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Chatlog from the Dev chat tonight

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Hakera	Posted - 2005.04.07 23:01:00 - [1] Thanks to CCP, Latta and those who helped, and all those who attended, the chatlog is now availible here for everyone. A bit late, but sticky now - Wrangler Dumbledore - Eve-I.com
Roy Focker	Posted - 2005.04.07 23:04:00 - [2] Thanks, Hakera! -------------------------------------------------- -------------------------------------------------- I am not paying $15 a month to play a immature a-hole.
Unholy Shadow	Posted - 2005.04.07 23:04:00 - [3] thx a lot
Gungankllr	Posted - 2005.04.07 23:06:00 - [4] Cheers www.hadean.org
Hakera	Posted - 2005.04.07 23:23:00 - [5] ive just tweaked some formatting to make it easier to read btw (dammned html doesnt like the <> name tags) :/ Dumbledore - Eve-I.com
Marcus Aurelius	Posted - 2005.04.07 23:30:00 - [6] Edited by: Marcus Aurelius on 08/04/2005 07:46:10 Thanks for hosting it. Other then Eve-I itself I see precisously little good about it...again. If I counted right we have set a new record of 8 out of every 10 lines of dev response being inane attempts at humour. Maybe, just maybe, they should try and apreciate how these few and far in between chats are the number one source of info as to future game developments for a big part of the playerbase (the rest simply has no idea at all obviously). Wasting half the time on trying to be l33t...ffs :/ At least they did say there's gonna be some attention to laying the structure we should have had already. But with that small remark about it being alot of coding slipped in by Oveur I sincerely doubt that we'll see more POS functionality in the next 3-6 months. Not really what I hoped for tbh, and most certainly not a source for new hope that this game will get back on track. So, Rod will not be back anytime soon.
Roy Focker	Posted - 2005.04.07 23:36:00 - [7] Edited by: Roy Focker on 07/04/2005 23:39:17 Originally by: Marcus Aurelius Thanks for hosting it. Other then Eve-I itself I see precisously little good about it...again. If I counted right we have set a new record of 8 out of every 10 lines of dev response being inane attempts at humour. Maybe, just maybe, they should try and apreciate how these few and far in between chats are the number one source of info as to future game developments for a big part of the playerbase (the rest simply has no idea at all obviously). Wasting half the time on trying to be l33t...ffs :/ Oh, amd anyone else notice the usual lack of commitment to timelines and actual details on planned changes ? At least they did say there's gonna be some attention to laying the structure we should have had already. But with that small remark about it being alot of coding slipped in by Oveur I sincerely doubt that we'll see more POS functionality in the next 3-6 months. Not really what I hoped for tbh. I am going to agree with this statement. While I was reading this so-called chat, the question in the back of my head was not about any game mechanics but how old these developers are. Like I really give a damn about what TomB is stroking, or who collects loot. Focus on giving out detailed information on your plans with the game. Arghh! Why do I feel there is no hope for this game. -------------------------------------------------- -------------------------------------------------- I am not paying $15 a month to play a immature a-hole.
Raven1x	Posted - 2005.04.07 23:43:00 - [8] Well, that was totally unsurprising: Only the vaguest of signs when we'll see the rest of Exodus and no mention at all of comets, dust mining, dynamic roids or any of the other industrialist stuff, no hard questions, the "SOON" response trotted out to illustrate CCP's contempt for deadlines, no really specific answers for anything, just nicely vague and "worship us". ____________________________________________ There is no such thing as too much cynicism. Beware of geeks bearing gifs.
Marcus Aurelius	Posted - 2005.04.07 23:44:00 - [9] Edited by: Marcus Aurelius on 08/04/2005 07:47:42 Edited by: Marcus Aurelius on 07/04/2005 23:47:51 Indeed, how ******* hard is it to have some kind of sensical discussion about the development of this game ? Do you think I like posting a five-post piece of constructive comment on concerns about the development of Eve only to see the people responsible for developing this game insult me by wasting that little precious window we get to look into their minds every x months on trying to be funny ? Remember, this may be a game, and irc chatting might sollicit funny crap, but in the end what counts is the value created by your communications. Well, its the last time I waste my time on trying to help out developing this game. Matter of fact, Rod Blaine is history. If these guys can't even force an attention span of one hour for direct communications with their customer base I honestly cba paying for this piece of downsliding crap anymore.
