) to start creating 100M SP toons out of thin air, then CCP is, in effect, spitting in the faces of their most loyal customers. (Actually this would be nothing new for CCP, think of a slightly more degrading activity perhaps.) CCP has a goose. That goose is called EVE. It lays golden eggs. Don't kill the goose, CCP. If you want to squeeze more money out of your playerbase, here's a radical idea: EARN IT. Commit to EXCELLENCE. Bring EVE out of beta. Then say 'We delivered, now we're going to charge a little more.' Who goes out of their way to destroy the greatest thing they've ever done in their miserable lives? Keep EVE great, make it BETTER. Follow the herd in your OTHER games. If you set the example with EVE by staying true to the original, revolutionary, concept and demonstrate once again that you are a company that has integrity, you will repair your reputation, will have more subscribers for ALL your games, and when you're old and on your deathbed you'll be able to feel like you did at least one worthwhile thing while you were here on earth. Or you can just try to squeeze every last miserable buck out of your players and you will reap what you have sown. "I represent those who voted for me, not 'everyone'. Don't give me your entitled voter schtick ..." ~CSM Chair Mittens
Mister Smithington	Posted - 2011.07.13 18:57:00 - [284] Originally by: Jonathan Ferguson Bumping my own thread by quoting myself because I'm a self-important S.O.B. and other people need to take me as seriously as I take myself. FYP
Brujo Loco Amarr Brujeria Teologica	Posted - 2011.07.13 20:22:00 - [285] Even though OP spouts some ideas I believe to be a bit extreme, even for me, I wholeheartedly agree. Anyone saying EVE is "well" atm is answering out of their head what THEY think its real. Check the API, check the current pop, for this still being summer, number are "LOW". Why? Because what everyone out there on the side of the fence that want to put this under the rug wants is just a "normal" environment. They want the old eve back, they see the dissenters as obsessed zealots full of hatred, and in their denial they just want to believe they were right. To be honest, NO ONE WON in this, not the protesters, not the opposers, not CCP, no one won Anything, even if CCP is SWIMMING IN CASH , they still lost whatever credibility they had in the gaming world, and I know that currently, word of mouth advertising is in the negative scale for them. Go to any MMO , WOW/WoT/LOTRO/COH and just say in or begin a topic with something like this "OMG EVE ONLINE SUX" and let the replies fill you in on the game. because, when you go to those communities of gaming, that's the target of the "NEW FEARLESS GREED" plan of them, to cater to the audiences that are not like the old core of subbers. Anyway, WE ALL LOST. The Dream is over, all that is left is the tattered remains being revivified for a new experience some of us <including me> did NOT WANT. I was a pro Incarna fan, until the moment I realized all it entailed. The game is not what it was. Unsub? eventually, but will keep lurking around here to see what is happening. I even know some people actively "paying" with their labour hate campaigns to inform newcomers to AVOID EVE. Even though also a bit extreme for me, I understand their feelings. CCP just reaped what they sowed, and they are now sowing a whole new breed of people. Let's see how it settles after the storm. And despite any kind of point you make, nothing will make me believe the most boneheaded move ever by CCP was the lack of proper PR standup to this. All of this could have been avoided if they DARED to show their faces and say everything that was happening, from real people, not a lame wall of text minute. A small video in youtube by the devs saying what they wanted with EVE would have worked wonders in quelling this. Where people see nothing of import in pixelated lasers attacking a pizelated statue, others <even several colleagues of mine> saw the great future and potential for the new set of Third Wave electronic revolutions. Where some people here see lag and spam, others see joyous words of dissent spreading at the speed of light and the hint at greater things to come. We live in a new world and I'm proud to have been an E-Protester, even if in your eyes we are commies, hippies or bums we are the new batch of Online Dissenters and Reactionaries that will try to scream FREEDOM!, even if we are banned, Ip blocked and D/C . I see for me as a student of human behavior, a huge success, for me as an EVE player a lack of real winnings or losing, but a storm that changes the landscape. CCP is willing to move in a direction some of us hate, despite the statements that say the contrary, CCP also shows they Speak about going left, when all they do is veer slowly or grossly to the right. They have done that before, they are doing it now. Why then should people like OP or me, or anyone else for that matter, BELIEVE a single word of what they say? They have proven time and time again they don't care, their way of dealing with situations is blatantly disrespectful and outright patronizing to the community. Their dev alt postings only keep showing it, and they fail to understand people CAN and WILL disagree with them despite THEM believing they doing it RIGHT. I sometimes wonder if the core management being from Iceland, and their local customs interfering somehow in their PR stunts on a GLOBALIZED community, like the one here. ---Eve is not dying, its being murdered ----
Jinx Kaundur	Posted - 2011.07.13 20:30:00 - [286] Edited by: Jinx Kaundur on 13/07/2011 20:35:30 Originally by: Mister Smithington Originally by: Jonathan Ferguson Bumping my own thread by quoting myself because I'm a self-important S.O.B. and other people need to take me as seriously as I take myself. FYP Turd Ferguson. @all the other melodramatic "dream is lost," posters: Rofl.
