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Macks Artilius
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Posted - 2011.09.05 04:58:00 -
[1]
Edited by: Macks Artilius on 05/09/2011 04:58:46
So I'm planning on using a shield-tank setup for my next ship; a Maelstrom. I have all the relevant skills except the four shield compensation skills.
I figured this wouldn't be worth training as:
A. Its four skills and thus will take four times as long to train as anything else
B. I'm going to be using active hardeners, and thus won't get any bonus while my hardeners are on.
Of course I want to make sure I'm correct about B; the skill description suggests the bonus from the hardening skills only applies to active hardeners when they are off. If this is true, I dont see the point in training these skills for the time being.
I ask because my attributes are currently mapped mostly to INT. I want to put everything into PER before I start training battleships and large guns, but I want to make sure I round out the INT skills I really need first. Basically, I want to remap and start training battleships ASAP, but want to make sure I dont screw myself over in the long-term by skipping these skills.
Opinions?
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Tau Cabalander
Retirement Retreat
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Posted - 2011.09.05 05:04:00 -
[2]
Train them if you need them.
They comes in handy with passive shield resist amplifiers, and with hardeners for making sure you don't have a big resist hole when neuted dry.
I have them all trained to level 5, so I find them handy. You may not.
Training them all to level 3 is quick. Level 4 takes about a day each.
Up to you.
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foksieloy
Minmatar
Rockets ponies and rainbows
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Posted - 2011.09.05 05:49:00 -
[3]
I had them all to III for a long time now, and never really found myself thinking: "Boy if only I had them to V now, I would still be alive!"
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The best thing in EvE is Barrage M. |
Tau Cabalander
Retirement Retreat
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Posted - 2011.09.05 06:05:00 -
[4]
Edited by: Tau Cabalander on 05/09/2011 06:06:24
 Originally by: foksieloy
I had them all to III for a long time now, and never really found myself thinking: "Boy if only I had them to V now, I would still be alive!"
I trained them to 5 to do for C5/C6 wormhole sites in a passive resist Tengu (with a max skill and mindlinked siege warfare booster in a command Tengu). I admit it is likely an exception rather than the rule.
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foksieloy
Minmatar
Rockets ponies and rainbows
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Posted - 2011.09.05 06:35:00 -
[5]
Originally by: Tau Cabalander
I trained them to 5 to do for C5/C6 wormhole sites in a passive resist Tengu (with a max skill and mindlinked siege warfare booster in a command Tengu). I admit it is likely an exception rather than the rule.
That, plus the passive vulture was what I considered them for.
Point is, all skills can be useful, it is up to the player to decide if they are useful to him, or would he rather spend those few days on getting another virtual statistic up.
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The best thing in EvE is Barrage M. |
Eternum Praetorian
PWNED Factor
The Seventh Day
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Posted - 2011.09.05 12:18:00 -
[6]
Training them to Lv 4 is fine...
The difference between lv 4 and 5 will be so utterly insignificant that it won't make a difference.
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Dantaeri
Caldari
Cold Steel Inc.
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Posted - 2011.09.06 01:05:00 -
[7]
While I had thought them pointless for a long time, I recently realize an added advantage to them, which I'm going to call "Act of God" insurance. What I mean by this is that they are a backup in the event you find yourself in a situation where your hardeners are offline, and you are getting shot at. For your average ship, the chances of this happening are fairly low and the risk isn't especially high. This primarily comes to mind when you have a shiny new faction fit ship, and unknowingly jump into a gank attempt. Of course, when you jump your hardeners aren't active, and in the time that it takes you to think about it and start turning them on, the gank fleet could already have you targeted and be shooting at you. In the case of ganks like this, they are trying to do the highest alpha damage as they can before concord kills them, so you want your EHP to be as high as possible. The small offline bonus to your hardeners could very well make the the difference between you living and dying. That being said, it isn't a huge difference per level, and until you are flying very valuable ships, I would simply train them to 4 for the time being.
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Dustin Roac
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Posted - 2011.09.06 03:28:00 -
[8]
Edited by: Dustin Roac on 06/09/2011 03:34:49
Edited by: Dustin Roac on 06/09/2011 03:29:09
The above.
Often happens to me when I'm trying to multi-task too much when missioning. Dealing with corp chat, listening to the radio, often talking to people in my room... Just forget to turn 'em on.
Or, when I've been drinking, is sometimes enough on it's own to cause me to forget.
Or if I'm out of cap, it's a good deal on a bit of shield insurance.
