Make it dread-only, then we can talk.

after which all locks on it would be broken

target is 100km away. after 90 km, target warps out.

congradulations, ships can now sprint.

Ramming other ships would be extremely awesome and I've been waiting for it since the first day I played Eve.

But why only capitals? Wouldn't it be much more fun if you could equip warheads on frig-sized hulls and crash wave after wave of kamikazes into a supercap?

I liked it right up to here



nonono. Webs should still work on it as normal, and it should be able to be shot down before it hits it's target. Kamikazes didn't suddenly become invulnerable as they started their dives, after all.

Interesting point, but kamikazes weren't locked, were they? :P Besides, even if the engine or wings took severe damage while diving towards a target, it would probably hit (or get extremely close to) the target. However, thanks for the input. I can see why you'd want to see webifiers stop ships, but if you consider the point of this is to jam open the throttles and smash into another ship, it'd be painful to see, say, a moros being stopped doing this by a Rifter...

Add an unbreakable self-destruct timer to prevent the sprinting abuse detailed earlier. Technical reason: The stress put on the drives to achieve ramming speed put them into critical and they will explode in 120 seconds if the ship isn't destroyed first.

Potential balance: if the ship is destroyed before reaching its target, does AoE damage. This adds the potential for a ship making a kamikaze run to damage friendly ships when it fails.

Great idea. If i remember correctly they did have collision damage when eve first came out, not sure on that though.

Unfortunately though, i think that with the scope of warfare in eve, that although collision damage would be realistic, it just wouldn't be practical. Just think of all the calculations for the server to make on one ship alone let alone thousands. We would end up with an eve where we would have a "line" of ships vs. another "line" of ships old civil war musket style and you would lose a lot of dynamic in the battlefield.

An old US nuclear test packed a surplus ship with materials and sank like 8 ships with it's "self-destruct". The attack on a US ship around 2000 by a speedboat packed with explosives did a lot of damage. - so on and so forth.

The ramming part doesn't do very much in reality. The target needs to be pretty much sitting still for full effect and even then rarely can the damage to a combat vessel be sufficient to do more than dent and crumple it a bit.

Even if your suicide pilot managed to impact ships, very few larger ships were sunk by this tactic. Capital class vessels (like carriers) could, and did absorb multiple hits from kamikaze pilots without sinking or even being so damaged as to be towed back to port.Destroyer sized vessels had problems with kamikazes, but were also harder to hit, due to being signifcantly lower in the water, and their loss was no real big loss - destroyers were figuratively a dime a dozen to the US and British naval fleets.

I don't like this idea. I would hate for myself, or my fleet, to outplay an opponent, then have them use this and score some easy, undeserved kills.

The Nyx is already well known for its ramming prowess. Ask any Ishukone employee.

level 5 should let you ram someone with warp speed.

I will only support this awesome idea if you let sansha ships do collision damage, or even better, let them impale the victim and drag them around and hit other ships with the skewered hunk, causing even more damage.

As OP pointed out , there does need to be a kamikaze in EvE, and the kinks worked out of course. But what about just one ship ramming another ship? It would be a desperate tactic for sure, but this would open a lot of tactics that otherwise not viable. In addition to a 'Kamikaze" skillbook that would be fatal for at least one party involved, there should also be a "Ramming" skillbook that allows you to ram another ship for damage(Kinetic of course) but on the same side, this would damage your own ship in the process. This would inflict X amount of damage over Y amount of time and in some other mathy crap and you have your equation for ramming. But for the Ramming skillbook, maybe 5% damage boost towards your output to ram other ships? This could be counter-balanced by another skill like "Hull Breach Compensation" would reduce damage taken by being rammed (lol) by say either 7 or 10 percent. This way it would keep ramming reserved as a desperate maneuver. I would also like to mention that Ramming would be a prerequisite for Kamikaze as that would just make sense (seems to for me). I'll let the mathy people figure out the equations :)

Well, as I understood your post is that your version of ramming would be a final, suicidal and desperate tactic to take down as many as you can with you, hence Kamikaze. What I'm suggesting is a similar desperate tactic that would instead allow you some what of a chance to either run away as if two ships came into physical contact going the speed that these ships do, I would imagine that such a collision would temporary disable targeting systems. This would make solo pvp rather more dangerous or interesting. In your Kamizake skill, once set on a collision course is set, it can't be undone due to everything going critical. In my proposed ramming, it could be undone if wanted so. I guess what I'm proposing is that it should be allowed to ram other ships by approaching them, but there would be 2 skills related in sub-cap collisions and 1 skill related in capitol (dread/carrier) suicide run. There is a lot more I could expand on with better details if ya want :) But I like your kamikaze idea, and I'm just trying to help expand on it.

I like it.

but I can see 2 problems right off the back.

POS's component prices would skyrocket.
Freighters loaded with rocks, being "Bumped by tens upon tens of 100MN fitted Stabbers....

Its a good idea, I really like it mostly because im picturing destroyer to battleship hulled blobs using the skill to increase fun and gratification of their own piloting ability.

