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New UI Features... really CCP?

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Author	Thread Statistics \| Show CCP posts - 4 post(s)
highonpop Eve Liberation Force Fatal Ascension 349	Posted - 2012.10.10 20:32:00 - [1] - Quote Dont get me wrong, I think it actually looks pretty cool.... But I think CCP has forgotten that brackets lag the game client more than anything else. So what are they doing? Adding to them so they take up more ram!!!! YAY!!!! https://sphotos-a.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ash4/285071_10151193544504394_1020228647_n.jpg http://www.soundboard.com/sb/Very%20best%20of%20Makalu%20Zarya R.I.P Vile Rat http://evemaps.dotlan.net/live/Outpost/Rename/2012-09-12
Senarrius Big Monkey Corp Final Admonition 38	Posted - 2012.10.10 20:34:00 - [2] - Quote Need more RAM? Buy more, it's as cheap as plex these days
James Amril-Kesh 4S Corporation RAZOR Alliance 928	Posted - 2012.10.10 20:34:00 - [3] - Quote Where'd you find this? I can't access dev blogs, I get an error when I try to do so. http://themittani.com/features/local-problem A simple fix to the local intel problem
highonpop Eve Liberation Force Fatal Ascension 349	Posted - 2012.10.10 20:35:00 - [4] - Quote James Amril-Kesh wrote: Where'd you find this? I can't access dev blogs, I get an error when I try to do so. the Eve Online facebook page if you notice, the fbcdn.net link is where facebook dumps their pictures http://www.soundboard.com/sb/Very%20best%20of%20Makalu%20Zarya R.I.P Vile Rat http://evemaps.dotlan.net/live/Outpost/Rename/2012-09-12
highonpop Eve Liberation Force Fatal Ascension 349	Posted - 2012.10.10 20:37:00 - [5] - Quote Senarrius wrote: Need more RAM? Buy more, it's as cheap as plex these days I know guys with 8+gigs of ram on brand new machines that have to turn off brackets when fleets get over 200+ on grid For fleets it is good practice to turn all graphics down and turn off brackets and learn how to fly by your overview and FC commands. http://www.soundboard.com/sb/Very%20best%20of%20Makalu%20Zarya R.I.P Vile Rat http://evemaps.dotlan.net/live/Outpost/Rename/2012-09-12

Chribba Otherworld Enterprises Otherworld Empire 5009	Posted - 2012.10.10 20:37:00 - [6] - Quote http://community.eveonline.com/devblog.asp?a=blog&nbid=73448 https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=161963 /c GÿàGÿàGÿà Secure 3rd party service GÿàGÿàGÿà Visit my in-game channel 'Holy Veldspar' Follow me on Twitter @Chribba

James Amril-Kesh 4S Corporation RAZOR Alliance 928	Posted - 2012.10.10 20:38:00 - [7] - Quote Well it's obviously a WIP - the Raven is missing 2/3 of its health indicators. http://themittani.com/features/local-problem A simple fix to the local intel problem
highonpop Eve Liberation Force Fatal Ascension 349	Posted - 2012.10.10 20:39:00 - [8] - Quote Chribba wrote: http://community.eveonline.com/devblog.asp?a=blog&nbid=73448 https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=161963 /c reading > me. Thanks for pointing that out. waiting for ISD now. :) http://www.soundboard.com/sb/Very%20best%20of%20Makalu%20Zarya R.I.P Vile Rat http://evemaps.dotlan.net/live/Outpost/Rename/2012-09-12
Jonah Gravenstein Mahatma Cote Temporal Research 1586	Posted - 2012.10.10 21:00:00 - [9] - Quote For years people have moaned about the UI, CCP try and improve it, people still moan. They just can't win either way Homo sapiens non urinat in ventum -á-á-á ---CCP can't patch stupid---
Temuken Radzu Bendebeukers Green Rhino 13	Posted - 2012.10.10 21:05:00 - [10] - Quote I like it, much more sleeker then what we have now.

