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fairimear
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Posted - 2005.05.05 14:47:00 -
[1]
I fear the message of us who like to play on our own is getting lost in the missile thread.
Im wondering how many other's feel this missile nerf may cause them to leave as it is depriving not only the raven of it's only frig defence vs npc ceptors who can't be nosted.
I only ever use a bs to PVE atm and all i can see coming out of this is that we will be forced into groups to do any belt hunting, missions or anything vs npc.
and frankly i don't want to have to wait till my corp mates come home from work to play eve.
(\_/)
(O.o)
(> <) This is Bunny. Copy Bunny into your signature to help him on his way to world Domination.
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chillz
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Posted - 2005.05.05 14:54:00 -
[2]
Edited by: chillz on 05/05/2005 14:56:48
massivly MULTIPLAYER online role playing game.
Invite some chums along to your missions.
You could always fit a couple of smaller launchers to your raven to kill those friggies.
-----------------------------------
A gun and a packet of sandwiches.
"When the going gets weird, the weird turn pro." - Hunter S Thompson
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SirSpectre
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Posted - 2005.05.05 14:55:00 -
[3]
Edited by: SirSpectre on 05/05/2005 14:55:18
I only PVE in BSs too. Personally I think its a welcome change. Those Torps take forever to hit rats at 40km. And theyre BSs so correct me if im wrong, they will still do the same damage to them. with faster missles and faster RoF will make rats much easier after that ebil pulse nerf. You say "what about the elite frigs?" HA! My drones wtfpwn those long before the torp could ever reach it, so I dont even bother. But for you poor ravens...i guess now you'll do the same thing against frigs as your doing now!! NOS and Cruise!! the cant out run the explsion too much if they dont have MWD. I think this will be a fun change.
Your turret W****
SirSpectre
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Matthew
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Posted - 2005.05.05 14:57:00 -
[4]
 Originally by: fairimear
Im wondering how many other's feel this missile nerf may cause them to leave as it is depriving not only the raven of it's only frig defence vs npc ceptors who can't be nosted.
Erm, raven has a drone bay. Do what apoc pilots have to and use it. Those npc ceptors that can't be nossed are also generally too stupid to retarget to your drones once they're shooting your ship.
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Alexi Borizkova
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Posted - 2005.05.05 14:59:00 -
[5]
For me, missiles were the crutch that allowed me to train industry skills and not totally suck at combat. Sure, with good skills I could do silly amounts of damage with guns, but with some paltry few ranks in missiles I could defend myself and have fun rat hunting.
It also had a feel I liked. Watching that missile slowly crawl towards my target, sometimes even saying out loud the countdown to impact... it felt right.
Now I am left only to fervently hope beyond hope the numbers are tinkered with more, and that the enjoyment I derived from the old missiles won't be entirely gone.
I don't aim to quit over this, but it could very possibly degrade my fun factor to the point that could add up with otehr concerns to cause me to rethink how I spend my free time.
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Ithildin
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Posted - 2005.05.05 15:00:00 -
[6]
Originally by: Matthew
Originally by: fairimear
Im wondering how many other's feel this missile nerf may cause them to leave as it is depriving not only the raven of it's only frig defence vs npc ceptors who can't be nosted.
Erm, raven has a drone bay. Do what apoc pilots have to and use it. Those npc ceptors that can't be nossed are also generally too stupid to retarget to your drones once they're shooting your ship.
The Raven also has the capacity of fitting 2 small guns in order to take out 'ceptors. I don't know what use those two slots has on Ravens outside PvP, as I don't use Ravens (and you'll never see me do it, EVER), so this is just a theory.
--
If TC causes you discomfort that you feel is unwarranted or may be outside TC's current contract - contact me, please. |
Stephra Parle
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Posted - 2005.05.05 15:03:00 -
[7]
Can you not use a webbifier and drones to deal with any pesky close range frigates/inties? There's always an alternative way to counter threats in the game, some of which require a bit of slot juggling, but it can be done.
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Golgrath
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Posted - 2005.05.05 15:04:00 -
[8]
Use drones like every other bs, web is not necessary.
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Hyey
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Posted - 2005.05.05 15:04:00 -
[9]
WEll ravens are certainly useless against angel BS now. Its not because of the ceptors or the fact that my torps do 70 damage to a cruiser (which is stupid in and of itself.) its that the angel bs are REALLY fast... so when they decide to MWD I have torps doing only 30-70 damage. The speed modifier is borked.
~~
Hyey
I just payed 15 dollars this month just to be able to respond on the forums... stupid cancellation error.