I agree that any collisions should be very catastrophic, but I don't think making it a 100% guarantee that you will die/lose ship. There should a very small chance that you survive from ramming some one but you'll be about alive as a zombie. Also, for non-Kamikaze runs, I think that escaping in your pod would be something you could so, but that would have to be a manual thing to do, and if you didn't hit the leave ship button in time, there goes your pod as well. On the other hand, if you eject from ship too early, it would be possible for your ship to miss seeing as it will fly in just a straight line. I really hope there is a dev watching this post as it does contain good ideas and I would love to see the Battle Freighter as a result of this.

hi elquirko

hi

That'd be an interesting mechanic, but it'd be pointless, since shields would negate all subcapital damage anyway before they impacted. Besides, anything subcap (except MAYBE a nightmare) wouldn't be able to take the damage as it warmed up. I'll think of a way it could possibly fit, though.

Well, I was intending for this to be sansha ships only, seeing as how their in game description states that their design gives them tremendous amounts of structural integrity. I was simply looking forward for the wicked protrusions that the sansha ships sported to be used in some fashion. And obviously, neither would ramming with caps work while the shields are still up.

I agree with whoever that said this should be a skill that can't be used by trail accounts, also, I like the Ramming skill being intertwined (or whatever) with the Kamikaze skill, But I was thinking that Ramming should also be a perquisite to Kamikaze (makes to anyyone else?) Caldain, you made some damn good points with the only way to slowing down a cap thats on a kami-run by maneuvering your ship in front of its path, and maybe you could slow it down further by setting your own collision course towards it? But I think if a frigate collides with any ship besides another frigate would pretty much be instadeath for frigate due to the sheer difference of mass (not guaranteed death, but almost always). For instance a rifter can slam into a Typhoon, the Typhoon be badly if not critically damaged, but there would be no more rifter. Can't think of much more ideas right now, like the spitballin we got tho :D

One thought that crosses my mind is this:

-once a kamikaze run is initiated a message goes out warning of it cross system or battle, etc. "X is initiating a suicide run ZOMG RUN!!!!!"
-base damage off lowest mass. IE run over a rifter during the run and there's a chance they'll survive, damaged and kiting off in a new direction but still alive.
-during a run ANYONE hit along the way gets/give damage. And hinders the runner. (IE BS's throwing them selves in the way or some other such noble nonsense or, conversely, not getting out of the way in time.)
-calculate damage based on relative speeds. IE: if I'm running away I reduce the damage.
-Also what would the damage output of a Rifter be anyway?

I like the idea of a manual eject as well.

No trial accounts, and at least 30 days of prerequisite skills to train.

probably the biggest issue with a ramming mechanic would be that if someone put a cruiser micro on a frig or a BS micto on a cruiser the momentum would ramp up to a heck of a lot more than would be reasonable.

The danger would be that a mass of frigs or cruisers set up the above way could be rediculously dangerous. one of the more important things for it would probably be to try to balance the way the damage is dealt seeing as if you were to use 1 kgms^-1 =1damage a ramming titan would be absolutely insanely dangerous, probably the best option would be to hardcap the damage to the ramming ship's max HP or current HP

capital only would limit it too much though, where's the fun in capital only

Even if it was capital only you'd still have to be very careful with the momentum to damage ratios

I'd love this but it wouldn't be feasible on anything smaller than a capital class ship because some idiot would use this in a highsec then complain about the concordokens...


And if it hasn't be added to the idea yet, should upon contact with the shield/ship itself emit an AOE to the general area based on ship class (carrier/dread - 10 km, supercarrier - 25km, titan -45km) or something like that. Debris doesn't stop after impacting just one object. Be nice if the aoe damage degraded with range too.

Sorry to go on with the sub cap idea, but I do enjoy the idea of other ships flying straight into the cross fire hoping to hit something. I remember the A-Wing from Star Wars VI going into the Super Star Destroyer command. Could make it entirely useless for a subcap to ram or kamikaze into anything larger than them, but effecting the ratios on whatever ship you're flying. Or change the 20,000 to a percentage so it can be applied to other ships.

I just want to be able to ram into stuff on anything. xD Doesn't matter if it does damage or not. Only then will I ascend to true Orkyness.

If they did implement collision damage, it should be for all ships, not just capitals. But then they could give you your ramming skill for caps. I figure they could just add skills like collision damage mitigation and avoidance, along with affects of shields on collision.

People talk about small ships torpedoing, but I would think that a frig running into a larger ship with adequate shielding would have most of the impact negated. They would also need to consider all of the other factors that arise with collision damage, such as station (Jita) undocking. So maybe a station buffer that prevents bump damage until you get > 0 from the station.

I've already said most of what you just said.

Also, there was an idea about a special t2 dessie that would be "optimized" for ramming. How's about instead of t2, create a second tier of destroyer that would be optimized for ramming. This would lower the cost and help make this a more effective tactic.

EDIT: El Quirko, shoot me a convo later. I want this to legitly get in Assembly Hall.