RAGE QU1T Deep Core Mining Inc. Caldari State 35	Posted - 2012.10.10 21:58:00 - [11] - Quote These changes are awesome! Reminds me of the old days of EVE, and note to this is a working P r o g r e s s. How slow does the dev have to reapeat it. Whinners plz find another improvment u need to ***** about.
Azrin Stella Oerndotte The Nommo 6	Posted - 2012.10.10 22:25:00 - [12] - Quote James Amril-Kesh wrote: Well it's obviously a WIP - the Raven is missing 2/3 of its health indicators. It is being locked. It will be much more noticeable when you see it actually moving. Does it really matter how fancy brackets are if they are off when they cause trouble (read:in huge fights) either way? Also, they have stated repeatedly that the new graphics will be optional.
D4mane Tribal Liberation Force Minmatar Republic 0	Posted - 2012.10.11 07:03:00 - [13] - Quote James Amril-Kesh wrote: Well it's obviously a WIP - the Raven is missing 2/3 of its health indicators. If you watch carefully that is the targeting indicator. It probably dose a 360 to target then you get the 3 health bars.
Shaalira D'arc Quantum Cats Syndicate 519	Posted - 2012.10.11 07:06:00 - [14] - Quote If you're flying in 200+ man engagements, you probably won't have much use for the added information the new brackets have to offer anyways. You'll probably be focusing on shooting exactly what the FC tells you to shoot while hitting broadcast whenever you need reps. For the rest of the game, it's grand.
Vera Algaert Republic University Minmatar Republic 376	Posted - 2012.10.11 07:43:00 - [15] - Quote highonpop wrote: But I think CCP has forgotten that brackets lag the game client more than anything else. So what are they doing? Adding little S/A/S indicators around them so they take up more ram!!!! YAY!!!! Please explain how brackets use up all your precious RAM... I'm a NPC corp alt, any argument I make is invalid.
Signal11th Against ALL Anomalies 791	Posted - 2012.10.11 07:57:00 - [16] - Quote RAGE QU1T wrote: These changes are awesome! Reminds me of the old days of EVE, and note to this is a working P r o g r e s s. How slow does the dev have to reapeat it. Whinners plz find another improvment u need to ***** about. How about a spellchecker for the forums? I find most people who say "noob/whiner/omg/plz" tend to have a most basic grasp on whatever language they are attempting to scrawl in. N'est-ce pas? God Said "Come Forth and receive eternal life!"-á I came second and won a toaster.
Roime Shiva Furnace Dead On Arrival Alliance 1326	Posted - 2012.10.11 07:59:00 - [17] - Quote Why can't you use the Dev blog comment thread like everybody else, you special little snowflake you. Gallente - the choice of the interstellar gentleman
Adoro Reikoku The Retirement Club 13	Posted - 2012.10.11 08:07:00 - [18] - Quote No No No CCP. I like it the way it is. (Except the targeting range bracket, thats good stuff actually)
Sarah Schneider PonyWaffe Test Alliance Please Ignore 1571	Posted - 2012.10.11 09:21:00 - [19] - Quote Good stuff. One thing I worry about is that CCP is more interested in making stuff "pretty" rather than actually adding and/or improving functionality/accessibility to the UI itself. Hopefully not. Spreadsheet in space is still going to be spreadsheet in space no matter how fancy the animations or how pretty the graphics are. "I think weGÇÖre just getting closer and closer to a place where the people we lose are people that itGÇÖs okay to lose." -Kristoffer Touborg, Eve lead designer
marVLs 35	Posted - 2012.10.11 09:27:00 - [20] - Quote New brackets and UI improvements looks cool. Approved. Maybe add to HP bars color borders (blue for shield, orange for armor etc)


