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Author	Thread Statistics \| Show CCP posts - 1 post(s)
TriadSte Gallente	Posted - 2011.07.15 16:00:00 - [1] Please can you tell me/us why it takes 12 minutes to reboot the server? Servers are just PCs yes? PCs with 12 minute boot times? Tell us the truth? We ain't kids and frankly tired of the standard CCP lie thesedays.
Chidori kun Minmatar Starship Operating BastardZ	Posted - 2011.07.15 16:04:00 - [2] OMG here we go ... geez servers need time to start up a database is not something that starts up in 1 minute it takes time. Sometimes a lot besides loading all your **** in your hangars also system and stuff a eve database is not a small thing. I rather hear why after a improve database server thingy they again have a crash.
Not-Apsalar	Posted - 2011.07.15 16:05:00 - [3] Edited by: Not-Apsalar on 15/07/2011 16:06:09 Originally by: TriadSte Please can you tell me/us why it takes 12 minutes to reboot the server? Servers are just PCs yes? PCs with 12 minute boot times? Tell us the truth? We ain't kids and frankly tired of the standard CCP lie thesedays. Err, it's a server farm. I'm sure they have tons of dependencies between different services and applications across the clusters. Depending on how they've built the software/what OS/etc, it may also need to be loaded in a certain order. And as we've seen before, you can be in server right after it comes up but not ever service in game is available because that particular service is still loading(like the markets). Frankly, I think you just don't have an understanding of how complex of an operation an MMO server farm is.
Asm Khurelem	Posted - 2011.07.15 16:06:00 - [4] Edited by: Asm Khurelem on 15/07/2011 16:07:37 They've used old technology. Also, no, in this case, "server" probably refers to the software, not the hardware. Unless hardware issues are causing the crashes. It's not how lon git takes to get the computer working, it's how lon git takes for your database software to start working :D. (And then your badly coded game-server as well? :() edit: And in addition, wokrin gon the assumption that the twitter people don't know how it works, it's probably not a single machine for the database, but a cluster. (Although the reliability says otherwise!)
Valeryia	Posted - 2011.07.15 16:06:00 - [5] "Servers are just PCs"? Are you a frickin idiot? No they are not like PCs at all.
Dr Geiger	Posted - 2011.07.15 16:08:00 - [6] Originally by: TriadSte servers are just PCs yes? PCs with 12 minute boot times?
Kaptain Kruncher	Posted - 2011.07.15 16:10:00 - [7] Once again, the experts have spoken. To the OP- What lies? Or are you just toting the victim banner around?
Dark Reignz	Posted - 2011.07.15 16:10:00 - [8] To fair to them .. sometimes database errors that cause server outage cannot be seen at first glance which sometimes require a little exploration and a quick fix before the server can be rebooted. The company I work for revolves around IT and servers and we get the same thing.. Database errors causing the server to crash and not reboot which often takes around 10 mins or in somecases longer before the server is back online.
Asm Khurelem	Posted - 2011.07.15 16:11:00 - [9] Originally by: Valeryia "Servers are just PCs"? Are you a frickin idiot? No they are not like PCs at all. Or you are! :D Other than the difference in case and component size standards. (Servers are generally rack-mounted = thin, but wide and long, for density in data-centres), there isn't a hardware difference! (Except it's recommended to use redundant power supplies and RAID, so you have data redundancy and no issues if a power supply fails, but it's not required...)
Ivoto Gallente VAPORWAR3	Posted - 2011.07.15 16:12:00 - [10] By far the WORST "Server Down" thread I've posted in. Not sure if OP serious? PC≠Servers.

Valeryia	Posted - 2011.07.15 16:12:00 - [11] Originally by: Asm Khurelem Originally by: Valeryia "Servers are just PCs"? Are you a frickin idiot? No they are not like PCs at all. Or you are! :D Other than the difference in case and component size standards. (Servers are generally rack-mounted = thin, but wide and long, for density in data-centres), there isn't a hardware difference! (Except it's recommended to use redundant power supplies and RAID, so you have data redundancy and no issues if a power supply fails, but it's not required...) True Wisdom from a technology nerd. Thanks for the clarification doofus.