Hakera	Posted - 2005.04.07 23:46:00 - [10] I think too many people have differing expectations of what a dev chat is. Yes imo, mostly issues are best explained on a forum post or blog and a few lines in irc will never do such justice. However we all know the devs read these forums and respond where they need to and are obviously aware of issues affecting the community of different scales. The chat is just that, a chat a simple Q&A session which does not really focus on any issue. For eg, you could discuss the ins and outs of bookmarks for hours and still not arrive at a mutual decision on whats best and perhaps such issues are best left to a forum post where devs can prepare answers. For what it is worth, I think the chat is useful for gauging current opinion on issues, and getting simple yes or no answers on many topics people are concerned about or seeking more info. The rest is best left to a decent forum post. Perhaps many of you like us who have been playing for a long time would have predicted or expected all the answers that came and the chat is of little use to you. But to the majority I feel it offers a good insight into what is to come and also helps the devs in realising the issues important to the community. Dumbledore - Eve-I.com
Marcus Aurelius	Posted - 2005.04.07 23:50:00 - [11] Edited by: Marcus Aurelius on 08/04/2005 07:48:19 Well, that would actually be fine with me. If CCP could actually reply to or post a discussion for once. But no, their whole mode of communication is made up of contentlacking chat sessions. Wow, that really ******* impresses me tbh.
Grimpak	Posted - 2005.04.07 23:52:00 - [12] Quote: Hammerhead: speaking of killmails, we generated some huge ones during our performance testing this week. Oveur had exotic dancer in his destroyed items MURDERER! ------------------- Quote: Fragm's Oversized Ego Cannon barely scratches the forums, inflicting omgnoonecares damage
Jaabaa Prime	Posted - 2005.04.07 23:53:00 - [13] From the Dev Chat: Originally by: Tomb Tomb missile balance will start in public testing right after this patch will lande on TQ /emote buys THESE before the screaming starts Excellent Dev Chat, nice answers, not too much "err, em, dunno". EVE-I dev chat 4TW. Add the Grab Bag idea to your web site developers plans please, I for one think it's great. -- Intergalactic Teeth Pullers "Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity, and I'm not sure about the former." Albert Einstein
Roy Focker	Posted - 2005.04.07 23:54:00 - [14] Edited by: Roy Focker on 07/04/2005 23:54:59 Originally by: Hakera I think too many people have differing expectations of what a dev chat is. Yes imo, mostly issues are best explained on a forum post or blog and a few lines in irc will never do such justice. However we all know the devs read these forums and respond where they need to and are obviously aware of issues affecting the community of different scales. The chat is just that, a chat a simple Q&A session which does not really focus on any issue. For eg, you could discuss the ins and outs of bookmarks for hours and still not arrive at a mutual decision on whats best and perhaps such issues are best left to a forum post where devs can prepare answers. For what it is worth, I think the chat is useful for gauging current opinion on issues, and getting simple yes or no answers on many topics people are concerned about or seeking more info. The rest is best left to a decent forum post. Perhaps many of you like us who have been playing for a long time would have predicted or expected all the answers that came and the chat is of little use to you. But to the majority I feel it offers a good insight into what is to come and also helps the devs in realising the issues important to the community. I understand the informal nature of IRC, but we are talking about a very serious matter. It seems you guys talk pretty much on a regular basis so next time could you please leave all the informal talk out? -------------------------------------------------- -------------------------------------------------- I am not paying $15 a month to play a immature a-hole.
Hakera	Posted - 2005.04.07 23:56:00 - [15] Originally by: Roy Focker I understand the informal nature of IRC, but we are talking about a very serious matter. It seems you guys talk pretty a much on a regular basis so next time could you please leave all the informal talk out. We dont actually, aside from those who frequent the chaos channel. As I said its a chat Dumbledore - Eve-I.com
anter	Posted - 2005.04.08 00:11:00 - [16] Edited by: anter on 08/04/2005 00:41:48 It was chat and not some board meeting. Just skip some of the comments if you dont have a sense of humour... Maybe if more people would eat one Golden Ratio per day would help them not take it so seriously.
Roy Focker	Posted - 2005.04.08 00:23:00 - [17] Edited by: Roy Focker on 08/04/2005 00:23:34 Originally by: anter Edited by: anter on 08/04/2005 00:14:49 It was chat and not some board meeting. Just skip some of the comments if you dont have a sense of humour... Maybe if more people would eat one Golden Ration per day would help them not take it so seriously. sigh For some reason lameness just does not make me laugh. -------------------------------------------------- -------------------------------------------------- I am not paying $15 a month to play a immature a-hole.