CCP Sisyphus C C P C C P Alliance 114	Posted - 2012.10.11 10:25:00 - [21] - Quote hmm.. the S/A/H indicator is only ever on your selected target... you can only have one of those. i'd guess a few kb extra ram at most. CCP Sisyphus \| Team PE \| @CCP_Sisyphus

Bubanni ElitistOps Pandemic Legion 465	Posted - 2012.10.11 10:28:00 - [22] - Quote CCP Sisyphus wrote: hmm.. the S/A/H indicator is only ever on your selected target... you can only have one of those. i'd guess a few kb extra ram at most. nbd :) Christmas wish list https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=134275 Module activation delay! https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=1180934
Gilbaron Free-Space-Ranger Ev0ke 369	Posted - 2012.10.11 10:35:00 - [23] - Quote CCP Sisyphus wrote: hmm.. the S/A/H indicator is only ever on your selected target... you can only have one of those. i'd guess a few kb extra ram at most. haha, i assumed i would have a totally cluttered screen full of expanded brackets with s/a/h for every locked ship, so i made this posting
Sarah Schneider PonyWaffe Test Alliance Please Ignore 1571	Posted - 2012.10.11 10:49:00 - [24] - Quote CCP Sisyphus wrote: hmm.. the S/A/H indicator is only ever on your selected target... you can only have one of those. i'd guess a few kb extra ram at most. Sweet. Err, how about something that's actually an improvement over space-spreadsheets? or is it still something :sekrit: from CCP? "I think weGÇÖre just getting closer and closer to a place where the people we lose are people that itGÇÖs okay to lose." -Kristoffer Touborg, Eve lead designer
Abdiel Kavash Paladin Order Fidelas Constans 892	Posted - 2012.10.11 11:10:00 - [25] - Quote CCP Sisyphus wrote: hmm.. the S/A/H indicator is only ever on your selected target... you can only have one of those. i'd guess a few kb extra ram at most. Uhh how is that in any way shape or form useful? I already see the S/A/H of all targets I have locked, I was hoping this would show me other people that are low so that I can switch to shooting them... highonpop wrote: I know guys with 8+gigs of ram on brand new machines that have to turn off brackets when fleets get over 200+ on grid For fleets it is good practice to turn all graphics down and turn off brackets and learn how to fly by your overview and FC commands. There is something seriously wrong with your PC. I am running EVE on a laptop with 8GB RAM and I run big fleets (500+) with brackets on at 15-20 FPS (not what I'd call flawless, but playable).
Nyla Skin Maximum fun chamber 89	Posted - 2012.10.11 11:11:00 - [26] - Quote highonpop wrote: Dont get me wrong, I think it actually looks pretty cool.... But I think CCP has forgotten that brackets lag the game client more than anything else. Good point. However, as long as the new brackets can be disabled the same way as the old ones, its propably fine.
Panhead4411 Rothschild's Sewage and Septic Sucking Services The Possum Lodge 220	Posted - 2012.10.11 11:48:00 - [27] - Quote CCP Sisyphus wrote: hmm.. the S/A/H indicator is only ever on your selected target... you can only have one of those. i'd guess a few kb extra ram at most. As its already been stated, the current system gives us this info easily and quickly already. What was deemed broken and wrong with it so badly that it was deemed a priority and needed to be replaced? Change for change sake is not good. You guys aren't remembering your past very well are you? http://blog.beyondreality.se/shift-click-does-nothing -á-á < Unified Inventory is NOT ready...
Brooks Puuntai Brutor Tribe Minmatar Republic 868	Posted - 2012.10.11 12:25:00 - [28] - Quote Its not bad, so long as you can disable it.
