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Maxnano
Caldari Provisions Caldari State
0
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Posted - 2012.12.15 18:44:00 -
[1] - Quote
A Guide on Scamming Red Frog Freight.
Due To Red Frog refusing my Initial extortion demand, I.E. Payment for Non-Publication of this Guide, I am now forced to release to the public Full Instructions on How to make Between 2 and 20 B Isk. You will soon Understand why this is not in any way Under-Estimated.
http://red-frog.org/annual-report-2011.php To get an idea how large this operation is.
Requirements:
2 Accounts - 1 For managing Corp Contracts, 1 for Hauling (Freighter 860k M3 min) And Will Join red Frog and instantly given access to Corp Contracts.
If you Currently only have 1 account, you can get a second account setup within minutes for the price of a plex. The Contract manager account can be as new as you want, The Hauler Acc should have a convincing History. But preferable not TEST, Evoke or Goons or other known freighter Gankers.
No Combat is involved in any way, This is purely a "White Collar Scam"
How It Works:
Red Frog Freight Is a large and well known Hauling company, Pilots of every type Create Contracts to the corp to have their Wares Moved from between 1 place and Another. They Only use Freighters.
Due to the Risk of Freighter Ganks, Red Frog Pilots are not allowed to take contracts with more than 1B in Collateral And Customers are not allowed to Set Contracts for more than 1B Isk Collateral.
This is where it gets interesting.
I Don't know if it is Laziness, Incompetence or just Calculated Risk, But People Constantly Put Cargo in the contract worth way more than the Collateral. On my first Day Some Incursion Nut put up a contract for 1b Collateral, but inside was a Machariel and 8B isk in Fittings.
Later that same Day, Some Idiot Put up 15 Contracts, im guessing for minerals to be moved of around 1b in value for each contract, Every single contract had 0 Collateral. Unfortunately at the time, i was not thinking of anything but how to chain together freighter trips and i missed that opportunity.
Every Day there are 6-7+ Contracts put up for Red Frog that have no collateral and countless numbers of contracts where the contents are worth way more than the Max 1B Collateral that they are ment to set.
The Best Way to get the most from this opportunity involves actually running the contracts like a typical employee, but all the while looking out for "The Big One" that will start your 24 Hour Timer.
Once you see that starting contract that is way over Collateral or none at all, you hold it, It has a timer of 24 Hours to complete. No one will notice a thing for at least the first 12 hours, more if you are lucky. During this time you need to run as many contracts as you can to find the "Gems" like 3B isk of WH Mats shoved into a 1B isk Collateral contract.
This is probably one of the easiest ways to gain Isk i have ever seen. And No doubt, i will try again ;) If its done right, a 20B isk Haul is very possible. |

Red Frog Rufen
Red Frog Freight Red-Frog
72
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Posted - 2012.12.15 18:51:00 -
[2] - Quote
Thank you very much.
This is a reminder to everyone, not just our customer, to properly collaterise your contracts.
In Red Frog Freight, we always try our best to reject those 0 collateral contracts as fast as we can, but unfortunatly, we do sleep sometime.
We run a background check on people, but it can only go so far.
oh, BTW, Test, Goons, anyone with a clean record of ganking can join Red Frog! As long as you meet our minimum requirement.
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Michael Harari
The Hatchery Team Liquid
403
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Posted - 2012.12.15 19:05:00 -
[3] - Quote
This is less "scamming red frog" and more "scamming idiots that happen to use red frog service" |

Ifly Uwalk
Empire Tax Collection Agency
407
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Posted - 2012.12.15 19:40:00 -
[4] - Quote
phail thread. OP /account pl0x. |

Darek Castigatus
Immortalis Inc. Shadow Cartel
217
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Posted - 2012.12.15 21:19:00 -
[5] - Quote
So your guide consists of pointing out what anyone with half a brain and any knowledge about the courier contract system could have worked out in about five seconds - exploit dumbasses who use insufficient collateral on their contracts.
Allow me to join Red Frog in pointing and laughing at you for expecting to get anything from that little gem. |

Vaal Erit
Science and Trade Institute Caldari State
393
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Posted - 2012.12.15 21:50:00 -
[6] - Quote
Michael Harari wrote:This is less "scamming red frog" and more "scamming idiots that happen to use red frog service"
Pretty much this. You can also join any large alliance, and say hey guys I own a jump freighter, who needs to move some stuff? I wouldn't say you were scamming that alliance though, just the few derps that are in it.
You also fail to mention the times when someone calls a contract 10x Bhaals and it ends up being shuttles and now you have to haul 50 jumps or else fail the contract and pay 1 bill in collateral. |

