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CCP Gargant C C P C C P Alliance 18	Posted - 2012.09.19 14:39:00 - [1] - Quote CCP Illurkall has a new dev blog available for your viewing pleasure which details the changes coming to the API system this fall. Illurkall is the overseer of the API for the foreseeable future and will make sure it is up to snuff. You can read all about it here We would be delighted to receive your (constructive) feedback in this thread. CCP Gargant \| Community Representitive

ChromeStriker The Riot Formation Executive Outcomes 232	Posted - 2012.09.19 14:43:00 - [2] - Quote First - Nulla Curas
Peter Powers Terrorists of Dimensions Free 2 Play 89	Posted - 2012.09.19 14:45:00 - [3] - Quote CCP Gargant wrote: CCP Illurkall has a new dev blog available for your viewing pleasure which details the changes coming to the API system this fall. Illurkall is the overseer of the API for the foreseeable future and will make sure it is up to snuff. You can read all about it here We would be delighted to receive your (constructive) feedback in this thread. can CCP Illurkall please post in this thread so we can LIKE his post? 3rdPartyEve.net - your catalogue for 3rd party applications
Ferria Among the Shadows Silent Infinity 7	Posted - 2012.09.19 14:49:00 - [4] - Quote any news on Crest?

CCP Atlas C C P C C P Alliance 191	Posted - 2012.09.19 14:59:00 - [5] - Quote Ferria wrote: any news on Crest? Here's a recent update from CCP Seagull


Chribba Otherworld Enterprises Otherworld Empire 4863	Posted - 2012.09.19 14:59:00 - [6] - Quote Sweepin' in with DUST! GÿàGÿàGÿà Secure 3rd party service GÿàGÿàGÿà Visit my in-game channel 'Holy Veldspar' Follow me on Twitter @Chribba

Captain Thunk Sniggerdly Pandemic Legion 124	Posted - 2012.09.19 15:01:00 - [7] - Quote CAKs fail to encompass the abilities of its predecessor the legacy API key. A full legacy key allows access to everything available with the account, with a CAK you are limited to 1 char, All chars or 1 Corp. This means to equal 1 full legacy key you will need upto 4 CAKs per account. 1 CAK for all the chars and if there are 3 chars, each a director or CEO of a different corp then 1 CAK for each of them. There is no reason for this backwards step, you can maintain the ~security~ CAKs are meant to achieve and still have an option to access ALL data for those that want it.
iskflakes Magnets Inc. 64	Posted - 2012.09.19 15:06:00 - [8] - Quote Captain Thunk wrote: CAKs fail to encompass the abilities of its predecessor the legacy API key. A full legacy key allows access to everything available with the account, with a CAK you are limited to 1 char, All chars or 1 Corp. This means to equal 1 full legacy key you will need upto 4 CAKs per account. 1 CAK for all the chars and if there are 3 chars, each a director or CEO of a different corp then 1 CAK for each of them. There is no reason for this backwards step, you can maintain the ~security~ CAKs are meant to achieve and still have an option to access ALL data for those that want it. Doesn't seem like a big problem to me -- just make 4 CAKs. How often do you have 3 different corporation directors on a single account anyway? I am pleased to see this dev blog change. There is no reason to support legacy systems forever and plenty of time has passed now. Also, as member of the HTTPS fanclub it's great to see you requiring it going forward. If any API developers read this, could we maybe get a relaxation of the cache time on the assets API? For my particular application I would like to request asset data more frequently than once every 6 (?) hours. The long cache time is probably the single biggest source of complaints amongst my users. Track your wealth with EVE Stats: https://ohheck.co.uk/EVEStats/home.php
Promiscuous Female GBS Logistics and Fives Support Goonswarm Federation 189	Posted - 2012.09.19 15:09:00 - [9] - Quote Captain Thunk wrote: CAKs fail to encompass the abilities of its predecessor the legacy API key. A full legacy key allows access to everything available with the account, with a CAK you are limited to 1 char, All chars or 1 Corp. This means to equal 1 full legacy key you will need upto 4 CAKs per account. 1 CAK for all the chars and if there are 3 chars, each a director or CEO of a different corp then 1 CAK for each of them. There is no reason for this backwards step, you can maintain the ~security~ CAKs are meant to achieve and still have an option to access ALL data for those that want it. read: "Even though months and months have passed I have been too lazy to update our software; now that the plug is getting pulled I am shitting myself continuously at the prospect of having to rewrite all my code in the span of 2 weeks"
Tork Norand Mechanical Eagles Inc. The Ancients. 114	Posted - 2012.09.19 15:12:00 - [10] - Quote What? No pretty pictures or graphs? Not even one showing something like....how many new keys were generated from the time they were offered? --Tork. CEO and Herder of Cats.

Captain Thunk Sniggerdly Pandemic Legion 124	Posted - 2012.09.19 15:15:00 - [11] - Quote Promiscuous Female wrote: Captain Thunk wrote: CAKs fail to encompass the abilities of its predecessor the legacy API key. A full legacy key allows access to everything available with the account, with a CAK you are limited to 1 char, All chars or 1 Corp. This means to equal 1 full legacy key you will need upto 4 CAKs per account. 1 CAK for all the chars and if there are 3 chars, each a director or CEO of a different corp then 1 CAK for each of them. There is no reason for this backwards step, you can maintain the ~security~ CAKs are meant to achieve and still have an option to access ALL data for those that want it. read: "Even though months and months have passed I have been too lazy to update our software; now that the plug is getting pulled I am shitting myself continuously at the prospect of having to rewrite all my code in the span of 2 weeks" It takes about 3 lines to make use of new keys. The reason I haven't done so is because, guess what, like I said in my first post - CAKs are not as good as a full legacy key.
iskflakes Magnets Inc. 64	Posted - 2012.09.19 15:16:00 - [12] - Quote Tork Norand wrote: What? No pretty pictures or graphs? Not even one showing something like....how many new keys were generated from the time they were offered? I created a key a moment ago and it gave me the ID: 1327730. The lowest ID I've seen personally is ~5000, and I have observed that creating keys in quick succession gives them consecutive key IDs. So, it's pretty easy to estimate the number of keys ever created at about 1.3 million. Not bad! Track your wealth with EVE Stats: https://ohheck.co.uk/EVEStats/home.php

CCP illurkall C C P C C P Alliance 2	Posted - 2012.09.19 15:20:00 - [13] - Quote Hey I'll try to make my next DevBlog look a little bit more happy with pictures and all. The reason for doing this is mainly an effort to keep the legacy to a minimum and making it easy for us to move forward. Because if we can move forward more freely that just means more stuff for you guys in the end.