Jonathan Ferguson JC Ferguson and Son Ltd Ferguson Alliance	Posted - 2011.07.24 23:33:00 - [287] Edited by: Jonathan Ferguson on 24/07/2011 23:37:19 Originally by: Jinx Kaundur Edited by: Jinx Kaundur on 13/07/2011 20:35:30 Originally by: Mister Smithington Originally by: Jonathan Ferguson Bumping my own thread by quoting myself because I'm a self-important S.O.B. and other people need to take me as seriously as I take myself. FYP Turd Ferguson. @all the other melodramatic "dream is lost," posters: Rofl. Turd Ferguson is one of the funnier characters created by SNL. If you want to call me Turd Ferguson, go at it. We can call the protest the Clash of the Turds: Me, Alex Gianturdo, and CCP. But really the protest has more of a South Park flavor to me. CCP's customers are saying: CCP, we can't tell the difference between Incarna and a reheated turd in a microwave! and CCP is saying: Nothing to see here. Meanwhile, Darius is saying 'He's coming right for us!' "I represent those who voted for me, not 'everyone'. Don't give me your entitled voter schtick ..." ~CSM Chair Mittens
GeoBlue	Posted - 2011.07.25 02:22:00 - [288] And the #1 reason the protest didnt work was..... CCP DOESN"T GIVE A CHIT!!! Plain and simple.
Jon Ferguson JC Ferguson and Son Ltd Ferguson Alliance	Posted - 2011.07.25 20:18:00 - [289] Originally by: GeoBlue And the #1 reason the protest didnt work was..... CCP DOESN"T GIVE A CHIT!!! Plain and simple. True 'nuff. CCP is betting the farm on the hope that their customer base is so easily distracted and addicted that they will be placated by some PR fluff and just keep playing and paying. Especially now that many of their most vocal and articulate critics have left. Once they force us to move over to new forums (is that next week?) they can sweep it all under the rug.
Crasniya	Posted - 2011.07.25 20:39:00 - [290] "Dev alts" is a troll excuse for not understanding that everyone doesn't agree with them. I'm a 22-year-old System Administrator with a Bachelor's of Science in Game and Simulation Programming, living in the suburbs of Chicago, IL. Yes, I understand game programming. No, I have not, and never will, work for CCP. I've been called a CCP alt about 20 times in the last month.

Jon Ferguson JC Ferguson and Son Ltd Ferguson Alliance	Posted - 2011.07.25 20:48:00 - [291] Originally by: Crasniya "Dev alts" is a troll excuse for not understanding that everyone doesn't agree with them. I'm a 22-year-old System Administrator with a Bachelor's of Science in Game and Simulation Programming, living in the suburbs of Chicago, IL. Yes, I understand game programming. No, I have not, and never will, work for CCP. I've been called a CCP alt about 20 times in the last month. Poor grammar and exaggeration aside, let's stick to the dev alt issue. We know that there are dev alts posting on forums. We don't know if any particular alt is a dev alt, a fanboi alt, or just a troll. If CCP believes in the validity of their actions, they should be willing to defend them openly. If they don't, then they are grossly unethical and worthy of the scorn being heaped upon them. Whether or not a few confused but well-meaning souls are mistaken as dev alts is not a concern of mine. Explain why it should be.