Muad 'dib The Imperial Fedaykin 560	Posted - 2012.10.11 12:56:00 - [29] - Quote i hope theres customizable options for this new settings. http://www.counterfrag.com/screenshots/eve%20online/3.jpg ccp got nothing better to do than go back through old UI looks that were changed IN THE FIRST PLACE because they were confusing. please options to keep bars, or heck make octagon ones too i dont care but dont force the old circles back on the UI again. Move forward not backward guys. http://img299.imageshack.us/img299/4375/mynewsig2.jpg

CCP Sisyphus C C P C C P Alliance 117	Posted - 2012.10.11 13:27:00 - [30] - Quote Panhead4411 wrote: As its already been stated, the current system gives us this info easily and quickly already. What was deemed broken and wrong with it so badly that it was deemed a priority and needed to be replaced? Change for change sake is not good. You guys aren't remembering your past very well are you? Actually, from watching people try to LEARN the eve system, you didn't already have the information quickly and easily available. Once you get used to it you can get the information quickly. But thats like saying QWERTY is the fastest layout for keyboards - its actually really difficult to learn and actually designed to slow you down...(let that sink in a bit) Looking all over the screen to try to find information is not optimal. This is not "change for change's sake", we're trying to improve the information available on the thing you are looking at, as well as showing information available in a better way to help prioritize targets. CCP Sisyphus \| Team PE \| @CCP_Sisyphus


Nyla Skin Maximum fun chamber 90	Posted - 2012.10.11 13:32:00 - [31] - Quote CCP Sisyphus wrote: This is not "change for change's sake", we're trying to improve the information available on the thing you are looking at, as well as showing information available in a better way to help prioritize targets. That doesn't really explain the change of HP bars into a HP circle..
Muad 'dib The Imperial Fedaykin 561	Posted - 2012.10.11 13:36:00 - [32] - Quote Nyla Skin wrote: CCP Sisyphus wrote: This is not "change for change's sake", we're trying to improve the information available on the thing you are looking at, as well as showing information available in a better way to help prioritize targets. That doesn't really explain the change of HP bars into a HP circle.. a change back to circles http://img299.imageshack.us/img299/4375/mynewsig2.jpg

CCP Sisyphus C C P C C P Alliance 117	Posted - 2012.10.11 13:41:00 - [33] - Quote Sarah Schneider wrote: Err, how about something that's actually an improvement over space-spreadsheets? or is it still something :sekrit: from CCP? can you imagine what would happen if we took away the overview/chat/etc and removed all the "spreadsheet" like things from the UI.... or rather - what the forums would look like after any hypothetical announcement?. But yes, we are definitely trying to move away from spreadsheets-in-space... in little steps. CCP Sisyphus \| Team PE \| @CCP_Sisyphus

Bienator II madmen of the skies 1003	Posted - 2012.10.11 13:47:00 - [34] - Quote what they basically say is that we want a predator targeting triangle, not a space pony circle (keep up the good work, looking forward to that change) a eve-style bounty system https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=359105 You fail you fail you fail you fail you fail you fail you fail to jump because you are cloaked
Sarah Schneider PonyWaffe Test Alliance Please Ignore 1572	Posted - 2012.10.11 13:48:00 - [35] - Quote CCP Sisyphus wrote: Panhead4411 wrote: As its already been stated, the current system gives us this info easily and quickly already. What was deemed broken and wrong with it so badly that it was deemed a priority and needed to be replaced? Change for change sake is not good. You guys aren't remembering your past very well are you? Actually, from watching people try to LEARN the eve system, you didn't already have the information quickly and easily available. Once you get used to it you can get the information quickly. But thats like saying QWERTY is the fastest layout for keyboards - its actually really difficult to learn and actually designed to slow you down...