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Simetraz
State War Academy
Caldari State
514
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Posted - 2012.12.17 03:13:00 -
[31] - Quote
API also doesn't make up for poor setup in the corporation.
IF someone with less then director rights steals billions from your corp then it has nothing to do with API.
It means you left the door wide open.
If anything API really is meaningless until you start getting lots of corporation rights.
If you had a corporation and you requested that all the directors give each other full access API's it would make sense.
Asking for the full API just to get into a corp and have no rights.
Waste of time
EVERYBODY KNOWS |
Petrus Blackshell
Rifterlings
Damu'Khonde
2138
|
Posted - 2012.12.17 03:17:00 -
[32] - Quote
Donn Red wrote:I have been cruising the recruitment forums for the last couple of weeks, and it seems like everyone who is anyone wants full API. As if that wasn't enough, some want full API for all accounts! My situation is rather unique for quite a number of reasons, and I find the prospect of giving out all of my API keys extremely unsettling.
Before you tell me, "you must have something to hide", ask yourself, are you comfortable with random people knowing who ALL of your alts are, what you are buying/selling, and where you get your isk from?
I also don't want to hear about how I fail at compartmentalizing my characters; I know how to transfer items between characters without it appearing on an API. I shouldn't have to act like a spy to get into a corp.
Am I paranoid for not wanting random people to know what color my underpants are before I even speak to them on voice?
Hello, corp CEO here. Corps require full API to protect themselves, not because they like nosing around in your business. Really, it's a rather dreadful and dull waste of time to go through someone's stuff to see whether he has "sketchy" ISK transfers.
Why do it then? Because it's important. Background checks are essential when potentially opening your corp up to a malicious insider. That person can AWOX, steal, and tarnish your corp's reputation. I am personally aware a case where an acquaintance of mine infiltrated a whole series of enemy corps, leaving each of them with internal turmoil and lacking several billion ISK of assets. Had those corps done more thorough background checks, they would have been safe.
Of course, I'm not saying a hyper-exhaustive butter-submerging process is always key to corp security. Are some corps overdoing it? Sure. Don't want to deal with that? Don't join them. There are plenty of others who do not have as strict requirements. For example, my corp only requires a select sub-set of API (not the full key), and even then it's mostly for checking loyalty and conflicts of interest, not for protection against theft.
Rifterlings - small gang frigate PvP - low/nullsec operations, newbie-friendly, free ship program; Join today! www.rifterlings.com
Accidentally The Whole Frigate (blog) - Learning how to pew pew, one loss at a time - www.thewholefrigate.com |
Merouk Baas
98
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Posted - 2012.12.17 04:51:00 -
[33] - Quote
NEONOVUS wrote:What is in a full API that is so bad for the giver?
What's so bad in your Facebook when your boss or interviewer asks you for your password?
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Mallak Azaria
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
1428
|
Posted - 2012.12.17 05:07:00 -
[34] - Quote
Merouk Baas wrote:NEONOVUS wrote:What is in a full API that is so bad for the giver? What's so bad in your Facebook when your boss or interviewer asks you for your password?
What the hell? People actually do this?
It's about time CCP stops catering to the lazy players with this sense of entitlement for fear of losing money. These aren't the people making the game better, these are the people wanting you to turn EVE in to a game that is like most other MMO's. |
Donn Red
Center for Advanced Studies
Gallente Federation
2
|
Posted - 2012.12.17 05:09:00 -
[35] - Quote
Katran Luftschreck wrote:An hour of voice chat is worth more than an any API key.
I wish I could like your post again. This 1000%. |
Frostys Virpio
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
112
|
Posted - 2012.12.17 05:18:00 -
[36] - Quote
Alavaria Fera wrote:NEONOVUS wrote:What is in a full API that is so bad for the giver? Uh, privacy stuff, I guess. We don't give full API, but all the important stuff, I don't even remember. Let me have a look. AccountStatus CharacterInfo SkillQueue SkillInTraining CharacterSheet AssetListKillLog Lol, kill log.