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Hast
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Posted - 2005.05.05 15:11:00 -
[10]
tbh, I do not feel sorry for you missile users at all... I'm almost done with my L proj spec and I still dont get the get out of warpscramble freecard that missileusers have today...
other then that I want to add omgbuhu2u
Well I dont think hte missile change will go through the way it is now, but after a bit of tweaking its not such a bad idea. And yes, no matter how delayed damage from missiles is its still unbalanced in PVE and I think Torps are kinda unbalanced in closerange pvp aswell since the damage potential in the raven off the boot is too high.
So nerf the raven back to the stoneage and give it skills to get it on par with the rest of the Battleships.
P.S. when the changes go through I will most likely sell off my raven and buy myself a second Tempest for npc hunting and I will enjoy it 
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Hyey
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Posted - 2005.05.05 15:18:00 -
[11]
Originally by: Hast
tbh, I do not feel sorry for you missile users at all... I'm almost done with my L proj spec and I still dont get the get out of warpscramble freecard that missileusers have today...
other then that I want to add omgbuhu2u
Well I dont think hte missile change will go through the way it is now, but after a bit of tweaking its not such a bad idea. And yes, no matter how delayed damage from missiles is its still unbalanced in PVE and I think Torps are kinda unbalanced in closerange pvp aswell since the damage potential in the raven off the boot is too high.
So nerf the raven back to the stoneage and give it skills to get it on par with the rest of the Battleships.
P.S. when the changes go through I will most likely sell off my raven and buy myself a second Tempest for npc hunting and I will enjoy it
GL npcing in that tempest, be sure to set off some time to make 150km bookmarks in every single belt you plan to use because you certainly wont be going short range tempest against those npcs. Tank wont last long enough 
~~
Hyey
I just payed 15 dollars this month just to be able to respond on the forums... stupid cancellation error.
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ews01
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Posted - 2005.05.05 15:27:00 -
[12]
Originally by: fairimear
I fear the message of us who like to play on our own is getting lost in the missile thread.
Im wondering how many other's feel this missile nerf may cause them to leave as it is depriving not only the raven of it's only frig defence vs npc ceptors who can't be nosted.
I only ever use a bs to PVE atm and all i can see coming out of this is that we will be forced into groups to do any belt hunting, missions or anything vs npc.
and frankly i don't want to have to wait till my corp mates come home from work to play eve.
Signed |
Gungankllr
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Posted - 2005.05.05 15:32:00 -
[13]
Aye, I log on usually for a few hours and do ONE or TWO L4 missions.
If I get Guristas Extravaganza, I know it's going to be a 4 hour ordeal.
Now with the missile changes, I will absolutely, positively not be able to do them alone. I love my corp, but 99% of them are in 0.0, and nobody currently has any incentive to group to do L4 missions since there is nothing to gain other than bounty.
I did some NPC hunting on sisi, and I found that It took me almost my entire cargo hold of torpedos to kill a simple 4 interceptor, 4 frigate and a 1 mill BS spawn.
www.hadean.org
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Hast
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Posted - 2005.05.05 15:33:00 -
[14]
Originally by: Hyey
Originally by: Hast
tbh, I do not feel sorry for you missile users at all... I'm almost done with my L proj spec and I still dont get the get out of warpscramble freecard that missileusers have today...
other then that I want to add omgbuhu2u
Well I dont think hte missile change will go through the way it is now, but after a bit of tweaking its not such a bad idea. And yes, no matter how delayed damage from missiles is its still unbalanced in PVE and I think Torps are kinda unbalanced in closerange pvp aswell since the damage potential in the raven off the boot is too high.
So nerf the raven back to the stoneage and give it skills to get it on par with the rest of the Battleships.
P.S. when the changes go through I will most likely sell off my raven and buy myself a second Tempest for npc hunting and I will enjoy it
GL npcing in that tempest, be sure to set off some time to make 150km bookmarks in every single belt you plan to use because you certainly wont be going short range tempest against those npcs. Tank wont last long enough
Thats why I have used the overpowered raven!!11one till now.
Its good having a uber npc pwning ship but I can live without it and start using the battleship I have specialized in instead
Just passed 5mill SP in gunnery and I still use a Raven for npc hunting 
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Hast
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Posted - 2005.05.05 15:35:00 -
[15]
Originally by: Gungankllr
Aye, I log on usually for a few hours and do ONE or TWO L4 missions.
If I get Guristas Extravaganza, I know it's going to be a 4 hour ordeal.
Now with the missile changes, I will absolutely, positively not be able to do them alone. I love my corp, but 99% of them are in 0.0, and nobody currently has any incentive to group to do L4 missions since there is nothing to gain other than bounty.
I did some NPC hunting on sisi, and I found that It took me almost my entire cargo hold of torpedos to kill a simple 4 interceptor, 4 frigate and a 1 mill BS spawn.