Crasniya	Posted - 2011.07.25 20:54:00 - [292] Edited by: Crasniya on 25/07/2011 20:57:32 Edited by: Crasniya on 25/07/2011 20:57:06 Edited by: Crasniya on 25/07/2011 20:54:47 How do we "know" that there are dev alts posting in support of CCP? Has CCP stated that some of their devs alts post in support of CCP on the forums? Or are you assuming there "has" to be, because you don't believe that many people actually like the game. Also: What grammatical errors? I'm referred to as a Grammar ** in most camps. So if you'd care to spell out your issues with my post, please do. Sigh... can't use that term on the forums. It's not like it's a swear word, yes, they were a horrible group of people that killed a lot of innocent people. But are they "They-Who-Must-Not-Be-Named"? I say "Voldemort" too. Sal**er <- S A L T W A T E R
Mallak Azaria Three 6 MaFiA KRYSIS.	Posted - 2011.07.25 21:03:00 - [293] Are people really still crying about this dead topic? ================================================== I love and hate 0.0 these days and feel CCP is taking a big **** on my chest every time i see super carriers. ~Tipsy McStagger
Jon Ferguson JC Ferguson and Son Ltd Ferguson Alliance	Posted - 2011.07.25 21:11:00 - [294] Originally by: Crasniya Also: What grammatical errors? I'm referred to as a Grammar **** in most camps. So if you'd care to spell out your issues with my post, please do. Here you go. Let's see if you can tell the difference between these two sentences: "Dev alts" is a troll excuse for not understanding that everyone doesn't agree with them. "Dev alts" is a troll excuse for not understanding that not everyone agrees with them. Would you care to substantiate your troll claim (to use your terminology) that I or any of the other protesters thinks that everyone agrees with us? Let's see if we can agree on this: If there hasn't been a single anonymous dev (CCP employee) alt posting on these forums (in the past month and change) in support of CCP, then I am talking out of my ass. If there has been at least one anonymous dev (CCP employee) alt posting on these forums (in the past month and change) in support of CCP, then you are talking out of yours.
Tautut The Union Of The Snake	Posted - 2011.07.25 21:18:00 - [295] Originally by: Jon Ferguson Let's see if we can agree on this: If there hasn't been a single anonymous dev (CCP employee) alt posting on these forums (in the past month and change) in support of CCP, then I am talking out of my ass. If there has been at least one anonymous dev (CCP employee) alt posting on these forums (in the past month and change) in support of CCP, then you are talking out of yours. Lmao - how will you ever know that? I don't think we need to confirm no dev-alt posting to determine that you're talking out of your ass. Sorry to hear that you're having such a hard time with the game. Not everyone's good at playing it I suppose. Still - if 'Forum Warrior' was a game, you'd be elite... right? The Union of the Snake [SNAKE]
Crasniya	Posted - 2011.07.25 21:18:00 - [296] I see a stylistic difference, I'm not sure I see one as more or less correct than the other. I don't agree with you. You specifically stated that "we know". That indicates you have some way that you know, for sure, that there is at least one CCP dev alt posting on the forums. If you can't explain how you know that, then whether there is or isn't CCP alts on the forum is completely irrelevant, because you are indeed, talking out of your rear.
JC Ferguson Federal Navy Academy	Posted - 2011.07.29 02:04:00 - [297] Thought of another reason why we failed. We didn't have a common communication channel. Bunch of us on eve-o (though a lot of us are censored/banned,) bunch of us on scrapheap, k-, twitter. Divide and conquer. The fact that not a single popular podcast had the balls to stand up to CCP (and mean it) didn't help. Makes me feel bad for being so hard on the Lost in EVE guys. I thought their blind fanboism was particularly deplorable, but less than a month later and all the podcasts (like V&V) are reading from the same script (and giggling with/sucking up to the authors of that script.) (If I'm wrong, I'd love to be pointed in the direction of a podcast that hasn't drunk the Koolaid yet.)
Sullen Skoung	Posted - 2011.09.03 09:22:00 - [298] Originally by: baltec1 It stopped because the bulk of us didnt want none vanity items. CCP has now said the will not go down that road so we are happy again. Its as simple as that. lol cause theyre so trustworthy with them words -------- CCP knows better than the players whats good for their game. SOE knew what was best for SWG too. Better than all those players that left too.
El'Niaga Minmatar Republic Military School	Posted - 2011.09.03 09:26:00 - [299] Check the average online.....the protests may have failed to change CCPs policies, but ultimately folks vote with their feet and they are.
Sullen Skoung	Posted - 2011.09.03 09:28:00 - [300] Originally by: Jon Ferguson Once they force us to move over to new forums (is that next week?) they can sweep it all under the rug. Remember, remember, the Fifth of September, the New Forum Treason and Plot. I know of no reason why the New Forum Treason should ever be forgot Goon Squad, tÆwas their intent to blow up our New Forums. Three score Threadnaughts struck a blow to prove old CCPÆs overthrow -------- CCP knows better than the players whats good for their game. SOE knew what was best for SWG too. Better than all those players that left too.



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