You mean I am not supposed to try to hide the fact that I collect exotic dancers? |
Nostradamouse Riraille
Relentless Terrorism
BOHICANS
94
|
Posted - 2012.12.17 05:20:00 -
[37] - Quote
Mallak Azaria wrote:Merouk Baas wrote:NEONOVUS wrote:What is in a full API that is so bad for the giver? What's so bad in your Facebook when your boss or interviewer asks you for your password? What the hell? People actually do this?
yup |
Frostys Virpio
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
112
|
Posted - 2012.12.17 05:23:00 -
[38] - Quote
Merouk Baas wrote:NEONOVUS wrote:What is in a full API that is so bad for the giver? What's so bad in your Facebook when your boss or interviewer asks you for your password?
My boss keep making pranks on my facebook when I forget my phone at my desk so giving him my password would not really change much... |
Alavaria Fera
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
1938
|
Posted - 2012.12.17 05:27:00 -
[39] - Quote
Frostys Virpio wrote:Alavaria Fera wrote:NEONOVUS wrote:What is in a full API that is so bad for the giver? Uh, privacy stuff, I guess. We don't give full API, but all the important stuff, I don't even remember. Let me have a look. AccountStatus CharacterInfo SkillQueue SkillInTraining CharacterSheet AssetListKillLog Lol, kill log. You mean I am not supposed to try to hide the fact that I collect exotic dancers?
It's used to ensure that people applying for the capital and supercapital group actually have those items.
The skill thing is used to check if they actually have the skills as well. According to the wiki, it's a simple Yes/No check to a list of requirements. (Also, skills checks are used by the reimbursement team as well, where reimbursements require a minimum skill level in some things - fittings obviously are seen in the lossmail.)
Those who cannot adapt become victims of Evolugalbugaslugakjlwsdhvbzxd
Click for old school EVE Portraits: http://jadeconstantine.web44.net/Maison.htm |
Frostys Virpio
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
112
|
Posted - 2012.12.17 05:36:00 -
[40] - Quote
Alavaria Fera wrote:Frostys Virpio wrote:Alavaria Fera wrote:NEONOVUS wrote:What is in a full API that is so bad for the giver? Uh, privacy stuff, I guess. We don't give full API, but all the important stuff, I don't even remember. Let me have a look. AccountStatus CharacterInfo SkillQueue SkillInTraining CharacterSheet AssetListKillLog Lol, kill log. You mean I am not supposed to try to hide the fact that I collect exotic dancers? It's used to ensure that people applying for the capital and supercapital group actually have those items. The skill thing is used to check if they actually have the skills as well. According to the wiki, it's a simple Yes/No check to a list of requirements.
Makes sense. I don't understand why people think hiding some stuff is necessary. If you are going to play in a corp, whats the matter if they know stuff about your toons? If you don't want people to know about them, the NPC corp accept everyone no question asked. |
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Alavaria Fera
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
1938
|
Posted - 2012.12.17 06:00:00 -
[41] - Quote
Frostys Virpio wrote:Alavaria Fera wrote:Frostys Virpio wrote:You mean I am not supposed to try to hide the fact that I collect exotic dancers? It's used to ensure that people applying for the capital and supercapital group actually have those items. The skill thing is used to check if they actually have the skills as well. According to the wiki, it's a simple Yes/No check to a list of requirements. Makes sense. I don't understand why people think hiding some stuff is necessary. If you are going to play in a corp, whats the matter if they know stuff about your toons? If you don't want people to know about them, the NPC corp accept everyone no question asked.
Yeah, so well, at least I am not asked for wallet transactions or mail. That's surprising, I realized my market alt isn't in the API system, so it must look pretty suspicious that every month all my accounts get a plex from it. Heh.
Then again, I'm also contracting tons of stuff to it and empty all my wallets to it (in Jita), so maybe not. But no one can actually check the assets information anyway. Solo Drakban even said spai hunters don't use it.
Those who cannot adapt become victims of Evolugalbugaslugakjlwsdhvbzxd
Click for old school EVE Portraits: http://jadeconstantine.web44.net/Maison.htm |
Frostys Virpio
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
113
|
Posted - 2012.12.17 06:05:00 -
[42] - Quote
Alavaria Fera wrote:Frostys Virpio wrote:Alavaria Fera wrote:Frostys Virpio wrote:You mean I am not supposed to try to hide the fact that I collect exotic dancers? It's used to ensure that people applying for the capital and supercapital group actually have those items. The skill thing is used to check if they actually have the skills as well. According to the wiki, it's a simple Yes/No check to a list of requirements. Makes sense. I don't understand why people think hiding some stuff is necessary. If you are going to play in a corp, whats the matter if they know stuff about your toons? If you don't want people to know about them, the NPC corp accept everyone no question asked. Yeah, so well, at least I am not asked for wallet transactions or mail. That's surprising, I realized my market alt isn't in the API system, so it must look pretty suspicious that every month all my accounts get a plex from it. Heh. Then again, I'm also contracting tons of stuff to it and empty all my wallets to it (in Jita), so maybe not.