CCP Hammer	Posted - 2005.04.08 00:27:00 - [18] Hmm, let me explain the way these chats work so some of you can maybe see how it is from our perspective. Ok, we have a few question takers, between 3 and 6 and they are being spammed by about 250 people. They filter through all the question and try to pick good ones then they paste those questions in another channel that all the devs are in and we say which questions we are going to answer based on our area of the game. Oveur is usually the guy who ends up answering most of the questions because he's the producer and thus he's the guy responsible for what everyone is doing and when everyone is supposed to be doing it. He knows what most of us are going to be doing before we do. These questiosn are usually in a queue of about 5 or 6 waiting to be asked next. So the question taker posts the question and then 500 eyes stare at a screen waiting for someone who is on the spot to come up with an answer that is as informative as possible without making promises that we can't keep. This period of time is known as "dead air" in the live broadcast industry. Dead air is no fun so I don't see any reason why it should be so bad that we have some fun with our players. Anyhow, it's 12:30am and I'm still at work so I'm going to go now but if you want to talk to me I'm always on coldfront in the #eve-chaos channel under the nick Hammerhead.
anter	Posted - 2005.04.08 00:30:00 - [19] Originally by: Roy Focker Edited by: Roy Focker on 08/04/2005 00:23:34 Originally by: anter Edited by: anter on 08/04/2005 00:14:49 It was chat and not some board meeting. Just skip some of the comments if you dont have a sense of humour... Maybe if more people would eat one Golden Ration per day would help them not take it so seriously. sigh For some reason lameness just does not make me laugh. Oh I see. What do you suggest they should do?
Elemmakil	Posted - 2005.04.08 00:38:00 - [20] Edited by: Elemmakil on 08/04/2005 00:40:34 i¦ve played everquest for two years and never saw the devs answering to the people like this. Anyway, some (most) of the answers were childish, but there¦s a fair bit of info on them. After reading this i got the feeling that devs really read the forums and are aware of most problems players have with EVE.
Face Lifter	Posted - 2005.04.08 00:40:00 - [21] I think it was a fun read. Some questions were rather pointless and some very important issues weren't covered, but hey, at least they talked about POS, map changes, and infrastructure in 0.0. Those are very important, so it wasn't a total waste, besides being an amusing read of couse.
Maya Rkell	Posted - 2005.04.08 00:44:00 - [22] Shrug. Very useful compared to other chats. Bloody whiners in this thread... "As far as I can tell, It doesn't matter who you are, If you can believe there's something worth fighting for " - Garbage, "Parade"
Jaabaa Prime	Posted - 2005.04.08 00:49:00 - [23] Originally by: CCP Hammer ... I found the chat log refreshing, the humour was a bonus. I understand that you Devs have 50,000+ accounts worth of people screaming at you about what they think is wrong with the game. So .. Thanks to: .. CCP for making this great game .. the GMs for wading through tons of petitions and making the right decisions .. the WHOLE vol team (ISD) for investing THEIR free time for 0 cash reward (although a little bird did say something about free account for time) IMO EVE, the community and everything that goes with it make this game a real long time challenge, I'm happy to be a part of it. And CCP Hammer (ex BH Hammerhead ?), I am of the honest opinion that the majority of the EVE players appreciated the injection of humour. -- Intergalactic Teeth Pullers "Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity, and I'm not sure about the former." Albert Einstein
Jaabaa Prime	Posted - 2005.04.08 00:56:00 - [24] Originally by: Elemmakil After reading this i got the feeling that devs really read the forums and are aware of most problems players have with EVE. Well hellmar said he has 2 player accounts, so I guess between work on EVE and playing EVE, his family must be missing him. I think that all the devs/GMs play EVE. And I think that Hellmar can understand some of things posted on these self same boards because he has also experienced them. -- Intergalactic Teeth Pullers "Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity, and I'm not sure about the former." Albert Einstein
Cheim	Posted - 2005.04.08 01:01:00 - [25] People ask questions, the devs give the best answers they can, what more do you want? They discussed some of the things planned for the next patch, noted why some features are harder to implement than others, gave an updated idea of tech 2 ammo, reported on the new world order's progress, and more. It isn't as if they only typed, "OMG n00b question, fear mah titan, lololol" for a couple hours. The playful stuff was in addition to the answers, not a replacement for them.