Ever tried npc'ing in a autocannon Tempest? Not only cant you hit the npc's without a web but you use insane amounts of ammo aswell. Long range sniping requires either an alt or a friend to collect loot. Therefor I stand by my statement;
omgbuhu2u
(no offence guys )
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Jim Steele
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Posted - 2005.05.05 15:35:00 -
[16]
For christ sake, all its going to do is fubar solo raven mission runners and that can only be a good thing, (free isk no risk anyone).
Hell i cant do lvl4 missions solo in an apoc with 5 mil in gunnary in the speed someone solos lvl4's in a raven with noob skills at the moment.
If you want to kill npc's fine just train some skills up to do it like the rest of us, you dont here us fighter types complaining about not being able to use large barges.
Death to the Galante |
Gunstar Zero
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Posted - 2005.05.05 15:39:00 -
[17]
uhm
There's still two turret slots on a Raven with max missile loadout - why not fit a pair of 125mm Tech IIs with AM for the frigates? Or whatever gun you fancy, something with high tracking anyway - quad laser or something.
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Bluestealth
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Posted - 2005.05.05 15:42:00 -
[18]
Umm... yeah close range tempest cant tank for **** :) I know, if I see 3 BSs and a lot of cruisers I take out what I can till the cruisers are dead then the BSs go down easy... now if seraphins showed up... im running.... long range is just so damn boring, and if the angel BSs do dicide to run at you before you can take them down you had better be ready to run
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Sobeseki Pawi
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Posted - 2005.05.05 15:43:00 -
[19]
That would require creative thought.
~Sobe
Captain Cutie, Razor's Kiss
What is your Radical Dream? |
Aequitas Veritas
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Posted - 2005.05.05 15:46:00 -
[20]
Why dont you just give the GMs a time to balance this? Its the first draft and like torps do 10 damage to a mwding Armageddon, so something isnt working as it should... Give them some time to fix this and I'm sure it will get better :)
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James Lyrus
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Posted - 2005.05.05 15:48:00 -
[21]
I take it you're talking about L4 missions here?
After all, L3 in a battleship are not really a problem in a BS, unless you're a muppet.
I've no problems with not being able to solo L4 missions. I've done it as a group, with a couple of BS and a cruiser or two, and the whole thing becomes much more fun.
OK, L4 missions are out solo. L3s'll still be viable though. After all, I know several people who do L3s in 'non missile' battleships.
Sorry, but it's not chasing off the solo player. It just means that the solo player has to 'mix' their setup, to deal with frigates, cruisers and battleships. Where if you bring a friend, you can 'share' the roles, and ... shock, do better overall.
Yes, it sucks when you're uber death machine gets less sickening. But seriously, it's not the end of the world, or indeed of eve.
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X'Alor
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Posted - 2005.05.05 15:48:00 -
[22]
Seige only torps. no fof torps, biggest nerf to small ships, slowest speed missles, short flight time compared to cruise missles.
Cruise launcher n Cruise missles: increased uber speed, increased ROF on the launcher par to seige, no change to cruise missle damage, possible new skills to increase the damage a bit, the options of swaping FoF cruise missles, not as heavily nerfed to small ships as torps, easier fitting than seige allows more options elsewhere
...... whats that T2 XL booster, T2 large booster, 2x shield amps, 2x hardners plus less cap use added to shield op skill. Thank you bring on my cruise missle and cruise missle launcher boosts please. they are the rank 5 missle and should perform like the rank 5 missle.
Yes torps are uber but cruise missles should be top of the food chain when it comes to missles.
They should have dropped the launcher ROF to 18 seconds base.
....... anyone seeing where i'm going with this.
Without the ROF nerf that the cruise launcher had compared to seige was the only reason not to use them.
Now with seige only firing torps and cruise only firing cruise and bringing the ROF in par with seige..... combined with flight time range and speed.
plus you can fit so much more cruise missles in your cargo. Compared to cargo space used, a cruise missle equipped raven can hold like 3 times the damage capable in cruise missle compared to torps.
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ElCapitan
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Posted - 2005.05.05 15:49:00 -
[23]
Originally by: Gungankllr
Now with the missile changes, I will absolutely, positively not be able to do them alone. I love my corp, but 99% of them are in 0.0, and nobody currently has any incentive to group to do L4 missions since there is nothing to gain other than bounty.
I did some NPC hunting on sisi, and I found that It took me almost my entire cargo hold of torpedos to kill a simple 4 interceptor, 4 frigate and a 1 mill BS spawn.
mmm so your corp does not suit your play style...what does it have to do with missiles? Perhaps is time to find a new corp?
and by the way: why use a raven for NPCing? Other ships are just as good at it, just require more skill points.