Unless there is a way to know the account is subscribed with a PLEX, then people could just think you pay for it. Or you mine the isk for a plex. Or rat it. Or scam for it. Or sell ship from the reimbursment program by generating false loss report. Why would people care how you get plexes? Pretty sure they only care about not being a SPAI and not looting the corp/alliance assets. |
Alavaria Fera
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
1938
|
Posted - 2012.12.17 06:13:00 -
[43] - Quote
Frostys Virpio wrote:Unless there is a way to know the account is subscribed with a PLEX, then people could just think you pay for it. Or you mine the isk for a plex. Or rat it. Or scam for it. Or sell ship from the reimbursment program by generating false loss report. Why would people care how you get plexes? Pretty sure they only care about not being a SPAI and not looting the corp/alliance assets.
Well what it would look like is
Account A receieved plex from Neutral.
The thing is sometimes spies get paid, and for whatever reason get paid to their spy account. I have no idea really. The market alt is sitting in some random highsec corp (not NPC). I don't even have any roles either, so really the big issue would be things like:
where's the fleet headed
how many people in the fleet
what ships in the fleet
what are they using
All very powerful information if delivered in a timely fashion. Like, if you knew the enemy was taking drakes and switched to kinetic resists to fight your tengus, then a load of bombers with EM bombs would wipe them....
Those who cannot adapt become victims of Evolugalbugaslugakjlwsdhvbzxd
Click for old school EVE Portraits: http://jadeconstantine.web44.net/Maison.htm |
Spacing Cowboy
Ordo Drakonis
Nulli Secunda
31
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Posted - 2012.12.17 06:22:00 -
[44] - Quote
Corporations are in alliance's.
A alliance uses API to manage comms ( teamspeak acces ), and forum rights.
If you refuse to give api, you cant be in comms.
A pilot who cant be in comms is useless , and
Needs to be kept out of the corp before he becomes
A pain in the ass / special cookie |
Frostys Virpio
Caldari Provisions
Caldari State
113
|
Posted - 2012.12.17 06:48:00 -
[45] - Quote
Alavaria Fera wrote:Frostys Virpio wrote:Unless there is a way to know the account is subscribed with a PLEX, then people could just think you pay for it. Or you mine the isk for a plex. Or rat it. Or scam for it. Or sell ship from the reimbursment program by generating false loss report. Why would people care how you get plexes? Pretty sure they only care about not being a SPAI and not looting the corp/alliance assets. Well what it would look like is Account A receieved plex from Neutral. The thing is sometimes spies get paid, and for whatever reason get paid to their spy account. I have no idea really. The market alt is sitting in some random highsec corp (not NPC). I don't even have any roles either, so really the big issue would be things like: where's the fleet headed how many people in the fleet what ships in the fleet what are they using All very powerful information if delivered in a timely fashion. Like, if you knew the enemy was taking drakes and switched to kinetic resists to fight your tengus, then a load of bombers with EM bombs would wipe them....
I don't understand how people could be stupid enough to get paid on thier spy toon. But then again, reading GD, it's not all that surprising... |
Vera Algaert
Republic University
Minmatar Republic
496
|
Posted - 2012.12.17 09:10:00 -
[46] - Quote
Mallak Azaria wrote:Donn Red wrote:Ocih wrote:Simetraz wrote:They only know about accounts and characters you tell them about.
This? Not to mention, what is it with people not showing a little self respect? If a corp is going to be anal and elitist, to hell with them. Don't join. How do suppose a corporation would react to a large isk transaction from a character that isn't present on the API, or having billions of isk in your wallet with no transactions showing where it came from, other than through selling the PLEX/DED mods/whatever that you retrieved from the container.... They check it once to make sure you're not a thief or awoxer & they only check it again if stuff starts going missing. What ever gave you the idea that someone was checking on you constantly?
ahem, you might want to check your api access logs...
I don't know about goons but as far as I remember the TEST auth system did pull a very small set of pages daily (to ensure that you are still in corp and subscribed) and pulled a significantly larger set once every few days.
