| Pages: [1] :: one page |
| Author |
Thread Statistics | Show CCP posts - 0 post(s) |
UTHAJA
   |
Posted - 2011.08.21 14:56:00 -
[1]
The Stage
a) an asteroid belt in HATAKAMI (one of the current systems under Incursion in the Caldari Border Zone)
b) 4 Combatants 1.) me in a Scimitar with 2.) a single Hammerhead II against 3.) a single RAA THALAMUS [Sansha Cruiser] and 4.) a single JEL RHOMBEN [Sansha Frigate].
c) I know, JELs have begun to breakfast drones. So I thought, why dont bother 4.) a single JEL RHOMBEN with 2.) a single Hammerhead II supported by a single large shield transporter II from my Scimi.
The Action
d) launch one drone - target it with one large shield transporter II and then - send the drone against the JEL - done.
e) meanwhile 3.) is firing at 1.) slowly - I turn red
f) 2.) hurts 4.) slightly
g) 4.) works like wild but can't bring 2.) down [my shield transporter stuff Scimi Skillz, implants, all max]
h) 4.) loses shield about 15-20% - and now :
i.) the RAA stops firing at me - runs over to its JEL (which is slightly under pressure] - and begins firing at my drone.
k.) Although I ordered my drone back and added a second shield transporter to it - my drone [still a single one] was killed with the combined forces of a Sansha Cruiser and a Sansha Frigate.
What do I learn :
l.) the first thing I got : Ah - it's the MPC against TRON
m.) programmed brilliantly
n.) RAA's thinking [we know it's a program] : gets aware of "my support is under pressure" and "my main disputant does not fire at me" so why don't help my Frigate. Could be as simple as a target switch . . .
o.) but why does a RAA shoot at a medium scout drone - which is no threat to a RAA ?
The balancing thing - if Sansha-Cruisers begin to battle done medium scout drones - why learn millions of drone-skills - only shooting is the right stuff in EVE - strongly worded : drones are a xxxx in New Eden - Gallente, whats that.
Yours sincerely
UTHAJA
|
Danika Princip
Minmatar
Tactical Narcotics Team
|
Posted - 2011.08.21 17:12:00 -
[2]
What exactly is the problem here?
|
UTHAJA
|
Posted - 2011.08.22 16:50:00 -
[3]
 Originally by: Danika Princip
What exactly is the problem here?
Hi,
I assume the reader knows the SciFi movie TRON - otherwise . . .
In the world of New Eden - CCP is the MCP - they can kill (progam) every instance at will. They can simply pull the plug.
The problem looks as follows : [from above]
But why does a RAA THALAMUS [ a sansha cruiser ] shoot at a medium scout drone - which is no threat to a RAA ?
The balancing thing - if Sansha-Cruisers begin to battle done medium scout drones - why learn millions of drone-skills - only shooting is the right stuff in EVE - strongly worded : drones are a **** in New Eden - Gallente, whats that. [Why learn a beautiful ship like the Vexor and become Gallente - which I promote in our HELP Channel.]
- -
A RAA should concentrate on its main target - in this case - me, in a Scimitar.
Only - if the threat is such, that is, the RAA could be affected itself = ( the number of Super-Scout-Drones to kill a RAA is = 3 ) then the RAA should act against a possible threat.
If the solution is programmed in the perfect way - like above - drones make few sense in the future - its more perfectly done than in average PvP.
To me it's a major shift in handling a complete weapons category [drones] - it needs much wider discussion. If everybody is fine with the actual solution - I'm wrong then.
|
Danika Princip
Minmatar
Tactical Narcotics Team
|
Posted - 2011.08.22 17:21:00 -
[4]
Originally by: UTHAJA
Originally by: Danika Princip
What exactly is the problem here?
Hi,
I assume the reader knows the SciFi movie TRON - otherwise . . .
In the world of New Eden - CCP is the MCP - they can kill (progam) every instance at will. They can simply pull the plug.
The problem looks as follows : [from above]
But why does a RAA THALAMUS [ a sansha cruiser ] shoot at a medium scout drone - which is no threat to a RAA ?
The balancing thing - if Sansha-Cruisers begin to battle done medium scout drones - why learn millions of drone-skills - only shooting is the right stuff in EVE - strongly worded : drones are a **** in New Eden - Gallente, whats that. [Why learn a beautiful ship like the Vexor and become Gallente - which I promote in our HELP Channel.]