Tanaka Aiko ICE is Coming to EVE Goonswarm Federation 113	Posted - 2012.09.19 15:27:00 - [14] - Quote I clicked on devblog link hoping for CREST news, left disappointed.
Akrasjel Lanate Naquatech Conglomerate 769	Posted - 2012.09.19 15:56:00 - [15] - Quote Cool
Promiscuous Female GBS Logistics and Fives Support Goonswarm Federation 191	Posted - 2012.09.19 16:25:00 - [16] - Quote Captain Thunk wrote: Promiscuous Female wrote: Captain Thunk wrote: CAKs fail to encompass the abilities of its predecessor the legacy API key. A full legacy key allows access to everything available with the account, with a CAK you are limited to 1 char, All chars or 1 Corp. This means to equal 1 full legacy key you will need upto 4 CAKs per account. 1 CAK for all the chars and if there are 3 chars, each a director or CEO of a different corp then 1 CAK for each of them. There is no reason for this backwards step, you can maintain the ~security~ CAKs are meant to achieve and still have an option to access ALL data for those that want it. read: "Even though months and months have passed I have been too lazy to update our software; now that the plug is getting pulled I am shitting myself continuously at the prospect of having to rewrite all my code in the span of 2 weeks" It takes about 3 lines to make use of new keys. The reason I haven't done so is because, guess what, like I said in my first post - CAKs are not as good as a full legacy key. your fault for writing code that relies on a goofy edge case instead of developing a proper application fortunately for you they aren't actually shutting down old keys, just making it impossible to generate additional legacy keys, so you probably got another couple of months before you have to get off your ass and change "3 lines" of code
Captain Thunk Sniggerdly Pandemic Legion 126	Posted - 2012.09.19 16:33:00 - [17] - Quote Promiscuous Female wrote: Captain Thunk wrote: Promiscuous Female wrote: Captain Thunk wrote: CAKs fail to encompass the abilities of its predecessor the legacy API key. A full legacy key allows access to everything available with the account, with a CAK you are limited to 1 char, All chars or 1 Corp. This means to equal 1 full legacy key you will need upto 4 CAKs per account. 1 CAK for all the chars and if there are 3 chars, each a director or CEO of a different corp then 1 CAK for each of them. There is no reason for this backwards step, you can maintain the ~security~ CAKs are meant to achieve and still have an option to access ALL data for those that want it. read: "Even though months and months have passed I have been too lazy to update our software; now that the plug is getting pulled I am shitting myself continuously at the prospect of having to rewrite all my code in the span of 2 weeks" It takes about 3 lines to make use of new keys. The reason I haven't done so is because, guess what, like I said in my first post - CAKs are not as good as a full legacy key. your fault for writing code that relies on a goofy edge case instead of developing a proper application fortunately for you they aren't actually shutting down old keys, just making it impossible to generate additional legacy keys, so you probably got another couple of months before you have to get off your ass and change "3 lines" of code I did the changes 12 months ago, I simply disabled it because instead of asking for multiple keys and doing the necessary checking to make sure all have been entered I could just stick to 1 legacy key as it's just much better. It was originally written when CAK didn't exist, so your spouting about "developing a proper application" is just stupid nonsense being spewed by a kid who just collected his Basic Computing certificate last week. Shutting down legacy API at this juncture serves no purpose other than to supply reason for a devblog. It's a system that happily runs itself and no-one is planning on adding anything to the API or working on it in any manner as all efforts are concentrated on CREST. My only crime is that I am one of the few people who actually use all of the available API which is why hoopleheads such as yourself keep spouting rubbish about "should have updated" oblivious to the limitations that CAK pose compared to their predecessor.
Sentient Blade Walk It Off LEGIO ASTARTES ARCANUM 482	Posted - 2012.09.19 16:51:00 - [18] - Quote Now if only there was JSON...
Promiscuous Female GBS Logistics and Fives Support Goonswarm Federation 191	Posted - 2012.09.19 16:59:00 - [19] - Quote Captain Thunk wrote: I did the changes 12 months ago, I simply disabled it because instead of asking for multiple keys and doing the necessary checking to make sure all have been entered I could just stick to 1 legacy key as it's just much better. It was originally written when CAK didn't exist, so your spouting about "developing a proper application" is just stupid nonsense being spewed by a kid who just collected his Basic Computing certificate last week. Shutting down legacy API at this juncture serves no purpose other than to supply reason for a devblog. It's a system that happily runs itself and no-one is planning on adding anything to the API or working on it in any manner as all efforts are concentrated on CREST. My only crime is that I am one of the few people who actually use all of the available API which is why hoopleheads such as yourself keep spouting rubbish about "should have updated" oblivious to the limitations that CAK pose compared to their predecessor. that's an awful lot of :words: for "i'm too lazy to update my application" also i guess you missed the locations, charactername, and contracts api stuff that they added after announcing crest
Hatsumi Kobayashi Sniggerdly Pandemic Legion 205	Posted - 2012.09.19 17:33:00 - [20] - Quote CCP illurkall wrote: Hey I'll try to make my next DevBlog look a little bit more happy with pictures and all. The reason for doing this is mainly an effort to keep the legacy to a minimum and making it easy for us to move forward. Because if we can move forward more freely that just means more stuff for you guys in the end. CAKs are a step backward. CAUTION SNIGGS