Alliances keep logs of you mumble, forum, IRC, ... activity so they can use them for spai hunting (see the PL mirror) but you claim they choose not to make use of the richest source of information available to them?
Oh wait, how come the PL killboard includes an asset manager for everyone registered with API key?
Why would you do only one spot check? security is a process and eve is srs business.
Do cheap automated checks for red flags on a regular basis and keep as much of the information available to you archived as you can afford (for use in manual investigations and post-mortems). Anything else would be surprisingly stupid.
I'm a NPC corp alt, any argument I make is invalid. |
Zack Korth
The Deneveh Collective
High Rollers
61
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Posted - 2012.12.17 09:19:00 -
[47] - Quote
the answer to this is obviously to start your own corp. and join whatever alliance you want API-free, most good alliance want very basic API info, 3 or 4 boxes checked.. come to think of it, i've never once given out my full API.. I wouldn't even care, I've just never been asked for it. |
Mr Pragmatic
183
|
Posted - 2012.12.17 09:22:00 -
[48] - Quote
I know a corp that doesn't demand API.
Message me if our interested.
Vote for me in the next CSM Elections. I will fight for the interest of all Hi-sec dwellers. No longer will you be cast aside and disparaged.-á |
Optimo Sebiestor
The Society
Calyxes
133
|
Posted - 2012.12.17 10:38:00 -
[49] - Quote
Heeey Op, You look like my long lost brother 
I guess some of the old timers have little to nothing to do, so getting a full api is like spying on your neighbour. I should know, I'm one of those  But as people say, if your smart and have tinkerd with the game a bit, no one can stop you from making other players life misreable. |
Quantum Mass
Quantum Wave Incorporated
0
|
Posted - 2012.12.17 11:29:00 -
[50] - Quote
I don`t understand , there is nothing wrong with giving a full api , its a information piece of paper, its like going to a car dealer and getting a better price for your car as you have the full repair history, for 1 you will be in the good books , 2nd if you got nothing to hide what's the problem.
I can understand the "but they will see all my assets" ADD? there YOURS not there's, so they cant take anything.
if i had a full api of someone with 50 billion i would be jealous yes , but that's it, am not gona ask "O can you lend me 20 million as you got a lot"
API is good and i for 1 like it :) |
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Ezri Dax
Infinite Improbability Inc
Relativity Alliance
1
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Posted - 2012.12.17 11:49:00 -
[51] - Quote
I think there way to paranoid for whats supposed to be a fun game , its not like theres any real life assests getting risked .
if they feel there is real life implication of losing a war they most prolly need banned anyway if you catch my drift .
api has usefull applications , getting barred from corp entry because of potential spai or corp thief isent imho good use of the api resource . |
Blacko Bellamy
Brutor Tribe
Minmatar Republic
0
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Posted - 2012.12.17 12:25:00 -
[52] - Quote
Just lie to them. They deserve it.
Make account with PVP/PVE char with 20 M or so SP. Say you are new.
Bureaucrats want their formulars filled in. Nothing else! They want to feel like they are something special. It does not matter, whether the information in the formular is right or not. It just has to look like it is correctly filled in.
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Natsett Amuinn
GoonWaffe
Goonswarm Federation
765
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Posted - 2012.12.17 12:45:00 -
[53] - Quote
Donn Red wrote:
Before you tell me, "you must have something to hide", ask yourself, are you comfortable with random people knowing who ALL of your alts are, what you are buying/selling, and where you get your isk from?
I also don't want to hear about how I fail at compartmentalizing my characters; I know how to transfer items between characters without it appearing on an API. I shouldn't have to act like a spy to get into a corp.
Am I paranoid for not wanting random people to know what color my underpants are before I even speak to them on voice?
No, because I don't hide anything.
And I'm sure that my alt would have considerably more trouble getting placed in a corp that isn't a member of the CFC or HBC than you would.
And you don't need to keep anything off the API unless you have a reason, and the only reason in EVE is because you're a spy.
Yes, you are paranoid. They can't do anything with API, and the information isn't being shared with the entire corp, only the person recuiting or responsible for going through the info to make sure you're not a spy is looking at it.
The only time you should be worried about who you give your API to is if you're being recruitment scammed, and everyone should know how to avoid that.