Roy Focker	Posted - 2005.04.08 01:18:00 - [26] Edited by: Roy Focker on 08/04/2005 01:26:04 Edited by: Roy Focker on 08/04/2005 01:23:25 Edited by: Roy Focker on 08/04/2005 01:18:36 Originally by: Cheim People ask questions, the devs give the best answers they can, what more do you want? They discussed some of the things planned for the next patch, noted why some features are harder to implement than others, gave an updated idea of tech 2 ammo, reported on the new world order's progress, and more. It isn't as if they only typed, "OMG n00b question, fear mah titan, lololol" for a couple hours. The playful stuff was in addition to the answers, not a replacement for them. I guess I just expected more. If I wanted "playful stuff" all I need to do is read the stuff from you guys on this forum. Granted, I did learn alot, but I felt much more could have been stated instead of talking about who gets podded or who collects loot. CCP is a business that offers a product to a paying base, MAYBE I expected a little too much. Oh well, I digress. What I would have like to see: * A clear cut time line on when new patches are coming. * Thier honest thoughts on EXODUS/SHIVA. If they could change EXODUS, then what would they change? * Will they or won't they deal with the rampant abuse of ALTS via escrow and ingame. Thier feelings on ALTS. * Thier thoughts on the growing feelings of newbies who feel the game is way out of reach for them. <- I don't feel this way. * Will there be any future improvements to the graphical engine? Just a sample of the questions that could have been fitted in a 2 HOUR chat. -------------------------------------------------- -------------------------------------------------- I am not paying $15 a month to play a immature a-hole.
RollinDutchMasters	Posted - 2005.04.08 01:30:00 - [27] While I feel that some of those questions were pointless, and a few were even downright idiotic... Is there any plans to allow us to declare war against individuals rather than corps, thus allowing people to attack individuals who have offended them and stopping people hiding in newb corps etc... As a whole, that was fairly well-run and informative. I'm usually a bit leery of fan sites running devchats, but I was pleasently suprised. I'm glad you hit the devs with some questions about what the hell they were on when they designed lvl 4 missions, and I'm glad there was a question about why the hell they havent fixed flagging (even if the answer was so useless that he should have just written it in icelandic). Originally by: Sochin CCP has provided you with the tools you need to avoid crime. You're just too lazy/stupid to use them.
Cheim	Posted - 2005.04.08 01:47:00 - [28] Originally by: Roy Focker Just a sample of the questions that could have been fitted in a 2 HOUR chat. CCP doesn't pick the questions. The devs can't be blamed for what's asked, only for their answers. They answered the best they could from what I can tell. As far as the questions go, keep in mind this is a complex game and different players have all kinds of different concerns. Some people are anticipating the missile overhaul with much dread or anticipation; that got a question. Others are tearing their hair out waiting for a full smuggling/contraband system; no question. It could be a 2-day chat and not all the questions out there would be answered.
Xeau	Posted - 2005.04.08 02:41:00 - [29] Edited by: Xeau on 08/04/2005 02:41:28 Quote: Latta [Mitchman] To TomB really.. The upcoming EW changes is highly controversial and it has been discussed to death. Why introduce such drastic changes in one go instead of using baby steps? This is not a nerf bat change, it's a nerf thermal nuclear bomb nerf. Hammerhead unless I'm working over this weekend and didn't know it Oveur Hmm, we should look into a thermal nuclear bomb nerf bat Tomb because its perfect I must say that's my fav bit lol.
Ankanos	Posted - 2005.04.08 02:51:00 - [30] i thought it was one of the best chats i've seen. kudos to the eve-i team. this is after all, a game unto which (i think) your supposed to derive fun. the humour amongst the devs was great, kinda shows that these people actually enjoy working with each other. -and as a team even. (/me ducks flying tomatos) it was informally informative and a good read, both for readings sake and whats getting thrown around the office in the form of ideas and whats on the plate in the near future.. -i expect nothing more.. some of you people act like you own stock in CCP or something and these devs chats hold your future designs on your life savings in the balance. ffs, lighten up and enjoy the comradery. if you need a serious chat, go call your stockbroker or something. or just go outside, you see, there is another world out there.. -keep up the good work guys -ank ---

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