4 at least. V's are on my long term plan, but pretty much close to last on the list of whatever this mission char will need.
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Toshiro GreyHawk
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Posted - 2011.09.06 08:59:00 -
[9]
Edited by: Toshiro GreyHawk on 06/09/2011 09:01:10
Yeah, getting surprised - which most ganks are ... a surprise ... is when they could be useful.
I've got industrials where I've got the mids all Shield Expanders and one Invincibility module. If you're traveling about - you have to turn on the Invincibility module every time you warp from one gate to the next.
What Hi Sec Gate Campers sometimes do - is to have a scout with a hidden targeting module and a cargo hold and maybe a ship scanner. They can thus lock you - and scan you - without you knowing it. That scout is usually along a trade pipe one or more jumps down from their gankers. They scan ships that are coming through - and report to their buddies if they find one with something worth expending a gank ship on. You warp though his gate - he locks & pops you.
I try to remember to turn on my Invincibility module every time I come through a gate ... but don't always remember. You also want to be turning that off once you're warping along so it doesn't use up your cap ... which would be another reason for those compensation skills.
Also, if you're traveling using the auto pilot ... that Invincibility module's not going to be getting turned on - now is it?
*shrug*
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Orbiting vs. Kiting
Career Agents
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Allanis Valtreis
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Posted - 2011.09.06 10:30:00 -
[10]
Edited by: Allanis Valtreis on 06/09/2011 10:31:16
I have all mine trained to three because **** happens, and all manner of bad luck or bad planning can find you breifly with your hardeners down (on jump in, capping out from neuts or stupidity, etc).
One thing I have wondered, is whether resist rigs benefit from these skills? Knowing how arse-about-**** this game is set up, it could go either way; but if these skills effect resist rigs, there is certainly an arguement for training up the skills that cover the more common rigs (for ex, nearly all Caldari or Mini fleet ships run with an EM resist rig to cover its EM hole, making that skill a worthwhile investment).
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foksieloy
Minmatar
Rockets ponies and rainbows
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Posted - 2011.09.06 10:53:00 -
[11]
They do not affect resist rigs.
_______________________
The best thing in EvE is Barrage M. |
Khanh'rhh
Sudden Buggery
Situation: Normal
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Posted - 2011.09.06 13:54:00 -
[12]
Originally by: Toshiro GreyHawk
Invincibility module
WTB Invincibility module.
As for the above suggestions ... don't waste your time training these skills for days to try to avoid suicide ganking - a suicide ganker doesn't fire unless he knows he/his gang has the damage (and some) to pop the ship; that's what the ship scanner is for.
You avoid (near all) suicide ganking by not making yourself a worthwhile target.
If you REALLY need to use autopilot, then fit passive shield amps instead of the active ones. Just keep the smallest secure container in your cargo with the alternate fit. Going half assed isn't worth it.
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E man Industries
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Posted - 2011.09.06 15:20:00 -
[13]
Train to 3.....because it's easy.
can help on some pvp frigates where your mids are all tackle and e-war.
My armor boats also don't mind the addition HP for 1 days worth of training.
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Hello WoW players. Look at your toon, now back to me. Sadly it isn't me, but if it wasn't simplistic pre scripted linear mono dimensional game you could look like me. I'm in a Paladin |
Khanh'rhh
Sudden Buggery
Situation: Normal
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Posted - 2011.09.06 15:30:00 -
[14]
Originally by: E man Industries
Train to 3.....because it's easy.
can help on some pvp frigates where your mids are all tackle and e-war.
My armor boats also don't mind the addition HP for 1 days worth of training.
Dude. What?
The bonus only works in ONE specific scenario:
When there is an active SHIELD hardener on the ship but it is INACTIVE.
It does nothing to your base shield resists.
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Kesshisan
Minmatar
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Posted - 2011.09.06 17:56:00 -
[15]
Originally by: Khanh'rhh
Dude. What?
The bonus only works in ONE specific scenario:
When there is an active SHIELD hardener on the ship but it is INACTIVE.
It does nothing to your base shield resists.
The bonus also works to help passive resistance amplifiers.
I've used this to great effect, too. Sometimes you can buy some of the cheaper officer resistance amplifiers (~10mil) and get the same resistance you would have had, had you used a T2 active hardener so long as your appropriate compensation skills are trained to IV. Where as if you take the time to train it up to level V then the passive resistance amplifiers actually give more resistance.*
I've used this to make ships cap stable when they otherwise would not be cap stable.
*Of course using the appropriately priced active hardener would probably give you even more resistances.
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