Captain Thunk Sniggerdly Pandemic Legion 127	Posted - 2012.09.19 17:36:00 - [21] - Quote Promiscuous Female wrote: that's an awful lot of :words: for "i'm too lazy to update my application" also i guess you missed the locations, charactername, and contracts api stuff that they added after announcing crest I remember back when Goons could troll well Now it's all generic paint-by-numbers nonsense.
Steve Ronuken Fuzzwork Enterprises 655	Posted - 2012.09.19 17:37:00 - [22] - Quote Hatsumi Kobayashi wrote: CCP illurkall wrote: Hey I'll try to make my next DevBlog look a little bit more happy with pictures and all. The reason for doing this is mainly an effort to keep the legacy to a minimum and making it easy for us to move forward. Because if we can move forward more freely that just means more stuff for you guys in the end. CAKs are a step backward. You mean how they introduced functionality that the legacy keys didn't have? Namely the ability to limit what you're handing someone, so, for example, you don't need to give your killboard a key that has access to anything other than your kill data? Yes, Captain Thunk is right that it removed one bit of functionality. But it's one that's /easily/ simulated, with 4 keys. What it added was impossible with the legacy system. FuzzWork Enterprises http://www.fuzzwork.co.uk/ Blueprint calculator, invention chance calculator, isk/m3 Ore chart-á and other 'useful' utilities.
Promiscuous Female GBS Logistics and Fives Support Goonswarm Federation 191	Posted - 2012.09.19 17:44:00 - [23] - Quote you can hardly call "3 ceo characters on one account" to be typical usage and worth stringing along an old, insecure system whose only other redeeming feature was making it easy to determine whether a person is worth scamming
Promiscuous Female GBS Logistics and Fives Support Goonswarm Federation 191	Posted - 2012.09.19 17:45:00 - [24] - Quote and the new system is just as easy because you can just hand them a CreatePredefined link and 90% of people won't bother looking at the checkboxes
Promiscuous Female GBS Logistics and Fives Support Goonswarm Federation 191	Posted - 2012.09.19 17:45:00 - [25] - Quote but seriously you've had how many months? to cut your system over and you're choosing just now to complain
Captain Thunk Sniggerdly Pandemic Legion 127	Posted - 2012.09.19 17:48:00 - [26] - Quote You like posting don't you? I can tell.
Andski GoonWaffe Goonswarm Federation 4764	Posted - 2012.09.19 18:00:00 - [27] - Quote too bad thunk is actually right since getting corp data requires a corp director key, as opposed to being able to use, say, a junior accountant key to get wallet data through the API, which was possible with the legacy keys please leave
Kearl Sniggerdly Pandemic Legion 2	Posted - 2012.09.19 18:43:00 - [28] - Quote Id say the dev working on this project is a bit better at lurking then actually responding. +1 for Thunk This change makes it easier for scammers/crooks and harder for people trying to catch them.
Liang Nuren Heretic Army Heretic Nation 2245	Posted - 2012.09.19 19:37:00 - [29] - Quote CCP illurkall wrote: Hey I'll try to make my next DevBlog look a little bit more happy with pictures and all. The reason for doing this is mainly an effort to keep the legacy to a minimum and making it easy for us to move forward. Because if we can move forward more freely that just means more stuff for you guys in the end. Hey, fantastic blog and good changes. Thanks! -Liang Normally on 5:00 -> 9-10:00 Eve (Aus TZ?) Blog: http://liangnuren.wordpress.com PVP Videos: http://www.youtube.com/user/LiangNuren/videos Twitter: http://twitter.com/LiangNuren
87102-6 Republic Military School Minmatar Republic 0	Posted - 2012.09.19 21:43:00 - [30] - Quote Oh dear. It appears to me someone (likely multiple people) at CCP haven't thought this all the way through. I see this time and time again in the actual IT industry as a whole, so I'm not too surprised. I'm a UNIX SA / NA by profession (almost 20 years worth) so I hope what I say holds some weight. Before I get started, I want to make something crystal clear: I'm not here to talk about the API semantics or the actual API protocol. I know nothing of it therefore am staying away from that topic. What I am going to talk about pertains to 1) use of HTTPS, and 2) the redirections proposed circa 2012/10/04. 1. Use of HTTPS (that is HTTP + SSL) has one major drawback which many administrators overlook: things like caching proxies cannot cache the data. Instead, it then becomes the HTTP client's responsibility to handle caching. This means quite simply that every HTTP request has to return data; things like ETag negotiation (used for caching) don't work well with HTTPS. Combine that with the added SSL overhead and you've got something that uses a lot more bandwidth for something that's probably doesn't need SSL. And don't even get me started on the SSL cert ordeal -- CCP has historically forgotten to renew their certificates many times in the past: http://community.eveonline.com/ingameboard.asp?a=topic&threadID=791627 http://www.eve-search.com/thread/909495-0/page/1 Basically whenever people start advocating use of SSL without providing full 100% justification up front, I am left with the impression that there is probably no justification for it. Instead it's "security through paranoia". What exactly gets transmit, API-wise, between client and server that mandates use of SSL? All I'm able to tell from the official API Functions wiki document is that the client's HTTP GET params connsist of a "userID" and "apiKey". So let's say there's a MITM attack going on, or someone capturing plaintext HTTP packets. They can get a user's user ID and API key. And what exactly does that get them? The API Key management page states quite clearly the following: Quote: Is this safe? Can someone steal my account? It is safe to provide your API key to applications and web sites as long as you are prepared to allow the application or web site to see your character and corporation information. You can specify which information is accessible for each customizable API key. Sharing an API key does NOT give people access to your account while sharing your account password would. Therein lies the whole purpose of API keys. An API key only allows the recipient to view your character and corporation data but gives them NO control over it. They are NOT able to log in to the game or post on the forums with the API information. No part of the API key information is in any way generated from your account password - there is no way to calculate your password using this information. So based on this, it appears to me that about all a person could do is then gain access to the information provided by the API -- none of which involves transactions of money/finances, or ability to change character data, nor does it have anything to do with actual EVE accounts (as in the accounting part). So again: why SSL? Politely: justify it. Unless you plan on extending the API to allow people to make changes in some way, I just don't see the point. Now for the 2nd item: 2. Redirections. The dev blog post specifically states, quote: Quote: ... http://api.eve-online.com and http://api.eveonline.com will be permanently redirected to https://api.eveonline.com ... This is a very, very bad idea from a protocol perspective. You are making a blind assumption that the clients using the HTTP (non-SSL) semantics have support for SSL. That is a very, VERY bad assumption. Let me expand: If you redirect clients blindly from a plaintext HTTP protocol (on TCP port 80) to an encrypted HTTP protocol (on TCP port 443), and the client does not support SSL, the client submitting the API request will break. Badly. Very, very badly. The same problem applies if the client does not honour HTTP 3xx redirection status codes (for example, libcurl can be adjusted to not follow these, and things like perl's LWP do not necessarily follow redirections blindly.). In either case, the client will throw back a generic protocol error to the user (assuming the client has error checking code in it that's even remotely decent -- others might just downright crash). Then there's the issue of CommonName support (SSL cert-wise) when doing an HTTP-to-HTTPS redirect. Client which supports SSL visits http://api.eveonline.com/ and gets redirected to https://api.eve-online.com/ (note the hyphen). The client's SSL library may result in a certificate verification failure, since the requesting Host of api.eveonline.com does not match the CommonName of api.eve-online.com. What the client sends and what the server's SSL cert contains CommonName-wise need to match: ALWAYS. My professional recommendation: don't redirect anything. Just simply shut down the non-SSL services (disable them in your load balancer, etc.) entirely. This will result in a clean failure for clients which need to be upgraded. Don't respond to the TCP SYN that comes in to TCP port 80 (or if you want, return TCP RST / ICMP port unreachable). Let the client handle that situation cleanly, and force the client authors to switch the API URL in their software. It's really the best choice here. Hope this gives you and your SAs something to think about, because from what I can tell, som...