Andracin
Beyond Divinity Inc Shadow Cartel
1
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Posted - 2012.12.15 21:54:00 -
[7] - Quote
Im stuck trying to figure out if the OP is serious in this post or just at 0/10 troll. In any case the only scam part of this was the OP attempting to blackmail Red Frog into paying him not to make a fail post in C&P....the rest of the post is common knowledge to anyone who knows anything about courier contracts....I suggest you go back to Jita and offer to double people's money.... |

NEONOVUS
Saablast Followers
74
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Posted - 2012.12.15 22:11:00 -
[8] - Quote
I approve of this service and posting. By that I mean Red Frog. OP is a base level intelligence post, useful to those of lesser intelligence. |

Darek Castigatus
Immortalis Inc. Shadow Cartel
217
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Posted - 2012.12.16 03:44:00 -
[9] - Quote
NEONOVUS wrote:I approve of this service and posting. By that I mean Red Frog. OP is a base level intelligence post, useful to those of lesser intelligence.
As a prime example of how not to do it I hope, last thing we need is more idiots pointing out the obvious like its some kind of revalation. |

Darius Brinn
Iberians Iberians.
137
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Posted - 2012.12.17 13:07:00 -
[10] - Quote
I fail to see how the OP has posted a guide of any sort. Please notice it's not Red Frog being scammed. It's people with more fingers than functional braincells.
I can-¦t imagine why your extortion attempts were ignored 
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Ra Jackson
CRIMINALS IN ACTION Pure Madness.
77
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Posted - 2012.12.17 13:39:00 -
[11] - Quote
Are you saying that I should not trust complete strangers with my stuff in this game?  |

Toroup
Prometheus Deep Core Mining and Salvage
50
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Posted - 2012.12.17 18:38:00 -
[12] - Quote
So your guide is basically - join a corp, steal from the corp, leave the corp. I have to say "thank you!" I've never thought about that before . How could I miss something so easy and definitely never talked about during all the discussions involving Eve? |

Duke Thunderhorse
Hellhawks The Devil's Tattoo
11
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Posted - 2012.12.17 20:47:00 -
[13] - Quote
Best guide ever! Can you direct me to a PDF version please? Or maybe a youtube video. Thank you. |

Piugattuk
Lima beans Corp
121
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Posted - 2012.12.17 22:54:00 -
[14] - Quote
Glad to know Red Frog is completing contracts worth more then collateral good honest business folk. |

Red Frog Rufen
Red Frog Freight Red-Frog
74
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Posted - 2012.12.18 11:57:00 -
[15] - Quote
Piugattuk wrote:Glad to know Red Frog is completing contracts worth more then collateral  good honest business folk.
we usually do, there's a lot of honest people in Red Frog, that see in the long term !
Not everyone is a thief like the OP.
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Darek Castigatus
Immortalis Inc. Shadow Cartel
217
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Posted - 2012.12.18 14:59:00 -
[16] - Quote
Red Frog Rufen wrote:Piugattuk wrote:Glad to know Red Frog is completing contracts worth more then collateral  good honest business folk. we usually do, there's a lot of honest people in Red Frog, that see in the long term ! Not everyone is a thief like the OP.
Oh I wouldnt call him a thief, you actually have to have something resembling a functioning brain to be one of those. |

Pinky Feldman
Gank Bangers Moar Tears
419
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Posted - 2012.12.18 16:43:00 -
[17] - Quote
Why would Red Frog care? I've seen this happen to dumb people and tired people who set up multiple contracts and mess up on one accidently before, and usually they just get a mail from Red Frog thanking them for the free isk and re-iterating the importance of setting proper collateral.
The moar you cry the less you pee |

Shylari Avada
Amok. Goonswarm Federation
157
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Posted - 2012.12.18 18:02:00 -
[18] - Quote
Why crap on a good service?
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lanyaie
705
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Posted - 2012.12.18 22:26:00 -
[19] - Quote
Wow..I came here expecting some badass conspiracy theory left with something not worth my time Hay |

Chandaris
Immortalis Inc. Shadow Cartel
131
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Posted - 2012.12.19 00:04:00 -
[20] - Quote
This post brought to you by the Institute of Slowly and Painfully Working Out the Surprisingly Obvious |
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Lady Ayeipsia
Red Federation RvB - RED Federation
448
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Posted - 2012.12.19 02:31:00 -
[21] - Quote
Chandaris wrote:This post brought to you by the Institute of Slowly and Painfully Working Out the Surprisingly Obvious
Now now, you do this fine institute a disservice. They knew about this concept last year. |