(let that sink in a bit) Looking all over the screen to try to find information is not optimal. This is not "change for change's sake", we're trying to improve the information available on the thing you are looking at, as well as showing information available in a better way to help prioritize targets. Well, while I do like the changes, it's more like it's a mere eye candy judging from the additional information provided as for whether it will weigh down the gaming experience even more or the other way around, quite frankly, I'm not sure; it is pretty, it's nice to look at, but other than that, I'm sorry but I can't say much more. I'm not disregarding the hard work you guys have pulled off and I meant no disrespect towards the devs, you guys are awesome. But surely CCP must have also realized that the UI, in whole, needs looking at, it is not broken, but let's be honest here. Eve is a game, when played in a single monitor on average screen size (resolution and physical), the UI consumes the majority (in a sense) of the player's screen, in fleet fights or even smaller combat, we can't even "enjoy" how pretty the graphics CCP devs have devoted their time working on them, because of the single major issue, we just can't. The UI in whole is not ergonomically designed, not intuitive enough and not smart enough (in a way that the UI doesn't react to what the player needs at one time) to provide us with the information needed during the time we actually play the game (as in undocking, in space, shooting stuff, or not shooting stuff). There are too many windows that needs to be opened at one time. The only most efficient way to solve this, is to buy more or bigger screen, but surely, does that seems logical from UI design perspective? Making the UI prettier, does not, in any way address that problem, it's a great thing to do because it feels good, it looks good. But it seems to me that from time to time, improvements to the UI just shows us, that CCP have no idea on how to fix the "spreadsheet in space" issue and try to redirect the attention to the issue itself by slapping more eye candy. So, this is a challenge, the one thing the devs may need to do something about, and prove us wrong... PS : Again, I don't disagree with the new changes, it's a job well done. "I think weGÇÖre just getting closer and closer to a place where the people we lose are people that itGÇÖs okay to lose." -Kristoffer Touborg, Eve lead designer

CCP Sisyphus C C P C C P Alliance 118	Posted - 2012.10.11 13:52:00 - [36] - Quote Sarah Schneider wrote: I'm not disregarding the hard work you guys have pulled off and I meant no disrespect towards the devs, you guys are awesome. But surely CCP must have also realized that the UI, in whole, needs looking at, it is not broken, but let's be honest here. Eve is a game, when played in a single monitor on average screen size (resolution and physical), the UI consumes the majority (in a sense) of the player's screen, in fleet fights or even smaller combat, we can't even "enjoy" how pretty the graphics CCP devs have devoted their time working on them, because of the single major issue, we just can't. The UI in whole is not ergonomically designed, not intuitive enough and not smart enough (in a way that the UI doesn't react to what the player needs at one time) to provide us with the information needed during the time we actually play the game (as in undocking, in space, shooting stuff, or not shooting stuff). There are too many windows that needs to be opened at one time. The only most efficient way to solve this, is to buy more or bigger screen, but surely, does that seems logical from UI design perspective? Agree with everything you just said... And this is what our team is devoted to doing - making the game cleaner and easier to understand without the need for window overload... CCP Sisyphus \| Team PE \| @CCP_Sisyphus

Tippia Sunshine and Lollipops 9837	Posted - 2012.10.11 13:52:00 - [37] - Quote CCP Sisyphus wrote: But yes, we are definitely trying to move away from spreadsheets-in-space... in little steps. OMG! EVE is dying!! How will we be able to play spaceship excel if you remove the spreadsheets?! Waaah! Doom! Gloom! [etc]. GÇ£If you're not willing to fight for what you have in GëívGëí you don't deserve it, and you will lose it.GÇ¥ Get a good start: newbie skill plan.
Sarah Schneider PonyWaffe Test Alliance Please Ignore 1572	Posted - 2012.10.11 13:55:00 - [38] - Quote CCP Sisyphus wrote: Sarah Schneider wrote: I'm not disregarding the hard work you guys have pulled off and I meant no disrespect towards the devs, you guys are awesome. But surely CCP must have also realized that the UI, in whole, needs looking at, it is not broken, but let's be honest here. Eve is a game, when played in a single monitor on average screen size (resolution and physical), the UI consumes the majority (in a sense) of the player's screen, in fleet fights or even smaller combat, we can't even "enjoy" how pretty the graphics CCP devs have devoted their time working on them, because of the single major issue, we just can't. The UI in whole is not ergonomically designed, not intuitive enough and not smart enough (in a way that the UI doesn't react to what the player needs at one time) to provide