Dersen Lowery Knavery Inc. StructureDamage 95	Posted - 2012.09.19 21:54:00 - [31] - Quote 87102-6 wrote: So again: why SSL? Politely: justify it. Unless you plan on extending the API to allow people to make changes in some way, I just don't see the point. CCP has discussed this as a possibility, particularly in terms of corp management and updating the skill queue. Nothing has been (revealed as) decided yet, but if SSL keeps the option open then that's explanation enough, for now.
Steve Ronuken Fuzzwork Enterprises 657	Posted - 2012.09.19 22:01:00 - [32] - Quote I don't /want/ people to cache the data. As I've seen too many caching proxies screw stuff up. And I'd prefer not to send credentials, even read only ones, clear text. FuzzWork Enterprises http://www.fuzzwork.co.uk/ Blueprint calculator, invention chance calculator, isk/m3 Ore chart-á and other 'useful' utilities.
Dawiid BenAimaic Dasa Fern Valley Jamaican Rum Transport Corp 40	Posted - 2012.09.20 00:15:00 - [33] - Quote I like the API, I use it with several 3rd party applications, phone apps, websites and with Google docs I have 10 spreadsheets with 10 to 20 pages each that make extensive use of the ImportXML command. Legacy keys can be a personal choice. I choose not to use them. It does not seem prudent to alienate your customers who do choose to use them. Converting to HTTPS for read only data which is authenticated only by a token pair does not make sense, there is zero benefit and much harm. Your API server does not enjoy 100% uptime, the downtime translates to a demand for caching proxie servers. I do not use a caching proxie server but when the API is down, I am unable to play the game for i am unable to make informed decisions. Setting up a caching proxie server was on my to do list because of your unreliability. If you have future plans to allow making changes in game using the API, I would respectfully suggest that you use the client user interface to make changes to in game values. I appreciate your letting me lookup names by TypeID but it would be nice to have an API that returns TypeId for names. My current workaround is using an SQL Query on data in EveHQ.
Kaaletram Lothyrawir Trust Brothers LLC. The Veyr Collective 10	Posted - 2012.09.20 00:48:00 - [34] - Quote This might just be a pipe dream but is there any chance of adding access to War Reports to the API? or be able to compile them for viewing via 3rd party apps?

CCP Explorer C C P C C P Alliance 908	Posted - 2012.09.20 01:51:00 - [35] - Quote Tanaka Aiko wrote: I clicked on devblog link hoping for CREST news, left disappointed. This was indirectly CREST news, we are cleaning up legacy to be able to deploy the initial CREST framework and start the long transition from the API to CREST. Erlendur S. Thorsteinsson \| Software Director \| EVE Online, CCP Games \| Follow on: Twitter / Google+