Your API can't be used for any malicious intent, at least in so far as your accounts are concerned. CCP created the API for just such a thing, sharing. |
De'Veldrin
East India Ore Trade
The East India Co.
566
|
Posted - 2012.12.17 14:49:00 -
[54] - Quote
Merouk Baas wrote:NEONOVUS wrote:What is in a full API that is so bad for the giver? What's so bad in your Facebook when your boss or interviewer asks you for your password?
I've never had a potential employer ask for this, but I already have my response ready:
"Unfortunately, as it's against the terms of service I signed with Facebook, I cannot provide you with my account password. I am sure you wouldn't want me to start my employment with you by violating an agreement with another party at your request, would you?"
I keep hoping I'll get to use that response one day.
Edit to be on topic:
I don't give out my full API, simple as that. If they request a partial API as part of the recruitment process, I create one that gives exactly the information they ask for and no more, and set the expiry for about 5 days. If they don't check it in that amount of time, they don't need to.
Bumping, leave it alone. |
Marcus Caspius
87
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Posted - 2012.12.17 14:57:00 -
[55] - Quote
You wanna join a group? They wanna check you out! Simple.
PRO TIP OF THE DAY: Just delete the Key once they are done! Simple.
Grammatical error and spelling mistakes are included for your entertainment!
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Andreus Ixiris
Mixed Metaphor
1269
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Posted - 2012.12.17 15:01:00 -
[56] - Quote
I'm in a recruitment cycle for my corporation and not asking for full APIs.
My corporation doesn't really have anything worth stealing, though.
Mane 614
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Sara Child
University of Caille
Gallente Federation
0
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Posted - 2012.12.17 15:06:00 -
[57] - Quote
The real problem is not giving out your api key or whatever.
The real problem is that CCP makes it possible to uniquely identify an account through the api by giving away the account ID (or whatever its called).
This is what bothers me tbh and can be used to hunt you down forever and ever if you keep using that account (yes, you can transfer your chars off there, but meh, that costs iskies).
Now, think about this: Your api contains a unique identifier for your account yet when you buy a char you have to hand over your LOGIN name to the seller, NOT your unique account ID.
Seriously, what is wrong with you CCP? |
Shadowschild
Black Lance
Fidelas Constans
3
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Posted - 2012.12.17 15:17:00 -
[58] - Quote
Dude when you apply for a job & they perform a credit & criminal check do you protest? Of course not.
Same story here, give out your FULL API, nobody gives a crap about how you earn an income or what your alts are. They just want to be sure your not a spy or a liability.
If your that paranoid about other people peeping in, then I really don't see you as a good candidate for a null sec corp. In fact it seems like your not even a team player. What will you do when a home defence fleet is needed to ward off invaders, or during planned ops, will you just continue ratting out of fear of losing a ship?
The first few weeks in any null corp is when you convert gained isk to ships, that you will lose. |
Toku Jiang
Jiang Laboratories and Discovery
20
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Posted - 2012.12.17 15:26:00 -
[59] - Quote
I've only ever had to give out partial API's just to show the characters on my account, and what corps they might be in, and thats really all they need to know. It lets the CEO or director who is taking you in an opportunity to do a background check on all of your toons and see if anything fishy pops up. I don't really see corp theft being a problem if the corporation is run correctly. You just limit your members to specific corp hangers and never put anything terribly expensive in there. I can't think of a time where corp theft was ever a problem in the corps I've been in. |
Malcanis
Vanishing Point.
The Initiative.
5503
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Posted - 2012.12.17 15:27:00 -
[60] - Quote
Donn Red wrote:I have been cruising the recruitment forums for the last couple of weeks, and it seems like everyone who is anyone wants full API. As if that wasn't enough, some want full API for all accounts! My situation is rather unique for quite a number of reasons, and I find the prospect of giving out all of my API keys extremely unsettling.
Before you tell me, "you must have something to hide", ask yourself, are you comfortable with random people knowing who ALL of your alts are, what you are buying/selling, and where you get your isk from?
I also don't want to hear about how I fail at compartmentalizing my characters; I know how to transfer items between characters without it appearing on an API. I shouldn't have to act like a spy to get into a corp.
Am I paranoid for not wanting random people to know what color my underpants are before I even speak to them on voice?
Sounds like something a spy would say
MatrixSkye Mk2: "Remember: You consent to unconsensual PVP the moment you press the "Undock" button." |
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