us with the information needed during the time we actually play the game (as in undocking, in space, shooting stuff, or not shooting stuff). There are too many windows that needs to be opened at one time. The only most efficient way to solve this, is to buy more or bigger screen, but surely, does that seems logical from UI design perspective? Agree with everything you just said... And this is what our team is devoted to doing - making the game cleaner and easier to understand without the need for window overload... Great then, I personally thank you for the responses. I believe you guys can do it. Keep up the hard work! Prove us wrong... "I think weGÇÖre just getting closer and closer to a place where the people we lose are people that itGÇÖs okay to lose." -Kristoffer Touborg, Eve lead designer
highonpop Eve Liberation Force Fatal Ascension 350	Posted - 2012.10.11 14:05:00 - [39] - Quote CCP Sisyphus wrote: Sarah Schneider wrote: I'm not disregarding the hard work you guys have pulled off and I meant no disrespect towards the devs, you guys are awesome. But surely CCP must have also realized that the UI, in whole, needs looking at, it is not broken, but let's be honest here. Eve is a game, when played in a single monitor on average screen size (resolution and physical), the UI consumes the majority (in a sense) of the player's screen, in fleet fights or even smaller combat, we can't even "enjoy" how pretty the graphics CCP devs have devoted their time working on them, because of the single major issue, we just can't. The UI in whole is not ergonomically designed, not intuitive enough and not smart enough (in a way that the UI doesn't react to what the player needs at one time) to provide us with the information needed during the time we actually play the game (as in undocking, in space, shooting stuff, or not shooting stuff). There are too many windows that needs to be opened at one time. The only most efficient way to solve this, is to buy more or bigger screen, but surely, does that seems logical from UI design perspective? Agree with everything you just said... And this is what our team is devoted to doing - making the game cleaner and easier to understand without the need for window overload... I have so much stuff open on my screen that I can barely see my ship. Between chat channels, cargo, fleet window, overview, locked targets, selected item, drones, and not to mention the Capacitor. I have my fleet chat stacked in my fleet window to save room. All my intel channels in one chat stack, local by itself right next to my overview, and another chat stack for random channels like corp/alliance/public chats. It seems that in order to fully appreciate this game you need a pretty beefy computer and a 30"+ monitor. http://www.soundboard.com/sb/Very%20best%20of%20Makalu%20Zarya R.I.P Vile Rat http://evemaps.dotlan.net/live/Outpost/Rename/2012-09-12
Muad 'dib The Imperial Fedaykin 561	Posted - 2012.10.11 14:11:00 - [40] - Quote thats never going to change much. Theres a lot of information in eve and good ways to deliver that information will always be a challenge, screen clutter is just going to be a problem for some one who wants the best advantage, by use of the most information. http://img299.imageshack.us/img299/4375/mynewsig2.jpg

highonpop Eve Liberation Force Fatal Ascension 351	Posted - 2012.10.11 14:13:00 - [41] - Quote Muad 'dib wrote: thats never going to change much. Theres a lot of information in eve and good ways to deliver that information will always be a challenge, screen clutter is just going to be a problem for some one who wants the best advantage, by use of the most information. Yes there is a TON of information, the UI scaling helps, but not enough really. It would be nice to be able to label your stacks and then apply certain characteristics to those stacks independently, like text size or image size. http://www.soundboard.com/sb/Very%20best%20of%20Makalu%20Zarya R.I.P Vile Rat http://evemaps.dotlan.net/live/Outpost/Rename/2012-09-12
Tarn Kugisa Infinite Covenant Tribal Band 158	Posted - 2012.10.11 14:14:00 - [42] - Quote Senarrius wrote: Need more RAM? Buy more, it's as cheap as plex these days It is crazy cheap 8GB is like $40 I Endorse this Product and/or Service Source Recorder-esque tool for EVE
Bubanni ElitistOps Pandemic Legion 466	Posted - 2012.10.11 14:29:00 - [43] - Quote CCP Sisyphus wrote: Sarah Schneider wrote: Err, how about something that's actually an improvement over space-spreadsheets? or is it still something :sekrit: from CCP? can you imagine what would happen if we took away the overview/chat/etc and removed all the "spreadsheet" like things from the UI.... or rather - what the forums would look like after any hypothetical announcement?. But yes, we are definitely trying to move away from spreadsheets-in-space... in little steps. The overview mainly needs to be streamlined so it requires less space (allowing us to get the useful information from looking at the ships instead of the overview) Christmas wish list https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&t=134275 Module activation delay! https://forums.eveonline.com/default.aspx?g=posts&m=1180934