Kossaw Body Count Inc. Pandemic Legion 55	Posted - 2012.09.20 03:46:00 - [36] - Quote Promiscuous Female wrote: but seriously you've had how many months? to cut your system over and you're choosing just now to complain Well I'm really pleased for you that you've had the luxury of writing your own high quality object orientated code, have been able to keep it completely up to date and now only need to change 3 lines of code. For the rest of us, stuck with maintaining ****** legacy code written by inbred morons (who think an object is something they hit with a hammer) and who have been quietly working away for the last 6 months aware that this issue was coming.... Well WE WOULD APPRECIATE SOME MORE F*CKING NOTICE THAN 2 WEEKS. We would also like CCP to fix the MASSIVE functionality hole that allows a user to change their CAK after they registered it with our web sites, thereby completely gimping a host of security precautions. (and yes, it was bug reported and commented on extensively with a few weeks of the "new" API Key system being released) https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=17150&p=2 WTB : An image in my signature
Kossaw Body Count Inc. Pandemic Legion 55	Posted - 2012.09.20 03:49:00 - [37] - Quote Promiscuous Female wrote: you can hardly call "3 ceo characters on one account" to be typical usage and worth stringing along an old, insecure system whose only other redeeming feature was making it easy to determine whether a person is worth scamming The "old" system is in NO WAY insecure. It is however more functional if you are the guy writing the application code. WTB : An image in my signature
Magic Crisp Amarrian Micro Devices Silent Infinity 40	Posted - 2012.09.20 06:55:00 - [38] - Quote Just a sidenote. I know that consistency is not really CCP's cup of tea, but you should use the ISO8601 timezone format, like the website does on most place. It'd make it a lot more consistence, and readable. these randomly ordered formats are a pain, that's why we've got a wordwide standard for it.
Golden Gnu EVE University Ivy League 67	Posted - 2012.09.20 07:48:00 - [39] - Quote @CCP Explorer Transition: The process or a period of changing from one state or condition to another So you want to kill the API as well? I do not understand why on earth you continue to invalidate all the work the community have put into improving the eve experiences. A lot of older applications, that are no longer maintained, will be useless after you remove the old API keys. If you move away from the current API, even more will follow. IMHO 3rd party apps adds value to eve. You should support us - not fight us... jEveAssets already moved to CAKe, but, I still get people who can not figure out they need a separate corporation key. @Magic Crisp Do not ask that kind of question - do you have any idea how much trouble it would cause if they changed the time format Download is the meaning of life, upload is the meaning of intelligent life http://eve.nikr.net - home of jEveAssets
Captain Thunk Sniggerdly Pandemic Legion 129	Posted - 2012.09.20 08:50:00 - [40] - Quote Golden Gnu wrote: jEveAssets already moved to CAKe, but, I still get people who can not figure out they need a separate corporation key. This is the problem (not the altering of code). Explaining to people that they've just entered a key but it's detected that it needs more just to maintain the same level of service they are used to with Legacy keys. And you have to check the validity of the key on every use because the user might have gone back to the Eve website and changed the privileges for the key.


CCP Explorer C C P C C P Alliance 908	Posted - 2012.09.20 10:14:00 - [41] - Quote Golden Gnu wrote: @CCP Explorer Transition: The process or a period of changing from one state or condition to another So you want to kill the API as well? I do not understand why on earth you continue to invalidate all the work the community have put into improving the eve experiences. A lot of older applications, that are no longer maintained, will be useless after you remove the old API keys. If you move away from the current API, even more will follow. IMHO 3rd party apps adds value to eve. You should support us - not fight us... No timeframe has been decided, but we are probably looking at 3-5 years from the time CREST comes online. The reasons we have to deprecate old tech to move forward are really detailed in this dev blog http://community.eveonline.com/devblog.asp?a=blog&nbid=1777 I wrote in 2009. Even if it's about minimum OS requirements then the same underlying principles apply here. Erlendur S. Thorsteinsson \| Software Director \| EVE Online, CCP Games \| Follow on: Twitter / Google+

Steve Ronuken Fuzzwork Enterprises 657	Posted - 2012.09.20 10:57:00 - [42] - Quote Dawiid BenAimaic wrote: I appreciate your letting me lookup names by TypeID but it would be nice to have an API that returns TypeId for names. My current workaround is using an SQL Query on data in EveHQ. edit: http://wiki.eve-id.net/APIv2_Eve_CharacterID_XML It's a non-documented use, but it should work. Though has problems with some things. alternate (which I whipped up) http://www.fuzzwork.co.uk/api/typeid.php?typename=Tritanium http://www.fuzzwork.co.uk/api/typeid.php?typename=Tritanium&format=xml FuzzWork Enterprises http://www.fuzzwork.co.uk/ Blueprint calculator, invention chance calculator, isk/m3 Ore chart-á and other 'useful' utilities.
Golden Gnu EVE University Ivy League 67	Posted - 2012.09.21 11:31:00 - [43] - Quote @CCP Explorer Thank you for your reply (to my somewhat angry post) Time is not really in you favor. The longer you wait, the more apps will be created using the current API. Knowing in advance is great, but, it will not save stuff that are no longer maintained. Unmaintained apps might not move forward, but, they can still be great IMHO. Anyway, enough with the rants. I'm just sad to see programs die with this change... Download is the meaning of life, upload is the meaning of intelligent life http://eve.nikr.net - home of jEveAssets
Steve Ronuken Fuzzwork Enterprises 659	Posted - 2012.09.21 12:46:00 - [44] - Quote Golden Gnu wrote: @CCP Explorer Thank you for your reply (to my somewhat angry post) Time is not really in you favor. The longer you wait, the more apps will be created using the current API. Knowing in advance is great, but, it will not save stuff that are no longer maintained. Unmaintained apps might not move forward, but, they can still be great IMHO. Anyway, enough with the rants. I'm just sad to see programs die with this change... So... Who wants to write a gateway for the api, to convert from legacy keys to CAKs? FuzzWork Enterprises http://www.fuzzwork.co.uk/ Blueprint calculator, invention chance calculator, isk/m3 Ore chart-á and other 'useful' utilities.
Golden Gnu EVE University Ivy League 67	Posted - 2012.09.22 09:25:00 - [45] - Quote @Steve Ronuken Someone that will make me a happy camper Download is the meaning of life, upload is the meaning of intelligent life http://eve.nikr.net - home of jEveAssets
Mars Theran Caldari Provisions Caldari State 295	Posted - 2012.09.23 02:46:00 - [46] - Quote Am I the only one who thinks it weird we're doing Spring cleaning in the Fall? ..aside from that; good idea. Maybe I was actually sleeping in front of my computer and dreamed I posted. Certainly, it's not there now.
Essack Leadae Deep Core Mining Inc. Caldari State 0	Posted - 2012.09.23 17:37:00 - [47] - Quote Maybe CCP should update all help links who are in the creation page of a CAK... It would motive to use this new system... I created one link for research jobs but I clicked to the help button to know how use it. The help tell me to use a userID/apiKey/characterID while I only get an ID (for what ?) and a verification code...
Steve Ronuken Fuzzwork Enterprises 662	Posted - 2012.09.23 17:54:00 - [48] - Quote Essack Leadae wrote: Maybe CCP should update all help links who are in the creation page of a CAK... It would motive to use this new system... I created one link for research jobs but I clicked to the help button to know how use it. The help tell me to use a userID/apiKey/characterID while I only get an ID (for what ?) and a verification code... keyID and vCode You'll still need the character id (which is your own id. http://api.eve-online.com/eve/CharacterID.xml.aspx?names=Steve%20Ronuken gets mine) You can always update the Evelopedia api pages yourself. I tend to update them when I drop by looking. But I don't do that often, so not many are done. FuzzWork Enterprises http://www.fuzzwork.co.uk/ Blueprint calculator, invention chance calculator, isk/m3 Ore chart-á and other 'useful' utilities.
Acac Sunflyier Burning Star L.L.C. 204	Posted - 2012.09.23 19:05:00 - [49] - Quote Would it really be SPRING cleaning? There just isn't anything intresting on the front page of the GD anymore. Yawn!
Steve Ronuken Fuzzwork Enterprises 662	Posted - 2012.09.23 21:06:00 - [50] - Quote Acac Sunflyier wrote: Would it really be SPRING cleaning? They're obviously paying attention to our antipodean Bros. FuzzWork Enterprises http://www.fuzzwork.co.uk/ Blueprint calculator, invention chance calculator, isk/m3 Ore chart-á and other 'useful' utilities.