- -
A RAA should concentrate on its main target - in this case - me, in a Scimitar.
Only - if the threat is such, that is, the RAA could be affected itself = ( the number of Super-Scout-Drones to kill a RAA is = 3 ) then the RAA should act against a possible threat.
If the solution is programmed in the perfect way - like above - drones make few sense in the future - its more perfectly done than in average PvP.
To me it's a major shift in handling a complete weapons category [drones] - it needs much wider discussion. If everybody is fine with the actual solution - I'm wrong then.
It shoots the drone to help it's little friend, much like you or I might pop a frigate with a HAC or something if it was menacing a coorp mate, despite it not being able to kill us. I assume it's all to do with the modified sleeper AI the incursion rats use, to make ti all more of a challenge.
Also, why are you even running scout sites? >_> |
SGT FUNYOUN
Gallente
|
Posted - 2011.08.22 22:24:00 -
[5]
Edited by: SGT FUNYOUN on 22/08/2011 22:24:39
Ok... your post is confusing; but I think I got the gist.
Basically you are asking why the new Incursion big ships might shoot at one of your drones when it is attacking one of its buddies instead of attacking you the "direct" threat, even though you are not shooting at it... I would say this.
Before the Incursions expansion posted; CCP took a long hard look at how actual Human beings fight PvE and PvP combat. They took these tactics and concepts and applied this data to the Incursion AI. Now the Incusion AI fights more like a Human might in that same situation.
Wouldn't you do the same thing if the tables were reversed?
No one is shooting at you.
Your buddy is getting hammered by a single drone.
There is only one ship out there and he is just sitting there.
Apparently according to the test data... Humans would go help their buddy.
Fight the biggest and most direct threat first might make sense in your head... but to a computer; it is just lines of code it is required to follow. The algorithim doesn't always work out to a (+) sign.
Yargh.  I be SGT Funyoun. King of the Pirates!!! |
UTHAJA
|
Posted - 2011.08.23 09:19:00 -
[6]
Hi,
Thanks you both for your friendly comments. I especially didn't know that CCP tried to copy PvP/E tactics.
One little thing then : If there is only a single RAA and again me in my Scimitar ( it's a logistics ship which doesn't shoot ) and now my Hammerheads II are directly fighting the RAA - why doesn't the RAA fight down my drones which are a real threat to it. 4 Hhs will kill the RAA in about 375 secs.
And to @Danika : I've participated in all Vanguards and most of the Assault and all HQ-Sites, only exception is the Mothership. My total losses are much bigger than my total income from Incursions. What I'm doing now is, I want a much better understanding of what is doable and what is not. I do not want to participate in so called shiny fleets which might contain of about 8 Machs and 2 Basis and run the Vans round and round the entire day. I guess that 3% of the pilots take all the riches while it's awful regarding all remaining pilots. That's why I decided to support especially our Minmatar people and our Gallente friends in Incursions.
And then - Pilots with sufficient skillpoints in drones, they (I) need to rethink the general use on drones.
Again, thanks for your help.
Yours sincerely
UTHAJA
|
Gemberslaafje
Vivicide
|
Posted - 2011.08.23 09:42:00 -
[7]
Well, a PVP pilot will first destroy or disable(ECM for example) the logistics, because if they don't the logistics will make it very hard to destroy the other ships or drones.
---
Creator of the Eve Character Appraiser/Assembler:
http://gemblog.nl/skill/
http://gemblog.nl/assembler/
Originally by: De'Veldrin
Welcome to the ****ing sandbox
|
UTHAJA
|
Posted - 2011.08.23 15:34:00 -
[8]
Yes - I've seen that twice now in the HQs. One case as an example : a crazy guy shot the "next" trigger down and quite a couple of Deltoles entered the arena. At first the Sansha got the cap chain of the basis down. If the basis loose thair cap-chain, they are sitting ducks at present. Most actual fits are simple fail fits, even Basis should be cap-stable to some extent. What followed then was a simple catastrophe, me being the last pilot perma-shield-transporting . . . so you are absolutely right - the Sanshas lernt somewhat from PvP.
|
| |
|
| Pages: [1] :: one page |
| First page | Previous page | Next page | Last page |