Bloodpetal Mimidae Risk Solutions 916	Posted - 2012.10.11 14:32:00 - [44] - Quote CCP Sisyphus wrote: Sarah Schneider wrote: Err, how about something that's actually an improvement over space-spreadsheets? or is it still something :sekrit: from CCP? can you imagine what would happen if we took away the overview/chat/etc and removed all the "spreadsheet" like things from the UI.... or rather - what the forums would look like after any hypothetical announcement?. But yes, we are definitely trying to move away from spreadsheets-in-space... in little steps. I think this is the greatest challenge you have, if at all possible. Mostly in scalability. Inevitably you would need to change data formats at some point in the "Scale" equation. You'd need to go from spreadsheet to graph chart, with a graph chart showing a numerical value of pilots doing a certain thing on that spreadsheet (lets say radial velocity). So from left to right it would show a fluctuating line indicating 20 pilots are approaching you at -200m/s, 2 pilots at 201m/s, .... 50 pilots are going 50m/s away from you, etc. Then, do that for the various information that we would want, and then perhaps drop it into 3d mode. And then we can call it GRAAAAAAAAAAAPHS IIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIN SPAAAAAAAAAAACE. Seriously though. I don't envy this UI challenge of yours. Inevitably, I think the only reasonable way you could manage this info is by clustering ships doing enough of the same things in unity that the UI treats them as one object in space (not for locking specific targets). And anything standing out from the blob would have to look different. So, let's say there's a sniping fleet moving 800m/s at a radial of 0m/s (in orbit), they would be highlight green on the screen as a whole, and then you'd have an Interceptor burning towards you (let's say), and that interceptor would be highlighted Red because it's radial is -5000m/. It would look like a heat signature (this idea is purely for demonstration purposes). And, you could filter your "heat" signature based on what info you wanted. It would get pretty "ugly" for EVE but, that technique is the most plausible way I could see to cluster information for 400 man engagements in a way that would be consumable without a spreadsheet (aka overview). And the blob, would literally look like a "blob" at that point. It would make a cool effect for teams though, if I was an FC I could view one heat signature for one set of info and I could assign others to watch for other information patterns. i.e. I could be watching what distance is while my anti-tackle could watch what radial is, and so on. So as FC I can keep our range to engagement in the right place, while my Destroyers could watch that nothing is flying into us because any inty's would stand out immediately as RED against the GREEN blob that is managing range, etc. I think the other reason the overview is crucial is that not all information is going to be "in front of you" on your screen if it's taken off the overview. I know that you want to do the PIP overview with your selected target, which would be sweet (would love to see that this expansion, not expecting it) - so that may alleviate some of the pressure, but many times while manual piloting I can't turn my screen to face my opponent because I have to fly in another direction to where I want to go to avoid other ships, etc. And do that with a lot of other ships coming on to the field, and it gets tricky fast. I need that info!!! Where I am.
MadMuppet A Better Corp Name 558	Posted - 2012.10.11 14:36:00 - [45] - Quote Could the DEVs post a picture of what will look like against a bright background. The nebula brightness has been an annoying issue since the new nebula were introduced. I am curious if the new targeting information will be legible at all against a bright background (like looking up at a target above you while flying in Domain)? If I tried to make a type of coffee that made all of you happy, and you rated it, the group score for it would be about 60 out of 100. Break into 3 or 4 coffee clusters, and made coffee just for each cluster, the scores would go from 60 to 78. The difference between coffee at 60 and coffee at 78 is a difference between coffee that makes you wince or makes you happy.