Dawiid BenAimaic Dasa Fern Valley Jamaican Rum Transport Corp 40	Posted - 2012.09.23 22:07:00 - [51] - Quote about 40% of the importXML statements in Google spreadsheets are not working today.. All my spreadsheets are broken.
Ken Kyoukan 6	Posted - 2012.09.24 18:16:00 - [52] - Quote Dawiid BenAimaic wrote: about 40% of the importXML statements in Google spreadsheets are not working today.. All my spreadsheets are broken. Known google issue, tweak them to the correct https api call and hopefully they will refresh, otherwise drop them to http and let CCP's http to https conversion handle it. The problem is with google docs/drive's import function, it doesn't read the cache until part of the xml as not every xml source uses it, I have been trying to get this corrected but like everything else it takes time. Another method is to append "&day="&today() which forces it to use the day as a reference, this recalculates when you open the sheet but should cache it for that day. A quick example: Importxml("https://api.eveonline.com/eve/TypeName.xml.aspx?ids=34,35&day="&today(),"//@typename") I'm also trying to get some gas (Google Application Script) work done to fix this but as the api is already on it's way out in favor of CREST, it may be safer to wait and see. CCP: CREST / API When will we get a direct cached market listing from the game rather than using the market cache uploaders and in some cases an igb market scanner, which can cause a lot of server stress on the in game market server. At least with a cache you could set cache update timers, and the main game servers can get hit a little less hard for us to get this information. Just for players reference these out of game prices are what eve central, battleclinic, evemon, eft, eve market data, etc all use as do several killboards. All of these require players to keep them updated so much so the current evemon has an inbuilt cache uploader, whilst some marketing sites use an igb rapid scan to read the prices of everything at a speed of 1 second per item. CREST / API could internally cache this at set time intervals directly from the main market server feeds and cut out this whole data chain and the potential game lag it causes. I wouldn't be surprised if the jita player limit didn't rise if this market information was available without the lag of market scanning. Note: I would be happy to discuss this with CCP, CSM & other players.
Herr Nerdstrom Wildly Inappropriate Goonswarm Federation 2	Posted - 2012.09.27 11:58:00 - [53] - Quote Minor point: US and EU read numeric dates in reverse order, so to a US person the dates listed on the blog are actually April of 2012. How about using 4-Oct-2012 to disambiguate?
Ken Kyoukan 6	Posted - 2012.09.28 20:27:00 - [54] - Quote Herr Nerdstrom wrote: Minor point: US and EU read numeric dates in reverse order, so to a US person the dates listed on the blog are actually April of 2012. How about using 4-Oct-2012 to disambiguate? Yes please use the eve format like this forum: Year Month Day Hour Minute (Seconds) It's generic It's the same as the forums and game I can list the custom format for google docs and other spreadsheets on request.
xp3ll3d Deep Core Mining Inc. Caldari State 11	Posted - 2012.10.17 12:12:00 - [55] - Quote One issue with moving EVERYTHING over to HTTPS, are things like profile pictures. HTTPS requests cannot be cached on the client, which means profile images will be downloaded EVERY time you use them in an app, rather than being cached. You might want to think about leaving things like that on HTTP.
hfo df Ramm's RDI Tactical Narcotics Team 10	Posted - 2012.10.17 13:00:00 - [56] - Quote Hi, since the change today i'm getting: Quote: wget https://api.eveonline.com/ --2012-10-17 12:40:40-- https://api.eveonline.com/ Resolving api.eveonline.com... 87.237.39.199 Connecting to api.eveonline.com\|87.237.39.199\|:443... connected. ERROR: cannot verify api.eveonline.comGÇÖs certificate, issued by GÇ£/C=US/O=GeoTrust, Inc./CN=RapidSSL CAGÇ¥: Unable to locally verify the issuerGÇÖs authority. To connect to api.eveonline.com insecurely, use GÇÿ--no-check-certificateGÇÖ. and Quote: javax.net.ssl.SSLHandshakeException: sun.security.validator.ValidatorException: PKIX path building failed: sun.security.provider.certpath.SunCertPathBuilderException: unable to find valid certification path to requested target and Quote: ERROR: The certificate of GÇÿapi.eveonline.comGÇÖ is not trusted. ERROR: The certificate of GÇÿapi.eveonline.comGÇÖ hasn't got a known issuer.
Vaerah Vahrokha Vahrokh Consulting 1940	Posted - 2012.10.17 13:23:00 - [57] - Quote hfo df wrote: Hi, since the change today i'm getting: Quote: wget https://api.eveonline.com/ --2012-10-17 12:40:40-- https://api.eveonline.com/ Resolving api.eveonline.com... 87.237.39.199 Connecting to api.eveonline.com\|87.237.39.199\|:443... connected. ERROR: cannot verify api.eveonline.comGÇÖs certificate, issued by GÇ£/C=US/O=GeoTrust, Inc./CN=RapidSSL CAGÇ¥: Unable to locally verify the issuerGÇÖs authority. To connect to api.eveonline.com insecurely, use GÇÿ--no-check-certificateGÇÖ. and Quote: javax.net.ssl.SSLHandshakeException: sun.security.validator.ValidatorException: PKIX path building failed: sun.security.provider.certpath.SunCertPathBuilderException: unable to find valid certification path to requested target and Quote: ERROR: The certificate of GÇÿapi.eveonline.comGÇÖ is not trusted. ERROR: The certificate of GÇÿapi.eveonline.comGÇÖ hasn't got a known issuer. It's a typical noob mistake when a server admin just flips from http to https without thinking of the consequences. Auditing \| Collateral holding and insurance \| Consulting \| PLEX for Good Charity Twitter channel
Peter Powers Terrorists of Dimensions Free 2 Play 90	Posted - 2012.10.17 14:16:00 - [58] - Quote i can confirm the issue on debian and ubuntu machine, chrome from same machine seems to handle it fine though. however it seems to be an issue with the certificate, not with my machine, since other certs don't cause that error 3rdPartyEve.net - your catalogue for 3rd party applications
Marcel Devereux Aideron Robotics 166	Posted - 2012.10.17 14:20:00 - [59] - Quote The SSL cert issue is affecting every single Aura user right now. I do not want them to have to install a certificate to make it work. Can you guys please get your SSL cert resigned by well know CA?
Peter Powers Terrorists of Dimensions Free 2 Play 90	Posted - 2012.10.17 14:21:00 - [60] - Quote Golden Gnu wrote: A lot of older applications, that are no longer maintained, will be useless after you remove the old API keys. If you move away from the current API, even more will follow. IMHO 3rd party apps adds value to eve. You should support us - not fight us... an application that is no longer maintained does only add value on the surface. its balast to everyone else, and i prefer CCP to modernize stuff, especially after they gave every more than enough time to adopt the new keys. its not CCP's fault if people are abandoning the software they launched. (and its a good reason why such software should be opensource anyways ;) Golden Gnu wrote: jEveAssets already moved to CAKe, but, I still get people who can not figure out they need a separate corporation key. so explain it better to them. 3rdPartyEve.net - your catalogue for 3rd party applications