And i think people having less incentive to do missions is a good thing for all of us....more minerals on the market, cheaper ships.
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Tonya Nastee
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Posted - 2005.05.05 15:56:00 -
[24]
Edited by: Tonya Nastee on 05/05/2005 15:57:37
I for one hail our missile nerfing overlord TomB! 
Just remember kids the contants have not been tweaked, so stop rolling your eyes over some damage numbers, think about the concept. The concept in it self is not that bad.
Missiles will not become turrets, they still do some damage to fast frigate.. for the most part they do contant damage. Any BS sized turret only has a slight chance somewhere near the end of the falloff otherwise does 0 damage. Somedamage is always better than none. So they still have different characteristic.
Definitely a step in the right direction, though some contants could use some tweaking.
What about the good stuff, the much higher speed.. will missiles become the new sniper flavor? At least higher dot than turrets can deliver at long range..?
Less inflation since missions take longer time..?
Can hit MWDing ceptor 20-200km away..?
edit: Ops, I think I replied to a wrong thread
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Reatu Krentor
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Posted - 2005.05.05 15:58:00 -
[25]
though i understand your concerns fairimear, you have to admit rather that CCP is rather brave for still attempting this after the endless posts about how it'll ruin the game for everyone ... overall I do think it will be a good change, escpecially once the values are more balanced. (Right now only thing i don't like is the range on the missiles) I'd rather see an optimal burn time wherein a missile does damage like normal and have a "falloff burn time" where damage goes down the longer it goes on till 0( like with turrets kinda) )
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The ammatar are not the enemy, they are the smoke and mirrors of the amarr. |
Zaintiraris
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Posted - 2005.05.05 16:04:00 -
[26]
If I left because my missiles were changed in some way, then EVE would be better off without me. If any of my corpies start complaining of it, I'ma tell them to STFU.
Why?
I'm sick of waiting for my dang torpedos to hit stuff! I waste more time on waiting for my hits than reloading. Sucks!
---
Originally by: CCP Hammer
This game was so much better back before people knew math.
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ElDiablo
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Posted - 2005.05.05 16:09:00 -
[27]
Learn to adjust....or just leave, and be sure to not let the door hit you.
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Sobeseki Pawi
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Posted - 2005.05.05 16:11:00 -
[28]
Adapt or die.
~Sobe
Captain Cutie, Razor's Kiss
What is your Radical Dream? |
Gungankllr
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Posted - 2005.05.05 16:12:00 -
[29]
Originally by: ElCapitan
Originally by: Gungankllr
Now with the missile changes, I will absolutely, positively not be able to do them alone. I love my corp, but 99% of them are in 0.0, and nobody currently has any incentive to group to do L4 missions since there is nothing to gain other than bounty.
I did some NPC hunting on sisi, and I found that It took me almost my entire cargo hold of torpedos to kill a simple 4 interceptor, 4 frigate and a 1 mill BS spawn.
mmm so your corp does not suit your play style...what does it have to do with missiles? Perhaps is time to find a new corp?
and by the way: why use a raven for NPCing? Other ships are just as good at it, just require more skill points.
And i think people having less incentive to do missions is a good thing for all of us....more minerals on the market, cheaper ships.
People had suggested earlier I get corpmates to help (might have been in another thread tbh) I'm just saying there is no real incentive for people to help each other do missions the way the current game mechanic is orking.
The reason I use a Raven, is I've always used Caldari ships. I started out with a Bantam, worked my way up through the frigates to a Merlin, then on to an osprey, and then up to a Scorpion.
the pinnacle of my pod-piloting experience was in my Raven. Simply put, I've loved missiles since I played a Terran Enforcer on the Andromeda Server of Earth and Beyond.
So I made a missile boat. I trained Caldari BS to 5, Cruise to 5, Torpedos to 5.
With these sweeping missile changes, I wish I would have just spent the time training a different battleship.
Finding a new corp isn't an option, I love the guys in HDY and I love the alliance I'm in.
I'm all for more minerals on the market and cheaper ships, but make mining fun. Mining to me is about as fun as stripping house paint with a chisel.
I have over 10 million skill points, and they are 95% devoted to flying a Raven.
www.hadean.org
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Nadija
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Posted - 2005.05.05 16:26:00 -
[30]
So basiclly for wot I've read, it will be more or less impossible to do some lvl 4 (if not all of then) solo in a raven or scorp, yes they have drone bays... but in something like a damsel in distress mission it would be totally impossible to do, not to mention you only have 45 mins to get the bonus!! I guess if u train all the new missile skills to lvl 5 then u might be able to do it. also if torps will be less effect against smaller ship (& i see the ROF of curise launchers have been reduced) i think siege launchers should get a decreace in ROF
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