Skaz Minmatar Skazmanian Industries	Posted - 2011.07.15 16:12:00 - [12] actually, a server reboot in 12 minutes for something that then handles 30-50 thousand users? Sounds rather impressive... - - PINK PINK PINK PINK
TriadSte Gallente	Posted - 2011.07.15 16:13:00 - [13] Originally by: Valeryia "Servers are just PCs"? Are you a frickin idiot? No they are not like PCs at all. Yes, yes they are. Theres not much difference at all. Case Motherboard CPU HDD RAM ****ty GPU for remote desktop OS installation Server rack Connectivity Done.
xXThunder StruckXx	Posted - 2011.07.15 16:14:00 - [14] Originally by: Skaz actually, a server reboot in 12 minutes for something that then handles 30-50 thousand users? Sounds rather impressive... Brown nose
Odium Eternus	Posted - 2011.07.15 16:14:00 - [15] Originally by: TriadSte Please can you tell me/us why it takes 12 minutes to reboot the server? Servers are just PCs yes? PCs with 12 minute boot times? Tell us the truth? We ain't kids and frankly tired of the standard CCP lie thesedays. hahahaha .... this guy thinks a SERVER takes the same time his ******ed PC takes to restart. Child, please, for the love of everyone on earth, do yourself a favor and get educated. If you are going to post something as stupid about something you have no idea what you are talking about then at least make it seem like you actually wanted to troll. Get educated in computers more plz.
Asm Khurelem	Posted - 2011.07.15 16:16:00 - [16] Originally by: TriadSte Originally by: Valeryia "Servers are just PCs"? Are you a frickin idiot? No they are not like PCs at all. Yes, yes they are. Theres not much difference at all. Case Motherboard CPU HDD RAM ****ty GPU for remote desktop OS installation Server rack Connectivity Done. Or no GPU, and SSH :D
Joran Orduvium Gallente Navy of Xoc The Remnant Legion	Posted - 2011.07.15 16:16:00 - [17] Any chance of a roll back to Quantum Rise while you reeboot please. ty bollox
TriadSte Gallente	Posted - 2011.07.15 16:17:00 - [18] Originally by: Odium Eternus Originally by: TriadSte Please can you tell me/us why it takes 12 minutes to reboot the server? Servers are just PCs yes? PCs with 12 minute boot times? Tell us the truth? We ain't kids and frankly tired of the standard CCP lie thesedays. hahahaha .... this guy thinks a SERVER takes the same time his ******ed PC takes to restart. Child, please, for the love of everyone on earth, do yourself a favor and get educated. If you are going to post something as stupid about something you have no idea what you are talking about then at least make it seem like you actually wanted to troll. Get educated in computers more plz. Work in IT, cry more. You make yourself look like a real noob when YOU think you know when you dont....clearly. A server is the same as a PC hardware wise. Maybe your using a Xeon instead of an I7 but meh thats the only difference other than whats already been posted by myself and others. If a server takes 12 minutes to BOOT its got some serious fecking issues, best health check that puppy!
Sonya Kranz	Posted - 2011.07.15 16:18:00 - [19] Originally by: xXThunder StruckXx Originally by: Skaz actually, a server reboot in 12 minutes for something that then handles 30-50 thousand users? Sounds rather impressive... Brown nose I think that unless you have a thorough understanding of databases and workings of servers ppl should keep their mouth shut tbh.
Narl' Amhar	Posted - 2011.07.15 16:20:00 - [20] Just like a PC. Somebody probably misplaced the external USB drive the database is running on which explains the delay.

Gypsy RoseLee	Posted - 2011.07.15 16:22:00 - [21] Originally by: TriadSte Work in IT, cry more. You make yourself look like a real noob when YOU think you know when you dont....clearly. A server is the same as a PC hardware wise. Maybe your using a Xeon instead of an I7 but meh thats the only difference other than whats already been posted by myself and others. If a server takes 12 minutes to BOOT its got some serious fecking issues, best health check that puppy! Please please tell me who you work for in their IT dept. I would place a short sell order on their stock based entirely on the fact that they were clueless enough to employ you.
Skaz Minmatar Skazmanian Industries	Posted - 2011.07.15 16:24:00 - [22] Originally by: xXThunder StruckXx Originally by: Skaz actually, a server reboot in 12 minutes for something that then handles 30-50 thousand users? Sounds rather impressive... Brown nose And you're an idiot. Tell me don't those BIG numbers compared to those two digit numbers actually look impressive? Not everything is brown nosing you lamer....sometimes CCP actually does stuff right. And sometimes they fail miserably like with these database issues, 4 crashes in like 24 hours isn't acceptable, not before a weekend. - - PINK PINK PINK PINK
Shiria Amaria Gallente Aliastra	Posted - 2011.07.15 16:25:00 - [23] Originally by: Gypsy RoseLee Originally by: TriadSte Work in IT, cry more. You make yourself look like a real noob when YOU think you know when you dont....clearly. A server is the same as a PC hardware wise. Maybe your using a Xeon instead of an I7 but meh thats the only difference other than whats already been posted by myself and others. If a server takes 12 minutes to BOOT its got some serious fecking issues, best health check that puppy! Please please tell me who you work for in their IT dept. I would place a short sell order on their stock based entirely on the fact that they were clueless enough to employ you. that posts make me love you m'thinks =D
Miss Zero	Posted - 2011.07.15 16:25:00 - [24] Edited by: Miss Zero on 15/07/2011 16:28:20 Edited by: Miss Zero on 15/07/2011 16:27:33 Edited by: Miss Zero on 15/07/2011 16:26:54 Originally by: TriadSte Please can you tell me/us why it takes 12 minutes to reboot the server? Servers are just PCs yes? PCs with 12 minute boot times? Tell us the truth? We ain't kids and frankly tired of the standard CCP lie thesedays. EVE doesn't run on a server, it runs on a cluster. IIRC, the EVE cluster is actually made up of over 150 servers. If they are actually rebooting all of this hardware (very unlikely) in one go, I'd say 12 minutes was actually very fast. I highly doubt that this is what they are doing. More likely, they are simply restarting the software or rebooting trouble nodes individually. Even if they are rebooting the hardware, that is only the first stage of the process. The software also has to load up and be confirmed working before connections can be allowed from us. The EVE cluster runs on Windows SQL Server and any one here who's worked in IT with Microsoft software for any length of time will tell you that just one Microsoft Exchange server can sometimes take 20 minutes before it's all fully available to service requests (and that's after the hardware has rebooted.) Now take into account that most of those servers will have an instance of SQL running on them that needs to talk to all the others before any of us can connect and you begin to see just how complex a process "rebooting the server" really is.