hfo df Ramm's RDI Tactical Narcotics Team 10	Posted - 2012.10.17 14:58:00 - [61] - Quote Just so you all know. CCP Fixed it for us. So its working agian for our platforms. What the problem was we'll never know, as Gormur (they guy who fixed it) isnt a regular poster ;). Cheers for the fast fix!

CCP Prism X C C P C C P Alliance 959	Posted - 2012.10.17 16:04:00 - [62] - Quote Confirming that this issue was fixed by our very own CCP Major Gormur around 1445 NEST (That's New Eden Standard Time. You should know this!). @CCP_PrismX EVE Database Developer and Expert Ranter Member of Team Pony Express

Vaerah Vahrokha Vahrokh Consulting 1940	Posted - 2012.10.18 08:05:00 - [63] - Quote Peter Powers wrote: an application that is no longer maintained does only add value on the surface. its balast to everyone else, and i prefer CCP to modernize stuff, especially after they gave every more than enough time to adopt the new keys. An application that is still used is still adding value even if it's outdated. Why? Because expecially in legacy products like EvE, the beginning pioneering phase is over, those who stay are long term players. Developing applications is like playing the MMO: the first time it's a challenge, a fresh initiative, even a race on who can create the: "did not know it was possible to do that" applications. Now, 0.0 systems are as stale and discovered as hi sec and the same applies to application. There's much less incentive to write something new when the fun and challenges to do it have all been explored and made routine. The only thing that could push me to write a new app is CCP finally releasing a damn real time markets data feed. ArenaNET did it since beta and their game is supporting 4+ times as many players, it's not impossible. So, go and reinvent warm water and the YAWN umpteenth inventory or trading profit app yourself, it's BORING, it's been done 50 times. EvE is full of close to perfect apps that have worked for years, there's a reason why they say "don't fix what's not broken". Peter Powers wrote: its not CCP's fault if people are abandoning the software they launched. (and its a good reason why such software should be opensource anyways ;) As for people abandoning software: we freeware SW developers write apps for ourselves and then decide to share them. Developing software takes weeks, weeks off our spare time. It's not our fault if other companies work to keep backward compatibility and CCP does not. No, giving NN months to change stuff is not the same as keeping backward compatibility, because it's not breaking news that people have their lives, people stop playing games, people find a new job etc. Not dealing with this is the fault and it's not a freeware developer fault. APIs exist also to develop consistent software. Whole generations of code I developed made use of COM / ActiveX and today, after 10 years they still work despite we are "centuries" away from that now. That was a (cumbersome) "API" that delivered. The whole "web services", "XML" etc. technologies were born to help interoperability but also backward compatibility. They pushed programmers to invest and use those technologies (imposing overhead) yet we still fail to keep compatibility? Peter Powers wrote: and its a good reason why such software should be opensource anyways Most legacy EvE apps are open source. That means NOTHING. Of all the dozens EvE apps I used, only 2 of them have been taken over. Legacy apps use surpassed technology, are hard to recompile, often written for personal use on an immediate need (and thus no documentation, hurried spaghetti coding). Finally, many of them use some commercial components that the original developer purchased for his other works. The application (1 of the 2 I know) I have taken over (EvEIncomeAnalyzer) took longer to find a way to recompile it. If it used commercial components, no way I'd have spent $500 to purchase them . It was written for .net 2.0 with now outdated and contrived code. It had zero documentation, source code had some comments but only on few obscure things, not about explaining what pieces did what. So yes, old software it's open source but open source does not mean it'll find a nerd whose only reason to live is to revive defunct spaghetti code. So yes, 80% of the legacy apps are open source and nobody cares to touch them with a stick, your brilliant reasoning failed. Auditing \| Collateral holding and insurance \| Consulting \| PLEX for Good Charity Twitter channel
Spurty V0LTA Verge of Collapse 512	Posted - 2012.10.18 14:21:00 - [64] - Quote oops, didn't spot this until it was 'headline news'. Updated all my stuffs :o ---- CONCORD arrested two n00bs yesterday, one was drinking battery acid, the other was eating fireworks. They charged one and let the other one off.
CAPTAIN INSAINO Dark-Rising 1	Posted - 2012.10.19 13:11:00 - [65] - Quote Thx for this; i wanted to spend my day off trying to update software that didnt need updating AGAIN What have we won bob, well today ladies and gentlemen we decided we hadnt screwed developers enough by making cack caks or changing pointless db item names 5000000 times so we also tried to move over to https for some extra lol. ccp > well its clearly just a case of adding an 's' amirite??? Old api keys / curl with ssl verify off works lol... (but wait those dont work anymore do they, awesome) New api keys / curl with ssl verify off (dreaming this would work, doesnt...) API ERROR: [https://api.eveonline.com/setKey.xml.aspx] Server Response Error::Not Found New api keys / curl with cainfo set + certIficate A snail could circumvent the globe before batch finishes + Random occurances of : API ERROR: [https://api.eveonline.com/account/Characters.xml.aspx] Server Response Error::Internal Server Error wtf is this? i dont have the time or effort for this bullshit everytime u guys get bored and want to validate ur existance. Hows about actually thinking what your doing is likely to effect the community before doing it