Buhhdust Princess
Mind Games. Suddenly Spaceships.
260
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Posted - 2012.12.19 10:02:00 -
[22] - Quote
I love how the OP tried to make a post about how to scam red frog because he's mad, and in turn actually helped red frog advertise how important it is to set the right collaterol.
:golfclap: |

Red Frog Rufen
Red Frog Freight Red-Frog
77
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Posted - 2012.12.19 11:57:00 -
[23] - Quote
I was requested a couple of time to post this, so just to make sure everyone he might enter in contact with knows who they are dealing with.
he's 2 main characters are
Cpt Bunny and Francois Miron .
Be safe with them around your corp. |

Lady Spank
Genos Occidere HYDRA RELOADED
3003
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Posted - 2012.12.20 16:58:00 -
[24] - Quote
More like Cpt Dummy and Francois Moron. (a¦á_a¦â) ~ (my spaceblog) http://getoutnastyface.blogspot.co.uk/~ (a¦á_a¦â) |

dexington
Caldari Provisions Caldari State
285
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Posted - 2012.12.23 09:40:00 -
[25] - Quote
Maxnano wrote:Due To Red Frog refusing my Initial extortion demand, I.E. Payment for Non-Publication of this Guide...
Demanding isk for the non disclosure of the trivial guide, is nothing more then laughable. You would have be extraordinary stupid, to believe this garbage has any value what so ever.
Red Frog clearly states how to use their service, and how to set the collateral correctly to avoid someone stealing your cargo. If someone decides to not follow the advice given, in the FAQ which every new customer is told to read before making the contract, well to bad for him.
Q4: How much collateral should I put on the contract?
A: Put an amount equal to or greater than the value of the cargo in the contract. Do NOT put an amount that is less than the value of the items in the contract. The purpose of the collateral is to secure your cargo against destruction or theft. If you put an amount that is less than the value of the cargo, you run the risk that an unscrupulous pilot or a suicide ganker will take the items. It is possible for a pilot to look inside a package and see what it contains, even if it is in a can. Please protect your valuables by setting an accurate collateral. RF Freight FAQ
GÇ£The best way to keep something bad from happening is to see it ahead of time, and you can't see it if you refuse to face the possibility.GÇ¥ |

Freighdee Katt
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
13
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Posted - 2012.12.23 19:03:00 -
[26] - Quote
Piugattuk wrote:Glad to know Red Frog is completing contracts worth more then collateral  good honest business folk. It's more a question of risk for the pilot than honesty. Regardless of how "honest" you think you are, I'm not sure why you would even accept a 30B cargo, since the ISK/jump is paid at a fixed rate, and it's unlikely you're going to make enough to pay for the freighter that you're sure to lose when you get ganked. The 1B collateral limit is there to limit the exposure of haulers, not to protect customers. And as a pilot, I'd think you have enough sense to pass on hauling anything with a value high enough to turn you into a sweet sweet pinata of ganktastic goodness.
"Honest" is completing a 0 collateral contract that has a 1B cargo inside. But putting 30B worth of anything in your freighter and undocking . . . well, there are other words for that. |

Red Frog Rufen
Red Frog Freight Red-Frog
79
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Posted - 2012.12.24 14:58:00 -
[27] - Quote
Freighdee Katt wrote:Piugattuk wrote:Glad to know Red Frog is completing contracts worth more then collateral  good honest business folk. It's more a question of risk for the pilot than honesty. Regardless of how "honest" you think you are, I'm not sure why you would even accept a 30B cargo, since the ISK/jump is paid at a fixed rate, and it's unlikely you're going to make enough to pay for the freighter that you're sure to lose when you get ganked. The 1B collateral limit is there to limit the exposure of haulers, not to protect customers. And as a professional hauler, I'd think you have enough sense to pass on hauling anything with a value high enough to turn you into a sweet sweet pinata of ganktastic goodness. "Honest" is completing a 0 collateral contract that has a 1B cargo inside. But putting 30B worth of anything in your freighter and undocking . . . well, there are other words for that.
we reject those 0 collateral usually.
as for the over collateral, i'd say 99% of our pilot will contact a director and manage to deliver it nonetheless. so yeah, risk is a factor, but you can't know what's inside before accepting, so you're left with 2 choice, make the honest move and deliver it with the help of the direction, or fail it and get booted.
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Kuyomi
School of Applied Knowledge Caldari State
0
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Posted - 2012.12.24 16:42:00 -
[28] - Quote
Red Frog Rufen wrote:
we reject those 0 collateral usually.
as for the over collateral, i'd say 99% of our pilot will contact a director and manage to deliver it nonetheless. so yeah, risk is a factor, but you can't know what's inside before accepting, so you're left with 2 choice, make the honest move and deliver it with the help of the direction, or fail it and get booted.
What do you do with a 1b collateral 30b value contract, IE heavy undercollateralization? To me, failing it seems like the only safe option; putting such a package in a freigher is madness |