Sarah Schneider PonyWaffe Test Alliance Please Ignore 1572	Posted - 2012.10.11 17:32:00 - [46] - Quote CCP Sisyphus wrote: Sarah Schneider wrote: Err, how about something that's actually an improvement over space-spreadsheets? or is it still something :sekrit: from CCP? can you imagine what would happen if we took away the overview/chat/etc and removed all the "spreadsheet" like things from the UI.... or rather - what the forums would look like after any hypothetical announcement?. But yes, we are definitely trying to move away from spreadsheets-in-space... in little steps. Was going to comment on this, seems that I missed this part Yes, I can imagine, especially if it's an extreme change and if it's done incorrectly. But that's the challenge isn't it, no one's saying we should dump the overview, but the problem with all of those redundant windows cluttering and filling up our screen is still a problem, regardless. Perhaps people can say, hey, at least it works; but ofc it works, no one's saying that it doesn't. You have stated previously that CCP is aware that this is actually an issue that needs to be addressed, so I'll leave it at that; but for the sake of clarity, I'll give an example. I'm playing in a bit smaller screen resolution (1366x768). Fortunately for me, by W3C statistics, this is the most common screen resolution used in 2012. During most of my activities, while undocked in Eve these are the things shown on my screen: damn fixed-unresizeable HUD with fixed-unmodifiable-module display as long as a marsupilami's tail overview (obviously) which consumes a huge portion of the screen if I want to grab the info I need drone window on drone boats selected object window (which apparently there for obvious but somewhat weird reasons) those little but not so little targeted object panels (yes, it's big enough to call it panels) first/primary chat window (with multiple tabs) local chat window intel chat window neocom that top-left system information the unmovable/fixed-position and unresizeable combat notification during fleet fights, big, small or pvp in general, several additional stuff is active watchlist (understandable and it's necessary) fleet window fleet chat (most times merged with the primary chat window) All in all, in the end, most of my screen is filled with something that's not spaceship (which is a bit sad). Again, since we're so used to this, the clutter and all, it's not a big issue to some people. Heck, it's not even a big issue for me. But if I think about it, why is everything so passive (the UI), why do I need to display all of those things and separate them to different positions to get the information I need. Why is my screen filled up with lists, windows, UI items, when some of those things could (maybe) be merged into smaller groups of stuff. Why is it that for every new (or not new) feature, CCP always present us with a new window and clutter the screen even more. Is it really impossible to design an ergonomic, intuitive, efficient and flexible UI for this game? To take it to the extreme, what good is it, all those pretty ships and amazing graphics for spaceships and nebulas CCP have put countless hours into the development if we can't even enjoy them during many cases when we need the UI operational? While I do believe that CCP may come up with something, and it might not be acceptable at first (just like the inventory UI). I still have my doubts that this is, maybe, just maybe a game, the one MMO in which a "good" UI is just not possible and the only reasonable solution is to "buy a bigger screen". Both technically and whether or not changes are acceptable because people have gotten too much used to the old ways... Just my 2 isk. "I think weGÇÖre just getting closer and closer to a place where the people we lose are people that itGÇÖs okay to lose." -Kristoffer Touborg, Eve lead designer
Lin-Young Borovskova Science and Trade Institute Caldari State 792	Posted - 2012.10.11 17:41:00 - [47] - Quote CCP, nice changes. This looks very nice and I will be very happy. However, I can't wait the day you will start getting rid of ZDAT grid of at least improve it to the point I could choose to show everything on screen (like brackets) or on grid. Yeah you are tired I'm moaning and beatching about it for years, but I will neva stop till ya dudes do it !! Get rid of zdat grid, nao !! DO IT !! brb
Vincent Athena V.I.C.E. 1046	Posted - 2012.10.11 20:32:00 - [48] - Quote Sarah Schneider wrote: ........Is it really impossible to design an ergonomic, intuitive, efficient and flexible UI for this game? ......... Make some sketches. No, I'm not asking you to design an entire new UI, just see if you can come up with some concepts. http://vincentoneve.wordpress.com/
Sarah Schneider PonyWaffe Test Alliance Please Ignore 1573	Posted - 2012.10.11 21:55:00 - [49] - Quote Vincent Athena wrote: Sarah Schneider wrote: ........Is it really impossible to design an ergonomic, intuitive, efficient and flexible UI for this game? ......... Make some sketches. No, I'm not asking you to design an entire new UI, just see if you can come up with some concepts. Why? "I think weGÇÖre just getting closer and closer to a place where the people we lose are people that itGÇÖs okay to lose." -Kristoffer Touborg, Eve lead designer


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