Peter Powers Terrorists of Dimensions Free 2 Play 91	Posted - 2012.10.21 11:52:00 - [66] - Quote Vaerah Vahrokha wrote: Peter Powers wrote: an application that is no longer maintained does only add value on the surface. its balast to everyone else, and i prefer CCP to modernize stuff, especially after they gave every more than enough time to adopt the new keys. An application that is still used is still adding value even if it's outdated. CCP is developing a product, and its totally without reason to expect them to keep 100% backward compatibility just so a few apps that are not maintained anymore keep running. seriously, i think they deal perfectly well with that, i rather see some progress and improvements (like using https, cak, and crest comming) then them supporting something that has been abandoned for ages. Vaerah Vahrokha wrote: As for people abandoning software: we freeware SW developers write apps for ourselves and then decide to share them. Developing software takes weeks, weeks off our spare time. thanks for mentioning that, i would have never guessed. Vaerah Vahrokha wrote: Whole generations of code I developed made use of COM / ActiveX and today, after 10 years they still work despite we are "centuries" away from that now. That was a (cumbersome) "API" that delivered. and the way this is working has created DLL hell, and required an hack as ugly as SxS to keep it going. Windows has a few very dark places, the way BC is achieved is one of them - it's also one of the reasons of windows degrading performance. Vaerah Vahrokha wrote: Legacy apps use surpassed technology, are hard to recompile, often written for personal use on an immediate need (and thus no documentation, hurried spaghetti coding). which introduces bugs, bc compatibility problems, reduced maintainability oh.. and security risks. but yeah, that totally sounds like apps worth keeping. (my answer was much longer, stupid 5 quotes rule). and no just because some apps are opensource AND not maintained anymore that does not make my "reasoning fail". it simply means there hasn't been enough demand for that app - or there will be someone taking over or rebuild it now. 3rdPartyEve.net - your catalogue for 3rd party applications
Snowtigers Claws Solar Wind Test Friends Please Ignore 2	Posted - 2012.10.25 08:07:00 - [67] - Quote Came here wanting to rant about not being able to view current API's or even recently generated ones. Saw the previous 4 pages and decided CCP had lots of problems with their adding an 'S' to the old http.. Going to leave still ranting but with added frustration because.... https://api.eveonline.com > login > pilot name > MENU DOESN'T GIVE AN OPTION TO VIEW CURRENT API'S piece of **** webpage coding on a global internet company gives a bad impression amirite ?
Steve Ronuken Fuzzwork Enterprises 746	Posted - 2012.10.25 09:14:00 - [68] - Quote Snowtigers Claws wrote: Came here wanting to rant about not being able to view current API's or even recently generated ones. Saw the previous 4 pages and decided CCP had lots of problems with their adding an 'S' to the old http.. Going to leave still ranting but with added frustration because.... https://api.eveonline.com > login > pilot name > MENU DOESN'T GIVE AN OPTION TO VIEW CURRENT API'S piece of **** webpage coding on a global internet company gives a bad impression amirite ? https://support.eveonline.com/api It's been that way for months. FuzzWork Enterprises http://www.fuzzwork.co.uk/ Blueprint calculator, invention chance calculator, isk/m3 Ore chart-á and other 'useful' utilities.As well as mysql and CSV/XLS conversions of the Static Data Extract.
Grath Telkin Sniggerdly Pandemic Legion 1179	Posted - 2013.01.01 05:38:00 - [69] - Quote Man this thread is awesome, Thunk was like hey this is broke and some Goon was like NO YOU"RE DOING IT WRONG and Thunk being the API Jedi that he is just went no look you misunderstand and the Goon was like NO YOU'RE DOING IT WRONG and Thunk again calmly waved his hand and said no you see you're not understanding me look here and the Goon was like NO YOU'RE DOING IT WRONG and Thunk said then Andski looked at the other Goon and was like Shut Up Stupid Thunk is a Jedi and then there was silence.
Hammer Legion Member University of Caille Gallente Federation 8	Posted - 2013.01.01 08:11:00 - [70] - Quote Grath Telkin wrote: Man this thread is awesome, Thunk was like hey this is broke and some Goon was like NO YOU"RE DOING IT WRONG and Thunk being the API Jedi that he is just went no look you misunderstand and the Goon was like NO YOU'RE DOING IT WRONG and Thunk again calmly waved his hand and said no you see you're not understanding me look here and the Goon was like NO YOU'RE DOING IT WRONG and Thunk said then Andski looked at the other Goon and was like Shut Up Stupid Thunk is a Jedi and then there was silence. im amazed, even Grath Telkin can he funny if he wants to regards, HML



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