TriadSte Gallente	Posted - 2011.07.15 16:33:00 - [25] Originally by: Gypsy RoseLee Please please tell me who you work for in their IT dept. I would place a short sell order on their stock based entirely on the fact that they were clueless enough to employ you. I'm actually very good at my job, many thanks for the sarcasm though. unlike most people in this thread that don't have those grey cells ;) to understand that a server is a desktop PC in a slimline case ready for rack mounting. Hardware is 95% the same, only big differences is what OS its running, Not exactly gonna run EVE on a windows 7 Os are ya :P
Morganta	Posted - 2011.07.15 16:34:00 - [26] large sql databases take time to restart and mount the datafiles and server is misleading, its a farm. parts of it control access, parts of it track whats happening in the game in realtime, parts of it handle transactions with the DB and parts of it is the DB. and all are typically independent systems working in unison, so while the access servers may go down and prevent logins, the game and db servers could be fine and people could be ingame blissfully unaware there is a problem. then you have the nodes.... anyhow suffice to say its very complex and does not boot up like your PC
Kunming Amarr T.H.U.G L.I.F.E	Posted - 2011.07.15 16:36:00 - [27] The hamsters.. they need to be fed u know!
Simetraz	Posted - 2011.07.15 16:50:00 - [28] Your trolling for no reason OP. Yes PC's and Servers are based on the same technology and for the most part they share the same component in a broad sense. Actually booting the hardware is a fairly quick deal, unless you are dealing with a sun server then the game changes. However the real time eater is the software. Depending on the OS and the software that needs to be running in order to do it job this can take anywhere from a minute to 1/2 hour. Keep in mind we are not talking about a single server or a single PC either. We are talking a cluster which eats up more time. Then even after they boot it up and everything is running they are going to double check a few things before they let you play on it. If you ever had to do it, 12 minutes passes by before you even know it.
Miss Zero	Posted - 2011.07.15 16:51:00 - [29] Edited by: Miss Zero on 15/07/2011 16:53:08 Originally by: TriadSte Originally by: Gypsy RoseLee Please please tell me who you work for in their IT dept. I would place a short sell order on their stock based entirely on the fact that they were clueless enough to employ you. I'm actually very good at my job, many thanks for the sarcasm though. unlike most people in this thread that don't have those grey cells ;) to understand that a server is a desktop PC in a slimline case ready for rack mounting. Hardware is 95% the same, only big differences is what OS its running, Not exactly gonna run EVE on a windows 7 Os are ya :P I don't mean to be argumentative here but you are talking rubbish my friend. Sure, the basic concept of a server is very much the same as a PC but the reality is very different and has been for many years. Take a look at a standard HP DL380 G7 and watch it boot up for yourself. It takes roughly 5 minutes before you even get to booting the OS. The motherboard BIOS has to go through all its hardware health checks (RAM, CPU, PSUs, fan speed, etc.) Most servers have more than one of everything for redundancy these days too. Next you have all the BIOSes for any other hardware cards installed in the system: RAID controllers, fibre channel HBAs, extra NICs, etc. It's not until this whole process has completed that the OS even begins to load. Add the load times of the OS and extra software needed to run a server that does anything other than serve files and it could well take 12 minutes to reboot one server.
TriadSte Gallente	Posted - 2011.07.15 17:00:00 - [30] No arguments from me, I'm not denying your correct just stating that hardware wise its 95% the same. I never argued anything about software. CCP should be a little better at explaining downtimes because to me server means server not the entire farm of servers



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