Red Frog Rufen
Red Frog Freight Red-Frog
80
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Posted - 2012.12.24 23:51:00 -
[29] - Quote
Kuyomi wrote:Red Frog Rufen wrote:
we reject those 0 collateral usually.
as for the over collateral, i'd say 99% of our pilot will contact a director and manage to deliver it nonetheless. so yeah, risk is a factor, but you can't know what's inside before accepting, so you're left with 2 choice, make the honest move and deliver it with the help of the direction, or fail it and get booted.
What do you do with a 1b collateral 30b value contract, IE heavy undercollateralization? To me, failing it seems like the only safe option; putting such a package in a freigher is madness
It depend on a lot of factor, but usually we involve a blue frog pilot for that. There are ways to move such value which I wont discuss here.
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Freighdee Katt
Center for Advanced Studies Gallente Federation
16
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Posted - 2012.12.26 18:15:00 -
[30] - Quote
Red Frog Rufen wrote:It depend on a lot of factor, but usually we involve a blue frog pilot for that. There are ways to move such value which I wont discuss here. I thought it was now possible to peek into plastic wrap prior to contract acceptance. I'm not sure exactly when that happened, but I believe it flew by in some patch notes in recent releases. I also think that I have inadvertently "discovered" this feature in game, while contracting stuff back and forth between alts. I could be wrong though.
It's up to you all of course, but it sounds like you're being unduly generous to customers by going out of your way to make Blue Frog hauls at Red Frog rates on these undercollateralized contracts (assuming Blue Frog rates are actually higher). If you're delivering them on the original Red Frog contract but making a Blue Frog run behind the scenes, then you're kind of inviting customers to play dumb and take advantage of you (especially since this "accomodation" is now advertised in this thread).
Even if the contract was already accepted, it seems like a better intervention would be to just contract the items back to the customer and send a polite mail inviting them to submit it to Blue Frog instead. |
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Dimitryy
Ever Flow Northern Coalition.
62
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Posted - 2012.12.28 01:57:00 -
[31] - Quote
I Dont Understand Why OP To Capitalize Every Other word In His Post. It makes Things Really hard to Read and Adds an un-natural Emphesis To his Words. |

Red Frog Rufen
Red Frog Freight Red-Frog
170
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Posted - 2012.12.28 05:14:00 -
[32] - Quote
Freighdee Katt wrote:Red Frog Rufen wrote:It depend on a lot of factor, but usually we involve a blue frog pilot for that. There are ways to move such value which I wont discuss here. I thought it was now possible to peek into plastic wrap prior to contract acceptance. I'm not sure exactly when that happened, but I believe it flew by in some patch notes in recent releases. I also think that I have inadvertently "discovered" this feature in game, while contracting stuff back and forth between alts. I could be wrong though. It's up to you all of course, but it sounds like you're being unduly generous to customers by going out of your way to make Blue Frog hauls at Red Frog rates on these undercollateralized contracts (assuming Blue Frog rates are actually higher). If you're delivering them on the original Red Frog contract but making a Blue Frog run behind the scenes, then you're kind of inviting customers to play dumb and take advantage of you (especially since this "accomodation" is now advertised in this thread). Even if the contract was already accepted, it seems like a better intervention would be to just contract the items back to the customer and send a polite mail inviting them to submit it to Blue Frog instead.
you can't peek at the content of a courier contract before accepting it.
When we send the contract to blue frog, we ask the customer to pay the difference, of course!
sending the item back means you need to fail the contract, and we hate failed contract. :) |

Red Frog Rufen
Red Frog Freight Red-Frog
170
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Posted - 2012.12.28 05:14:00 -
[33] - Quote
Dimitryy wrote:I Dont Understand Why OP To Capitalize Every Other word In His Post. It makes Things Really hard to Read and Adds an un-natural Emphesis To his Words.
it's probably related to him being.. well.. you know.
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